When Cavernous Maw is a 0/0 creature with counters on it from the confluence, you can still pay two mana and activate it to give it +3/+3. Would have given you lethal earlier in game 2.
@@MTGGoldfish I was thinking that also.. I thought you were going to do that because you made the maws 0/0 + 3 counters creatures rather than other caves.. I wonder if the landlord Tortoise from Eldraine would fit the caves deck -- would be kinda cool since you already have turttlepower in the sky..
were you aware that card kingdom is missing cards from this deck? I have to laugh, all of your decks aren't able to be bought in completion on card kingdom. forcing people to look elsewhere, finding better deals on other sites.@@MTGGoldfish
So recently you guys did your "haters comments" podcast. And Richard was like "sometimes you guys forget that we're all really good at magic." That last game really highlighted that. Mr. Statistician over here taking calculated risks and lines most of us wouldn't see. Pretty freaking excellent if you ask me.
Seth loves to concede when he has lethal on board, then keeps playing against control when it's turn nine and the opponent is at 14 and has 7 cards in hand. A few highly visible blunders make people forget that he is, for the most part, a very competent player.
I hate Bat Colony because it wants to be played with Caves, but if you sac a Cave and Discover into it then you didn’t spend mana from Caves to cast it, and so won’t make bats.
I guess you can still choose to put it in your hand but yeah it is a feel bad. Still though bat colony seems pretty strong when you can get all three bats
Agreed, seems like somewhat of an oversight. Maybe it would have worked better as "make x bats, where x is the number of caves you control. x can't be greater than 3." Sounds kinda clunky, I'm sure there's a better way of making that idea work
I love the concept. I put the deck together and started playing the ladder. It is so much fun to play! I hate playing the decks everyone else is playing. There are so many synergies. It is a blast! Thank you so much!
sweet deck, thanks seth. the synnergy between caves ablaze, bat tokens for chumping and tutorable manlands makes this deck look pretty legit. interesting to see where it leads in standard.
As well as playing a bunch of lands with a ton of different abilities that the majority of your opponents are not likely to know much about. Nvm the abilities, it's hard to remember which colours you have available lmao
When you were exploring with the map tokens at 16:00 you would've had lethal if you just left a non-land on top, admittedly that line is soft to the opponent having an instant speed kill spell in hand, but they'd already spent at least three of their real kill spells.
16:34 you had lethal if you fired up the Maws already on the field. They were 0/0’s with counters, so instead of exploring, it would have been 4 mana to make a 10/10 and a 7/7
Opponent said Good Game at 36:14 because they were dead on board to animating the Cavernous Maws. Seth of course doesn't see it and goes for the prolonged BM involving putting the shigeki in hand and recurring a bunch of spells. Heck, he didn't even notice that discover lets you put the spell to hand for the shigeki in the first place.
I'd love to see your take on that second deck (I guess you could call it Boros Discover? Chaining Hit the Mother Load makes my brain happy in a way that overwhelming value generally doesn't). And dear god. I want to see Spelunking in Gates.
Love you Seth! Your the best. I recently imported the Dino deck you played on stream. Been trying out the one drop and your right, topiary stomper is better in it
Finally got the cards to build this only spending a 3 wild cards (had to swap out get lost for another removal) but it is tearing it up in diamond today and yesterday. I know this is a bit late but this thing is suprisingly awesome in best of one. Thoughts on a sideboard / non budget upgrades? would love to see you revisit this in youtube vid of twitch stream. Keep up the great content.
that's a sweet deck, I'm a EDH player and now interested for trying standard because of this deck! do you have any recommendation for the side deck? thankyou for the content!
Spelunking makes gates decks way better too. Drop the Maze's End untapped late game and then activate it for the win before opponent can play a sorcery speed answer (which most land destruction is). Perhaps a future video Seth/Goldfish?
this deck is sweet. im building it right away. gonna refine it the best i can. i've been waiting for so long for a fun meme deck to come along and cave tribal is dope.
I've been brewing a Zur Enchantment deck with Bat Colony. Not sure if the caves are worth the hit to the mana base but Bat Colony is powerful and slots right into Zur
Follow the link in the description to the full article, from there you should be able to copy it to your clipboard to import it into Arena ((: (Although I don't think the cards are actually on arena until tomorrow)
39:51 and i saw another one. There is a missplay : play forest then sperlunking so you draw and if it's not a cave you play the forgotten monument you have in hand then gain 4 life ans it comes untap. You did this missplay twice in your video.
