Could you do a video on songs that use the double harmonic scale? I love this scale it's a lot of fun to play, but I don't hear it much except for some surf rock stuff I listen to.
Don't forget that John Williams worked from a temp track with classical music for Star Wars. George Lucas didn't trust John Williams, thinking he was "just" a jazz pianist, which he also is - and a brilliant one. I adore John Williams. BTW The "Scene D'Amour" by the great Bernard Herrmann, for Vertigo, is basically Wagner's Tristan And Isolde. No human being creates anything from scratch and film composers are always working on the edge of getting fired by the director.
Exactly, he was working within a context at a certain time for a particular purpose. People also forget that Williams has composed concert pieces outside of the strictures of film music.
@@DavidBennettPiano Yes these might be rumors only. I'm talking Berklee music teachers no less. BUT let's assume there was no temp track. The movie that hugely encouraged George Lucas to make his Sci Fi movie (or better: space adventure) was Stanley Kubrick's 2001. It features mostly classical music (I simplify the term for the sake of clarity), which were use in a temp track. Alex North's score was ditched as a last minute decision (again: perhaps rumors, but they persist). So John Williams was very likely composing as closely as possible to a "soundalike", so he can reference back to exiting pieces and be on the safe side. J.W. was recommended to Lucas by Steven Spielberg. As far as I can tell one has a harder time finding inspirations that turned into soundalikes in later John Williams scored movies. I am not arguing, just sharing my thoughts. John Williams gets a lot of criticism. I believe it's for the fact that he isn't edgy and experimental (except for some cool atonal parts, say in Close Encounters). Going for pure beauty makes you an easy target.
@@DavidBennettPiano Paul Hirsch, the editor of Star Wars, has stated clearly that they were using temp tracks. He's even done lectures on it. You can easily find RUclips videos of the editor of Star Wars himself stating this as fact.
As stated by others they used no temp track. But nevertheless: When you're composing for a movie you're giving the director what they want! If they ask for "Something in the vein of [insert another composer]", then they get exactly that. John Williams are often being scolded for borrowing from others, but that is how scoring a film works. Since he's a high-profile composer, who have borrowed from other high-profile composers, it's easy to blame him. But he works no differently than any other film composer.
It’s actually the Han and Leia love theme from Empire that bears the more striking resemblance to that Tchaikovsky violin concerto, rather than Leila’s theme. They all share that initial interval from the fifth to the third above, over the tonic major chord (along with Marion’s theme from Raider’s - Williams seems to associate it with romantic heroines), but the Han and Leia theme continues to closely resemble it even after that.
Han and Leia's theme (some versions of the theme more than others) is to my ears clearly inspired by 1) Leonard Bernstein's "Make Our Garden Grow" and 2) the opening of Henri Mancini's Days of Wine and Roses. Since Williams worked with Mancini, this isn't a stretch. ruclips.net/video/YPBIEBjwU44/видео.html
One of the greatest film composers of all time and composers draw inspiration all the time from given pieces and soundscapes. Lucas did want his film to have a classical feel and cited several examples of the sound of the composers you mention here for John to craft his music like. It’s all great and different enough overall to appreciate the music and time that went into it
Yes! Cheap shot and inacurate to alllege that Williams ripped off other composers. Whose work btw is not protected by copyright. So Williams actually could have lifted it entirely. Of course he did not. All artists are influenced by some other artists.
And it's interesting how complex the flow of inspiration gets when you also consider that Stravinsky, Dvorak, and Holst used themes/tune from folk traditions in their own music.
before any commenters get carried away, let's clear one thing up: Anyone who seriously tries to claim that John Williams plagiarized anything is simply demonstrating how little they understand the film music industry. 90% of time what actually happened is the Director specifically requested “hey, I was thinking this scene could kind of sound like this“ and so the composer basically has no choice but to write a new music that sounds similar enough to the pre-existing music to make the Director happy. Williams does this just as much as other composers do, he’s just more famous so the times he does it gets more attention. If there’s ever *actual* plagiarism, there’s legal action taken. Like when action was taken against Hans Zimmer for copying Holst’s Mars music in gladiator. or when action was taken against Tyler bates’ score for 300 for plagiarizing music from Titus.
His voice is NOT distinct. If you play classical music to people in public, 9/10 of them will say, "OH is that John Williams? blah blah blah." I've tested it with hundreds of different artists with the same result. He is a plagiarist, plain and simple, and the fact that he doesn't even partially credit the original artists makes him a scummy composer.
@@TalmoTheSell OH I thought I deleted this one because I came across as emotional. John Williams is a hack, but he does deserve a tiny bit of credit for his arrangement skills.
He also drew a lot from Shostakovich, Prokofiev, and obviously, Wagner to create leitmotifs for his film scores. Just like Mozart and Beethoven drawing from Haydn and Bach. My mentor once told me: "an average composer imitates; a great composer steals." Williams is a modern examplar of it.
I think autocorrect hit you there. It's stole, not Drew. He stole the works. He gives no credit at all, even in interviews, to the original artists. He is a scam composer.
@@gergoretvari6373 If that were the case, then yeah... but Williams didn't steal 5 notes. He stole entire 8 measure phrases. He stole entire compositions and rearranged them. He is not a composer, and nobody who knows the old greats considers him one. He is an arranger with an inflated ego, and since he doesn't credit those he plagiarized, he is a scummy person.
I think this approach is wrong, what Williams is doing is not being influenced but borrowing. The relationship between Beethoven and Mozart is not similar.
On the Jaws theme, John Williams credited “Man” from Disney’s Bambi as his inspiration. Man featured a three note motif that slowly increased tempo each time. It stuck with him since he first heard it as a child in the theater. He went back to it, changed the key, and dropped the third note to get his Jaws theme.
