I’m recommending we NOT INSULATE This Old House
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- Опубликовано: 29 сен 2024
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You’re missing the most relevant factor as to why those walls are dry on the inside: lime mortar. The bricks are laid with lime mortar, which is less dense than the bricks and breaths/allows the moisture to wick out on a grand scale and evaporate.
Idk if you're right, but it sounds good. You get a like haha
Yep and lime plaster on the interior, which they just ripped out--ooops
@@kevinhibbard320 They're 100% correct. This is how solid walled houses are pointed in the UK, and if they're also rendered they're rendered with lime. Houses of this period that are pointed or rendered with cement often have so many issues with blowout and damp
I use lemon mortar... I save lime for my ice cold Corona
@@carlsapartments8931 Grapefruit plaster is also good.
The author does like to from scratch, ruclips.net/user/postUgkxbnOKZBE4evMO5V2vroHeCjq6d_MV6wJO shaping and trimming wood from large blocks into fine finished products. As another reviewer mentioned, most projects require a lot of high-dollar equipment that most of us don’t have the room or budget for. But, knowing how to do these things, even if we won’t be able to practise the full stack project, is still great.
I lived in an old home in Spain. No insulation, concrete and stucco build, plaster walls.
It got cold and I turned on my kerosene space heater, closed the door to that part of the house and started fixing dinner. You cannot imagine my shock when I went back into the living room to discover I couldn’t see farther than my arm! The extreme moisture held in the walls formed a thick fog cloud inside the house with the introduction of the heater. ☁️☁️☁️☁️☁️
I opened the windows as the air outside was drier than inside.
I believe you. And that's hilarious!
You should always have the windows cracked a little when using a kerosene heater indoors anyway. Otherwise their combustion products (CO2, carbon monoxide, nitrogen dioxide, etc) will accumulate in the room to unhealthy levels.
You should also only use them as much as necessary, and turn them off every so often and air out the room before continuing, if you're doing it for a long time.
(It is ironic that in places where these heaters are your main heat source for a home, to heat up your home in the winter, you actually need to open a window...)
@@foogod4237
The room had ventilation via a fireplace, but you aren’t wrong! Good advice!
Pics or it didn’t happen
@@nofurtherwest3474
I took three but something went wrong…the film printed out nothing but whiteout.
🤣 joking
Unfortunately the brick has an R value of about ZERO, my former boss in NW Iowa restored an 1898 2 floors and attic all brick, slate roof townhouse, I remember he said his utility bill was $800 a month on average- he was basically heating and cooling the SKY with that zero R value brick and single pane windows everywhere.
Without insulation you are going to pay thru the nose for heating and cooling, and it will never be comfortable when it's 20 below zero and windy outside, especially with single pane windows!
I think what everybody missed on this home is that it is balloon framed the wall studs go all the way to the foundation it's constantly circulating air all the way around the outer shell from the crawl space I think this house could be insulated within baffles in the wall to keep the air flow circulating it'd be perfectly fine for another hundred years
Exactly my thoughts.
I hear what you're saying, and I agree, and I think that can work in the final whole home system, however...I'm in Canada, colder climate... can't think of not insulating the house. IMO, poly inside the framing and seal it, and then build an inner frame with modern insulation technologies, likely something that breathes well such as rock-wool. You lose a small percentage of overall square footage, but with a house that size nobody will miss it. The outer wall still moves any moisture it needs to, the inner wall is protected from that, and the house enjoys a proper insulating layer. Matt, thoughts?
I was wondering the same thing and this is the question I am dealing with in my house as well. The one issue I see is my house has 2x4 studs so adding baffles and then insulation, I would need some kind of very thin Rockwool which I'm not sure they make. Not to mention all the other stuff like electrical I need to run through my walls.
Are you thinking baffles on the outside of the cavity?. In cooler climates I'd wonder if you are placing the dew point (for in-house moisture) inside the wall. Yet what you are describing is a little how a vented attic works.
@@pcatful yes sir
I would still insulate. There are organic alternatives that hold moisture. We use it for old farm houses. I would be more worried about vapour barriers than insulation.
Matt did not explain it but here is what I believe may happen. If you put in insulation less heat will leech out to the old particle board. Which means moisture in the air will condense into liquid water droplets earlier because the relative humidity will hit 100% faster in cool air vs warm air. Which is bad. But if you add more material that can hold humidity to "share" the load of the particle board it may not be a problem. May not, as in if you do not do a good job it will probably fail. I would want the moisture to be able to move in and out so I would not put in a vapour barrier. You can always add more ventilation. I really recommend a vapour barrier if the walls are unable to hold a _lot_ of moisture.
Why oh why are we not building with these antiquated materials and techniques today??? I have a 100 yr old house in a historic district. Built like a tank. Strong and solid. Wonderfully insulated. The walls are literally a foot thick with brick and stucco, which is masonry. I just do not understand our cheap materials and techniques today. I think it’s so incredibly sad.
Lack of cheap labor?
You should insulate with natural (sheep)wool. Just like the other materials in your wall, it absorbs moisture and give it back in dryer times. No moisture barrier please.
Matt, consider using fiberglass faced gypsum... They use it as sheathing on the outside of commercial buildings!
