Curtis: wants people to listen to him and learn the game also Curtis : puts some of the most insane clips back to back causing the audience to watch them instead of listening
ngl. I wanna learn how to play Irelia now. I dont think I'll ever get to that level, but if I can get good enough to make just 1 of those plays, like once a month or something when the planets align and the stars twinkle brightest, Ill be satisfied. That looks completely fucking disgusting.
@@somebodyintheworld5036me for years with irelia lmao. I’ve always liked her design but I could never find my groove with her. Maybe I should try her mid instead of too since I’m more comfortable mid anyway
Pekin Woof is indeed an insane player - the climb he did last season to challenger playing random off-meta picks in mid lane was such a wild ride to witness.
So glad part of the community notices him, the level of awereness he has to where ppl are on the map and where they re headed to is insane. Lets him land some insane skillshots
Agreed! And I love how pekin's "climb with any champ" mentality on that climb perfectly dovetails with coach Curtis in this vid, too. He might have been playing different Champs from video to video but Pekin would explain how mastery of that specific champ could/would overcome any drawbacks it had that kept it from bring in the meta.
Something similar for jungle, Santorin is doing an account where he plays EVERY champion that can feasibly jungle ONCE. Currently he's through 54 champions - including some very offmeta picks that are just able to complete a jungle clear like aatrox, shen, ornn, teemo, yone. He's made it up to 250LP EUW masters with almost 70% WR so far. I assume he will eventually start repeating picks but it's really impressive so far.
LOVED seeing the Quantum and PekinWoof shout-outs. Quantum has been playing since I think 2009, since before there were even seasons. He's my favorite streamer, and I've been studying his Diana so closely recently. It's not fair to compare yourself to those folks, people. You can learn from them, but don't compare.
Coach mentioned PekinWoof, i can die happy. Pekin is such a good content creator, he puts out an educational video every day where he vocalizes his thoughts. Very insightful, very useful, very respectful as well (the number of times hes complimented an enemy or straight up admits he got outplayed or something); he's really good and calm. Doesn't rage, and also tells you the elo he's playing in. If he smurfs, you're gonna know it cause he'll tell you. He gives you insight into how much a challenger level player actually thinks about and is aware of. Even when i don't play league for long stretches of time, i still watch him because he's just so good. Would be interesting if you could get him on the BBC podcast, or at least take a look at his stuff. Very fun guy, my favorite keague streamer.
I think it's also the most fun way to learn league. It's almost like "bonding time" with your champion and learning all this cool tricks and combos is really fking exciting. Learning fundementals of laning or the game overall can sometimes be boring and there is no such a feeling like queueing all excited and motivated after watching a montage of your main ;;
I had this realization very early in my climb. I am a very big fan of strategy games and when I started league I approached it like chess with abilities. I didn't have much of a background in competitive games which made me lean towards easy champions to compensate for my lack of micro. But when I got serious about my climb and started watching people like you saying I need a champion pool I started learning Syndra and literally every time I lost to someone in the lane I watched high-elo players playing against that champion until I got to a point where I was winning 9 out of 10 times in lane. I went from silver to plat in like 5 weeks right before the season ended (it was season 7 I think) and even made it to diamond in mid-season.
literally the story of how i started, my first champ was garen until i got stomped by a sett, i started playing sett then realised i dont have enough mobility, then moved towards midlane playing ahri where i got stomped by a zed and i became a zed main since then, i struggle with good yasuo players and good talon players but that didnt make me quit, i started following the best zed plays and zed players and i just played every game as is, even if the enemy mid counter picks me or kills me in lane, i compensate with better farming, better macro, better positioning and i end up winning the hard games
Something I say to myself when I'm counterpicked: 'You picked scissors, they picked rock. Learn to cut rock.' And my main, for reference, is Riven - who is heavily, heavily matchup reliant. I've literally picked Riven into her worst matchup; Poppy. And I still won - it wasn't easy, and I did go under for a large portion of the game, but I managed to pull myself up to where I could threaten the rest of the enemy team.
i think trying to change the perception of Champion mastery is the wrong approach here. I think if you used the term champion literacy it would get across what you mean much easier. the way riot gives mastery is really just them saying you're familiar on that champion, so rather than trying to fight the wave against them, adding a term would be best. a yorick main who has 1 million mastery points but doesn't know that his W can stop teleports would be a yorick main with high mastery (familiarity) but with low literacy (knowing what my champion can do in any given situation). then you can use this term for the opposite too. a person who knows that urgot w cycling is a thing but has only played urgot once has a higher literacy with urgot than they do familiarity/mastery.
I wish every day that Riot would let me hide my Mastery score, not just from others but from myself. It's deeply shameful how little I have to show for such an absurd number while everyone else I know just casually picks up champs they barely play and carry games with them. When I hit 1 million Mastery and Plat 4 in my second year of playing League, I couldn't have been happier. I've accrued another 500K in the three years since that day, and still struggle to reach my old peak. I'm not even embarrassed when other people see the number. I'm embarrassed when I'm the one who sees it.
my highest mastery is about 300-400k on ekko and in relativity to some of the obscene numbers i’ve seen it’s not that much, but i’m still embarrassed by it and wish i had more to show for it. i’ve decided to stop playing him for the near future in order to break my narratives and start fresh with a new champion and hopefully come back to him once i have a deeper and more refined understanding of the game.
You dont need to stop playing the champ. just find someone else to watch and genuinely take in what they are doing, vs what you are doing. I have some content creators that I watch for my otp, and it has genuinely helped a ton. Its humbling and inspiring to see other people succeed in ways you didnt even know was possible on your champ@@eebbaa5560
I don't even understand how people can reach such absurd mastery numbers. I've played more league than I can stomach, yet my highest mastery champ was at 200k
@@eebbaa5560 I enjoy my champ too much to drop playing them. That, and I'm a true one trick. I can't do well with anyone else. I spent more games on trying to learn a new champ and their role than I did my main last year. I told myself it would improve my play. Instead, it reached the point where I tanked enough games that friends would actively avoid playing with me or just demand I go back to my one trick because they don't want to deal with the alternative. I'm so tired.
Low ELO players don't even know the difference between an easy and hard matchup. He's not talking about playing from behind he's talking about team comp. And team comp literally doesn't matter in low ELO. Not till gold at least and even then people don't understand comps till high ELO outside ad vs ap.
@@joshbrucks you don't need to know any fundamentals until atleast master where enemy who counter picks your champion actually knows how to do so. I first pick aphelios every game < diamond and only when i climb to GM is where i try to actually counter pick, or not pick him in terrible games
It really helped to hear Coach Curtis's comments near the end about looking at the game through your champion's lens. I don't think I make my macro decisions that way
Compared to fighting games league is so complicated because figuring out what the mistake is in the first place is so hard. I'm sure some games I've played I've picked the wrong champion (Taliyah into a comp where everyone outranges her), but I can't ever tell how much of that is cope vs how much is legitimate.
I think analyzing *individual* games is a harder skill to master than building up good intuitions over time, so I'd be reluctant to advise people who haven't put a lot of time into the game already to do it/rely on it. Thinking, after a loss, about what went wrong and what you could've done to avoid it is all well and good, but making decisions to implement that into your future games is too hasty. You need context, and that's why quantity is just as important as quality. For example, let's say that you play toplane, and you decide to rush level 2 first and all in your lane opponent at level 2. You go ahead and do that, and the enemy jungle vi ganks just in time to save your lane opponent and kill you, and from there your lane goes downhill. You decide your lack of ability to see VI coming was the main crux of the loss, so from that point on you decide to ward early against Vis if you want to play aggressive before your first recall. This is a faulty analysis if you have the *context* that Vi's first gank is usually after a full clear, rather than a 3 camp clear, so against a Vi that paths normally, your early ward will actually *expire* before her gank timing, and you're worse off. You can do a similar cost-benefit analysis with the Taliyah loss. It is true that Taliyah is generally unhappy with playing against people who can reliably do damage from outside of her range. But it is *also* true that comps where *everyone* is a champion that outranges Taliyah tend to be pretty bad comps (you can build a poke comp, but you don't do it by taking 5 pokers, you do it by taking 3; with 5 you're giga vulnerable to flanks for obvious reasons). So in that situation I'd entertain the idea that the game was lost moreso on mismanaging teamfights rather than the Taliyah pick; if anything, Taliyah is above average at flanking.
Hello! I come from an Overwatch 2 background and there is a stark similarity I’ve started noticing between OW and LoL. Since there is no economy in OW, characters get value in other ways; DPS of course wants damage, Supports value heals etc. However, each Character has a very specific objective in mind (maybe dps flanking w/ escape tools, or supports that can make opportunities). The very best example for league I found was Vex (burst, roam, anti assassin), and your video on her identity clicked. Alongside the addition of items, runes, and games not just being team-fight after team-fight (OW) the amount of expression is huge, allowing characters to somewhat change their champion identity or objective to better fit with your play style or the teams needs.
