Pro Cyclist BikeFit Analysis - Foot compensation
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- Опубликовано: 11 сен 2024
- Jules and Phil look at how a cyclist will unconsciously compensate with their feet to improve their performance and comfort on a bicycle.
They have selected three professionals whose 'technique' and bike fit is possibly less than ideal, yet they are and were the best in the world:
Lance Armstrong
Peter Sagan
Pello Bilbao
Could they be better?
If two of the greatest, strongest and most successful cyclists of all time have "poor pedalling technique", is it not possible that the academics don't understand cycling efficiency as well as they think? Obviously if you are as strong, fit and determined as those guys, biomechanics are a secondary concern. We gotta work with what we were given.
Correction: we have to work around what we are given. Some things are fixable and modifiable, other things aren't. In the end you have to find a solution that accommodates and/or helps you function better biomechanically. To be fair it doesn't look like they've tried to help or accommodate Peter or Pellos biomechanics at all. For Peter I know they had a bikefit team working around him which helped stabilise his position, but he struggled to find comfort. This could be an adaptation thing that Peter wouldn't be willing to go through, too many changes at a time or maybe the bikefitters were stabilising him in a way that he simply isn't built for - say like kneed drifting out then force it in, which obviously doesn't help if ex. the hip is driving it. Really the point that they are talking about is that the rider is using unnecessary energy to stabilise themselves. This could affect breathing by virtue of things being affected up-and-down the chain or it could simply be overworking certain muscles so you can't pedal as efficiently and/or powerfully at any point in time. Of course they are absolute specimens, but that doesn't mean they don't have room for improvement.
As soon as they have the theory sewn up, someone will come along a do the opposite.
Thanks for sharing yet again, a fascinating close up look at possibly the most underrated aspect of the bike fitting process imho , love the phrase “folklore and myth” speaks volumes that does !
The idea of meeting the ground totally changed the way I think about Bike fit. I have struggled all my life with extreme flat foot . Meeting the ground has helped me process the feedback Ving from feet in a different light and create a more successful orthotic. Thank you!
Such an awesome series. Would be cool to see more especially with big names like Sagan etc
Interesting video... I would be keen to see more of especially some good/perfect examples if they exist?
Fascinating stuff - thanks for sharing it, and please keep it coming!
У Сагана, одна нога короче другой... кажется на 2 сантиметра...
Ноги короткие, и пресс довольно внушительный... Он не может вести колен вдоль рамы, поэтому они в стороны. Иначе, при низком наклоне туловища, сидя в седле, колен просто упирались бы в живот. Да и угол между туловищем и бедром, в низкой посадке очень острый.
Потому он компенсирует длинну ног, подьемом стопы.
Он спринтер, финиширует в основном стоя, с колеса (где посадка не так важна). А уже когда стоит на педалях, тогда длинна ног менее значима. Аналогично и у Кевендиша и особенно у Макюэна. Которые кстати, стоя на педалях наклоняют тело сильно вперед.
А вот сильнейшие ТТ гонщики, в основном длинноногие.
If I were to guess, after watching the Peter Sagan part is that he has a bit of scoliosis. His right hip is "hiked" up and back causing him to sit twisted or further back on his right side. This twist points his left leg outward and functionally lengthens it. AND causes the right foot to roll in.
98 percent sure Sagon does not have Scoliosis. its most probably a muscular imbalance. look at when he was younger and a bit leaner he looked very stable....and inline...
Now idk Sagans limb lengths, but the man has a 150mm stem on there and probably the stem pretty low as well and an anteriorly rotated pelvis. This is probably very comfortable for him in the back to have the anterior rotation and the spine elongation, but who knows how this all affects him through the front of the hip. Perhaps he should lessen the reach a bit also or put the handlebars up 10mm to open his hips. You are just going to hike one hip to open up the other side or to cope with reaching differently to each stroke because of some tightness. Say if your left hip doesn't want to go up further into flexion and so it abducts pulling your right side away from the pedal possibly what do you do? You roll laterally to reach the right pedal.
Ex runner here. Went forward on the cleats. Just couldn’t enjoy a ride. Then. Cleats back. Night and day adjustment. Ridged ankle. More power.