DensGlass
@@mikehermesmeglio yes, and DensArmor from GP. USG and others make similar products. I think commonly used on interior walls of commercial buildings before dry-in. I put it on the walls of my bathrooms and in the basement.
I think that wall material is homasote fiberboard. Super-thick solid cardboard. It's made a lot like paper is made but blown into a sheet without water.
2 things. I think that particle board sheathing was called Temp test? At least here in Canada. As well I have found the bricks from the old days were a lot more “solid” and not as airy as the newer bricks. Maybe that also helps with the water penetration? Love your channel
My question would be is this wall cavity open from crawl space of the house to the attic, because if it is then that would be why the wall cavity is not rotted. The air flow through the wall cavity would have removed any moisture that would have gotten into the house.
I’m restoring my 120+ year old balloon frame house and we removed all the tongue and groove and insulated the almost 4inch stud depth by first a layer of 1/2 inch continuous foam board precisely cut to push in each cavity then sealing all edges with silicone caulk. We then used r13 glass batts for a total of 16.5 r value. We planned to then Sheetrock and ultimately ad lots of wood wainscoting etc using the t&g we took out. The exterior is clapboard witch was at one point covered with vinyl siding witch we are removing leaving the original clapboard. After this thought provoking excellent video I’m now thinking I should add a layer of some type of mesh over the clapboard before covering with 1/2 inch foam board and ultimately 4x8 sheets of smart panel ? We plan to close the space from the floor to the sill with rock wool to deter mice/ bugs. Any thoughts to help us… anybody ?
That sheathing is not new to me. In the Pac NW, many new stucco houses in the 1970s and 1980s used it, because of its better insulating qualities compared to plywood or shiplap, as well as low cost. Covered with tar paper outside. Then they would nail wire base for stucco onto only the studs. They did understand that it does not provide diagonal bracing like wood, so it was required to put diagonal studs into many cavities instead. Fortunately, the code already required continuous plastic vapor barrier before the sheetrock.
It dries to the outside. Closed cell foam on the inside would not create an issue. It would allow the partical board to dry toward the air gap. I’ve been remodeling 1880’s-1930’s in Cleveland using closed cell foam for many many years.
I appreciate the videos on making decisions with older homes. Thanks
I didn't even know they made that board material so long ago. I would have guessed they started making that material in the early '40s.
Easy way to fix the bottom mold issue is to puncture drain holes into the brick at the bottom where none can see them. In my experience things can get wet and dry out with no issues, it's when they stay wet that it's an issue
Bricklayers use to leave "weep holes" in the mortar. Usually the bottom course of bricks and they did it by leaving out the mortar in between the bricks on that course every eight feet or so. At least in St. Louis area. Too often the walls were tuck pointed much later by people who plugged them up and caused more trouble than help.
Yeah I'm curious what would happen if you used mineral wool throughout with it's high perm rating
That odd sheet material is often called "beaver board". It does not mold easily for some reason. I would suggest having that old insulation tested for asbestos. Plaster is definitely the way to go in a house like that. I prefer plaster if the budget supports it and you can fine a good plasterer, which is getting harder to do.
For sure. Back in the 1920s many homes were very solidly built, because the folks usually built their own homes and would pass them down through the family, just like the farmhouse that's been in my family since 1881 built by my great- great-great-great grandparents. Aunt Sharon and Uncle Bill currently live in it. Their oldest daughter is set to inherit the house once they move to an old folks home or pass away.
Old carpenter here. IMHE that is not Homasote, which is the trade name for "beaver board". It is the wrong color and does not break like shown. I believe it's particle board. That said, it presents issues with Matt's theory that the house was originally sheathed in particle board, as WIKI claims the stuff was not in production, as a commonly available panel sheathing until a decade later. So, the build date, or something, is out of sync here. If it was a 1920s build, I would assume that the diagonal board sheathing shown is probably the original. From WW2 to the 70s, particle board came and went as a structural sheathing product. Plywood supply issues, and economics, I guess. I had a friend who watched a new build go in next to his house, in the 1970s. This new SFH was on top of a small hill, in farm country. The builder was famous for building very low cost crap. The framers covered most of the rafters with 1/2 particle board and wrapped up for the day. High winds came through and over the next few hours the sheathing was reduced to chunks blowing around the neighborhood, leaving a debris field like a tornado, and damaging neighbor's cars, with bits of it still nailed to the roof. The mobile home industry gave it a try also. I have seen it develop huge sags between trusses, and create a bizarre looking shingled roof.
@@kerrykerry5778 The stuff he's showing is definitely not Homasote. I believe it is Beaver Board (which actually is its own trademarked name) or similar.
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Beaverboard
The attic and part of the sleeping porch of my 1913 house are finished with it.
@@jongeers1954 Eh, true, but. Homasote sheathing was called "beaver board" for at least 75 years after the brand name failed. Both of these, and similar products that were popular until the 80s, were compressed wood fiber sheets. The product shown in the video is neither the same color nor does it break down by hand in that manner. I remember framing in the 70s, as a young kid, when walls were sheathed with 1/2" fir ply on the corners, and 1/2" black homasote sheathing for the field. At that time it was called beaver board by the carpenters, roughly half a century after the brand name failed.
