I'd agree. Heard it might be force pvp however which I'm not a fan of, just want a solid and fun PVE experience really. So I hope that if this is the case they eventually release PVE servers.
?? It's very true, WoW is a good example of this, SWTOR same way an even FF14, all dps do this. Or guilds stack certain classes for insane buffs to 1 class to push higher dps. It's why For example PI(Power Infusion) is so strong a flat 20% haste is insane for certain classes. People will purposely not use CDs just to wait for another person to increase their dps.
@@motherpigeon1582DPS Goblins are a thing in every single MMO you can name, even OSRS players who raid care. Someone will make a DPS tracker addon, if possible, and everyone will install it and Thor will be prophetic if and when that becomes normalized. If they ever let a DPS meter stick, the meta will inherently become more selfish and the original comment will be correct. That's my guess at least, with my MMO knowledge which is limited but I'm pretty sure OP will be right.
This is why "haste" is the most damaging spell in 3.5 D&D/PF1E. Yes, the haste caster does no additional direct damage, but every melee character in the party gets an extra swing every round, and that adds up to a lot more damage than fireball.
@lastwymsi nah in 5e there are much better things to Concentrate on for a caster. Usually control spells or even just Bless will often translate into more damage since they'll boost the DPR of multiple characters than what you'll get from giving 1 character a single attack. edit: unless you're using it on a Rogue
FFLogs (FF14 fight and dps tracker) uses RDPS to fix this issue, which is essentially your damage dealt + damage dealt by party members that your gameplay affected. So like if I give out a 10% party buff, the party's 10% more damage contribution affects my overall parse/percentile. Its a neat way of handling games that have team synergy and encourages people to utilize their full kits in tandem with each other. In reality it boils down to "everyone press your buffs at the same time" but its better than nothing 🤠
Unfortunately it really does not track rdps very well. So classes like DNC and AST are regarded even worse than if their added raid damage was nebulous.
There's also a big dev rulings and player culture difference in FFXIV than in WoW. They will straight up ban you for any mention of DPS log results in public group games, especially if you're using them to be toxic to other players. They know they can't really block log parsing from happening, or for private groups from using the results to improve their play in top-level content, but they can keep it out of the WoW-style effect where they kick and harrass players in public-matched content for not being at the best tier.
Was literally gonna mention rDPS lol I will add that it is a little naive to assume there won't be a DPS meter or some kind of parsing system because damage output is tied to group synergy. rDPS became the primary grading metric in FFLogs after Dancer was introduced in Shadowbringers because evaluating personal performance with over-inflated numbers due to Dancer buffs was difficult and thus the community became obsessive over rDPS instead of regular DPS.
@ IIRC they overcorrected in Endwalker and early savage group comps left Dancers completely unplayed and Bards as the vast majority of ranged phys in groups.
Likely not. It seems to be that there will evolve a support role that applies all of the debuffs, and a damage role that strictly hits punch. In cases like that it is the supports role to bring the correct debuff for the damge dealers spec.
It's funny, because in the MMO I play, Star Trek Online, we have multiple DPS metres, and a lot of times in supported DPS runs people will intentionally decrease the amount of damage they do so that they can deal more debuff, and therefore improve the amount of damage that a specific person deals. It's interesting that in this game, your own dps is directly dependent on your party members, rather than being strictly enhanced by them.
@@darkreuchiha1842 It hasn't had new mechanics in quite a while, but numbers still go up due to new traits coming out with new ships. And consequently, it's super easy to play. It's a chill game that isn't terribly hard.
What i like about the STO contect creators is that they always say in their DPS videos that it was a supported run and explain which buffs/debuffs of their teammates accounter for roughly how much DPS. That's not the case for content creators in all MMOs but it's so important for other players to understand how to improve the performance of the whole group/raid.
@omadduxo in my videos I try to avoid featuring runs that will skew my results, because I like to demonstrate builds as they are, without much, if any, help.
Would be a bit more difficult, but dps meters in other games will account for this type of thing. When i boost the crit rate in ff, when my team crits, i get a portion of that as rDPS in the log.
Yeah, but there are issues that can still arise from that that make it ridiculously difficult to determine what the actual proportion is. WoW is currently battling with this because when you get a haste buff you can't really directly compare the DPS increase to anything because so many things change from what kind of spells you even could have cast to what kind of procs could have even procced during the time window and beyond. You just can't calculate it directly and need to use statistical methods to get an estimate out of it which is really not doable for a DPS meter.
@@slowazzd2165 Toxic players create toxic players. Also people will always find ways to evaluate performance and toxic people will always find "something" to flame you for regardless if false or not.
@@slowazzd2165 it will expose toxic players sooner. Having tools to gauge your performance is a good thing, even better if the tool itself is made available within the game because in just about every MMO DPS check is a real concept. If the content that you're playing requires none of it, then good! But it's an MMO, by definition you're not the only one that dictates how the game is played
This is why having things like rDPS as a metric is beneficial. rDPS is essentially a measure of how much damage you provide under your own effects plus how much damage others deal under those same effects. If you have to drop one or two cooldowns so everyone else can tack an extra zero to the end of their numbers, that's a good thing.
Also Augmentation Evokers in WoW have their damage calculated in the same fashion on the dps meters or logs as the majority of their damage evolves around the rest of the grp so it makes Thors argument kinda void. Details (one of the dps meters) even depicts it through a see-through bar how much dps the augmentation evoker actually does during the fight. Sure there are some margins of errors in the dps meters but its so small that nobody cares.
in Final Fantasy 14, we have a way around this. It's called rDPS and its the metric that actually gets used for parses in fight. rDPS is your damage + Damage others got as a result of your buffs - Damage you received from others buffs. The numbers themselves are still look off in the DPS meter itself, but the logs and the end of a fight would reflect it in a proper light. Most people wont care and complain that there damage is lower on the meter, but solutions do exist. (Not that they need to)
This is pretty much how things work in GW2 through the dps boons, and combo fields in vanilla, but we have/had no problem judging lower boon dps fairly there. Also DPS meters are important for knowing group dps either way. DPS meters will happen unless banned.
I was also thinking about GW2. In smaller parties or raids is when it really matters, but open world bosses most people basically have max of all the boons. Maybe not always, but lots of the time.
@Mythis1 It actually turns out that in open world, quickness and alacrity uptime is really low due to the randomness of not being in a party. This is why the Soo-Won fight and Greer+Decima can still fail often unless you focus on organizing squad parties.
