Thank you for existing Ordnance Lab. I hope you guys do this stuff forever. We all have our curiosities. Mine just happen to be extremely dangerous so I can't legally satisfy them. But I sure am glad you guys can instead!
So, the cast iron ones are usually weighted training grenades. They are made for practice throwing before you toss a real one, or for things that just involve tossing them into a specific area. Sometimes we get boxes of fuses with blasting caps to use with them sometimes not. Once we had a bunch of the fuzes left over and people started jamming them into oranges and throwing them at each other, because Marines.
Filming this video was a legit pain as it rained on and off this trip. Between the constant rain, flooding, mud, and other issues, we were glad to be done with this video finally.
@@tafdiz good question. We have used TNT before in grenade tests. COVID has screwed us with logistics and getting TNT flake. We didn't have time to make enough for the video. So we had to use the next available explosive. It has nearly the same det velocity so it serves as a decent analog. Under better conditions, we would have casted TNT or comp B.
@@jlambuth 1. Demoralize a nation 2. Destabilize the nation 3. Crises: civil war or invasion 4. New normal... tanks in the streets YURI Bezmenov 1984 video. 1hr on RUclips 🤣 Most people don't know history so this is why it repeats often. We're in stage 3 with invasion on the border
@@jlambuth new to the channel so I'm not sure if you've done this already, but have you made/tested the Mk2 variant that was filled with smokeless powder?
I carried and threw quite a number of M-26 grenades in Vietnam. I also saw a guy throw a defective one. It hit a rock and didn’t explode but the thin sheet metal shell popped apart. Inside was a ball, a little smaller than a golf ball. The ball was the actual grenade, the lemon shaped shell was just a shell. It wouldn’t have fragmented. The ball itself was a tightly wound diamond shaped (in cross section) high carbon spring steel wire, with serrations every 5 mm or so. There were 960 of those serrations and the C-4 inside would shatter the very brittle wire into 961 sharp shards about the size of a grain of wheat, traveling at 4,000 to 5,000 feet per second, much faster than the 3,100 or 3,200 fps the bullets came out of an M16. I saw a Vietcong soldier go down after an M-26 blast. Later, after all the shooting stopped I went over to look at his lifeless body. He was unmarked, except for a single tiny hole in his forehead. The M-26 grenade was a very effective weapon.
neato, saw a history channel bit as a kid that described the m67 as having a very similar fragmentation mantle, makes me wonder if those baseballs are actually full to the shell with frag and explosives or if they're another casing for a golfball that's just more convenient to pack and throw.
Since Cuba is in the news again, you guys should look into Che Guevaras "M-16" mortar/launcher. Just a simple single shot 16ga shotgun that launches molotovs like mortars. They claimed it was super effective and was very cheap to make.
In the army we were told to go prone, face in the dirt, head towards the grenade. The school of thought was that the frag and concussive force usually goes upward in a wide cone shape, and if any frag should hit you, your helmet was what you want it to hit. This is a good proof of concept
Same but we wore plastic level 3 face shield on our helmet we did that so when a grenade was thrown we go prone and instead of putting our faces in the ground the face shield would help protect from fragments and see where enemy might be
Wait, wait. So you're saying that when a grenade goes off it doesn't have the power to completely level a house like in the movies? 👀 Imagine that. Hollywood gets weapons wrong again. Who'd have thunk it. Like completely silent suppressors, or super long firing sub machineguns. 🤣 Great video guys. Thanks for sharing it. Please let Buddy know I bow before his absolute supreme power. 😎
How about replicating the Glasmine 43 from WW2.. It would be interesting to see how detectable and effective they were. Additionally the wooden Schu-mine 42 for the same reasons.
Did a tour of a mine in Lead, SD and they stated that in WW2 their machine shop converted to making grenade bodies for the Army only to find out that their production of the design was 'too strong' so the hulls were used as dummy grenades and not filled. Seems there is a science to not just the design but metallurgy of grenade hulls.
When he said made of junk metal, they meant it. So all that crap that has slag, dirt, glass, and other things you're throwing out would be used. Cast it into the halves and then bind them together. Think of it as the hotdog meat of metal-making. Don't look up what is in hotdogs now... LOL.
@@robertthomas5906 at least in Europe, named types of sausage like Wiener sausage or Falukorv (Swedish type of "doctors sausage") has a strict quality and recipie adherence control.
@@SonsOfLorgar Hope it stays that way. Here in the states when we buy something that says Extra Virgin Olive Oil, who knows what is in the container? Especially if it's $5 for a liter. I know that's crap oil. The real stuff should be more like $35 a liter. The cheap stuff often isn't even good enough for a lamp.
Back when I was a kid, we had M36 grenades, the user had to prime them, by inserting the fuses, choosing what delay you wanted. It was much safer than the factory primed grenades, which sometimes had an instantaneous fuse ( those instantaneous grenades cost ).
I recall from basic training at Ft Dix in 1963 serving as a grenade demonstrater, the M-26 had or has a coil of spring steel inside it that is serrated so it breaks up and scatters bits of steel in it's blast radius.Very effective.
i wonder if the next time you do explosive fragmentation testing if you could get one of those clear block of ballistic gel and set it up right like one of the orange target just so we can see how deep a lot of that fragmentation would really go.
As a child my neighbor use to modify surplus store shells, and go fishing with them in our neighborhood pond. He was not allowed over to our house but me and my brother would watch him. Last Christmas, 30 years later, I ran across this same person, he had a prosthetic arm, and half his body was melted. Didn’t even need to ask,
Ordinance Lab, make your targets out of Sheetrock, much cheaper than even economy plywood. We used Sheetrock in the Marine Corps to test the coverage pattern of air-burst artillery fire. It worked beautifully.
You should stake a large circular parachute to the ground and blow it up with an air mover, kinda like we used to do in the gym when we were kids. Set a grenade off on the inside and really see where every fragment pierces the parachute. Would be cool to see
I was at a Goodwill when up popped a live pineapple grenade. It was in a bin ready to be put on the shelf when a customer reached in and grabbed it. He was walking around the store for a few minutes with it before a former military employee recognized it and took it from him. I got a nice K-Bar type knife dated 1967 and some loaded magazines. The cops took it from the store.