I really want to see an upgraded version of this deck with blossoming tortoise... Also you can gain 4 life with spelunking so long as the land you play is a cave too.... That's not an irrelevant line of text on the card
Ah Seth, Exploring a nonland to the top at 16:09 would have given you lethal. Sometimes, guaranteeing a +1/+1 counter is better than setting up potential future draws. Edit: actually nevermind, you had to draw a land to use that last explore.
Nice deck, glad to see caves actually putting in some work. Ten rares isn't exactly a low amount in terms of MTGA wildcards but it's a decent paper deck potentially.
10:02 I haven't seen them in a while but I have played a couple games against gate decks and they owned me. I don't think they even had any creatures in the deck It was all just using the gates to shut me down. I only started playing recently after not playing for a very very long time. I wasn't playing when the gates were released, so I'm kind of excited to see caves.
What cards should i swap out for if i wanted to play this deck on a bigger budget. Also what cards would be good for a sideboard so this can be played in best of three?
Kami war is VERY strong. Atraxa is also an obscene top end. Blossoming tortise is very strong as well. Makes your cavernous maws cheaper to activate and also lets you rebuy your caves youve used.
So far. I've cut the go for the throat for 2x Virtue of Persistence and 1x Path of Peril. The hardest matchups so far are Aggro: Soldiers & Red. So adding a bit of life gain and more flexable removal helps, but its still the weakest point of it. Also just having a top end of Virtue to just ramp into sometimes closes the game outright. Urabrask's forge generally beats you 9 times out of 10 though. I think the sideboard reflects what's the problems... In control matchups I think you want to board in wren and worldbreaker (2) I'm heavily considering Abraid, Brotherhood's end, and Loren of the Thrid Path. Downside with Loren and Wren is that you can't get them with Shegeki loops, So that might be incorrect. I think 2x Path of Peril is also correct in the board? Because i kind of feel that black/white is a bit easier that black-black? Weird observation from playing, diversifying your mana-pips in your tech...almost makes it easier to cast in this deck. Your less likely to draw something that is just off color, if you have a bit of everything? But that's just my experince.
I've been hesitant to try the aria, but I might give it a shot just to see how it feels. I was concidering sunset revalry for the potential blockers, life, card, time bye. I'm a little shocked that so few people are brewing/iterateing on this deck online and ladder. Every other article post I've seen always reads for better top end like Itali, but I think the top end is perfectly fine. You can loop a wrath every turn. It's the early game survival that is the tension point.
"Are cavegates a thing?!" "Can we make gatecaves a thing is cavedard?!" "Caves is legit a gate in gatedard?!" -seth probably "Am i a joke to you?!" -shigeki turtle engine
With Standard moving to a new day I joked I was maybe going to try Cave Tribal. ....Now I'm wondering if we deck it out is it a Lands deck? Gates returned without as much gimmick? Can we kill people quoting Nissa without Nissa even being present? XD I kinda want to find out! Though I'll probably just build it for Standard first. I have 150$ to drop on Merfolk as it is and then consider if I can go fin to toe with the store champs since I'll literally only be lacking Force of Negations.
Always a good idea to put all your triggers on the same creature so one removal spell cancels it all…..or so I learned was a bad idea on my second day of playing magic…..
A deck where u can constantly wipe the board, have every threat with the opponent having to deal with only on your turn as well as playing all its spells by sacrificing and endless supply of returnable lands... Think this might be pretty good yeah
Hard to judge how good a deck is from VIP day given everyone is just playing jank. But I do love gates so will most likely spin this up at some point too.
I've had moderate success with it. Mostly I just want to play something different for a while, but I am struggling to tech' it correctly. Urabrask's Forge is the actual bane of this deck, Aggro is actualy a really tough matchup. Anything really grindy or control heavy you generally beat because the Turtle-Shegeki loop is un-counterable and lets you greed harder than their greed. Variance is Variance. I've cut the go for the throat for 2x Virtue of Persistence and 1x Path of Peril. So adding a bit of lifegain and more flexable removal helps, but its still the weakest point of it (Mostly that I kept running into artifact threats that go for the throat couldn't touch) Also just having a top end of Virtue to just ramp into sometimes closes the game outright.