Augmentation Evoker’s entire shtick is doing this, and it really feels great knowing that I’m making everyone else stronger and don’t have to worry about my damage numbers as much.
This is exactly pointing out my issues with 'scoreboards' in many games that just shows the basic 'most kills/most deaths' and such, rather than actual valuable info.
Especially in team games like overwatch or marvel rivals. You'll get people saying stuff like 'support diff' based on the stats. Despite the fact the dps were just shooting the tanks only and letting them farm heals and ult charge off them. They'll just look at the numbers and say 'well i got 20k damage in one round so it couldnt have been my fault. Must be because the other supports have 5k heals over mine.'
In general, the 3 main roles should have different metrics, not the same universal metrics. DPS should be either K/D ratio or damage dealt depending on what type of game it is. Damage metrics would be broken down into personal damage for assassin DPS and raid damage for support DPS. Healers should be measured by minimized party deaths or maximized party uptime depending on game type. Tanks should be measured by minimized party damage or maximized damage absorbed depending on game type. Measuring everyone by K/D encourages everyone to play like an assassin DPS regardless of role.
@@dragonbretheren or game needs mechanics in it like say FPS with a supression effect thusly an HMG would be useful for it's purpose, not rambo-gunning around.
@@crestothegecko6279that's why u use jr brain and realize someone with 20k dmg but 5 kills is just doing fake dmg, scoreboard can and are useful if used right, and just bc otherwise don't use them right doesn't mean u can't either
there is just way too much info to reliably objectively quantify which things are useful, especially so the more complex the game and then each character are. just keeping it at KDA, damage done/taken/healed/mitigated gives you enough info to extrapolate more information. being able to directly see more info is not going to help you improve as a player and is not going to prevent others from flaming either, it would just give you ground to argue and time spent arguing isn't time spent on focusing on the win, so it's not beneficial either way.
An “assisted damage” stat at the end of a game would help so much with encouraging players to do this shit to help in other games, not just a “damage” stat. Some people play just for the numbers at the end
When used "properly" damage meters aren't about "zomg who's doing the most damage." They're about analyzing a fight, yes sometimes to determine a players relative contributions, but also just to see how different skills perform, how enemy damage is dealt etc etc
I feel like this is a good explanation of what teamwork is like in real life too. Imagine if we could see damage meters or effectiveness meters for our team members in every day life. We'd all be winning
There are DPS meters for this game. It's an addon just like any other game. Just because it doesn't have the ease of access to addons like WoW doesn't mean they don't exist. The majority of players use DPS meters to track their own ability usage, crit procs and generally to make sure they are getting the most out of their class. The people who say things like "DPS meters are toxic" or that games are better off without them are just people who have insane ego but can never get high on the DPS meter lol.
@@Gentoes Facts. The hypocrisy is wild. Says dps metres are bad because people with high numbers dont help the group. Meanwhile all the rank 1’s use warcraft logs that does the same shit but even more detailed. The delusion and ego is huge, and the dunning kreuger effect is real. Says they are ‘’not helping the rest of the team’’ meanwhile he dips on his own team to save himself. Lost all respect. Hands down.
I think there ought to be revised dps meters that calculate the procs of allies and count it as your dps so you can still see what is effective even in a team setting
I need this short DMed to every single player in Marvel Rivals so I can finally get teammates that dont see big bukber and think their god when they mindlessly shot a pocket healed tank for the whole game
That’s true for DPS meters in any MMO. Not the best indicator for player skill, but it is the only indicator any MMO allows. There’s no stat that tracks your contribution via party buffs or combinations of effects with other party members
When I get better internet I'm going to have to play this it seems like the OG days of wow. People don't know much it was a team effort for helping every step of the way.
Back when my wife and I played, I was a shadow priest, and she was a warlock. My shadow resist the buff made her damage skyrocket. So it all worked out.
Same thing in dnd. Yes guiding bolt is not always the best spell to use, but if your rogue with a 6d6 sneak attack need advantage, it's a fantastic set up for even more damage.
Been playing Pantheon and it makes people realize that just bcus you yourself aren't the highest dps ur helping get the other dps have more dmg with your skills. Love this style of gameing
That's why usually stuff like that is accounted for in the logs like in ffxiv when you apply a buff for your party the dps they do more is accounted to your metric. So you want a higher parse you gotta play optimal and make sure your buffs are applied to all at the best time so that your team can make the most of it, not just you.
in lost ark the dps meter calculate the value that the support provide to the other 3 party members so it wouldn't be impossible to add this in the dps meter based on how much dmg your freeze increased to the other party emmbers
For someone who still doesn't somehow get it. Imagine you decrease your damage by 50% for 20 seconds but in return the enemy takes 20% increased damage from all sources, so your damage is decreased but your teams isn't. So for the 20 seconds the boss has been debuffed your team dealt an extra 20% damage more than what they would normally do. The fight is over 20% faster.
This is why i like ffxivs dps meter, it messures several different dps types including your own damage, your own damage after party buffs. And it calculates how much damage party members did because of your buffs adding it to your dps
@@mikelee_616 You think SE doesnt know about it because people "keep their mouth shut"? SE knows about it. It works because SE made it clear as long as you dont talk about it, they will turn a blind eye.
I have yet to see a game that was improved by the inclusion of party member damage tracking, especially when elements like cc are involved. It always results in people prioritizing chasing highest damage done over team cohesion and better play. I know some people who say they want to have it just to see how much they did, but they always feel disparaged when they aren't near the highest.
FFXI did skillchains which do the same but you can do it 5 times and keep it going. The skillchain when I left was able to out put a large amount of dps. So you could essentially have a party of 8 who are the same job , who can skillchain off each other and themselves to output some serious dmg.
I seem to recall this was a thing for Guild Wars 2, though eventually the community got access to a number of dps metres which changed peoples attitudes.
This is part of the reason why I like the “DPS meter” in PoE 2. It doesn’t show how much damage you do alone - it shows you how much damage your entire party has done together.
Unless there's no sort of battle log, there will be a way to math this sort of thing out and develop a tool to see performance metrics. Even if it wasn't personalized, there would still be usefulness in seeing your group's DPS "stat". This system feels familiar but different from GW2, and I think that's a positive thing. One thing people will have to actualize when they play this game is not overlapping effects overly much, so that you can better utilize combos. There will likely be a "best practices" sort of document for people to follow, but good communication, and just paying attention to your environment, will also be important.
depends on how much they are doing, without a dps meter you wouldn't know, but if the boosted person is already doing the most, a 50% boost can be far greater than the 20% for 4 people. its why so many mmo's come down to a math-spreadsheet, ignorance is great untill you hit a wall of do X better. most of the time its heal more or do more damage faster.
