A roller delayed blowback Gewehr 43, better too. Had the Germans perfected the roller delay earlier, Gewehr 43 would've been replace the bolt actions in service. Gerat 06 would be replacing SMGs for the officers.
The flapper-locking system of the G43 (and many firearms before it) was the basis for roller-locking, which became the basis for roller-delayed blowback. So in a sense, they're almost, sorta related to the G43. I think they could certainly be used in military service in the mid-war period, had they existed back then. :)
My father has a SL7. I helped him clean and oil it when I was a kid and got to shoot it a few times, so I#m a bit disappointed that it doesn't get disassembled in this video, because that would have given me some childhood nostalgia, but haven't seen it since my childhood. It is sitting in his gun safe and he hasn't shot it in about 30 years either. (He had a bunch of strokes 15 to 20 years ago and can't anymore, but even before that he hadn't touched it in many years. He apparently got bored with range shooting and only did skeet shooting for the last 10 years or so before his first stroke.) He was a Bundeswehr soldier in the 70s and 80s and a reserve soldier in the 80s add early 90s and he wanted to get something as close to his service rifle as possible, but back then there still was a weird and silly law in Germany, forbidding private citizens from owning guns that looked too much like military rifles. I only recently learned that that law was repealed a while back and that civilians are allowed to own "military looking" semi auto rifles like the AR-15 in Germany nowadays. Back in the 80s and 90s, this one here was as close as you could get. I think he, being a former soldier who was used to the G3 as a service rifle and wanting to own something as close to that as possible, was typical for just the market H&K was aiming for with those guns. Nowadays the small gun enthusiast community in Germany is a lot more like the one in the USA. It is all about what accessories you put on your AR-15 and tactical gear and guns that are cool because they were featured in a movie and so on.
Colonel Angus Higher quality than a Mini-14/30 is a given. Even Ruger's own competition team in the Shooting Industry Masters used Model 77s instead of Mini-14s because of the Mini's accuracy issues. It's mostly a dig at H&K taking something that's been around for ages, charging 3-4 times the price, and calling it revolutionary. They're probably great rifles. So is an M1 Garand/M1A. So is an SVT-40. So is the Gewehr 43. There's nothing new here. Just a good rifle with magical teutonic H&K runes on the receive that somehow makes their stocks more pretty, their receivers more expensive, and their barrels more exotic. Just like the HK416. No other company before H&K thought to put a piston on a Stoner design (the rumors that people have been doing that for decades are just lies, H&K lawyers are already in-bound with cease and desist letters). H&K did it, and *POOF*. Revolutionary and innovative and shit. Now give us $2300.
Eh, I'm not an HK apologist. I think they are overpriced and overhyped. But I haven't seen them claim that this is revolutionary or anything. It's just a sporting version of their military rifles' action. Germany has specific laws on the books that prevent arms manufacturers from selling the military version of their wares to civilians.
+matchesburn The roller locking system is pretty unique to HK and the Mini-14 is basically a clone of the old M1 Garand/M-14 action with the gas system below the barrel and the external operating rod, rotating bolt etc. The Mini-14 was more like a poor man's M1A if you ask me. I mean, I like Ruger, and I like the Mini-14 but an M1A was twice the price when they came out in the 70's and surely much more accurate.
+matchesburn Wrong, the Mini-14 was designed for Bill Ruger by Jim Sullivan and is a scaled down, slightly modified Garand action. They only similarities the Mini-14 shares with H&K anything is they both have barrels and bullets come out of them. Jim Sullivan is one of the people that designed the AR-15 and subsequent M-16 lineage. The AR-15 was a scaled down design of Stoner's AR-10. A lot of people think the AR-15 was Eugene Stoner's design but it is not technically directly his. Jim Sullivan is an under-appreciated and talented man and has a lot of guns to his credit. Ian @ Forgotten Weapons did several interviews with him, I highly recommend watching them. I like H&K and they have some fantastic guns but they are not faultless. They are overpriced in many cases, they can make very fine quality, but guns like the 91, MP5's etc are not worth what they ask. As far as H&K never changing.... they have held on to that pretty tightly and that probably has a lot to do with their bankruptcy. They don't know how to listen and have been suckling the teat of military contract for so long they have ignored important markets. Just like Colt here in the states. Colt is a gung-ho about military contract and and not give two shits about civies till it was too late and they were already swirling the toilet bowl. Colt is better at funding bankruptcy then they are at making guns. Had H&K been more open to civilian markets (the US), perhaps they would have had some money. What was the definition of insanity again? Keep trying the same thing over and over and expecting a different result? Some companies evolve and continue to move forward, many wither on the vine at their own devices.
I own a SL7 and I can only relate my impression that these are really good guns. One point of correction, though, there are 20-round factory magazines for sale for this rifle. They are very rare and expensive (last one I saw went over the table for 300€) but they exist.
+Mirdarion I had major issues with my PTR-91, wasn't chambered right. Too much space causing constant jams. Was horrible. $2000 down the drain (Then, it got stolen) - Suckers.
From what I read this gun was originally developed as a practice weapon for german reserve troops (hence their civilian hunting appearance however the actual hunting rifle version of the SL-7 used a different sight).
He has to find one first. Getting access to rare and odd Russian weapons isn't necessarily simple to do. But if we're wishing for him to review some of these, then I'd love to see any of the following... I hope for one of those TOZ bolt action underfolder short-barrel shotgun things Or an NRS-2 silent Spetsnaz gun/knife/multitool Or a PSS silent autoloading pistol
Watching this video again such a long time later, it suddenly occurred to me that the reason why they changed the position of the charging handle is probably because the gun lacks a pistol grip. With the military rifles you can exert enough force on the pistol grip to counteract the force you have to put into working the charging handle. The same action would be much harder on these rifles because they have a semi-pistol grip stock.
