I have no interest in politics, but this video is really well done. I like that you used Mario Kart to get your ideas across and I’d like to see more videos in this style :)
Gotta know what the home crowd wants. I def wouldn't do political content, but I see this as more adjacent to it than actual political content. I think at the end of the day, knowledge of alternative systems is very important to get into the mainstream mindset. The point is, we don't always have to limit ourselves. I'm glad you could enjoy this topic despite it not being something you probably expected to engage with when starting the day 😊
Another issue with the "other" option that wasn't mentioned is that it also takes more effort for both the candidate and the voter to vote for it, because the voter needs to care enough about the candidate to both remember and consider them unprompted, and that means that the candidate needs to stand out a lot more. The overall video does a great job showing why there's a lot more than just that going on and strategic voting probably is where the issue starts, but the extra effort involved in being perfectly honest would likely exascerbate it
Great video, super well articulated, bringing up an extremely important topic that not enough people care about in a way that’s easy to understand. Being a part of the sample size made me love this video a lot too, because I had no idea it was gonna be used for this and I absolutely loved it
Really great video! I like how you frame (at least part of) the video by emphasizing the importance of semantic reflection (i don't know how to say it -- basically that the action, here, voting, is doing what it says it is doing; for voting, representing how people feel on things). I find it difficult when the words being used to describe things have accumulated other meanings or intentions. What I understand as you clarifying the action of voting by decentering strategic voting from it's mechanics is what I'm gesturing at. I don't know how to say it but I liked the video :D
I think I understand what you're saying here. The idea of "strategic" voting is inherently disingenuous, and we've let the system take us away from what it's original purpose was. The sad reality is that establishing FPTP early on was probably a mistake originally, but an easy one to make. George Washington even had a warning about the two party system in our country, and how he saw it as perhaps a natural evolution of FPTP. That said, we didn't really listen very well it seems. Hopefully we can self correct over time, but it is hard to get stuff done with this level of division within the country. Holding out hope though that we can actually get back to the basics (answering honestly) my embracing what's difficult (a deeper system itself).
There is a quote that goes "perfect is the enemy of good" and that applies a lot here, it is easy to get hung up on all the problems that face other types of voting systems and easy to forget that they are all better options that the one the U.S. uses know.
Yeah, it almost feels harsh to criticize RCV for being broken, when the system we have already is broken. That said, we probably should just be arguing for the alternatives that truly work.
Vivian is awesome. STAR is not perfect, so don't go with the assumption that's it's infallible of course. That said, I think it limits any downsides incredibly well.
@@Vexoned She came from the concept of Metal Mario, as in "if there's a metallic mario, what would a metallic peach look like?" Just like how baby Rosalina came from the concept of the baby Mario, Luigi, and Peach.
hi!!! your video appeared on my feed and i clicked it bc i saw luigi on it, haha!!! but it was a nice video, your research is summarized in such a way that anyone can understand it, and i liked that u applied it with mario kart related stuff since it's simpler to comprehend. good luck to everyone up there with their voting, im mexican so i cannot do much, but i wish u the best! keep it up and thanks!
Hey, thanks for the words. Really though, it's not just a USA thing also - this applies to really any election, or any poll or any of that. Glad you enjoyed the video though!
Thank you for such an interesting video. My prior experience was mostly with preference-ballot methods (Borda, Copeland, Hare, . . .) and not with star voting methods, as this is enough to talk about Arrow's Theorem and the like. If you want more reading material about voting theory/social choice theory in general (as opposed to star voting in specific), perhaps the next step would be Jordan Ellenberg's *How Note to Be Wrong: The Power of Mathematical Thinking*, Chapters 17 (and a bit of 18), which lays out some of the voting methods and paradoxical situations in an approachable way. A more thorough (but more demanding) text would be Alan D. Taylor and Allison M. Pacelli's *Mathematics and Politics: Strategy, Voting, Power, and Proof*. Also, just to give a little bit of translation between the social-choice-theory language and ordinary language: (At about 11:12): Ballots where you give a first choice, second choice, etc. are called preference ballots. They can be used in various voting methods, either in the method discussed, or in methods assigning a point value to each rank, or in counting head-to-head matchups. (At about 11:32) The elimination method discussed in ranked-choice voting is called the Hare method. The Coombs method is the alternative rule where you eliminate the candidates with the most last-place votes per round. (At about 18:17) This examples shows that the Hare Method (Ranked-Choice Voting) violates Monotonicity: changes in favor of a candidate on individual ballots can cause the candidate to do worse overall. (Monotonicity is basically the assertion that this can't happen -- you cannot reduce a candidate's social ranking by improving the candidate's ranking on individual ballots.)