@@edwxx20001Right? Everyone loves to bitch about dps meter goblins, but nobody mentions all the good things about having a dps meter. For example, to know if I am actually doing my rotation properly, or if I have a teamate that is literally doing 0 work.
you mean the exact issue people had with Augmentation Evoker when it came out? where a lot of its dps came from buffing people so it parsed low till they realized
This was a thing I did back in destiny 2 (when it was still respectable / before lightfall) There was a particular gun called divinity, it created a large extra crit bubble and debuffed the enemy you’re shooting at. It was an exotic so you could only equip it at the cost of another bigger damage weapon and you had to have it equipped from the start of the encounter (you lose all ammo when changing equipped weapons). It was an ordeal to even get divinity and I mostly ran it because almost no one else either had it or wanted to use it. That and I mostly ran with randoms so coordination for high skill strats wasn’t common.
WoW has changed a lot since I last played then. That is all DPS cared about at that point...who delt more damage during a fight. I was mainly a Warrior Tank so damage wasn't my thing. Best instance was when my Druid heals got bored and started to DPS. He would pop a HoT and go back to damage. He was 1st in heals and 2nd in DPS. 😂 Good times.
Ff14 and I think SW have dps meters that calculate buffed, unbuffed, and other dps. A/r/n dps, so it isn't hard to imagine them figuring it out as well. Ff14 has classes they strictly do very little damage just to enhance their team and they are not in short supply.
Really like the idea of this, because it encourages more skill expression across the whole team. Anthem (RIP) had a similar play style where you'd use different element types and stacking different types would give critical hits and overall if the team was using different elements the damage overall would be insane! could wait to see where/how far Ashes goes in the future.
GW2 has combo fields which sounds great in theory, one player puts down a field and other players use it to increase their damage, but it's not used. This seems nice.
I love that the most damaging instances in the game is compounding effects of like 3 freeze effects and a shatter deals like 3 times the damage of any normal ability/spell instance. Suddenly you have to know what effects are active and compound them and one of you need to ignite the effect. Instead of just anyone being dps fiends you should talk tactics and what your kits are and how the synergise before even going into combat and then execute on that tactic cooperatively.
This is exactly what has caused FFLogs to be a detriment to the game as a whole- Introducing a leaderboard for damage then caused everything to be about highest personal damage and we no longer are allowed to have cool things like player synergy (other than a completely uniform 2minute burst window across all classes) because of the players incessant complaining from the perspective of wanting to be leaderboard gamers. And now those same players complain the game is too easy because of it.
Seems like it would be pretty easy to add some sort of PPS (Procs per second) if that is what does the most damage overall that is what players would track.
If that's the case, I feel like I would want to have damage meters and proc meters, like how there is DPS meters and healing meters because I like to be a support, I don't like doing the damage itself but I love helping people do more... Random person's opinion
Doesn't matter how dynamic the damage dealt is lol you can still have a meter. I think he just wanted explain the dynamic damage. In short no matter how dynamic the damage algorithm is, it can still be metered. That's like saying there is no health meter because health is dynamic to your defence and your buffs and debuffs, other players can heal you and apply buffs to you, you could block or not block. We get it, its dynamic but we still have an accurate hp meter. So yes they could implement a dps meter.
I love mechanics like these and I hope they stay Killing floor had a similar function where you heal others at twice the rate than healing yourself, so it encouraged grouping and helping each other But in KF2 they reduce the benefit so much that you might as well heal yourself since teammates won't heal you.
Not in that exact form, wow currently has one spec that is purely support Classes have buffs for others as well but they are not actively lowering their own dps by using them, it's a bonus on top
Playing FFXIV we usually look at rDPS (raid-contributing DPS) which uses a formula that subtracts dps gained from external buffs, and adds the damage given to others by your buffs, it's kind of an objective metric of the DPS you're bringing to the team. Probably wouldn't be applicable to AoC with special status effect procs but I think a meter that takes into account party buff contribution is neat.
I love that Ashes has synergistic class design. FFXIV has some similar notions and I've always deeply appreciated how what people play works together - because isn't that the whole point, in the end? Cohesion? Dump the meters forever.
other games have damage meters that account for buffs and effects and reward the person who applied the debuff with the dps they added by being there. Rather than looking at who does the most damage, you can look at amounts adjusted for who BROUGHT the most damage by being there. The terms i've always seen for this is rdps. This is raid-contributing DPS. This applies the damage increases you provided to other player's abiltiies as your own dps, since they wouldn't have been buffed for those attacks if you weren't there. Would be tougher with spells you can't use or justify unless certain statuses were applied by other players... but you could substitute in a spell that would have been cast, and calculate the damage increase by having the chance to cast the other spell instead. Many games have damage meters that break down buffs and things at least... there will be a useful damage meter at some point, plus damage meters are always good for tracking your own improvements and such.
I just don't think there is any more room for innovation in the mmo rpg genre. And even if there was, the culture is very anti trying anything new, and developers can't take too many risks. MMOs will remain in the same stale state for years to come. I do not see anything special about this one either tbh.
in destiny 2 there's a rocket launcher that deals less damage than all other rocket launchers, but it buffs all your allies, so in a raid where you're 6, it's really good as it's more damage overall for your allies with only having you sacrifice your damage for that buff
I’m pretty sure DPS meters could account for this - details does this for augmentation evoker in WoW, showing a “shadow” bar that extends beyond the “real” damage to indicate the amount of damage its buffs contributed
"Final Fantasy has a similar system where the 'low DPS' is in the form of a class - dancer. The DPS meters have adapted to this and created something called 'Raid DPS,' where the damage you boosted for others is added to yours, and the damage you got boosted by someone else is taken from yours
I love systems like that Hell yes I’m cool with doing no damage to set up 3,4 maybe 5 other party members to do double or even triple their damage in a hit It’s more than I could do solo
Makes sense but they also already solved for that years ago in 14. When you look at logs theres adps, which is more "selfish damage" and rdps which factors in your raid contributions. There's also tools like xivanalysis that very quickly and easily show if someones not keeping their stuff on CD (such as party buffs which are insanely important to not only use but time with everyone elses buffs). I only really look at this if we're struggling with dps checks, skipping certain mechanics, etc. Sometimes its just a bad run or even off day and the ones lagging behind are otherwise fine, but other times there's a bigger reason for it like "he's losing a ton of uptime because of the strat we're using" and it becomes worth adjusting. Of course theres also the occasional bad player that almost always has the worst attitude anyways so they end up getting kicked for more reasons than just poor performance. But if youre not using it as a tool for an end goal that necessitates it then you really don't need it.