I saw one of these in the firearms section of a camping store here in Australia a few years ago and didn't know what it was. Cool to find out a bit more about them.
Nice video! Glad you didn't try to demonstrate field stripping the SL-6 or SL-7. I own an SL-6 and know that the gun can be field stripped only with difficulty, and tools are needed. The gun is equally difficult to reassemble. This is very different from any other gun that H&K has made, where they seem to pride themselves on ease of disassembly. Also, the flush fitting magazine on the SL-6 holds five rounds rather than three.
Yep... Way back in the day, I almost bought one of these. A cool mix of 'sporter' and aggressive military functionally (What I like). Now, lookin' at this, I regret I didn't... DAMN! >_
Saw these two in 1986..worked at a gun store in Pompano Beach ..guy had all sorta exotic guns..many 80s era Springfield Armory stuff.. and these two. They looked like G41s
These, along with the Mod 300 & 270, are wonderful, rugged, accurate rifles. Very desirable. The Mod. 270 (.22 LR) has a great feature - you can drop the entire trigger assembly with the push of a button, great for keeping it safe from young fingers!
Being trained on the G3 when I was a soldier in the Bundeswehr and owning a SL6 for 27 years now, I'd still prefer the bolt handle to be on the left side. Especially when shooting from.prone position.
hey ian, the sl-guns were mainly intended to be reserve duty guns. they were mentioned for sights-training and field strip training. there are no police units in germany that used sl-guns. some special-police-forces just used the g1 (fn-fal) and a paramilitary-unit is not existing here in germany. yes you can buy these guns as a civilian but only with a 3-round magazine. for the 10-round magazine you need a special-permission of the german army AND you have to be a reserve-duty-soldier. but anyway, thank you for the good work and for the upload.
+no name available Your facts seem wrong to me. The 3-round magazine is only necessary for hunting. 10-round magazines are freely available to all civilians for purchase in Germany. Magazines are not considered a necessary part of a firearm in Germany - meaning they can be bought by people who have no license for owning guns.
+Michael Schulz for hunting? nope, in germany are only 2-round mags allowed... for hunters. 3rd round in the chaimber might be legal, but certainly no more than 2 rounds in the magazine.
+no name available This magazine thing sounds new to me. But it might be a reason why it is hard and very expensive to get a 10rd mag for the SL6 here in Germany. Fortunately it is quite easy to convert AR15 mags to fit into the SL6.
I love these rifles, but they have two shortcomings: a very heavy working recoil spring - nearly impossible to load the rifle without pressing the weapon in your shoulder or against your hip- and second: the nerving screw, which needs to be turned out in order to disassemble the rifle. I think both shortcomings occurred only because the design of the weapons was fully dominating technical and practical features. To understand that it is necessary to know that from the 1970s - 2003 Germany banned all self loading rifles from the market, which resembled somehow to assault rifles. This 'appearance clause' in the German Weapon Law said that typical features for an assault rifle look are: e.g. flash hiders, bayonet mounts, non wood/ plastic-covered weapon casings, pistol grips, ventilation holes... At this time all civilian G3 variants were banned, and for example the flash hiders of Tokarevs were cut away, ventilation holes covered. Garands lost their bayonet mounts etc. At the same time ten thousand of conscripts left the German Army year by year and there was a relevant market for reservist willing to train 'at home' with a G3-like rifle. Heckler & Koch's answer was to create a weapon with no resemblance to an assault rifle, but as close to the G3 as possible.
ah the tactical 3 round magazine. for hunting in most states in the USA, the mighty Berthier, and ammo on a diet, which im sure everyone can relate to.
I would love to see a demonstratiin of these rifles at the range. In a way, they remind me a little of the FN 49 I grew up shooting, but with shorter ranged drum sights. Our FN 49 (7.92x57) was part of a consignment originally intended for the Egyptian army, but when their king was overthrown, the rifles ended up on the civilian market. It had a flip up aperture sight for longer ranges, marked in hundreds of meters out to 1200, although the markings were in Arabic. It was an excellent hunting rifle, very accurate and reliable, and it put a lot of food on our family's table over the years. I'm sure the 7 version would be just as good for taking moose and deer as our old FN was.
The proprietary scope mount is the excellent HK05 mount. These are rarer than the rifles today. The mount will slightly mar the top of the rifle's receiver, so it can be seen that neither gun in the video has ever had a mount installed. 10 round magazines are also very hard to find. The SL is a bear to field strip and reassemble. The procedure requires a tool and is not intuitive at all, unlike most HK offerings.
...first saw these at a gun store in Pompano Beach, FL in 1986...back in the day when Springfield Armory had some good sh*t in their catalog - the BM-59, the FN FAL - aka the (IIRC) SAR 48, etc...
Ian. it is also worth noting that the SL7 mag is the same mag as is usd on the 770, which was used in .243, hence the mags being so-marked. I also note that you did not make note of the scope mount holes on the top - they took a proprietary (and VERY expensive) scope mount that was a clamp/claw detachable type. i was extremely secur once in and the guns shot very=very well, but one thing about the mount was that the scope was fairly high off the gun, as with European 'turret' & claw- type mounts. I recall a local fella had one of thee and had a stock maker add a raised cheekpiece for scope use
I used to hunt rocky mountain elk with a .243 (80 grain boat tail, 41 grains of imr 4350) quite happily, so I would just love to have on of those in .243 . That would be a thing of beauty...
