Eugene Stoner and Mikhail Kalashnikov - Part 1 - Discussing the AR-15
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- Опубликовано: 10 сен 2024
- This video is part of a series created from footage of Eugene Stoner and Mikhail Kalashnikov meeting in Virginia in 1990. All the footage is courtesy of the Smithsonian Institution Archives. All I have done is cut some of the waiting time between tapes out and tried to fix the audio. Otherwise, what you are seeing is entirely unadulterated.
Feel free to ask any questions about the various topics of the video in the comments. I will do my best to answer them.
All footage is used with permission from the Smithsonian Institution Archives.
ruclips.net/video/ct8grNPfImo/видео.html
A little more about their trip.
Most AR vs AK debates: _screaming, swearing, name calling_
Eugene Stoner: "I like your gun"
Mikhail Kalashnikov: "thanks, I also like your gun"
It’s not a competition, it’s which tool is more appropriate under which circumstances.
“When someone makes something better then our designs we will shake there hand”
*Based*
Two world renowned famed and skilled master smiths or engineers howver the case may be. I would have honestly loved to see what a rifle they both collaborated on would have been.
Because real recognize real, both are marvellous piece of engineering, famous by their distinct and effective design, both of them has made history in military technology
These two discussing their own guns more civil than any AR vs AK debate I've ever seen
They are men. Civilized men.
That's the difference between consumers and producers.
Thanks
Right
Most men who make fantastic weapons are very civilized men ironically
This is like when your Grandpa from your mom's side of the family meets your Grandpa from your dad's side of the family.
Wholesome Kalashnikov and stoner family meet up
@@fregyt that in and of itself sounds hilarious 😂
Except their both dead so it could have probably happened lmao
Actually pretty similar yes, my dad was a soldier in the west German army, my mom's side grandpa was in the east German army border guards. When they first met they compared rifle qualification scores.
so fckn true
lol
46:44 “If somebody make a better design than me and Mr. Stoners designs then together we will shake that guys hand”- Mikhail, that almost brings a tear to my eye.
And too this day, no one has. These two designs these men made have stood the test of time. Becoming the 1911 of the assault rifle class. Almost wished Browning was still alive to be a part of this.
@@durzoblint6532 1911 only stood the test of time for American Boomers and civilians wanting to look "cool" and "retro".
9mm, light weight polymers glock-like hanguns are what every police and military in the world want. Show them a 1911 they will laugh at your face.
Sorry.
@@hypnoz7871 glock as well as the most of modern pistol use m1911's short recoil operation and tilting barrel🤣 the difference is only caliber and assembly of mechanisms.
@@hypnoz7871 every police and military in the world want glocks? No, at least Russia don't trust a piece of plastic.
Well it looks like Stoner’s getting replaced by the NGSW program while Kalashnikov lives on in Russia with his final project being the AK 100 series. But Stoner will live in other militaries and the American civilian market for decades to come.
Mikhail correcting his translator just makes me ROFLOL. Even tho he doesn't understand english too well he just has some instinctual level of understanding when it comes to talking about design.
like most Russians, don’t underestimate their English abilities
@I_Commission_DSPriscilla_Art quiet sseth
I'm about 10 minutes in currently but if I miss it and want to go back where would I find that part?
I love his expression at 08:13, looking at the disassembly. He doesn't even need the translation, at that point.
Yeah, i know very little russian, but i can hear that translator is missing a LOT of what Stoner is saying. I think it is not a real, profesional translator, just some russian guy who was around and knows some english.
One thing they agreed on was the idiocy of bureaucrats.
Gun designers from every company agree lol.
Still remember the US navy requesting specific weapons from HK, getting exactly what they want after months of r&d and STILL rejecting them.
Trials periods dragging on, having your gun perform exemplary- no adoption, current adopted rifle is fine.
Every engineer feels the same way I'm sure lol
@@blackwoodsecurity531 aah yes, the two HK SMG prototypes come to mind. At least they were able to further develop them into the UMP
100%👍 It’s a universal truth, bureaucrats/bureaucracy is the central bane and primary root of failure of centralized government; irrespective of the flavor (democracy, communist, et al).
Blackwood Security or how about that one time that they did trials for a new camo pattern. Then after the trials ended a general decided to insert a new camo pattern that didn't blend in with shit and picked it because it looked kinda cool to him and it ended up getting soldiers killed in the Middle East because of it and of course like always nothing bad happens to the higher ups and the average man gets punished for it.
If only John Browning could have been there too.
