They would have the potential to be insanely good at their own thing, if naval battles were a thing, instead of both armies conveniently agreeing to land on the nearest island to fight a pitched battle.
I’ve gotten a victory screen with Noctilus holding no more than the Galleons Graveyard and a ton of coves. And could afford all my hoard armies and then some. The power of the coasts artillery and gunline is stacked. Coast slowly became my favorite faction. Always fun, chill, low maintenance campaign
@@BearPawSwipe only thing I wish they had was a canister shot option for the carronade, for once infantry closed in. Though, mortars are just fine for thinning out infantry. Oh, also wish Noctilus had a mixed Vamp/Deep lore. Would feel more thematic I think. But otherwise, faction is fine.
I disagree with this video. Vampire Coast is one of my favorite factions. Thats not the same as saying that they are strong or easy. Just that they are fun to play. You have two big problems with how you play them. 1) The army composition is wrong! Vampire coast is the only nation in the game that plays like its Empire Total War. With an army thats mostly a gunline of handgunners and artilery. Plus blockers and raiders that prevents the enemy from reaching your lines / shape the battlefield. Handgunners especially are brutal. If you compare them to empire handguns or Thunderers then they have 33-40% more entities and each attack does more damage. Especially the first volleys with the extra powder trait probably does 211% the damage of the empire equivalent (assuming they all hit). They are also cheaper! The drawback is that they reload slower and have worse accuracy. They also only have the mob formation and are very slow and terrible in melee. But overall they carry the faction and you dont even need to recruit them because they exist as a guaranteed raise dead in every region! Most other unit are designed to delay the enemy while they are being shot at by your ranged. Crabs are great at blocking enemy cavalry, Syreens are great at blocking infantry. They even have two different kinds of summons in their magic schools that summons deckhands and crabs as temporary blockers. Depth guards will be held in reserve to kill whatever things actually makes it to your lines. This kind of army is also pretty great in auto-resolve. Add to this fact that you can reduce the upkeep of Handgunners by about 83% means that you can get 26 gold upkeep per unit on your main lords. Or 93%, 10 gold for Luthor. (OK, plus supply lines) So the lack of economy is not as bad as you think.
Your second big problem is playing as Aranessa. She is the worst and least interesting lord in the faction! The other campaigns rely heavily on the fact that Cylostra and Noctilus are amazing one-man-doomstacks. I have seen Cylostra especially get 2k kills in a battle in WH2. Though Magic was stronger back then. Noctilus might also benefit from abandoning Ulthuan and going somewhere else as High elves are a bad matchup for the Coast with its long range archers and the coast's lack of armor and shields. Also, all the High Elf factions are programmed to hate anyone who owns any land on Ulthuan thats not them and will gang up on you. Better to sack them and make coves and sell back captured cities for peace and money. Luthor is kind of weak starting off too. He get strong after finishing his main quest though. If you feel that the amount of lords are limited you could also get the "Recruit Defeated Legendary Lords" mod. That way you usually get access to a couple of the other Coast lords.
My main critique as I'm currently at about 100th turn, is lack of progression. It feels like aside from big monsters my main handgunners/mortars core stayed with me since the very beginning. I feel like in my gobbos only playthrough I had more army building variety than here.
I enjoy playing the Vampirates. Count Noctilus is one of my favorite factions. Love sailing the ocean wrecking things and causing mayhem. Obliterating things with artillery and guns is so much fun. The Lore of the Deeps is also one of my favorite lores of magic.
Meh, they just don't feel like you're playing pirates. Occupying non-coastal settlements feels wrong, and the lack of naval battles certainly doesn't help. They're basically just Vampire Counts with a nautical theme. It's a rather boring experience overall.
@@BloodwyrmWildheartI don’t occupy a bunch of land when playing them. I stick to the seas and set up coves wherever I can. Holding only the Galleons graveyard (as Noctilus) or even just the Vampire Coast (as Harkon), I’ve won campaigns, affording a ton of fleets and guns for days. The coves are perfectly good income. You don’t have to paint the map to win.
