Thank you for this video! I just wanted to specify that the group you covered here is often called ‘old order Mennonites’ to differentiate from the Mennonite denomination. Oddly enough, as a denomination, the non-old-order mennonites tend to be rather progressive. I went to Goshen College, which is a Mennonite affiliated Christian college, and it was considered far more progressive than most other private christian colleges. I chose Goshen because many of their core values aligned with mine even though it wasn’t my denomination. Goshen has a phenomenal science program, nursing program, Women’s studies program and Peace Justice Conflict Studies Program since the Mennonite denomination is still pacifist. Denominational mennonites like this still call themselves Mennonites and generally refer to groups you are speaking of ‘old order Mennonites.’ :)
I was JUST coming to comment on this. XD My best friend is ex-Mennonite and has been to all sorts of Mennonite churches from old colony to more progressive Mennonite churches. There are some things that stay the same, but Mennonites are a LARGE group so there is a lot of variety.
OK, so I told you I was Mennonite. Where is this video from?? Look up Russian Mennonites and follow them to Canada. My ancestors came in 1876 I will send you another email 📧
I’m glad you made this point. My step relatives are Mennonite and go to a large Mennonite church in Fresno CA. They are similar to every other Protestant denomination albeit a bit more xenophobic. They’re relatives are liberal, many scientists (genetics predominately), passivists. A lot of the core social services-mental health etc were started and funded by these mennonites. Growing up it was such a bizarre juxtaposition of beliefs.
As a kindergarten and first grade Montessori teacher, I can not imagine teaching children how to read from the Bible. There are no phonetic patterns to follow, no emphasis on basic sight words, and it is complicated text.
There's a podcast called The Plain People's Podcast that interviews people who've left Amish, Mennonite, and Anabaptist sects and is hosted by former members (a la Sam -- grew up in the faith, now out but not necessarily atheist, critical of the organizational/misogynistic powers that be). They've got a ton of episodes and I can't think of a specific one to recommend, but it's a good place for people to start to get a "vibe" on that sliver of Christianity and how the various communities have similarities and differences if you're interested.
* And they feature the music of a variety of choirs from within the communities. My understanding is most music is not allowed (rebellion happens, variation per congregation), but they are generally allowed to sing hymns and play piano.
Great Job with this info! Idk a lot about the Mennonites but I did have a special interaction long ago. Back in the 80’s when I was around 12 or 13 my home suffered severe flood damage. My mom, a single mother, battling cancer, had no way to pay to fix our home. We were helped by 3 young mennonites on their mission. They came for several months and repaired everything. They were wonderful and a bit magical to my young mind. I remember that they dressed like everyone else while they were with us. I cannot tell you how much their help meant to us.
Peter Santenello here on RUclips has done some videos on the Amish and Mennonite communities. I think he does a great job giving an objective view on things!
We definitely converse during meals, share, and laugh. Fellowshiping through "breaking bread together" is also a big thing within our church. Enjoying your exploration into other groups.
On the shopping on the sabbath thing I had a friend that grew up 7th Day Adventist and they would buy gift cards in advance to get around the "no shopping / purchasing on the sabbath rule.
I am a Mennonite so let me explain some things. There are many different types of Mennonites, the main difference is what church you belong to. My husband grew up in Bolivia in a group almost exactly like the group you talked about (which are traditional Mennonites)except for the silent dinner tables. I guess that is a rule in some families but not in my husband's family. They are not allowed to have any technology, no music, no cars, no electricity, no rubber tires on your tractors so only steel tires and also no windows on your tractors or combines. You would get in trouble for all of those things. I grew up in Mexico with cars and phones and even a DVD player. We were not supposed to have smart phones and TVs or DVD player's but my parents did not always follow those rules but they never got in trouble for it. The only way you got in trouble was for cheating or something like that. So you can already see that there are many different types of Mennonites. If you don't want to follow all those rules in the church anymore you just leave that church and go to a different one and because the church doesn't own the properties they can't make you leave, but in these traditional communities a lot of people do leave because that makes it easier because a lot of times people like the parents or preachers will give you a hard time so leaving makes it easier. The church we go to now has every type of technology and lives just like every other family in the United States does, the only way we are different is that we have our own christian schools and we wear head coverings and wear dresses or skirts but there are no rules on what type of dresses or anything like that. I can answer some more questions if anyone is interested in hearing more.