No doubt, i went with J Garand ;-b
Neither man has anything on Mr. Browning
@@jimbob465 I think Kalashnikov definitly has something on browning mate 👍
People, you just can't compare anyone with anyone, John Browning was a man of his time as was Kalashnikov, they were designing firearms in accordance of situation. Both of them deserve respect of their own.
Imagine
I speak both English and Russian and it's interesting that sometimes the translator did not translate some technical terms well enough but even so Kalashnikov and Stoner automatically understand what the other meant despite the not so perfect translation.
I also speak both as foreign languages. I speak both at proficient level. It is good to understand both and to see where the translation is not so good. I have also been translating live speech, it is not so easy- especially when both of the languages you are translating are not your native languages.
I was concerned when stoner started speaking for 3 minutes straight with no pause
They could grasp what each other was trying to say because they both were so genius at design, certain aspects are the same from both sides
@ To be fair this was in 1990, with maybe not the best translator, but even so they seemed to convey the important messages back and fourth well enough.
English is my native language, and I know a good bit of Russian. His translation wasn’t 100%, but I’m sure Kalashnikov got the gist of it.
My favorite part was watching Kalashnikov enjoying a Sunkist Orange soda 😁
Tastes like capitalism.
yum
I cannot drink Sunkist. Instantly induces a headache to me
@@youtubeisgarbage900 lol. Even just tasting it gives me a headache. I haven't regularly drank soda in years
@@youtubeisgarbage900 that's all I drink now. And milk
8:00 is truly a magical moment. As soon as Stoner goes into showing the gas tube system you can see Kalashnikov's eye's lock directly onto the rifle. Even know they can't understand each other you get the feeling Kalashnikov knows exactly what Stoner is saying! Man what a thing to witness.
Russian language uses similar words for some gun components and metals (titanium in Russian is similar sound to English, bolt is a commonly heard word) so he probably understood some basic English words
I'm Brazilian, speak Portuguese and fluent English, never had a Russian class in my life, but I can understand a lot of what is said in Russian about firearms since I know what's going on with the gun and what is being pointed at, even when the video is Russian without a translation... If we really like something we gain a certain understanding that goes beyond language (and I am not a gun designer, only a student of engineering, imagine how much more Mr Kalash knows)
@@fregyt ôlllpppppppppiiiiuuu¥) !!!£
@@eduardocharlier7560 to my ears (being only an English speaker) Portuguese has always sounded like a blend of Spanish and Russian. I don’t know the history of both languages, but it just seems like at some point their paths crossed.
Interesting that being a Portuguese speaker that you kinda confirmed that.
@@literallyshaking8019 well, that wasn't really where I was going with my comment since Portuguese and Russian gave only a few common words (the ones in Russian with Latin origins), that said you are not the first to tell me Portuguese and Russian sound alike (and in fact I find it so myself, even if I have no clue what Russian words mean the pronunciation comes easy).
Edit: my original point is how graphic Mr kalashnikov is in his explanations, pointing at the right parts etc, which coupled with words like "patroni" which I know means cartridge (not so in Portuguese, which would be munição/cartucho), I pretty much get what he means about function, and get lost on the stories...
cool thing too is that they both served in WW2
Serving their country in more way than one
Thats exactly why the guns they designed are timeless; 2 of, if not the best rifle platforms. They were designed by men who fought in real harsh combat and saw first hand everything that could be improved when it came to their assigned rifles
They used to be allies while fighting the war then found each other on the oposite sides of the cold war to become friends at the ends of their lives
Kalashnikov was a tank crewman, so the AK was built like a tank; Stoner maintained weapons for fighter planes, so the AR was built like a plane.
@@tlshortyshorty5810how has that influenced the design
15:24.......so youre telling me this dude went black powder shooting with Eugene Stoner and Mikhail Kalashnikov on the Smithsonian's budget? Thats gotta be one hell of a story to hear
Bless the man who not only decided to bring these two legends together, but to film it.
Imagine if John Browning was still around at the time to have participated...
Browning had a similar relationship with John Pedersen, his contemporary
Browning was much more accomplished but he regarded Pedersen as the future of arms design and the better gunsmith
Can’t forget Samuel Colt
I heard that Colt was more of a businessman and the famous six shot revolver was designed by Browning.
@@smileydog5941 you heard incorrectly
Imagine if Maxim was also there, together these four men will represent some tens of millions of death everywhere.
Russians tend to be very stoic people. You can tell kalashnikov was really enjoying himself by the fact that he smiles alot in this interview. They had alot of respect for one another.