@@djn6962 I think thats the main problem. People want to play them like empire builders and their just not that. You need to play them like pirates, just like you said control one province and wreck havoc around
Just a heads up, the reason why your alliance with Tyrion didn't last as Noctilus is a quest popup that involves you going to war with another faction - it's a bug that will break any and all of your military alliances (but not defensive ones, it seems), and that only applies to the VC as far as I know. Also, you were talking about vassals, but you probably know that they cannot vassalize at all. They also can't confederate, of course, leaving them with only defensive alliances as their best diplomatic option. In addition, you failed to mention the severe nerfs the VC has recieved from game 2 to 3 - nerfs to all ranged combat, nerfs to artillery (AI didn't dodge in WH2), nerfs to undead crumbling, nerfs to ship growth (T5 delayed by about 10 turns), nerfs to their income (a global 5% or so bonus was removed from the income building), the nerf to Syreens (they'd reach 85% to 90% physical resistance in campaign). Oh, and while they do get 30% campaign movement from ship buildings, they do not have the 25% provided by the hero embed action most races have acces to (and they have it for all armies, not just 5).
Vampire coast has also been buffed compared to WH2. Mainly in that vampiric corruption is no longer a detriment and they dont suffer order penalties in any place that does not have high corruption. But they do gain order bonuses where it is high. This means that you can build up your cities faster and can invest in other buildings.
I'll never understand why people think fighting "too many" Total War battles manually is a bad thing. That's always been the most fun part of TW games. Sure, there are issues about battles that CA needs to fix, but that's what the complaint should be. If you want easy strategy-focused games, there's always Civ.
Costin should probably say he is coming with a take/hot take instead of discussion at the start of his videos since a monologue cannot be a discussion. It would become one once he gets responses in the comments or invited someone on.
I find a really effective strategy for mid-late game is having an army of 19 mortars accompany each of your armies. This requires resources and extra management but you can mostly set them to AI control in battles (though it's much more fun to control). Even early game I'll have my LL accompanied by a lord with 19 mortars, would highly recommend trying the strat. Count Noc is great.
They need to double down on pirate coves. Add buildings that provide better income, hero capacity, lord recruitment rank, army recruitment capabilities etc etc. Cus if you can't hold territory cus you only have a few armies, then you should just have other factions do it for you. Another change id like to see is that instead of a pirate cove dying when a settlement is razed is that it lingers and that if no faction claims the ruin within X number of turns it reverts to your control as a ruin. The cove would still stick around even if you own the settlement. And further on that, i think you should auto set up pirate coves wihout needing to do a specific action.
Starting location means so much. Aranessa in Old World is a pretty easy start. Gor Rok on Albion, I just can't make it work. The inhospitable terrain is just screwing me over.
It's really funny how this is one of my favorite races in the game despite all this. If they got some TLC and became even better they very possibly could just flat out BE my favorite race.
Honestly my biggest gripe with Vampire Coast is just gunpowder being so shit in WH3. I could look over a lot of the other flaws if atleast the one true USP of the coast (a lot of f.cking guns) were more fun and impactful.
I just started Aranessa in Old World and I'm loving it. I had never tried them because everyone hates on them. Love the office system, (straight outta 3kibgdoms), only partially dependant on the boats (unlike dark elves), port cults (just a lil extra), lotsa shooty troops (not a huge fan of rush armies). I think she's my 2bd favorite lord right now
Same here, I was holding on buying this DLC because of Costin's reviews on them, but found out that a lot of other streamers are considering them a very fun race to play. Bought it, tried it and for me it was really fun and easy campaign, played Luther Harkon, but only on hard because of so many bad opinions on their strength. The only think I didn't like were sieges, where your units are shit and they were taking me 40+ minutes :/ But it was fun to sail and attack every settlement you see near the coast, not worrying that they can take the settlement back if you are just establishing the cove :)
@@Costin_Gaming Kislev isn't bad, do they have a rough start yes. But once you get them rolling they are actually VERY good. I don't think there is any BAD races except maybe the Tomb Kings, and its not because their army is terrible, but rather because they are sort of stuck in the desert and once you take over desert which takes maybe 30-40 turns, there isn't really anything more to do with them as pretty much every other region is uninhabitable for them.