I believe that shrapnel material is really important in terms of the element/compound. Copper is known to be effective against hardened targets. Copper shielding tape for electronics can be wrapped around almost anything you want
You have just been visited by the "Hidden Bummer Factor"!! Basically, it is a theory that any job will take at least twice as long to complete as your boss says it will, that you will not have the required tool to complete your task, and nobody will own up to the fact that they are the ones that left the needed tool in the rented care you used last week.
I saw that comment and he is wrong we can’t do it in our back yards because we are not licensed or now really anything about that stuff love your channel and I don’t care if the targets where used I just like learning more and seeing the explosion
What a lot of people often forget is, that a group of injured men are more beneficial than one or two dead, because the others have to take care of them and take them out, which makes the whole unit more vulnerable and less effective!
Yeah, until they are actually in combat and have to prioritise fighting over saving already heavily wounded (likely basically dead men). Maybe good tactics against a green unit, but not veteran units.
@@rameynoodles152 You seem to believe the MSMedia (especially Newspaper) Normandy type of actions! One of the military analysts on the National Interest said it how it would go down, and I agree with him! To destroy any of the important military locations (headquarters, bases, airfields, depots) or bigger military forces, they don't need to put one man in harms way, and they can use land or sea based missiles which would end any hostilities before they even begin, and the special forces, mercenaries and Nazis will be where they have been in 2014/15 as well, far away from the battleground. Which they left before sh*t went down! How do we know that you ask? This war was very good documented with GoPro's, and they didn't get any of them in the two big battles because they were not there anymore! So how is the current situation around the Ukrainian Military in the East? It's worse than in 2014/15 and if a bigger operation starts, you will see the majority going without weapons over or leave towards their homes! The Clownshow in Kiev is best pictured with the situation, it's almost at the point of "Hitler was in beginning of March 1945, when he was talking about Troops and people who are no longer there", but Zelensky and Poroshenko are different, they are trying to get as much cash out before they leave, and weapons who won't change anything at all, but they can be sold and this is whats going to happen! But the first Analyse you can read yourself, a Marine General wrote about it, and he is absolutely right! No Normandy, No Street fights or anything like that! The people are fed up with sh*t show in Kiev!
The case of the m26 was not the source of fragmentation, there was a spiral wound notched stainless wire around the charge . That's why the case is sheet metal . If the hulls you are using don't have the fragmentation sleeve then your tests won't have any real world results .
I know that when I was in the army back in 90. At the live fire grenade range, I found a few chunks of shrapnel that looked like it was laser cut into a pattern to help in fragmentation and dispersion on the inside.
Cheap self-adhesive shelf paper could be considered really big tape. Just saying... it would let you present a completely clean target surface every time, and it's waterproof. Could even wrap a scrapped ironing board with it, set it on it's end, and have a human-ish sized self-standing target that can also serve as a range table in a pinch.
Great video as always. This sort of confirms my own belief that grenades aren't a sure thing. Probably 10x more useful indoors where the concussive force will be amplified but the shrapnel is literally hit or miss.
Depends on whether or not you want to also set things on fire as well because I have heard of some fragmentation grenades that also have little tiny flecks of Willie Pete in them
There's two main types of grenades. Offensive and defensive, Most grenades you'll see are defensive and are meant to maim, wound, and potentially kill and act as an area of denial device. An offensive grenade would be like the german potato masher or stick grenades which are packed with enough high explosives to create a blast wave that within a certain distance will turn your insides into meat jello. They're meant to kill and are usually a danger to their handlers as well due to their nature.
@@Shinzon23 it's my understanding that the use of incendiary devices as a weapon (as opposed to as an illumination device) is a war crime. Although I'm not really sure anymore, Ive seen videos of WP artillery shells being used during the day and I can't imagine the goal was to make the area brighter. But WP definitely isn't being used inside of off./def. hand grenades. Some smoke grenades do use white phosphorus tho
@@Shinzon23 WP shells and grenades are exclusively designed as instant visual smoke consealment, it does not hide IR signatures more than the instant it goes off. That said, smoke is not only used for screening, but also to blind, the latter is usually done by mortars or howitzers with non-WP smoke as it's a firemission where 1-2 pieces in a 4 piece battery fires smoke while the others fire impact or airburst HE/FRAG, all of them directly on top of a designated target gridref. /120mm Mortar crew
@@SonsOfLorgar they're also used to set things on fire and make people scream,run around, and die painfully if that sort of thing is required as well. Seen plenty of footage in which smoke shells are used to an absurd degree which is not using it to smoke things you're using it to set whatever they're fired at on fire as well...
Did you add a fragmentation coil to your “clone correct” m26? If not how is it clone correct? Obviously sheet metal is more clone correct than cast iron but how can you say you’re testing fragmentation without a fragmentation coil?
The F1 grenade is obviously nicknamed Limonka. The people who made the nickname possibly never tasted pineapple. Lemons were available in the soviet union though, especially before Christmas. Lucky ones were able to buy bananas and oranges too. In Bulgaria there was a saying: Портокалите у нас идват само с дядо Мраз.
Great video. I really enjoyed it, because i had like three or four of those training grenades as a kid and always wonderef if they were converted by drilling a hole in the bottom and if they could just be welded up. Also, if you test something with fragmentation again, can you put up some Gallon Jugs filled with water around it? Like one "ring" at 5 m, another at 10 m, etc.. It would be interesting to see the hydrostatic shock if they get hit, to kind of get a feeling of the energy they contain. Once again thanks for the great work. Keep it up. PS: After thinking about it, could you also compare the fragmentation pattern of an elevated (like 50cm) grenade and an grenade that lies on the ground?
Hollywood directors should be forced to watch this video if they want to depict using hand grenades in movies. They seem to think you can blow a car 10 feet in the air using a grenade.
