Genshin Lore|| Vishaps and Primordial life: Dragons in Teyvat
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- Опубликовано: 6 июл 2024
- Musings on the Vishaps and the Seven Sovereigns that ruled the world before Teyvat was formed by the Primordial one. I delve into the prophecy of the Sovereigns' rebirth and the backgrounds of the dragons we've met in-game.
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Игры
Kokomi is Chekhov’s water gun
No. She's a Water Gun.
No. She's a Kokomi.
Wow, you nailed it. The Dragon of Water was born in human form - Neuvillette
Not only Kokomi is Sleeping Dragon, her baby doll has details in light blue on one side and purple on the other, like a reference to the cryo and electro vishaps from enkanomiya
Her title card also features those crooked plants only found on Enkanomiya
Also on her legendary mission, voiceline and demo its strongly suggested that she can breathe underwater. This is not a hydro vision perk
she was also saying that her ancestors saw the real sky and stars in her demo trailer!
@@huasaihun she said "stary sky" it is likely the current one...
@@Sacration if as in ancestors mean vishaps then no they saw the real sky before the “genshin firmament” (the starry sky we see now) was created by primordial one or second who came (most likely current celestia)
Lol
This aged TERRIBLY
That isnt the only clues to that Kokomi is the dragon sovereign! Kokomi and Watatsumi/Enkanomiya is based on Otohime and the dragon king palace. Otohime was the daughter of the dragon king/god Ryujin and the palace was a beautiful building that was created from red and white coral, but in it, time slowed down. It is pretty easy to see that they split the properties of the palace in two to create Enkanomiya where time is slowed down, and Watatsumi that is built of corals. There are even myths that tell how Ryujin beat the crap out of jellyfishes and thats why they have no bones in their bodies. Thats probably why Kokomi has a jellyfish that has healing properties.
Oh and the reason why Sucrose tried to stop Albedo when creating the Vishap was because he got bored of drawing it and didnt finish it completely before trying to bring it to life. He is notorious for drawing very detailed when interested but only doing the bare bones when he isnt interested. You would kind of expect a half completed drawing to not be able to live and just suffer until it died.
I want more kokomi lore. She has been too busy with her duties - even during Irodori visit...
[26:09] This "detail" about the Pyro element has been haunting me since Enka first released... Like, I can't shake the feeling that this has something to do with the unknown situation in *Natlan* and the Pyro Cube's "number" leaping so much in it's "order", like the Pyro archon is constantly dying and being replaced for some reason...
*Wei* made a video on this theory that the Cubes' *codenames* follow the *Hebrew alphabet* and always pair with an Archon (simulating the Vishap Sovereigns?), going as:
1st, *Aleph* (Electro)
2nd, *Beth* (Anemo)
3rd, *Gimel* (Geo)
4th, *Daleth* (Cryo)
5th, *He* (Hydro)
6th, *Vav* *(SKIPPED)* _(Rukkhadevata's original cube?)_
7th, *Zayin* (Dendro)
8th~15th, *(ALL 8 SKIPPED)* _(Failed archons? Fire Dragon somewhat alive, so it's power can't be inherited?)_
16th, *Ayin* (Pyro)
The sleeping dragon is also a reference to Zhuge Liang, a famous strategist in the romance of the three kingdoms
I like how you came to a conclusion that Durin is of the Void element. I've given thought of this myself, and I had always been thinking that he's most likely, yes, Pyro. The only things that make me think that way are: the Crimson Agate (to an extent the Frostbearing Tree), his beating heart, and the Scarlet Quartz.
If, the Scarlet Quartz are made due to his "poison' seeping into the mountain, (I believe this due to the whole crimson / red theme going on against the white snow) then him being Pyro element wound relate to how Scarlet Quartz give us pyro infusion attacks and stave off Sheer Cold. This alongside with how he's depicted as covered by fires match as well.
27:06
My friend, I've been thinking almost the same thing lately. What if the moons are not dead? But they were exiled and everyone just assumed they were dead because they took on different identities. Like the Goddess of Flowers. Or maybe Gold.
And what if (this one is also very tin foily) Guizhong was actually one of the shades of the primordial one?