I don't have TW3, but I play TW2 a fair bit still. I found the most consistant way to win is to run around in groups of two, one with crabs, guns and melee, and a second army of a lord and 19 deckhands with polearms. Nothing can beat that combo without heavy reinforcements. I would agree they have alot of issues. Some are: -Deckhands with polearms & the elite version of the polearms forgot their name both lose to monsterous units in melee, or can't kill them fast enough, so they cannot protect your artillery or ranged units from fast flying units or fast cav. -Front line units may have high hp, but their extremely low leadership means they crumble too fast, and that crumble dps really hurts them. -limited hero slots -Their low tier monsterous infantry unit forgot its name, the anti infantry one, needs to cause terror, it only causes fear. Have you seen how scary they look? Underpowered unit. -Gunnery Mobs were over nerfed because of multiplayer. Please seperate multiplayer and singleplayer balance, or this happens. -no identity for the deckhand mobs with the swords, because polearms are a better unit. no reason to use this unit. -Pirate coves has conflicting mechanics with the faction, they suck. -Poor economy. -AI pirate factions always lose in combat, even to other AI. i'm sure theres more...
I only played a little of WH 2 (and then only Lizardmen) so I wanted to ask, what IS the change they made to gunpowder units? I understand they have a very flat curve of trajectory for their projectiles, which makes sense and thus are more easily screwed over by slight terrain discrepancies (It's amazing that you literally have to zoom in on ground level to see that they can barely look over a slight hump) but apart from that, what is their problem?
One of the biggest problem i found (despite all the video says) is the functioning of pirate coves. Has 15 turns cooldown for each hero + 15 turns of double cost (wtf). The option to do a Pirate cove on a raid its useless, because you can´t let an enemy faction alive (i did with lizards and omg, what a nightmare). They should add an option to make a pirate cove on a capured settlement, so you can "sell" the settlement to another faction with a "gift" inside. They just can adjust the income to make it more fun/useful mechanic, not as the actual rate. Btw i just finished a Noctilus campaing (long victory, not total domination), Legendary+very hard. never been on positive income xDDDDD
They were amazing in 2 for sure. After the general ranged nerfs and changes from 2 to 3 they fell off very hard. Lot of races got updates to their ranged units and artillery as well in 3 while the vampirates got.. nothing. Their gun units fall over with a moderate breeze of the wind and their arty can barely break 200 value. Depth guard used to be amazing but again fell off when other factions received updates/buffs. The only viable way to stay alive past the early game is to rush necrofex colossus doomstack and play super sweaty. Pirate coves are also very lackluster, it takes 30+ coves to reach the economic capability of any other faction that you can play. They are a super cool faction but they seriously need attention from CA.
With risking to spam things a little on your videos, I definitely agree with most points here. Winning a campaign is never the issue with this game. Having fun and not breaking the keyboard on the AI cheats is. Vcoast are severely underpowered, as you say. Only one LL, guns are much worse than archers now due to range changes... unless youd spam deck gunners, but then you have to pray, because a single breeze can make them crumble. Their artillery is decidedly mid, so is the necrofex in Wh3. Queen Bess is nice, but you get one. Chorfs get as much as they want. So do TK with the Casket. And BOTH of those are better than Bessy anyway. Their fun factor was in the Vortex... when they came out, they were the must fun race. Coves have been surpassed by under-empires and now Changeling. Infamy doesnt matter outside of Vortex. They never got the sea monsters, not even as a mechanic or rite in ME/IE. Pirate rogue armies are there for everyone (and AI never kills any of them, so its always all yours). Treasure hunts are WORSE than Ogre contracts. Theyre what I consider a challenging race in Wh3. Not strong, mid at best... probably not even that, because their starts suck. Two goes against elves, archer-heavy factions. Luthor against Lizards, Aranessa against Dwarfs and again, Wood Elves... besides Men, sure. Empire gonna outshoot and outpower you economically. Bretonnia will bring the cavalry stacks. Enjoy being in the Old World as Aranessa, one of the top3 worst LL in the game. When you said theyre a limited race, you hit the nail on the head. Thats exactly how it feels playing them now. Youre deciding to play something thats not as fun or strong as most other factions.