They could have the DPS meter calculate the dmg added from the proc, to the player who created the effect, incentivising elemental proc gameplay. Additionally showing what play style and combination works best together. But they won't, because feelings, which is valid, but so is wanting to improve yourself based on factual metrics.
This is what I liked about Final Fantasy XI. I started out as a black mage, which on their own could hit pretty hard, but the way to get the real numbers was for two melee's to fire off their weapon skills in quick succession which would form a skill chain. The weapon skills caused damage, the skill chain would cause damage, and then the black mage would cast the corresponding element to the skill chain and get a magic burst which multiplied the damage of the cast. Different weapons gave different skills, and some skills paired better than others, and there were three tiers of skill chains with the best two being light and darkness to which a black mage would cast thunder or blizzard respectively. We would have to play against the mob's weaknesses and strengths to pull off the best damage. This along with the subscription fee did a good job of keeping the people who were jerks, or just didn't care to learn how to play the game out of the scene, and kept the community from turning into something like League of Legends.
In Monster Hunter World, I like to use Wide-Effect to share my potion heals. I once had a person tell me that I was going to do less damage because of that. My thought was "It's only me not doing damage in that moment. I have 3 other people MORE focused on doing damage to the monster now with less KO's." Only time it's a problem is when one person gets hit so often, that I (with a build meant to keep a supply of potions at all times) starts to RUN OUT. I use armor that gives me a 75% chance not to use my potions, and yet I still run low during the battle trying to keep some people supported.
I liked how WoW used to do it with blessing of might in WoD. You gave someone a % damage buff but the meter counted it as your damage. Would be fun to see who was giving the best party buffs.
I feel like a team dps meter could exist, rather than individual damage Where it caluclates all the damage in total thats happening to the enemy, and shows that, which could help identify if things are going right or wrong. As a note, i personally have not played this game, and i have minimal mmorpg experience as well.
If there's a meter that accounts for the extra damage from debugfs and can attribute it properly it should work fine. It should even help players improve given that they're incentivised to use the mechanics properly.
Bro is talking about skillchains, and magic burst. Melee would save up TP for a special attack and the rest of the team would too. Then we would all do our attacks one at a time, in the correct order, to build increase extra effects of damage that had elements tied to them. And if the mages knew what the element was, they could follow up with a huge burst damage. But the timing had to be precise. And this was when there was no voice really.
The top EGLS/HNMLS didn't do skill chains though. At least not back in the 75 era. They'd get Monks to boost 11 times and chi blast, or get SAMs to meditate to 3k tp and WS. Most DDs didn't even melee to not feed the HNM tp.
@@sylvenia Yes, this was when min/maxing, and metagaming came into play, and people stopped playing for fun, and played more for ego. But it happens in every game at some point. Devs could have fixed this by making an internal cooldown on mob TP gain, for example, they only gain TP from being hit once every 6 seconds or so. Then we could have continued to play the game was it was intended, instead of using these cringe tactics.
He correctly identified the situation as a dumpster fire and stayed far enough away to make sure he survived. The only thing he did wrong was not typing in a /dance and a /laugh at the end
Monster hunter doesn't have team buffs to nearly the same extent, but they also don't let you see your teammates damage in multiplayer, i suspect for largely the same reason
This dynamic right here is perhaps the most compelling thing I've seen about the game. It sounds good so far.
Reminds me of vanguard in the day.
Agreed. Raids are actually going to be fun again.
I'd agree. Heard it might be force pvp however which I'm not a fan of, just want a solid and fun PVE experience really. So I hope that if this is the case they eventually release PVE servers.
kind of just makes me think it will be dog shit on release bc it creates so many potential problems that could ruin the combat
@@raventhorX it's a pvp game dude.
"If there were DPS meters, people wouldn't do that." Thor tells the future of the game right here.
?? It's very true, WoW is a good example of this, SWTOR same way an even FF14, all dps do this. Or guilds stack certain classes for insane buffs to 1 class to push higher dps.
It's why For example PI(Power Infusion) is so strong a flat 20% haste is insane for certain classes. People will purposely not use CDs just to wait for another person to increase their dps.
@@motherpigeon1582DPS Goblins are a thing in every single MMO you can name, even OSRS players who raid care. Someone will make a DPS tracker addon, if possible, and everyone will install it and Thor will be prophetic if and when that becomes normalized. If they ever let a DPS meter stick, the meta will inherently become more selfish and the original comment will be correct.
That's my guess at least, with my MMO knowledge which is limited but I'm pretty sure OP will be right.
The game could have the bonus damage given to other players included in the stats. Shouldn't be hard on a technical level.
Easy solution is just having the dps meter included how much damage your skills added for the party
@@motherpigeon1582AoC is what casual gamers think a hardcore game is like
This is why "haste" is the most damaging spell in 3.5 D&D/PF1E.
Yes, the haste caster does no additional direct damage, but every melee character in the party gets an extra swing every round, and that adds up to a lot more damage than fireball.
or 3 MORE FIREBALLS!! MUHAHAHAHA
but like,
I cast fireball.
Legit though.
My Artificer hasted our Gloomstalker at the start of the fight, and goddamn, over 100 damage total in round 1.
Not just 3.5e , 5e (even with the 2024 version) its still an incredibly strong spell.
@lastwymsi nah in 5e there are much better things to Concentrate on for a caster. Usually control spells or even just Bless will often translate into more damage since they'll boost the DPR of multiple characters than what you'll get from giving 1 character a single attack.
edit: unless you're using it on a Rogue
FFLogs (FF14 fight and dps tracker) uses RDPS to fix this issue, which is essentially your damage dealt + damage dealt by party members that your gameplay affected. So like if I give out a 10% party buff, the party's 10% more damage contribution affects my overall parse/percentile. Its a neat way of handling games that have team synergy and encourages people to utilize their full kits in tandem with each other.
In reality it boils down to "everyone press your buffs at the same time" but its better than nothing 🤠
Unfortunately it really does not track rdps very well. So classes like DNC and AST are regarded even worse than if their added raid damage was nebulous.