She was very knowledgeable
She was older than Zhong Li
She was weak (maybe weakened by the exile or an injury of sort)
She loved glaze lilies and they bloom in the evening aka in the moonlight (from 18:00 to 6:00 in game) like nilotpala lotus.
She was also very interested in Khaenri'ah technology.
She was the archon of Dust. And I know this is a stretch, but dust has so much temporal connotation. Like when dust is used to show that something's old, ancient. The passing of time.
Also the etymology of her name, "Guizhong (Chinese: 归终) is a legendary Chinese beast mentioned in the Yiwen Leiju. It is a type of 狌狌 xīngxīng, a legendary ape-like beast said to know all about the past but cannot know the future"(from Genshin wiki)
I wonder if what she hid in the memory of dust could actually be the forbidden knowledge.
This is a double tin foil theory but, she even might have helped Sea Gazer with the creation of the Fantastic Compass. And it moves you in...time. Guizhong did help Adepti build the Realm of the Clouds and the Ballista, after all. She could very much also help build the compass.
As I watched this video and got to the part about the vishaps being as intelligent as humans, I started to think back to how the hilichurls clearly had their own culture and human intelligence from the beginning, which to me from my prior experience with two anime I won't name here for spoiler reasons, indicated they were probably human. I wondered if it wouldn't be humorous that we get a double plot twist that the primordial one didn't create humans from nothing, but from the vishaps. Such that the monsters (hilichurls) were actually humans all along, but that the humans themselves were monsters (vishaps) all along as well. And then I started to take the idea seriously. I thought back to how humans seemed to be able to manipulate elements prior to the existence of visions (or at least I'm told by others who get deeper into the lore, that this was the case). I thought as to why the water dragon lord must be born to humans simply because the hydro vishaps have been corrupted. It only really makes sense if humans are at least related to vishaps as distant cousins. Otherwise, why humans and not something more similar in biology to amphibious lizards like the axolotls in Liyue or unagi? (I'm sure my taxonomy is wrong and they're not close to vishaps either, but you get what I'm saying.) Surely, even a pyro or anemo vishap would be more closely related to the dragon lord of depths than a human, if humans are not cursed/mutated vishaps and should therefore be first in line to becoming the dragon lord of depths. Humans being modified vishaps also explains why they're both vulnerable to abyssal energy, while human weakness to elemental energy could be from their curse.
If the gods of Celestia have the power to curse humanity into hilichurls with a curse that exists on a higher plane of reality than the victims themselves do, then whether the gods of Celestia are the primordial one and its shades or not, as long as the first who came and the second who came are comparable in abilities, the primordial one should also have had the power to curse vishaps into the form of humans. And if the primordial one is indeed based on the demiurge that wishes to keep humanity from accessing its divine spark, it makes sense if it keeps humanity ignorant to their powerful vishap origins.
And for me, that resolves the biggest issue I had with believing that the first who came had triumphed over the second who came. I couldn't understand how a god who defeated the vishaps and created humanity would be so terrified of the spread of the story in Before Sun and Moon to the point it would throw celestial nails everywhere and lock Enkanomiyans in the depths. The story doesn't paint the primordial one in a bad light at all, it could only ruin the reputation of the second who came if they are the current rulers of Celestia. But if Before Sun and Moon is not the full truth, and instead that it obscures the truth that the primordial one crafted humans from vishaps, then it makes a lot more sense. Then it's better for the primordial one to bury even its own white-washed story and make something up completely different.
In that case, when Ei said that there is another part to granting visions, as many others have said, the visions may be a limiter on the unlocking of the original vishap abilities that humans have. And thus, the element of the vision a human gains is the element of the kind of vishap they would be if not for the primordial one's meddling. Or, because the visions are limiters, the visions could be the opposite element to what the vision wielder would have in their vishap form. Just like pyro neutralizes cryo better than the reverse in elemental gauge theory, pyro visions are given to cryo-vishap-descended humans to effectively curtail their power.
The vishap-people myth may have actually been a way around Irminsul-censoring or similar about the origin of humanity as vishaps like Nahida's fairy tale about Scaramouche.
Further on, in the second Albedo/Dragonspine event, I believe it was said that Albedo, Durin, and they failed Alberto prototype are like brothers. What if that is very literal? What if the nigredo, albedo, citrinitas, and rubedo stages are Gold's attempts to either replicate or reverse the humanization process used on vishaps?