Thank you so much for posting these interviews. I had no idea Stoner and Kaleshnikov ever met. What a remarkable moment in time!
two legends
Yes met several times
people wielding these rifles have met each other many times and often kill each other
They became friends actually.
@@wheelgunslingers can you give some examples of designers killing each other
They both speak gun
I’m sure Mr. Kalashnikov had already broken down that rifle back in the 60s just as our guys were looking at the Soviet and Chinese weapons as they came in.
Them discussing the ridiculousness of the army chief of staff's demand for a forward assist was my favorite part. "Military men are the same everywhere." "Ya they love to defy the laws of physics" lol
Shoot, it does come in handy sometimes. Nonbelievers really ought to crawl around some more, save some oxygen for everybody else.
@@KH-rt3ef So the guy that designed the rifle should have crawled around some more and saved oxygen for the rest of us? Ooookaaay.....
The demand for the forward assist was due to the lack of a bolt handle to hammer on. No Kalashnikov has ever had that problem, and I would argue that for it's many other grievous faults, an AK is far more likely to *not be broken* by having the bolt kicked shut (or hammered open with a rock because it froze).
@@KH-rt3ef If enough dust and mud get into the system to cause the bolt to not close, then:
1) You probably didn't close the dust cover like you should have
2) You definitely shouldn't be making the problem worse by forcefully kicking the bolt in
Interesting that the forward assist saved Kyle Rittenhouse's life against Gaige Grosskreutz.
This is a very significant historical document. Thank you to the Smithsonian for filming it and thank you Bakelite N Waffles for posting it.
Bakelite N Waffles in association with the Smithsonian 🤣
@@alexs1972 he wishes 😂😂😂
Too bad they suppress and destroy other information.
@@alexs1972lol
@@charliemartin4392like what?
I love how Kalashnikov corrects the translator behind the scenes at 18:40 about his M16 - AR confusion
What did he say?
@@baileyclifford2852 he said that americans don't usually call the rifles AR and that it's better to call them by M designationd. At least that is what I managed to hear before the sound went out
@@baileyclifford2852 or the other way around. I listened to it again and heard "They call it AR". Before that the translator asked if M16 and AR16 are the same thing. I also heard Kalashnikov say something like "don't worry, it's just a name"
@@Paul_Sergeyev Oh i see, thank you! I really wish they would have hired a more experienced translator for such a prominent historical meeting like this, but i guess we were lucky to see this footage at all!
@@baileyclifford2852 yeah, me too! It seems that this translation really didn't know much about weapons
Some of the still shots that could be pulled from these two together are wholesome to behold. What an amazing thing that Mr. Ed Ezell did to bring both of these men together so that we could have an opportunity to see them reflect on both of their innovations that changed the course of history, I wish all of these men were still with us today to see how much American civilians love both of these small arms. And thanks to the OP for uploading these videos so that we can finally enjoy them after more than three decades in the Smithsonian.
gorgeous backdrop too. two legends nondoubtb
I was thinking the same thing maybe I can get a poster made
These rifles are very much sought after and cherished world wide. Individually these men will have shaped history more than the mightiest of kings.
I like that immediately after the first translation Eugene realized he needed to make his comments shorter so they were easier to translate.
Stoner: biggest problem with M16A2 is complicated sight and 3 round burst
M4A1: Simplified sight and no burst
He knew what he was about.
“The A2 is going to cause more problems”
Paraphrased
“Yes, soldiers will mess with the rear sight like on the M1”
Me a former soldier “jokes on you, the army only taught me to mess with it when zeroing and, then never mess with it again. I only used 3 round burst once in my life, (in basic when the DS needed to get rid of a bunch of unexpended blank ammo that they could not turn in live)”
You're not lying about 3 round burst. The only time I ever used it was during some contracted training when they were teaching suppressing fire drills for egress movements. It's a good way to almost definitely miss 2/3 of all your shots, burn through all your combat load of ammo, and heat up your barrel. I assume there are some merits to semi-accurate fire in greatly increased volume from several individuals dumping 3 round bursts in your direction. I wouldn't know. Every TIC I was ever in was vs AKs, RPKs, and PKMs and they were all firing full-auto bursts. (Well, minus one terrifying instance by the Helmand River involving a DShK, *shudders*).