Actually there's nothing surprising about grenade with more explosives having smaller effective radius. F1 is a defensive grenade. They are heavier have less explosives and produce lots of heavier fragments that can fly further. Far enough to hit the soldier who throws the grenade so he has to be in cover - that's why it's called defensive. Offensive grenades like M26 are lighter but have more explosives. Their shrapnel is smaller and can't fly that far but the explosion is stronger. And you can throw it and mostly be safe without getting into cover. Soviets too had various offensive and defensive grenades with similar weights of the shell and explosives according to these two types.
It would be great if you guys could do a meat/ballistics gel comparison of the fragmentation of grenades or other devices,great footage again guys, thanks.
Cool vid. Somehow, I had never heard of this model grenade. In the 80s, I had a surplus M57 frag and a "pineapple" (forgot M designation) hull and practiced throwing each. As a teen I presumed war with Russia was imminent thanks to the cold war looming over our heads. Then the movie Red Dawn came out but, I digress. Great channel!
My older brother brought a deactivated pineapple hull back home with him from a foreign exchange student high school year in Sacramento CA during the late '80ies, I never got the idea to practice throwing it though, despite the Soviet Union beeing less than 6h away by boat eastwards and Poland or DDR about 8h by boat due south... I even have early memories of greeting Polish portrait painting "student tourists" at the door when I was a primary school kid. It's only as an adult that I found out that they most likely were Polish GRU intelligence, as my father was a serving Costal artillery staff Lt. Col. at the time...
Umm, the second M26 style grenade may've been made from sheet steel like the genuine, but it lacked the interior coil of pre segmented wire that the case covers, that's what causes the fragments in the M26 from memory.
So if one was to go off, is your best bet to lay on the ground, because it seems like the shrapnel goes upwards, but still can’t forget about that concussion effect.
I don't know what surplus stores you shop at, but all the ones I've been to in the last few years only sold fake 'nades that were solid in the center. I haven't seen de-wat units since I was a kid.
I've seen the fake ones with drilled bottoms, I picked one up and it was like aluminum'ish pot metal, definitely not steel, or if they were it had to be some exceptionally low density steel alloy probably with air pockets. I haven't seen solid ones before. They were like $10 or maybe a little less, cute paperweight I guess but being so light weight I'd debate if they would make as good of a paperweight as the heavy steel ones (which would be both great for workouts and paperweights). I guess they look cool, but I don't think they would be useful for anything other than decorative anyways. I think more practical would be to drill a puck of scrap metal, or simply a puck lock and weld the open side as those are ridiculously heavy and thick steel with a drilled out core for the locking core which is easily removable, but I don't know, maybe those are too thick? I also don't think the pattern would be that great, but maybe something interesting for someone with an 07 explosives license or whatever it is. Those puck locks are the same cost or lower in the $8-$10 range and much stronger steel, might make for a cool vid.
@@jakegarrett8109 To be fair, original gen 1 grenades were made of cast iron (F1's, "pineapples", etc.) and gen 2's (lemons, etc.) were made from the cheapest sheet metal that govt's could get in bulk and had a fragmenting coil inside, grenades don't have to be made from 50's Cadillac bodies and handrolled against the skulls of commie POW's to be lethal * enough *, and also we need to remember that half of the military grenades were designed without fragmentation at all, relying solely on concussive blast to injure/maim/kill. Pipebombs usually use shitty iron pipe, cricket bombs are made from mini CO2 canisters used for BB guns, put a sufficient amount of flash powder in cardboard and wrap it with nails sharpened to a needle point on both ends and you got old school cherry poppers with a cherry on top, dynamite is nothing more than nitroglycerin-soaked dirt stuffed in a cardboard tube, the list could go on forever. My point is, I'd be willing to bet that those pot metal bitches would do a number if filled with the right stuff, stuck on the end of an inch diameter piece of dowel rod and chucked into an Antifa shieldwall.
A very interesting video that shows the real function and not Hollywood nonsense. For example, there is no way an M18 Claymore could be detonated on the other side of a police riot shield and the person holding the shield not be blown to pieces by the backblast. Touching off 1.5 pounds of C4 inches away from your head and not being killed is ridiculous.
I hope you guys do more videos with M 80s this past Fourth of July my friend got a hold of a couple decided to put it inside of a old monitor and got a face full of glass with one piece completely going through his cheek luckily he didn’t lose any body parts and still has his vision
Is there any chance you guys could test the effects of something like a MK3 concussion grenade and the effects of overpressure in the future? I remember Mythbusters used these "Shock Stickers" that would break once a certain amount of shock or G-Force hit them. Would require some sort of enclosed structure, which might be tricky, but if someone has an old shed or something they don't mind potentially being blown up...
This I want to know also. Having a grenade stand like that is basically like flipping a coin and having land on its edge and not moving. It might happen, but not often enough to care about the result. I would think the lethality would be massively improved from laying the grenade on its side, because standing it basically means you have a cone of shrapnel moving upwards only. In standing mode I would think the lower half shrapnel cone plows into the ground, the middle ring shrapnel moves at ankle height until it hits anything higher than ankle height and the top half shrapnel being left to do almost all the damage work.
You should make a hollow steel front door filled with tannerite... leave the interior side intact and put score lines on the exterior so the exterior side will fragment like a giant claymore....
I guess that they were playing with what they had. The video is about comparing 'fake' grenades that were loaded with explosives, not comparing the real grenades. Unless I'm missing something... (?)
@@ChevTecGroup Yeah, I re-read the info and agree. The hull not containing that is important, since that is a key factor of the lethality of the real grenade. I think they're saying this is what would be expected from a homemade copy but implies it to be similar to the real deal. My guess is the thing they used was as accurate as they could get but they should have clarified that better. Yall Take Care, John
How much stronger is comp b then tnt? These are the bits of info lacking from this channel. I understand there are some things you can get into, such as how to manufacture etc, but you are able to tell us the difference in power between explosives
I actually have a F1 I don’t have the fuse for it, but I have a brown cap for it. It did pretty good in this video despite having less power than most of the grenades I guess that’s why they’re still being used in wars across the world
I’m surprised you guys used the lemon style surplus store hull. Out of any of them, I’ve always thought the “pineapple” style grenades were more prevalent. I wonder if they would have better fragmentation too?