![Seungmin "그렇게, 천천히, 우리(As we are)" | [Stray Kids : SKZ-PLAYER]](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/kAzmhLHePqU/mqdefault.jpg)
New drinking game: Take a shot every time Seth says "gates" when he means "caves"
AKA, destroy your liver in 5 minutes
you are going to have a lots of death on your hands with that game
*dies*
And cascade for discover if you want hard mode
@@ericaschner3283 to be fair, discover is basically cascade
When Cavernous Maw is a 0/0 creature with counters on it from the confluence, you can still pay two mana and activate it to give it +3/+3. Would have given you lethal earlier in game 2.
Hmm, I think you might be right :)
@@MTGGoldfish I was thinking that also.. I thought you were going to do that because you made the maws 0/0 + 3 counters creatures rather than other caves..
I wonder if the landlord Tortoise from Eldraine would fit the caves deck -- would be kinda cool since you already have turttlepower in the sky..
were you aware that card kingdom is missing cards from this deck? I have to laugh, all of your decks aren't able to be bought in completion on card kingdom. forcing people to look elsewhere, finding better deals on other sites.@@MTGGoldfish
22:51 THEY weren’t trying new things! They were trying OLD things! And you BEAT them!
So recently you guys did your "haters comments" podcast. And Richard was like "sometimes you guys forget that we're all really good at magic." That last game really highlighted that. Mr. Statistician over here taking calculated risks and lines most of us wouldn't see. Pretty freaking excellent if you ask me.
Right. Magic is a really hard game and everybody makes mistakes, unless they are playing the same deck for the 10,000th time
Seth loves to concede when he has lethal on board, then keeps playing against control when it's turn nine and the opponent is at 14 and has 7 cards in hand. A few highly visible blunders make people forget that he is, for the most part, a very competent player.
I thoroughly enjoyed seeing Caves lay a smackdown on some decks. Would be hilarious if it actually ends up being competitive. I'm here for it.
It gets better with copies of Boseiju and Otawara
I think there is a chance it's actually surprisingly synergistic.
I hate Bat Colony because it wants to be played with Caves, but if you sac a Cave and Discover into it then you didn’t spend mana from Caves to cast it, and so won’t make bats.
I guess you can still choose to put it in your hand but yeah it is a feel bad. Still though bat colony seems pretty strong when you can get all three bats
Then don't cast it, put it in your grip, and enjoy your tutor.
@@OGNoNameNobodyYeah I feel that Bat Colony probably is better than I’m giving it credit for but I’m just irrational
Yeah, that part is awkward, but you can always just put it in your hand and sac cast it for mana.
Agreed, seems like somewhat of an oversight. Maybe it would have worked better as "make x bats, where x is the number of caves you control. x can't be greater than 3." Sounds kinda clunky, I'm sure there's a better way of making that idea work
I love the concept. I put the deck together and started playing the ladder. It is so much fun to play! I hate playing the decks everyone else is playing. There are so many synergies. It is a blast! Thank you so much!
sweet deck, thanks seth. the synnergy between caves ablaze, bat tokens for chumping and tutorable manlands makes this deck look pretty legit. interesting to see where it leads in standard.
I never thought of it quite so succinctly, but those ARE the staples of a classic Standard control deck, no?
Dang... Lmao
As well as playing a bunch of lands with a ton of different abilities that the majority of your opponents are not likely to know much about. Nvm the abilities, it's hard to remember which colours you have available lmao
colour me absolutely shocked when you somehow mispronounce cave
already calling them gates. god will judge you, seth, probably better known as saffronolive
Mono coler deck maybe
I was absolutely expecting him to pronounce them "Kayvee"
What are caves but earth gates?
@@OfficeCommandoProBABly better known as Safrooooooooonnnn Ahhhhhhlive
I think Seth missed that when you discover Shigeki, you can put it into your hand and not risk it being killed
I was going to say this to
Also came to say the same thing. He's putting himself on hard mode lol
Yea people have gotten to used to calling this 'new cascade' and forget that option
That last game was super suspenseful. So fun to watch!