I like how you explained that champ mastery was the bed rock of league of legends skills, but I don't know if I relate to that as much. To me it seems more like a web of skills that all complement each other. For example, as a top laner, wave control is essential to champion mastery. Even if you're the best gangplank player and you can hit all your combos, that's useless if you all-in when the enemy jax is crashing 3 waves and kills you. On the other hand, if you play tryndamere top, you will easily out-climb a micro focused person if you understand how to use your wave to your advantage and how to effectively split push.
Ever since I heard the swain video was coming out me and my friend have been impatiently waiting..! Take your time, I know it'll be great, but know we're in ferocious anticipation!
i understand and believe all of this to be true; my current struggle is just in finding the champions that i truly want to dedicate myself to. like you said, i don’t have enough time to get good at every single champion that interests me, but i also want to be a competitive player. i’m trying to start over with a new champion (vex) to break my narratives and learn how to learn so to speak. after about 50-100 games, i plan on adding 1-2 other champions to my pool over the course of this split. there are so many cool champions in this game that the hardest part about accepting the truth of champion mastery is deciding which champions i really want to commit myself to.
I think performing/carrying games is a better term to use than winning games, since even as a hardstuck gold for years I won many games I shouldn't with champions I first timed in ranked, just because my teamates where straight up better
very good video. I struggled so much to pick a champ and stick to it and learn the game on a deeper level for years because I'd just get bored after 20+ games of the same champ. Then I finally found a champ and sticked to it and the results were astronomical. Also, I have FUN on the champ and I think it's very important.
The best swain videos I've ever seen are made by Husum. This guy helped me get from hardstuck silver 4 to emerald 2 in one month. Why?, Because he explains the mechanics of the champion and the mindset you need to have at every matchup, but also macro. He explains it so well through the lens of a swain player.
so that means I have reached beginner champion mastery after 2000+ azir games over 9 years enjoying life in iron 4 don't worry coach that was just a self-irony, I understand your points here, well said >_-
I love the analogy @ 5:55, I have always taught the end goal of the game was create beauty; only through complete mastery (being the ability to manipulate absolute) all aspects of the game, which includes every nuance, can you achieve this goal. Players often set bars far to low for themselves and only realize the goals they set.
great content as always curtis. im a 2m mastery points swain myself and I'd love to see your learning curve of the champion. Any posibilities for you to stream or upload longer whole game videos of this? Would be very interesting to see.
100% spot on about intentional practice. I have so little mastery points on ADC champs but because I’ve been intentional about my practice I feel better on them than mid (which I’ve played for at least twice as long)
Was not expecting to sit here and watch a 30 minute video and pay attention to the whole thing...but here i am 32 minutes later really thinking about who im gonna main this season having just come back from a 2-3 year hiatus from the game (Hecarim and Briar are for sure in that pool (largely due to the low mechanical demand) and IDK who/if I'm gonna pick as a 3rd champ)
Bro, i think you did this video just for me. I was thinking EXACTLY what you said the entire time for like 4-6 months. I have 2mi Cassiopeia mastery, but im stucked on D1 for 2y and i want reach GM, so i was trying to play with another champions. I will make this Cassiopeia reach GM bro, thanks
He didn’t exactly say he recommends to otp, in his podcast he mentions that playing the same champ for too long will eventually lead a player to losing his mind so it’s good to rotate champs in their pool to keep mental clarity
@@goobandz1663 what I retrieve for this video is to push a little more for my champ, review some plays I did... Literally I just played one match now and I played using 200% what my Cass can give and I win 8/0/9 with 18min 90% kill participation. Probably I was scared for so long to do some things in game that my Cass was an worm
Hey Curtis, former and when I am finally finished University future MLS member. Just a quick question about a point you brought up in the video , if champion mastery is the bedrock of the pyramid and comes before fundamentals and game concepts then is it still important to play a champion that is good for learning the fundamentals? For example, Annie is seen as a great champion for learning the fundamentals of the game, as you have previously stated when in lane you can either farm with Q or trade with Q unlike Yasuo that has to E through the minions to trade. However, if champion mastery supersedes fundamentals then does it matter which champion you pick as long as you develop champ mastery since you are seeing the game through the lens of the champion you decide to pick? Just wanted your opinion on this, thanks.
Not directed towards me, but yes, it does. Different champions require different levels of approaching the game; Different approaches makes your team take more or less advantage of it, depending on the "subjectivity" of your champion. For example, its easier for your silver teammates to take advantage of your flash + W + Ult as you're playing annie, but it takes a lot of time and knowledge to understand that your allied qiyana standing on a bush near a wall means DEATH independently of the enemy's HP (if you follow up).
Champion mastery comes before fundamentals because without mastery of your champ, you won't even have the muscle memory/mental stack to APPLY the fundamentals. Playing easier to execute/simpler champions definitely helps when learning the game because : A) It's easier to develop mastery on them B) The journey is smoother and more streamlined C) The execution OF the fundamentals with the champ is simpler
So I wanted to add my take to the painting analogy: A one trick might only have one color, but they can utilize all of the smallest shades of that color that there are to create a beautiful monochrome painting. Their paintbrush might not be of the highest quality or they might not even have one. What they do have is hands they can use to paint the canvas with their shades of a color, and hands is not something that most league players have. Great video on a topic I've often been confused with myself. Cheers!
As a rocket league player it is so easy to identify how your individual mechanics and mistakes are losing you games. In League of Legends, it's so easy to scapegoat that to others mistakes the champion you picked the mechanics, the items the ruins you took. But at the end of the day it's not a growing mindset to find excuses instead of looking at what you could have done better. Not necessarily what you did wrong but what you could have done better
I mean do you think the same thing applies to jungle where you can be great one trick but suck in jungle and great ardent support who dont know anything about the game? I mean yea you can easily hit master playing just eve or rengar if your good at them but for majority of different champs i wouldnt say so. Champion mastery is something really important on mid and top no doubt but other roles I think prefer learning fundamentals over anything else
Looked on the website and couldn't find anything, but does MLA have a lucian mid guide in there? would look into possibly signing up if so :) ty anyways, great vid
Different game, but I think it adds harmony. When I played Apex Legends I loved pistols and made an effort to do well with them in any game. When I was asked by friends why I don't pick stronger, meta weapons. I simply said, "Why would I want to pick a weapon that plays the game for me?" Now if I played with randoms that cussed me out, reported me for throwing, and then jumped off the map whenever I picked up a sidearm, I'd be harder to push the envelope.
would you say someone like tarzaned has fully mastered graves because i used to watch his videos all the time and i learned pretty fast id love to hear your thoughts
Falling in love with League now and I just wish I got here earlier. Like I genuinely regret that I missed out on the last few years I could've been playing League.
hey curtis i have a question about like cass and this topic, I'm trying to figure out how to play some hard matchups like syndra, viktor, lux etc and i usually try to watch otps play her and take conq and e most of the time, but im hearing other players like masters gm+ recommending me q max with aery, but I'm not sure what approach I'm supposed to do since I'm trying to have a more inspired playstyle from like quad in kr? what do you think since i know you play a lot of cass
I think your champ mastery can only ever be as good as the players you verse and their champion mastery. For example when I was P1/E4 playing tristana mid, I gained what I thought was champion mastery after 400 games lol. I "felt" able to play most of my match-ups really well, team fight well, position well etc. A specific example is, I thought I had mastered the tristana vs fizz match-up, I would play super aggressive and keep him under tower and bully him all game. I thought I finally had mastery of this match-up as it always played out this way in my games. However I climbed to E1 and all of a sudden I feel like I have no mastery in that match-up, they play way more aggressive, they trade better and they know their all in windows much better. They play in a way I haven't even seen and more specifically a way I haven't "felt". So now I have to re-master my champion to accommodate to my new elo range. Most of that is unlearning the poor habits I was previously doing that worked and don't anymore which is pretty difficult. This is why I am actually starting to think you might be better off cycling champions every few months as you climb. Otherwise you are constantly required to keep unlearning bad habits you picked up on your champions. The example of Nathan playing nocturne is a good example of this. It took him like 20 games to gain a shit load more mastery of the champion than someone who has played 100s in silver. What if you are silver, you play 300 games of Xin Zhao, and finally you get to gold, then you decide it's time to take what you've learnt and apply it to learning a new champion like Wukong, then you play him until you reach plat. This way you are not having to unlearn to poor habits you had from playing Xin vs silver players and instead get to build your Wukongs mastery starting in gold. Thats my thoughts anyway, great vid brotha.
i have been making a point to raise all my champs to a mastery lvl 5. I have noticed that in my first few lvl with a champ I tend not to do so hot but by time I am at lvl 5 I can clear lanes and get kills. I think my biggest issue when playing is dealing with teammates who get into bad fights. in the last game I played a Briar champ started a fight on the bottom lane. They got angry because me and my support didn't follow them. They were between the outer and inner turrets which I do not think is favorable because I have threats both behind and in front of me. I like to stay behind my minions and have a clear path to run in the case I need to retreat. i noticed a lot of players I team with seem to play too aggressively. In the beginning I want to focus on getting gold and exp so I can buy items yet my teammates want to get into fight I know I will die if I engage in them. I am learning that it is best to follow my gut when it comes to playing the game. I am learning it is best to assume that fellow champs are not going to have my back so I need to act as if I am on my own. If I can win the fight then I run.