Though where would this theory leave the archons and other gods? I think in the CBT, Zhongli said he descended from Celestia, though I don't know if that origin is true in the live game anymore. I guess they are just other forms of elemental beings that are not vishaps, like eyes of the storm and slimes.
Holy Celestia you're definitely on something here !
Happy New Year Hexenzirkel Initiates (and friends!)
I hope you enjoy this one, and look ahead to another year with new mysteries for us to explore together.
--Ganymede
Edit: I gambled on the power of Kingdom Hearts wrt how to pronounce Chi in this episode and the power of Kingdom Hearts failed me.
When you started talking about Durin in this context I was surprised that you skipped the description of the Dragonspine Spear. The weird implication of Durin being caught in an eternal waking dream even as he wreaked havoc across the Nations, only waking as he lay dying kind of keeps me up at night... But, the more important thing I'm thinking of is the very end of the description during Durin's dying lamentations:
"Now then, this great blessing that pulses through my veins," "And the lovely sight of the dark universe that gave me birth..." "They are now yours to inherit."
Idk, says Void pretty strongly to me lol. Also, I never noticed anything about Kokomi and her constellation!!! Thank you for pointing it out because my mind is now blown. Thank you again for gathering up all these pieces of lore that I forget about and piece them back together for me to scream over to myself at 1 in the morning.
Chi questline grabbed me by the throat and I still wait for more information on it.
Love how you summarize the history of the Vishaps! I suspect Kokomi as the reincarnation of the hydro vishap. I mean her demo music isn't based off Japanese music like with other Inazuma characters, and she mentioned about her ancestors once dwell under dark water depths and wondered how they felt once they saw the starry sky for the first time.
We haven't seem Dendro or Pyro Vishaps yet. I hope that we get to see a Dendro Vishap during the Sumeru update so we get more lore. I do think there's a Void Vishap and I don't have any evidence but just random guesses. I imagine visions as colors. Light is white and is a combination of all colors. When you split white light with a prism, you see all of the colors.
About her demo music, it's probably a watatsumian thing. Gorou also has part of his demo music that sounds enkanomiyan than inazuman. But your points still stands though, im also really curious about what happened to the rest of the elemental vishaps too.
Durin being Pyro would also make sense because going to his remains on Dragonspine warm you up.
*Celestia* vs. *The Fatui* feat. *Abyss Order* - _Youkai Adepti_ [Archons Remix]
Vishaps: "... why nobody listen to our music anymore?"
18:20 I think it is now Neuvillette who was reborn as human
Here kind of early, love the choice of topic!
Edit: This was excellent! I've long awaited a deep dive of this magnitude, thank you Ganymede. So much detail it deserves a rewatch imo.
I actually think there is a lot of evidence to suggest Durin was Pyro because his blood on Dragonspine has properties of Pyro, as it can light braziers, imbue attacks with Pyro, and the fact it can melt ancient rime seems to me like the blood has a high concentration of Pyro, which would suggest Durin was an advanced elemental dragon of Pyro like Dvalin with Anemo and Azhdaha with Geo. And of course him being wreathed in flames in his cut scene. So there is a lot more evidence supporting Durin as the Pyro dragon sovereign than you mentioned here.
just a minor correction for pronunciation of 'Chi", it's not with a 'K' but with a 'Ch' like 'chocolate' or 'chick'
Y'know I almost put a note in there somewhere that I wasn't sure whether it was like "key" or just "chi" but I didn't realize it until I was rendering. Appreciate the confirmation though haha.
Outing myself as a bigger nerd, I 100% went "Well, it's Chi-blade in Kingdom Hearts, so I'll take the gamble" LOL
Tyrants enlisted to ravage the wilderness is so interesting... especially if the entire world outside of Celestia's Teyvat looks like Enkanomiya... dead.
Great video as always!! I love you how bring up topics that I don't really think about too often! well, apart from the kokomi part, I think about that all the time, also, YES, PLEASE, DRAGONSPINE PART 3 WHEN??
uhhh idk what else to say, I'm mainly just commenting because I love you guys' videos, and wanna help the algorithm! anyways, happy new year!!
