Douglas Murray: From Poetry to Free Speech
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- Опубликовано: 14 май 2024
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A message from Lawrence:
I have to say that Douglas Murray reminds me in several ways of my late friend Christopher Hitchens. It is not merely that they are both English, eloquent and well-read. Douglas doesn’t suffer fools gladly, and pulls no punches when necessary. But he is otherwise genteel, thoughtful, and willing to enter into intelligent conversations on many topics. Both Douglas and Christopher have been journalists covering dangerous parts of the world, which has helped shape some of their views. Douglas is more conservative, Christopher was in some ways more liberal, but their deep reserve of knowledge combining literature and current events makes listening to either one of them compelling.
I first got to know Douglas through his marvelous book, The Madness of Crowds, a take-off on Charles Murray’s 1841 classic Popular Delusions and the Madness of Crowds, which was “A distillation of some of the most humiliating, terrifying, and confusing things humans have done in collectivity”… treating things like alchemy, haunted houses, and the crusades. Douglas’ book discusses modern craziness, cutting with surgeon-like skill to the heart of issues related to gender, race, identity politics, and of course free speech.
The Madness of Crowds was followed more recently by The War on The West, which took up where the former book left off, dealing with issues ranging from postmodern attacks on the western Canon, attacks on modern science, and more recent ‘Critical Race Theory’ related attacks on modern western society.
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I discussed all of these issues with Douglas, but was very pleased to be able to bookend the dialogue, front and back, with a discussion of poetry. He writes a weekly column for Free Press on the virtue and joy of committing great poems to memory, and while I have a limited appreciation and tolerance for poetry in general, there are a few poets, T.S. Eliot, and Rainer Maria Rilke in particular, who I greatly enjoy. It was a pleasure to listen to Douglas recite some favorite lines, and to discuss these sublime subjects with him before and after we dropped down into the muck that comprises the modern culture wars.
I hope you enjoy this discussion as much as I did.
As always, this ad-free video is available to paid subscribers only. Your subscriptions support the non-profit Origins Project Foundation, which produces the podcast. The audio version is available free on the Critical Mass site and on all podcast sites, and the video version will also be available on the Origins Project RUclips channel as well.
Consider supporting the podcast and the Origins Project Foundation at originsproject.org/
The Origins Podcast, a production of The Origins Project Foundation, features in-depth conversations with some of the most interesting people in the world about the issues that impact all of us in the 21st century. Host, theoretical physicist, lecturer, and author, Lawrence M. Krauss, will be joined by guests from a wide range of fields, including science, the arts, and journalism. The topics discussed on The Origins Podcast reflect the full range of the human experience - exploring science and culture in a way that seeks to entertain, educate, and inspire.
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I love Douglas Murray .Please please let him talk. He is brilliant and sticks to the topic. Even polite Douglas is getting bored. Let him talk.
Agreed would have liked to hear more from him
I like this podcast but Krauss does have a bad habit of interrupting his guests. He needs to let them
Speak and get their point in then respond
@@brianmeen2158an old story. he can't lay off real time side comments in the middle of the guest's or even his own speaking. he should record 2 cameras, 2 audio tracks, then have an editor remove every nonessential interruption. instant improvement
Absolutely. It was painfully obvious at some point that Douglas was annoyed/bored.
Agree. Poor Douglas
Your conversation just struck a wonderfully vivid memory.
Way back in the 60's & 70's, when in Jr. high school, I was a terrible student; my mind always on what was happening outside.
I managed to fail English (of all things) in 9th grade.
Then, in summer school, taking a make-up English class, we had a most unlikely looking fellow (Mr. Reilly, if you're out there) teaching class... kind of a brutish truck driver look to him.
But he started reading E.A. Poe... walking up and down the aisles, bellowing Poe's work in incredibly an emotional way... and I was hooked!
After that class I never stopped reading everything I could get my hands on.
Thank you Mr. Reilly... an amazing teacher!
A very nice conversation. I don’t think that Douglas Murray was bored. I think he enjoys listening to people. It’s one of the reasons he is such an intelligent and articulate person because he listens.