According to german Wiki these were originally designed as practice guns for reservists. At the time there was a law in West Germany which banned civilian ownership of guns which LOOKED like military assault rifles hence this is essentially the then german army rifle made to look civilian. However they became quite popular amongst non-reservists since they are pleasant to shoot and fairly accurate. The SL6 produces 1 inch groups at 100m. They sell for well under €1000 in Germany They'd go well as a set with a P7.
+Forgotten Weapons Do you think if there is another "Assault weapons" ban that there will be a suitable niche for a rifle like this? That all states legal AR thing is hideous...
The SL-6 and SL-7 guns are a departure from standard H&K practice in that they are somewhat difficult to field strip and re assemble, tools are required, and the procedure is not intuitive. They're very accurate and pleasant to shoot. The 05 scope mount is almost impossible to find, and very expensive.
Question from a person who is not very versed in firearms. What is the main difference between .223 and 5.56 ? EDIT : I think Ian should some videos about ammunition.
+Jovial Bard (セクシー ホモゲイ) .223 Winchester is the commercial ammunition and 5.56mm is the standard adopted by NATO. There are some minor technical differences, but they are basically the same.
Yeah. 308 in that gun would be cold that’s a cold rifle I love HK looks I bought a hardar two because it looked like a HK I never got one it’s ok the hardar style is the same cool even in .223
Well, I wasn't familiar with these rifles, but I like the looks of them. I really like that they have full length stocks, because I don't have any use for those sporter style ones.
These rifles have great looks. The lines in the stock and the convergence toward the barrel goes really well with the trigger guard. That safety is in a weird spot though...
Leave it up to H&K to make gorgeous looking hardware. The distinctive black and red safety mechanism, very fine cut parts, and a snazzy stylized logo. These may be the best looking hunting (ish) rifles I've seen to date, and if not, then they at least win a smithy award for "Best supporting wooden firearm". Note to self: create the smithy awards. They're like oscars, but for guns.
The delayed roler blowback was invented by Edward Stecke, a man from poland in 1934 (United States Patent 2089671). I have heard a rumor, that the first weapon Stecke was used the blowback princip in was an civilian shotgun. Do you have any historic information about the delayed roler blowback before it came to the germans during the war?
I had one of these for hunting hogs in Australia,very fast pointing gun,sweet to use.hard to reload for because the case's got spat out so fast,,hard to recover. Not legal now sadly.
One of them would make a beautiful & classy 3 gun set with a P7 and a 512. For the most stylish and discerning survivalists. :-) But seriously as a set those would cover 98% of all reasonable shooting needs and a fair percentage of unreasonable ones very adequately. If I had those I'd never even look at another gun (after fitting a longer barrel to the 512).
Nice Vid about a rifle i am quite familiar with. The SL6/SL7 were ( and still be) used by the German "Reservistenverband". A voluntary civilian, but public founded organisation of former Bundeswehr soldiers, witch offers f.e. shooting training for it members. During their introduction the where still the "Anscheinsparagraph" (look alike act) in charge. So no civilian were allowed to own or shoot a rifle that might look like a select fire army gun. BTW we got rid of this bs in 2001 but EU wants to reinstall it right now... So I was told than HK developed the SL Series with the Reservistenverband in mind an sold quite a lot to them. Greets from Germany.
+aldi404 mhm, sehr schicke Teile. Man kann nur hoffen, dass die nicht auch von der neuen EU Richtlinie zum Verbot von Halbautomaten etc. betroffen sind, die gerade in der Mache ist (siehe Webseiten von DWJ, Visier und FWR) :(
I soo wanted the .22 WMR H&K but back when it was on the market and avilable my kids were young and money wad always tight. Before I was married I saved for 6 months and bought an H&K 91 new in box, cost me $650 in 1984 dollars. Still kick myself for selling that fine shooting rifle.
2:00 the HK 630, HK 770 and HK 940 weren't created as sporting rifles, but hunting rifles! The 2-shot magazines were tailored to German hunting law even today. You could get those magazine bodies for 2, 3 or 5 shots, whichever you chose in your country. The Rückprallfeder (bounce-back spring) isn't as much a problem in full-auto as it can bounce your lock out of battery. You use self-loading hunting rifles to have a second (and third) shot ready at once without repeating a (normally) 98 system. When the weapon doesn't fire because the lock is out of battery, it's not only a nuisance, but you have to "rack" the whole gun - IF you then don't bounce out of battery again. Do you have any reports from a HK roller-locked blowback firing out of battery? I always thought the problem was just the light stroke, as the hammer DOES put the lock back into battery. BTW, AFAIK the blow-back-spring isn't there in the MP-5. In fact, it was new to me the SL-6 has one. (My father(+) had a HK 770 and I have an SL-7, so I don't know about HK SLs in other calibres than .308 Win.)
+Leetgrain You can't, I'm afraid. Semi-automatic centrefire rifles are Section 5 and thus banned unless you have the personal permission of the Home Secretary. You can't get them on a Firearms Certificate. The closest things you can get are manually operated (straight-pull/bolt action/level action) centrefire rifles or semi-automatic .22 rimfire rifles. Although there is an interesting recent wave of, for lack of a better classification, 'semi-semi-automatic' rifles, such as the lever release Southern Gun AR15 Lever Release or the Caledonian Classic Arms trigger release VZ58-MARS.