They could definitely use a rework. They are one of my favorite factions in battle and thematically, but much like the Ogres, their mechanics are frustrating and garbage. In comparison to Chaos Dwarves, Skave, even something like Grom for Orkz, it's just a tedious mess and feels like it's fighting against you rather than empowering you.
Also nurgle has more late game power than VC since Exalted heroes, GUO, Chosens, Daemon princes and other high tier units have a lot of HP, healing, resistance and MD and not counting the recipe plagues that buff them up, late game vampirates have units that can hardly shoot and necrofex that is expensive. The entire faction has too muich thrown at it without sticking with a theme, they have rites, treasures, coves, infamy, trade, land empires, hordes and positions.
Like Norsca the Vampire Coasts are a faction with a awesome theme and little support to make it work. I really don't know if CA will tackle this factions since they need a good amount of love even tough they are less popular.
It has everything from other races but is so poorly implemented, if anything the pirates should have only one settlement and the rest coves or pirate ships (ala black arks).
The only thing keeping me from old world is the same thing that keeps me liking the vampire coast. Aesthetic/immersion. The VC is so bad but their theming is so amazing. Alternatively, Old world hopefully should include the rest of the map at some point, because I just cant get around lizardmen or other factions in places they absolutely should not be and make no sense. I gotta be able to have some internal story going.
They aren't a weak race they are a different race. They aren't meant to be played the same as other factions. You aren't trying for global domination with 20 armies roaming around. You only need a couple armies running around collecting the pieces of 8. They aren't a standard faction, they are a niche faction.
If you are interested in what "leggends of totale war" said, the vampire coast fail as a race because of the huge difference between the 3 high tier doomstack units (still you will use only one that is very superior to the other 2) and the low level units. In the very early game you'll spam zombies, then you can only try to rush a doomstack because all the 1-2 tier units are too much bad to consistently win battles.
Not sure what are you talking about. Legends' rating of factions for VC: Noctilus - OP. Luter and Sylostra - Strong. Aranessa - weak. Nobody cares for Aranessa's ogres and militia - they are weak. Campaign is boring. "They have decent units. They've got some CRAPPY units but at least they are cheap. But some very powerful units later down the track. They have some good faction mechanics and their economy is pretty good". It just sounds like Costin is playing a different game/a game in a very different way. Which is fine: it is an opinion of a fellow player in Warhammer community. We all have races we like and race we don't. Anyway, I keep saying that Costin is just doesn't enjoy certain races and their intended playstyle, which is enforced through the game design. He is very focused on design (map, economy, abilities, etc.)
they are just like ogres but in sea, lack of gold in the beginning. Very hard to upgrade things, but I enjoy the units. They just melt anything in range.
@@Costin_Gaming The composition of your army vs the enemy army is much more favorable on an easier difficulty, no? You DONT have to fight t3 with t1 only on normal. But if you still think than an artillery and powder faction with a quest battle win condition is inadequate, i disagree. Unless of course, you listened to Harkon and went to make a LAND empire in the JUNGlES of Lustria.
They would have the potential to be insanely good at their own thing, if naval battles were a thing, instead of both armies conveniently agreeing to land on the nearest island to fight a pitched battle.
I’ve gotten a victory screen with Noctilus holding no more than the Galleons Graveyard and a ton of coves. And could afford all my hoard armies and then some. The power of the coasts artillery and gunline is stacked.
Coast slowly became my favorite faction. Always fun, chill, low maintenance campaign
Mix in the monsters and it is great! I love the coast.
@@BearPawSwipe only thing I wish they had was a canister shot option for the carronade, for once infantry closed in. Though, mortars are just fine for thinning out infantry.
Oh, also wish Noctilus had a mixed Vamp/Deep lore. Would feel more thematic I think. But otherwise, faction is fine.
@@djn6962All good suggestions! I completely agree on Noctilus. He should have a blended set of spells because he is a von Carstein.
I disagree with this video. Vampire Coast is one of my favorite factions. Thats not the same as saying that they are strong or easy. Just that they are fun to play.