One important caveat is that all of my combat experience took place outdoors and usually between 100-300 meters (of course there were plenty of instances of a burst or a few shots at us from longer ranges, but I rarely had any reasonable way to respond to some guy spraying a pkm at me from cover from 500m with my m4, even after replacing my Aimpoint with an ACOG). My response in that scenario was: Don't get shot, try to locate the shooter and communicate that to the 240s and the designated marksmen with .308s and LPVOs. I can't really speak as to whether 3 round burst would be something that I would have found useful in practice during CQB/MOUT. I know that I do not feel like a competent semi-auto AR platform rifle is any less effective in 99% of scenarios than an M4 or a full-auto variant. At least that's been my limited, but more informed than most, experience.
Is there a good reason to mess with sights in field conditions?
I understand elevation adjustment but I’ve never dicked with windage on a gun with iron sights.
@The_SmorgMan I concur, but when using a weapon of heaver such as the FAL, Accidental dropping the rifle under combat conditions will seriously affect
@The_SmorgMan I concur, but when using a weapon of heaver such as the FAL, Accidental dropping the rifle under combat conditions will seriously affect
@@Jermdizzle In my unit we were never aloud to fire on Full Auto , but three rd burst was ok.
В голове не укладывается, что с того момента прошло уже 30 лет.
❤️
Time flies. Hi from Tennessee in America.
@@samh3805 hello fellow Tennessean
Time flies by.
Да, прошло много времени
I love how around 23:45 Mr Kalashnikov is swatting a fly away from the rifle
Lol Eugene Stoner was spot on about the burst firing problem the US military was bound to have. He predicted it almost 30 years before they made the change. Notice how the us military switched from the burst M16A4 and M4 carbine to the M4A1.
One thing I would add is that the M4 introduced a new problem, its carbine gas tube would make the M4 wear a lot faster than the M16s gas length,, Im surprised to see that the mid gas system is relatively new thing and solves the overpressuring problems the M4 had. Too bad it doesnt matter since the military is looking to replace the AR lineup.
His translator called the muzzle device front sight. Eugene Stoner was explaining how titanium muzzle devices were replaced and the translator botched it horribly, lol. Hurts to watch if you speak both
I'd be interested to see if he was a government translator for either country or just some dude they hired on their own, because it's frankly surprising to see how many comments are saying this kind of thing when you look at most cross country interaction, media, the UN ect and they are basically doing it real time.
Stoner was talking about trying to use titanium for BOTH the front sight block and muzzle device. So the translator wasnt inaccurate.
@@John_Redcorn_ the translator didn't make that distinction originally, and the whole video is pockmarked with such instances
You need to speak 3 languages to understand this conversation Russian, English and firearm. Maybe the translator only spoke 2. I don’t think it is very common to be completely fluent in any 2 languages. I am sure almost anyone who has a job where alot of technical terminology is used would have a hard time translating that level of technical expertise into any other language.
@@icepickstabski8823 i feel ya. I'm glad he did at least 80% correct, in some sense at least.
Two brilliant men who answered their nations' call with truly remarkable designs. John Browning would have been impressed with them both. Some people may attempt to mischaracterize their achievements as mere jingoism or warmongering, but such associations are oversimplified, grossly naïve and short-sighted.
Very interesting video.
This video is being recommended to me exactly 34 years. May 20, 2024
Приятно видеть дружбу двух гениев. Тем более из разных стран и культур
Two of the most influential weapon designers in modern history civilly discussing their respective designs. This is perfect. Thank you for uploading.
Two legends having a calm discussion and respect for each others design....
When he mentions @16:00 that bad ammo led the army to believe that the rifle was no good, I wanted so badly in that moment for Mikhail to stop him with “nyet, rifle is fine!” What a superb interview.
The translator totally butchered that part. Instead of saying that the problem was propellant and not the gun, he just "translated" something about gun being unreliable at first.
@@azzazel225 From what i understood with my broken russian, he said that: 1. there was powder fit for the gun, 2. when "they" changed it, rifle no good.... idk, might me wrong, but translator did good
Хорошо, что опубликовали этот интересный исторический момент - встречу двух выдающихся конструкторов из разных противостоящих ранее государств! Спасибо за видео!
а я уже думал ниодного русского в коментах
@@abdulabdanahib9617 ага
Ранее?
This is literally a historic moment. Sad to think it could never happen again
As a marine that’s shot thousands of rounds through the M16A4, the forward assist has always been an addition that makes you feel like you’re doing something when you’re really not. I’ve been told to use it many times, but it’s never fixed anything that re-racking or clearing the chamber with a finger hasn’t fixed.
This comment deserves more attention
The Forward assist is the most useless feature in the AR.
The “Close Elevator” button
Beta Gun Buyers: “NoOOo! You can’t like both platforms! You have to choose one and ONLY one!”