Very informative stuff, and thank you for sharing some sources. 🙂 The last place elimination thing is interesting, but I also feel like it would still be susceptible to the exact same issues, no? I do think there is an argument to be made that a utilitarian approach is better for optimizing happiness at the end. Simple majority solutions can lead to selfish outcomes I think. For instance, there's a game out there. I forget the name. But there's 2 players and there's a round. If both players do nothing, they get 3 points. But if one attacks. They get 5 points, unless both attack where they both get 1. It's not a direct comparison but sometimes society would be best if we could all pick up 3s consistently, but if there's a majority who tries to see 5 as their best personal option, we will never maximize overall utility.
Rookie you are one of the best RUclips content creators out there! Really love your videos - I enjoy that they are longer too. I like to have them streaming on my second monitor as I work or surf the web! Wishing you continued luck. Really love your Mario kart content!
I really need to get back into shorter form content again, but I feel too many details in these videos now. I can only upload like once every 2 months now but I hope it's worth it! Thanks for the kind words 🙂
I think another thing to touch on with the "other" category is that voting for it didn't really feel like you were actually voting for your course but all the other available courses. This is becuase even though your choice was recognised in the comment it wasn't reflected in the poll for example. If the "other" category one but most people voted for Excite Bike Arena but you hate that course and in the "other" category you were actually voting for Thomp Ruins it would feel as if your vote was misplaced since you helped something you disagree with win.
Could definitely see that - weirdly, there's a lot of dishonest methods you can use to incentivize certain responses. Even in the question wording sometimes🫣
@@HDRookie As someone in Psychology who has done some research stuffs, this is an ever-present issue with research methodology-namely surveys. Question wording, order of questions, how many qustions, the order of options, the scaling of options (think: absurd hypothetical daily sleep survey where options are 1hour of sleep, 2 hours of sleep, 3 hours of sleep, and 4 or more hours of sleep)... it's a whole thing. Even with no immediate incentive to answer dishonestly, there are so many things that can unintentionally skew answers.
I mean if you're seeking more honest approaches in voting, you could try 1 on 1 voting, or voting for individual characters (scoring) and then adding up the totals when comparing and contrasting. You could ask for expression alongside the votes as it helps clear up honesty. Ofc you could also be less specific when referring to the class of the vote. In theory, these should all dim out or make strategic voting less applicable because it's harder. It will likely take longer to get a final anwser however. There is many formulae for votings, and they're all likely to be different, but at the end of the day, it's good exposure and explanation because a lot of people could be unaware of this. Good video Rookie. 👍 P.S. I knew you'd pick bWP, I KNEW IT-
As mentioned, strategic voting is everywhere, maybe we even do it without realizing it when we open this app and see the polls 🤷♀️ All we can do is try to learn from it and try to find the systems that minimize it!
On the "Greatest of All Time" ranking it also is important that the framing of "Greater" compared to "Favorite" it does account for legacy/significance rather than personal preference. My "Favorite" Roman Emperor is not who I would say is the "Greatest" Roman Emperor. It's a difference between "someone who I think I would get along with, who I would like to talk to, who I would want to support if given the option" versus "someone I would want to live under."
That's fair also. I do think that is a prevalent issue though, many people interpret the question differently to begin with. Most deserving vs best is always a contentious topic. It's funny how election night had no company on this regard. The college football playoff rankings reveal last night are always based on this debate as well.
