Efren's legacy stands above all others because he actually changed the game of pool. He did things nobody did before. SVB is just as good a player when it comes to competition but Efren will always lead because of his innovation and creativeness on the table.
Efren revolutionized pool and he made Pool popular around the world. Who would have thought that a boring table game can be entertaining to watch? Back in the day everyone would watch tournaments because of Efren because he plays like crazy. He would always make crazy risky shots and make the crowd go nuts, smiles everywhere. The American pro players in the 70's thought that they are at the pinnacle of playing pool, then Efren came and humbled them all. Efren's impact and influence to the game was on a global scale and that's why he is the G.O.A.T.
Efren didnt change pool's popularity. Its the movies the Hustler amd the color of Money who brought people to it in 2 big waves. Since them it's been on the decline and efren didnt change that.
He in fact even came 3rd in one pocket last year at 68 years old, beating the likes of pagulayan, filler etc. That's longevity and greatness right there
ORCULLO > SHANE VAN BOENING SVB will never be GOAT that is an IGNORANT statement! 10 ball the race to 90 ruclips.net/video/DxU0HFJYYvY/видео.html 9 ball race to 120 ruclips.net/video/nGOKKCsMSD8/видео.html THIS IS THE GOAT ruclips.net/user/shortsE-UZFULnMW4
I say it's gonna be SVB for sure. He's already surpassed Reyes in career earning and titles and isn't anywhere close to his age. More importantly, he's a more well rounded player. Altho he has mentioned not liking jump cues and has said he thinks they're bad for the game, he still learned and has become a master of the technique.... unlike Reyes, who effectively just neglected it altogether. Shane is also known for his mastery of the break, another aspect of Efren's game that was neither strong or even noteworthy. I think SVB's accomplishments, his age and time remaining to achieve even more, as well as his willingness to learn and try to perfect all aspects of the game even if he doesn't like them, set him apart as the GOAT.
ORCULLO > SHANE VAN BOENING SVB will never be GOAT that is an IGNORANT statement! 10 ball the race to 90 ruclips.net/video/DxU0HFJYYvY/видео.html 9 ball race to 120 ruclips.net/video/nGOKKCsMSD8/видео.html THIS IS THE GOAT ruclips.net/user/shortsE-UZFULnMW4
@@GuiH-ss7ylStill a key part. If your opponent snookers you and you can’t kick out you’re in trouble. Efren went one step further, being able to not only kick, but kick to safety himself, by knowing which side of the object ball he would be hitting.
They represent a huge part of the game... if you get out of line, you have to kick/bank to a safety. when other people get out of line, they kick/bank safety you and you have to kick/bank out of the safety to a re-safe or you sell out... You cannot be the G.O.A.T. if you don't have that in your repertoire. Someone who can kick and bank with perfect speed control can dominate the game.
Kicking and backing is for when you get into trouble. Breaking is the key to pool, especially at the highest level. Typically whoever is breaking better wins. And SVB is the greatest breaker ever hands down. He’s also one of the best ever at runouts. That combo is definitely better than kicking and banking. Reyes is the best kicker ever. Hands down.
@@tjblackartist Earl Strickland banks better than Efren Reyes, yet, Efren Reyes beat Earl in a race to 120 when both players were at the top of their career. Yes, the break is the most important "shot" of the game; but after you break, it's all strategy, creativity, and knowledge. I've seen Reyes kick 6 rails to thin the target ball and leave his opponent a tough shot still. Show me another pool player who can do that.
I like the style of this video, a bit deeper subject than the light hearted videos you usually put out. Well done and your vocal tone was spot on, dont listen to that other guy. 😉
Harold Worst was the best player of all time. Died of brain cancer decades ago. He won a championship with brain cancer a few weeks before he passed. All the old greats talk about him. Look him up
I believe when you consider eight ball, nine ball, and 10 ball SVB has a strong argument for GOAT. But so does Reyes. When you consider eight ball, nine ball, 10 ball, three cushion, and one pocket then Reyes is the best because of the three cushion. There are many ways to be great. Reyes was very flashy and spectacular, but he needed to be because his game as very loose at times. SVB is more steady and just gets it done. Plus, SVB is playing against much deeper fields than Reyes ever did. The fields are so deep today that just making it to the final 16 can be brutal. It really wasn't like that when Reyes was in his prime.
Let me say Efren has been my hero since 93, however Shane is very accomplished at all games., and with his break could give him the edge in most games. The only clear advantage Efren would have would be 1 pocket
plus they forgot, Efren's game is rotation. during his prime nobody can beat him in rotation. He only played 3 cushion because nobody wants to play with him anymore even giving them 25 points in rotation.
You can't even talk to ppl about this debate. SVB has more titles and has surpassed Efren in career prize money. Yet, ppl act like he isn't even in the conversation. I'm as big an Efren fan as anyone. But he's in the conversion, plain and simple.
The difference between Efren and Shane is that Efren plays/played to the crowd and Shane tunes it out. "Amateurs need motivation, professionals just go to work. Legends make it look easy" In my opinion a true GOAT has confidence and charisma flowing through their veins. It's that wry smile before they rearrange your neurons. Shane hits the target no one else can hit, but Efren hits the target no one else can see. Simply put, Efren has been playing pool longer than Shane has even been alive, so the next GOAT has yet to claim the throne.