Sigma Gun Designers: “Your gun is nice.”
“Thanks, your gun is pretty nice too.”
Then in comes the 7.62x39 ar. I have one and love it. If only someone could make good magazines
If it is a gun, then this goblin likes it.
Always AK that's why AR is on my back..... Tatoo
I prefer m16 but ak 47 also cool
AK is great, But M16/AR can do it as well.
Whats funny is theyve probably seen each others rifles a million times during various inspections for design competition.
I was thinking the same thing.
“The ruined my baby for no good reason.”
Not a lot of people understand how close our ties are with Russia / the soviet union in certain realms of reality. It's really nice to see these two together. I believe Eisenhower once gave a fishing tackle to Zhukov, probably the most victorious general of WW2, and Zhukov cherished it for the rest of his life.
I’m not super familiar with Zhukov but I have heard at least the main details about how he started relatively lowly as an officer and managed to incredibly work all his way up to the top. He really does come off as a quiet genius, easily the peer of any of the best generals during that war. He also seemed to be quite likeable too, almost every picture I’ve seen of him he is smiling for some reason or another.
zhukov also called truman just for a coca cola fix
@@i4lmpatience945 does this mean he was his coke dealer
It's a shame, since Russia was so crucial to the defeat of the Nazis, and afterwards Russia tried to join NATO. The west really should give more respect to Russia
One of the greatest tragedies of the post war era is that we did not remain allies with the USSR.
I think I agree with Larry Vickers assessment in a interview I heard with him discussing the AK vs AR debate with Ian from forgotten weapons. Both are excellent platforms. The AK is a better tool for a WW3 type scenario and for conscript soldiers, simpler to use, simpler to clean and maintain and needs less spare parts. While the AR is a bit more refined but also has downsides, it can be made more accurate with a free floated barrel etc, more modular by design, with great ergonomics is really well suited for high end operators like special forces. long term deployment and adverse conditions impact the AR more in a negative way, logistically in spare parts, and in malfunctions; in a special forces type context (in and out missions) it doesn't play much of a factor. In a perfect world the main mass production weapon for the army would be a AK type weapon, and ARs would be used by veteran elite units who value pure performance over robust reliability and simplicity.
Dude this comment rotted my fucking brain
I have a fork. I have a russian fork. Theyre both fucking forks. Some forks fucking suck. In this scenario, both forks have good and bad attributes. This weird video game stat larp around guns is fucking insufferable.
@@DeadEndGoose Very ironic you talk about brain rotting comments, because you managed to say nothing of value at all, in-fact I don't even know what you are trying to say other than whining. You want insufferable, look in a mirror.
Imagine walking into the sporting store and seeing the caliber and case size you developed being sold by the 1000s, amazing
Both legends. Its so cool to have these guys talk. Soviet/Russian designs are always cool to see because they live somewhat isolated from the west and design everything to be self-sufficient from western supply chains. You end up with a much different design philosophy.
Quite ironic since the AK long stroke system is inspired by the M1 Garand's own.
@@StormerSixActual who told you that? Sincerely.
@@StormerSixActualModern America's education ladies and gentlemen.
@@sr-456yakn3 Okay but I'm Indonesian
So youtube been an ass because I can't seem to link the book nor the article here because it is always been taken down.
Nevertheless Kalashnikov himself said that Garand is one of his influence, this statement came from the book Kalashnikov The Arms and The Man, which is written by Edward Clinton Ezell, a man who interviewed Kalashnikov himself.
I tried to link an article since the past days and always, RUclips takes it down, but you should be able to search it by typing "Rifle Paternity Test: Pinning Down The M1 Garand’s Influence On The AK"
Absolutely magical. You can see how their understanding of things on the technical level is so great that they're able to go beyond the language barrier at time while discussing things. Them being able to meet and exchange ideas is truly beautiful.
Timestamp 48:00 is an interesting one.
Stoner was referring to the A2 as if it were still under trials despite being in service in 83 with the Corps and 86 with the Army. Granted the A2 saw service alongside the A1 in Grenada and Panama, but it seems like he wanted to see it in tried in hard combat like in the Gulf and Iraq War.
Stoner also mentions the possibility of an A3 not having any changes in functionality other than the RISystem for optics, but nearly a decade later, the USN would end up requiring full-auto for the A3.
Stoner mentioning the optics is amazing. Optics weren’t standard issue for the regular Riflemen and Infantrymen so it’s interesting he mentioned it. Only time I remember seeing optics used regularly by grunts in photos was in the late 90’s with M4 Carbines with M68 CCOs in Kosovo and Aimpoint Goosenecks in Iraq.