The game will be less homogenized in 8.0, please look forwards to it xD :D
There's also a big dev rulings and player culture difference in FFXIV than in WoW. They will straight up ban you for any mention of DPS log results in public group games, especially if you're using them to be toxic to other players.
They know they can't really block log parsing from happening, or for private groups from using the results to improve their play in top-level content, but they can keep it out of the WoW-style effect where they kick and harrass players in public-matched content for not being at the best tier.
Was literally gonna mention rDPS lol
I will add that it is a little naive to assume there won't be a DPS meter or some kind of parsing system because damage output is tied to group synergy. rDPS became the primary grading metric in FFLogs after Dancer was introduced in Shadowbringers because evaluating personal performance with over-inflated numbers due to Dancer buffs was difficult and thus the community became obsessive over rDPS instead of regular DPS.
@ IIRC they overcorrected in Endwalker and early savage group comps left Dancers completely unplayed and Bards as the vast majority of ranged phys in groups.
"You mean I have to think about what other members of my party are doing and act according to what they do ?! **confused DPS player noises** "
*SCREEEEEECHING*
REEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEE!!!!!!!!!!!!!
You might even have to move out of the fire.
Likely not. It seems to be that there will evolve a support role that applies all of the debuffs, and a damage role that strictly hits punch. In cases like that it is the supports role to bring the correct debuff for the damge dealers spec.
woooooooooooooooooooooooossshhhhhhhhhhh
It's funny, because in the MMO I play, Star Trek Online, we have multiple DPS metres, and a lot of times in supported DPS runs people will intentionally decrease the amount of damage they do so that they can deal more debuff, and therefore improve the amount of damage that a specific person deals. It's interesting that in this game, your own dps is directly dependent on your party members, rather than being strictly enhanced by them.
How is star trek online going? I used to play a lot but haven't been on if a few years
@darkreuchiha1842 Been a bit turbulent lately since the Cryptic layoffs and DECA taking over but otherwise it's doing really well
@@darkreuchiha1842 It hasn't had new mechanics in quite a while, but numbers still go up due to new traits coming out with new ships. And consequently, it's super easy to play. It's a chill game that isn't terribly hard.
What i like about the STO contect creators is that they always say in their DPS videos that it was a supported run and explain which buffs/debuffs of their teammates accounter for roughly how much DPS.
That's not the case for content creators in all MMOs but it's so important for other players to understand how to improve the performance of the whole group/raid.
@omadduxo in my videos I try to avoid featuring runs that will skew my results, because I like to demonstrate builds as they are, without much, if any, help.
Would be a bit more difficult, but dps meters in other games will account for this type of thing. When i boost the crit rate in ff, when my team crits, i get a portion of that as rDPS in the log.
Yeah, but there are issues that can still arise from that that make it ridiculously difficult to determine what the actual proportion is. WoW is currently battling with this because when you get a haste buff you can't really directly compare the DPS increase to anything because so many things change from what kind of spells you even could have cast to what kind of procs could have even procced during the time window and beyond. You just can't calculate it directly and need to use statistical methods to get an estimate out of it which is really not doable for a DPS meter.
DPS meters just create toxic players
@@slowazzd2165not really.
@@slowazzd2165 Toxic players create toxic players. Also people will always find ways to evaluate performance and toxic people will always find "something" to flame you for regardless if false or not.
@@slowazzd2165 it will expose toxic players sooner. Having tools to gauge your performance is a good thing, even better if the tool itself is made available within the game because in just about every MMO DPS check is a real concept.
If the content that you're playing requires none of it, then good! But it's an MMO, by definition you're not the only one that dictates how the game is played
This is why having things like rDPS as a metric is beneficial. rDPS is essentially a measure of how much damage you provide under your own effects plus how much damage others deal under those same effects.
If you have to drop one or two cooldowns so everyone else can tack an extra zero to the end of their numbers, that's a good thing.
Also Augmentation Evokers in WoW have their damage calculated in the same fashion on the dps meters or logs as the majority of their damage evolves around the rest of the grp so it makes Thors argument kinda void. Details (one of the dps meters) even depicts it through a see-through bar how much dps the augmentation evoker actually does during the fight.
Sure there are some margins of errors in the dps meters but its so small that nobody cares.
Love this song you always use😊
Love the guy in the group also trying to help, saying his spell highlights itself when Thor freezes the enemy. Thanks, player!
Man, I was actually there for the clip. I love his livestreams.
in Final Fantasy 14, we have a way around this. It's called rDPS and its the metric that actually gets used for parses in fight.
rDPS is your damage + Damage others got as a result of your buffs - Damage you received from others buffs.
The numbers themselves are still look off in the DPS meter itself, but the logs and the end of a fight would reflect it in a proper light. Most people wont care and complain that there damage is lower on the meter, but solutions do exist. (Not that they need to)
That's kinda cool, but I still refuse to use any dps parsers of any kind.
This is pretty much how things work in GW2 through the dps boons, and combo fields in vanilla, but we have/had no problem judging lower boon dps fairly there.
Also DPS meters are important for knowing group dps either way. DPS meters will happen unless banned.
I was also thinking about GW2. In smaller parties or raids is when it really matters, but open world bosses most people basically have max of all the boons. Maybe not always, but lots of the time.
@Mythis1 It actually turns out that in open world, quickness and alacrity uptime is really low due to the randomness of not being in a party.
This is why the Soo-Won fight and Greer+Decima can still fail often unless you focus on organizing squad parties.
Augmentation Evoker’s entire shtick is doing this, and it really feels great knowing that I’m making everyone else stronger and don’t have to worry about my damage numbers as much.
This is exactly pointing out my issues with 'scoreboards' in many games that just shows the basic 'most kills/most deaths' and such, rather than actual valuable info.
Especially in team games like overwatch or marvel rivals. You'll get people saying stuff like 'support diff' based on the stats. Despite the fact the dps were just shooting the tanks only and letting them farm heals and ult charge off them. They'll just look at the numbers and say 'well i got 20k damage in one round so it couldnt have been my fault. Must be because the other supports have 5k heals over mine.'
In general, the 3 main roles should have different metrics, not the same universal metrics.
DPS should be either K/D ratio or damage dealt depending on what type of game it is. Damage metrics would be broken down into personal damage for assassin DPS and raid damage for support DPS.
Healers should be measured by minimized party deaths or maximized party uptime depending on game type.
Tanks should be measured by minimized party damage or maximized damage absorbed depending on game type.