I think Reyes is the OVERALL greatest billiard player of all time when you consider all of the games. But I do not think he is the best nine ball or 10 ball player of all time, or even the greatest eight ball player. SVB could very well be the GOAT. Reyes WAS great, don't get me wrong, but he mostly played in an era that was not nearly as deep as it is today. Reyes would not come close to winning as often now as he did when he was in his prime. I played in the Philippines for over 16 years. I have met Reyes many times and watched him in person. He is a good guy, a good ambassador for the sport but people say he is the GOAT because - well - that is what the narrative is. But if you look at it closely, he is probably not as far as eight, nine, and 10 ball. Reyes is known for spectacular kicking and banking - mainly kicking - and he was. But he was also very sloppy and had to get himself out of trouble many times. Reyes was great, SVB is still great. They both have an argument for GOAT.
Reyes made a greater impact because he was a non american playing what is considered to be an american game Reyes didn't only win tournaments but he essentially changed the game. The game is played today the way it is because of efren. Jump cues are here because of his greatness, people had to come up with ways to equalize the game. The way it's played today, kick shots, kick safeties, creative shot making, is because of him ,and he was a player who is multidisciplinary. He plays, 9,10,8 balls, rotation, one pocket, straight pool, balk line, carom, banks even snooker etc. He doesn't just play them well but even well enough to win them in tournaments. He isn't a one dimensional player. Plus almost all the highest prized tournaments have been won by him. He was a dominant, multidimensional, game changing player. That's what makes efren great plus his humility, this guy doesn't go on top of tables beating his chest after winning tournaments but simply raises his cue to acknowledge the fans and thank them and all that with his now all familiar sheepish smile.
here are my top 5 list (next generation of all time greats) not the GOAT 1st Joshua Filler 2nd Fedor Gorst 3rd Shane Van Boening 4th Ko Pin Chung 5th Francisco Sanchez Ruiz
The history of pool goes back more than a hundred yrs. The games played were predominantly balk line, 18.2, 3 cushion, banks , one pocket, & 14.1. 9 & 10 ball came a bit later. One pocket & 10 ball were played on 5x10 tables. The balls were ivory , then clay composition, there was a big cue ball used at times. There were few cue makers. Most of the cues were off the rack. The equipment is much better now than in the past. The popularity of the game is historically cyclic. Large cities like Chicago had hundreds of pool rooms, not a handful. The men wore suits, not jeans n t shirts like today. So the conditions were entirely different than today. Efren’s skill is undeniable & his accomplishments prove that as well as SVBs but to say either is the GOAT is premature & can not be proven w/out comparing them to the accomplishments of their predecessors.
This is a tough one.. can't make the same case as jordan/kobe/lebron.... cause pool is pool. rules have been the same forever. But I would still have to give the slight edge to Efren.. If SVB can keep up a high level into his 60's... then it might change, but man... prime Efren vs SVB.... now that would be something to watch...
This is like Jordan vs James in basketball. Efren is a veteran of the game and in his prime he would win any tournament he'd participate in today's world and he still is able to play now but won't dominate. When it comes to the greatest of ALL TIME, Efren is without question
ORCULLO > SHANE VAN BOENING SVB will never be GOAT that is an IGNORANT statement! 10 ball the race to 90 ruclips.net/video/DxU0HFJYYvY/видео.html 9 ball race to 120 ruclips.net/video/nGOKKCsMSD8/видео.html THIS IS THE GOAT ruclips.net/user/shortsE-UZFULnMW4
As much as I love Efren, he played on much looser tables, and against fewer world class players in his prime. Not to mention his break was weak compared to most of his peers, and he simply never amassed the insane tournament record that Shane has. Even today, the top ranked players in the world apparently can't beat Shane in a race to 100. So, yes, there are some things Efren was better at, but Shane also has his advantages too. SVB will go down in history as the GOAT. He's just dominated for way to long and against much, much, tougher players from all over the world.
@phillipschuman4307 yeah that's why there's an asterisk on the plaques next to Babe Ruth and Ty Cobb with an annotation that says, "didn't play the game recently".
Awesome video Josh. SVB & Earl, 2 of my all time favourite players. Reyes had/had the best kick/bank/safety game in the business, but overall titles and results don’t match to the 2 boys.