Apparently testing showed that Mills Bomb or "pineapple" style castiron bodied grenades rarely fracture along the grooves cast into the body, tending to randomly fragment instead. I personally would have guessed that castiron would have mostly turned into dust by the force of the explosion, just because of the well-known brittleness of castiron.
@@dj1NM3 I have a completely empty & inert WW2 British Mills Bomb. It survived being thrown around by mini-me. One story I heard about this pattern was the fracture issue was known, but not redesigned as it helped with grip. Also the US troops didn't like them, or the official overarm/cricket style bowling throw. Which I guess is why the US pattern evolved to more of a baseball size and shape.
The American MII grenade started off with a detonator and tnt filling. It gave inferior fragmentation supposedly. Supposedly the grenade switched to a plain fuse entering the charge material which was changed to 'EC Blank Powder.' That must have been a US Army technical specification. There is no further information on that material that is easily found. Supposedly the design changes gave superior fragmentation.
was wondering if you could do one showing what happens if you glue a bunch of ball bearings to the outer casing... have seen this in movies but would like an expert opinion😁👍🇺🇸
Forgot the frag ribbon on the inside. From everything I've heard from guys who have time with all three, was that the 26 produced more consistent casualties than the 33 and later, the 67
My father was a welder by trade and had got me a surplus grenade one year. I asked him to weld up the bottom to make it more realistic. Still sits on my desk. Is my dog going to get shot?
Yes, but I think those are more commonly planted by the AFT (if they do prosecute you for a planted grenade, check the serial numbers, apparently they may forget to scratch those off when they plant one that's registered to the ATF)
I don't know if you did this, but if the grenade was wrapped in barb wire or had a some more junk metal taped to the grenade, how much worse would it be? I would love to see it.
the cast iron hull tend to break into large pieces of fragmentation thus makes it less likely to do actual damage, for training purpose I think they are fine
How would you compare those detonations to a real production M67? It’s hard to tell from the camera and the microphone, but it seems to me those were so much weaker than a real M67.
Thank you for existing Ordnance Lab. I hope you guys do this stuff forever. We all have our curiosities. Mine just happen to be extremely dangerous so I can't legally satisfy them. But I sure am glad you guys can instead!
I usually launch salute firework shells at firework clubs for some pyro satisfaction lol
Couldn't have said it better myself
I second this
You can always do the work to be licensed and you can do the same, but if you haven't got the experience, then get it 😀
So, the cast iron ones are usually weighted training grenades. They are made for practice throwing before you toss a real one, or for things that just involve tossing them into a specific area. Sometimes we get boxes of fuses with blasting caps to use with them sometimes not. Once we had a bunch of the fuzes left over and people started jamming them into oranges and throwing them at each other, because Marines.
thats one way to get your vit c
sounds like fun
Hey Ordnance Lab, we can help with your targets for explosive analysis!
Y'all gained a sub for that. Lulz
^^^
Yeah he totally needs to take you up on that offer that would be way more cooler to see.
👍bump
@Ordnance Lab
I'd take 'm up one that one !!
Should be verryyy interessting.
Filming this video was a legit pain as it rained on and off this trip. Between the constant rain, flooding, mud, and other issues, we were glad to be done with this video finally.
Sounds like Florida issues. If it isn't raining something or somebody is going to screw it up for you.
@@tafdiz good question. We have used TNT before in grenade tests. COVID has screwed us with logistics and getting TNT flake. We didn't have time to make enough for the video. So we had to use the next available explosive. It has nearly the same det velocity so it serves as a decent analog. Under better conditions, we would have casted TNT or comp B.
@@jlambuth
1. Demoralize a nation
2. Destabilize the nation
3. Crises: civil war or invasion
4. New normal... tanks in the streets
YURI Bezmenov 1984 video. 1hr on RUclips 🤣
Most people don't know history so this is why it repeats often. We're in stage 3 with invasion on the border
@@jlambuth new to the channel so I'm not sure if you've done this already, but have you made/tested the Mk2 variant that was filled with smokeless powder?
@@salthack we haven't but we def can
“Good job butterfly”
Butterfly: WHAT?!
Fortunately, we have an insurance plan that covers butterfly incidents.
@@jlambuth 👈🏻👈🏻
I carried and threw quite a number of M-26 grenades in Vietnam. I also saw a guy throw a defective one. It hit a rock and didn’t explode but the thin sheet metal shell popped apart. Inside was a ball, a little smaller than a golf ball. The ball was the actual grenade, the lemon shaped shell was just a shell. It wouldn’t have fragmented. The ball itself was a tightly wound diamond shaped (in cross section) high carbon spring steel wire, with serrations every 5 mm or so. There were 960 of those serrations and the C-4 inside would shatter the very brittle wire into 961 sharp shards about the size of a grain of wheat, traveling at 4,000 to 5,000 feet per second, much faster than the 3,100 or 3,200 fps the bullets came out of an M16. I saw a Vietcong soldier go down after an M-26 blast. Later, after all the shooting stopped I went over to look at his lifeless body. He was unmarked, except for a single tiny hole in his forehead. The M-26 grenade was a very effective weapon.
Hard to know what to say but thanks for sharing!
neato, saw a history channel bit as a kid that described the m67 as having a very similar fragmentation mantle, makes me wonder if those baseballs are actually full to the shell with frag and explosives or if they're another casing for a golfball that's just more convenient to pack and throw.
Since Cuba is in the news again, you guys should look into Che Guevaras "M-16" mortar/launcher. Just a simple single shot 16ga shotgun that launches molotovs like mortars. They claimed it was super effective and was very cheap to make.
In the army we were told to go prone, face in the dirt, head towards the grenade. The school of thought was that the frag and concussive force usually goes upward in a wide cone shape, and if any frag should hit you, your helmet was what you want it to hit. This is a good proof of concept
Same but we wore plastic level 3 face shield on our helmet we did that so when a grenade was thrown we go prone and instead of putting our faces in the ground the face shield would help protect from fragments and see where enemy might be
Air Force teaches the same, but with feet towards the grenade. The idea being that feet aren't critical for life, but head and organs are.