We also didn't grow up hugging or kissing, I was just something that was past on from generation to generation, my parents have left that church I grew up in, but they still find it super awkward to show affection and tell their own children that they love them
This is all so interesting! Thank you for sharing! It seems very similar to the LDS in that there are so many break off groups that while sharing a lot of the core doctrine, do things very differently.
In Kansas, there is a town that has at least 4 different Mennonite churches. They had different beliefs in technology and what they wore. I had a former coworker who was Mennonite who went to college and played basketball. He always wore button up shirts, but otherwise one could not have known he was Mennonite.
There are so many mennonites on youtube who aren't Old Order (the group talked about here). Would be great to do an interview with them! One woman in particular Lynnette Yoder was raised Amish and is now Mennonite!
Can you imagine sitting in silence at the table, listening to everyone chewing their food!? I would go mad! (I grew up Holdeman Mennonite in the USA...quite different from the mennonites you spoke about today.)
We have a fairly large population of Old Order Amish/ Mennonite in rural southern Indiana. It’s not uncommon to get stuck behind a buggy on a single lane highway. They are much more social than this particular group. Lots of quilt auctions and farmers markets. Always buy the pies 🥧 😉
I grew up in a very rural area in southwestern Pennsylvania and we had a large Mennonite population there. While they did dress in the way you’re describing, they drove cars, had phones (landlines back then) and were involved in business in the community. My parents put an addition onto our house around 1995-1996 and a Mennonite man built our entire kitchen - they do beautiful cabinetry work. He had a large family and would bring one of his daughters with him to play with me and my sister while he worked. A Mennonite family also owned the large farm behind my parents’ house and every year they would farm the fields on tractors. They had cows and sheep and peacocks that made loud noises at night, lol. You often saw them out in the community too. Sadly, the same man who made our kitchen had an accident in his large family van where he went over a bridge very close to our house and many of his children died. 😞
I was born in the US but grew up in several countries in South and Central America. When we lived in Honduras, we used to stop on our way in to the city at a Mennonite farmstand to buy Banana Bread. It was soooo good. One day we drove up the driveway, and tucked in behind the trees we were shocked to see a beautiful north american style house and barn. It was like stepping out of Honduras and into a barnyard in Vermont!
I lived in Honduras for a while and I know exactly where you are talking about because we would stop there between Teguc and Catacamas! There was also a Mennonite ice cream store in Siguatepeque that had amazing ice cream!
Just watched the youtube doc about them after watching this and it's so interesting! Hearing that their only time for leisure is in church speaks volumes..so it's only positive association. I absolutely think each to their own as long as people are safe and happy, but I can't help feeling for them having no music or a creative space. I know they know no different, but music brings a joy to the soul they'll never experience and it makes me sad for them!
Regarding what is or is not ok to buy...they have a meeting where new things are discussed and the community decides as a group. The key factor in deciding is whether or not it is deemed necessary.
After the U.O. in FLDS we were required to eat the meal in silence. Also all meetings were in silence. No one talked before or after meetings, entered and exited in silence.
That was a really good discussion. I wonder why physical expressions of affection are discouraged in those communities. It would be interesting to know.
Enjoy your videos. I've noticed many similarities in principle and practice between FLDs and Amish and Mennonites. I am formerly Amish, so this one was interesting, and I'm looking forward to the one about Amish. ☺ There is a huge variety of these as well as Mennonites.
So growing up we always talked about our day at the dinner table. Usually it was my dad telling us about interesting or weird things about his job. There were only four of us (2 adults and 2 kids) so pretty quiet. However currently it’s only my husband and I which tends to be quiet. We usually talk when we get home before dinner so dinner tends to be quiet or watching out favorite show.
We definitely talk at dinner time and breakfast time at the table. I homeschool my kids, so when we're home for lunch, I'll usually play a show or movie for them while we eat. The kids especially need a break from each other come lunch time.😅There's an entire movement that is encouraging families to sit down and eat together, because they talk to each other during the meal. If you talk, you can work through the tough times, and families who eat (and talk) together actually have lower rates of all kinds of negative things - depression, anxiety, eating disorders, substance use, low self-esteem, etc. Thanks for your input on these groups!