I’ve always wanted to main Trundle top, but I feel like he has too low of a skill ceiling, so I’ll just get wrecked by more skill expressive champions. He was even nerfed recently, so I feel like I missed my chance. I guess my question is, Is it worth committing my time to an easy and inferior champion?
I had a game recently Using sejuani in Top lane againts MORD. I knew immediately it was going to be tough. He pretty much dominated me in the early game and i had to give up a good amount of CS. However he never killed ME! I had to play super submissive and wait for chance. Once we got to mid game i was able to farm up and eventually come back and won that game. I have come to learn that literally not dying can help in the later game. If you die more than three times in your lane you’re pretty much done for and have to rely on your other laners.
Even when you have mastered your champ there will be some games where your flow seems to have disappeared, remember to see the stats at the end of the game, I had 4 games in a row that were perfectly winnable and we blundered right at the end, it's easy to blame my teammates and I did that, but truth is that even though I did most of the objectives as jungler in those games, I still had almost less damage than the support. In the following game I decided that I had to be way more aggressive and that game I ended up carrying, so that's another thing to consider
You are so correct about league players being obsessed with BS. So many people making excuses about losers queue and never look within on what they couldve changed or what they coulsve improved.
Something overlooked is how champ mastery doesnt directly correlate with agency. All the montage examples are high agency 1v9 champs. If you have extreme champ mastery in Chogath, you wont have the same level of agency as other 1v9 champs. This is a major part of why people overlook champ mastery b/c they play easier champs to learn the game but you dont get the same rewards for champ mastery
Yes and no. I coach a master OTP chogath mid in my program and he has extremely high impact in games and often solo carries. Ofcourse some champs will have more impact then others, but you'd be suprised. There was a top 10 EUW annie OTP last season as well
7:55 yes i think exactly the same. A person NEEDS a lot of points so mastery is even possible (a lot of games played), but a lot of games played or milions of points probably mean they aren't very good at the champ and often prove that they haven't mastered the champ!
Curtis the kinda guy to explain a point super thoroughly and understandably then throw the worst analogy you've ever heard on top just to confuse people.
A small question : I have been playing for so long with Lux, she's my biggest main, and I get myself a lot of success in climbing rank with her throughout the year, and I reached emerald this early season with her with only 10 first games However, the more I play her, I feel like Lux is getting a little bit too "weak" - or I thought so, with the new changes to mage items this new season Then I played Malzahar - my 2nd most played main - won a lot, felt better when playing him and kept spamming him for free lp on rank rn My wr with Lux is 4-6 rn , and I feel a little bit off that I played exactly like what I used to play, but my result gets worse. Is my problem is that I still can not adapt with the new changes or is it that she really needs the next patch buff to shine again? For me at least
I think the main problem is that 10 games is not a sample size. Even if your true winrate on lux is, say, 60%, you still have a 25% probability given a 10 game sample size to lose 6 or more out of them. I'd be worried if your wr was something like, say, 20-30 instead, but I wouldn't draw any conclusions from 4-6.
i feel like i got some of this by default because of how i play the game. i quit league twice and only came back a third time to play lillia. since then shes been my otp and lately the games have been feeling oddly easy while playing her. not sure if its because im now at the experienced level or im just getting lucky with getting easy matchups, but im having so much fun with her
Usually it comes from being able to win every matchup (maxing different skill, playing wave differently, heavy trading early level or waiting) or knowing different item or runes that are more effective against team. Even tho it’s a pocket pick you can still get more out of it. Just won’t reward you as much as more flexible champs.
I don't have any experience with trying to master Malphite but here are two examples I can give with a champion that most people would consider simpler than Malphite (Garen). 1. Having a feel for *exactly* when your ult is lethal allows you to ult right at that point rather than piling more damage just to be safe, saving 1-2 seconds which can be crucial in a 2v2 or 3v3 skirmish as they allow you to help with a different target. 2. Having a feel for *exactly* how long it takes you to clear a wave allows you to decide when you can safely proxy and when you can't. It's not much (and it's okay for it to not be much, Garen really IS low skill ceiling relative to most) but it's enough that I definitely see high elo players who *don't* main Garen screw those two up when they play him.
I think it more like, first you need some fundamentals, like you can effectively cs and have some map awareness. Then you focus on champion mastery. It doesn't matter how well you can execute some crazy combos if you can't get decent cs without pressure and just auto gap yourself from your opponent. Once you have some instincts for your champ (e.g. I'm Viego. I am super strong in skirmishes mid game so I should force some), you go back to honing fundamentals and repeat.
Curtis has said he personally thinks champion mastery comes before fundamentals, both in previous podcasts and in this comment thread, and I tend to agree. In fact, you bring a great point that illustrates why: cs'ing. You need differently executed fundamentals to learn how to cs if your champ either has a hard time farming without overpushing the wave (rumble, volibear), differently executed fundamentals if your champion is inherently slow at pushing waves whether they want to or not (vayne, shen), differently executed fundamentals if your champion has to trade and push at the same time in particular ways (viktor, lissandra), etc. In fact, the reason why Annie is such a common coach recommendation is because of her versatility with cs'ing, which makes her fundamentals more widely transferrable. I think part of the misunderstanding here is what champion mastery even *is*. Because it's not just how reliably you can execute crazy combos. It's also things people sometimes consider "pure macro" or "pure decision making". For example, a Riven with high champion mastery will be able to pull of the Shy combo, sure, that is part of it, but she's also able to correctly judge whether to force-freeze by pulling minions through sacrificing health vs putting her E on cooldown, or correctly estimate how long it will take her to rotate from top to mid if she ability spams (and thus how much farm she expects to lose off the roam), or precisely determine when she has lethal on a target when it's not trivially obvious. You might see her flash on the 80% adc, do some fancy animation cancels, and one shot them, and assume that the decision to go in was good macro while the cleanness of the combo was good champion mastery, but in fact the decision to go in, knowing she had the lethal, is champion mastery too. In fact, you gave an example yourself of what Curtis would consider part of champion mastery. You know that, as Viego, you should force mid game skirmishes. That's not just your general proficiency at mid game macro, that's something you know *because* you understand Viego.
But is it an excuse if its true? Some champions just cant thrive in certain comps. Like ye, you can try to do X, Y, Z, but in the end counterpicks DO exist.
Yo Coach Curtis, I fell down the rabbit hole of exploring the game through all of the fundamentals. I literally know so much about the game not even diamonds know like not everything, but a lot even though I am still only bronze after 4-5 years. So i've decided on just playing my champion better instead of the game and it's working so much better. I used to think whilst reviewing pro vods. Alright, why did he roam, or why did he have this wave state. But I am so bad at the easy stuff, that when I asked myself "Alright, let's just see how he is using his W *on ekko*" I was bewildered. What! Why place it there and not there instead? Ohhh, it's because 'blah, blah, blah'. So now i'm actually seeing improvements and I am honestly scared how fast I can climb to masters (I am still bronze 3) now that I can have a foundation. It's like being the best and painting in the world, but only being able to paint in white on a white canvas (I love your painting analogies). So i've enrolled in your MLA program and it's just beautiful how much I can learn for my champion and it is so FUN learning the details about everything, I wish the best to you Coach Curtis!
Hey curtis great video, may i also ask do you have information on whats going on with LP gains this season? I have around 50 games with 55% winrate and somehow i am losing 30 and gaining 24 on plat4. How am i supposed to climb when i have negative gain with positive winrate? I also saw another guy who had 70% wr with 100 games and he was losing 30 and gaining 14 on emerald.
I can guarantee you if you improve to a Emerald 4 level and start stomping your still plat 4 elo games, you will be out of that elo in no time.@@tuh774
completely agree mechanics come first. In fighting games you have to be a master at your character that’s like playing a fps without trying to better your aim. if you miss all your shots, what’s the point in positioning well..