Brilliant double act. 🙌🏼🙌🏼🙌🏼
Shifting to the very nose of the saddle when already many km's into an effort makes it much easier to sustain decent watts. It reduces your peak knee extension and gives you more time to apply force at the start of the pedal stroke. What you end up with is about 5 more rpm for the same effort and thus a decent increase in watt output. It's only possible to keep up for about 15 minutes though at max effort before it gets too uncomfortable. Looking at bikefit in riders while they're in the break but a long way from the finish would get a better representation of their actual target fit.
All that money spent on riders/eqpt yet an afternoon with you may realise power that they are missing. Marginal gains indeed.
Can you do one on the great Jan Ullrich
yeah but peter is sitting far forward obviously that will change the angles, also peter is amazingly flexible so he could likely ride any way he wanted and not hurt himself.
Again, thanks for this. Can you make a general rule saying that a person pronating or supinating should have their toes pointing out or in?
Another awesome analysis! Regarding foot stability, I often get pain in my tibialis anterior. Is that due to foot stability, or something else in the pedal stroke?
Regarding Sagan. His right hip is off. He says it himself. And he has a guy working on him fulltime, to keep him riding. On Bilbao - finally someone explained what the heck is going on with him. I've noticed it so many times with him.
Hi Thomas, thanks for the compliment, re your anterior tibialis is it on both legs or just the one? It is an unusual problem for a cyclist. Is Sagan's right hip off because of his feet? Maybe the symptom is being treated and not the cause.
@@cyclefituk2622 its on both legs. I think its because of "wrong pedalling/muscle recruitment" due to a previous injury that kept on giving pain for so long that I started compensating for it all the time. I don't know if it would be possible to see on a video. I has improved recently though. Some have recommended changing shoes from Bont to Lake.
Re Sagan, that's a really good question. From how I've heard the story, the problem is his hip and that it was "off" before he started cycling. I've also wondered about his feet ankle and pedalling. I wonder how he can keep it up.
@@Knud451 Tib ant can only be over-worked if you are dorsi-flexing to an extreme. we worked with an elite cyclist that had a touch of this when he climbed - he needed to re-work his pedalling slightly.
@@cyclefituk2622 thanks a lot! After testing a bit more, I think its because I'm not lengthening through my quads, hence restricting hip extension. Yesterday it was almost non-existent. So perhaps more neurological, from that previous injury. I still have some quad and hip flexor pain from "stamping" on the pedals, rather than lengthening, but it feels better. Just my thoughts on it :)
@@Knud451 I had a think about your situation. If the foot is unstable the big toe is recruited to aid stability by 'clawing' the shoe and 'fixing' the foot in place. This can over work the Extensor Hallucis Longus muscle which sits beside the Anterior Tibialis as it tries to balance the effort of the Flexor Hallucis longus muscle that is curling the big toe. Improving contact for the first met head (with internal or external wedges) and supporting the foot with a footbed will improve this and relax the foot.
Saw John at Wilmslow. 2 year ago. I need a bio mechanic on my leg pain leavin me fatigued falling asleep at home after low wattage rides. Something is wrong
How far behind the 1. metatarsal do you place the cleat in general?
How can you fix excessive heel drop?. It causes my calves to fatigue
We would need to check your saddle position first, you may be dropping the heel to open the knee angle. After that your feet, if you are not making good contact with the forefoot your brain is looking for end range i.e. the ground and the heel drops, we would look at supporting the feet with Sidas footbeds or an orthotic and maybe some forefoot correction too so there is something to push against. if your cleats are forward you could move them back, this will help stabilise a little.
@@cyclefituk2622 thank you for your response. The knee angle makes sense, so I raised my saddle. Now, comparing to online calculators and formulas, my saddle is 3 cm higher but prevents me from dropping my heel and I feel like there is pressure against my foot.
@@matyss1094 ideally your saddle height should be approx 100mm less than your inseam. we made another video for that on our channel. thx
I want to send in a video of me riding so you guys could give feedback to an amateur.
What could be the usual reason on numbness on right foot? My cleats are as far back and im a usual heel dropper
Hi Ram, numbness can be a result of a few factors. We would recommend having a look at the width of your shoes, making sure the shoe isn't too tight. Secondly, having the correct arch support through the foot and support on your forefoot.
Poor biomechanics, then not perfect ? Then Philip says idiosyncratic , you have an attitude problem the way you replied to Philip, you embarrassed him
This shit is hilarious. Let's pick out two of the greatest generational talents and then say how wrong they are based on... right, nothing. If anything, emulation of their fits is the better idea. You are basing this on basically nothing.
its not hates to love .. its loves to hate (re. lance armstrong) lol !!