He's also very polite, even when he's tearing your argument to pieces. Wish we had heard more of him on this show...
He's bad news and so is the pervert with him
This is intended as a gentle, constructive criticism of Professor Krauss, who I greatly value and appreciate for this series of honest conversations. There are times, professor, lengthy portions of this conversation, when you completely dominate and don't allow your guests space to develop their ideas. We all get excited by these chats, and I understand. A lot of what I am speaking of is the professor sputtering and trying to formulate a line of thought as Douglas was trying fruitlessly to interject a coherent comment. I am certainly interested in your thoughts, but the focus should be more on your guests with more of your comments following and eliciting and expanding the guest's thoughts. That being said, I do thank you for what you bring us even as I suggest how you might refine and improve the conversations.
That's exactly right, I thought the same. There were interesting questions from Professor Kraus, but he rambled them on too long, padded them too much, and then interrupted Douglas before he could get into the full sway of his answer.
This. This happened around 2:04:00 for example and it went on for quite some time. Let the man speak!
This drove me insane. 90% of the video is Krauss rambling about topics he hopes to get to and then only allowing very short comments from Murray before Krauss goes on and on and on. There's nothing worse than feeling like you desperately want to hear from the guest and never get the chance.
I am 27 minutes in and it's as if Douglas is interviewing Prof. Kraus, not the other way around! Let your guest speak more, man!
@@32island11 Couldn't agree more. I despise Murray, but wanted to hear his views in this exchange. Krauss always speaks more than his guests, many of whom I revere. Please, Dr Krauss, let your guests do the majority of the talking!
"What answers we could not cope with? Then there's no room to learn."
Well said 👏
Murray is one of those minds that reaffirms your faith in Humanity.
What a huge shame he will never have children of his own, I really really wish people like him could have tonnes of children - Why did he have to be gay?? Bloody nuisance when that happens. There is basically zero chance of several young Douglas replacements trained up by the man himself.
How will young people know their worth if they are not told in this manner? I worry for the youth when the large majority of people they NEED will not be continuing their family past this generation because of whatever trap or reason.
Douglas should get married and have half a dozen children! It's a massive loss to the gene pool if he doesn't, and I 100% blame it on paedo gays getting to him when he was younger. That's the primary reason people decide at the age of 10 that they must have been "born gay".
To try to add rationale and reasons to recover from it that do not include murder then suicide. So the natural result of that trauma and mental gymnastics is to say "I way born this way this rape made no different to me" but its a LIE.
Philip Scofield has had a whole pervert career on that notion. All his victims pretend to have been born as fucking damaged as they are now since meeting that disgusting paedophile Schofield.
He's a con, a bigot and you have him. We don't want him.
Signed
The whole of the British isles
anyone that is able to confront the left is, considering the left is by far the greatest threat to enlightenment values. Twas them that stripped dawkins of humanism award and are against free speech etc.
Oh, there are a few more notable Conservative "intellectuals" that will increase your "faith in humanity" even more.
Richard Spencer, David Duke, Tucker Carlson, Jordan Peterson are some of the popular ones.
Why not invite them, as well? 😏
Indeed.
Douglas Murray's voice is like poetry. Love to listen to his perpetual elouquence
Man I’m really stoked for this guest! I’m a big fan of his works..
He's a bigot, just yukky.
Douglas might be British, but he is all of Europe's champion. He's a force of nature
Douglas Murray is English not british 😊
It annoys me when hosts interrupt, talk over guests, dominate the conversation and chop and change the topic without exploring their answers.