I find one that people always miss is the Luke and Leia theme with Leonard Bernstein's "Make Our Garden Grow" from "Candide." Being that Williams and Bernstein knew each other, I wouldn't be surprised Williams borrowed it from Bernstein.
Merci beaucoup. A Piano professor told me about a student that wanted to drive his neighbour nuts. So he practiced his scales and ended them all on the leading tone, never playing the tonic. He moved out in less than 2 months.
I, ve always thought the same. Nevertheless, his themes and soundtracks are so good and appropriate and definitely they are golden classics themselves.
I may be influenced by my love of the films he writes for, but when Williams “borrows” from these preceding compositions, I feel he actually makes them better. Or at least, more accessible.
@@kenvives nah if you look at it as a piece of music the classical pieces work better I think because they arent supposed to underline a certain movie scene but are made to express something single handedly and separated from any other sources In the end it's all subjective of course
Williams also incorporated some themes from Debussy’s La Mer in his Jaws score as I’ve read. George Lucas originally wanted to use The Planets suite for Star Wars, but couldn’t get the rights, so he asked John Williams to compose something similar to or in the vein of The Planets.
I don’t see this as giving John Williams a hard time. In fact, I think the fact that he was inspired by classical composers keeps classical music alive. He is one of my favorite examples when having the age old debate of is it “plagiarism” or is it “inspiration” with someone.
Well done! I had noticed some of these, but you've catalogued far more. So the difference between "borrowed from" and "violated copyright" is a matter of waiting 70 years after the composer has died. Thanks!
All of these examples are true and I've "felt" them for decades. However, there is still a "John Williams" sound that is original enough that his music is always recognizable as a John Williams score. Sabrina, Accidental Tourist, Jurassic Park, E.T. and of course Harry Potter are some of his best amongst the typical of the John Williams sound..... He was responsible for starting me at a young age with classical music composers so I have a warm place in my heart for great film music.
I think it's important to note that directors tend to give composers quite clear instructions on what they want for the soundtrack of their film. Since the soundtrack is created rather late into the production of a film, directors usually accompany the scenes they've shot so far with already existing music to simulate what watching the film might be like when it's finished. So whilst composers commonly look for inspiration in pre-existing music, it is in many cases also down to the director telling the composer that they'd really love something that sounds a lot like piece x in that one scene and something that sounds like piece y in another. They sometimes just get so used to watching a scene and listening to that piece that they feel having anything else as the soundtrack would be wrong. Great video btw^^
Really glad you brought up Tchaikovsky, I think there are even more examples (ex. both the Swan lake theme and Vader's theme end in an extremely similar fashion, virtually the same notes). Once again, excellent video.
Similarities can indeed be unconscious. I was reminded of this yesterday when, several hours after writing a song, I realized it was reeeeeeally similar to the opening song of Disney's animated _Cinderella._ Just add an extra measure before the end of each line and you get the start of my melody and chord progression. Of course, it diverges soon after that, but I couldn't un-hear it, so I fiddled with the opening a bit to make it less noticeable 😂 it's also reminiscent of "In My Life" from Les Misérables, but only for that first ascending line.
That part at 2:58 is actually even more strongly heard at the start of the movie as the Star Destroyer flies overhead. That segment is basically the part from Holst but with the stings building and building as they go.
When i first heard Tchaikovsky's Swan lake, i immediately thought it was the Anakin vs. Obiwan theme. And i swear if you listen to Swan Lake's Turning Point, you can hear the Darth Vader theme!!
In the movie Minority Report, in the Spyders scene, J W has definitely borrowed from Bohuslav Martinu’s 6th Symphony around the middle of the second movement. Doesn’t last long but immediately recognisable.
Crazy as Ive listened to the SW soundtrack since I was a kid in late 70s, continuing on to this date AND once you mentioned the composer and part of the film I suddenly knew which piece you were going to match them to!! I cant believe I hadnt made these connections before!
I'm a huge fan of Williams, classical music and the act of composition. The Planets Suite by Holst holds a lot more cues to other Williams scores, including Harry Potter, A.I., Jurassic Park, E.T. and more.. Holst is a huge inspiration, no doubt. The Planets suite is full of underdeveloped themes and ideas. Not that it's a bad thing or anything, it just holds too much content for its own good. No wonder Holst hated the piece in his later years. The whole world completely ignored his other music because of it.
Another Holst inspiration is the opening to Venus and the opening of the force theme. The shape and feel is very similar and I’ve heard the similarity for a long time
I always most closely associated mars with the first scene in the first movie, where the star destroyer is chasing down tantive iv. Love the other examples you give, never realized neptune was so similar too
The Creature from the Black Lagoon had a big influence on Spielberg's Jaws and there's a lot in the music too that John Williams seems to have got inspiration from, the underwater scene where the creature first appears is the theme right there.
You should’ve also featured sugar plum fairy and the motif he used in home alone that resembles it. Also from the nutcracker, but I think it specifically, is one of the most obvious examples of “borrowing” and influence of all his works.
Most film scores of John Williams are based on classical music. Some of them are also based on already existing themes of classical music (the correct title of this video).
Additional comment re John Williams compositions. One of my favorite Williams scores is EMPIRE OF THE SUN. Especially the choral music that is part of that score. Could you give some background on that, please? 😊
I’ve seen several videos like this, but I’ve never seen anyone else comment on the fact that the Ark theme from Raiders is almost directly lifted from Holst’s Saturn.