You have two big problems with how you play them. 1) The army composition is wrong! Vampire coast is the only nation in the game that plays like its Empire Total War. With an army thats mostly a gunline of handgunners and artilery. Plus blockers and raiders that prevents the enemy from reaching your lines / shape the battlefield. Handgunners especially are brutal. If you compare them to empire handguns or Thunderers then they have 33-40% more entities and each attack does more damage. Especially the first volleys with the extra powder trait probably does 211% the damage of the empire equivalent (assuming they all hit). They are also cheaper! The drawback is that they reload slower and have worse accuracy. They also only have the mob formation and are very slow and terrible in melee.
But overall they carry the faction and you dont even need to recruit them because they exist as a guaranteed raise dead in every region!
Most other unit are designed to delay the enemy while they are being shot at by your ranged. Crabs are great at blocking enemy cavalry, Syreens are great at blocking infantry. They even have two different kinds of summons in their magic schools that summons deckhands and crabs as temporary blockers. Depth guards will be held in reserve to kill whatever things actually makes it to your lines.
This kind of army is also pretty great in auto-resolve.
Add to this fact that you can reduce the upkeep of Handgunners by about 83% means that you can get 26 gold upkeep per unit on your main lords. Or 93%, 10 gold for Luthor. (OK, plus supply lines) So the lack of economy is not as bad as you think.
Your second big problem is playing as Aranessa. She is the worst and least interesting lord in the faction! The other campaigns rely heavily on the fact that Cylostra and Noctilus are amazing one-man-doomstacks. I have seen Cylostra especially get 2k kills in a battle in WH2. Though Magic was stronger back then. Noctilus might also benefit from abandoning Ulthuan and going somewhere else as High elves are a bad matchup for the Coast with its long range archers and the coast's lack of armor and shields.
Also, all the High Elf factions are programmed to hate anyone who owns any land on Ulthuan thats not them and will gang up on you. Better to sack them and make coves and sell back captured cities for peace and money.
Luthor is kind of weak starting off too. He get strong after finishing his main quest though.
If you feel that the amount of lords are limited you could also get the "Recruit Defeated Legendary Lords" mod. That way you usually get access to a couple of the other Coast lords.
My main critique as I'm currently at about 100th turn, is lack of progression. It feels like aside from big monsters my main handgunners/mortars core stayed with me since the very beginning. I feel like in my gobbos only playthrough I had more army building variety than here.
I enjoy playing the Vampirates. Count Noctilus is one of my favorite factions. Love sailing the ocean wrecking things and causing mayhem. Obliterating things with artillery and guns is so much fun. The Lore of the Deeps is also one of my favorite lores of magic.
Meh, they just don't feel like you're playing pirates. Occupying non-coastal settlements feels wrong, and the lack of naval battles certainly doesn't help.
They're basically just Vampire Counts with a nautical theme. It's a rather boring experience overall.
@@BloodwyrmWildheart And with guns. Lots of guns.
@@BloodwyrmWildheartI don’t occupy a bunch of land when playing them. I stick to the seas and set up coves wherever I can. Holding only the Galleons graveyard (as Noctilus) or even just the Vampire Coast (as Harkon), I’ve won campaigns, affording a ton of fleets and guns for days. The coves are perfectly good income. You don’t have to paint the map to win.
@@djn6962 I think thats the main problem. People want to play them like empire builders and their just not that. You need to play them like pirates, just like you said control one province and wreck havoc around
@@markomarkulincic2621 I mean I just take the doughnut and go from there
Just a heads up, the reason why your alliance with Tyrion didn't last as Noctilus is a quest popup that involves you going to war with another faction - it's a bug that will break any and all of your military alliances (but not defensive ones, it seems), and that only applies to the VC as far as I know. Also, you were talking about vassals, but you probably know that they cannot vassalize at all. They also can't confederate, of course, leaving them with only defensive alliances as their best diplomatic option.
In addition, you failed to mention the severe nerfs the VC has recieved from game 2 to 3 - nerfs to all ranged combat, nerfs to artillery (AI didn't dodge in WH2), nerfs to undead crumbling, nerfs to ship growth (T5 delayed by about 10 turns), nerfs to their income (a global 5% or so bonus was removed from the income building), the nerf to Syreens (they'd reach 85% to 90% physical resistance in campaign).