Pretty neat video, thanks for the content! Applying the concept to Mario Kart is nice. I think it takes away some of the initial bias/reactions related to anything in real life politics, and helps to keep the point of the video clear. Also... I've been of the opinion that FPTP can be pretty flawed for a long time, but STAR voting was new to me. Actually might look up some stuff on voting systems now. Thanks. :)
For sure. I think it's pretty legit. There are some electoral rules it breaks like Later No Harm, but no system can satisfy every criteria and be "perfect". I think this limits the impact of tactical voting pretty well though, and makes the most warranted sacrifices.
With the Minecraft Mob Vote, I often see comments complaining about how people never seem to like the winner despite voting for it. What these people don't consider is that the mob votes are always extremely close, only a few % difference between each choice. Because only 1/3 is selected, what ends up happening is that ~60% or so ended up never wanting the winner to begin with, well over half of the players voting.
It's always hard to express this stuff since many people hate talking about the political process. Gotta just find your spots to share and inform though 🙂
@@HDRookie Absolutely. It's a really delicate art, and I appreciate the thought and work put into informing people! I'm gonna rewatch this and show my mom! I'll have fun explaining a lot of the Mario context, and my mom has wanted to learn more about alternative voting practices already anyway. 😁
Update: my mom LOVED the video! The only critique she has is specifically about the character names. Obviously, in the Mario gaming sphere, Mario, Luigi, Wario, and Waluigi are fully distinct, discrete characters. We wouldn't ever mix them up. Without visual cues, it was easy for my mom to get mixed up. That being said, this was a spot on video for your intended audience, and I wouldn't expect consideration for every possible iteration of audience. It was just an interesting perspective about something I took for granted: distinguishing characters with very similar names. This tickled me.
i’ve wanted raphael the raven in mk for SO long and the worst part is that is feels like it could happen, i loved the part in paper mario 64 with him as a kid
SPOILERS FROM ONE OF SCHAFFRILLAS' RECENT VIDEOS But Luigi is actually more popular than Mario, it said so in Schaffrillas' video talking about how popular every Mario character is.
You know, I ordinarily do not actually say it that way lol. I'm not sure why it came out that way but often I am focused on tone more than the script itself as I record. I think I might actually say it differently depending on if its being used as a noun/verb, but never have really thought about it before so idk for sure 🤔
Voting reform was obviously never going to be a solvable issue in a matter of hours of course - this video was never about today though, rather tomorrow. The actions we take in 2025-2027 do absolutely matter. Many of us only show up to the issues every 4 years, and it all starts at local/state level. We have a long way to go overall too, there's no denying that. But nothing is ever built in a day, and we have to start somewhere, even if that first step is awareness of the issues that systems like FPTP bring. I wish i could change it all immediately in the short term for you, but again, I am just a guy. Don't give up though.
I have no interest in politics, but this video is really well done. I like that you used Mario Kart to get your ideas across and I’d like to see more videos in this style :)
Gotta know what the home crowd wants. I def wouldn't do political content, but I see this as more adjacent to it than actual political content.
I think at the end of the day, knowledge of alternative systems is very important to get into the mainstream mindset. The point is, we don't always have to limit ourselves.
I'm glad you could enjoy this topic despite it not being something you probably expected to engage with when starting the day 😊
Thats such a well made analogy. Smart for posting it on election day
Another issue with the "other" option that wasn't mentioned is that it also takes more effort for both the candidate and the voter to vote for it, because the voter needs to care enough about the candidate to both remember and consider them unprompted, and that means that the candidate needs to stand out a lot more. The overall video does a great job showing why there's a lot more than just that going on and strategic voting probably is where the issue starts, but the extra effort involved in being perfectly honest would likely exascerbate it
Great video, super well articulated, bringing up an extremely important topic that not enough people care about in a way that’s easy to understand. Being a part of the sample size made me love this video a lot too, because I had no idea it was gonna be used for this and I absolutely loved it
Really great video! I like how you frame (at least part of) the video by emphasizing the importance of semantic reflection (i don't know how to say it -- basically that the action, here, voting, is doing what it says it is doing; for voting, representing how people feel on things). I find it difficult when the words being used to describe things have accumulated other meanings or intentions. What I understand as you clarifying the action of voting by decentering strategic voting from it's mechanics is what I'm gesturing at. I don't know how to say it but I liked the video :D
I think I understand what you're saying here. The idea of "strategic" voting is inherently disingenuous, and we've let the system take us away from what it's original purpose was.