Mosconi is the greatest player of all time. There is unfortunately basically nothing of his play captured on film or video in his prime. Reyes wasn't really dominant against the players in his prime and you could make an argument that Sigel was more accomplished and better at 9 and certainly straight. Reyes is insanely good and good at all games. That is usually the knock against Mosconi but Bill Stroud has explained that Mosconi would give the top pros of his time the 5 out in 9 ball and win easily. Mosconi was also world class in 3 cushion billiards and in a tour with the world snooker champion won about 1/3 of his matches. if we include other billards style games Ronnie O'Sullivan is a better player and Cuilemans was essentially unbeatable in billiards for a quarter of a century. Efren is definitely in the conversation as is SVB. I talked once to a contemporary of Mosconi's while a tournament with Rempe, Mizerak and Hopkins was going on and he said that Mosconi was much much better than they were. He said Mosconi was so good and so fast that you didn't even realize he had just taken a hard shot. I know people will dismiss this because they want Efren to be the GOAT but he s not
@@jamescathcart4762 I will say this. Somewhere around 1988 or 1989 there was a tournament in Willie's honor at Hard Times in Bellflower. Willie was there as well as a couple pros (Earl Strickland won it) and a couple of the old time players that had become a little famous from the Legends of Pool series on ESPN. So Cowboy Jimmy Moore is running around telling everyone that he wants to challenge Willie, but Willie wont play and that Willie can't beat him, bla bla bla. So he is just going on and on about how Willie is ducking him, and somehow it turned to Willie only being good at straight pool. So Moore has just been trashing Willie for a half hour and at some point they start talking about Wimpy would have destroyed Willie "back then" in 9 ball. To which Moore says something like "when Willie was in his prime?" and then proceeds to say that in his prime Lassiter couldn't have beat Willie in anything including 9 ball. He said some weight like the 7 out or more but I don't remember. He sort of goes back to trashing Willie and how he wouldn't lower himself to play other games but that if you pissed him off he would eventually play and destroy that person at any game. The Stroud comments, what Moore said and what an old timer said about Willie at East End billiards in Elizabeth are why I firmly believe Mosconi was the best. I mean I really only saw him play in his 70s but the people who saw him play in his prime all thought he was pretty much unbeatable. Just my opinion but based on things I have heard and read, If you have ever seen his instructional video made late in his life the ease at which he runs a couple racks of straight is astonishing.
@@johnnyp6202 Very interesting. I guess there are all the what ifs including Babe Ruth, Wilt Chamberlin and all the other greats. Kinda makes ya wonder. Me anyway.
@@jamescathcart4762 Another quick story. When I was a little kid my next door neighbor was in his 80s and had been a season ticket holder for the Yankees from like 1915 or something crazy like that. He would tell me stories about Babe Ruth. He said the images we know about Ruth where he seems a little overweight and all that were nothing like he really was. He said Ruth was by far the most athletic baseball player he had ever seen. So yeah it is difficult to compare eras.
Like this style of video man! Well done! I think SVB is the greatest American player of all time, but in order to claim the true goat title he needs several more titles in other games. Efren win MOT at Derby City 5 times! That’s hard to overcome
Well, Shane has 5 US Open 9-Ball titles, including 3 in a row in the middle, which is a much tougher tournament and so, a far more prestigious title than Derby City. Efren has 1 title there (plus one other finals appearance). And except for multiple Derby City titles (more besides the MOT-- and some Asian Cup team tournaments), Efren never defended any of his titles (or even got to the finals the next year to have a chance to defend them), and never repeated. An overlooked contender for having a GOAT career is Nick Varner. 8 world titles in several different games, and the first back-to-back US Open 9-ball winner.
@@phillipschuman4307 Nick Varner is certainly in the conversation! He was dominant in his era as well. I still have to give the edge to Efren. In his prime he was considered the best overall player because of his proficiency in every game. SVB is incredible and a generational talent for sure. He’s easily in the top 3-5 of all time. But if you ask the players it is almost unanimous who the goat is. As of right now Fedor and Filler are the ones I look at to give Efren a run for that title. SVB could as well but like I said I think he needs more titles in games like one pocket and banks.
I’ve often wondered who would win in a race to 100 between Shane and Efren,both being in dead stroke. That being said for now Efren is the goat, BUT Shane isn’t far behind .
Efren could not play in the states as he was from the Philippines, i.e. visa requirements - so it's a little like comparing apples and oranges in my opinion. If Efren had the chance to play in as much stateside top tier tournaments - as in the 80's, 90's and early 2000's most were stateside - I think Efren's resume would be even more impressive. They are both legends and good for the game but no disrespect to Shane, I will have to go with what most professional pool players regard as the GOAT - Efren!
How has Shane been doing in Mosconi cup lately? Seems like a brewing teenager after getting a lesson in humility. When there is a SVB tournament like Reyes cup.. we can address this again. I like SVB a lot, just has some big shoes to still fill.
SVB is a great player yes he is. But his Mosconi Cup history has been completely horrible. It's like he plays great all year then when the Cup comes around he crumbles. Not only that but I'm sure Efren is a very nice guy! I cant say the same for SVB has anyone tried to get an autograph from him he doesn't even make eye contact with you. And it's almost like he's annoyed that you asked. Worst PRO I've ever witnessed is Allison Fisher the one with out the tattoos. Saw her in February and a friend of mine asked for an autograph and she literally stuck her nose in the air and said absolutely not as she walked by and didn't even look back that was the most ignorant things I've ever witnessed in my life !
Great video. But you did not account that Efren was already in his prime prior to traveling to the US. Had he been born American, the narrative would be more like how Americans push the thought that Bobby Fischer is the GOAT in chess.
@@Amateur_Poolonly because of que tech. When I was 15 playing with a cheap que I was good. I couldn't do then what i can do today. I'm 48 now, and I use a custom made carbon shaft. I'm playing they best pool have ever. SVB is awesome, but I have watched him straight up strcach many times and miss when it is important. Like last year at the mosconi cup. I never seen Reyes misque the way Svb has.. Mosconi never misqued on tape that I know of. Neither did fatz. I think players like Reyes were more atune with there que and how it played.