Some great regular Mennonite RUclipsrs are: Megan Fox Unlocked Lynette Yoder The Mennonite Mom (currently on a break) However these people are not old order like you are talking about here, but a more modern version. Janine on Mennonite Mom has some fantastic vids about her brand of the M faith. Really really beautiful
Interesting to hear about these Mennonites. We have a big Mennonite community where I live in Canada and there are several differences between what I know about them compared to this group.
I am Mennonite, and I would have grown up like that if my parents hadn't moved to Canada with their families in the 60s. I would still be a Mennonite regardless of what church I would go to, since it's also a culture, a people, bloodline. Our history started after Martin Luther in the 1500s. Originally they were called Anabaptists (rebaptizers), a name given to them as a derogatory term, but they embraced it. Amish & Hutterites are also anabaptists. We derived our name from Menno Simon, a former Catholic priest from Friesland, Netherlands. They were brutally persecuted by the Catholic church there, so when they were invited to north Germany by a rich landowner to live there, they did so. That is where I believe we get our German dialect from (low German, northern Germany is lower than southern Germany (?)). That landowner passed away, and they needed to be on the move again, and they ended up in Prussia (modern day Poland). They ran out of land there, which was crucially important, since all Mennonites wanted to farm. Plus, they are pacifists, so they wanted exemption from enlisting in war, something Prussia wasn't wanting to give. Catherine the Great found out about their plight and invited them to come to Ukraine. She gave them the war exemptions, and the right to school their own children, so they moved there. My forefathers moved to Canada from the Ukraine in the 1880s, but many stayed there into the 2nd world War. That's when they suffered incredibly under the Bolshevik army, and later Stalin. I believe there are still a few low German speaking Mennonites left living there 😔 In 1920, there was a mass exodus from Manitoba and Saskatchewan to Mexico, and then later other South American countries due to persecution in Canada (!) German speaking people who didn't want to fight were looked down on by the government and their neighbours after fighting in a war against Germany. This is a very condensed version. Trying to keep it short here 😁
This is curious to me and I’m only 3 minutes in lol!! I homeschool my kids and a substantial amount of our materials come from a Mennonite publishers (we are not Mennonite but the material is great.). So yes, they definitely have Mennonite textbooks. I’m sure whether or not they choose to use them varies from community to community, though.
I think the biblical argument for shunning/excommunication/etc. may come from one of Paul's epistles in which he discusses church discipline or what to do if someone in the church has wronged you. I remember it being the last step, where if after xyz, the person still won't repent, let them be like an outsider (maybe the word there is gentile) to you. I'm terrible at remembering and finding verse references, so it would take me longer than I'm willing to spend rn to find the exact wording and context (and even then, it would be only the context of the surrounding text, not the full context of what was going on in the church Paul was writing to). My own nondenominational churches have had no policies related to that verse than I know of. The only church discipline I've witnessed involves church leaders who had to be confronted and then had to resign.
I was in a youth symphony when I was in middle and high school. We had several members who were Mennonite. They wore very modest handmade clothes (long dresses/head scarves for the girls and long pants/long sleeve shirts for the boys) and all the girls had the most gorgeous long hair. They never spoke to anyone outside their group and sat out for songs that were too beat-heavy. One time we had a concert featuring several big band songs and they were excused from the stage during that part of the performance. Very interesting!
My parents would talk to us around the dinner table but we were only allowed to have one conversation at a time. We were a family of 5 and the only rule would be to let one person talk at a time. Then we would all end up talking quite a bit over the entire dinner.
Love your videos, something I wanted to add: I worked at a small coffee shop in the past and we had mennonites come in. They were nice and would converse, I always thought it was interesting though they seemed very strict, but were still allowed to come get a fancy blended drink
Thanks for making this video! My husband is from Pennsylvania near Lancaster, where there is a big Amish community. There was a Mennonite community around as well bc we would see them around some but definitely not as often as the Amish. My husband worked in construction for a few years and they had some Amish workers that he worked with everyday. He said they were really nice and obviously very hard workers. They made him a hat and we still have it haha. As far as the dinner table conversation, we talk a lot in my family. Growing up I was only in a family of 5 but when my husband joined he always said he couldn’t keep up. We talk over eachother and have loud, constant conversation. My husbands family talked but they are much more quiet and keep to themselves. Either way, it’s very important, to all of us, to eat meals together at the table. Everyone let’s their guard down a little more, relaxes, and you can really bond. It’s great!