Introduction 0:00
Poetry and other writing 2:52
Murray's origins story 21:35
Being gay when young / primary school 30:22
University: humanities and sciences 35:10
How Murray became a neo-conservative / free speech 50:00
The Madness of the Crowds 1:01:20
Pretending to know what we don't know 1:17:02
Chapter 1: Gay 1:36:25
What is equality? Merit 1:41:40
Woke capitalism / virtue signaling 1:49:25
Differences: hardware versus software / Questions you are not allowed to ask 1:52:55
Chapter 2: Women / Chat GPT 2:06:40
Chapter 3. Race 2:30:00
American foreign Policy / Brexit 2:43:20
Closing poetry 2:56:00
Nice one, thank you 👍
OMG! Analysis of poetry is what has killed it!! I'm older however I am still teaching at a high school in Detroit. These past weeks I was to pass on or teach from the Poetry Unit. For my own sanity and that of my students I tossed out the "instruction on instruction of teaching poetry" and relied on my instincts, and that saved us all. I love your podcast with Stephen Fry and this one is just as fabulous. Thank you for saving minds and our collective consciousness.
Murray is always EXCELLENT!!!! ❤️
Douglas is one of the worlds most sane and reasonable minds . Brutally funny with a honed sense of reason .
One of my country’s finest exports without a doubt
That's like Franco praising Hitler. He's disturbing and Ireland despises his fascist ideology.
You on that red fuc'ing bus they sold their country for, thought so.
There's not a celt on these islands who'd piss on him if he was on fire.
No more Great, no more Britain and the kingdom crumbles into the Irish sea.
That'll be along shortly and the tyranny of occupation will be no more.
Freedom for all Celtic nation's
✊✊✊✊✊✊
@@tonyburton419 wow what a brilliant comment. Added so much.
I am an American, and on behalf of the rest of the world, I thank your country for creating him. ❤
Douglas Murrey is one of my favorite intellectual. I also respect him as a gay person who doesn't feel the need to ever talk about his sexual preference, unless someone specifically asks him about it, but even then he keeps it very private. Even Dave Rubin, who doesn't bring it up "too" much still does more often. We don't need to know, including heterosexuals, what peoples sexual preferences is, as it contributes nothing to nearly any intellectual conversation.
Not considered with anywhere near as this in the UK itself.
While I appreciate that this discussion is here, it's another interview where the host does 75% of the speaking, often going on at length about potential questions that are never actually arrived at for Douglas to answer. So much of this video is Douglas nodding while Lawrence talks at length. I just wish more of the time was given to hearing Douglas' answers and thoughts.
Am feeling the same. The host interrupted way too much with his "two cents". :(
Yes. I'd rather listen to Murray than listen to him constantly being interrupted. This is hard to listen to. I'm 8 minutes in and I have to stop.
I made it to about the 15 minute mark, I can't imagine Murray dealing with this for 3 hours.
A common problem with this host, unfortunately.
Thoroughly enjoyed this brilliant interlude on this fine Saturday afternoon! Imagine a world where this is considered perfectly normal and expected discourse versus what we now live through almost daily in North America. Thank you Dr. Krauss and Mr.Murray for allowing us this moment of sanity!!
I used to hold professor Krauss in quite high regard until I watched a debate that was held in Spain a few years ago on climate change, in which his first statement was "I don't know what we are doing here discussing this subject, the science is settled". He of all people should know, science is never settled.
"I used to hold professor Krauss in high regard until he said something I didn't like"
Yesterday, I wrote a very gentle comment here to Professor Krauss trying to encourage him to hone his interview craft a bit; chats with the sorts of guests he attracts are treasures that need thoughtful handling. Reading the comments of others this morning kinda winds me up again: Nobody questions the professor's brilliance or the breadth of his intellect, which is far ranging. But there is a serious, narcissistic-like inability to see what a mess he often makes of these conversations by dominating them with his own thoughts, often thoughts that he is sputtering incoherently at length trying to formulate. I presume that if he were able to view himself and the interview as others do, he would correct this recurring pattern. Writers (even brilliant ones) need editors and media people need producers. Being a brilliant thinker in no way implies being a brilliant conversationalist. Professor Krauss, sir, you need to hire a producer and put him in another room with a microphone wired into your ear and put him in charge. Share with him your plan for the interview (which you talk far too much about and do not follow), and pretend that he is the boss telling you when to move along and to let your guest talk and such. You need this even if just for a training period. Interviewing is a skill, a craft and, sir, you really don't have it. What you have is a brilliant mind and the ability to attract other minds to these conversations. You badly need help in learning to shape these raw gems into polished stones. And you need to learn to focus on the guest.