They both agreed that the H&K G11 was not the rifle of the future.
Take what I say with a grain of salt. Never served nor knew any firearms in detail. This is just my speculation from research as I collected US surplus from the late 80’s.
I kinda wish that we'd actually had an alien invasion around that time so that Eugene Stoner and Mikhail Kalashnikov could join forces to develop Earth's greatest assault rifle. I mean, don't tell me you WOULDN'T want an assault rifle with the durability and simplicity of an AK with the functionality and quality of an AR.
If aliens had the technology to invade earth we would all be wiped out with ease.
@@BJJISTHEGAYPARTOFMMA what if they only ever invented melee weapons?
Stoner already developed that rifle. It's called the AR-15.
@johnnytyler5685 yes. That's the response was looking for. So many think the ak is so much more reliable than the ar but real life testing does not agree
"durability, simplicity, functionality and quality." Just like the AR-15 already is.
I never would of thought that Stoner and Kalashnikov did an interview like this. Wow this is crazy and boys and Girls in 1990 Russia was the Soviet union which makes this even weirder that this took place.
No, in 1990 it is already Russia, not Uni-Sovyet
The official dissolution of the USSR was on December 26th, 1991, but the pieces for the dissolution were already put in place by the late 1980’s. After the fall of the Berlin Wall, it was only a matter of time before the Soviet Republics officially separated into their own sovereign countries.
@@JesusFriedChristNot really. The USSR could still be saved, but the hardline stalinists ruined everything.
As an engineer/ gun enthusiast/ Marine, this is awesome to watch these 2 discussing the birth of this rifle. I’m glad this was videotaped for historical purposes.
This meeting is mind boggling. Two titans of arms innovation from different sides of the world & the war, sitting at the same table in friendly conversation about their inventions. Truly historic footage & hammers home the importance of peace in our modern world.
46:46 I couldn't agree more with Mikhail Kalashnikov if anybody can make a better fighting rifle than him and Gene Stoner they will get together shake their hands! These two men made the finest 2 fighting rifles of all time!
seeing these two legends of firearm history talk is so cool
"It is not the guns that are tested, but the designers who are dropped (on concrete)" Mikhail referring to the stress testing process
This is a legendary video. I’m so glad I came across it. I had never even considered what these two legends meeting would be like. May they both Rest In Peace for eternity
“Is there going to be an M16 A3? “ Heckler & Koch : YES
When two legends meet
Truly this is a historical moment
Too bad they never collaborated. I’d love to see an AR with a kalash bolt and cam track design with an AR gas system and buffer setup. I hate how complex the AR is to field strip and how difficult the star chamber is to clean. Absolutely awesome video
See Robinson Armament XCR.
Hmm, I thought the piston system on the AK would be something to keep, as well as the recoil system.
@@mikebastiat buffers shoot smoother with less bolt bounce and have a straight back and forth impulse in line with your shoulder. The AR gas system saves a fuck ton of weight and Is softer shooting because of it.
@@georgebigr Sure, but the buffer system seems so much more sketchier and involved. I've seen springs, detents, backplates, stocks, and buffer tubes and springs, all fall apart at once. Without a stock, you can't fire an AR. It may be smoother, but is it reliable? To me it seems bad to depend on a stock to cycle the weapon. The AK recoil spring in my mind is superior to buffer weights (which need to be right), tubes, etc.
@@mikebastiat the system is dope doesn’t mean the current design is. Go check out KE arms monolithic lower for example. Could combine that with a JP SCS and suddenly you’ve got no little parts to break. Theoretically you only need one buffer weight for a given setup and it should be tuned and mass produced that way.
Best thing to watch when you are alone and there is peace in the house.
I remember these days as a kid when the cold of a long winter was thawing and we felt like the future was ours we sat together and realized we had much more in common than not.
I loved AK’s and Russian weapons because of red dawn in the 80’s now after many years of being familiar, intimately familiar with the AR platform I do prefer it.
This is beautiful.
Same. I own both platforms and I prefer my AR platform to my AK platform. I have fewer issues with my AR than my AK. The AK isn't as "reliable" as people say it is.
The production isn't great and to me, that makes it even more fascinating- it's real.
When Mr Kalisnikov says 'your design is simple' thats the highest compliment.
I like how they both laughed and joked of their opposition of each other. Both amazing men and heroes to their country. Respect to both.