BadlanderOutsider Ah, yes, thanks for reminding me. I meant the R8, although from what I've heard they're pretty hard to come by here without import, or at least are pricey. even then I'd probably just get a .22 rimfire, I'm not in the need for a high-calibre anyway. Thanks again, mate! Seems like I need to brush up on my GCL's :)
+Leetgrain No problem. It's a silly law in my opinion. And the R8 is a very nice rifle. There is also an interesting Walther made G36 .22lr clone that apparently is quite good from what I've heard about though that is being imported in and is fairly cheap.
Do want. I'd have to pick up a 10 round magazine (pinned, thanks Trudeau) and maybe the scope mounts too, but a spectacular looking rifle that I've never heard of before.
You get 10 rounds? Everything I've ever seen was pegged to 5. To be completely honest, I'd probably just open up the mags and take out the pins if they were mine, keep a hidden stash with the pins taken out and store the guns with legal spec mags to keep the government happy. The pins themselves are such a stupid concept, do they not realize that if someone is going to go on a shooting spree, they won't give a shit about the legality of their magazines? Fucking stupid bullshit.
+BadlanderOutsider Canadian law mandates magazines have to be pinned to five rounds. I guess that's not clear in the original comment. I just prefer larger magazines, even if it's only five as opposed to three.
Dammit HK, you have a golden opportunity to sell these rifles in ban states right now. If they could be had for 1000 to 1500 bucks, and the ten round mags were made cheaply enough and available, this would be an awesome alternative to rifles like the mini 14 and the SU16.
After hearing about these rifles, I wondered to myself if they may have be marketed as "enthusiast" grade. For those with slightly deeper pocketbooks or H&K aficionados.
![OsamaSon - ik what you did last summer [Official Music Video]](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/4DIQDnu3mr4/mqdefault.jpg)
The thing I like about these rifles is that they look a bit like they belong in WW2. Their looks just kind of remind me of a gewehr 43.
It’s like a G43 in good
A roller delayed blowback Gewehr 43, better too. Had the Germans perfected the roller delay earlier, Gewehr 43 would've been replace the bolt actions in service. Gerat 06 would be replacing SMGs for the officers.
...my sentiment exactly...I first saw these when I worked in a Gun Store in Pompano Beach, FL from Feb- Aug 1986...
The flapper-locking system of the G43 (and many firearms before it) was the basis for roller-locking, which became the basis for roller-delayed blowback. So in a sense, they're almost, sorta related to the G43. I think they could certainly be used in military service in the mid-war period, had they existed back then. :)
It's a perfect blend of mid 40s battle rifle with early 50s g3 style sights
they're really nice looking rifles
+Oliver Karuna
Someone needs to import more of these.
The blockiness is very neatly geometrical
+lastswordfighter none Having a G43, I see no similarities.
I can really see what you mean
Reminds me of a Gewehr 43 in some ways, like the top receiver cover, front sight and vented handguard, otherwise, that's it.
My father has a SL7. I helped him clean and oil it when I was a kid and got to shoot it a few times, so I#m a bit disappointed that it doesn't get disassembled in this video, because that would have given me some childhood nostalgia, but haven't seen it since my childhood. It is sitting in his gun safe and he hasn't shot it in about 30 years either. (He had a bunch of strokes 15 to 20 years ago and can't anymore, but even before that he hadn't touched it in many years. He apparently got bored with range shooting and only did skeet shooting for the last 10 years or so before his first stroke.)
He was a Bundeswehr soldier in the 70s and 80s and a reserve soldier in the 80s add early 90s and he wanted to get something as close to his service rifle as possible, but back then there still was a weird and silly law in Germany, forbidding private citizens from owning guns that looked too much like military rifles.
I only recently learned that that law was repealed a while back and that civilians are allowed to own "military looking" semi auto rifles like the AR-15 in Germany nowadays.
Back in the 80s and 90s, this one here was as close as you could get.
I think he, being a former soldier who was used to the G3 as a service rifle and wanting to own something as close to that as possible, was typical for just the market H&K was aiming for with those guns.
Nowadays the small gun enthusiast community in Germany is a lot more like the one in the USA. It is all about what accessories you put on your AR-15 and tactical gear and guns that are cool because they were featured in a movie and so on.
and now I want an HK rifle. Thanks Ian for helping me be even more broke.
So H&K successfully invented the Mini-14...
"they were not available for very long, and also rather expensive"
Never change, H&K. Never change.
+matchesburn This looks like a much higher quality rifle than the mini, and I love my mini.
Colonel Angus
Higher quality than a Mini-14/30 is a given. Even Ruger's own competition team in the Shooting Industry Masters used Model 77s instead of Mini-14s because of the Mini's accuracy issues.
It's mostly a dig at H&K taking something that's been around for ages, charging 3-4 times the price, and calling it revolutionary.
They're probably great rifles. So is an M1 Garand/M1A. So is an SVT-40. So is the Gewehr 43. There's nothing new here. Just a good rifle with magical teutonic H&K runes on the receive that somehow makes their stocks more pretty, their receivers more expensive, and their barrels more exotic.
Just like the HK416. No other company before H&K thought to put a piston on a Stoner design (the rumors that people have been doing that for decades are just lies, H&K lawyers are already in-bound with cease and desist letters). H&K did it, and *POOF*. Revolutionary and innovative and shit. Now give us $2300.
Eh, I'm not an HK apologist. I think they are overpriced and overhyped. But I haven't seen them claim that this is revolutionary or anything. It's just a sporting version of their military rifles' action. Germany has specific laws on the books that prevent arms manufacturers from selling the military version of their wares to civilians.