The sad reality is that establishing FPTP early on was probably a mistake originally, but an easy one to make. George Washington even had a warning about the two party system in our country, and how he saw it as perhaps a natural evolution of FPTP. That said, we didn't really listen very well it seems. Hopefully we can self correct over time, but it is hard to get stuff done with this level of division within the country. Holding out hope though that we can actually get back to the basics (answering honestly) my embracing what's difficult (a deeper system itself).
There is a quote that goes "perfect is the enemy of good" and that applies a lot here, it is easy to get hung up on all the problems that face other types of voting systems and easy to forget that they are all better options that the one the U.S. uses know.
Yeah, it almost feels harsh to criticize RCV for being broken, when the system we have already is broken. That said, we probably should just be arguing for the alternatives that truly work.
I looove statistical analyses like these, especially with Nintendo games. Its one of the reasons u subscribed to you
HDRookie! This is honestly a well made video and the timing is honestly perfect! Congrats man!
The character I picked was Vivian from TTYD but no way in hell is she making it in. I'm completely sold on STAR voting now!
Vivian is awesome.
STAR is not perfect, so don't go with the assumption that's it's infallible of course. That said, I think it limits any downsides incredibly well.
Pink Gold Peach deserves her own game
Finally someone brave enough to say it 👏
Where did she even come from though
@@Vexoned from nothing
Go eat a banana! Worst take ever >:(
@@Vexoned She came from the concept of Metal Mario, as in "if there's a metallic mario, what would a metallic peach look like?"
Just like how baby Rosalina came from the concept of the baby Mario, Luigi, and Peach.
hi!!! your video appeared on my feed and i clicked it bc i saw luigi on it, haha!!! but it was a nice video, your research is summarized in such a way that anyone can understand it, and i liked that u applied it with mario kart related stuff since it's simpler to comprehend. good luck to everyone up there with their voting, im mexican so i cannot do much, but i wish u the best! keep it up and thanks!
Hey, thanks for the words. Really though, it's not just a USA thing also - this applies to really any election, or any poll or any of that. Glad you enjoyed the video though!
Thank you for such an interesting video. My prior experience was mostly with preference-ballot methods (Borda, Copeland, Hare, . . .) and not with star voting methods, as this is enough to talk about Arrow's Theorem and the like.
If you want more reading material about voting theory/social choice theory in general (as opposed to star voting in specific), perhaps the next step would be Jordan Ellenberg's *How Note to Be Wrong: The Power of Mathematical Thinking*, Chapters 17 (and a bit of 18), which lays out some of the voting methods and paradoxical situations in an approachable way.
A more thorough (but more demanding) text would be Alan D. Taylor and Allison M. Pacelli's *Mathematics and Politics: Strategy, Voting, Power, and Proof*.
Also, just to give a little bit of translation between the social-choice-theory language and ordinary language:
(At about 11:12): Ballots where you give a first choice, second choice, etc. are called preference ballots. They can be used in various voting methods, either in the method discussed, or in methods assigning a point value to each rank, or in counting head-to-head matchups.
(At about 11:32) The elimination method discussed in ranked-choice voting is called the Hare method. The Coombs method is the alternative rule where you eliminate the candidates with the most last-place votes per round.
(At about 18:17) This examples shows that the Hare Method (Ranked-Choice Voting) violates Monotonicity: changes in favor of a candidate on individual ballots can cause the candidate to do worse overall. (Monotonicity is basically the assertion that this can't happen -- you cannot reduce a candidate's social ranking by improving the candidate's ranking on individual ballots.)
Very informative stuff, and thank you for sharing some sources. 🙂 The last place elimination thing is interesting, but I also feel like it would still be susceptible to the exact same issues, no?
I do think there is an argument to be made that a utilitarian approach is better for optimizing happiness at the end. Simple majority solutions can lead to selfish outcomes I think.