I have a 1929 craftsman style bungalow that has 3/4 inch shiplap inside and outside all the walls. I am renovating my home and decided not to wrap or insulate the walls because it is supposed to breath and dry out if water gets in.
I bet that house is beautiful.
Wouldn't it work to use unfaced insulation and an air barrier that allows drying to the outside? Or would that still slow the drying too much?
Why not just add Rockwool with no vapor barrier? Rockwool is vapor permeable and shouldn't cause additional mold risk to the fiberboard section.
If the owner wants to use sheet rock instead of plaster job, it is wise to prime the back of sheet rock with "Kills" primer paint before enclosing the wall cavity. Also , instead of insulation. Maybe press into the cavity that tybeck fabric instead of insulation.
In NC, you start a remodel with a permit, it has to brought up to minimum energy code requirements.
Good point. If following the law and getting a permit you will have options for the type of insulation but not whether or not you do it.
Would it make sense to just spray foam all the cavities?? And maybe add a sheer board on the inside, that way even if there was significant water getting into the old particle board, it could just rot over time and have no effect on the house, since the spray foam is keeping any mold particles from entering the house and the new sheer board can take up any of the load from the failing particle board
00:33 That stuff WAS NOT INSTALLED when the house was built...Obviously, someone did exterior work, most likely in the 60's-early 70's ...Come on Matt; it's not that hard...
Excellent conversation to have!
What are some alternatives to modern drywall in general? I rarely see places with anything other than drywall or paneling.
Wood lath and plaster..,!
Gypsum board, as manufactured in this present day , (in my 40 year experience as a GC engaged in residential work,) is the greatest liability and health threat of our industry. It’s a complete bait trap for the slightest intrusion of moisture to trigger mold, mildew, rot…. 😣😣.
How and why do we continue to embrace this disastrous building product??
Spray Foam (closed cell) insulation or standard with vapour barrier don't seem to be an option for you? It may not be done properly, therefore a giant energy pig is fine with you. I would then focus on insulating the attic.
Mans casually throwing around 1940’s rockwool....... your lungs will never forgive you....
it's funny that they demolished the walls around the windows but the window coverings are still hanging... lol
Damn! Was that 1930s "beaver board"?
I have an old house, 1959 and i want to insulate the walls. And i want to replace siding as well. Do you think it would cause issues if i do that? Based on what was said on the video? Thanks for the feed back. I live in Texas and summers are a nightmare
It's a type of insulation board we use to call it a derogatory name. 😂
Very good!.
I’ve thought about this on old houses, i’d probably do rocksol in the cavities and tyvek instead of poly on the inside.
Question? I Know on this particular home you would not insulate from the outside, but what if this was a 100 year old siding home Should you add exterior insulation and then new siding.
nevermind the insulation, bull those studs out of that archway !!
Is there not an air gap between the brick and the sheathing like a modern build?
To my eyes it looked like there is an air gap at 3:30 where Matt is able to poke a finger in a sheathing opening. -shrug-
what if you use a solid spay foam insulation??? better or still same problems
are cement board mold proof?
Looks like cork insulation, not particle board. used for wet applications for at least a millenia.
Seal the brick. Use closed-cell spray foam in the wall cavities. Add 1" Celotex insulation before gypsum board. That will seal and insulate the house blocking condensation on the walls which would mean mold formation.
I'd like to educate on the comment about mold needing cellulose to grow as food. Mold will grow on glass🤔. It only needs moisture, and humidity levels above 50% is sufficient for most molds to grow, anywhere, and especially where it can readily condensate. Like on the fiber board. The turpentine nature of the sap in pine lumber helps to retard its growth. But mostly in what I saw is the ability for air movement to keep it dry is what it had going for it. Mold cleaning and prevention specialist.
The fiber sheathing your referring to was not manufactured 100 years ago. That section of wall was probably from a later remodel. I don't disagree with you reluctance to insulate the wall with fiber sheathing, as it could cause problems.
Highly reasonable Matt, good work!
You got an old house, guess what, you don't get to do the cheapest solutions, drywall problematic but plaster isn't, then guess what YOU HAVE TO PLASTER. HISTORICALLY more accurate too so no problem with either historic or DOB. That's a multi million dollar house. SPEND THE MONEY. Close up all the holes in outside wall. Treat with anti fungicide when air is dry and fungicide will dry quickly, use fans too. Run a bead of sealant around studs and exterior wall ea stud space. You've no reduced wind driven air flow to nothing. You only have vapor water flow. Install a drain mat made of twisted plastic strands w no facings that way no surface for water to condense on against old material Install unfaced rock wool TIGHT to studs. Put on SS lath. Run sealant up lath at ea stud so when plaster is applied they'll be an air barrier between stud bays. Install CEMENT based plaster that won't decay under water vapor. Finish with BREATHABLE paint. If sufficiently paranoid put another drain mat between plaster and rock wool. The drain mat at exterior wall will allow some air movement up in hot weather to help carry away water vapor. The rock wool will allow transmission of water vapor to 'dry' ie inside air conditioned side. Dew point might occur within Rock wool, which luckily will remain unaffected until at some point it can evaporate and move thru plaster into house or back outside.
oh
and
INSTALL GUTTERS BIG OLD HUGE NEVER CLOG CAUSE THEY ARE SO HUGE OLD FASHIONED GUTTERS
If historic agency says anything, hand them a bill from your mason for his bid to come back every year, inspect and point. Historic agencies cannot force you to let your building be destroyed , create a hazard, or endanger occupants if there is an inherently dangerous existing condition. Research history of applied gutters, find the most appropriate DO IT. Also, install hard surface 18 inches wide at bottom of wall sloping away from building to 'draining soil' gravel bed trench drains or French drains to ensure run off will not sit and soak into bottom bricks. Maintain drain surface free of all overhanging vegetation. This will increase air flow around the building and dry wet brick from outside faster, so they'll be less water left to drive inwards.