+matchesburn The roller locking system is pretty unique to HK and the Mini-14 is basically a clone of the old M1 Garand/M-14 action with the gas system below the barrel and the external operating rod, rotating bolt etc. The Mini-14 was more like a poor man's M1A if you ask me. I mean, I like Ruger, and I like the Mini-14 but an M1A was twice the price when they came out in the 70's and surely much more accurate.
+matchesburn Wrong, the Mini-14 was designed for Bill Ruger by Jim Sullivan and is a scaled down, slightly modified Garand action. They only similarities the Mini-14 shares with H&K anything is they both have barrels and bullets come out of them. Jim Sullivan is one of the people that designed the AR-15 and subsequent M-16 lineage. The AR-15 was a scaled down design of Stoner's AR-10. A lot of people think the AR-15 was Eugene Stoner's design but it is not technically directly his. Jim Sullivan is an under-appreciated and talented man and has a lot of guns to his credit. Ian @ Forgotten Weapons did several interviews with him, I highly recommend watching them.
I like H&K and they have some fantastic guns but they are not faultless. They are overpriced in many cases, they can make very fine quality, but guns like the 91, MP5's etc are not worth what they ask. As far as H&K never changing.... they have held on to that pretty tightly and that probably has a lot to do with their bankruptcy. They don't know how to listen and have been suckling the teat of military contract for so long they have ignored important markets. Just like Colt here in the states. Colt is a gung-ho about military contract and and not give two shits about civies till it was too late and they were already swirling the toilet bowl. Colt is better at funding bankruptcy then they are at making guns. Had H&K been more open to civilian markets (the US), perhaps they would have had some money. What was the definition of insanity again? Keep trying the same thing over and over and expecting a different result? Some companies evolve and continue to move forward, many wither on the vine at their own devices.
I own a SL7 and I can only relate my impression that these are really good guns.
One point of correction, though, there are 20-round factory magazines for sale for this rifle. They are very rare and expensive (last one I saw went over the table for 300€) but they exist.
@Squigglefang :3they look similar to G3 mags in construction.
May be worth buying a 3 dollar G3 mag to see what can be done
Finally! A gun I've actually shot before! The SL-7 really is an awesome rifle to shoot. Just wish it wasn't so pricey.
+LIshoot One of the sad things about H&K weapons. Most of them are fantastic, but the cost is just ridiculous for most of them.
+Mirdarion I had major issues with my PTR-91, wasn't chambered right. Too much space causing constant jams.
Was horrible. $2000 down the drain (Then, it got stolen) - Suckers.
HundK: Because you suck, and we hate you.™
+Regolith how do you make the tm thing
Or... alt codes like a normal person? Alt+332 = ☻for instance. It isn't hard. Get over yourself.
From what I read this gun was originally developed as a practice weapon for german reserve troops (hence their civilian hunting appearance however the actual hunting rifle version of the SL-7 used a different sight).
Correct HK770
Heh, three-round magazine. 'Cause hey, it worked for the Berthier.*
* it didn't work for the Berthier
German law has it that guns you hunt with can only have a 3 round magazine
Edit: in semiautomatic rifles, that is
@@hanfpeter2822 Ah, I see.
@@ZGryphon Because if it is good enough for the French, it can't threaten the Germans...
@@hanfpeter2822 True for Semi-Auto rifles. No limitation on boltaction rifles afaik.
@@manfredbreuer3067 you are probably right. I didnt specify as the Video only Shows Semi Autos, but i will edit my comment.
TP-82 Cosmonaut Triple Barrel Shotgun, please vote up so Ian can see and potentially review!!
He has to find one first. Getting access to rare and odd Russian weapons isn't necessarily simple to do. But if we're wishing for him to review some of these, then I'd love to see any of the following...
I hope for one of those TOZ bolt action underfolder short-barrel shotgun things
Or an NRS-2 silent Spetsnaz gun/knife/multitool
Or a PSS silent autoloading pistol
Wanted a SL-7 back in the late 80's...still love the looks!
It was like the HK version of the mini14. They were neat guns.
Years back I saw some guy shooting one of these at a competition. It’s truly impressive how far and high this gun throws the brass.
Watching this video again such a long time later, it suddenly occurred to me that the reason why they changed the position of the charging handle is probably because the gun lacks a pistol grip. With the military rifles you can exert enough force on the pistol grip to counteract the force you have to put into working the charging handle. The same action would be much harder on these rifles because they have a semi-pistol grip stock.
I saw one of these in the firearms section of a camping store here in Australia a few years ago and didn't know what it was. Cool to find out a bit more about them.
Nice video! Glad you didn't try to demonstrate field stripping the SL-6 or SL-7. I own an SL-6 and know that the gun can be field stripped only with difficulty, and tools are needed. The gun is equally difficult to reassemble. This is very different from any other gun that H&K has made, where they seem to pride themselves on ease of disassembly. Also, the flush fitting magazine on the SL-6 holds five rounds rather than three.
I feel like an old fart - I remember when these came out.
Did u buy one?
@@BestiaTres3 I did not.
Me too, wished I bought one, local gun store had an SL-7 on clearance for 400.00 in the late 80's
Good looking rifles! Thanks for sharing them with us :)
Had an SL6 and loved it......
Yep... Way back in the day, I almost bought one of these. A cool mix of 'sporter' and aggressive military functionally (What I like). Now, lookin' at this, I regret I didn't... DAMN! >_
Just found a SL-6 on a german hunting website for 599 €. :)
Saw these two in 1986..worked at a gun store in Pompano Beach ..guy had all sorta exotic guns..many 80s era Springfield Armory stuff.. and these two. They looked like G41s
“Push this button in” BANG “and the bolt drops”
it's like the German version of the mini 14
More like a roller-delayed blowback M-14 since it use .308 Winchester or the 7.62×51 NATO.