For laners yeah champ mastery is most important. For jungle there are so many important fundermentals that are universal that understanding these are actually more important than the champion you are playing. Once you've learnt them you can then look at champions you enjoy the most. But for lanes the fundermentals are basically controlling waves and vision in that one part of the map. Jungle have their camps, the opposing junglers camp, neutral objectives, lane states, jungle tracking, jungle cs teacking, jungle pathing, gank pathing and invading to learn before it makes any difference between champions.
This is probably gonna sound less inspirational and more purely pragmatic, but here is the reason why I personally choose to have a tiny champion pool and focus on champion mastery over champion diversity: In 50% of your games, you will be blind picking relative to your lane opponent. That's just how champ select works. And if you're in those situations, then the guy who is expert level on 1 champion is *strictly better off* than the guy who is intermediate level on 12 champions, because his ability to adapt literally *can't* be taken advantage of. Cheers. (also, there is another reason, but this I feel only applies to toplane: Due to its insular nature, toplane is the role that benefits the most from knowing your lane opponent, but benefits the least from knowing the rest of the enemy comp. As a consequence, if you request to be lower in pick order in champ select but the enemy toplaner picks after you anyway, which can definitely happen a lot on blue side, you hindered your team's adaptability for almost no gain. So having that *one* champion you are really confident on can really help on blue side drafts.)
In music it's well known that nothing is more harmful than practicing wrong. In melee and other fighting games there's the phenomenon of "endless friendlies", which is pretty similar in essence. Myself I've fallen many times into the trap of looking at all the ragers and sore losers and thinking "at least I have a better mindset than those guys", but then forgot to ask what I could have done better.
lots of people just don't understand the insanity that goes into truly mastering a champion. i genuinely thought i was coked at Vayne as a low gold player. now being low emerald, i'm BARELY experienced. i have just under 1300 ranked games on vayne since season 6, and i wasn't really improving much until last year. taking that step back, humbling myself, realizing i'm nowhere near as good as people as gosu, uzi, etc. sure i have muscle memory and i don't need to think about the champ anymore, i'm focusing more on the gameplay aspects rather than the champion at this point. its CRAZY to me that people who have like 50 games on a champ think they're absolutely insane with them, just to realize people like Irelking, arkadata, forest within, etc. have THOUSANDS of games and hours put into a specific champion and thinking they're on the same level
Irelia, Yasuo, Zed, Lee Sin, Riven, Akali...always the same champions with the "insane" plays, but only because their kits were build with added complexity that made them far more rewarding at higher skill levels of play (at least in soloQ). It's especially dumb how rewarding point and click abilities are. Makes me feel like my skillshots don't matter and I'm wasting my time playing something else.
Im otp ezreal with 2.5 milion matery points, i was hardstuck silver until i asked for coach and he said that my mecanical execution was realy good but my decision makin was so shit that it was holding me back, now im d3 adc enjoyer
Hello Coach, make a video about can league of legends and the real life being balanced together or not , sometimes I think it is not worth it because it makes us behind in real life
Any champion I have mained in the past will be back in (almost) peak form after 5-10 games at the most. It's like riding a bike, once you've done it you will never fully lose it ever again. I think most of these points mainly apply to newer players who haven't played for many years. Even if you've been high plat/low diamond for most of your time playing league, you will have mained so many different champions you no longer view the game as the champion you are playing at that moment. By the time you've mained more than 5 champions you should really drop the goggles and start looking at the actual game as it is. I also really feel like this applies less to my main role jungle, since it's not as much about the 1v1 and more about strategic concepts as a whole. Yes there are specific things you need to know, but knowing the exact 1v1 is not how jungle is played
B-b-b-but Choach Curtis. I am a Cho OTP and am GrandMasters, and can probably pick up any champ in average elo and perform as if I touched that champ before. I think game knowledge and experience facing and playing with that champ, takes higher priority than specific champion mastery. I did a jungle unranked challenger 3 years ago and had a 75% w/r on Evelyn to masters, and could prob do the same for many other champs all from game experience.
I'm the opposite. I can't understand why people would ever pick a different champion than one they're learning when there's an infinite amount of things to learn. I've been playing Qiyana for 4.5 years now and I went from Diamond to Grandmaster (about 40lp off Chall at peak) and still think I'm not even comparable to someone like Irelking or Beifeng. It's just not fun playing a champion for 20 games and barely knowing how to play it for me, there's nothing enjoyable about losing games when you're clueless or winning a freebie.
On the contrary I did get Master last split on my "off Qiyana" account as a meme to beat the allegations but it's REALLY hard conceptually for me to not just start one tricking a 2nd champion and actually keep my champion pool diverse.
Random comment here but hopefully it helps someone. I don't really play league any more but when I did, I was in bronze and got mad all the time and called everyone trash. Then one day a fellow bronze said to me your also trash your in bronze, the whole team laughed at me. Something about that struck a nerve. After that I accepted I was trash then climbed my way to Gold!!!! remember, your trash folks and you'll get better. Sounds dumb but when you have this epiphany you'll climb. It's like magic
If you wear a hat people won’t call you bald. But if you always wear a hat you’ll always be unconfident. If u don’t wear a hat you give people the chance to mock you. It can go well or poorly but you’re allowing change to happen. This is the same as wanting to get better at your main but over prioritize draft instead. You’re not guaranteed to get better every game (that you have mental clarity) but you also might. No progress happens when you’re mentally preoccupied, so allow yourself to get stomped and pay perfect attention. People suck at winning *all* of their “guaranteed” winning matchups. Allow individual games to be lost and play for a great loss. A great loss can turn into a win at many moments. That’s the most a league of legends player should ever expect. (Like i think that’s healthy and productive at least) Ramble ramble ramble :)
I haven't finished the vdeo but I just wanted to throw it out that I envy people like Irelking who can play 1000+ games with a champ they love. Because I only have one champion that I can play with pure muscle memory and after a while it just gets boring, Illaoi is fun and all, but I like learning new champs so It's hard to back to one I've "mastered". I suck at the game but with Illaoi I literally can't remember the last time I've lost lane, even when the game was stacked against me with a camping jungler or roaming supports and counter picks just because I've been in all of those situations and instinctively know what to do in all of them. Now I'm learning Sion and it's been very fun, I really like learning champs and just wish I could play one's I've "mastered" more since I know I'm about to get bored of Sion as well since I know feel comfortable fighting his absolute total counters like Riven and Fiora and am able to completely carry games by myself. I want to learn Twisted Fate but I am so bad at squishy champs it's unreal
I think you are rigth i am mad when i loose a game, but at least me watch the replay to see what can i do better, ofc not all the game, most likely a bad teamfighh or a losing lane
I got literally hypnotized by Irelia. Realized I wasn't even listening to what Curtis was saying haha
Aye yo same lmao. Let me re watch now lol.
Hurts even more cause I just started one tricking her lmao
IKR? Is that Chovy's Irelia?
LITERALLY came to the comments to write this lol
@@meganb.2249 think its irelking
Curtis: wants people to listen to him and learn the game
also Curtis : puts some of the most insane clips back to back causing the audience to watch them instead of listening
He did that on purpose so every single viewer will have to rewatch the entire stuff, multiplying his viewership by 2x. 190 IQ farming technique
i had 2 rewind a few times lol the plays were so clean
I recommend listening to it like a podcast
ngl. I wanna learn how to play Irelia now. I dont think I'll ever get to that level, but if I can get good enough to make just 1 of those plays, like once a month or something when the planets align and the stars twinkle brightest, Ill be satisfied. That looks completely fucking disgusting.
@@somebodyintheworld5036me for years with irelia lmao. I’ve always liked her design but I could never find my groove with her. Maybe I should try her mid instead of too since I’m more comfortable mid anyway
Pekin Woof is indeed an insane player - the climb he did last season to challenger playing random off-meta picks in mid lane was such a wild ride to witness.
100%, really impressive player
So glad part of the community notices him, the level of awereness he has to where ppl are on the map and where they re headed to is insane.
Lets him land some insane skillshots
Agreed! And I love how pekin's "climb with any champ" mentality on that climb perfectly dovetails with coach Curtis in this vid, too. He might have been playing different Champs from video to video but Pekin would explain how mastery of that specific champ could/would overcome any drawbacks it had that kept it from bring in the meta.
Something similar for jungle, Santorin is doing an account where he plays EVERY champion that can feasibly jungle ONCE. Currently he's through 54 champions - including some very offmeta picks that are just able to complete a jungle clear like aatrox, shen, ornn, teemo, yone. He's made it up to 250LP EUW masters with almost 70% WR so far. I assume he will eventually start repeating picks but it's really impressive so far.
Gosh you're such a good coach. You are the coach for most people who overthink and otherwise get really depressed by all the BS and anxiety.
Bob Ross of League
I cannot focus with that God tier gameplay in the background xD
IrelKing's gameplay truly makes me awestruck.