You headline is click bait sensationalism which is defensible to get people to learn what to do.
Your choice to pick the cheapest solution, and ignore all other remedial work related to problem that in and of themselves might solve problem is weak, very, very weak.
You obviously KNOW about buildings. Then USE that knowledge to teach. Give the RIGHT solution and if there is a significantly lower cost solution, and you care that those without millions to redo an old mansion might watch and appreciate the info, you can add, BUT if money is tight, and KNOWING you're heating bills will go up, and the room might feel cold, just seal the holes up, seal ea joist cavity to limit wind driven air / moisture vapor flow, use mold resistant drywall wall, use fiberglass mesh instead of tape and mold resistant compound. The upcharge for mold resistant materials isn't that high. Installing a baseboard heater at the wall would also help evaporate away water vapor (do not have HVAC duct discharge against wall if you have central AC as cold air in summer will encourage condensation mold.
But is modern plaster as moisture absorbent per sqft as old plaster?
Is this moisture/mold issue the reason why renovation through fast and easy covering all the walls and ceilings of houses with a kind of insulated click panels is not possible??
Probably the best tip ever. Never considered letting something just Stay as it is.
I am really curious how one of your previous videos fits into this.
You put dimple mat on, if I remember correctly, barn board sheathing, then foam board, sealed that and insulated on top of that. Oh before you started you drilled holes to create airflow across the back of the sheathing.
Would you still do this? Is the brick the reason why you didn't in this build?
yeah, brick is the big difference. if you're using a water-tight cladding (siding), then you want an air gap behind it, a vapor barrier (if you're in a hot climate), then insulation, the sheathing, then insulation in the wall cavity, then drywall or whatever wall material.
If you add air conditioning you're changing the way the house works regardless of insulation. On a hot humid day, warm air is going to flow through the wall cavity (through the giant holes in the sheathing you showed) and condense on the back of the cold sheetrock.
No way air conditioning is just now being added to this building. Likely had a/c for the last 50 years.
it wil dry out fast enough to not be an issue in the majority of cases, great point tho for crawl space or basement type areas.
Yep. Bet if you pulled that stack (ductwork) out, the back of that is in interesting shape.
If sheet rock were a conductor I would worry, but it is not it is an insulator, I would insulate the ducts in this house for sure.
I would think rockwool would have enough breathing ability to mitigate mold growth
It would not surprise me that the particle board has been treated with something super toxic like arsenic to retard mold growth.
You mean the good stuff
could it have asbetos?
It is cane fiber from sugar cane that has been pressed and washed out completely. It was a waste product until they started making sheathing out of it. Not very strong so you had wood corner bracing with this stuff in between as a brick backer. Later in time they sprayed it with asphalt on one side for water resistance and continued making the bare stuff for sound deadening as sound board. Both products were sold well into the seventies and early eighties. I remember using it in the mid sixties when I first started framing. And yes it is fragile but has no wood in it.
@@randomrazr that "rock wool" batt looked like asbestos to me.....1950s remodel - time fits
@@markpashia7067 That's interesting. When I was a kid and I'm talking back In the 60s, we lived in a WW2 era apartment built as temporary war time housing. We referred to the sheathing back then as 'gyp lap'. It had the asphalt coating you refer to on both sides. It's been too long to remember the manufacturer but I seem to remember that it was USG. No insulation in the walls, asbestos siding and sheetrock interior walls. I had always thought it was a sawdust/ chipboard mix sheathing and I remember seeing a gray colored mastic product on the seams, probably something with asbestos.
One of the biggest takeaways I've gotten from watching this channel is the importance of things drying out. Getting wet or exposed to moisture is not always a problem if things dry out. It's made me look at my old house differently.
Best to let basement walls dry to the interior of the space; above grade, in northern climate, let it dry to the exterior. Today's homes have poly sheat behind drywall; this method is so different from plaster.
Exactly I learned this here a long time ago.
It's OK if it gets wet as long as it gets dry too.
You don't have to use basic insulation. You can use other spray types that don't absorb water. That seems to be what he is afraid. So to answer your question.
Yes!!!!!!!!!!!!!! 10000000000000000000000000000000% insulate that house.
This was great because you are back to reality, advising on problems most of us will face rather than new ideal builds
They always seem to drift away from things that regular people experience.
@JustAnotherTowerClimber Yes he is, however his youtube audience isn't. What makes content interesting is how we can identify with it. I will never have a 20K HVAC system.