Is there anything you would change about this list if you had an unrestricted budget? Aside from adding a sideboard, obviously in paper
When you were exploring with the map tokens at 16:00 you would've had lethal if you just left a non-land on top, admittedly that line is soft to the opponent having an instant speed kill spell in hand, but they'd already spent at least three of their real kill spells.
this might be my favorite fun deck ive seen. Great piloting saffron!
It plays very consistently and the synergy with the cards comes off powerful.
16:34 you had lethal if you fired up the Maws already on the field. They were 0/0’s with counters, so instead of exploring, it would have been 4 mana to make a 10/10 and a 7/7
Love the content! Maybe try Aclazotz Waste Not for a Against the Odds.
Opponent said Good Game at 36:14 because they were dead on board to animating the Cavernous Maws. Seth of course doesn't see it and goes for the prolonged BM involving putting the shigeki in hand and recurring a bunch of spells. Heck, he didn't even notice that discover lets you put the spell to hand for the shigeki in the first place.
I'd love to see your take on that second deck (I guess you could call it Boros Discover? Chaining Hit the Mother Load makes my brain happy in a way that overwhelming value generally doesn't).
And dear god. I want to see Spelunking in Gates.
I love gambling mechanics 🤑💰
Yeah, that deck looked super cool.
Love you Seth! Your the best. I recently imported the Dino deck you played on stream. Been trying out the one drop and your right, topiary stomper is better in it
Nice!
Finally got the cards to build this only spending a 3 wild cards (had to swap out get lost for another removal) but it is tearing it up in diamond today and yesterday. I know this is a bit late but this thing is suprisingly awesome in best of one. Thoughts on a sideboard / non budget upgrades? would love to see you revisit this in youtube vid of twitch stream. Keep up the great content.
The funny cave deck somehow winning through two Gishath hits was nuts dude goddamn
that's a sweet deck, I'm a EDH player and now interested for trying standard because of this deck! do you have any recommendation for the side deck? thankyou for the content!
I’m surprised that you didn’t even put in a singular copy of that Bojuka Bog’ish cave.
not a cave tho
@@novelnouvel It is a cave. Pit of Offerings.
That last game was a preposterous come from behind win lol
cosium - up A beanstalk - gates - shigiiiiki .... I should be used to it by now but I swear seth is going to give me an aneurysm one of these days
“Is a 6/6 big enough?” Colossal Dreadmaw would like a word
Hey Seth, thanks for taking the time in Vegas to sign my sons playmat. He still brags about it.
Spelunking makes gates decks way better too. Drop the Maze's End untapped late game and then activate it for the win before opponent can play a sorcery speed answer (which most land destruction is). Perhaps a future video Seth/Goldfish?
this deck is sweet. im building it right away. gonna refine it the best i can. i've been waiting for so long for a fun meme deck to come along and cave tribal is dope.
I wonder when we'll get a Maskwood Nexus for lands that gives your lands every nonbasic land type?
that'd be so broken. acorn card nearby planet already feels broken, being all land types itself
Seth is excited Caves might be a new deck...but I fear Atraxa Ramp will just get an optional new Cave package.
This makes me think that Jorael and Tatiova might actually have a lands matter home. Adds card draw and evasion for the cave deck
ive been playin the heck out of this deck. its so good, i either sweep em or its a close, fun game. i highly recommend playing this deck
there's no longer a limit on the Wildcard bundle in arena! i don't know why there was one in the first place!
this deck need Tatyova, Steward of Tides to make the caves flying
super cool deck! although I think it would be a bit tedious to play on paper with all the library search + shuffle :P
"maybe X is actually good" is my favorite Sethism
A Caves / Discover list sounds fun
Also, if you make Bat Colony cost more mana, do you get more bats with more caves.
Asking for a lodestone friend.
I've been brewing a Zur Enchantment deck with Bat Colony. Not sure if the caves are worth the hit to the mana base but Bat Colony is powerful and slots right into Zur
I’ve been waiting for this one! Great content seth
Seems like the deck wants blossoming tortoise, not sure what to take out though.
Built this deck myself leech is where i started my cuts.