Efren would never have jumped on a table after winning a match. Act like you've been there before. That's enough for me to take SVB out of GOAT conversation.
What's up with the soft voice??? I'd much rather hear this in your normal voice. Interesting though, he seems to be slipping a little bit IMHO. That being said, cool content, Josh!
That is my normal voice. Talking soft because I was so close to the mic (the best way to make the voice over sound clean). I'm a noob to this stuff. I'll work on it with the next one I do like this
@raymondphillips7762 that's a huge false equivalency. The break is 1 shot. If your goat status depends on that, then you're not the goat. Efren revolutionized pool and excelled at ALL the games. Go compare their highlight videos...
@@ojh7025 Shane has won titles in every pool discipline there is. Saying take away his break is like saying take away LeBron James athletic ability, and he would,t be as good. Do you think Shane didn’t work hard to get his break the way it is? He worked at it.
I would have thought of him as a possible goat, but since he punked out everyone else and played WPT events, when he said he wouldn't, I no longer care for him much
LOL.... ALWAYS at least 1.... funny how arrogant some of them are too. As if snooker is the ONLY cue sport in the world. What's extra funny about this one is that the title of the video says "the goat of POOL."
@@monalisa-bs4zs these guys play on 9ft tables. That is the correct size, for pool. As far as the pockets being smaller in snooker, the balls are also smaller
I don't think it is the pressure. I think SVB just does better on his own, in his own space. I don't think he actually enjoys the Mosconi Cup much. SVB has been sensational for a long time and today is still very very very good against top fields. Reyes played much of his career against weaker overall fields. The same goes for Strickland. If Strickland played in todays game when he was in his prime he would not win as often. The fields are incredibly deep today.
![Seungmin "그렇게, 천천히, 우리(As we are)" | [Stray Kids : SKZ-PLAYER]](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/kAzmhLHePqU/mqdefault.jpg)
Great video! But how can one discuss the pool GOAT without even mentioning the one, the only, Josh Powell??
LMAO.... This is the video idea that i've had for a long time. I'm just glad to see it through
Efren's legacy stands above all others because he actually changed the game of pool. He did things nobody did before. SVB is just as good a player when it comes to competition but Efren will always lead because of his innovation and creativeness on the table.
Efren revolutionized pool and he made Pool popular around the world. Who would have thought that a boring table game can be entertaining to watch? Back in the day everyone would watch tournaments because of Efren because he plays like crazy. He would always make crazy risky shots and make the crowd go nuts, smiles everywhere. The American pro players in the 70's thought that they are at the pinnacle of playing pool, then Efren came and humbled them all. Efren's impact and influence to the game was on a global scale and that's why he is the G.O.A.T.
Efren didnt change pool's popularity. Its the movies the Hustler amd the color of
Money who brought people to it in 2 big waves. Since them it's been on the decline and efren didnt change that.
He in fact even came 3rd in one pocket last year at 68 years old, beating the likes of pagulayan, filler etc. That's longevity and greatness right there
Exactly. One of the toughest tournaments with a field of 427 players.
I genuinely believe by the time his career is over, SVB will be the GOAT. Thanks for the great video Josh, love all of the content you put out 😁
They say the same about Lebron vs. Jordan. Not really turning out that way...
ORCULLO > SHANE VAN BOENING
SVB will never be GOAT that is an IGNORANT statement!
10 ball the race to 90
ruclips.net/video/DxU0HFJYYvY/видео.html
9 ball race to 120
ruclips.net/video/nGOKKCsMSD8/видео.html
THIS IS THE GOAT
ruclips.net/user/shortsE-UZFULnMW4
I think the GOAT is someone who changes the game. Not only just a great player. When Efren came, the game changed.
I say it's gonna be SVB for sure. He's already surpassed Reyes in career earning and titles and isn't anywhere close to his age. More importantly, he's a more well rounded player. Altho he has mentioned not liking jump cues and has said he thinks they're bad for the game, he still learned and has become a master of the technique.... unlike Reyes, who effectively just neglected it altogether. Shane is also known for his mastery of the break, another aspect of Efren's game that was neither strong or even noteworthy. I think SVB's accomplishments, his age and time remaining to achieve even more, as well as his willingness to learn and try to perfect all aspects of the game even if he doesn't like them, set him apart as the GOAT.
ORCULLO > SHANE VAN BOENING
SVB will never be GOAT that is an IGNORANT statement!
10 ball the race to 90
ruclips.net/video/DxU0HFJYYvY/видео.html
9 ball race to 120
ruclips.net/video/nGOKKCsMSD8/видео.html
THIS IS THE GOAT
ruclips.net/user/shortsE-UZFULnMW4
No one can take the title of G.O.A.T. from Reyes until they learn to kick and bank like Reyes.
I like efren he is the best at kick and bank shot but those shot represent a small part of the game.
@@GuiH-ss7ylStill a key part. If your opponent snookers you and you can’t kick out you’re in trouble. Efren went one step further, being able to not only kick, but kick to safety himself, by knowing which side of the object ball he would be hitting.