@@jtmack77 its a money thing
@@jtmack77 Not sure how you can say what the audience is, some videos get over 1million views, some videos are deliberately geared toward builders and those looking to build. Just because you're not part of that group doesn't mean others aren't.
I really don't get the constant complaints about content due to price. This isn't a renovation channel. It's certainly not a renovation channel geared toward small budgets. The whole point of the channel was to show how to build better -- certainly better than the production work he did previously. And with the average new production build now close to 300k, a lot of people will never have that. And that's ok, enjoy the content for what it is even if your own circumstances mean you'll never try for a passive house. Neither will I
@@recoveringarchitect7581 Dont you know? Anyone thats not upper class sees themselves as the "regular person" and everything is supposed to represent what they as individuals want to see because they support their individuality with the illusion that it represents most people
Old houses that breathe are more healthy than the ballons we build now days in my opinion.
1) The particle board has a air gap between it and the brick (That is 1 reason why it's survived so well as others pointed out old brick work sheds humidity better than modern mortar) 2) if you want to give the particle board air you can use Sofit spacers used for insulating rafters to keep the insulation 1.5" from the sheeting. you'd be able to insulate while maintaining the original air gap on the inside of the sheeting. 3) Now that the Original particle board has Numerous holes you've punched into it you'll have to change the approach to keeping it dry by increasing the volume of airflow so the interior of the board doesn't retain humidity (Which is what you saw at the base with discolored particle board. Not enough air) 4) A completely closed pocket must stay closed and have some through absorbent surface to shed any moisture (Which the original plaster was) since you plan to go with drywall and you perforated the outer board you definitely want insulation to mitigate rapid moisture changes in outer walls.
Our 1948 ballon frame house had no insulation, tar paper, and 105 wood siding nailed to the studs. The upper part had tar paper, 1x4s spaced out with double course cedar shakes attached to those. And we still had rotten siding on a few spots! We recently stripped the exterior walls, added Rockwool insulation, plywood not osb, 30# tar paper, and double course cedar shakes. Above that hardie board. I’m loving it so far.
Damn how much did you spend for that? And what do you mean by exterior walls? Aren’t all 4 sides exterior walls?
@@oshitomaha It usually means they worked from the outside, removing the outermost layer and insulated from there versus removing interior plaster/sheetrock and insulating from there.
That sheathing is Homasote. Also that mineral wool insulation was made from Coal slag and it's messy and not very effective. I know cause our 1960 house(not too many miles from that house you are showing) had it in the walls... The house was also built out of lumber from a disassembled house so the lumber is very old very hard and very strong. I have a few of the 2x4s left from an older remodel and I hate to use them because they are such nice lumber that isn't available anymore.
Yes, my 1958 house had it. In my area they referred to it as beaverboard. I think that was an old brand of the product.
My house was build in 1950 and sometimes I think the reclaimed lumber from it would cost more than the house.
Or possibly Masonite, invented in 1924, mass produced starting in 1929. Unfortunately, they started using it as siding in the 1980s, and class action lawsuits started in the late 1990s. Still makes for good pegboard.
can any of it ahve asbetos?
@@randomrazr when i saw johns manville i thought ASBESTOS!
OMG you are in Texas. Your rain is like mist compared to the rest of the country, then the hot heat dry's everything out anyway. It should be insulated and then have Lath and plaster again, historically speaking.
Texas is huge and pretty diverse climate. The gulf is hot and humid and the pan handle is dry and dust. Some places are green, some are rocks
You do not know Dallas at all. Hot in the summer and snow in the winter!!! Lots of condensation. Pea soup fog in the fall.
@@markpashia7067 lol. Dallas averages 1 inch of snow per year. Average snowfall in United States is 28 inches per year
I have the same particle board sheathing on my brick house from the 60's. The walls have fiberglass insulation and two layers of sheetrock, and as far as I can tell that's how it was built. There are no moisture issues that I know of. It has stood this way for 60 years, so I guess it must be fine.
I did some work on a house built in 1928 in South Florida, had the same type of particle board walls with no rot. Had the material tested for asbestos, came back clean.
Must have been the lucky one :) A home from 1928 is almost sure to contain asbestos, lead paint, lead plumbing (possibly lead supply piping) balloon framing with no firestopping installed, and a mixture of knob and tube wiring and newer romex as upgrades over the years have been made. The original electrical service was typically 110 volts, 30 amps with 2 to 4 circuits total.
what aboit 1909 @@Sparky-ww5re
As someone who lives in a 120 year old house with plaster walls, this was much appreciated. I like your style on new construction and am appreciative that the principles you speak of, properly applied, still work with old construction.
so if u buy a 100 year old house. trying to modernize it with insulation vapor barriers etc could actually be a bad thing?
@randomrazr yes. I have a 1910 home balloon framing. There are methods to modernize it with a "channel and vapor barrier then dry wall.. but you would have to demo all the walls.. not economical.
@will201084 all the exterior one's at least.
One time, I added exterior underground insulation to a basement. It did nothing after adding on the long sides. One side was above ground due to terrain slope. But when I added the final 25" of rigid insulation, suddenly the basement was a LOT warmer! While you might want to add insulation on the spots without that particle board, based on my experience, it'll be a waste of money because the heat loss from the uninsulated area will dominate the heat demand.