Oh, and while they do get 30% campaign movement from ship buildings, they do not have the 25% provided by the hero embed action most races have acces to (and they have it for all armies, not just 5).
Heh let's just I wasn't a VC player in 2, that bad eh?
And yeah I know they can't vassalize.
Vampire coast has also been buffed compared to WH2. Mainly in that vampiric corruption is no longer a detriment and they dont suffer order penalties in any place that does not have high corruption. But they do gain order bonuses where it is high. This means that you can build up your cities faster and can invest in other buildings.
I'll never understand why people think fighting "too many" Total War battles manually is a bad thing. That's always been the most fun part of TW games. Sure, there are issues about battles that CA needs to fix, but that's what the complaint should be. If you want easy strategy-focused games, there's always Civ.
To specify when I say that I don't mean field battles against peer armies, or field battles in general.
I mean garrisons.
It took me much longer to beat civ 6 on deity than Warhammer 3 on legendary, just sayin
Costin should probably say he is coming with a take/hot take instead of discussion at the start of his videos since a monologue cannot be a discussion. It would become one once he gets responses in the comments or invited someone on.
My favourite race hands down!
I find a really effective strategy for mid-late game is having an army of 19 mortars accompany each of your armies.
This requires resources and extra management but you can mostly set them to AI control in battles (though it's much more fun to control).
Even early game I'll have my LL accompanied by a lord with 19 mortars, would highly recommend trying the strat. Count Noc is great.
They need to double down on pirate coves. Add buildings that provide better income, hero capacity, lord recruitment rank, army recruitment capabilities etc etc. Cus if you can't hold territory cus you only have a few armies, then you should just have other factions do it for you. Another change id like to see is that instead of a pirate cove dying when a settlement is razed is that it lingers and that if no faction claims the ruin within X number of turns it reverts to your control as a ruin. The cove would still stick around even if you own the settlement. And further on that, i think you should auto set up pirate coves wihout needing to do a specific action.
Starting location means so much. Aranessa in Old World is a pretty easy start. Gor Rok on Albion, I just can't make it work. The inhospitable terrain is just screwing me over.
I installed a mod that removes climate penalties and it's very nice
@@Hatredcptr666 we talked about it and ultimately chose not to . Kicking my butt now
A living pirate faction and 70% of her roster is made of undead and vampires... Cmon CA.
It's really funny how this is one of my favorite races in the game despite all this. If they got some TLC and became even better they very possibly could just flat out BE my favorite race.
Honestly my biggest gripe with Vampire Coast is just gunpowder being so shit in WH3. I could look over a lot of the other flaws if atleast the one true USP of the coast (a lot of f.cking guns) were more fun and impactful.
I just started Aranessa in Old World and I'm loving it. I had never tried them because everyone hates on them. Love the office system, (straight outta 3kibgdoms), only partially dependant on the boats (unlike dark elves), port cults (just a lil extra), lotsa shooty troops (not a huge fan of rush armies). I think she's my 2bd favorite lord right now
Same here, I was holding on buying this DLC because of Costin's reviews on them, but found out that a lot of other streamers are considering them a very fun race to play. Bought it, tried it and for me it was really fun and easy campaign, played Luther Harkon, but only on hard because of so many bad opinions on their strength. The only think I didn't like were sieges, where your units are shit and they were taking me 40+ minutes :/
But it was fun to sail and attack every settlement you see near the coast, not worrying that they can take the settlement back if you are just establishing the cove :)
Enjoy what you enjoy. I mean I enjoy playing Kislev even though they are bad.
It's all about figuring a campaign dynamic that works.
@@Costin_Gaming i also play heavily modded, so that affects faction weaknesses
@@Costin_Gaming Kislev isn't bad, do they have a rough start yes. But once you get them rolling they are actually VERY good. I don't think there is any BAD races except maybe the Tomb Kings, and its not because their army is terrible, but rather because they are sort of stuck in the desert and once you take over desert which takes maybe 30-40 turns, there isn't really anything more to do with them as pretty much every other region is uninhabitable for them.