I'm commenting on this video in a first second. I just want to say that this type of content has been done many many many times before, and even some videos have been taken down since I saw the first one. I hope this video shows me something new. Sorry if I sound like an a%%hole.... I won't deleted my comment, I'll just edit it once I've finished the video. Edit: Yep, just finished the video. Nothing new here. A few points out of about 20 I'd like to make: 0:49 - The prominent high strings are a big part of Williams' piece, and the moving notes underneath are just a "mysterious" ostinato. 2:00 - William’s piece is in 3/4 , a completely different feel to a 2/4 (try dancing a waltz to a polka in 2/4). 3:57 - "A clear influence here" - I thought you were going to say Ravel! I didn't think you were going to say Tchaikovsky because that is your next clip. So, on Tchaik at 4:38 - Williams uses just the 'relaxed' 6th interval.... and that's about it. You can also here this beautiful 6th leap in such a piece as Brahms Hungarian Dance No.4 to "settle" the hectic vivace section of music that comes before a molto rit. leading back into a moderato opening theme. 6:37 - Yes it sounds similar- mainly because of the instrumentation and tempo - but when looking at it properly, each instrument is doing something quite different. It just gives the same feel. 7:24 - Jaws vs. Dvorak - Dvorak’s actually sounds like he was taking inspiration from Beethoven’s 5th! Of course we can’t be blind/deaf to that semitone. William's builds up that particular semitone *a lot* more..... so beyond the first three Dvorak bars, it actually turns into some sort of Shostakovian piece rather than Dvorak! 7:49 - Lastly, "The King’s Row". I don't have much to pick on with this one because it does have many things in common with the Star Wars fanfare. However I've seen this "exposed" about 5 or 6 or 7 times before, so it's "old hat" now. Anyway. Not a bad vid, and I'd be happy to link this video to my students.
David, I’m an amateur musician, singer/songwriter and producer of my own music. I’m fascinated by your videos comparing various pieces that are borrowed from earlier pieces. What Id love to see would be an interview with John Williams discussing his influences from earlier composers. I think he would be honest in such a discussion. I’ve “stolen” from Dvorak in composing my best song. As Isaac Newton said, in effect, we stand on the shoulders of giants when composing. After all there are only 12 notes in an octave.
At least concerning Star Wars, Lucas himself said during editing that he used temp tracks of various classical pieces before Williams began scoring, so it's likely Williams drew from those sources to keep a similar vibe and match the editing cuts. Love your content, by the way
There’s another “inspiration” moment that I think gets overlooked. It’s the second movement of the Neilson violin concerto which inspired a moment in Jurassic Park. The melody, chords, and orchestration are almost identical.
And this is all music always, intended or not. I think in cases like with John Williams it's that he's such a renowned composer borrowing from other very renowned composers it's so easy to cross check. But if you found the inspirations I think a video like this could be made for every composer. Great video, thanks
David, I'd like to see you do a similar comparison using Howard Shore's brilliant Lord of the Rings score. I'm curious what, if anything, was inspired by other sources.
@@thegoodgeneral lol! What the hell are you talking about? Who said David's video was original or not? Also, I don't think you've been on the internet since 1994. I have.
@@frankfrank7921 my point is if you want you see his take on Shore’s LotR, all you need to do is search on the Internet and see anyone writing on the subject and you’re going to find everything you will hear in David’s video on the subject.
I am passing on a bit of hearsay: Long ago a music teacher told me JW has a huge library of "conductor scores" of all kinds of classical music and basically copied entire sections into his own work. This is not at all an indictment of his work, but an insight into how/why he's so prolific. To hear it this clearly feels like it lends creedence to my teacher's story.
John Williams is a perfect example of why the Blurred Lines plagiarism case set a dangerous and unjustified precedent. I would say many of his scores have gotten way closer to plagiarism than Blurred Lines. Imagine he was sued by all of these estates based on that case.
We all know 'Star Wars' to be an all-time movie classic, but some have suggested that at the time of production it was looked upon as just another space opera? Was Williams aware this film was going to be immortal at the time he composed it?
Always loved this topic! The third movement of Dvorak’s 9th makes me think Star Wars as well… maybe it gives me Dual of the Fates vibes?… can’t put my finger on it
When I worked at a hi-fi stereo shop around 1980 I loved playing the King's Row opening (which even had the Fox fanfare on it) for customers. They always thought it was The Empire Strikes Back.
Can't believe we went through all of these but didn't get the Superman theme! Hugely inspired by Fanfare for the Common Man by Copland Thanks to Williams, the Planets by Holst is one of my favorite things to listen to now!
They all do it. John Ottman did a big Respighi borrow for Superman Returns. I recall Previn's soundtrack for Rollerball being nearly straight Shostakovich.
10 месяцев назад+1
What's the piece played over the closing credits? It's so good.
As a songwriter, I learned a long time ago that it's virtually impossible to create anything 100% original. It was actually very liberating to realize that. The context from which I am speaking is the 3 minute pop/rock song. Now if you consider writing two hours of soundtrack music then there's going to be a massive amount of "borrowing", consciously or not. It shouldn't, but I wonder if that takes the luster off of people like John Williams in the eyes of some?
It doesn't in my opinion. He's a musical genius and the only composer currently that comes even remotely close is Hans Zimmer Guys like Williams don't come around often.
So interesting David, thank you. It also seems in most of the examples that John Williams even wrote his pieces in exactly the same key as the 'inspiration' pieces! I thought he might have been tempted to change keys just to make the similarities slightly less in your face. Still a genius, as you say!
What about the most significant Williams composition? It's that music that plays when Gilligan steps on the Skipper's head while getting into the top hammock. Yep, John Williams wrote that.
He was definitely heavily influenced by the Romantic era. One of my favorite examples, which has only recently occurred to me, is the track "Sean by Agatha" from 'Minority Report': I don't recall which symphony or movement, but it's very similar to Mahler. And the point that he's not the only composer influenced by those before him is very true: I also have noticed there are points in Hans Zimmer's score to 'Gladiator' that are almost literally Wagnerian.