For instance, there's a game out there. I forget the name. But there's 2 players and there's a round. If both players do nothing, they get 3 points. But if one attacks. They get 5 points, unless both attack where they both get 1. It's not a direct comparison but sometimes society would be best if we could all pick up 3s consistently, but if there's a majority who tries to see 5 as their best personal option, we will never maximize overall utility.
Rookie you are one of the best RUclips content creators out there! Really love your videos - I enjoy that they are longer too. I like to have them streaming on my second monitor as I work or surf the web! Wishing you continued luck. Really love your Mario kart content!
I really need to get back into shorter form content again, but I feel too many details in these videos now. I can only upload like once every 2 months now but I hope it's worth it! Thanks for the kind words 🙂
I think another thing to touch on with the "other" category is that voting for it didn't really feel like you were actually voting for your course but all the other available courses. This is becuase even though your choice was recognised in the comment it wasn't reflected in the poll for example. If the "other" category one but most people voted for Excite Bike Arena but you hate that course and in the "other" category you were actually voting for Thomp Ruins it would feel as if your vote was misplaced since you helped something you disagree with win.
Could definitely see that - weirdly, there's a lot of dishonest methods you can use to incentivize certain responses. Even in the question wording sometimes🫣
@@HDRookie As someone in Psychology who has done some research stuffs, this is an ever-present issue with research methodology-namely surveys. Question wording, order of questions, how many qustions, the order of options, the scaling of options (think: absurd hypothetical daily sleep survey where options are 1hour of sleep, 2 hours of sleep, 3 hours of sleep, and 4 or more hours of sleep)... it's a whole thing. Even with no immediate incentive to answer dishonestly, there are so many things that can unintentionally skew answers.
I mean if you're seeking more honest approaches in voting, you could try 1 on 1 voting, or voting for individual characters (scoring) and then adding up the totals when comparing and contrasting. You could ask for expression alongside the votes as it helps clear up honesty. Ofc you could also be less specific when referring to the class of the vote. In theory, these should all dim out or make strategic voting less applicable because it's harder. It will likely take longer to get a final anwser however. There is many formulae for votings, and they're all likely to be different, but at the end of the day, it's good exposure and explanation because a lot of people could be unaware of this. Good video Rookie. 👍
P.S. I knew you'd pick bWP, I KNEW IT-
I'm all for seeing more polls from you, Mr. Rookie 👑
Baby Rosalina. Pink Gold Peach feels more like a skin to me. She can be used to build hype for the inevitable DLC
I know what i want to add. the ability to customise koopa troopa shells. i want to play as red shelled koopa troopa. not an extra character slot tho
Paratroopa still awaiting his grand return.
@@HDRookie Better be an alt skin not a character slot
This vid is so cool you deserve more attention !!!!!!!!
Wow, never thought I'd learn so much from a Mario Kart voting video, thank you HDRookie!
6:09 omg this is so true, My fav is electrodrome but I just voted cloudtop because I think it's a 2nd or 3rd for me!!
As mentioned, strategic voting is everywhere, maybe we even do it without realizing it when we open this app and see the polls 🤷♀️
All we can do is try to learn from it and try to find the systems that minimize it!
On the "Greatest of All Time" ranking it also is important that the framing of "Greater" compared to "Favorite" it does account for legacy/significance rather than personal preference. My "Favorite" Roman Emperor is not who I would say is the "Greatest" Roman Emperor. It's a difference between "someone who I think I would get along with, who I would like to talk to, who I would want to support if given the option" versus "someone I would want to live under."
That's fair also. I do think that is a prevalent issue though, many people interpret the question differently to begin with. Most deserving vs best is always a contentious topic. It's funny how election night had no company on this regard. The college football playoff rankings reveal last night are always based on this debate as well.
Pretty neat video, thanks for the content!
Applying the concept to Mario Kart is nice. I think it takes away some of the initial bias/reactions related to anything in real life politics, and helps to keep the point of the video clear.
Also... I've been of the opinion that FPTP can be pretty flawed for a long time, but STAR voting was new to me. Actually might look up some stuff on voting systems now. Thanks. :)
For sure. I think it's pretty legit. There are some electoral rules it breaks like Later No Harm, but no system can satisfy every criteria and be "perfect". I think this limits the impact of tactical voting pretty well though, and makes the most warranted sacrifices.