My family rarely ate together, my parents both worked different hours and I was involved in a lot of after school activities. But when we did all eat together we were quiet because there are only 3 of us! Usually my parents just complained about work. lol
My family are southern baptists and the men and women sit at opposite sides and ends of the table, so partners sit together. Except typically the genders speak to each other so we end up yelling across the table and above the other so we can hear each other. My poor boyfriend was shook at the first family dinner. He was like y’all are really loud and talk a lot. 😂
Just along the discussion of the groups splitting off calling themselves Mennonite, my great grandparents to my understanding are german mennonites, as such my extended family refers to themselves as Mennonite, attending Mennonite schools etc. I was not raised religious and unfortunately my grandparents did not pass the german language along to their kid. While a lot of the religious aspects for us have fallen off, a lot of the cultural traditions such as recipes remain. In fact we have a german prayer we will say before family meals. I do remember seeing the old order mennonites at a livestock auction once and it was fascinating.
Please do the 12 Tribes of Israel! They are a very interesting group and I almost joined when I was a teenager in Rutland, Vermont. I'd love to hear your reaction. They pool their property, and have many successful businesses. They were raided as well (in Vermont) and all their kids were returned.
Growing up, my dad lead the conversation. We listened. Mostly polite not big conversation. I grew up in the South but to both parents from NYC/Northern Jersey Protestant.
In a nursing home where I worked a Mennonite group came out one Sunday a month and sang hymns (in four part harmony) to our residents. I went to a commencement ceremony at a Mennonite college that included hymns (again in four part harmony). Maybe voices are okay but instruments are not?
I know of someone (not personally) whom is established with His own Internet Blog who is an Ex-Amish. He's a hoot, his style is a perfect match for what you 2 are asking here for a Source to speak to you. I'd have to reach out to him first, of course. Let me know if you are interested. You guys will love him. He's honest as honest can be. This Man is also very open to talk. Love and Hugs to you both with your podcasts. I recognize the 2 of you are open and love all people. Thanks 4 your work.
The nurse who cared for me when I was pregnant and had to be in the hospital for a week before delivering my baby 6 1/2 weeks early was Mennonite. They can have educations, drive cars use technology. There are many Mennonite people in the US
My cousin married a former Mennonite. She said once every month or two someone would go into a closer town to the community PO box and they would get and send mail that way.
growing up we didn't eat around the table even at the holidays. with my family now we talk around the table and have just wonderful fellowship time, I hope my kids look back on our family dinners with the best memories. I don't know if you have ever thought about comparing some of the FLDS patterns to any other non-christian groups around the world. I know so many religions have so many things similar as far as standards and rules they abide by.
We would definitely love to compare to non-christian groups as well. Our list of groups to cover is just getting so long haha, but as we hear of any we will definitely add them as well! =)
If we didn't talk to our teenager during dinner we would probably never know anything!! The rest of the day everything is either "fine" or "no, thank you"!
I followed a Mennonite woman who had a RUclips channel. I was always under the impression that mennonites use some technology but otherwise live similarly to the Amish. The show “leaving Amish” had a one or two mennonites who said that as well.
Agree with Kanna below...this is just one of several branches..the Old Brethern are as origional as they can be. Growing up Baptist ,my father had been raised newer Mennonite,we didnt speak much at the table either
When I was about seven my grandfather was dying from lung cancer and a lady affiliated with hospice would come visit. She was Mennonite. She drove a car and had enough education to be a part of hospice. She was a very kind lady.
I’m intrigued by this because I’m from Pennsylvania and there’s a prominent Mennonite/ Amish community and even some in Northeastern & Central Pennsylvania. I don’t really like their beliefs but their food they sell at market is hella good😂
So, my mother is from Colombia (South America) and one of 16 children! Same two parents (Catholic). They always spoke at the table, and family reunions are LOUD as you can imagine! Lots of excitement and shouting over one-another. When I brought my first husband to his first family reunion (he didn't speak much Spanish) he was concerned and asked me what they were arguing about. I started laughing and said "oh, no, they're not arguing they're just reminiscing!" So that was my mom's side of the family. My father is from Connecticut, and protestant, and one of 2 siblings. Their household growing up was much quieter, and there were more strict rules about how to behave at the table, and as children we were reminded children were to be seen and not heard. Also, politics, religion, etc. were not topics at the table, whereas my mom's family spoke about all kinds of things at the table. Growing up, my mother tried her best to teach us proper table manners, and I was often sent to the kitchen to eat by myself because I would put my elbow on the table, or my fingers in my food. However, there were no restrictions on talking at the table.