How do I build this deck in MTG Arena? I just started out. Thanks and thanks a ton for the superb content!!!! Big fan.
Follow the link in the description to the full article, from there you should be able to copy it to your clipboard to import it into Arena ((:
(Although I don't think the cards are actually on arena until tomorrow)
WE CAN’T STOP HERE. THIS IS BAT COLONY!
What do you think of caves in explorer/pioneer?
Seth: "So what did we learn this week?"
Me: "That we can now officially call ourselves cave dwellers? 👀"
39:51 and i saw another one. There is a missplay : play forest then sperlunking so you draw and if it's not a cave you play the forgotten monument you have in hand then gain 4 life ans it comes untap. You did this missplay twice in your video.
Inb4 MTG duel decks: Gates vs. Caves
Can't you just spend 2 mana to turn your cavernous maw into a 3/3 with +1/+1 counters on it?
The feel you have on this deck leads me to believe its best case scenario is probably temur control.
i like that this deck has so many difrent lines you can take and so many difrent ways of winning the game
do you have a upgraded version of it that non budget??
why are lands coming in untapped when Cosmium Confluence states Search your library for a Cave card, put it onto the battlefield tapped, then shuffle?
Because spelunking
Can't wait to see the update to this with a sideboard for Bo3
I really want to see an upgraded version of this deck with blossoming tortoise...
Also you can gain 4 life with spelunking so long as the land you play is a cave too.... That's not an irrelevant line of text on the card
16:11 you could have just activated with maw with 7 counters on it for lethal.
I just made this deck on Arena, and it works XD
@MTGGoldfish - What would you do to upgrade this deck?
Anyone count how many times he called caves gates? LOL Thanks for the great video as always. :)
Seth surprised that manlands are good... even Desol saw it coming since the spoilers, hehe.
Spelunking is gonna make gates great again.
That was the most hype thing I've ever seen
Like caves, because they have nice chill in middle of summer. But we have winter, so this deck will be off meta, try next summer in historic.
Ah Seth, Exploring a nonland to the top at 16:09 would have given you lethal. Sometimes, guaranteeing a +1/+1 counter is better than setting up potential future draws.
Edit: actually nevermind, you had to draw a land to use that last explore.
I can say that is a good deck for standart because of his versatility, is this a new gates deck?
drinking game: take a shot every time he says "I've always loved gates"
Every time Seth says Cavernous Maw I hear Cavern of Smaw.
Important note:
If this build seems _remotely_ interesting to you, build it fast; both *Shigeki* and *Skyturtle* rotate out next year.
How about you add Aftermath's "Rebuild the City"?
I'm seriously in love with this deck. I wonder if there ever will be a modern viable version of it
Imma going to be so depressed when this deck rotates out.
No universe where this is EVER modern viable.
Wouldn’t blossoming tortoise be very strong with this?
I hope you can teach arena zoomers the power of intruder alarm with the new merfolk enchantment! Combos for everyone!!
Nice deck, glad to see caves actually putting in some work. Ten rares isn't exactly a low amount in terms of MTGA wildcards but it's a decent paper deck potentially.
I don’t think anyone actually knows you as saffronolive, they know you as Sethprobablybetterknownassaffronolive.
I love this deck I upgraded it by jamming 4 blossoming turtles
Love this Idea. great deck sir
10:02 I haven't seen them in a while but I have played a couple games against gate decks and they owned me. I don't think they even had any creatures in the deck It was all just using the gates to shut me down.
I only started playing recently after not playing for a very very long time. I wasn't playing when the gates were released, so I'm kind of excited to see caves.
What cards should i swap out for if i wanted to play this deck on a bigger budget. Also what cards would be good for a sideboard so this can be played in best of three?
Kami war is VERY strong. Atraxa is also an obscene top end. Blossoming tortise is very strong as well. Makes your cavernous maws cheaper to activate and also lets you rebuy your caves youve used.
So far. I've cut the go for the throat for 2x Virtue of Persistence and 1x Path of Peril.
The hardest matchups so far are Aggro: Soldiers & Red. So adding a bit of life gain and more flexable removal helps, but its still the weakest point of it.
Also just having a top end of Virtue to just ramp into sometimes closes the game outright.
Urabrask's forge generally beats you 9 times out of 10 though.