I don't have TW3, but I play TW2 a fair bit still. I found the most consistant way to win is to run around in groups of two, one with crabs, guns and melee, and a second army of a lord and 19 deckhands with polearms. Nothing can beat that combo without heavy reinforcements. I would agree they have alot of issues. Some are:
-Deckhands with polearms & the elite version of the polearms forgot their name both lose to monsterous units in melee, or can't kill them fast enough, so they cannot protect your artillery or ranged units from fast flying units or fast cav.
-Front line units may have high hp, but their extremely low leadership means they crumble too fast, and that crumble dps really hurts them.
-limited hero slots
-Their low tier monsterous infantry unit forgot its name, the anti infantry one, needs to cause terror, it only causes fear. Have you seen how scary they look? Underpowered unit.
-Gunnery Mobs were over nerfed because of multiplayer. Please seperate multiplayer and singleplayer balance, or this happens.
-no identity for the deckhand mobs with the swords, because polearms are a better unit. no reason to use this unit.
-Pirate coves has conflicting mechanics with the faction, they suck.
-Poor economy.
-AI pirate factions always lose in combat, even to other AI.
i'm sure theres more...
I only played a little of WH 2 (and then only Lizardmen) so I wanted to ask, what IS the change they made to gunpowder units? I understand they have a very flat curve of trajectory for their projectiles, which makes sense and thus are more easily screwed over by slight terrain discrepancies (It's amazing that you literally have to zoom in on ground level to see that they can barely look over a slight hump) but apart from that, what is their problem?
One of the biggest problem i found (despite all the video says) is the functioning of pirate coves. Has 15 turns cooldown for each hero + 15 turns of double cost (wtf). The option to do a Pirate cove on a raid its useless, because you can´t let an enemy faction alive (i did with lizards and omg, what a nightmare). They should add an option to make a pirate cove on a capured settlement, so you can "sell" the settlement to another faction with a "gift" inside. They just can adjust the income to make it more fun/useful mechanic, not as the actual rate. Btw i just finished a Noctilus campaing (long victory, not total domination), Legendary+very hard. never been on positive income xDDDDD
But sea shanty's and yo hos :(
They were amazing in 2 for sure. After the general ranged nerfs and changes from 2 to 3 they fell off very hard. Lot of races got updates to their ranged units and artillery as well in 3 while the vampirates got.. nothing. Their gun units fall over with a moderate breeze of the wind and their arty can barely break 200 value. Depth guard used to be amazing but again fell off when other factions received updates/buffs. The only viable way to stay alive past the early game is to rush necrofex colossus doomstack and play super sweaty. Pirate coves are also very lackluster, it takes 30+ coves to reach the economic capability of any other faction that you can play. They are a super cool faction but they seriously need attention from CA.
Thank you, that somebody say it.👍👍👍
Yes. The dynamic between get a normal or a pirat port is so awful. It makes the campaign so strange to play. 😢
With risking to spam things a little on your videos, I definitely agree with most points here. Winning a campaign is never the issue with this game. Having fun and not breaking the keyboard on the AI cheats is.
Vcoast are severely underpowered, as you say. Only one LL, guns are much worse than archers now due to range changes... unless youd spam deck gunners, but then you have to pray, because a single breeze can make them crumble. Their artillery is decidedly mid, so is the necrofex in Wh3. Queen Bess is nice, but you get one. Chorfs get as much as they want. So do TK with the Casket. And BOTH of those are better than Bessy anyway.
Their fun factor was in the Vortex... when they came out, they were the must fun race. Coves have been surpassed by under-empires and now Changeling. Infamy doesnt matter outside of Vortex. They never got the sea monsters, not even as a mechanic or rite in ME/IE. Pirate rogue armies are there for everyone (and AI never kills any of them, so its always all yours). Treasure hunts are WORSE than Ogre contracts.
Theyre what I consider a challenging race in Wh3. Not strong, mid at best... probably not even that, because their starts suck. Two goes against elves, archer-heavy factions. Luthor against Lizards, Aranessa against Dwarfs and again, Wood Elves... besides Men, sure. Empire gonna outshoot and outpower you economically. Bretonnia will bring the cavalry stacks. Enjoy being in the Old World as Aranessa, one of the top3 worst LL in the game.