Williams is not the only one. For instance, almost all western soundtracks before Morricone are based on Dvorak's 9th symphony. Stravinsky is also mimicked in countless Sci Fi soundtracks, including the ones John Williams wrote for the Irwin Allen's TV series
Most of Howard Hanson’s Symphony No. 2 sounds like the “Jaws” score. Not to mention Dvorak’s “New World Symphony” 4th movement. And even more by Maurice Ravel’s La Valse. Also part 3 of Debussy’s La Mer (the sea).
7:18 I’ve been saying that ever since the beginning of freshman year of high school when my strings class learned it, and it’s my example of a song associated with a minor 2nd.
Great video. In my mind, the most obvious example is ET - the famous Moonlight Bike Ride theme is lifted directly from the cello solo at the end of the last movement of Dvorak’s Dumky Trio, just modulated to D major but otherwise not changed at all.
John Williams I feel is a pioneer in film score composing. He gave each of his iconic pieces it's own identity and it perfectly fits with the vibe and feel of the movie. The Harry Potter score feels whimsical and magical. It's fluttery and airy with all the clarinets and horns. Indianna Jones has a sense of motion and movement which adds to the adventurous feel. The main Star Wars theme is loud and bombastic and grand representing the vastness of space and the inhabitants of it. ET has that sense of childlike wonder, Superman feels bold and brash and heroic. He told full stories and painted full pictures with his film scores. A whole world in a piece of music. He's a genius. Those pieces of music could be played anywhere in the world by any orchestra and you will instantly know it and where it is from and the vibe it is evoking.
The saying is that mediocre composers quote other works, but master composers will outright steal! Williams is truly a master! (I attempt the stealing idea in my own compositions, in hopes of creating the illusion of also being a master.)
I think the Leia's theme comparison is a little bit of a long shot. Sure it's the same key and the same interval to start off but the rest of it for me is sufficiently different enough for it to be nicked. But yes I agree with these on the whole. He's very good at finding inspiration and adapting it beautifully to fit what he's writing for.
There is another one: The beginning of Leia's theme is nearly exactly, far more than from Tchaikovsky, the second theme of the second movement of Richard Wagner's Piano Sonata in B-flat.
Not John Williams. But in the category of "Composers associated with Spielberg", I'm utterly convinced that Dave Grusin's "Fratelli Chase" (aka the Goonies' theme music) was very strongly inspired by Beethoven's Waldstein I
I'm glad you added Korngold & King's Row. In the interview he did with Leonard Maltin for the VHS box set, he did mention how much Korngold influenced his musical style in general.
Thanks for the video. You have to be mindful of the role that the "temp track" plays in film music. That is pre-existing music laid down by the editor and director BEFORE an original score is produced. Often times, the incoming composer will be under pressure to mimic the temp score simply because the director has fallen in love with it. This has been a common situation throughout the entire history of film music. It was particularly the case with the first Star Wars film. TBH, I think some of your other Williams examples here are a wee bit of a stretch. Nevertheless, a pleasant video. Thanks again.
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Congratulations on being sponsored by Apple, man! That's a great leap forward for your channel :)
No thank you.
Why would you promote a FAANG company trying to take control of classical music?
You created this (unoriginal) video for the sole purpose of promoting Apple Music Classical didn't you
@@Nilmand so? This is a great video and he deserves money for the high quality content he puts out
Could you do a video on songs that use the double harmonic scale? I love this scale it's a lot of fun to play, but I don't hear it much except for some surf rock stuff I listen to.
1:35 Stravinsky sustains a D Minor and creates a masterpiece
I sustain a D Minor and have to repeat the school year
😂
D minor for a year? Gosh, that’s really sad 😊
Don't forget that John Williams worked from a temp track with classical music for Star Wars. George Lucas didn't trust John Williams, thinking he was "just" a jazz pianist, which he also is - and a brilliant one. I adore John Williams. BTW The "Scene D'Amour" by the great Bernard Herrmann, for Vertigo, is basically Wagner's Tristan And Isolde. No human being creates anything from scratch and film composers are always working on the edge of getting fired by the director.
Exactly, he was working within a context at a certain time for a particular purpose. People also forget that Williams has composed concert pieces outside of the strictures of film music.
I have heard some sources mention a temp track, but George Lucas claimed that he never used a temp track for Star Wars.
@@DavidBennettPiano Yes these might be rumors only. I'm talking Berklee music teachers no less. BUT let's assume there was no temp track. The movie that hugely encouraged George Lucas to make his Sci Fi movie (or better: space adventure) was Stanley Kubrick's 2001. It features mostly classical music (I simplify the term for the sake of clarity), which were use in a temp track. Alex North's score was ditched as a last minute decision (again: perhaps rumors, but they persist). So John Williams was very likely composing as closely as possible to a "soundalike", so he can reference back to exiting pieces and be on the safe side. J.W. was recommended to Lucas by Steven Spielberg. As far as I can tell one has a harder time finding inspirations that turned into soundalikes in later John Williams scored movies. I am not arguing, just sharing my thoughts. John Williams gets a lot of criticism. I believe it's for the fact that he isn't edgy and experimental (except for some cool atonal parts, say in Close Encounters). Going for pure beauty makes you an easy target.
@@DavidBennettPiano Paul Hirsch, the editor of Star Wars, has stated clearly that they were using temp tracks. He's even done lectures on it. You can easily find RUclips videos of the editor of Star Wars himself stating this as fact.
As stated by others they used no temp track. But nevertheless: When you're composing for a movie you're giving the director what they want! If they ask for "Something in the vein of [insert another composer]", then they get exactly that. John Williams are often being scolded for borrowing from others, but that is how scoring a film works. Since he's a high-profile composer, who have borrowed from other high-profile composers, it's easy to blame him. But he works no differently than any other film composer.