P.S. Kalashnikov drinking Sunkist goes hard af
The most awaited crossover event of the last century.
this reminds me of that old meme that said: "Name a more iconic duo, I'll wait" 🤣
hint: there is not
Still looking for a eugene account
Neither of these guys ever had to shake anyone else’s hand in their respective countries. AK and AR are still the two top dogs
Kalashnikov drinking a Sunkist! That's so funny! I love it
Eugene Stoner was such a Chad. Changed the M16/M4/AR15 world. God bless, Stoner. Mikhail created the most iconic rifle in the world; even used on Mozambique's flag. Again: phenomenal design, and simplicity. It’s art. Rest in Peace Kalashnikov!
What do you mean by changed the M16/M4/AR15 world? He created that world 😂 😂
Two legends coming together like this is almost unheard of
Kalashnikov understood what H&K demonstrated in their "over the beech test". At least when there is submersion fire, it will rupture the gas tube. Just taking it out of the water and letting it drain for a few moments prevents that, however, as Stoner says.
Man, I really like how they are just staying calm, not fighting!
May both of them Rest in Peace.
How am I just seeing this now after all these years. This entire conversation from start to finish is fascinating. Wow was this cool.
i love how these dudes met randomly and loved exploring each-other’s different ideas.
Love how the two men speak TO each other, even while requiring a translator. Mutual Respect.
Geniuses together.
I've seen bits of this video several times but never the entire interview. Thanks so much for posting it.
What a moment in history man! Two legends being civil and discussing the passion of their trade
It would be interesting to see what these two guys could come up with if they had to work together to build a rifle.
Ak-15
M47
It would have to be politically correct and be able to identify and gender fluid so if in battle it needed to go to both bathrooms.
@@KPMACHINE1you sound fucking insane. This is a video about two of the most influential firearms designers in the world and you want to bring trans people into this somehow
@@vividfiber6668 you'll never bee a rel women.
That time Stoner said the m16 doesn't need a forward assist.
I didn't know that.
Yep, it was forced upon his design. Should never even touch it.
What possible jam can be solved by jamming it more? I just don't get it.
It was a problem created by taking the charging handle from its original position inside the carry handle.
A more elegant fix for the advent of Picatinny rails would have been to turn it 90 degrees and keep it reciprocating.
William M. It’s pretty useful in arctic environments. Until you’ve put about a full mag through to warm it up you’ll get jams when trying to shoot in negative temps. It likes to not let the bolt all the way back forward because any oils or even just condensation will freeze and stop it from fully chambering. I’ve used the forward assist many times in sub zero temps.
I guess you can use it to quietly chamber a round, since the bolt needs a little momentum to close completely in some cases.
It's why the first ever prototypes never had it. It is why the navy did not have it for the time. And it is why the sr25 does not have it
LOOK at those two names. This has to be one of the most historical and significant firearms events recorded on tape
Two of the most creative minds in the history of human kind, one with a communist background and the other one with capitalist background but in general the most iconic weapons ever designed. Great video every guns enthusiast has to watch this videos regardless of political differences two guys talk about their inventions how they thought they had advantages over the other design features, functions, materials etc etc.
No hate, no bullshit. Just two men being friends.
Great minds think alike. The goals with their respective rifles were the weight reduction of the rifle. One did it with sheet metal, the other did it with aluminum forgings.
Боже мой, насколько более цивилизованным был конец холодной войны. Лично я, как американец, не имею претензий к вам в России.
Мы не стремимся к войне с вами, друзья мира. Мы с вами с одного дерева.
If only Eugene stoner could see the M16/M4 of today. Its a whole new gun since 1997 when he died.
Literally nothing in the design has changed whatsoever
@@japarsell the way it works is the same, but there have been lots of changes. Adjustable length of pull, Free float rails, mounting systems, optics, better feed ramps, different barrel materials, lengths, twist rates, and contours, gas and buffer systems, modern bolts and ejectors, etc. Also we have piston AR's now lol
@@japarsell buy a M16a2 clone then buy a 10.3-16" modern AR15 with Mlok free floated rails, picatinny top rail and adjustable stock. Compare the two side by side and then realize how much the AR has changed. After that, go ahead and delete your ignorant comment.
Weird. It's like if you were to strip all the stuff you mentioned off it'd look just like it does in this video. Delete your own comment you doofus
@@harrisonhellmich81 Yeah, it changed so much that it would fail the original trials that led to its adoption. Stoner made a light rifle then the military made it fat and added useless features like the bolt assist or heavy barrels.