Mi Husband grew up in Belize in the Colony little Belize and he did go to the same doctor you are talking about, and some of mi Husbands Siblings are born at that doctors place
There is a lady - Megan fox unlocked on RUclips - she gives a really great personal view on growing up Mennonite and her current life being Mennonite ! I highly recommend looking her up if you’re looking for more about Mennonite life!
Lynette Yoder also has a great RUclips channel with insight on growing up Amish and later becoming Mennonite! She shares a lot of interesting details of her current life as a Mennonite!
They aren't from the same group of Mennonites though then the documentary they are talking about! My ancestors are the Mennonites they are talking about.
My parents were raised Mennonite and there are 7 children in each of their families. We were not raised Mennonite but many of the principals were followed by my parents including no physical affection. I recall shaking hands with my grand parents as well.
Love hearing about the other groups! One of my other favorite RUclipsrs is a Mennonite and very modern like mommy blogger and i love it! Her name is Megan Fox unlocked here on RUclips. From what I’ve learned from her there are several groups and churches and each one has different rules.
I have a dear friend, who is a Mennonite. She is very progressive. They believe in education, and they use technology. She has two daughters. What is a college professor with a PhD and one is a nurse practitioner! She has worked in a public school for many many years. This looks like a very small amount of the Mennonite church. Them and the German Baptist have a lot of members in the Ohio, Indiana and Pennsylvania
Hey Sam and Melissa! Would you be interested in interviewing a Catholic residential school survivor? Talk about a system of religious control and indoctrination! Or even the daughter of one? (It's me, hi, I'm the daughter 😂)
Your story about your dad breaking the Sabbath to do shopping brings to mind the concept of the Shabbos Goy, where some practicing Jews literally employ a non-Jewish person to perform tasks that they aren't allowed to do on the Sabbath (which, depending on how strictly they interpret the rules can even include things like turning on and off lights etc). It's a very controversial practice because the argument against it is that you're obeying the word of the rules but not the spirit, and it's the spirit that matters. The first time I ever heard about this concept was when an Australian football team whose President at the time was an Orthodox Jew got into the Grand Final (our version of the Super Bowl) for the first time in a while - the Grand Final is played on a Saturday afternoon, so there was a lot of media attention on the fact that the club President wouldn't be able to watch or directly listen to it, even at home (I mean, he was accustomed to not being able to watch Friday night or Saturday afternoon games, but this was no ordinary game). There was a lot of talk about what he might do and one of the suggestions was to have a Shabbos Goy watch it and give him a play-by-play second-hand. My dad, whose father was Jewish, had to explain it all to me and, as someone who was raised without any religious beliefs, it just all seemed so weird and hilarious that people can be so devout until they encounter an inconvenience that they don't want to live with and then they tie themselves in knots trying to find loopholes.
🤣My husband and I can identify with you two about dinner table conversations. I come from an extended family that has dozens of conversations going on at once; bairly a few seconds in-between people talking at most. 🙄 My husband's family is old school Norwegian Lutheran; a little conversation is normal but oh boy the disciplinary looks and occasionally disciplinary words from my husbands parents when I talk too much or don't allow several minutes between asking questions 🤦♀️
The shunning aspect is 100% an aspect of Behavior and Emotional control, as seen in the BITE model, a model which breaks down common traits of high control groups and religions (aka cults). Shunning discourages doubters from leaving- do you really want to be cut off from your entire community? Additionally, it makes it more difficult for leavers to come back and rescue their friends and family. Check out Steven Hassan's work on the BITE model (he created it and has spent his academic career working on this).
Definitely. And their fear of apostates being a "bad influence" is a euphemism for fearing that people will hear alternative viewpoints or learn that what they've been told about the outside world is an outright lie.
There’s quite a few Mennonite and Bretheren families in the town that I live in. They don’t come off as isolated from the rest of the community or to try and be as far from the rest of us at all.
Children were seen and not heard at our dinner table in the 1970s, my parents tried it at times and it didn’t last too long, I think my dad was just tired and stressed, so it was a good excuse to use!