Measuring everyone by K/D encourages everyone to play like an assassin DPS regardless of role.
@@dragonbretheren or game needs mechanics in it like say FPS with a supression effect thusly an HMG would be useful for it's purpose, not rambo-gunning around.
@@crestothegecko6279that's why u use jr brain and realize someone with 20k dmg but 5 kills is just doing fake dmg, scoreboard can and are useful if used right, and just bc otherwise don't use them right doesn't mean u can't either
there is just way too much info to reliably objectively quantify which things are useful, especially so the more complex the game and then each character are. just keeping it at KDA, damage done/taken/healed/mitigated gives you enough info to extrapolate more information. being able to directly see more info is not going to help you improve as a player and is not going to prevent others from flaming either, it would just give you ground to argue and time spent arguing isn't time spent on focusing on the win, so it's not beneficial either way.
there are already meters in other games that track how much you buff other players. so dps meters very much can be a thing
Sounds like the guys in first person shooters bragging about their KD ratio when they're losing an objective-based game type.
Raiders in most MMOs are pretty much entirely that kind of guy. Even the tanks and healers.
An “assisted damage” stat at the end of a game would help so much with encouraging players to do this shit to help in other games, not just a “damage” stat. Some people play just for the numbers at the end
When used "properly" damage meters aren't about "zomg who's doing the most damage." They're about analyzing a fight, yes sometimes to determine a players relative contributions, but also just to see how different skills perform, how enemy damage is dealt etc etc
They are useful! They can tell you things you wouldn't necessarily learn from just playing.
You can build a dps meter that tracks the dps added to party as well so there will be dps meters
There should be a group DPS meter so you can experiment with different group combinations and see which ones yield the best results as a group.
You‘re basically building your own party for a turn based RPG, it‘s just that every character is played by a different person
I feel like this is a good explanation of what teamwork is like in real life too. Imagine if we could see damage meters or effectiveness meters for our team members in every day life. We'd all be winning
There are DPS meters for this game. It's an addon just like any other game. Just because it doesn't have the ease of access to addons like WoW doesn't mean they don't exist. The majority of players use DPS meters to track their own ability usage, crit procs and generally to make sure they are getting the most out of their class. The people who say things like "DPS meters are toxic" or that games are better off without them are just people who have insane ego but can never get high on the DPS meter lol.
@@Gentoes Facts. The hypocrisy is wild. Says dps metres are bad because people with high numbers dont help the group.
Meanwhile all the rank 1’s use warcraft logs that does the same shit but even more detailed. The delusion and ego is huge, and the dunning kreuger effect is real. Says they are ‘’not helping the rest of the team’’ meanwhile he dips on his own team to save himself. Lost all respect. Hands down.
I think there ought to be revised dps meters that calculate the procs of allies and count it as your dps so you can still see what is effective even in a team setting
Seems like itd make more sense to count the combo damage of others as your own. That would reward people for upping the damage of other people
I need this short DMed to every single player in Marvel Rivals so I can finally get teammates that dont see big bukber and think their god when they mindlessly shot a pocket healed tank for the whole game
That’s true for DPS meters in any MMO. Not the best indicator for player skill, but it is the only indicator any MMO allows. There’s no stat that tracks your contribution via party buffs or combinations of effects with other party members
I love that actually, the fact that the game allows that much play within mechanics is awesome, more of this kinda thing please games industry
When I get better internet I'm going to have to play this it seems like the OG days of wow. People don't know much it was a team effort for helping every step of the way.
Back when my wife and I played, I was a shadow priest, and she was a warlock. My shadow resist the buff made her damage skyrocket. So it all worked out.
Can't wait for this game to come out. It looks sick
Same thing in dnd. Yes guiding bolt is not always the best spell to use, but if your rogue with a 6d6 sneak attack need advantage, it's a fantastic set up for even more damage.
Been playing Pantheon and it makes people realize that just bcus you yourself aren't the highest dps ur helping get the other dps have more dmg with your skills. Love this style of gameing
That's why usually stuff like that is accounted for in the logs
like in ffxiv when you apply a buff for your party the dps they do more is accounted to your metric. So you want a higher parse you gotta play optimal and make sure your buffs are applied to all at the best time so that your team can make the most of it, not just you.
in lost ark the dps meter calculate the value that the support provide to the other 3 party members so it wouldn't be impossible to add this in the dps meter based on how much dmg your freeze increased to the other party emmbers
For someone who still doesn't somehow get it.
Imagine you decrease your damage by 50% for 20 seconds but in return the enemy takes 20% increased damage from all sources, so your damage is decreased but your teams isn't. So for the 20 seconds the boss has been debuffed your team dealt an extra 20% damage more than what they would normally do. The fight is over 20% faster.
This is why i like ffxivs dps meter, it messures several different dps types including your own damage, your own damage after party buffs. And it calculates how much damage party members did because of your buffs adding it to your dps
I mean ff damage meters work because most people have an understanding to keep your mouth shut about it.
@@mikelee_616 You think SE doesnt know about it because people "keep their mouth shut"? SE knows about it. It works because SE made it clear as long as you dont talk about it, they will turn a blind eye.
Dps as a whole should be the goal. It incentives helping and assisting
I have yet to see a game that was improved by the inclusion of party member damage tracking, especially when elements like cc are involved. It always results in people prioritizing chasing highest damage done over team cohesion and better play.
I know some people who say they want to have it just to see how much they did, but they always feel disparaged when they aren't near the highest.
Damn it shows that none of the RUclips viewers actually watch stream.
FFXI did skillchains which do the same but you can do it 5 times and keep it going.
The skillchain when I left was able to out put a large amount of dps.
So you could essentially have a party of 8 who are the same job , who can skillchain off each other and themselves to output some serious dmg.
Good memories playing a SAM in that game. Started as a THF doing SATA backstabs and then went full tilt boogie with SAM endless skill chain combos.
This is what I miss in modern MMO’s. Teamwork with abilities playing off each other. This clip is the best ad I’ve seen for AoC so far.
I seem to recall this was a thing for Guild Wars 2, though eventually the community got access to a number of dps metres which changed peoples attitudes.
You could make the dps meters reward the extra damage to the person who applied the debuff
This is part of the reason why I like the “DPS meter” in PoE 2. It doesn’t show how much damage you do alone - it shows you how much damage your entire party has done together.
Seeing this gave me actual goosebumps. If AoC came out 5 years ago I'd be in so much trouble...