LOVED seeing the Quantum and PekinWoof shout-outs. Quantum has been playing since I think 2009, since before there were even seasons. He's my favorite streamer, and I've been studying his Diana so closely recently. It's not fair to compare yourself to those folks, people. You can learn from them, but don't compare.
talking about mastery and having Irelking gameplay in the back is very fitting.... hes the goat
Coach mentioned PekinWoof, i can die happy. Pekin is such a good content creator, he puts out an educational video every day where he vocalizes his thoughts. Very insightful, very useful, very respectful as well (the number of times hes complimented an enemy or straight up admits he got outplayed or something); he's really good and calm. Doesn't rage, and also tells you the elo he's playing in. If he smurfs, you're gonna know it cause he'll tell you. He gives you insight into how much a challenger level player actually thinks about and is aware of. Even when i don't play league for long stretches of time, i still watch him because he's just so good.
Would be interesting if you could get him on the BBC podcast, or at least take a look at his stuff. Very fun guy, my favorite keague streamer.
keague of kegends
I think it's also the most fun way to learn league. It's almost like "bonding time" with your champion and learning all this cool tricks and combos is really fking exciting. Learning fundementals of laning or the game overall can sometimes be boring and there is no such a feeling like queueing all excited and motivated after watching a montage of your main ;;
I had this realization very early in my climb. I am a very big fan of strategy games and when I started league I approached it like chess with abilities. I didn't have much of a background in competitive games which made me lean towards easy champions to compensate for my lack of micro. But when I got serious about my climb and started watching people like you saying I need a champion pool I started learning Syndra and literally every time I lost to someone in the lane I watched high-elo players playing against that champion until I got to a point where I was winning 9 out of 10 times in lane. I went from silver to plat in like 5 weeks right before the season ended (it was season 7 I think) and even made it to diamond in mid-season.
oh shit, that's actually an amazing idea, i got shit on by a yasuo these days because i didn't know wtf i was supposed to do against him,
literally the story of how i started, my first champ was garen until i got stomped by a sett, i started playing sett then realised i dont have enough mobility, then moved towards midlane playing ahri where i got stomped by a zed and i became a zed main since then, i struggle with good yasuo players and good talon players but that didnt make me quit, i started following the best zed plays and zed players and i just played every game as is, even if the enemy mid counter picks me or kills me in lane, i compensate with better farming, better macro, better positioning and i end up winning the hard games
Something I say to myself when I'm counterpicked:
'You picked scissors, they picked rock. Learn to cut rock.'
And my main, for reference, is Riven - who is heavily, heavily matchup reliant.
I've literally picked Riven into her worst matchup; Poppy. And I still won - it wasn't easy, and I did go under for a large portion of the game, but I managed to pull myself up to where I could threaten the rest of the enemy team.
Looking at those clips Irelking looks like the best fkin player in the world 😂😂
If not him then who else? At least mechanically.
@@JamesBaleLAme mate, mysteriaslol 😎 my udyr mid is unmatched
@@CoachMysterias AINTNOHWEI
@@JamesBaleLA Pzzzang
@@JamesBaleLA beifeng
i think trying to change the perception of Champion mastery is the wrong approach here. I think if you used the term champion literacy it would get across what you mean much easier. the way riot gives mastery is really just them saying you're familiar on that champion, so rather than trying to fight the wave against them, adding a term would be best.
a yorick main who has 1 million mastery points but doesn't know that his W can stop teleports would be a yorick main with high mastery (familiarity) but with low literacy (knowing what my champion can do in any given situation). then you can use this term for the opposite too. a person who knows that urgot w cycling is a thing but has only played urgot once has a higher literacy with urgot than they do familiarity/mastery.
I agree, using different terminology would actually help. Good point!
I wish every day that Riot would let me hide my Mastery score, not just from others but from myself. It's deeply shameful how little I have to show for such an absurd number while everyone else I know just casually picks up champs they barely play and carry games with them. When I hit 1 million Mastery and Plat 4 in my second year of playing League, I couldn't have been happier. I've accrued another 500K in the three years since that day, and still struggle to reach my old peak. I'm not even embarrassed when other people see the number. I'm embarrassed when I'm the one who sees it.
my highest mastery is about 300-400k on ekko and in relativity to some of the obscene numbers i’ve seen it’s not that much, but i’m still embarrassed by it and wish i had more to show for it. i’ve decided to stop playing him for the near future in order to break my narratives and start fresh with a new champion and hopefully come back to him once i have a deeper and more refined understanding of the game.
You dont need to stop playing the champ. just find someone else to watch and genuinely take in what they are doing, vs what you are doing. I have some content creators that I watch for my otp, and it has genuinely helped a ton. Its humbling and inspiring to see other people succeed in ways you didnt even know was possible on your champ@@eebbaa5560
I don't even understand how people can reach such absurd mastery numbers. I've played more league than I can stomach, yet my highest mastery champ was at 200k
@@eebbaa5560 I enjoy my champ too much to drop playing them. That, and I'm a true one trick. I can't do well with anyone else. I spent more games on trying to learn a new champ and their role than I did my main last year. I told myself it would improve my play. Instead, it reached the point where I tanked enough games that friends would actively avoid playing with me or just demand I go back to my one trick because they don't want to deal with the alternative. I'm so tired.
Could be worse there are plenty of people with 4-5 million MP stuck in silver
Totally relate to the 'hard games', especially throughout the actual game, it's insane to win after teammates claim 'unwinnable' in low elo games
Low ELO players don't even know the difference between an easy and hard matchup. He's not talking about playing from behind he's talking about team comp. And team comp literally doesn't matter in low ELO. Not till gold at least and even then people don't understand comps till high ELO outside ad vs ap.
@@joshbrucks you don't need to know any fundamentals until atleast master where enemy who counter picks your champion actually knows how to do so. I first pick aphelios every game < diamond and only when i climb to GM is where i try to actually counter pick, or not pick him in terrible games
It really helped to hear Coach Curtis's comments near the end about looking at the game through your champion's lens. I don't think I make my macro decisions that way
Compared to fighting games league is so complicated because figuring out what the mistake is in the first place is so hard. I'm sure some games I've played I've picked the wrong champion (Taliyah into a comp where everyone outranges her), but I can't ever tell how much of that is cope vs how much is legitimate.
I think analyzing *individual* games is a harder skill to master than building up good intuitions over time, so I'd be reluctant to advise people who haven't put a lot of time into the game already to do it/rely on it. Thinking, after a loss, about what went wrong and what you could've done to avoid it is all well and good, but making decisions to implement that into your future games is too hasty. You need context, and that's why quantity is just as important as quality.
For example, let's say that you play toplane, and you decide to rush level 2 first and all in your lane opponent at level 2. You go ahead and do that, and the enemy jungle vi ganks just in time to save your lane opponent and kill you, and from there your lane goes downhill. You decide your lack of ability to see VI coming was the main crux of the loss, so from that point on you decide to ward early against Vis if you want to play aggressive before your first recall. This is a faulty analysis if you have the *context* that Vi's first gank is usually after a full clear, rather than a 3 camp clear, so against a Vi that paths normally, your early ward will actually *expire* before her gank timing, and you're worse off.
You can do a similar cost-benefit analysis with the Taliyah loss. It is true that Taliyah is generally unhappy with playing against people who can reliably do damage from outside of her range. But it is *also* true that comps where *everyone* is a champion that outranges Taliyah tend to be pretty bad comps (you can build a poke comp, but you don't do it by taking 5 pokers, you do it by taking 3; with 5 you're giga vulnerable to flanks for obvious reasons). So in that situation I'd entertain the idea that the game was lost moreso on mismanaging teamfights rather than the Taliyah pick; if anything, Taliyah is above average at flanking.
Hello! I come from an Overwatch 2 background and there is a stark similarity I’ve started noticing between OW and LoL.
Since there is no economy in OW, characters get value in other ways; DPS of course wants damage, Supports value heals etc. However, each Character has a very specific objective in mind (maybe dps flanking w/ escape tools, or supports that can make opportunities).
The very best example for league I found was Vex (burst, roam, anti assassin), and your video on her identity clicked. Alongside the addition of items, runes, and games not just being team-fight after team-fight (OW) the amount of expression is huge, allowing characters to somewhat change their champion identity or objective to better fit with your play style or the teams needs.
I like how you explained that champ mastery was the bed rock of league of legends skills, but I don't know if I relate to that as much. To me it seems more like a web of skills that all complement each other. For example, as a top laner, wave control is essential to champion mastery. Even if you're the best gangplank player and you can hit all your combos, that's useless if you all-in when the enemy jax is crashing 3 waves and kills you. On the other hand, if you play tryndamere top, you will easily out-climb a micro focused person if you understand how to use your wave to your advantage and how to effectively split push.