I think the sideboard reflects what's the problems...
In control matchups I think you want to board in wren and worldbreaker (2)
I'm heavily considering Abraid, Brotherhood's end, and Loren of the Thrid Path.
Downside with Loren and Wren is that you can't get them with Shegeki loops, So that might be incorrect.
I think 2x Path of Peril is also correct in the board? Because i kind of feel that black/white is a bit easier that black-black?
Weird observation from playing, diversifying your mana-pips in your tech...almost makes it easier to cast in this deck. Your less likely to draw something that is just off color, if you have a bit of everything? But that's just my experince.
@TheFiretiger try incandescent aria. Its real good at stabilizing against aggressive decks if you just need an extra turn for the deck to get running
I've been hesitant to try the aria, but I might give it a shot just to see how it feels.
I was concidering sunset revalry for the potential blockers, life, card, time bye.
I'm a little shocked that so few people are brewing/iterateing on this deck online and ladder. Every other article post I've seen always reads for better top end like Itali, but I think the top end is perfectly fine. You can loop a wrath every turn. It's the early game survival that is the tension point.
@TheFiretiger the only top end ive really liked is atraxa honestly just because she has evasion and all the key words.
Any sideboard recommendations for BO3 for this deck?
Disdainful stroke, wedding announcements, incandescent aria is another sweeper for aggressive decks.
"Are cavegates a thing?!" "Can we make gatecaves a thing is cavedard?!" "Caves is legit a gate in gatedard?!"
-seth probably
"Am i a joke to you?!"
-shigeki turtle engine
With Standard moving to a new day I joked I was maybe going to try Cave Tribal.
....Now I'm wondering if we deck it out is it a Lands deck? Gates returned without as much gimmick? Can we kill people quoting Nissa without Nissa even being present? XD I kinda want to find out!
Though I'll probably just build it for Standard first. I have 150$ to drop on Merfolk as it is and then consider if I can go fin to toe with the store champs since I'll literally only be lacking Force of Negations.
Cosmium Confluence is insane with caves, 5 mana, get 3 lands or make a 9/9, 3 3/3s
Always a good idea to put all your triggers on the same creature so one removal spell cancels it all…..or so I learned was a bad idea on my second day of playing magic…..
Can't wait for Historic version of this deck
In Historic I think Gates might still be better, but you could do a lot of the same tricks with Caves for sure.
A deck where u can constantly wipe the board, have every threat with the opponent having to deal with only on your turn as well as playing all its spells by sacrificing and endless supply of returnable lands...
Think this might be pretty good yeah
Hard to judge how good a deck is from VIP day given everyone is just playing jank. But I do love gates so will most likely spin this up at some point too.
36:40 The way you're playing makes me think you don't realise that you can put cards into your hand with discover.
Am I nuts? I thought these cards werent out till tomorrow on arena
Opponents caved in to the deck
Mum can we play gates today?
Timmy we have gates at home
I was actually wanting to build this but looks like you beat me to it
Dope shirt bro
Get Lost seems like absolutely insane removal
Yeah, it's even better than I thought because Map tokens are worse than I expected.
I think Seth played a Polish MTG commentator in game 1
Since Rares are more plentiful than Mythics, I actually find that I tend to have more Mythic Wildcards than Rare
Can we get a non budget cave deck
Have people been trying this deck? I am getting abysmal results with it. I'm not a good player, but I usually score more than 1 in 15...
I've had moderate success with it.
Mostly I just want to play something different for a while, but I am struggling to tech' it correctly.
Urabrask's Forge is the actual bane of this deck, Aggro is actualy a really tough matchup.
Anything really grindy or control heavy you generally beat because the Turtle-Shegeki loop is un-counterable and lets you greed harder than their greed.
Variance is Variance.
I've cut the go for the throat for 2x Virtue of Persistence and 1x Path of Peril.
So adding a bit of lifegain and more flexable removal helps, but its still the weakest point of it (Mostly that I kept running into artifact threats that go for the throat couldn't touch)
Also just having a top end of Virtue to just ramp into sometimes closes the game outright.
Where is brewer's kitchen videos?
Legend says he was beat by a Legend using the same kind of deck
It may have been prerelease day, but Jank Spank is Jank Spank.