With the Minecraft Mob Vote, I often see comments complaining about how people never seem to like the winner despite voting for it. What these people don't consider is that the mob votes are always extremely close, only a few % difference between each choice. Because only 1/3 is selected, what ends up happening is that ~60% or so ended up never wanting the winner to begin with, well over half of the players voting.
didn't expect the topic good video
Thank you for making this
6:49 never knew that fun fact, I'll keep an eye out for that!
This was really cool! Thank you! I care!!
It's always hard to express this stuff since many people hate talking about the political process. Gotta just find your spots to share and inform though 🙂
@@HDRookie Absolutely. It's a really delicate art, and I appreciate the thought and work put into informing people!
I'm gonna rewatch this and show my mom! I'll have fun explaining a lot of the Mario context, and my mom has wanted to learn more about alternative voting practices already anyway. 😁
Update: my mom LOVED the video! The only critique she has is specifically about the character names. Obviously, in the Mario gaming sphere, Mario, Luigi, Wario, and Waluigi are fully distinct, discrete characters. We wouldn't ever mix them up. Without visual cues, it was easy for my mom to get mixed up.
That being said, this was a spot on video for your intended audience, and I wouldn't expect consideration for every possible iteration of audience. It was just an interesting perspective about something I took for granted: distinguishing characters with very similar names. This tickled me.
i think the best method for these kind of things is just ask me. i will choose. i have well honed opinions that are very accurate.
I love Squeaky Clean Sprint
I wonder why he'd pick today to do this video
IDK, the idea just spontaneously came to me or something 😮
1:03 Pink Gold Peach ftw
I'll NEVER forget the poll where Mario isn't listed as the #1 most popular character.
i’ve wanted raphael the raven in mk for SO long and the worst part is that is feels like it could happen, i loved the part in paper mario 64 with him as a kid
That would be such a wild card. Feel like they would put in King Bobomb first though, for the big round black ball rep
incredibly based
Hey that was a pretty good video,
Sad that Mario placed very low in the polls :(
He won the IGN Tournament though, so he's gucci
SPOILERS FROM ONE OF SCHAFFRILLAS' RECENT VIDEOS
But Luigi is actually more popular than Mario, it said so in Schaffrillas' video talking about how popular every Mario character is.
Would be crazy if that was in the video now 😅
Lucas from Mother 3 for Mario Kart 10 (they pulled a Microsoft and skipped 9)
But shy guys been in 4 Mario kart games so that’s cap.
Crono not being in Smash Bros Ultimate makes me so sad 😔
That's my goat right there
cool video, wasnt expecting to learn about voting systems today lmao but you did a good job at it
I main Baby Rosalina in MK8 so easy pick
i love waluigi pinball why didnt i get to vote :(
4:06 THERES MY BOY BITSTIM
Every comment has a shot of making the video 😊
13:57 no way you actually pronounce "compromise" like "come promise".
You know, I ordinarily do not actually say it that way lol. I'm not sure why it came out that way but often I am focused on tone more than the script itself as I record. I think I might actually say it differently depending on if its being used as a noun/verb, but never have really thought about it before so idk for sure 🤔
I've never been this early!
1:00 These are the types of choices that make me not want to continue living.
Gotta fight sometimes to make the changes we want. It's of course not easy, but we've got to start somewhere of course.
500 likes
Waluigi #1
neat
yeah my day has been made irreparably worse and i still cant change the system that governs us. thanks for the mario kart video and making me "care"
Voting reform was obviously never going to be a solvable issue in a matter of hours of course - this video was never about today though, rather tomorrow. The actions we take in 2025-2027 do absolutely matter. Many of us only show up to the issues every 4 years, and it all starts at local/state level. We have a long way to go overall too, there's no denying that. But nothing is ever built in a day, and we have to start somewhere, even if that first step is awareness of the issues that systems like FPTP bring. I wish i could change it all immediately in the short term for you, but again, I am just a guy. Don't give up though.
... *LOL*
3:51 I see my comment. E N D O R P H I N S.
vivian from pm:ttyd
Outstanding choice