Ever since I heard the swain video was coming out me and my friend have been impatiently waiting..!
Take your time, I know it'll be great, but know we're in ferocious anticipation!
i understand and believe all of this to be true; my current struggle is just in finding the champions that i truly want to dedicate myself to.
like you said, i don’t have enough time to get good at every single champion that interests me, but i also want to be a competitive player. i’m trying to start over with a new champion (vex) to break my narratives and learn how to learn so to speak. after about 50-100 games, i plan on adding 1-2 other champions to my pool over the course of this split.
there are so many cool champions in this game that the hardest part about accepting the truth of champion mastery is deciding which champions i really want to commit myself to.
It can take time to find what you enjoy, but remember the better you get at a champ the MORE FUN you'll have
I think performing/carrying games is a better term to use than winning games, since even as a hardstuck gold for years I won many games I shouldn't with champions I first timed in ranked, just because my teamates where straight up better
Mans never heard of the 30 30 40 rule....
very good video. I struggled so much to pick a champ and stick to it and learn the game on a deeper level for years because I'd just get bored after 20+ games of the same champ.
Then I finally found a champ and sticked to it and the results were astronomical. Also, I have FUN on the champ and I think it's very important.
Which champion was that for you?
100% on the fun aspect!
shaco support. climbed mid shaco last season to emerald 1 actually but it became too hard after that @@kevinchappelle5473
The best swain videos I've ever seen are made by Husum. This guy helped me get from hardstuck silver 4 to emerald 2 in one month. Why?, Because he explains the mechanics of the champion and the mindset you need to have at every matchup, but also macro. He explains it so well through the lens of a swain player.
Husum literally did the same for me last season, from silver 1 to emerald. Hes the goat and has been saying hes a fan of curtis!
🐦
100%, I'm a big fan of him
so that means I have reached beginner champion mastery after 2000+ azir games over 9 years enjoying life in iron 4
don't worry coach that was just a self-irony, I understand your points here, well said >_-
This video was so eye opening for me, im sure ill come back and replay it before getting again on rankeds
I love the analogy @ 5:55, I have always taught the end goal of the game was create beauty; only through complete mastery (being the ability to manipulate absolute) all aspects of the game, which includes every nuance, can you achieve this goal. Players often set bars far to low for themselves and only realize the goals they set.
great content as always curtis. im a 2m mastery points swain myself and I'd love to see your learning curve of the champion. Any posibilities for you to stream or upload longer whole game videos of this? Would be very interesting to see.
Had to rewatch some sections because i was so impressed by this irelia… nice video though!
that part when you say it's jungle diff is very convincing, love the vid
100% spot on about intentional practice. I have so little mastery points on ADC champs but because I’ve been intentional about my practice I feel better on them than mid (which I’ve played for at least twice as long)
Was not expecting to sit here and watch a 30 minute video and pay attention to the whole thing...but here i am 32 minutes later really thinking about who im gonna main this season having just come back from a 2-3 year hiatus from the game (Hecarim and Briar are for sure in that pool (largely due to the low mechanical demand) and IDK who/if I'm gonna pick as a 3rd champ)
Bro, i think you did this video just for me. I was thinking EXACTLY what you said the entire time for like 4-6 months. I have 2mi Cassiopeia mastery, but im stucked on D1 for 2y and i want reach GM, so i was trying to play with another champions. I will make this Cassiopeia reach GM bro, thanks
He didn’t exactly say he recommends to otp, in his podcast he mentions that playing the same champ for too long will eventually lead a player to losing his mind so it’s good to rotate champs in their pool to keep mental clarity
@@goobandz1663 what I retrieve for this video is to push a little more for my champ, review some plays I did... Literally I just played one match now and I played using 200% what my Cass can give and I win 8/0/9 with 18min 90% kill participation. Probably I was scared for so long to do some things in game that my Cass was an worm
Hey Curtis, former and when I am finally finished University future MLS member. Just a quick question about a point you brought up in the video , if champion mastery is the bedrock of the pyramid and comes before fundamentals and game concepts then is it still important to play a champion that is good for learning the fundamentals? For example, Annie is seen as a great champion for learning the fundamentals of the game, as you have previously stated when in lane you can either farm with Q or trade with Q unlike Yasuo that has to E through the minions to trade. However, if champion mastery supersedes fundamentals then does it matter which champion you pick as long as you develop champ mastery since you are seeing the game through the lens of the champion you decide to pick? Just wanted your opinion on this, thanks.
Not directed towards me, but yes, it does. Different champions require different levels of approaching the game; Different approaches makes your team take more or less advantage of it, depending on the "subjectivity" of your champion.
For example, its easier for your silver teammates to take advantage of your flash + W + Ult as you're playing annie, but it takes a lot of time and knowledge to understand that your allied qiyana standing on a bush near a wall means DEATH independently of the enemy's HP (if you follow up).
Champion mastery comes before fundamentals because without mastery of your champ, you won't even have the muscle memory/mental stack to APPLY the fundamentals.
Playing easier to execute/simpler champions definitely helps when learning the game because :
A) It's easier to develop mastery on them
B) The journey is smoother and more streamlined
C) The execution OF the fundamentals with the champ is simpler
So I wanted to add my take to the painting analogy: A one trick might only have one color, but they can utilize all of the smallest shades of that color that there are to create a beautiful monochrome painting. Their paintbrush might not be of the highest quality or they might not even have one. What they do have is hands they can use to paint the canvas with their shades of a color, and hands is not something that most league players have.
Great video on a topic I've often been confused with myself. Cheers!
you mentioned a while back you’d redo the irelia guide you made, are you still planning on making another irelia guide?
As a rocket league player it is so easy to identify how your individual mechanics and mistakes are losing you games.
In League of Legends, it's so easy to scapegoat that to others mistakes the champion you picked the mechanics, the items the ruins you took.
But at the end of the day it's not a growing mindset to find excuses instead of looking at what you could have done better.
Not necessarily what you did wrong but what you could have done better
"Thirteen year veterans" is what you were looking for. Another great breakdown. Thanks!
Who are the player in the video ?
i know irelia is irelking, yasuo is pzzang, but who is the akali ?
nagasawa, Brazilian Akali OTP
I mean do you think the same thing applies to jungle where you can be great one trick but suck in jungle and great ardent support who dont know anything about the game? I mean yea you can easily hit master playing just eve or rengar if your good at them but for majority of different champs i wouldnt say so. Champion mastery is something really important on mid and top no doubt but other roles I think prefer learning fundamentals over anything else
Looked on the website and couldn't find anything, but does MLA have a lucian mid guide in there? would look into possibly signing up if so :) ty anyways, great vid
Bro glad to see you back Coach, love your content
love the painting analogy
Different game, but I think it adds harmony.
When I played Apex Legends I loved pistols and made an effort to do well with them in any game. When I was asked by friends why I don't pick stronger, meta weapons. I simply said, "Why would I want to pick a weapon that plays the game for me?" Now if I played with randoms that cussed me out, reported me for throwing, and then jumped off the map whenever I picked up a sidearm, I'd be harder to push the envelope.
would you say someone like tarzaned has fully mastered graves because i used to watch his videos all the time and i learned pretty fast id love to hear your thoughts
Falling in love with League now and I just wish I got here earlier. Like I genuinely regret that I missed out on the last few years I could've been playing League.
hey curtis i have a question about like cass and this topic, I'm trying to figure out how to play some hard matchups like syndra, viktor, lux etc and i usually try to watch otps play her and take conq and e most of the time, but im hearing other players like masters gm+ recommending me q max with aery, but I'm not sure what approach I'm supposed to do since I'm trying to have a more inspired playstyle from like quad in kr? what do you think since i know you play a lot of cass
I think your champ mastery can only ever be as good as the players you verse and their champion mastery.
For example when I was P1/E4 playing tristana mid, I gained what I thought was champion mastery after 400 games lol. I "felt" able to play most of my match-ups really well, team fight well, position well etc.
A specific example is, I thought I had mastered the tristana vs fizz match-up, I would play super aggressive and keep him under tower and bully him all game. I thought I finally had mastery of this match-up as it always played out this way in my games.
However I climbed to E1 and all of a sudden I feel like I have no mastery in that match-up, they play way more aggressive, they trade better and they know their all in windows much better. They play in a way I haven't even seen and more specifically a way I haven't "felt".
So now I have to re-master my champion to accommodate to my new elo range. Most of that is unlearning the poor habits I was previously doing that worked and don't anymore which is pretty difficult.
This is why I am actually starting to think you might be better off cycling champions every few months as you climb. Otherwise you are constantly required to keep unlearning bad habits you picked up on your champions.
The example of Nathan playing nocturne is a good example of this. It took him like 20 games to gain a shit load more mastery of the champion than someone who has played 100s in silver.