Could be a party dps meter. So ppl can see how much their actions are increasing damage.
Unless there's no sort of battle log, there will be a way to math this sort of thing out and develop a tool to see performance metrics. Even if it wasn't personalized, there would still be usefulness in seeing your group's DPS "stat".
This system feels familiar but different from GW2, and I think that's a positive thing. One thing people will have to actualize when they play this game is not overlapping effects overly much, so that you can better utilize combos. There will likely be a "best practices" sort of document for people to follow, but good communication, and just paying attention to your environment, will also be important.
Boosting 4 other people by 20% is a lot more than one person getting a 50% boost
depends on how much they are doing, without a dps meter you wouldn't know, but if the boosted person is already doing the most, a 50% boost can be far greater than the 20% for 4 people. its why so many mmo's come down to a math-spreadsheet, ignorance is great untill you hit a wall of do X better. most of the time its heal more or do more damage faster.
@@edwxx20001Right? Everyone loves to bitch about dps meter goblins, but nobody mentions all the good things about having a dps meter.
For example, to know if I am actually doing my rotation properly, or if I have a teamate that is literally doing 0 work.
you mean the exact issue people had with Augmentation Evoker when it came out? where a lot of its dps came from buffing people so it parsed low till they realized
You can make a damage meter that counts bonus damage towards the support caster. Imagine a support being the highest dps in a fight.
This was a thing I did back in destiny 2 (when it was still respectable / before lightfall)
There was a particular gun called divinity, it created a large extra crit bubble and debuffed the enemy you’re shooting at. It was an exotic so you could only equip it at the cost of another bigger damage weapon and you had to have it equipped from the start of the encounter (you lose all ammo when changing equipped weapons).
It was an ordeal to even get divinity and I mostly ran it because almost no one else either had it or wanted to use it.
That and I mostly ran with randoms so coordination for high skill strats wasn’t common.
WoW has changed a lot since I last played then. That is all DPS cared about at that point...who delt more damage during a fight. I was mainly a Warrior Tank so damage wasn't my thing. Best instance was when my Druid heals got bored and started to DPS. He would pop a HoT and go back to damage. He was 1st in heals and 2nd in DPS. 😂 Good times.
That's cuz this is Ashes of Creation, not WoW. Dx
RPG game guide sounds like a fun futuristic retirement plan.
Ff14 and I think SW have dps meters that calculate buffed, unbuffed, and other dps. A/r/n dps, so it isn't hard to imagine them figuring it out as well. Ff14 has classes they strictly do very little damage just to enhance their team and they are not in short supply.
Really like the idea of this, because it encourages more skill expression across the whole team. Anthem (RIP) had a similar play style where you'd use different element types and stacking different types would give critical hits and overall if the team was using different elements the damage overall would be insane! could wait to see where/how far Ashes goes in the future.
GW2 has combo fields which sounds great in theory, one player puts down a field and other players use it to increase their damage, but it's not used.
This seems nice.
Feels like a more advanced version of the ESO ability synergies in group content.
I love that the most damaging instances in the game is compounding effects of like 3 freeze effects and a shatter deals like 3 times the damage of any normal ability/spell instance. Suddenly you have to know what effects are active and compound them and one of you need to ignite the effect. Instead of just anyone being dps fiends you should talk tactics and what your kits are and how the synergise before even going into combat and then execute on that tactic cooperatively.
Just got access to the game and I love it, can't wait for the 16th to roll around. Shout out to the Clerics!
there is actually charts in FF14 like pdps(personal dps) and rdps(raid dps) and its possible to calculate that to minmax for tryhards
This is exactly what has caused FFLogs to be a detriment to the game as a whole- Introducing a leaderboard for damage then caused everything to be about highest personal damage and we no longer are allowed to have cool things like player synergy (other than a completely uniform 2minute burst window across all classes) because of the players incessant complaining from the perspective of wanting to be leaderboard gamers. And now those same players complain the game is too easy because of it.
1 force multiplier will increase the parties total damage more then you could ever do alone
Haven't played WoW in ages, but that was the only game i ever used a DPS meter, mostly because any raid required it from the raid leader.
Seems like it would be pretty easy to add some sort of PPS (Procs per second) if that is what does the most damage overall that is what players would track.
If that's the case, I feel like I would want to have damage meters and proc meters, like how there is DPS meters and healing meters because I like to be a support, I don't like doing the damage itself but I love helping people do more... Random person's opinion
It took me from vanilla-wotlk to realize this in olden times. The warlock dots went hard
I love how such a concept works against toxic competitiveness
Doesn't matter how dynamic the damage dealt is lol you can still have a meter. I think he just wanted explain the dynamic damage. In short no matter how dynamic the damage algorithm is, it can still be metered.
That's like saying there is no health meter because health is dynamic to your defence and your buffs and debuffs, other players can heal you and apply buffs to you, you could block or not block. We get it, its dynamic but we still have an accurate hp meter. So yes they could implement a dps meter.
I love mechanics like these and I hope they stay
Killing floor had a similar function where you heal others at twice the rate than healing yourself, so it encouraged grouping and helping each other
But in KF2 they reduce the benefit so much that you might as well heal yourself since teammates won't heal you.
Hasn't this idea been in wow for years?
Not in that exact form, wow currently has one spec that is purely support
Classes have buffs for others as well but they are not actively lowering their own dps by using them, it's a bonus on top
There will be. The idea that there won’t be dps meters because people misuse it is crazy. If there is a log of the numbers there will be a tracker.
Playing FFXIV we usually look at rDPS (raid-contributing DPS) which uses a formula that subtracts dps gained from external buffs, and adds the damage given to others by your buffs, it's kind of an objective metric of the DPS you're bringing to the team. Probably wouldn't be applicable to AoC with special status effect procs but I think a meter that takes into account party buff contribution is neat.
I love that Ashes has synergistic class design. FFXIV has some similar notions and I've always deeply appreciated how what people play works together - because isn't that the whole point, in the end? Cohesion? Dump the meters forever.
other games have damage meters that account for buffs and effects and reward the person who applied the debuff with the dps they added by being there. Rather than looking at who does the most damage, you can look at amounts adjusted for who BROUGHT the most damage by being there. The terms i've always seen for this is rdps. This is raid-contributing DPS. This applies the damage increases you provided to other player's abiltiies as your own dps, since they wouldn't have been buffed for those attacks if you weren't there. Would be tougher with spells you can't use or justify unless certain statuses were applied by other players... but you could substitute in a spell that would have been cast, and calculate the damage increase by having the chance to cast the other spell instead. Many games have damage meters that break down buffs and things at least... there will be a useful damage meter at some point, plus damage meters are always good for tracking your own improvements and such.