Oh shit it’s my favorite RUclipsr SHEEPDOG OPERATOR DESTRUCTION FARM
You know that butterfly went on to brag about how bad ass it is. Probably started wearing axe body spray, tank tops, and only drinks Jagerbombs.
Wait, wait. So you're saying that when a grenade goes off it doesn't have the power to completely level a house like in the movies? 👀
Imagine that. Hollywood gets weapons wrong again. Who'd have thunk it. Like completely silent suppressors, or super long firing sub machineguns. 🤣
Great video guys. Thanks for sharing it. Please let Buddy know I bow before his absolute supreme power. 😎
I know! My entire world is ruined. Especially after watching a ton of 80s action movies.
Ordinance lab 1 year from now: HOMEMADE ICBM BETTER THAN ORIGINAL
How about replicating the Glasmine 43 from WW2.. It would be interesting to see how detectable and effective they were. Additionally the wooden Schu-mine 42 for the same reasons.
Did a tour of a mine in Lead, SD and they stated that in WW2 their machine shop converted to making grenade bodies for the Army only to find out that their production of the design was 'too strong' so the hulls were used as dummy grenades and not filled.
Seems there is a science to not just the design but metallurgy of grenade hulls.
"too strong" grenade hulls could be used as flashbangs, I'd think.
When he said made of junk metal, they meant it. So all that crap that has slag, dirt, glass, and other things you're throwing out would be used. Cast it into the halves and then bind them together. Think of it as the hotdog meat of metal-making.
Don't look up what is in hotdogs now... LOL.
@@robertthomas5906 at least in Europe, named types of sausage like Wiener sausage or Falukorv (Swedish type of "doctors sausage") has a strict quality and recipie adherence control.
@@SonsOfLorgar Hope it stays that way. Here in the states when we buy something that says Extra Virgin Olive Oil, who knows what is in the container? Especially if it's $5 for a liter. I know that's crap oil. The real stuff should be more like $35 a liter. The cheap stuff often isn't even good enough for a lamp.
Back when I was a kid, we had M36 grenades, the user had to prime them, by inserting the fuses, choosing what delay you wanted. It was much safer than the factory primed grenades, which sometimes had an instantaneous fuse ( those instantaneous grenades cost ).
I recall from basic training at Ft Dix in 1963 serving as a grenade demonstrater, the M-26 had or has a coil of spring steel inside it that is serrated so it breaks up and scatters bits of steel in it's blast radius.Very effective.
You should try exploding the grenades on a hard surface like concrete or metal, so we can see the frag pattern without mud spraying the tgt
i wonder if the next time you do explosive fragmentation testing if you could get one of those clear block of ballistic gel and set it up right like one of the orange target just so we can see how deep a lot of that fragmentation would really go.
As a child my neighbor use to modify surplus store shells, and go fishing with them in our neighborhood pond. He was not allowed over to our house but me and my brother would watch him.
Last Christmas, 30 years later, I ran across this same person, he had a prosthetic arm, and half his body was melted. Didn’t even need to ask,
Ordinance Lab, make your targets out of Sheetrock, much cheaper than even economy plywood. We used Sheetrock in the Marine Corps to test the coverage pattern of air-burst artillery fire. It worked beautifully.
You should stake a large circular parachute to the ground and blow it up with an air mover, kinda like we used to do in the gym when we were kids. Set a grenade off on the inside and really see where every fragment pierces the parachute. Would be cool to see
I was at a Goodwill when up popped a live pineapple grenade. It was in a bin ready to be put on the shelf when a customer reached in and grabbed it. He was walking around the store for a few minutes with it before a former military employee recognized it and took it from him. I got a nice K-Bar type knife dated 1967 and some loaded magazines. The cops took it from the store.
How the hell does a live pineapple grenade end up a ta goodwill? your sure it wasn't one of those inert repros or an inert surplus one?
@@PilotTed Mate, they end up in all kinds of places. People die, relies or the city clean out the house and ship everything to Goodwill
People love giving that man all their old stuff. It's a business for profit.
@@PilotTed Nope. I asked the cops later and he confirmed it was real and live. The junk stores get all sorts of arms.
@@SomervilleBob Jesus.... now I wish I worked at a goodwill, would have kept that one for my self lol. For legal reasons that was a joke....
I believe that shrapnel material is really important in terms of the element/compound. Copper is known to be effective against hardened targets. Copper shielding tape for electronics can be wrapped around almost anything you want
You have just been visited by the "Hidden Bummer Factor"!! Basically, it is a theory that any job will take at least twice as long to complete as your boss says it will, that you will not have the required tool to complete your task, and nobody will own up to the fact that they are the ones that left the needed tool in the rented care you used last week.
I was actually going to ask this question earlier. Nice!
I saw that comment and he is wrong we can’t do it in our back yards because we are not licensed or now really anything about that stuff love your channel and I don’t care if the targets where used I just like learning more and seeing the explosion
Yeah fuck that guy, even if he’s licensed, no reason to rain on OL parade.
No worries, he unsubd and i subed. Felt like im missing out on this stuff that apparently everybody has in their back yard.
I get so excited when I see a new Ordnance Lab upload this is probably my favorite channel on YT
0:30 sounds like you need to make batch numbers or serials so you know what the serial break is for a bad batch.
What a lot of people often forget is, that a group of injured men are more beneficial than one or two dead, because the others have to take care of them and take them out, which makes the whole unit more vulnerable and less effective!
Yeah, until they are actually in combat and have to prioritise fighting over saving already heavily wounded (likely basically dead men). Maybe good tactics against a green unit, but not veteran units.
@@rameynoodles152 You seem to believe the MSMedia (especially Newspaper) Normandy type of actions!
One of the military analysts on the National Interest said it how it would go down, and I agree with him!
To destroy any of the important military locations (headquarters, bases, airfields, depots) or bigger military forces, they don't need to put one man in harms way, and they can use land or sea based missiles which would end any hostilities before they even begin, and the special forces, mercenaries and Nazis will be where they have been in 2014/15 as well, far away from the battleground. Which they left before sh*t went down!