IM LOVING THE DEEP ANAYSIS OF THE LORE! Plz teach me your ways
Great vid as always! Love the style in which you present these subjects, super interesting and enjoyable to listen to! Also I hadn't noticed that thing about Kokomi's constellation, my jaw dropped to the floor!
I want to know when that clone of Albedo will make an appearance again. He should still be knocking around Dragonspine, but since the event, we haven't heard anything about him.
not gonna lie, hat off to this video, first one i see from this channel and it was pretty informative, love the theories and speculations
The description of how elemental creatures are born of concentrations of elemental energy sure sounds a lot like the description of how Hanyuuda Chizuru / Tsukumogami youkai are born from the recent event. Heizou says she was born because there was a lot of youkai energy around ("You gradually developed sentience after being influenced by great youkai power")
Isn't Zhongli half dragon or atleast a descendant of them? He has some intimate knowledge about them and their people atleast.
Also, the branches at the end of Azhdaha's tail reminds me of an Irminsul tree. And if Irminsul is a computer, maybe part of its original design was based off of the sovereigns and whatever control they had over the natural flow of leylines. I also have two hypothesis on the current disruption of the leylines. One could be connected to the fact that the elements are no longer as pure as they were if electro, cryo, and dendro were created off shoots of the original elements. Second, the dragons were the original beings who had the most intimate connection to the leylines and elements of the world. Forbidden knowledge and cutting them off from those original connections could disrupt they leylines natural flows. Perhaps the original "leylines" were more like veins, but with the coming of the primordial one was alter and manifested into something more like a tree, to take control of Teyvat in some shape or form. Idk if that even makes sense though
Love your theory i think you're into something and yes, zhongli is an hybrid being, half Qilin half dragon!!
Now i'm wondering WHO ARE HIS PARENTS?
Zhongli is supposedly half Dragon, half Qiling. If we suppose that the dragon form was his real form that is...Its kinda hard to trust anything in Genshin anymore. I think some youtuber said that the chinese version hinted to that he is some sort of disgraced prince or has some status according to that, but I dont know chinese so I cannot verify. But its an interesting idea, could beings like dragons that are born from magic, reproduce? We know that Qilin can boink pretty much anything since we have Ganyu, but we dont know the origins of Qilins...
Unfortunately, Zhongli himself isn't a dragon. We actually have yet to discover what he originally was.
He only takes on the form of a Dragon and that, sadly, isn't even entirely a dragon. The exuvia is a dragon/qilin cross.
@@mysticdemon6339There is nothing that say he isnt really a dragon, dragon mix or some other type of dragon, so we cant say he isnt a dragon either. Considering he even have patterns of his dragon form on his clothing, there may be something to him actually being a dragon. But we have no proper proof for either.
Rex Lapis does appear to take the form of a classical Chinese dragon during the Rite of Descension, as we can see from the Exuvia. It's not clear if that is his true form as the Prime Adepti though many people speculate it is since the adepti largely seem to take animalistic forms. Its definitely an interesting correlation! - Psyche
Happy New Year! Thank you for another awesome video!
THIS IS SO GOOD KEEP GOING BRO I CANT WAIT TO SEE MORE LORE OF YOU words can’t explain how hype these kind of videos get me keep it up!
When you pulled out the Kokomi Constellation I just cursed and laughed to myself and whelp, that's all the proof I need ngl
Lmao the "ehe" in the captions at 20:58 when talking about venti
this channel is so underrated ahhh i love the video keep it up
hopefully it blows up soon
Man, you need more subs. Good content
happy new year, travelers
It’s taken me a few days to get to this video but it was worth it. Can’t wait for the next!
Makes sense that every Vishal has the chancel to become a dragon lord but only one among their elements can become a sovereign
At 24:32 you actually have something to suggest Durin's associated with the fire element, since the cutscene shows him breathing fire at Dvalin (which also explains why the whole scene is in flames). So assuming he has to be fully elemental due to being a dragon (which might not be necessarily true since he's an artificial one), fire would be the more likely of the three.
Kokomi relevence returns when
Happy new year, ty
My theory is that Durin was Gold's/Khaenri'ah's attempt to create an Abyssal Sovereign, considering how they seemed to have been trying to both harness the power of the Abyss and create a power separate from the gods/Archons.