What if you are silver, you play 300 games of Xin Zhao, and finally you get to gold, then you decide it's time to take what you've learnt and apply it to learning a new champion like Wukong, then you play him until you reach plat. This way you are not having to unlearn to poor habits you had from playing Xin vs silver players and instead get to build your Wukongs mastery starting in gold.
Thats my thoughts anyway, great vid brotha.
30:10 how did that ashe arrow not hit lol
i have been making a point to raise all my champs to a mastery lvl 5. I have noticed that in my first few lvl with a champ I tend not to do so hot but by time I am at lvl 5 I can clear lanes and get kills. I think my biggest issue when playing is dealing with teammates who get into bad fights. in the last game I played a Briar champ started a fight on the bottom lane. They got angry because me and my support didn't follow them. They were between the outer and inner turrets which I do not think is favorable because I have threats both behind and in front of me. I like to stay behind my minions and have a clear path to run in the case I need to retreat. i noticed a lot of players I team with seem to play too aggressively. In the beginning I want to focus on getting gold and exp so I can buy items yet my teammates want to get into fight I know I will die if I engage in them. I am learning that it is best to follow my gut when it comes to playing the game. I am learning it is best to assume that fellow champs are not going to have my back so I need to act as if I am on my own. If I can win the fight then I run.
I’ve always wanted to main Trundle top, but I feel like he has too low of a skill ceiling, so I’ll just get wrecked by more skill expressive champions. He was even nerfed recently, so I feel like I missed my chance. I guess my question is, Is it worth committing my time to an easy and inferior champion?
I had a game recently
Using sejuani in Top lane againts MORD.
I knew immediately it was going to be tough.
He pretty much dominated me in the early game and i had to give up a good amount of CS.
However he never killed ME!
I had to play super submissive and wait for chance.
Once we got to mid game i was able to farm up and eventually come back and won that game.
I have come to learn that literally not dying can help in the later game. If you die more than three times in your lane you’re pretty much done for and have to rely on your other laners.
Even when you have mastered your champ there will be some games where your flow seems to have disappeared, remember to see the stats at the end of the game, I had 4 games in a row that were perfectly winnable and we blundered right at the end, it's easy to blame my teammates and I did that, but truth is that even though I did most of the objectives as jungler in those games, I still had almost less damage than the support. In the following game I decided that I had to be way more aggressive and that game I ended up carrying, so that's another thing to consider
You are so correct about league players being obsessed with BS. So many people making excuses about losers queue and never look within on what they couldve changed or what they coulsve improved.
a bit off-topic, but are you making a Hwei guide soon?^^
As an Intermeadiate Kayn main i agree with you and what is that op gaming in the background
Another great video; thanks as always for everything you do Coach!
Something overlooked is how champ mastery doesnt directly correlate with agency. All the montage examples are high agency 1v9 champs. If you have extreme champ mastery in Chogath, you wont have the same level of agency as other 1v9 champs. This is a major part of why people overlook champ mastery b/c they play easier champs to learn the game but you dont get the same rewards for champ mastery
Yes and no. I coach a master OTP chogath mid in my program and he has extremely high impact in games and often solo carries. Ofcourse some champs will have more impact then others, but you'd be suprised. There was a top 10 EUW annie OTP last season as well
7:55 yes i think exactly the same. A person NEEDS a lot of points so mastery is even possible (a lot of games played), but a lot of games played or milions of points probably mean they aren't very good at the champ and often prove that they haven't mastered the champ!
Curtis the kinda guy to explain a point super thoroughly and understandably then throw the worst analogy you've ever heard on top just to confuse people.
Everything i believed has been destroyed with this video.
Thank you so much for opening my eyes.
A small question :
I have been playing for so long with Lux, she's my biggest main, and I get myself a lot of success in climbing rank with her throughout the year, and I reached emerald this early season with her with only 10 first games
However, the more I play her, I feel like Lux is getting a little bit too "weak" - or I thought so, with the new changes to mage items this new season
Then I played Malzahar - my 2nd most played main - won a lot, felt better when playing him and kept spamming him for free lp on rank rn
My wr with Lux is 4-6 rn , and I feel a little bit off that I played exactly like what I used to play, but my result gets worse. Is my problem is that I still can not adapt with the new changes or is it that she really needs the next patch buff to shine again? For me at least
I think the main problem is that 10 games is not a sample size. Even if your true winrate on lux is, say, 60%, you still have a 25% probability given a 10 game sample size to lose 6 or more out of them.
I'd be worried if your wr was something like, say, 20-30 instead, but I wouldn't draw any conclusions from 4-6.
i feel like i got some of this by default because of how i play the game. i quit league twice and only came back a third time to play lillia. since then shes been my otp and lately the games have been feeling oddly easy while playing her. not sure if its because im now at the experienced level or im just getting lucky with getting easy matchups, but im having so much fun with her
Hi Curtis. Do you think a "Craftsman" level of mastery exists for simpler / lower agency champs (e.g. Malphite)?
Of course! Have you seen Banana combo on Malphite? Or reverse bermuda combo?
Usually it comes from being able to win every matchup (maxing different skill, playing wave differently, heavy trading early level or waiting) or knowing different item or runes that are more effective against team.
Even tho it’s a pocket pick you can still get more out of it. Just won’t reward you as much as more flexible champs.
I don't have any experience with trying to master Malphite but here are two examples I can give with a champion that most people would consider simpler than Malphite (Garen).
1. Having a feel for *exactly* when your ult is lethal allows you to ult right at that point rather than piling more damage just to be safe, saving 1-2 seconds which can be crucial in a 2v2 or 3v3 skirmish as they allow you to help with a different target.
2. Having a feel for *exactly* how long it takes you to clear a wave allows you to decide when you can safely proxy and when you can't.
It's not much (and it's okay for it to not be much, Garen really IS low skill ceiling relative to most) but it's enough that I definitely see high elo players who *don't* main Garen screw those two up when they play him.
Curtis looking like he's from the evil timeline with the goatee
I think it more like, first you need some fundamentals, like you can effectively cs and have some map awareness.
Then you focus on champion mastery. It doesn't matter how well you can execute some crazy combos if you can't get decent cs without pressure and just auto gap yourself from your opponent.
Once you have some instincts for your champ (e.g. I'm Viego. I am super strong in skirmishes mid game so I should force some), you go back to honing fundamentals and repeat.
Curtis has said he personally thinks champion mastery comes before fundamentals, both in previous podcasts and in this comment thread, and I tend to agree. In fact, you bring a great point that illustrates why: cs'ing. You need differently executed fundamentals to learn how to cs if your champ either has a hard time farming without overpushing the wave (rumble, volibear), differently executed fundamentals if your champion is inherently slow at pushing waves whether they want to or not (vayne, shen), differently executed fundamentals if your champion has to trade and push at the same time in particular ways (viktor, lissandra), etc. In fact, the reason why Annie is such a common coach recommendation is because of her versatility with cs'ing, which makes her fundamentals more widely transferrable.
I think part of the misunderstanding here is what champion mastery even *is*. Because it's not just how reliably you can execute crazy combos. It's also things people sometimes consider "pure macro" or "pure decision making". For example, a Riven with high champion mastery will be able to pull of the Shy combo, sure, that is part of it, but she's also able to correctly judge whether to force-freeze by pulling minions through sacrificing health vs putting her E on cooldown, or correctly estimate how long it will take her to rotate from top to mid if she ability spams (and thus how much farm she expects to lose off the roam), or precisely determine when she has lethal on a target when it's not trivially obvious. You might see her flash on the 80% adc, do some fancy animation cancels, and one shot them, and assume that the decision to go in was good macro while the cleanness of the combo was good champion mastery, but in fact the decision to go in, knowing she had the lethal, is champion mastery too.
In fact, you gave an example yourself of what Curtis would consider part of champion mastery. You know that, as Viego, you should force mid game skirmishes. That's not just your general proficiency at mid game macro, that's something you know *because* you understand Viego.
But is it an excuse if its true? Some champions just cant thrive in certain comps. Like ye, you can try to do X, Y, Z, but in the end counterpicks DO exist.
Yo Coach Curtis, I fell down the rabbit hole of exploring the game through all of the fundamentals. I literally know so much about the game not even diamonds know like not everything, but a lot even though I am still only bronze after 4-5 years. So i've decided on just playing my champion better instead of the game and it's working so much better. I used to think whilst reviewing pro vods. Alright, why did he roam, or why did he have this wave state. But I am so bad at the easy stuff, that when I asked myself "Alright, let's just see how he is using his W *on ekko*" I was bewildered. What! Why place it there and not there instead? Ohhh, it's because 'blah, blah, blah'. So now i'm actually seeing improvements and I am honestly scared how fast I can climb to masters (I am still bronze 3) now that I can have a foundation. It's like being the best and painting in the world, but only being able to paint in white on a white canvas (I love your painting analogies). So i've enrolled in your MLA program and it's just beautiful how much I can learn for my champion and it is so FUN learning the details about everything, I wish the best to you Coach Curtis!