It’s actually the Han and Leia love theme from Empire that bears the more striking resemblance to that Tchaikovsky violin concerto, rather than Leila’s theme. They all share that initial interval from the fifth to the third above, over the tonic major chord (along with Marion’s theme from Raider’s - Williams seems to associate it with romantic heroines), but the Han and Leia theme continues to closely resemble it even after that.
I always thought he got that from Tchaikovsky's Romeo and Juliet.
Parts of the main SW theme resemble March Slave also
@@wtk6069 and how about Duel of the Fates resembling Beethoven 5th?
@@0live0wire0 Also, the "Imperial March (Darth Vader's Theme" borrowing from Chopin's "Funeral March" from his 2nd. Piano Sonata.
Han and Leia's theme (some versions of the theme more than others) is to my ears clearly inspired by 1) Leonard Bernstein's "Make Our Garden Grow" and 2) the opening of Henri Mancini's Days of Wine and Roses. Since Williams worked with Mancini, this isn't a stretch. ruclips.net/video/YPBIEBjwU44/видео.html
The Kings Row example is mind blowing.
The Holst Mars movement is in some ways more similar to the music accompanying the opening scene of Star Wars (1977).
One of the greatest film composers of all time and composers draw inspiration all the time from given pieces and soundscapes. Lucas did want his film to have a classical feel and cited several examples of the sound of the composers you mention here for John to craft his music like. It’s all great and different enough overall to appreciate the music and time that went into it
Yes! Cheap shot and inacurate to alllege that Williams ripped off other composers. Whose work btw is not protected by copyright. So Williams actually could have lifted it entirely. Of course he did not. All artists are influenced by some other artists.
It's one thing to draw inspiration, and another thing to copy the lines note for note. He's a scam artist. Stop defending theft.
And it's interesting how complex the flow of inspiration gets when you also consider that Stravinsky, Dvorak, and Holst used themes/tune from folk traditions in their own music.
before any commenters get carried away, let's clear one thing up: Anyone who seriously tries to claim that John Williams plagiarized anything is simply demonstrating how little they understand the film music industry. 90% of time what actually happened is the Director specifically requested “hey, I was thinking this scene could kind of sound like this“ and so the composer basically has no choice but to write a new music that sounds similar enough to the pre-existing music to make the Director happy. Williams does this just as much as other composers do, he’s just more famous so the times he does it gets more attention.
If there’s ever *actual* plagiarism, there’s legal action taken. Like when action was taken against Hans Zimmer for copying Holst’s Mars music in gladiator. or when action was taken against Tyler bates’ score for 300 for plagiarizing music from Titus.
I think it's pretty amazing how even pointing all of the similarities and inspirations, Williams' voice is still very distinct
I feel like that's proof that, no matter what you borrow from, your personal voice is going to come through in whatever it is you do.
His voice is NOT distinct. If you play classical music to people in public, 9/10 of them will say, "OH is that John Williams? blah blah blah." I've tested it with hundreds of different artists with the same result. He is a plagiarist, plain and simple, and the fact that he doesn't even partially credit the original artists makes him a scummy composer.
@@drakemallard1486 Who hurt you man
@@TalmoTheSell OH I thought I deleted this one because I came across as emotional. John Williams is a hack, but he does deserve a tiny bit of credit for his arrangement skills.
@@drakemallard1486 Ok, give me an example
He also drew a lot from Shostakovich, Prokofiev, and obviously, Wagner to create leitmotifs for his film scores. Just like Mozart and Beethoven drawing from Haydn and Bach. My mentor once told me: "an average composer imitates; a great composer steals." Williams is a modern examplar of it.
I think autocorrect hit you there. It's stole, not Drew. He stole the works. He gives no credit at all, even in interviews, to the original artists. He is a scam composer.
@@drakemallard1486 using 5 notes from a piece or a song and creating something different with it isn't exactly stealing
@@gergoretvari6373 If that were the case, then yeah... but Williams didn't steal 5 notes. He stole entire 8 measure phrases. He stole entire compositions and rearranged them. He is not a composer, and nobody who knows the old greats considers him one. He is an arranger with an inflated ego, and since he doesn't credit those he plagiarized, he is a scummy person.
I think this approach is wrong, what Williams is doing is not being influenced but borrowing. The relationship between Beethoven and Mozart is not similar.
Thanks for showing actual scores and highlighting notes being played - would studies like more like this
On the Jaws theme, John Williams credited “Man” from Disney’s Bambi as his inspiration. Man featured a three note motif that slowly increased tempo each time. It stuck with him since he first heard it as a child in the theater. He went back to it, changed the key, and dropped the third note to get his Jaws theme.
Thanks for this video. Fascinating and great to see the scores as well as listening to the similarities.
Excellent video! Thanks for the effort.
I find one that people always miss is the Luke and Leia theme with Leonard Bernstein's "Make Our Garden Grow" from "Candide." Being that Williams and Bernstein knew each other, I wouldn't be surprised Williams borrowed it from Bernstein.
Definitely doesn't seem like an accidental similarity. Love that operetta!
Merci beaucoup.
A Piano professor told me about a student that wanted to drive his neighbour nuts. So he practiced his scales and ended them all on the leading tone, never playing the tonic. He moved out in less than 2 months.
I, ve always thought the same. Nevertheless, his themes and soundtracks are so good and appropriate and definitely they are golden classics themselves.
I may be influenced by my love of the films he writes for, but when Williams “borrows” from these preceding compositions, I feel he actually makes them better. Or at least, more accessible.
@@kenvives nah if you look at it as a piece of music the classical pieces work better I think because they arent supposed to underline a certain movie scene but are made to express something single handedly and separated from any other sources
In the end it's all subjective of course
Williams also incorporated some themes from Debussy’s La Mer in his Jaws score as I’ve read. George Lucas originally wanted to use The Planets suite for Star Wars, but couldn’t get the rights, so he asked John Williams to compose something similar to or in the vein of The Planets.