I just don't think there is any more room for innovation in the mmo rpg genre. And even if there was, the culture is very anti trying anything new, and developers can't take too many risks. MMOs will remain in the same stale state for years to come. I do not see anything special about this one either tbh.
What would be really interesting to see is a dps meter of what the boss or enemy is receiving.
in destiny 2 there's a rocket launcher that deals less damage than all other rocket launchers, but it buffs all your allies, so in a raid where you're 6, it's really good as it's more damage overall for your allies with only having you sacrifice your damage for that buff
I’m pretty sure DPS meters could account for this - details does this for augmentation evoker in WoW, showing a “shadow” bar that extends beyond the “real” damage to indicate the amount of damage its buffs contributed
"Final Fantasy has a similar system where the 'low DPS' is in the form of a class - dancer. The DPS meters have adapted to this and created something called 'Raid DPS,' where the damage you boosted for others is added to yours, and the damage you got boosted by someone else is taken from yours
I love systems like that
Hell yes I’m cool with doing no damage to set up 3,4 maybe 5 other party members to do double or even triple their damage in a hit
It’s more than I could do solo
Ashes of Cremation looks neat
Makes sense but they also already solved for that years ago in 14. When you look at logs theres adps, which is more "selfish damage" and rdps which factors in your raid contributions. There's also tools like xivanalysis that very quickly and easily show if someones not keeping their stuff on CD (such as party buffs which are insanely important to not only use but time with everyone elses buffs). I only really look at this if we're struggling with dps checks, skipping certain mechanics, etc. Sometimes its just a bad run or even off day and the ones lagging behind are otherwise fine, but other times there's a bigger reason for it like "he's losing a ton of uptime because of the strat we're using" and it becomes worth adjusting. Of course theres also the occasional bad player that almost always has the worst attitude anyways so they end up getting kicked for more reasons than just poor performance. But if youre not using it as a tool for an end goal that necessitates it then you really don't need it.
They could have the DPS meter calculate the dmg added from the proc, to the player who created the effect, incentivising elemental proc gameplay.
Additionally showing what play style and combination works best together.
But they won't, because feelings, which is valid, but so is wanting to improve yourself based on factual metrics.
This is what I liked about Final Fantasy XI. I started out as a black mage, which on their own could hit pretty hard, but the way to get the real numbers was for two melee's to fire off their weapon skills in quick succession which would form a skill chain. The weapon skills caused damage, the skill chain would cause damage, and then the black mage would cast the corresponding element to the skill chain and get a magic burst which multiplied the damage of the cast.
Different weapons gave different skills, and some skills paired better than others, and there were three tiers of skill chains with the best two being light and darkness to which a black mage would cast thunder or blizzard respectively.
We would have to play against the mob's weaknesses and strengths to pull off the best damage. This along with the subscription fee did a good job of keeping the people who were jerks, or just didn't care to learn how to play the game out of the scene, and kept the community from turning into something like League of Legends.
In Monster Hunter World, I like to use Wide-Effect to share my potion heals. I once had a person tell me that I was going to do less damage because of that. My thought was "It's only me not doing damage in that moment. I have 3 other people MORE focused on doing damage to the monster now with less KO's."
Only time it's a problem is when one person gets hit so often, that I (with a build meant to keep a supply of potions at all times) starts to RUN OUT. I use armor that gives me a 75% chance not to use my potions, and yet I still run low during the battle trying to keep some people supported.
I liked how WoW used to do it with blessing of might in WoD.
You gave someone a % damage buff but the meter counted it as your damage. Would be fun to see who was giving the best party buffs.
I like the idea, as long as they don’t gymp solo play.
Reminds me of the combos from Anthem.
"All of your damage is based
Hopefully they manage to keep it that way, ffxiv doesn't have one either but it got modded in pretty quick.
I feel like a team dps meter could exist, rather than individual damage
Where it caluclates all the damage in total thats happening to the enemy, and shows that, which could help identify if things are going right or wrong.
As a note, i personally have not played this game, and i have minimal mmorpg experience as well.
Rising tide raises all ships
If there's a meter that accounts for the extra damage from debugfs and can attribute it properly it should work fine. It should even help players improve given that they're incentivised to use the mechanics properly.
This is what made FFXI so great. Combos and building off other players was so much fun.
Still FFXI have dps metter too
@@RasnerG Bro FFXI is from 2001 it doesn't even have a functional mouse look system.
Bro is talking about skillchains, and magic burst. Melee would save up TP for a special attack and the rest of the team would too. Then we would all do our attacks one at a time, in the correct order, to build increase extra effects of damage that had elements tied to them. And if the mages knew what the element was, they could follow up with a huge burst damage. But the timing had to be precise. And this was when there was no voice really.
The top EGLS/HNMLS didn't do skill chains though. At least not back in the 75 era. They'd get Monks to boost 11 times and chi blast, or get SAMs to meditate to 3k tp and WS. Most DDs didn't even melee to not feed the HNM tp.
@@sylvenia Yes, this was when min/maxing, and metagaming came into play, and people stopped playing for fun, and played more for ego. But it happens in every game at some point. Devs could have fixed this by making an internal cooldown on mob TP gain, for example, they only gain TP from being hit once every 6 seconds or so. Then we could have continued to play the game was it was intended, instead of using these cringe tactics.
Track the DPS you contributed to the team. Everyone wants that number to go up because its on a meter. Boom, cohesion
this is how final fantasy 11 worked. almost all skills had a way to synergies with other classes skills, making a new effect
Which is cool but they didn't make it easy to tell which ones combo off what, gotta look up a guide for that.
And you know, FFXI have dps metters too right?
@@RasnerG they sure did. bunch of mods. but those are mods.... what are you on about here?
did you know rain comes from clouds?
More mobs were frozen in this video than an entire DMN run.
He correctly identified the situation as a dumpster fire and stayed far enough away to make sure he survived. The only thing he did wrong was not typing in a /dance and a /laugh at the end
cry more lol, the streaming community have blown this so far out of proportion, it's unreal
Monster hunter doesn't have team buffs to nearly the same extent, but they also don't let you see your teammates damage in multiplayer, i suspect for largely the same reason
what if, party member's proced damage is shared in the dps meter