How do we know that you ask?
This war was very good documented with GoPro's, and they didn't get any of them in the two big battles because they were not there anymore!
So how is the current situation around the Ukrainian Military in the East?
It's worse than in 2014/15 and if a bigger operation starts, you will see the majority going without weapons over or leave towards their homes!
The Clownshow in Kiev is best pictured with the situation, it's almost at the point of "Hitler was in beginning of March 1945, when he was talking about Troops and people who are no longer there", but Zelensky and Poroshenko are different, they are trying to get as much cash out before they leave, and weapons who won't change anything at all, but they can be sold and this is whats going to happen!
But the first Analyse you can read yourself, a Marine General wrote about it, and he is absolutely right! No Normandy, No Street fights or anything like that!
The people are fed up with sh*t show in Kiev!
@@cheguevara3392 What the actual fuck are you talking about? We were talking about how effective wounding soldiers is versus killing them outright.
I Appreciate the work that goes into making these videos, scary how far fragments *can* go
Just wondering if you added a fragmentation core in these like many defensive grenades have or if it was just a straight load of HEs and a cap?
07:16
That butterfly is so getting laid after this near death experience.
I would like to see the dutch mini grenades sometimes carried by the sog guys in nam. Thanks for all the fun!!!
The case of the m26 was not the source of fragmentation, there was a spiral wound notched stainless wire around the charge . That's why the case is sheet metal . If the hulls you are using don't have the fragmentation sleeve then your tests won't have any real world results .
I know that when I was in the army back in 90. At the live fire grenade range, I found a few chunks of shrapnel that looked like it was laser cut into a pattern to help in fragmentation and dispersion on the inside.
Well done butterfly well done... to this day the butterfly still has tinnitus
As a suggestion, consider setting up a concrete or earthen blast room and put up replaceable plywood walls around the perimeter.
Cheap self-adhesive shelf paper could be considered really big tape. Just saying... it would let you present a completely clean target surface every time, and it's waterproof. Could even wrap a scrapped ironing board with it, set it on it's end, and have a human-ish sized self-standing target that can also serve as a range table in a pinch.
I was just googling this topic last week. I have the cast iron trainer and I wanted to learn more about it. Great vid thumbs up.
Great video as always. This sort of confirms my own belief that grenades aren't a sure thing. Probably 10x more useful indoors where the concussive force will be amplified but the shrapnel is literally hit or miss.
Depends on whether or not you want to also set things on fire as well because I have heard of some fragmentation grenades that also have little tiny flecks of Willie Pete in them
There's two main types of grenades.
Offensive and defensive, Most grenades you'll see are defensive and are meant to maim, wound, and potentially kill and act as an area of denial device.
An offensive grenade would be like the german potato masher or stick grenades which are packed with enough high explosives to create a blast wave that within a certain distance will turn your insides into meat jello.
They're meant to kill and are usually a danger to their handlers as well due to their nature.
@@Shinzon23 it's my understanding that the use of incendiary devices as a weapon (as opposed to as an illumination device) is a war crime. Although I'm not really sure anymore, Ive seen videos of WP artillery shells being used during the day and I can't imagine the goal was to make the area brighter. But WP definitely isn't being used inside of off./def. hand grenades. Some smoke grenades do use white phosphorus tho
@@Shinzon23 WP shells and grenades are exclusively designed as instant visual smoke consealment, it does not hide IR signatures more than the instant it goes off.
That said, smoke is not only used for screening, but also to blind, the latter is usually done by mortars or howitzers with non-WP smoke as it's a firemission where 1-2 pieces in a 4 piece battery fires smoke while the others fire impact or airburst HE/FRAG, all of them directly on top of a designated target gridref.
/120mm Mortar crew
@@SonsOfLorgar they're also used to set things on fire and make people scream,run around, and die painfully if that sort of thing is required as well.
Seen plenty of footage in which smoke shells are used to an absurd degree which is not using it to smoke things you're using it to set whatever they're fired at on fire as well...
Did you add a fragmentation coil to your “clone correct” m26? If not how is it clone correct? Obviously sheet metal is more clone correct than cast iron but how can you say you’re testing fragmentation without a fragmentation coil?
What is the fragmentation coil?
@@ChevTecGroup thanks for the detailed description. I never knew this but I wasn’t in the military either. You sound like you were
@@dirk480 Notched High tensile wire to be totally correct so much harder and fractures like tool steel.
You guys did great! Appreciate the work you put in.
I think thay have done that in a earlier vid
That butterfly is an absolute badass lol
I am curious, the M 26 was supposed to have a coil of notched hardened steel wire inside. Did yoir reproduction have the same??
Wondering this too
The F1 grenade is obviously nicknamed Limonka. The people who made the nickname possibly never tasted pineapple. Lemons were available in the soviet union though, especially before Christmas. Lucky ones were able to buy bananas and oranges too. In Bulgaria there was a saying: Портокалите у нас идват само с дядо Мраз.
I would love to see you guys test different explosive compounds in grenades to see how it would effect overall performance
Great video. I really enjoyed it, because i had like three or four of those training grenades as a kid and always wonderef if they were converted by drilling a hole in the bottom and if they could just be welded up.
Also, if you test something with fragmentation again, can you put up some Gallon Jugs filled with water around it? Like one "ring" at 5 m, another at 10 m, etc.. It would be interesting to see the hydrostatic shock if they get hit, to kind of get a feeling of the energy they contain.
Once again thanks for the great work. Keep it up.
PS: After thinking about it, could you also compare the fragmentation pattern of an elevated (like 50cm) grenade and an grenade that lies on the ground?
Can you do a demo of a grenade with the coiled notched frag wire lijing the inside of the body that the M26 actually had in service?
Hollywood directors should be forced to watch this video if they want to depict using hand grenades in movies. They seem to think you can blow a car 10 feet in the air using a grenade.
My favorite is hididng behind a door way in a gun fight like bullets dont go through sheet rock
Oh hell yea! New video
And suddenly everyone is an explosive specialist.