Thank you for making this video! Goodness, you taught me a lot!
Thanks!
I don’t see this as giving John Williams a hard time. In fact, I think the fact that he was inspired by classical composers keeps classical music alive. He is one of my favorite examples when having the age old debate of is it “plagiarism” or is it “inspiration” with someone.
Well done! I had noticed some of these, but you've catalogued far more. So the difference between "borrowed from" and "violated copyright" is a matter of waiting 70 years after the composer has died. Thanks!
Strawinski died in 1971.
All of these examples are true and I've "felt" them for decades. However, there is still a "John Williams" sound that is original enough that his music is always recognizable as a John Williams score. Sabrina, Accidental Tourist, Jurassic Park, E.T. and of course Harry Potter are some of his best amongst the typical of the John Williams sound..... He was responsible for starting me at a young age with classical music composers so I have a warm place in my heart for great film music.
I think it's important to note that directors tend to give composers quite clear instructions on what they want for the soundtrack of their film.
Since the soundtrack is created rather late into the production of a film, directors usually accompany the scenes they've shot so far with already existing music to simulate what watching the film might be like when it's finished. So whilst composers commonly look for inspiration in pre-existing music, it is in many cases also down to the director telling the composer that they'd really love something that sounds a lot like piece x in that one scene and something that sounds like piece y in another. They sometimes just get so used to watching a scene and listening to that piece that they feel having anything else as the soundtrack would be wrong.
Great video btw^^
yeah, Lucas told WIlliams he wanted 30s orchestral style and different themes for each characters, like Prokofiev's Peter and the Wolf
Really glad you brought up Tchaikovsky, I think there are even more examples (ex. both the Swan lake theme and Vader's theme end in an extremely similar fashion, virtually the same notes). Once again, excellent video.
Similarities can indeed be unconscious. I was reminded of this yesterday when, several hours after writing a song, I realized it was reeeeeeally similar to the opening song of Disney's animated _Cinderella._ Just add an extra measure before the end of each line and you get the start of my melody and chord progression. Of course, it diverges soon after that, but I couldn't un-hear it, so I fiddled with the opening a bit to make it less noticeable 😂 it's also reminiscent of "In My Life" from Les Misérables, but only for that first ascending line.
That part at 2:58 is actually even more strongly heard at the start of the movie as the Star Destroyer flies overhead. That segment is basically the part from Holst but with the stings building and building as they go.
And 4:07 is even closer to "Han Solo and the Princess" from Episode 5 than it is to Leia's Theme.
I did a whole unit on this when I taught elementary school music! It was one of my favorites to teach!
3:20 Neptune
7:48 Korngold "Kings row"
When i first heard Tchaikovsky's Swan lake, i immediately thought it was the Anakin vs. Obiwan theme. And i swear if you listen to Swan Lake's Turning Point, you can hear the Darth Vader theme!!
In the movie Minority Report, in the Spyders scene, J W has definitely borrowed from Bohuslav Martinu’s 6th Symphony around the middle of the second movement. Doesn’t last long but immediately recognisable.
The Star Wars theme also sounds like Tchaikovsky's Romeo and Juliet. Nearly every film composer has used Holst as inspiration.
7:49 ok this is super mindblowing!
Crazy as Ive listened to the SW soundtrack since I was a kid in late 70s, continuing on to this date AND once you mentioned the composer and part of the film I suddenly knew which piece you were going to match them to!! I cant believe I hadnt made these connections before!
Jaws is also based on the Sacre du Printemps by Stravinsky earlier mentioned in this video
I'm a huge fan of Williams, classical music and the act of composition. The Planets Suite by Holst holds a lot more cues to other Williams scores, including Harry Potter, A.I., Jurassic Park, E.T. and more.. Holst is a huge inspiration, no doubt. The Planets suite is full of underdeveloped themes and ideas. Not that it's a bad thing or anything, it just holds too much content for its own good. No wonder Holst hated the piece in his later years. The whole world completely ignored his other music because of it.
Nothing NEW under the sun. No "ripping off" so much as EVERY artist has their influences, on account of nothing exists in a vacuum.
Awesome video as always, David! John Williams is one of the GOATs when it comes to film composers.
I'll take Bernard Hermann. YMMV.
Another Holst inspiration is the opening to Venus and the opening of the force theme. The shape and feel is very similar and I’ve heard the similarity for a long time
Yeah I feel like that one is overlooked a lot
Also Venus influenced Yoda's Theme. There are many similarities.
Dvorak's Symphonic Variations ----> E.T Theme
Chopin's Funeral March ---> Imperial March
"Overt inspiration." 😂😂😂
The more I learn about music, the more I contemplate where the copyright line is and should be.
I always most closely associated mars with the first scene in the first movie, where the star destroyer is chasing down tantive iv. Love the other examples you give, never realized neptune was so similar too
The Creature from the Black Lagoon had a big influence on Spielberg's Jaws and there's a lot in the music too that John Williams seems to have got inspiration from, the underwater scene where the creature first appears is the theme right there.
You should’ve also featured sugar plum fairy and the motif he used in home alone that resembles it. Also from the nutcracker, but I think it specifically, is one of the most obvious examples of “borrowing” and influence of all his works.
Most film scores of John Williams are based on classical music. Some of them are also based on already existing themes of classical music (the correct title of this video).
Additional comment re John Williams compositions. One of my favorite Williams scores is EMPIRE OF THE SUN. Especially the choral music that is part of that score. Could you give some background on that, please? 😊
First heard of the Planets on the soundtrack of the movie "The Right Stuff"
HAHAHA, you got me! I was like, “That’s the Rite of Spring”, they are very close!!