Looking back at what I wrote it occurs to me that Professor Krauss does not really accept the role of interviewer. I expect that he sees this as two lively minds crashing into each other in a way that emits a shower of brilliant sparks. Such magic might happen occasionally, but it is more frequently a hot mess when no one takes the roles as host and facilitator giving the spotlight to the guest.
One possible approach you might try is not to listen to/watch the podcasts if you don't like them.
@@nicksmith2193 Thanks! I hadn't thought of that.
Well done, Agreed 100 % I hope Professor Krauss can see your comment and suggestion.
Jordan Peterson has similar problems, but he has listened to criticisms like these and continues to improve all the time. (His conversations with Murray are always a treat.) It obviously takes practice. Hope Krauss follows a similar trajectory.
@@yatesfletcher1424 Yes! I have also been exasperated at JP. He just gets so excited and sometimes is just brainstorming when it would be better if he did less of that with guests who also have things to say.
Douglas Murray, intellectually elegant, deeply insightful, brilliant writer and social commentator ❤ the man who made conservative values SEXY again 👏🏽 love him!
So deeply insightful he wrote in I think in the UK's "The Spectator" , that a Trump winin 202 would be a positive outcome, - 2- 3 weeks before the Capitol riots.
@tonyburton419 lol what "Capitol riots"? 🤣🤣
@Tony Burton He actually said that a Trump presidency would be more favourable towards the UK.
@@andreaking4818 Thanks for the clarification...interesting that I had twisted the memory to conform to a confirmational bias. However, his recent attendance at The Conservatism Conference, claiming nationalism was a positive aim for any country but that the Germans "mucked it up" twice, was rather unwise. He views the world through a privileged, Eton-educated, right-wing len.
@andreaking4818 the UK was expecting co-operation from the Trump administration for post-Brexit trade deals. Biden obviously deals only with China and Ukraine 🙄 obviously...
I so looked forward to this interview, having followed Lawrence Krauss for a number of years. In contrast, I have just discovered Douglass Murray, and was really wanting to hear his ideas. Instead, I was increasingly frustrated as Krauss described Murray's ideas in his pre-question ramble, then failed to be quiet and listen to Murray's answer, and interrupted him continually. You can see Murray, himself, get worn down gradually; at one point, I seem to observe, even laughing as he opens his mouth to speak, and Krauss ONCE AGAIN dives in there so we cannot hear what Murray had to say! Incredibly disappointing.
I believe he is slightly excited to have Douglas Murray as his guest and he is partly in awe of his works.
@@leegrant7333he does it to everyone
I think that you are right. I was letting someone else’s opinion sway me. Mea culpa It’s two intellectuals having a substantive conversation. Refreshing indeed!
No, not yet! Surely only a few dozens of minutes have passed. Lawrence Krauss reminds me of how much so many of us miss Christopher Hitchens. It shows us how time is fleeting.
It’s such a pleasure to listen to Douglas Murray. Half of this Saturday on a Memorial Day weekend. I know some poetry, not a lot, but I could never forget Shelley’s *OZYMANDIAS* - “Look on my works, ye Mighty, and despair … Nothing beside remains. Round the decay of that colossal wreck the lone and level sands stretch far away.”
Same! I had a teacher in highschool who would give us credit for memorizing and reciting poems to him. You could increase your GPA by up to 0.3 through memorizing poems. Ozymandias was my favorite.
Oh that poem by Chidiock Tichborne...... I cried, tears were trickling down my face, it resounded so deeply in me, and recited by Douglas Murray, so beautiful, so so very beautiful and true. Feel blessed to have discovered it thanks to this great podcast. Thanks to both of you
Imagine if the guest could finish their own thoughts without being interrupted.
Douglas Murray is the Legend ! Love listening his speaking
I've read your contributions to New Scientist over the years - so glad you had the flexible intelligence to discover my hero of many years - Douglas Murray. Thank you.