They represent a huge part of the game... if you get out of line, you have to kick/bank to a safety. when other people get out of line, they kick/bank safety you and you have to kick/bank out of the safety to a re-safe or you sell out... You cannot be the G.O.A.T. if you don't have that in your repertoire. Someone who can kick and bank with perfect speed control can dominate the game.
Kicking and backing is for when you get into trouble. Breaking is the key to pool, especially at the highest level. Typically whoever is breaking better wins. And SVB is the greatest breaker ever hands down. He’s also one of the best ever at runouts. That combo is definitely better than kicking and banking. Reyes is the best kicker ever. Hands down.
@@tjblackartist Earl Strickland banks better than Efren Reyes, yet, Efren Reyes beat Earl in a race to 120 when both players were at the top of their career. Yes, the break is the most important "shot" of the game; but after you break, it's all strategy, creativity, and knowledge. I've seen Reyes kick 6 rails to thin the target ball and leave his opponent a tough shot still. Show me another pool player who can do that.
I like the style of this video, a bit deeper subject than the light hearted videos you usually put out. Well done and your vocal tone was spot on, dont listen to that other guy. 😉
thanks, kris
Fedor is going to make this conversation nothing but a footnote.
Let’s see SVB play 3 cushion, balkline, rotation, bank pool and on and on. GTFO here.
The GOAT to me is who the greats say it is. Talk to the greats.
Imagine if Efren can travel freely without restrictions as early as his career started I bet he could've won more.
For sure!
Harold Worst was the best player of all time. Died of brain cancer decades ago. He won a championship with brain cancer a few weeks before he passed. All the old greats talk about him. Look him up
Efren can make insane shots on command, plus he plays multiple disciplines ,Shane would lose against Efren at 3cushion , balkline, that's my take..
I believe when you consider eight ball, nine ball, and 10 ball SVB has a strong argument for GOAT. But so does Reyes. When you consider eight ball, nine ball, 10 ball, three cushion, and one pocket then Reyes is the best because of the three cushion. There are many ways to be great. Reyes was very flashy and spectacular, but he needed to be because his game as very loose at times.
SVB is more steady and just gets it done. Plus, SVB is playing against much deeper fields than Reyes ever did. The fields are so deep today that just making it to the final 16 can be brutal. It really wasn't like that when Reyes was in his prime.
Let me say Efren has been my hero since 93, however Shane is very accomplished at all games., and with his break could give him the edge in most games. The only clear advantage Efren would have would be 1 pocket
plus they forgot, Efren's game is rotation. during his prime nobody can beat him in rotation. He only played 3 cushion because nobody wants to play with him anymore even giving them 25 points in rotation.
You can't even talk to ppl about this debate. SVB has more titles and has surpassed Efren in career prize money. Yet, ppl act like he isn't even in the conversation. I'm as big an Efren fan as anyone. But he's in the conversion, plain and simple.
The difference between Efren and Shane is that Efren plays/played to the crowd and Shane tunes it out.
"Amateurs need motivation, professionals just go to work. Legends make it look easy"
In my opinion a true GOAT has confidence and charisma flowing through their veins. It's that wry smile before they rearrange your neurons. Shane hits the target no one else can hit, but Efren hits the target no one else can see.
Simply put, Efren has been playing pool longer than Shane has even been alive, so the next GOAT has yet to claim the throne.
Ya, kind of like Alec "the Hurricane" Higgins in snooker.
Very nicely done Josh. Really enjoyed the video. Josh is the Amateur GOAT of You Tube! Lol.
Thanks, bro!
Shane won multiple bank tournaments, 1 pkt, 8 9 ball world champion, 5 times us open 10 ball,.. He is the best all around pool player of all time
I think Reyes is the OVERALL greatest billiard player of all time when you consider all of the games. But I do not think he is the best nine ball or 10 ball player of all time, or even the greatest eight ball player.
SVB could very well be the GOAT. Reyes WAS great, don't get me wrong, but he mostly played in an era that was not nearly as deep as it is today. Reyes would not come close to winning as often now as he did when he was in his prime.
I played in the Philippines for over 16 years. I have met Reyes many times and watched him in person. He is a good guy, a good ambassador for the sport but people say he is the GOAT because - well - that is what the narrative is. But if you look at it closely, he is probably not as far as eight, nine, and 10 ball.
Reyes is known for spectacular kicking and banking - mainly kicking - and he was. But he was also very sloppy and had to get himself out of trouble many times.
Reyes was great, SVB is still great. They both have an argument for GOAT.
great comment
Reyes made a greater impact because he was a non american playing what is considered to be an american game Reyes didn't only win tournaments but he essentially changed the game. The game is played today the way it is because of efren. Jump cues are here because of his greatness, people had to come up with ways to equalize the game. The way it's played today, kick shots, kick safeties, creative shot making, is because of him ,and he was a player who is multidisciplinary. He plays, 9,10,8 balls, rotation, one pocket, straight pool, balk line, carom, banks even snooker etc. He doesn't just play them well but even well enough to win them in tournaments. He isn't a one dimensional player. Plus almost all the highest prized tournaments have been won by him. He was a dominant, multidimensional, game changing player. That's what makes efren great plus his humility, this guy doesn't go on top of tables beating his chest after winning tournaments but simply raises his cue to acknowledge the fans and thank them and all that with his now all familiar sheepish smile.