Actually there's nothing surprising about grenade with more explosives having smaller effective radius. F1 is a defensive grenade. They are heavier have less explosives and produce lots of heavier fragments that can fly further. Far enough to hit the soldier who throws the grenade so he has to be in cover - that's why it's called defensive.
Offensive grenades like M26 are lighter but have more explosives. Their shrapnel is smaller and can't fly that far but the explosion is stronger. And you can throw it and mostly be safe without getting into cover.
Soviets too had various offensive and defensive grenades with similar weights of the shell and explosives according to these two types.
If I remember correctly, the soviet offensive version of the F1 was the RGD-5, which used a sheet steel body.
When recycling targets just slide a white garbage bag over the old target. Any tear in the garbage bag is a new hit. Replace bags as needed.
Based
It would be great if you guys could do a meat/ballistics gel comparison of the fragmentation of grenades or other devices,great footage again guys, thanks.
"It's not always fun and games here at Ordnance Lab". Seriously? You guys get to blow shit up every day!!!
Cool vid. Somehow, I had never heard of this model grenade. In the 80s, I had a surplus M57 frag and a "pineapple" (forgot M designation) hull and practiced throwing each. As a teen I presumed war with Russia was imminent thanks to the cold war looming over our heads. Then the movie Red Dawn came out but, I digress. Great channel!
My older brother brought a deactivated pineapple hull back home with him from a foreign exchange student high school year in Sacramento CA during the late '80ies, I never got the idea to practice throwing it though, despite the Soviet Union beeing less than 6h away by boat eastwards and Poland or DDR about 8h by boat due south...
I even have early memories of greeting Polish portrait painting "student tourists" at the door when I was a primary school kid.
It's only as an adult that I found out that they most likely were Polish GRU intelligence, as my father was a serving Costal artillery staff Lt. Col. at the time...
Also, a lawn sprinkler system that shoots gasoline would be great. Then get an MG with some tracers.
Or the HE in a light bulb trick
I feel like the whole system would just explode
Umm, the second M26 style grenade may've been made from sheet steel like the genuine, but it lacked the interior coil of pre segmented wire that the case covers, that's what causes the fragments in the M26 from memory.
This channel is just great love the content keep it up
So if one was to go off, is your best bet to lay on the ground, because it seems like the shrapnel goes upwards, but still can’t forget about that concussion effect.
I wanna see them try doing the nail bomb from Last of Us
M26 has a coil of pre notched wire inside and comp b explosive
would be so cool to see ya detonate frags in sheds, playhouses and other structures. Great video as always
I don't know what surplus stores you shop at, but all the ones I've been to in the last few years only sold fake 'nades that were solid in the center. I haven't seen de-wat units since I was a kid.
I've seen the fake ones with drilled bottoms, I picked one up and it was like aluminum'ish pot metal, definitely not steel, or if they were it had to be some exceptionally low density steel alloy probably with air pockets. I haven't seen solid ones before. They were like $10 or maybe a little less, cute paperweight I guess but being so light weight I'd debate if they would make as good of a paperweight as the heavy steel ones (which would be both great for workouts and paperweights).
I guess they look cool, but I don't think they would be useful for anything other than decorative anyways. I think more practical would be to drill a puck of scrap metal, or simply a puck lock and weld the open side as those are ridiculously heavy and thick steel with a drilled out core for the locking core which is easily removable, but I don't know, maybe those are too thick? I also don't think the pattern would be that great, but maybe something interesting for someone with an 07 explosives license or whatever it is. Those puck locks are the same cost or lower in the $8-$10 range and much stronger steel, might make for a cool vid.
@@jakegarrett8109 To be fair, original gen 1 grenades were made of cast iron (F1's, "pineapples", etc.) and gen 2's (lemons, etc.) were made from the cheapest sheet metal that govt's could get in bulk and had a fragmenting coil inside, grenades don't have to be made from 50's Cadillac bodies and handrolled against the skulls of commie POW's to be lethal * enough *, and also we need to remember that half of the military grenades were designed without fragmentation at all, relying solely on concussive blast to injure/maim/kill. Pipebombs usually use shitty iron pipe, cricket bombs are made from mini CO2 canisters used for BB guns, put a sufficient amount of flash powder in cardboard and wrap it with nails sharpened to a needle point on both ends and you got old school cherry poppers with a cherry on top, dynamite is nothing more than nitroglycerin-soaked dirt stuffed in a cardboard tube, the list could go on forever. My point is, I'd be willing to bet that those pot metal bitches would do a number if filled with the right stuff, stuck on the end of an inch diameter piece of dowel rod and chucked into an Antifa shieldwall.
A very interesting video that shows the real function and not Hollywood nonsense.
For example, there is no way an M18 Claymore could be detonated on the other side of a police riot shield and the person holding the shield not be blown to pieces by the backblast.
Touching off 1.5 pounds of C4 inches away from your head and not being killed is ridiculous.
Fucking Nobody
Not to mention the shaped charge effect you get on the back end of a claymore style curved explosive...
I hope you guys do more videos with M 80s this past Fourth of July my friend got a hold of a couple decided to put it inside of a old monitor and got a face full of glass with one piece completely going through his cheek luckily he didn’t lose any body parts and still has his vision
After watching this, I’m buying some Axe body spray.
Now, if you will excuse me, I have to go find my old can of calcium carbide.
have you done any tests with fuel air type explosions
Is there any chance you guys could test the effects of something like a MK3 concussion grenade and the effects of overpressure in the future? I remember Mythbusters used these "Shock Stickers" that would break once a certain amount of shock or G-Force hit them. Would require some sort of enclosed structure, which might be tricky, but if someone has an old shed or something they don't mind potentially being blown up...
If the grenade were laid on its side as if it were thrown would it’s lethality and fragmentation pattern be significantly different?