There's also Brahms' Piano Concerto No.2 and the Star Wars theme.
I’ve seen several videos like this, but I’ve never seen anyone else comment on the fact that the Ark theme from Raiders is almost directly lifted from Holst’s Saturn.
I'm commenting on this video in a first second. I just want to say that this type of content has been done many many many times before, and even some videos have been taken down since I saw the first one.
I hope this video shows me something new. Sorry if I sound like an a%%hole.... I won't deleted my comment, I'll just edit it once I've finished the video.
Edit: Yep, just finished the video. Nothing new here. A few points out of about 20 I'd like to make:
0:49 - The prominent high strings are a big part of Williams' piece, and the moving notes underneath are just a "mysterious" ostinato.
2:00 - William’s piece is in 3/4 , a completely different feel to a 2/4 (try dancing a waltz to a polka in 2/4).
3:57 - "A clear influence here" - I thought you were going to say Ravel! I didn't think you were going to say Tchaikovsky because that is your next clip.
So, on Tchaik at 4:38 - Williams uses just the 'relaxed' 6th interval.... and that's about it. You can also here this beautiful 6th leap in such a piece as Brahms Hungarian Dance No.4 to "settle" the hectic vivace section of music that comes before a molto rit. leading back into a moderato opening theme.
6:37 - Yes it sounds similar- mainly because of the instrumentation and tempo - but when looking at it properly, each instrument is doing something quite different. It just gives the same feel.
7:24 - Jaws vs. Dvorak - Dvorak’s actually sounds like he was taking inspiration from Beethoven’s 5th! Of course we can’t be blind/deaf to
that semitone. William's builds up that particular semitone *a lot* more..... so beyond the first three Dvorak bars, it actually turns into some sort of Shostakovian piece rather than Dvorak!
7:49 - Lastly, "The King’s Row". I don't have much to pick on with this one because it does have many things in common with the Star Wars fanfare. However I've seen this "exposed" about 5 or 6 or 7 times before, so it's "old hat" now.
Anyway. Not a bad vid, and I'd be happy to link this video to my students.
2:50 2:58
David, I’m an amateur musician, singer/songwriter and producer of my own music. I’m fascinated by your videos comparing various pieces that are borrowed from earlier pieces. What Id love to see would be an interview with John Williams discussing his influences from earlier composers. I think he would be honest in such a discussion. I’ve “stolen” from Dvorak in composing my best song. As Isaac Newton said, in effect, we stand on the shoulders of giants when composing. After all there are only 12 notes in an octave.
At least concerning Star Wars, Lucas himself said during editing that he used temp tracks of various classical pieces before Williams began scoring, so it's likely Williams drew from those sources to keep a similar vibe and match the editing cuts.
Love your content, by the way
7:49 8:02
There’s another “inspiration” moment that I think gets overlooked. It’s the second movement of the Neilson violin concerto which inspired a moment in Jurassic Park. The melody, chords, and orchestration are almost identical.
Also "Theme from Superman (Main Title)" (1978) ≈ Max Greger's "Fanfare March for the 20th Summer Olympics, Munich 1972." 👍
And this is all music always, intended or not. I think in cases like with John Williams it's that he's such a renowned composer borrowing from other very renowned composers it's so easy to cross check. But if you found the inspirations I think a video like this could be made for every composer. Great video, thanks
Ele simplesmente pegou uma pedra que já era preciosa e burilou.
0:20 David should have said HEAVILY inspired.
"HEAVILY inspired" -Charles the French
this video is BRILLIANT! I’m always in awe of such a great job with classical music videos like you!
David, I'd like to see you do a similar comparison using Howard Shore's brilliant Lord of the Rings score. I'm curious what, if anything, was inspired by other sources.
The ring theme was taken from Leonard Bernstein's "Glitter And Be Gay" from his opera Candide
lol you think there’s some originality to David’s video here? This stuff has been repeated by people on the Internet for like… 30 years.
@@thegoodgeneral lol! What the hell are you talking about? Who said David's video was original or not? Also, I don't think you've been on the internet since 1994. I have.
@@frankfrank7921 my point is if you want you see his take on Shore’s LotR, all you need to do is search on the Internet and see anyone writing on the subject and you’re going to find everything you will hear in David’s video on the subject.
This influence of Copeland on The Cowboys is pretty obvious, but that title theme is bizarrely original.
I am passing on a bit of hearsay: Long ago a music teacher told me JW has a huge library of "conductor scores" of all kinds of classical music and basically copied entire sections into his own work. This is not at all an indictment of his work, but an insight into how/why he's so prolific. To hear it this clearly feels like it lends creedence to my teacher's story.
John Williams is a perfect example of why the Blurred Lines plagiarism case set a dangerous and unjustified precedent. I would say many of his scores have gotten way closer to plagiarism than Blurred Lines. Imagine he was sued by all of these estates based on that case.
We all know 'Star Wars' to be an all-time movie classic, but some have suggested that at the time of production it was looked upon as just another space opera? Was Williams aware this film was going to be immortal at the time he composed it?
Always loved this topic! The third movement of Dvorak’s 9th makes me think Star Wars as well… maybe it gives me Dual of the Fates vibes?… can’t put my finger on it
It has a similar rhythm.
When I worked at a hi-fi stereo shop around 1980 I loved playing the King's Row opening (which even had the Fox fanfare on it) for customers. They always thought it was The Empire Strikes Back.
Love this! I knew a few but not all. Planning to share with my fellow music loving friends. Thanks!
Hi
There is another part of Leia,s theme that really sounds like the violin concerto…
Can't believe we went through all of these but didn't get the Superman theme! Hugely inspired by Fanfare for the Common Man by Copland
Thanks to Williams, the Planets by Holst is one of my favorite things to listen to now!