We just finished remodeling my house built in 1918. We replaced the siding and the house had no sheathing. So we decided not to sheath the house. the studs and interior walls were in great shape. I have heard of mold growth with osb sheathing so if it worked for 100 plus years why change it.
now that was v/ smart
Not a contractor, and really a only small project DIY guy, but I never miss one of your vids. Thanks dude!
I’m not even in the game anymore used to be a handyman and help carpenters but still love learning from his videos!
Matt, I lived a old 1800's brick mill and had a Mason repoint the bricks. When they were finished, they sprayed the entire structure with a silicone sealant. Rain would bead up and run off the outside. But it was breathable so any moisture on the inside could escape.
I have a brick full masonry house, and am considering applying this type of sealant so that I would then be able to insulate without having moisture problems. Sounds like you have been pleased with the sealant. Did you add insulation at the same time you applied the sealant?
It may have been silane/siloxane and not silicone
how can we do a partial thermal insulation of an old house if we want the thermal insulation work to be done gradually and partially, over the course of several years, having a low budget and living only in a small part of a house?
Sheetrock presents more of a breathability/condensation problem than insulation does. Why not consider using plaster and lath like the original? Or a paperless plasterboard?
I was thinking the same thing. they might actually be doing that, but matt might have just not known about it.
Was thinking Savolit plus board for insulation and lime plaster over.
it wasnt rock latch. it looks like plaster board and plaster.
it seems like that might be in other words what he was stating and maybe from more of an experienced aspect
Plaster and lath is outdated and weak. I would definitely try something stronger like paperless plasterboard.
Good gracious you are a young man. That product was sold well into the 1970s and was very common. It is a use of cane fiber. Mostly on the exterior it was sprayed with asphalt as a vapor barrier.The reason that corner had one by wood sheathing was for wind bracing. All corners were diagonally braced with that non structural sheathing in between. If you are going to plaster again don't insulate, but if you are going to use drywall, use a non vapor barrier insulation like unfaced fiberglass and then use a vapor barrier floor to ceiling and corner to corner over the studs. Then drywall. With modern AC I do believe you will want to insulate. That non insulated with double hung windows was very common in the south for the walls to breath. But a cold surface from AC will give you grief without vapor barrier and insulation. Better bone up on old methods!!!
They pulled the brick of that corner of the house to re sheath it with 1x8! OKAY!
It's surprising how little he knows about construction for a "pro"
@@davidribeca1745 I agree this seems very unlikely, but what do you make of the 1939 insulation in that cavity?
I was thinking the same thing. Unfaced insulation should work fine. No vapor barrier, so no worries of trapping in moisture.
@@CybekCusal What is even more surprising is that construction has been going on for 5000 years and you expect him to know every single part of it. Is a modern car mechanic supposed to know how to fix the SPICA fuel injection on a classic Alfa Romeo???
Thanks for the nice video. Well, following the same rationale, you can use natural insulation materials with hygroscopic properties like the ones used in building biology and also lime plaster with the same properties as well.
my professional opinion is pack those stud bays with moist soil from the lawn, set up a sprinkler to keep them wet for 48 hours, staple some poly over it, and drywall it in, but then again my profession has nothing to do with home construction
than the question might be why are you giving some professional advice on something, when you stated that's not in your (professional) area.
WIERD
@@mikeoland5909 not gonna lie, your pretty weird, he obviously was just making some random stuff up and messing around lol
@@mikeoland5909 it's funny how people without a subtle sense of humor don't understand subtle humor. WEIRD.
My house is from the 60’s all the exterior walls are solid masonry. This is EXACTLY the idea I had to make my home more comfortable.. One room is significantly colder because three of the walls are solid masonry. Any help would be appreciated
But I should plaster the garden walls, right?
Matt enters the jobsite. Taking off his sunglasses and flicking a cigarrette. "Alright, roll camera" he groans. The nine man personal camera crew gives the signal. Matt rambles. Picking up sheathing, removing insulation, throwing it all on the floor for the peasants to clean up. Ends the video. Drives to the airport, leaves for vegas. Candy misses him. Brought to you by ZIP systems.
You left out Roxul 😂
You should look into how straw light clay insulation works with lime plaster. It's a different approach to moisture movement through walls than what you normally talk about. That system allows moisture movement and it works because the straw and clay diffuses moisture rather than allowing "hot spots". Then lime plaster wicks the moisture out of the wall
In a nutshell: If it's not broke, don't 'Fix' it. Take the small hit of increased heating\cooling bills. That house endured the elements very well for near to a century. Changing the equation is going to introduce new variables that are overwhelmingly likely to only make things worse, not better.
I would call in BCS for a recommendation
It will be with it.
I would pay Joseph Lstiburek rather than the
Electric company for the next 200 years!!!
Joe is the best. 1 Email with pictures and I'm sure Matt would have an answer in no time.🏗
I have an old log farm house here in Finland that serves as my summer cabin, disassembled moved to it's place in 1920's. Just by keeping the doors shut it stays "cold" in 20C no matter how hard the sun bathes the walls in the summer, kids call it the "ice room" because the temperature difference to some times over 40c outside is so big on summers. Other end of the house that sees more traffic doesn't do the same as the door there is most of the times open and people go in and about as it has the kitchen and the living room.