These, along with the Mod 300 & 270, are wonderful, rugged, accurate rifles. Very desirable. The Mod. 270 (.22 LR) has a great feature - you can drop the entire trigger assembly with the push of a button, great for keeping it safe from young fingers!
These are some beautiful looking rifles.
Being trained on the G3 when I was a soldier in the Bundeswehr and owning a SL6 for 27 years now, I'd still prefer the bolt handle to be on the left side. Especially when shooting from.prone position.
hey ian, the sl-guns were mainly intended to be reserve duty guns. they were mentioned for sights-training and field strip training. there are no police units in germany that used sl-guns. some special-police-forces just used the g1 (fn-fal) and a paramilitary-unit is not existing here in germany. yes you can buy these guns as a civilian but only with a 3-round magazine. for the 10-round magazine you need a special-permission of the german army AND you have to be a reserve-duty-soldier. but anyway, thank you for the good work and for the upload.
+no name available Your facts seem wrong to me. The 3-round magazine is only necessary for hunting. 10-round magazines are freely available to all civilians for purchase in Germany. Magazines are not considered a necessary part of a firearm in Germany - meaning they can be bought by people who have no license for owning guns.
you are right. i was to deep into §37
+Michael Schulz for hunting? nope, in germany are only 2-round mags allowed... for hunters. 3rd round in the chaimber might be legal, but certainly no more than 2 rounds in the magazine.
Be St i guess +Michael Schulz meant sporting.
+no name available
This magazine thing sounds new to me. But it might be a reason why it is hard and very expensive to get a 10rd mag for the SL6 here in Germany.
Fortunately it is quite easy to convert AR15 mags to fit into the SL6.
For me these are maybe the most elegant and beautiful rifles ever made.
So slick!! The SL-7 looks like it would make a great whitetail rig for out in the southern Missouri woodlands.
Those are slick. I'll put it on my wishlist ;P
>"Scary appearance".
I chuckled.
I love these rifles, but they have two shortcomings: a very heavy working recoil spring - nearly impossible to load the rifle without pressing the weapon in your shoulder or against your hip- and second: the nerving screw, which needs to be turned out in order to disassemble the rifle. I think both shortcomings occurred only because the design of the weapons was fully dominating technical and practical features. To understand that it is necessary to know that from the 1970s - 2003 Germany banned all self loading rifles from the market, which resembled somehow to assault rifles. This 'appearance clause' in the German Weapon Law said that typical features for an assault rifle look are: e.g. flash hiders, bayonet mounts, non wood/ plastic-covered weapon casings, pistol grips, ventilation holes... At this time all civilian G3 variants were banned, and for example the flash hiders of Tokarevs were cut away, ventilation holes covered. Garands lost their bayonet mounts etc. At the same time ten thousand of conscripts left the German Army year by year and there was a relevant market for reservist willing to train 'at home' with a G3-like rifle. Heckler & Koch's answer was to create a weapon with no resemblance to an assault rifle, but as close to the G3 as possible.
Did not know these existed until now! Thanks for making me aware! And of course, now I want one,.....
ah the tactical 3 round magazine. for hunting in most states in the USA, the mighty Berthier, and ammo on a diet, which im sure everyone can relate to.
I would love to see a demonstratiin of these rifles at the range. In a way, they remind me a little of the FN 49 I grew up shooting, but with shorter ranged drum sights. Our FN 49 (7.92x57) was part of a consignment originally intended for the Egyptian army, but when their king was overthrown, the rifles ended up on the civilian market. It had a flip up aperture sight for longer ranges, marked in hundreds of meters out to 1200, although the markings were in Arabic.
It was an excellent hunting rifle, very accurate and reliable, and it put a lot of food on our family's table over the years. I'm sure the 7 version would be just as good for taking moose and deer as our old FN was.
The proprietary scope mount is the excellent HK05 mount. These are rarer than the rifles today. The mount will slightly mar the top of the rifle's receiver, so it can be seen that neither gun in the video has ever had a mount installed. 10 round magazines are also very hard to find. The SL is a bear to field strip and reassemble. The procedure requires a tool and is not intuitive at all, unlike most HK offerings.
Dammit Ian! How am I supposed to save any money when you keep doing videos on all these awesome rifles that I HAVE to get?
With how unique that safety switch is I half expected Ian to show us this guns quirks as well as features. LOL
Thank you, informative as always
...first saw these at a gun store in Pompano Beach, FL in 1986...back in the day when Springfield Armory had some good sh*t in their catalog - the BM-59, the FN FAL - aka the (IIRC) SAR 48, etc...
Ian. it is also worth noting that the SL7 mag is the same mag as is usd on the 770, which was used in .243, hence the mags being so-marked. I also note that you did not make note of the scope mount holes on the top - they took a proprietary (and VERY expensive) scope mount that was a clamp/claw detachable type. i was extremely secur once in and the guns shot very=very well, but one thing about the mount was that the scope was fairly high off the gun, as with European 'turret' & claw- type mounts. I recall a local fella had one of thee and had a stock maker add a raised cheekpiece for scope use
...worked for a gun store in Pompanno Bch, Fl for 6 mos before getting my job at Sikorsky...we had a couple of these rifles
I used to hunt rocky mountain elk with a .243 (80 grain boat tail, 41 grains of imr 4350) quite happily, so I would just love to have on of those in .243 . That would be a thing of beauty...
Thanks, Ian! That was very interesting!
According to german Wiki these were originally designed as practice guns for reservists.