Douglas brilliant as ever,I did find the interviewer really irritating.
He's not just "some interviewer" he's a world renowned physicist, he's allowed to speak when he wants to and people listen with interest.
His knowledge/expertise of physics is irrelevant here. Krauss was interviewing Murray here and he repeatedly asked long, rambling questions then interrupted before Douglas could provide an expanded answer. It made it a frustrating listen.
Correct, that's what I was referring to, I don't doubt he's brilliant at physics what so ever. Just found him rambling and Interrupted a fair bit.
I am gaining massive respect for Lawrence Kraus over the last couple years. Obviously, I have always respect him as an intellectual, but his willingness to speak to people on the political right shows his courage and commitment to the enlightenment principles that he espouses.
@@Horsemanrayrespectfully, as an active religious Christian, highly conservative, I believe in forgiveness and redemption. I’ve certainly made many mistakes in my life. Anyone willing to fight for truth is someone I see as either an ally or a possible ally.
Respectfully, LAWRENCE KRAUS did not go after anyone’s kids. Epstein is currently burning in hell, as will be the fate of anyone that goes after kids.
Douglas Murray is a powerhouse
What a pleasure to hear you both speak. Thank you.
I love Lawrence . Wonderful.
Thank you, gentlemen, for a fantastic discussion!
This physicist seems to love talking about himself way too much. On the other hand Douglas; oh dear! Just excellent.
What a joy to see these two together, discussing common sense ⭐
I once walked past Douglas late at night around 11:30pm. He had his back to me while playing on his phone but i recognised him from his hair. As i returned from the direction i had walked past him (i was pottering around before a journey) he tilted his head slightly and i saw his face, but I did not bother him. It seems he had been out with friends and i assume these well-known sorts would enjoy being able to do something now and then without being bothered.
I have to say, that is the most long-winded version of "I saw so and so in the street the other day" I have ever read.
@@burtdandy5755 lol 'I saw someone and moved on'.
The difference between an entertaining book and an instruction manual is illustrated in the comments above.
@@shelleyphilcox4743 🤣
@@burtdandy5755 Reading your insult is seconds I'll never get back.
I say this in as polite a way, as possible... Would you please please, please, ask Douglas to come back on ... But ONLY when you sorted out your connection issue and learned to let the subject speak.
I have never seen anyone have someone as interesting and intelligent as Murray on, then just interrupt and continue to speak, asking a question and then cutting the person off when they are trying to answer it.. To ask another question, you will answer yourself- its as if you ONLY ask a question in order to make your own point. It's like a strange mix of ADHD and narcissism- Im not saying you have ADHD or are a narcissist.. Just saying that's how it comes off
With Murray, all you have to do is ask a question and let him go ..
Its HILARIOUSLY bad form to ask someone about their childhood and schooling and then cut them off when they are explaining just to say "As my friend Stephen Fry said..."
I physically balked at that point.
On Lawrence’s, ‘words don’t matter” - I’m reminded of Chuang Tzu who realised that his anger was within him; it merely needed the bump of an external object to provoke it out of him.
In the spirit of "a change is as good as a rest", listening to this delightful conversation was just the respite I needed after eating, breathing, sleeping, dreaming the war in Israel literally non-stop since Oct 7.
This conversation itself, and its contents, are one of the beautiful things in life that our children are fighting for. I might sleep well tonight.
G-d bless you all.
Are really fascinated by Douglas, he is unique and has a welcoming aura. Fantastic poems🎉❤
This is sparkling, too many goodies to unwrap and praise in one comment, but the one quote that resonates with me right now is, “that a good scientist must always acknowledge that they may be wrong”. How illuminating, that we should all possess this humility.
THREE hours with Douglas Murray! What an honour for the loquacious, interrupting host, who is interesting and curious, but who also entirely fails to understand the essentially authoritarian nature of the EU.
"who also entirely fails to think what I think, and must therefore be wrong"
Talk to the guest.Douglas is amazing.Let him speak.