Not an original bone in Williams' body, in other words.
They all do it. John Ottman did a big Respighi borrow for Superman Returns. I recall Previn's soundtrack for Rollerball being nearly straight Shostakovich.
What's the piece played over the closing credits? It's so good.
Thank you! The outro music to this video is my track "The Longest March", available on Spotify and other streaming services 😊😊
Mate, can you do a video analysing where Randy Newman borrowed from Carl W. Stalling? That would be good.
If, as has been said, "Mediocre composers imitate, great composers steal", then John Williams ranks among the great composers.
As a songwriter, I learned a long time ago that it's virtually impossible to create anything 100% original. It was actually very liberating to realize that. The context from which I am speaking is the 3 minute pop/rock song. Now if you consider writing two hours of soundtrack music then there's going to be a massive amount of "borrowing", consciously or not. It shouldn't, but I wonder if that takes the luster off of people like John Williams in the eyes of some?
It doesn't in my opinion. He's a musical genius and the only composer currently that comes even remotely close is Hans Zimmer Guys like Williams don't come around often.
Great video, also Prokoviev, which you can hear very clearly in his music for Return of the Jedi-
So interesting David, thank you. It also seems in most of the examples that John Williams even wrote his pieces in exactly the same key as the 'inspiration' pieces! I thought he might have been tempted to change keys just to make the similarities slightly less in your face. Still a genius, as you say!
"Good composers borrow, Great ones steal" - Stravinsky
What about the most significant Williams composition? It's that music that plays when Gilligan steps on the Skipper's head while getting into the top hammock. Yep, John Williams wrote that.
Hey David - super interesting as usual 👍 Good composers borrow - great composers steal 😊
He was definitely heavily influenced by the Romantic era. One of my favorite examples, which has only recently occurred to me, is the track "Sean by Agatha" from 'Minority Report': I don't recall which symphony or movement, but it's very similar to Mahler. And the point that he's not the only composer influenced by those before him is very true: I also have noticed there are points in Hans Zimmer's score to 'Gladiator' that are almost literally Wagnerian.
Williams is not the only one. For instance, almost all western soundtracks before Morricone are based on Dvorak's 9th symphony. Stravinsky is also mimicked in countless Sci Fi soundtracks, including the ones John Williams wrote for the Irwin Allen's TV series
Very interesting. Could you consider some of Maurice Jarre's desert scenes music from LAWRENCE OF ARABIA? ❤
Most of Howard Hanson’s Symphony No. 2 sounds like the “Jaws” score. Not to mention Dvorak’s “New World Symphony” 4th movement. And even more by Maurice Ravel’s La Valse. Also part 3 of Debussy’s La Mer (the sea).
7:18 I’ve been saying that ever since the beginning of freshman year of high school when my strings class learned it, and it’s my example of a song associated with a minor 2nd.
Great video. In my mind, the most obvious example is ET - the famous Moonlight Bike Ride theme is lifted directly from the cello solo at the end of the last movement of Dvorak’s Dumky Trio, just modulated to D major but otherwise not changed at all.
John Williams I feel is a pioneer in film score composing. He gave each of his iconic pieces it's own identity and it perfectly fits with the vibe and feel of the movie. The Harry Potter score feels whimsical and magical. It's fluttery and airy with all the clarinets and horns. Indianna Jones has a sense of motion and movement which adds to the adventurous feel. The main Star Wars theme is loud and bombastic and grand representing the vastness of space and the inhabitants of it. ET has that sense of childlike wonder, Superman feels bold and brash and heroic. He told full stories and painted full pictures with his film scores. A whole world in a piece of music. He's a genius. Those pieces of music could be played anywhere in the world by any orchestra and you will instantly know it and where it is from and the vibe it is evoking.
He is in good company - Andrew Lloyd Webeer has snitched bits of Mendelssohn's (Andante) and Brahms' (Finale)Violin Concertos.
I've listened to these, what we have is a sever case of sour grapes.
Thank you for breaking this down. I’ve enjoyed many of John Williams’ soundtracks and now I will be able to enjoy them in the original!
The saying is that mediocre composers quote other works, but master composers will outright steal! Williams is truly a master! (I attempt the stealing idea in my own compositions, in hopes of creating the illusion of also being a master.)
I think the Leia's theme comparison is a little bit of a long shot. Sure it's the same key and the same interval to start off but the rest of it for me is sufficiently different enough for it to be nicked. But yes I agree with these on the whole. He's very good at finding inspiration and adapting it beautifully to fit what he's writing for.
There is another one: The beginning of Leia's theme is nearly exactly, far more than from Tchaikovsky, the second theme of the second movement of Richard Wagner's Piano Sonata in B-flat.
Not John Williams. But in the category of "Composers associated with Spielberg", I'm utterly convinced that Dave Grusin's "Fratelli Chase" (aka the Goonies' theme music) was very strongly inspired by Beethoven's Waldstein I
I'm glad you added Korngold & King's Row. In the interview he did with Leonard Maltin for the VHS box set, he did mention how much Korngold influenced his musical style in general.
When making Jaws, the film went over budget. To cut costs, Spielberg told Williams he could only afford to use two more notes in the main score.
Your videos are always amazing and lovely, but this one had that little extra❤
Thanks for the video. You have to be mindful of the role that the "temp track" plays in film music. That is pre-existing music laid down by the editor and director BEFORE an original score is produced. Often times, the incoming composer will be under pressure to mimic the temp score simply because the director has fallen in love with it. This has been a common situation throughout the entire history of film music. It was particularly the case with the first Star Wars film. TBH, I think some of your other Williams examples here are a wee bit of a stretch. Nevertheless, a pleasant video. Thanks again.
Does anyone know the name of the piece at the very end?