On winters though the house is cold as heck but still keeps naturally relatively warm in -10C and the old masonry heaters take ages to warm up. original double windows help to keep it warm though as do the floor that sits 1meter above ground with 1/2 meter of saw dust for insulation, the mid roof (the house has an attic accessed from outside) is similarily insulated albeit with clay and straw.
Only issue the house has is that frost has moved the stone foudation over the years so the house has started to drop from one side and also dry rot that eats timber over time.
There are techniques to make foundation to not move (staves under stones in foundation similar to today) but those are only found in mansions of the nobles not in farms of the common folk.
Solid brick wall construction is how all Victorian era houses were made, just like a large percentage of UK houses.
You might get mold on cold walls in near freezing wintertime but nothing rots as it's all breathing. Even the floor joists are all intact.
You can of course insulate with Rockwool, as I will be doing to my house because solid walls are bloody freezing in winter. 🥶
I beg to differ--Our 1898 Queen Anne is not brick, it's sided with wood, interior is lath and plaster.
Not where I live (northern NH). It's almost unheard of to see any brick, except the tops of some foundations. My 1893 is all wood exterior, lathe and plaster inside.
Fellow uk resident who bought a solid block home... how are you going to manage the moisture build up or prevent it?
Wood frame with brick veneer just like this (though usually less cheapish) was already very common in the outgoing 19th century (in the Us).
@@fabriglasYou could use wet-sprayed cellulose
Mold forms in the presence of water. Insulation doesn't cause water formation or water retention. Water in walls comes from temperature differentials that generate condensation.
The reason the particle board has survived is not just because it didn't have insulation, it's because there was never very much temperature difference between the inside and outside (because nobody has ever wanted to heat that much uninsulated house).
The debate should not center on whether insulation should be in the walls, the debate should be on how the building will be used. If you plan on living like a modern family and try to keep that building at 70f plus all year, then condensation will form on that old particle board, (AND it will cost more to heat).
The lack of insulation only caused the lack of desire to heat and therefore reduced the possibility of condensation. But if you plan to heat it, you had better put insulation (and vapor barrier) or you will have rotten walls about the same time you run out of money to heat the place.
Shorter version:
Thinking insulation will CAUSE rot is like thinking marriage CAUSES divorce.
SMH
Where do you suggest the vapor barrier be placed in the assembly for this climate zone? What about cooling?
Especially as the humidity in the building changes.
The current HVAC system is likely oversized, with a LOT of airflow and plenty of ductwork.
Start trying to add in modern systems like a whole-home dehumidifier into that system, or install variable speed equipment, and suddenly you're dropping the humidity to a point where we now have condensation that never happened before, because the house has never been that dry.
While those systems will dry out the house overall, they'll completely change the dynamic between the temp/humidity of the air inside the ducts and the dewpoint in the air outside of the ducts, and there will be all kinds of duct sweating issues...
Insulation can absorb and hold more moisture longer and prevent quick drying leading to… mold.
@@epiphany6 What? Reducing the humidity causes condensation?
@@D2O2 cooling is still only needed for less than 4 months of the year. So Since the majority of Hvac will be heating, then the vapor barrier goes on the inner side of the wall behind the drywall.
Also, when people do run cooling, the temperature difference is not as significant for as long. Running AC will usually bring about a 20-25f degrees or less difference, worst at the hottest part of the day.
Heating runs all through the colder months and even runs more at night. 30 or even 40 -- up to degrees difference every night in the winter (if you run it at 68) is far worse than summer.
Also, interior air is usually more moist due to human occupation. So the hotter and relatively more moist interior heated air in winter is a far bigger problem than higher summer humidity.
Fort worth is not the deep south of Louisiana. Temperature and humidity differences will be less severe in the summer than the winter. Meaning the AC is not as good at cooling or de-humidifying in summer as mother nature is for the other 3 months of the year.
So when it rains the bricks absorb water, then when the sun shines on that brick it drives the moisture further into the wall?? Seems to me that as the outside of the wall dries the moisture would migrate from the damper interior to the dryer exterior. I'm just nitpicking this one point. Your larger argument that insulation is ill-advised might make sense. The discussion is more than just academic to me. I live in a brick house that is about 100 years old, too. Mine, however, has outside walls that are solid masonry/plaster all the way in. No studs, cavities or insulation. I believe the horizontal structural wood members are actually supported by the outer masonry walls. Not sure if there's any practical, affordable way to add insulation in my situation.
Blow in cellulose from the inside. Cellulose works. I was a foam and spray-on cellulose contractor from 1977-1985. If you stay in an older hotel in Las Vegas they have my foam insulation in their pipe chases.
My guy over here rubbing the insulation like Buddha’s belly 🤦
An unsealed house that lasted a century and 8 can see it lasting another?!? What a crazy idea! It’s great building a perfectly sealed home, like he usually promotes but one tiny defect that was not caught or one that develops on it own over time or one that has external force damage that no one thinks harmed the building envelope and you have a hidden problem. One that will reveal its self after it’s done extensive damage to property and possible occupants health. Let you homes breath and work with nature, not against it.