The interviewer would benefit greatly from exploring further the lectures of the eminent Professor Jordan B Peterson in my most humble opinion
I'm afraid I have to agree. He's very likeable but you end up hearing far too much about him; and frankly you can see Douglas struggling with his divagations which make actual dialogue impossible. I'm afraid I eventually became bored which is quite an achievement with someone like Douglas.
I think Douglas is a gem .
Douglas & Lawrence are both so brilliant & inspiring. Bravo to you both!
The poem is Elegy by Chidiock Tichborne
Professor Krause, you have GOT to let Douglas finish his thoughts. There are so many examples where I became excited to hear Douglas fully articulate an idea or a question and you interrupted. Douglas has this great way of signalling that he's about to sort of bask in an idea for a moment, but you more often than not would prevent him from doing so. One of many examples is when he started to express a concern he has about the certainty of among atheist circles, see 2:13:41 I really hope you see this and other comments and take the constructive criticism to heart. I know it might not be easy for me to accept the criticism (even if I knew it was well intentioned) if I were in this position, but we must. Still greatly appreciate the conversation.
Cross is a very good, reasonable, well informed interviewer. He always ask very good, interesting questions.
I have always loved Diuglas Murrey and his talks❤
Thank you for lifitng us all up. Of course, I can only speak for myself; but ... thank you. Lawrence - it must also be said - I love you for your humility.
Enjoyed this conversation. You surprise me continually, Krauss. Two fascinating people
Let Murray talk!
He's a bigot and it all sounds like vomit to me. 🤮
😂😂 Ikr
I love listening to Douglas…a bright light of common sense in this increasingly confusing world! But frustrated to hear yet ever more of Laurence waffling on and on and not allowing Douglas to speak…
Absolutely miss Christopher Hitchens. Well said
A beautiful conversation, well done!
Interestingly, before even reading the message I was thinking that Murray is very much taking up the mantle of Hitchens, and to see that this wasn't an unfounded idea is heartening. Keep up the good work, the both of you.
I've thought the same thing the more I read of Murray's
The Origins podcast does exactly that- it makes me see the diversity of human existance! Thank you for the joy of various types of enlightenment.
Daniel Schmactenberger points out that most of our most admired polymaths throughout history ( Marcus Aurelius, Newton, the Dalai Lama, etc.) acquired their capacity for wisdom from the tutelage of the best thinkers of their times. Compare that to the plight of a Puerto Rican kid from the inner-city whose teacher got her "education" from a community college in Iowa. THAT is the story of the America we now live in. I believe that the elevated realms form which both of you speak, are oblivious to the paucity of other people's realities.
In my new book on the 1976 play THE BELLE OF AMHERST, I write how even in the latter days of his Alzheimer's disease, the play's author, my godfather William Luce, could still recite Emily Dickinson's verse. A thing of beauty is a joy forever.
My goodness, as much as I admire the professor, his incessant rambling made this conversation a chore instead of a joy to listen to. It seemed to be a vehicle for the Professor to mention how many famous friends he has and not a place for Douglas to breathe and talk freely. I love Douglas and was I looking forward to hearing him without being constantly interrupted.
Fully agree, very disappointing.
Douglas Murray. A sane voice in insane times.
Indeed
To me, this is by far one of the most important podcasts of our times. One thing lost by the waves of feminism is something we never discuss, and that is the loss of knowing ways or perhaps what is called in a broad sense ESP. I was raised with 6 sisters and an intuitive mother, the most important thing we were gifted was the are of listening to silence and hearing with the heart. My family made it clear to never strive for equality with men but that we were already ahead and that one of our societal endeavors was to helplift men up. Interestingly enough,
Excellent podcast. ❤
Douglas Murray, worth it! I got the Stasis point Douglas, a very good point, Gold, didn't cover it!
There's probably a name for it amongst psychologists but I love that feeling when I talk to people in other areas of study and I see similar patterns in thinking with totally different topics. I find that, in itself, fascinating and wonder which other patterns might be useful to me.
I think Neil has rubbed off on Lawrence as he never shuts up and insists on interrupting constantly now
I TOO LOVE DOUGLAS MURRAY!!! NICE TO SEE HIM IN THIS LIGHT!