Hey curtis great video, may i also ask do you have information on whats going on with LP gains this season? I have around 50 games with 55% winrate and somehow i am losing 30 and gaining 24 on plat4. How am i supposed to climb when i have negative gain with positive winrate? I also saw another guy who had 70% wr with 100 games and he was losing 30 and gaining 14 on emerald.
Play to improve, not to climb.
@@chi0224 Both supposed to go hand in hand. Whats the point of trying to improve if riot punishes me for having a positive winrate?
I can guarantee you if you improve to a Emerald 4 level and start stomping your still plat 4 elo games, you will be out of that elo in no time.@@tuh774
What do I do if my main keeps getting banned?
Hwei reference, I love it !! :D 6:05
completely agree
mechanics come first.
In fighting games you have to be a master at your character
that’s like playing a fps without trying to better your aim.
if you miss all your shots, what’s the point in positioning well..
it's kinda hard to focus when there's an irelia solokilling showmaker lvl 2
For laners yeah champ mastery is most important. For jungle there are so many important fundermentals that are universal that understanding these are actually more important than the champion you are playing. Once you've learnt them you can then look at champions you enjoy the most. But for lanes the fundermentals are basically controlling waves and vision in that one part of the map. Jungle have their camps, the opposing junglers camp, neutral objectives, lane states, jungle tracking, jungle cs teacking, jungle pathing, gank pathing and invading to learn before it makes any difference between champions.
This is probably gonna sound less inspirational and more purely pragmatic, but here is the reason why I personally choose to have a tiny champion pool and focus on champion mastery over champion diversity:
In 50% of your games, you will be blind picking relative to your lane opponent. That's just how champ select works. And if you're in those situations, then the guy who is expert level on 1 champion is *strictly better off* than the guy who is intermediate level on 12 champions, because his ability to adapt literally *can't* be taken advantage of. Cheers.
(also, there is another reason, but this I feel only applies to toplane: Due to its insular nature, toplane is the role that benefits the most from knowing your lane opponent, but benefits the least from knowing the rest of the enemy comp. As a consequence, if you request to be lower in pick order in champ select but the enemy toplaner picks after you anyway, which can definitely happen a lot on blue side, you hindered your team's adaptability for almost no gain. So having that *one* champion you are really confident on can really help on blue side drafts.)
In music it's well known that nothing is more harmful than practicing wrong. In melee and other fighting games there's the phenomenon of "endless friendlies", which is pretty similar in essence.
Myself I've fallen many times into the trap of looking at all the ragers and sore losers and thinking "at least I have a better mindset than those guys", but then forgot to ask what I could have done better.
What happened @ 11:55?
one tricking katarina for two years showed me that you are right here
Another Curtis banger video speaking reality like it's supposed to be
At 9:00 I think that was Nathan coaching a hecarim not nocturne
lots of people just don't understand the insanity that goes into truly mastering a champion. i genuinely thought i was coked at Vayne as a low gold player. now being low emerald, i'm BARELY experienced. i have just under 1300 ranked games on vayne since season 6, and i wasn't really improving much until last year. taking that step back, humbling myself, realizing i'm nowhere near as good as people as gosu, uzi, etc. sure i have muscle memory and i don't need to think about the champ anymore, i'm focusing more on the gameplay aspects rather than the champion at this point. its CRAZY to me that people who have like 50 games on a champ think they're absolutely insane with them, just to realize people like Irelking, arkadata, forest within, etc. have THOUSANDS of games and hours put into a specific champion and thinking they're on the same level
Irelia, Yasuo, Zed, Lee Sin, Riven, Akali...always the same champions with the "insane" plays, but only because their kits were build with added complexity that made them far more rewarding at higher skill levels of play (at least in soloQ). It's especially dumb how rewarding point and click abilities are. Makes me feel like my skillshots don't matter and I'm wasting my time playing something else.
Im otp ezreal with 2.5 milion matery points, i was hardstuck silver until i asked for coach and he said that my mecanical execution was realy good but my decision makin was so shit that it was holding me back, now im d3 adc enjoyer
Love the compilation of akail being "balanced" from 26:30 onwards lmao
Hello Coach, make a video about can league of legends and the real life being balanced together or not , sometimes I think it is not worth it because it makes us behind in real life
Hey mate, love your vids, but please boost the audio of your voice up 5-10 db
How long to be experienced level with riven? Is 22 games very good?!
not even close lol
@@eebbaa5560 23?????
Any champion I have mained in the past will be back in (almost) peak form after 5-10 games at the most. It's like riding a bike, once you've done it you will never fully lose it ever again.
I think most of these points mainly apply to newer players who haven't played for many years. Even if you've been high plat/low diamond for most of your time playing league, you will have mained so many different champions you no longer view the game as the champion you are playing at that moment. By the time you've mained more than 5 champions you should really drop the goggles and start looking at the actual game as it is.
I also really feel like this applies less to my main role jungle, since it's not as much about the 1v1 and more about strategic concepts as a whole. Yes there are specific things you need to know, but knowing the exact 1v1 is not how jungle is played
Coach curtis the colab must happen between you and husumlol for a swain video
“TAKING SOULS” 😅 stay hard!
B-b-b-but Choach Curtis. I am a Cho OTP and am GrandMasters, and can probably pick up any champ in average elo and perform as if I touched that champ before. I think game knowledge and experience facing and playing with that champ, takes higher priority than specific champion mastery. I did a jungle unranked challenger 3 years ago and had a 75% w/r on Evelyn to masters, and could prob do the same for many other champs all from game experience.
Can't even focus on wtf you are saying when there's a irelia doing stuff I never seen before in my life -.-..... I zoned out in awe.
I'm the opposite. I can't understand why people would ever pick a different champion than one they're learning when there's an infinite amount of things to learn. I've been playing Qiyana for 4.5 years now and I went from Diamond to Grandmaster (about 40lp off Chall at peak) and still think I'm not even comparable to someone like Irelking or Beifeng. It's just not fun playing a champion for 20 games and barely knowing how to play it for me, there's nothing enjoyable about losing games when you're clueless or winning a freebie.
On the contrary I did get Master last split on my "off Qiyana" account as a meme to beat the allegations but it's REALLY hard conceptually for me to not just start one tricking a 2nd champion and actually keep my champion pool diverse.
Random comment here but hopefully it helps someone. I don't really play league any more but when I did, I was in bronze and got mad all the time and called everyone trash. Then one day a fellow bronze said to me your also trash your in bronze, the whole team laughed at me. Something about that struck a nerve. After that I accepted I was trash then climbed my way to Gold!!!! remember, your trash folks and you'll get better. Sounds dumb but when you have this epiphany you'll climb. It's like magic
Who is that Akali player? Need citation
If you wear a hat people won’t call you bald. But if you always wear a hat you’ll always be unconfident. If u don’t wear a hat you give people the chance to mock you. It can go well or poorly but you’re allowing change to happen.
This is the same as wanting to get better at your main but over prioritize draft instead. You’re not guaranteed to get better every game (that you have mental clarity) but you also might. No progress happens when you’re mentally preoccupied, so allow yourself to get stomped and pay perfect attention. People suck at winning *all* of their “guaranteed” winning matchups. Allow individual games to be lost and play for a great loss. A great loss can turn into a win at many moments. That’s the most a league of legends player should ever expect. (Like i think that’s healthy and productive at least)
Ramble ramble ramble :)
18:48 Brazil mentioned yay! É o nagas
I haven't finished the vdeo but I just wanted to throw it out that I envy people like Irelking who can play 1000+ games with a champ they love. Because I only have one champion that I can play with pure muscle memory and after a while it just gets boring, Illaoi is fun and all, but I like learning new champs so It's hard to back to one I've "mastered". I suck at the game but with Illaoi I literally can't remember the last time I've lost lane, even when the game was stacked against me with a camping jungler or roaming supports and counter picks just because I've been in all of those situations and instinctively know what to do in all of them. Now I'm learning Sion and it's been very fun, I really like learning champs and just wish I could play one's I've "mastered" more since I know I'm about to get bored of Sion as well since I know feel comfortable fighting his absolute total counters like Riven and Fiora and am able to completely carry games by myself. I want to learn Twisted Fate but I am so bad at squishy champs it's unreal
I think you are rigth i am mad when i loose a game, but at least me watch the replay to see what can i do better, ofc not all the game, most likely a bad teamfighh or a losing lane
after 100 games as nasus i realized you cant master him into being fun