I think hes falling off a little bit, I hope he comes back. That Mosconi performance was rough, him and Fedor.
For whatever Shane doesn’t play well in team events. I don’t think that hampers his overall greatness
here are my top 5 list (next generation of all time greats) not the GOAT
1st Joshua Filler
2nd Fedor Gorst
3rd Shane Van Boening
4th Ko Pin Chung
5th Francisco Sanchez Ruiz
I think Eklent Kaci or Aloysius Yapp are gonna replace Shane on this list.
The history of pool goes back more than a hundred yrs. The games played were predominantly balk line, 18.2, 3 cushion, banks , one pocket, & 14.1. 9 & 10 ball came a bit later. One pocket & 10 ball were played on 5x10 tables. The balls were ivory , then clay composition, there was a big cue ball used at times. There were few cue makers. Most of the cues were off the rack. The equipment is much better now than in the past. The popularity of the game is historically cyclic. Large cities like Chicago had hundreds of pool rooms, not a handful. The men wore suits, not jeans n t shirts like today. So the conditions were entirely different than today. Efren’s skill is undeniable & his accomplishments prove that as well as SVBs but to say either is the GOAT is premature & can not be proven w/out comparing them to the accomplishments of their predecessors.
This is a tough one.. can't make the same case as jordan/kobe/lebron.... cause pool is pool. rules have been the same forever. But I would still have to give the slight edge to Efren.. If SVB can keep up a high level into his 60's... then it might change, but man... prime Efren vs SVB.... now that would be something to watch...
This is a great conversation! You touch on some good points! But, it's so hard to say who's better nowadays! All these players are so damn good!
What about Earl Strickland? How can he not be in the conversation
This is like Jordan vs James in basketball. Efren is a veteran of the game and in his prime he would win any tournament he'd participate in today's world and he still is able to play now but won't dominate. When it comes to the greatest of ALL TIME, Efren is without question
Good effort on this one Josh. I think he’s got to put another 10 strong years in to be considered greater than Reyes.Reyes was so dominant.
ORCULLO > SHANE VAN BOENING
SVB will never be GOAT that is an IGNORANT statement!
10 ball the race to 90
ruclips.net/video/DxU0HFJYYvY/видео.html
9 ball race to 120
ruclips.net/video/nGOKKCsMSD8/видео.html
THIS IS THE GOAT
ruclips.net/user/shortsE-UZFULnMW4
Efron is by far the goat 🐐
Shane is still playing but he is no longer #1. Like SVB but he doesn't have the presence of Efren.
Earl Stricklands name deserves to be in the conversation , whether you like him or not , you can’t ignore him.
Efren and SVB are miles ahead of Strickland. Even Dennis Orcollo, whom I would consider the goat in 3rd place, is way ahead of Earl.
@ Earl won the US Open 5 times,, I respect your opinion though Dennis is great
The GOAT appellation is a misnomer. There is no GOAT. There is only the best in your lifetime.
As much as I love Efren, he played on much looser tables, and against fewer world class players in his prime. Not to mention his break was weak compared to most of his peers, and he simply never amassed the insane tournament record that Shane has. Even today, the top ranked players in the world apparently can't beat Shane in a race to 100. So, yes, there are some things Efren was better at, but Shane also has his advantages too. SVB will go down in history as the GOAT. He's just dominated for way to long and against much, much, tougher players from all over the world.
You made some very good points there, he could end up being the best!👍
If they were the same age, reyas would win .. As fas as now SVB is the current greatest..edit: this isnt a question they arw both the best.
Remember! Earl Strickland won the U.S. open 5 times! 3 different decades, and 2 different centuries! 1984, 1987, 1993, 1997, 2000!
That's right. Earl is actually more decorated in 9 ball than Efren.
@@cliffhart7673 And he said that Efren is the best.
@@BRAVO_FOUR_06-13 Earl was a Beast!
The early titles were against small fields without many top players.
@phillipschuman4307 yeah that's why there's an asterisk on the plaques next to Babe Ruth and Ty Cobb with an annotation that says, "didn't play the game recently".
Awesome video Josh. SVB & Earl, 2 of my all time favourite players.
Reyes had/had the best kick/bank/safety game in the business, but overall titles and results don’t match to the 2 boys.
At 3:30 I was mostly listening and only half watching and when I saw that shot I thot wait wtf happened and had to rewind to watch it again.
Mosconi is the greatest player of all time. There is unfortunately basically nothing of his play captured on film or video in his prime. Reyes wasn't really dominant against the players in his prime and you could make an argument that Sigel was more accomplished and better at 9 and certainly straight. Reyes is insanely good and good at all games. That is usually the knock against Mosconi but Bill Stroud has explained that Mosconi would give the top pros of his time the 5 out in 9 ball and win easily. Mosconi was also world class in 3 cushion billiards and in a tour with the world snooker champion won about 1/3 of his matches. if we include other billards style games Ronnie O'Sullivan is a better player and Cuilemans was essentially unbeatable in billiards for a quarter of a century. Efren is definitely in the conversation as is SVB. I talked once to a contemporary of Mosconi's while a tournament with Rempe, Mizerak and Hopkins was going on and he said that Mosconi was much much better than they were. He said Mosconi was so good and so fast that you didn't even realize he had just taken a hard shot. I know people will dismiss this because they want Efren to be the GOAT but he s not
No way on earth Mosconi could give Luther Wimpy Lassiter anything, Period! Luther would have robbed Willy. Nine ball for sure.