Douglas is fantastic. Eloquent and wise way beyond his years. I found him in an Intelligence Squared debate about religion, years ago, and got hooked not only by his fluent and clear articulation of ideas, but also by the content of his sharp analyses - he has always something interesting and insightful to say.
Your choice of guests has been really great, lately, Lawrence. Thank you for that. If I may, I'll reiterate a suggesstion that I made before: I would love to hear you having a conversation with James Lindsay (his latest book, _The Marxification of Education,_ touches on a really important subject). Since you're acquainted with Peter Boghossian, I suppose this wouldn't be too far-fetched.
I've never heard of James Lindsay so glad that I read your comment. I'm going to read his book. I hope that Lawerence has him on!
@@eyeswideopenpod That's nice. Lindsay was, along with Helen Pluckrose, Boghossian's partner in the so called "grievance studies affair." If you haven't heard about it, it is worth investigating a bit.
@@Doutsoldome Oooh thank you so much! I will definitely check into it. 🙏💖
*The far-right has revived Marxism in a way that those of us who are Marxist could only ever dream of. It's such a wonderful, staggeringly-satisfying irony right-wing scumbags aren't aware of.*
How fortunate for Douglas to have had parents who encouraged him instead of parents who whipped him into self loathing and knocked down completely who he was. It is circumstance, then, not choice and will, that determines what sort of adventure our lives become although if even the most unfortunate realizes their circumstance, at whatever stage of life, it is will that can elevate their lives to dignity. For one who is a wanderer or an observer, leaving no trace of having been may be the most heroic choice one can make.
Best talk ever bro’s!😂🙌
Long live the Hitch🇬🇧
i had to bounce to my laptop for this one
thank you 🥰
"playing gracefully with ideas." Is a dope line
I stil cant believe your my neighbor accross the river! Great podcast
The closest we have to Christopher Hitchens. Glad he's on our side.....actually he could only be on our side 😊
Got into poetry late. When 33 in a yr long class on it I took. But it opened my mind & spirit to such beauty had never fathomed. Later took that love home with me, & also put to memory many wonderful poems.
Thank you both.
Two men whom I greatly respect. Only recently found Murray, but it became clear to me almost immediately that I would add him to my list of individuals whose incite I greatly admire.
I took the day off work today with a heavy cold. It's taken six hours to listen to it as I slept a lot, but what a fantastic chat that was. I'd like to spend an evening in the pub with them.
I think the word Douglas was looking for is "autological": a word that defines itself. Like a "word" is a "word" and a "noun" is a "noun."
As a former "humanities person", I recently took a job that applies my skills in the scientific field. There is nothing more fulfilling than learning from the opposite side of the spectrum. I spent so many years thinking that science is something that I'm just 'too dumb for'
Very well put
Have to confess that I could never get into poetry. Somehow it doesn't gel with me. But I do have a great love of classical music, so I have committed a lot of that to memory instead. Can't think of anyone else who can whistle Grieg's Piano Concerto! I suppose it is my substitute for poetry.
A most enjoyable interaction with you both..joy in words and poetry..thankyou❤
After watching this, I've come down with the logic flu. For it was way too rich, of something sensibly new. New but familiar, like a new pair of shoes. And like something so sweet, too much can make you blue.
Keep up the good work Lawrence and Douglas
Great man. God bless him.
Let me quote a great poet, mr. Kai Hansen... You can take my heartbeat, but you can't break my soul...
...Helloween? Although, considering Lawrence's field, I should mention Gamma Ray instead.
@@DDeCicco Yes, gammaray... however, helloween is qute correct answer as well
A wonderful discussion.
What a treat! Thank you.