100% percent agree. I own a home built in 1910, no insualtion, mostly plaster walls, original poured foundaton with no cracks or leaks, original pine floors, and original wood windows (storms in the outside). The house will probably outlast me.
I think what you are referring to as "old school particle board" looks like what was called "beaver board." Don't know why the name, but when I was a builder in a small southern town years ago, it was still available at the local lumber yard. Also, insulation question aside, my concern in remodeling an old house like this is the inherent danger of the framing system in the first room. It is balloon framed by running long studs up from the foundation and hanging the floor (or floors) inside the studs, leaving perfect open fire chases in every stud bay. A fire in a basement or lower floor is free to move upward without obstruction. Blocking between the studs at the floor and ceiling level would solve that issue. The second room is platform framed, with a sole plate on top the floor. There are to openings between floor, so a fire is more contained. Just sayin'
its not molding because the particle board lets air through.
Here in germany we build houses with the airtight layer (plaster or a foil) on the inside so the warm moist air from inside cant travell though the insulation and condensate on the outside of it.
No water in the wrong place no mold.
Draftsman for civil engeneering and construction foreman ..... not just a keybord warrior
I'm not a pro, but I'm having a tough time wrapping my head around particle-board in the 1920's... seems off to me. But the content of this video is spot-on. I wonder - is there a way to vent a wall cavity like you would a roof or cathedral ceiling? Maybe then you could get some insulation in there behind a double wall or something?
Everything was balloon framed back then and vented through the attic. They are going to mess up if they put fire blocking as required by code. Its always best to apply the same building techniques used because they were constructed with full knowledge of that system at the time.
@@danbiss87 thanks...so I shouldn't put 1x4's between framing?... To slow fire spread? 🤔 and HOW can I insulate from inside? Can I use fiberglass and poly then drywall? I need heat without destroying 150 yr farmhouse. 😄
At time of about 0:40, are you familiar with buffalo board? From the video it looks like buffalo board.
Vapor management is extremely climate-specific, and masonry behaves very differently from wood (Matt Risinger knows all this).
GreenBuildingAdvisor and Building Science Corp have excellent article on vapor management. I'm building in climate zone 7 (cold, high desert) and found mold and frost on the inside of my OSB sheathing after just one winter with open-faced rockwool insulation and no drywall. In this climate, vapor is driving from the inside out and condenses on the cold sheathing. There's almost never vapor driving from the outside in because it's rarely cooler inside than out, and when it is, it's hot and DRY outside.
Put some woodfibre and lime render on the inside. Vapour-open construction, which should let it continue to dry the way it has been. Or cellulose fill behind mesh in the bays and woodfibre across the front to render onto. 'No insulation, burn more energy' is a terrible idea. If it really is unfixable then it just has to be knocked down and a useful building put up, but I'm pretty sure that's not the case there.
It's obvious that this part with the particle board is a later addition or something.
Why not use loose sheep's wool to increase hygroscopic buffering?
My house is built in 1880. . It is 2 story full basement, brick exterior. It is balloon frame. How they built this is brick 1 inch space , 2x4 stud, 1x6 t&g , plaster interior. No insulation. It’s 2400 sq ft living. Basement is unfinished at the moment but I still heat it.so I have 3600 sq ft to heat . I have a 1996 gas furnace, electric water heater. I live in northern Indiana My electric and gas bill never got above $300. Temp is set at 72 all year round. No drafts in the house.
Last year power went off for 36 hours when the temperature outside was -5 f and windy. (Snow storm) it 18 hours for the temperature inside to drop to 54f .
During my building diploma. Insulation was best explained as: with respect to the delta T, moving the dew point into the middle of the insulation where there is no moisture to condense. Rockwool or glasswool combined with sarking the walls and roof works well in Australia. Minimal air movement in the insulation.
@@toddthreess9624 Sarking is common building term in Australia and New Zealand for reflective foil laminate used as a radiant barrier under roof tiles and roof metal. The product is also use on the timber or metal frame in brick veneer construction. We get some hot days!
I'd insulate and vapor barrier the interior and it can breathe to the outside.
I had it even worse in MN where I had a 1924 church that had brick on the outside and ceramic block on the inside with plaster directly over it. I spent over $1000 one January to keep it at 60 degrees F. The only thing that made sense was to cover the building with insulation. This is something that they are doing in England now, but back then there wasn't much available. In the end I moved to Oregon and let someone else deal with it.
How about using cork board insulation? I've used it in my previous house in Belgium. It's natural and permeable, doesn't rot and insulates very well. Yes, it is more expensive but it might be worth using on this historic house.
That's a sensible European-style solution. Americans do very strange things with their cardboard homes.
Australia is even worse. Or was in the past. Yes, many homes in Australia were built like a 'cardboard box' where weather would be between -2 C in winter & 45 C in summer. Not fun.
He could use cellulose as well
Thank you for saying it! This has been the National Park Service’s stance through their Preservation Briefs; however, no one besides you and Brent are pushing this information to the public.
We consistently see that small issues in how modern building materials are implemented into historic structures have catastrophic long-term consequences.
May be a good place to use gypsum base with veneer plaster using stainless anchors.
This title scared me!!😱
Would Paperless drywall be a good choice? Have you used it? It'd be nice to see you talk to the manufacturers about this stuff.