@@jamescathcart4762 I will say this. Somewhere around 1988 or 1989 there was a tournament in Willie's honor at Hard Times in Bellflower. Willie was there as well as a couple pros (Earl Strickland won it) and a couple of the old time players that had become a little famous from the Legends of Pool series on ESPN. So Cowboy Jimmy Moore is running around telling everyone that he wants to challenge Willie, but Willie wont play and that Willie can't beat him, bla bla bla. So he is just going on and on about how Willie is ducking him, and somehow it turned to Willie only being good at straight pool. So Moore has just been trashing Willie for a half hour and at some point they start talking about Wimpy would have destroyed Willie "back then" in 9 ball. To which Moore says something like "when Willie was in his prime?" and then proceeds to say that in his prime Lassiter couldn't have beat Willie in anything including 9 ball. He said some weight like the 7 out or more but I don't remember. He sort of goes back to trashing Willie and how he wouldn't lower himself to play other games but that if you pissed him off he would eventually play and destroy that person at any game. The Stroud comments, what Moore said and what an old timer said about Willie at East End billiards in Elizabeth are why I firmly believe Mosconi was the best. I mean I really only saw him play in his 70s but the people who saw him play in his prime all thought he was pretty much unbeatable. Just my opinion but based on things I have heard and read, If you have ever seen his instructional video made late in his life the ease at which he runs a couple racks of straight is astonishing.
@@johnnyp6202 Very interesting. I guess there are all the what ifs including Babe Ruth, Wilt Chamberlin and all the other greats. Kinda makes ya wonder. Me anyway.
@@jamescathcart4762 Another quick story. When I was a little kid my next door neighbor was in his 80s and had been a season ticket holder for the Yankees from like 1915 or something crazy like that. He would tell me stories about Babe Ruth. He said the images we know about Ruth where he seems a little overweight and all that were nothing like he really was. He said Ruth was by far the most athletic baseball player he had ever seen. So yeah it is difficult to compare eras.
Strong argument for best American player. Reyes , Portillo, pagalatan and a few guys from Asia u have never heard of alll have a claim for goat
There's no doubt that Earl Strickland was the second GOAT
Reyes
Like this style of video man! Well done! I think SVB is the greatest American player of all time, but in order to claim the true goat title he needs several more titles in other games. Efren win MOT at Derby City 5 times! That’s hard to overcome
Thanks, Chad!
Well, Shane has 5 US Open 9-Ball titles, including 3 in a row in the middle, which is a much tougher tournament and so, a far more prestigious title than Derby City. Efren has 1 title there (plus one other finals appearance).
And except for multiple Derby City titles (more besides the MOT-- and some Asian Cup team tournaments), Efren never defended any of his titles (or even got to the finals the next year to have a chance to defend them), and never repeated.
An overlooked contender for having a GOAT career is Nick Varner. 8 world titles in several different games, and the first back-to-back US Open 9-ball winner.
@@phillipschuman4307 Nick Varner is certainly in the conversation! He was dominant in his era as well. I still have to give the edge to Efren. In his prime he was considered the best overall player because of his proficiency in every game. SVB is incredible and a generational talent for sure. He’s easily in the top 3-5 of all time. But if you ask the players it is almost unanimous who the goat is. As of right now Fedor and Filler are the ones I look at to give Efren a run for that title. SVB could as well but like I said I think he needs more titles in games like one pocket and banks.
@@phillipschuman4307 Nick Varner and Dennis Orcollo would be easy picks to add to the GOAT list IMO
Benjamin Franklin is the greatest player of all time
I'm glad SVB is the modern day GOAT but even he knows who the true GOAT is. Although Efren praised Joshua Filler
I believe we are going to see the GOAT in 15 years from now with all his titles and that’s fedor gorst
I’ve often wondered who would win in a race to 100 between Shane and Efren,both being in dead stroke. That being said for now Efren is the goat, BUT Shane isn’t far behind .
Goat means greatest of ALL TIME.
Efren could not play in the states as he was from the Philippines, i.e. visa requirements - so it's a little like comparing apples and oranges in my opinion. If Efren had the chance to play in as much stateside top tier tournaments - as in the 80's, 90's and early 2000's most were stateside - I think Efren's resume would be even more impressive. They are both legends and good for the game but no disrespect to Shane, I will have to go with what most professional pool players regard as the GOAT - Efren!
The goat is the one who can eat the grass.
GOAT is such bs. Every sport fans & players are always comparing w/no knowledge of the past. There is no GOAT. Only the best in your lifetime.