If anyone can claim Christopher Hitchens throne as the most eloquent, courageous, contrarian intellectual speaker today, Douglas is that man. He wears the title with humility and hostility, when required, we are lucky to have him. Even more so in the current climate of victimhood which is worn as a badge of honour, a time when reducing complex issues to good and bad (black or white really) and is never afraid to call out the hypocrisy of both left and right, actually investigates the subjects he writes about, unlike many so-called writers today, visits the areas he criticises, and, if you read him properly, maintains his humanity while defending sovereignty and highlighting what is still truly wonderful about the West and Britain. Of all those who hate the countries that gave them the freedom to criticise them perhaps you take your freedom for granted, I don’t, and Douglas is the loudest, proudest voice in upholding the beauty we still have, the tolerance we dispel, the magnificence of our architecture, the rule of law, and the celebration of our history. That doesn’t mean we haven’t made mistakes, or that we can’t improve but for those who hate their homelands perhaps start with some introspection and see what lurks in your own heart, that truly despises you about your own existence. Until you see your own self- hatred you are condemned to project it onto that which gives you freedom and be nothing more than a vitriolic virtue signaller.
Please let Douglas talk, he is the guest
Great conversation, especially given that you weren’t in the same room, that’s hard to pull off.
Just finished "War on the West" a bit late as it came out last year but another great piece of work sir!
great discussion; thank you for posting
Great questions Lawrence! Love there's no holds barred with the questions. DM is a breath of fresh air and thoughts great episode :)
I found the host talking over the guest annoying. Will search out Murray, but not listen to this podcast again
One of our greatest
Both of you a great. I love that you can have differnt opinions and that's fine. It's refreshing. Two great minds having a great chat. Lawrence has an enthusiastic childlike curiosity. Douglas is one of the greatest thinkers of our time. I have never seen him lose a debate.
Thank you Mr.Murray! Wow I didn't know you write poems..❤ We should listen mainly your voice because your brillant mind proposing solutions to preserv the Western Civilization..I wish your books were translated in many lenguages..you should be Prime Minister and a lider of the Wester world.
lol, i went to a comprehensive, leaving at 16 in 1970, it was brand new and we had brand new uniforms and it was assumed by the locals to be "posh", but in fact it was a school that kids who got expelled from other schools got sent to, like a maximum security school.
and we had three types of teachers, the unprepared who had breakdowns and quit, the sadists who believed in the cane, despite the fact we had a competition to see who could get caned the most, and the oddballs who actually taught us stuff, had us totally enthralled and needed no canes at all.
mr holt, and actual artist and sculptor, shaped my entire life, the art room was a civics class, and he was gone before i could revisit and tell him what an amazing life i've had thanks to him and my envy of his abilities at art. i went on to st martin's school of art, chelsea school of art, london college of printing and eventually did graphics at kingston poly in 1981, and now after a career in tv, commercials and movies i'm doing sculpture (occasionally) at morley college at 69.
a crappy, unruly state school education isn't a bad thing.
I think it depends on the student to take whatever education they get and improve on it or let it ruin them. Your teacher, Mr. Holt would have loved to know that he made an impact. As a former teacher, the idea that I might have made an impact on ONE child would mean that I did the right thing and it would feel amazing. Good for you for taking what you were given and improving your skills.
Easy for you to say!
I was far more travelled during schooling. I was expelled twice every year until I was 15 when there were no other remaining schools to attend, so I missed out on my exams despite being the top of all my classes.
I learnt next to nothing useful from ALL those institutions and all that time, all it did was poison my heart against the rich and the smart-arsed. I was no better off than illiterates, in some ways worse. That was until I attended private schooling.
That was the sole reason I didn't become a terrible criminal, despite being told repeatedly (and shown) that I would amount to a hill of beans during state education. The teachers are worthless in the main, it's not the rest of the school it is the actual choice of tutors they offer.
They're probably far less able than an average person in so many ways, it is amazing people trusted their children with these sorts. I could spot a child rapist a fuckin mile away by the age of 10 and guess where I found most of them?
State education. It's fucking atrocious. Fact, unless you are in that lucky few it ruins most kids.
I love The Origins Podcast!
This is one of the better Podcast I've listened to : a good job indeed !!!
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Sweeet Douglas Murray is treasure
This was wonderful, so much respect and love. 💕 Girl from Vancouver Island.🌻