Given Durin's dream-state during his rampage, I'm leaning dendro...
Not all dragons have to be one of the seven sovereigns that fought the Primordial One. In fact I'd say only Azhdaha seems possibly that old from your list however you missed perhaps the oldest know creature in Teyvat history from your list of dragons, namely Kapatcir the Thunderbird. "She" (if it is a she) is no god since she has no love for humans, but was rather disastrously mistaken for one by Tsurumi islanders. She says she remembers when humans had not yet learned how to make fire. ie far back before the 2nd throne and all the way to the arrival of the first throne or nearly so. She could be older than the 1st throne. Gods had not yet appeared in Teyvat at the time she says she remembers. But even so was she a sovereign? Or just a dragon?
Now we know Apep is the Dendro Dragon so Durin is likely void or pyro
Genshin lore masters be wracking their brains after Enkanomiya is2g, I hope for yall sanity we get another ancient history lore dump like that 😅
What about the riddle hints at reincarnation? It’s just a really weird description of how years, months, days, hours, minutes, seconds, milliseconds, etc work until it gets to the smallest unit of time-the moment-Istaroth. And of course a bit about how Istaroth is tied to the every moment in the universe’s history, making her the Mother of 14 Billion Years. I can see why this was banned-for mentioning Istaroth-but I don’t see how this relates to Vishap reincarnation.
I think there could be lught and dark dragon if those are hidden elements
The researches don't conclude Vishaps are intelligent, but more like they could be experimentally made to be somewhat intelligent by successive generations forced to adapt. It's a big big difference. Dragons are intelligent but not vishaps. Or do you think that all vishaps are now presumed to be ancestors of experimental subjects from Enkanomiya? I would think they'd have been destroyed.
Omg lore!
as an adeptal dragon, would Zhongli/morax be a descendant of vishaps or be a vishap himself. if so then where is the line drawn between gods and vishaps, is it more of a rank/power thing rather than a species thing? i.e some vishaps are gods but not all gods are vishaps? Great Vid!
I was actually thinking about this exact thing today, and came to the conclusion that... so far, most of the Archons we know are elemental beings, so yes-- likely from the original races that inhabited Teyvat. In real world history for better or worse, it's not unheard of for a 'conqueror' to let the people they conquered govern themselves-- as long as the leaders they select are loyal to them. And that's kind of what the whole thing seems like. Pretty dark, but Celestia seems to be hiding a lot of dark. LOL.
Can you explain how/why you think the banned riddle has anything to do with reincarnation of gods or dragons? I can't see even the slightest hint of that. Do you think every life form in Teyvat reincarnates or just shades, gods and dragons? what about outlanders? I have no idea how you'd reply to this because I have no idea what the basis of the theory is.
I thought Osial was a normal god not a dragon (and his wife too, presumably) and that he being referred to as "demon god" in Chinese agrees with that. Do vishaps even have male and female sexes? I thought the archons were "demon gods" too? why ignore the title given and say he's a dragon? I don't think Durin is a dragon either though at least he's called one. Durin is a dragon like a zombie is a human, or more on the nose, like Albedo is a human.
The hydro Archon= hydro sovereign?
Why do you say Zhongli remember the time of the Chasm's creation? why do say he remembers the fall of the Seelie race? No evidence given for quite controversial statement there.
@Aneki Ryota Where does it say the Chasm is only 6000 years old? I mean maybe I'm missing it. I'm not that fussed about the Chasm history. But I had a quick look in view of Sumeru repeating a mention of something flying back up into the sky, which I've never heard explained. Doesn't Bamboo Forrest say it's story is older than the gods? which is a lie but people tend to ignore that these books are works of fantasy. Is that the one where the only connection is it offhandedly says "back when even Morax was young" or something else that just means "a long long time ago".
@Aneki Ryota I don't think we have any idea what created the chasm or when. Also whether it had it's corkscrew shape when it was first formed. We don't even know if the map uses lateral movements to represent increasing depth (ie whether the reality is that all of the chasm's space lies on top of itself and therefore the nail is directly under the opening but for practical purposes it's displayed as if stretched and spun out).
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