I think svb is one of the best in the world for sure but no one anytime soon is going to get goat status over Efren Reyes
thank you sir for this video 🙏🏽🤓👍🏽♥️
🙏🏽♥️
How has Shane been doing in Mosconi cup lately? Seems like a brewing teenager after getting a lesson in humility. When there is a SVB tournament like Reyes cup.. we can address this again. I like SVB a lot, just has some big shoes to still fill.
his cup record is el horribles!
There is only one GOAT. But Shane deserves recognition and arguments for the title.
Just wish SVB would step it up in the Mosconi. It’s been terrible the last few years.
same... he always chokes at the cup
SVB is a great player yes he is. But his Mosconi Cup history has been completely horrible. It's like he plays great all year then when the Cup comes around he crumbles. Not only that but I'm sure Efren is a very nice guy! I cant say the same for SVB has anyone tried to get an autograph from him he doesn't even make eye contact with you. And it's almost like he's annoyed that you asked. Worst PRO I've ever witnessed is Allison Fisher the one with out the tattoos. Saw her in February and a friend of mine asked for an autograph and she literally stuck her nose in the air and said absolutely not as she walked by and didn't even look back that was the most ignorant things I've ever witnessed in my life !
Great video. But you did not account that Efren was already in his prime prior to traveling to the US. Had he been born American, the narrative would be more like how Americans push the thought that Bobby Fischer is the GOAT in chess.
Efren himself said he shot his best in the '70s, and never was as good later. So we missed Efren's true prime years (a scary thought!).
Mike Sigel would disagree. LOL.
As long as Efren and Ronnie are still alive, Shane VanChocking will never be the g.o.a.t. And he isn't the greatest of all time.
Ronnie? I know you're not talking about O'Sullivan, as the title says "goat of pool"
Efren is the GOAT. Go compare highlight videos...end of story
If u put Willie Mosconi, Girl strikland, Minnesota fats,and SVB in a tournament who would win. 😂😂
@@losoj30 today? SvB
@@Amateur_Poolonly because of que tech. When I was 15 playing with a cheap que I was good. I couldn't do then what i can do today. I'm 48 now, and I use a custom made carbon shaft. I'm playing they best pool have ever. SVB is awesome, but I have watched him straight up strcach many times and miss when it is important. Like last year at the mosconi cup. I never seen Reyes misque the way Svb has.. Mosconi never misqued on tape that I know of. Neither did fatz. I think players like Reyes were more atune with there que and how it played.
Efren would never have jumped on a table after winning a match. Act like you've been there before. That's enough for me to take SVB out of GOAT conversation.
🤔
Chris meling is pretty great.
What's up with the soft voice??? I'd much rather hear this in your normal voice. Interesting though, he seems to be slipping a little bit IMHO. That being said, cool content, Josh!
That is my normal voice. Talking soft because I was so close to the mic (the best way to make the voice over sound clean). I'm a noob to this stuff. I'll work on it with the next one I do like this
@Amateur_Pool as a former radio and VO guy, I can tell you there are other ways. HMU if you want to talk about it at some point.
Efren the GOAT is getting old and he barely plays that's the harsh truth
Take away Shane's break and tell me how great he is...
That’s what makes him a GOAT consideration. That’s like saying take away Efren’s kicking ability and creative play.
@raymondphillips7762 that's a huge false equivalency. The break is 1 shot. If your goat status depends on that, then you're not the goat. Efren revolutionized pool and excelled at ALL the games. Go compare their highlight videos...
@@ojh7025 Shane has won titles in every pool discipline there is. Saying take away his break is like saying take away LeBron James athletic ability, and he would,t be as good. Do you think Shane didn’t work hard to get his break the way it is? He worked at it.
@@raymondphillips7762 he never revolutionized the game. Like I said, go compare highlight videos
My point is that Efren did it all with little to no break while Shane wouldn't even be talked about without his break. Btw, Lebron is not the goat
Joshua filler
I would have thought of him as a possible goat, but since he punked out everyone else and played WPT events, when he said he wouldn't, I no longer care for him much
Neither played on correctly sized tables. The goat is playing?or played on traditional snooker tables or tables with traditional sized pockets.
There’s always one snooker comment 🙄
LOL.... ALWAYS at least 1.... funny how arrogant some of them are too. As if snooker is the ONLY cue sport in the world. What's extra funny about this one is that the title of the video says "the goat of POOL."
My comment is actually about correctly sized tables. Practising for life on tables with smaller pockets creates better players.
@@monalisa-bs4zs these guys play on 9ft tables. That is the correct size, for pool. As far as the pockets being smaller in snooker, the balls are also smaller
@@monalisa-bs4zs no it doesn’t. How many snooker players have won any major pool titles?
He hasn’t done it in the Mosconi Cup pressure seems to much there
I don't think it is the pressure. I think SVB just does better on his own, in his own space. I don't think he actually enjoys the Mosconi Cup much. SVB has been sensational for a long time and today is still very very very good against top fields. Reyes played much of his career against weaker overall fields. The same goes for Strickland. If Strickland played in todays game when he was in his prime he would not win as often. The fields are incredibly deep today.
@@jamesdavis8731that’s a food argument, but I disagree. Earl In his prime was almost unbeatable. He’d do very well now days
@@raymondphillips7762 Earl was a Beast!