At the time there was a law in West Germany which banned civilian ownership of guns which LOOKED like military assault rifles hence this is essentially the then german army rifle made to look civilian.
However they became quite popular amongst non-reservists since they are pleasant to shoot and fairly accurate. The SL6 produces 1 inch groups at 100m. They sell for well under €1000 in Germany
They'd go well as a set with a P7.
Is it traditional rifling or polygonal because HK did produce some products with it.
Beautiful guns, wish could get one.
Can they please mass produce this gun??? I know they won't... :(
They already did, but you didn't buy enough so they stopped.
+Forgotten Weapons I wasn't born yet ;(
That isn't H&K's fault. :)
+Forgotten Weapons Do you think if there is another "Assault weapons" ban that there will be a suitable niche for a rifle like this? That all states legal AR thing is hideous...
sure; any bolt-action with a 20mm pic rail that you can mount Hk sights to.
The SL-6 and SL-7 guns are a departure from standard H&K practice in that they are somewhat difficult to field strip and re assemble, tools are required, and the procedure is not intuitive. They're very accurate and pleasant to shoot. The 05 scope mount is almost impossible to find, and very expensive.
Nevermind not forgotten, this was an interesting video. that mechanism though, id love to try one...
I was not aware of these at all.
Great vid, Ian!
Question from a person who is not very versed in firearms. What is the main difference between .223 and 5.56 ?
EDIT : I think Ian should some videos about ammunition.
+Jovial Bard (セクシー ホモゲイ) .223 Winchester is the commercial ammunition and 5.56mm is the standard adopted by NATO. There are some minor technical differences, but they are basically the same.
Forgotten Weapons Oh okay, thank you
+Rex Holes Dont you mean millimeters?
Rex Holes 5.56 cm == 1,968504 inches
+Logan Hoy No, in Europe we use 55.6 mm Rifles for sporting.
new filming techniques! i like it
I wonder if these rifles will get a pass in Feinstein’s 2021 awb? No pistol grip, no threaded muzzle, no bayonet lug, 10 rd magazine, wood furniture.
Love the look of those rifles!
I know someone who owns one of these. They are so fun to shoot. In fact it was the first .308 I ever shot.
...I liked them from the first time I saw them...looked like the G43...
.243 win in this would have been fantastic home defense & hunting.
i had a 630H&K was great rifle bolt was hard to pull back though the sporting stock was great and scope mounts worked with a leupold
Beautiful rifle! I want one..
Recommended videos: Florida teacher starts each day by complimenting students
Ian start each day by talking about obscure guns.
I wanted one of these when they were on the market, but never had the money for it. Will need to put in my bid in right away
I'd love to find one. Very cool.
It's really a pair of forgotten weapons for me. I forgot y buy them.
i really wish that hk would make like a 7.62x51 version of the SL8, i really enjoy my SL8 but i would love to get the same gun in a larger caliber
Yeah. 308 in that gun would be cold that’s a cold rifle I love HK looks I bought a hardar two because it looked like a HK I never got one it’s ok the hardar style is the same cool even in .223
Well, I wasn't familiar with these rifles, but I like the looks of them. I really like that they have full length stocks, because I don't have any use for those sporter style ones.
These rifles have great looks. The lines in the stock and the convergence toward the barrel goes really well with the trigger guard. That safety is in a weird spot though...
Leave it up to H&K to make gorgeous looking hardware. The distinctive black and red safety mechanism, very fine cut parts, and a snazzy stylized logo.
These may be the best looking hunting (ish) rifles I've seen to date, and if not, then they at least win a smithy award for "Best supporting wooden firearm".
Note to self: create the smithy awards. They're like oscars, but for guns.
The SL6 will take M16 Magazines. and the 3 round Mag can be modified to take 5 rounds but then you cannot put it in the rifle with a closed bolt.
Looks a hell of a lot nicer than the SL8.
The delayed roler blowback was invented by Edward Stecke, a man from poland in 1934 (United States Patent 2089671).
I have heard a rumor, that the first weapon Stecke was used the blowback princip in was an civilian shotgun. Do you have any historic information about the delayed roler blowback before it came to the germans during the war?
I had one of these for hunting hogs in Australia,very fast pointing gun,sweet to use.hard to reload for because the case's got spat out so fast,,hard to recover. Not legal now sadly.
These are what the Mini-14 wishes it was
such nice guns, not sure why they didnt go big retail with these.
One of them would make a beautiful & classy 3 gun set with a P7 and a 512.
For the most stylish and discerning survivalists. :-)
But seriously as a set those would cover 98% of all reasonable shooting needs and a fair percentage of unreasonable ones very adequately. If I had those I'd never even look at another gun (after fitting a longer barrel to the 512).
Very nice! The bolt looks a little difficult though. But I'm sure it's pedigree is overbuilt!
Nice Vid about a rifle i am quite familiar with.
The SL6/SL7 were ( and still be) used by the German "Reservistenverband". A voluntary civilian, but public founded organisation of former Bundeswehr soldiers, witch offers f.e. shooting training for it members. During their introduction the where still the "Anscheinsparagraph" (look alike act) in charge. So no civilian were allowed to own or shoot a rifle that might look like a select fire army gun.
BTW we got rid of this bs in 2001 but EU wants to reinstall it right now...
So I was told than HK developed the SL Series with the Reservistenverband in mind an sold quite a lot to them.
Greets from Germany.