When you said theyre a limited race, you hit the nail on the head. Thats exactly how it feels playing them now. Youre deciding to play something thats not as fun or strong as most other factions.
They could definitely use a rework. They are one of my favorite factions in battle and thematically, but much like the Ogres, their mechanics are frustrating and garbage. In comparison to Chaos Dwarves, Skave, even something like Grom for Orkz, it's just a tedious mess and feels like it's fighting against you rather than empowering you.
Also nurgle has more late game power than VC since Exalted heroes, GUO, Chosens, Daemon princes and other high tier units have a lot of HP, healing, resistance and MD and not counting the recipe plagues that buff them up, late game vampirates have units that can hardly shoot and necrofex that is expensive. The entire faction has too muich thrown at it without sticking with a theme, they have rites, treasures, coves, infamy, trade, land empires, hordes and positions.
I recently play Aranessa with only one settlement. I just want to "see the sea", do pirate things and don't care much for "land lovers" 😄
Like Norsca the Vampire Coasts are a faction with a awesome theme and little support to make it work. I really don't know if CA will tackle this factions since they need a good amount of love even tough they are less popular.
It has everything from other races but is so poorly implemented, if anything the pirates should have only one settlement and the rest coves or pirate ships (ala black arks).
The only thing keeping me from old world is the same thing that keeps me liking the vampire coast. Aesthetic/immersion. The VC is so bad but their theming is so amazing. Alternatively, Old world hopefully should include the rest of the map at some point, because I just cant get around lizardmen or other factions in places they absolutely should not be and make no sense. I gotta be able to have some internal story going.
Norsca:" Hold my beard"
They aren't a weak race they are a different race. They aren't meant to be played the same as other factions. You aren't trying for global domination with 20 armies roaming around. You only need a couple armies running around collecting the pieces of 8. They aren't a standard faction, they are a niche faction.
Vampire Coast needs a remake. Leadership is very low and we can't keep units fighting for too long.
Skill issue
Did you manage to watch the video without understanding his points?
If you are interested in what "leggends of totale war" said, the vampire coast fail as a race because of the huge difference between the 3 high tier doomstack units (still you will use only one that is very superior to the other 2) and the low level units.
In the very early game you'll spam zombies, then you can only try to rush a doomstack because all the 1-2 tier units are too much bad to consistently win battles.
Not sure what are you talking about. Legends' rating of factions for VC: Noctilus - OP. Luter and Sylostra - Strong. Aranessa - weak. Nobody cares for Aranessa's ogres and militia - they are weak. Campaign is boring.
"They have decent units. They've got some CRAPPY units but at least they are cheap. But some very powerful units later down the track. They have some good faction mechanics and their economy is pretty good".
It just sounds like Costin is playing a different game/a game in a very different way.
Which is fine: it is an opinion of a fellow player in Warhammer community. We all have races we like and race we don't.
Anyway, I keep saying that Costin is just doesn't enjoy certain races and their intended playstyle, which is enforced through the game design. He is very focused on design (map, economy, abilities, etc.)
@@Xrono666 he said that during a live, not during an analysis video.
they are just like ogres but in sea, lack of gold in the beginning. Very hard to upgrade things, but I enjoy the units. They just melt anything in range.
I've never had an issue with upgrading things, maybe you are playing them wrong.
Think it boils down to skill, VC is FAR from an awful race.....
Wasted Potential for a vampire counts dlc in the life cylce of tww2
RACIST
And during all those hours didnt it come to you that the game isnt and shouldnt be balanced for legendary? Also mods.
What an argument.
Legendary changes squat in terms of faction imbalance. The races that are strong on Legendary are just are strong on Normal.
@@Costin_Gaming The composition of your army vs the enemy army is much more favorable on an easier difficulty, no? You DONT have to fight t3 with t1 only on normal. But if you still think than an artillery and powder faction with a quest battle win condition is inadequate, i disagree. Unless of course, you listened to Harkon and went to make a LAND empire in the JUNGlES of Lustria.