Yo you can tell these two man have very deep level of respect for one another, and on top of that they probably never thought they would have the chance to sit and have a normal conversation with one another. This is truly beautiful and im glad that its here for the world to see ❤❤❤
When Stoner mentioned that cleaning was necessary with 2k cartridges, I could see a smirk on Mikhail's face.
Cleaning AK is important. Not as important, but please do!!!!
Interesting to remember that these two men designed their guns in the 1940s and 1960s
Majority of the design work of the ar-15 came from the ar-10 which was a early/mid 1950s design. Its a little bit of semantics but helps to clarify that the two rifles were designed roughly in the same era
This is an incredible piece of history
You get the sense that both of these fellas are the good guys.
Both are patriots who worked hard for the success of their respective countries.
Shame the audio cuts out when Mikhail and the translator are talking. Really neat seeing this. Thanks for sharing.
31:48 Kalashnikov said that he is very heart broken to see his designs being used by the enemy or by anyone that's not using it for Russia. Im sure he didnt find it that funny when Stoner mentioned fighting against the VietCong with their chinese supplied Type 56 rifles (AK47 design)
Considering Vietnam was warmer with the USSR than with China even with Chinese soldiers fighting for Vietnam, I’m sure Kalashnikov didn’t mind since spreading the USSR’s influence is a good thing from his nation’s perspective. (Btw Type 56 also refers to SKS which China supplied a lot more of than the AK version of the Type 56)
@@thelieutenant7732 China is more of a "You are my enemy but this time there is a bigger enemy so you can "help" us just this time"
@@thelieutenant7732 From what he's spoken in other records, he was never a fan of his designs being used in conflict, but he saw it necessary to defend the nation and protect the people, so he did his best regardless. I won't bother getting into anything besides what he said.
Fun fact: China later fought 2 wars against Vietnam after the Americans left. During the first one they had their arses handed to them because most of their AKs were supplied to the North Vietnamese, while their own troops mostly had the SKS 😑 that's what's led to the development of the Type 81
@@thelieutenant7732 Keep in mind that, by 1969, the Sino-Soviet split was in full effect. By 1972 China's relationship with the US was stronger than with the Soviet Union.
Two Absolute Legends in the firearms world. They have faced each other in combat Uncountable times. They have won and defeated each other around the world. To see these Legends sit beside one another and discuss their designs, trials, and tribulations is nothing short of Awesome. I don't want the over use of that word to limit it's meaning. Awesome-to inspire Awe, Awe-A feeling of reverential respect mixed with fear or wonder.
I can't wait to see this all over the place. /k/
The most genuine, kind & respectful “AR vs AK” debate I’ve ever witnessed, occurred after the Cold War between so-called Enemies.
Take notes young folks… this is respect.
I was very impressed by the translator for just how much he could translate in one setting maybe I never seen it live like that before but it was impressive.
I knew they met, but thought it was more like the kind of photos and short talk meeting for some magazines. Over one hour of conversation is just nice.
In 1990 the ussr was still in existence, the fact these two who held the secrets of the main battle rifles of both countries could meet is amazing and the conversation was as civil and wholesome as any Weapon designers could have
Pov: you and your homie each hadda make a physics project and show it to the teacher and you both passed
The RUclips algorithm Gods have smiled upon me today. What a find!
Rhodesians never die!
Absolutely incredible watching this piece of history! Thanks for uploading it 👍💗
This video is great! Thanks guys!!!!!
I wish they could have come together to create the greatest assault rifle of all time.
They each did for their own countries needs.
Both rifles are perfect in the context of each country's doctrine
Thecoolnerdplays VR that they did, I just wish I could have seen what they could have come up together.
Carbine is probably a better term than assault rifle
@@collinlynch4569 ahem either scar H, or sig 552
Flavortown I agree with the SIG 552 and even the SIG 556.
Amazing. Thanks for sharing this!
seeing these two old engineering wizards agreeing over so many things shows why both platforms are so relevant today. so glad this meeting took place.
Shout out to the absolute unit that managed to get these two to sit down at a picnic table in middle of nowhere Virginia
Star Tannery is pretty much the middle of nowhere. It's absolutely gorgeous there, but definitely off the beaten path.
If only Wilhelm Stähle and Ludwig Vogrimler were there. For those who ain't aware of them, they were the Mauser engineers who invented the roller delayed blowback system, made the first roller delayed blowback assault rifle StG45.
Ludwig later went on to develop the CETME Model 58 rifle which later evolved into HK G3, HK33, and HK G41.