Damn, those are gorgeous. Very much my aesthetic
Bundeswehr Flashback XD So viele G3 Teile ^^
+aldi404 sl7 is die zivile version vom g3
+0815Skorpio Als Reservistenwaffe gedacht und auch eingesetzt
Schon als ich das Visier gesehen hab, und die Bolzen ^^
+aldi404 mhm, sehr schicke Teile. Man kann nur hoffen, dass die nicht auch von der neuen EU Richtlinie zum Verbot von Halbautomaten etc. betroffen sind, die gerade in der Mache ist (siehe Webseiten von DWJ, Visier und FWR) :(
Garantiert -.-
Good-looking guns.
It's a shame they stopped the production of these rifles
Had one of the 308's back in the mid 90's ...great shooting rifle until I stumbled onto a G/K 43 in 95... Still shoot the K43 to this day.
H&k also made a .22 WMR sporter.It was a model 300.
I soo wanted the .22 WMR H&K but back when it was on the market and avilable my kids were young and money wad always tight.
Before I was married I saved for 6 months and bought an H&K 91 new in box, cost me $650 in 1984 dollars. Still kick myself for selling that fine shooting rifle.
H&K is one of the few companies that have really sexy markings on their guns.
well yeah, what else could you use them for?
+Jimmy De'Souza oh man just the thought of that... or imagine having to explain to a doctor what happened ^^,
Why not remove the ”anti-bounce spring” on the semi autos? Seems like it would be an improvement.
2:00 the HK 630, HK 770 and HK 940 weren't created as sporting rifles, but hunting rifles!
The 2-shot magazines were tailored to German hunting law even today. You could get those magazine bodies for 2, 3 or 5 shots, whichever you chose in your country.
The Rückprallfeder (bounce-back spring) isn't as much a problem in full-auto as it can bounce your lock out of battery. You use self-loading hunting rifles to have a second (and third) shot ready at once without repeating a (normally) 98 system. When the weapon doesn't fire because the lock is out of battery, it's not only a nuisance, but you have to "rack" the whole gun - IF you then don't bounce out of battery again.
Do you have any reports from a HK roller-locked blowback firing out of battery? I always thought the problem was just the light stroke, as the hammer DOES put the lock back into battery.
BTW, AFAIK the blow-back-spring isn't there in the MP-5. In fact, it was new to me the SL-6 has one. (My father(+) had a HK 770 and I have an SL-7, so I don't know about HK SLs in other calibres than .308 Win.)
I hope we get a video of the sl6a2 shooting in burst, there doesn’t seem to be any information on it.
BRING THEM BACK!!
found one of the sl6 in a pawn shop. wanted 1900 for it. Figured that was actually a decent price for one.
you can stil bay them here new in the box (europe)
+raoul pabon In the UK here, if I ever decide to get a firearms license I'm sure as hell going to get either those or the SL-8
+Leetgrain You can't, I'm afraid. Semi-automatic centrefire rifles are Section 5 and thus banned unless you have the personal permission of the Home Secretary. You can't get them on a Firearms Certificate. The closest things you can get are manually operated (straight-pull/bolt action/level action) centrefire rifles or semi-automatic .22 rimfire rifles. Although there is an interesting recent wave of, for lack of a better classification, 'semi-semi-automatic' rifles, such as the lever release Southern Gun AR15 Lever Release or the Caledonian Classic Arms trigger release VZ58-MARS.
BadlanderOutsider Ah, yes, thanks for reminding me. I meant the R8, although from what I've heard they're pretty hard to come by here without import, or at least are pricey. even then I'd probably just get a .22 rimfire, I'm not in the need for a high-calibre anyway.
Thanks again, mate! Seems like I need to brush up on my GCL's :)
+Leetgrain No problem. It's a silly law in my opinion. And the R8 is a very nice rifle. There is also an interesting Walther made G36 .22lr clone that apparently is quite good from what I've heard about though that is being imported in and is fairly cheap.
BadlanderOutsider Ah, thank you very much for telling me, I'll definitely keep an eye out for that, that sounds right up my alley!
keep it up Ian
I think they'd make excellent military rifles. As good as or better than anything in WW2.
I don't see why H&K stopped making these. It's not like they would be banned from import. I'd totally buy one.
Do want. I'd have to pick up a 10 round magazine (pinned, thanks Trudeau) and maybe the scope mounts too, but a spectacular looking rifle that I've never heard of before.
You get 10 rounds? Everything I've ever seen was pegged to 5. To be completely honest, I'd probably just open up the mags and take out the pins if they were mine, keep a hidden stash with the pins taken out and store the guns with legal spec mags to keep the government happy. The pins themselves are such a stupid concept, do they not realize that if someone is going to go on a shooting spree, they won't give a shit about the legality of their magazines? Fucking stupid bullshit.
+Reese Tompkins The largest capacity H&K made for these was 10 rounds, so you're in luck there.
+BadlanderOutsider Canadian law mandates magazines have to be pinned to five rounds. I guess that's not clear in the original comment. I just prefer larger magazines, even if it's only five as opposed to three.
+Reese Tompkins Ah, sorry. I forgot about the 5 round for centrefire rifles cap.
I used to own a 770, and I'd much rather have had one of these on the basis of the sights alone.
Looks like a refined version of CETME FR7 and 8, the "CETMETON"
Dammit HK, you have a golden opportunity to sell these rifles in ban states right now. If they could be had for 1000 to 1500 bucks, and the ten round mags were made cheaply enough and available, this would be an awesome alternative to rifles like the mini 14 and the SU16.
Mint Rifles. These won't be cheap..
Last rifle was made in 1991.
After hearing about these rifles, I wondered to myself if they may have be marketed as "enthusiast" grade. For those with slightly deeper pocketbooks or H&K aficionados.