This I want to know also. Having a grenade stand like that is basically like flipping a coin and having land on its edge and not moving. It might happen, but not often enough to care about the result. I would think the lethality would be massively improved from laying the grenade on its side, because standing it basically means you have a cone of shrapnel moving upwards only. In standing mode I would think the lower half shrapnel cone plows into the ground, the middle ring shrapnel moves at ankle height until it hits anything higher than ankle height and the top half shrapnel being left to do almost all the damage work.
Wow very interesting thought. Some Grenades aren’t decommissioned, just fake castings.
Tries to recreate the new stackable modular grenades. Greetings from Germany
That would be awesome, I'd be interested to see how many could be stacked together, and how awkward they might be to throw or toss.
@@M.H.D.actual or lob from a ballista...thank you Task and Purpose.
You should make a hollow steel front door filled with tannerite... leave the interior side intact and put score lines on the exterior so the exterior side will fragment like a giant claymore....
I like the way you think. Attach bags of salt water to the interior side of the door and it should direct most of the blast outward.
I just have flower pots on my porch. I see a stack and shoot the flower pot. Also getting a stuffed dog soon. Gonna fill him up to the brim.
shouldn't the m26 have a segmented wire coil inside that forms the shrapnel?
Yes, it should.
Do you guys have to pay $200 for each DD that you create, like us mere mortals? Or is it lesser or no cost per item due to your FFL?
I'm curious as well
They said it in a video before. I think its a yearly SOT fee and then registration, but the registration is not an additional charge.
Nice y’all gave that butterfly ptsd 😂
M61 grenade has pieces of ore fragmented metal inside, the casing wasn’t meant to contribute.
concussion grenades are very different than frags. German steihlhandgrenate vs a pineapple grenade
I wonder if these guys could manufacture and make some 37mm explosive round prototypes if you can't get your hands on a 40mm
@@justotalkalottashit8392 I know but it would seem like a fun project just a nice little one and done like the army's xm8 trial
Did the m26 have the notched spiral wound wire under the sheet metal case?
I did wonder about the tessellated wire frag coil too.
I would like to see this done properly at least once.
I guess that they were playing with what they had. The video is about comparing 'fake' grenades that were loaded with explosives, not comparing the real grenades. Unless I'm missing something... (?)
@@ChevTecGroup Yeah, I re-read the info and agree. The hull not containing that is important, since that is a key factor of the lethality of the real grenade. I think they're saying this is what would be expected from a homemade copy but implies it to be similar to the real deal.
My guess is the thing they used was as accurate as they could get but they should have clarified that better.
Yall Take Care, John
How much stronger is comp b then tnt? These are the bits of info lacking from this channel. I understand there are some things you can get into, such as how to manufacture etc, but you are able to tell us the difference in power between explosives
Approximately 40 percent stronger. The RE factor of C4 is 1.4 compared to TNT is 1.0.
You guys need to do a video with ballistic high speed
I actually have a F1 I don’t have the fuse for it, but I have a brown cap for it. It did pretty good in this video despite having less power than most of the grenades I guess that’s why they’re still being used in wars across the world
The Explosive filler amount doesn't matter that much, just changes how fast the shrapnel is moving
@@_Kommissar_ Oh, well that’s good to know. Thank you.
I would like to see measurements of the concussive forces to demonstrate blast injuries.
Didn’t the 26 have a pre notched coil spring inside the sheet metal?
I’m surprised you guys used the lemon style surplus store hull. Out of any of them, I’ve always thought the “pineapple” style grenades were more prevalent. I wonder if they would have better fragmentation too?
Apparently testing showed that Mills Bomb or "pineapple" style castiron bodied grenades rarely fracture along the grooves cast into the body, tending to randomly fragment instead. I personally would have guessed that castiron would have mostly turned into dust by the force of the explosion, just because of the well-known brittleness of castiron.
@@dj1NM3 I have a completely empty & inert WW2 British Mills Bomb. It survived being thrown around by mini-me. One story I heard about this pattern was the fracture issue was known, but not redesigned as it helped with grip. Also the US troops didn't like them, or the official overarm/cricket style bowling throw. Which I guess is why the US pattern evolved to more of a baseball size and shape.
Also, have you guys ever done an RC-XD?
Without internal fragmentation coils they're just pipe bombs. Its the coil that produces the shrapnel.
The American MII grenade started off with a detonator and tnt filling. It gave inferior fragmentation supposedly. Supposedly the grenade switched to a plain fuse entering the charge material which was changed to 'EC Blank Powder.' That must have been a US Army technical specification. There is no further information on that material that is easily found. Supposedly the design changes gave superior fragmentation.
was wondering if you could do one showing what happens if you glue a bunch of ball bearings to the outer casing... have seen this in movies but would like an expert opinion😁👍🇺🇸
Forgot the frag ribbon on the inside. From everything I've heard from guys who have time with all three, was that the 26 produced more consistent casualties than the 33 and later, the 67
My father was a welder by trade and had got me a surplus grenade one year. I asked him to weld up the bottom to make it more realistic. Still sits on my desk. Is my dog going to get shot?
Just have a boating accident
Yes, but I think those are more commonly planted by the AFT (if they do prosecute you for a planted grenade, check the serial numbers, apparently they may forget to scratch those off when they plant one that's registered to the ATF)
I think you can have a inert grenade with a closed bottom, though I am not 100% sure, I think it depends on state and such.
Moral of the story...all would suck to be close to.
Awesome work guys give yourself a pat on the back. Seems like y'all had ol Murphy hanging around with yall.
I don't know if you did this, but if the grenade was wrapped in barb wire or had a some more junk metal taped to the grenade, how much worse would it be? I would love to see it.
the cast iron hull tend to break into large pieces of fragmentation thus makes it less likely to do actual damage, for training purpose I think they are fine
can you test coconut grenade form the Swiss family Robison movie ?
Yes. I def want to see this as well.
Does the company that you got the correct hulls from sell inert ones for displays and reenactors?
Can you get some ballistic gel dummies for frag test? That would be awesome!
I was about to ask you if the butterfly survived the grenade blast but you gave the answer right away as if you read my mind. Lol.
How would you compare those detonations to a real production M67? It’s hard to tell from the camera and the microphone, but it seems to me those were so much weaker than a real M67.