Ok, so this will be a long post lol. First let me introduce myself. I'm a young mom from a Mennonite community..and surprise surprise I am using the internet and clothing like anybody else does haha. There are many different kinds of Mennonites first of all. There are these ones in documentary (Russian Mennonites) and then there are the amish-mennonites that live mostly in the USA. And there are a ton of others as well. My ancestors are from the same group as these are. I grew up in a Mennonite community in Mexico. My parents both grew up in a very traditional way (kind of like the people in the documentary) but these are the most extreme ones out there. There are very few left that are still like this. If you were to go to Mexico to the Mennonite community there in Chihuahua, you wouldn't believe that they are the same kind. But sadly they only make documents of the extreme ones. I would say about 50 percent of Mennonites you wouldn't even recognize as Mennonites from the way they are dressed or live. Another 30 percent that still dress somewhat traditional but are living normal lives other then there believe. But they have contact with the "outside world". They have electricity and work normal jobs. They do however still have their own schools and traditional church. And then the rest are the more extreme ones. It's a very complex group of people! It would take hours to explain the whole thing lol But hey if anyone has any questions..I'll try to answer them.
That is so interesting! If you would ever be willing to be on our channel and chat with us, we would love to hear more straight from the source! Please email us if that is something you would be open to at growingupinpolygamy@gmail.com
I live in Northern California and I see the Mennonites all the time. They shop in the same shops I do and this morning I went to a Mennonite cafe for breakfast today. They drive the same cars we do. Many wear calico dresses. The little children wear the same clothes that the other kids do.
Growing up I was the youngest of 5 and we all talked at the dinner table. But in the early 2000’s my great grandmother came to live with us for a week. She was born in 1903 in England . At the dinner table the first day she scolded us children for talking at the table without first being addressed. (Only able to talk if an adult talked to you first) My mom then yelled at HER for yelling at as telling her that her kids are allowed to talk at the table. BTW this is my great grandmother on my dad’s side
Interesting. I've definitely heard, "Children are not to speak unless spoken to first," and "Little children should be seen and not heard." Both seem horrible to me, but I think it wasn't uncommon in the past to expect kids to be silent.
@@LivetolearnMama yeah. My grandfather (her son) didn’t raise my dad as strictly. So when it got to my generation talking at the table was normal. We still had to ask to get up from the table, etc.
Interesting! I live in Canada and we have a lot of mennonites. Some of them are just as modern as everyone else but go to a Mennonite church, so it’s more just about their religion. Some live without electricity and use horse and buggies. But they don’t live far away from everyone else and they often sell their goods at farmer’s markets. My brother is a contractor and works with a Mennonite that build cabinets and he uses electricity and has a phone but doesn’t have a computer and some other modern things. Around here people love to buy Mennonite furniture for the quality.
The Old Order is the more strict group of Mennonite I have encountered. Most I have lived near in both NNY and KY are not Old Order and have phones, drive cars and use electricity which non of the Amish I lived near used. The Amish folks would accept rides in cars very rarely (extreme emergency) from select people. The Mennonites operated many open to the public businesses such as general stores, bakeries and meat processing. The Amish folks would have road side stands (at the end of their driveways) where people could come buy extra baked items, produce, honey, maple syrup and home canned items like pickles. My son misses the maple cinnamon rolls and peach pies from our time in KY
I follow Ruthann Zimmerman (Homesteading With The Zimmermans on RUclips) and she used to be Mennonite. She may still be in some ways but I'm not sure how that breaks down. Would love to see you guys collab with her!
I have relatives who became Mennonites in the late 1800’s after fleeing Brigham Young and Utah. The funny thing is they are music teachers 🤷♀️ I also know someone who is Mennonite and is an educated engineer
The Old Colony don't have everything in common like the Hutterites. But they do create self-sustaining colonies or community with land connected to the other families.
I grew up in Southwest Kansas where there are a lot of Mennonites, but they weren't on the traditional end of the spectrum. The town I lived in was heavily Mennonite, but you wouldn't know it unless you were there for a while. They dressed just like everyone else and didn't have an practices that were outside the norm for the average American. They did eat certain traditional Mennonite foods and they intermarried a lot (in fact this had gotten be to a genetic problem so for a while they were encouraging people to go up to Mennonite communities in Minnesota and Canada to look for spouses). In other communities nearby there were other Mennonites who were more traditional. They could have cars, but they had to be black. The women wore a certain style of floral dresses and black caps. In recent years the women from these groups have started wearing more mainstream clothes that have been adapted to fit their modesty requirements (like maybe a modest shirt with long jean skirt). Some of my friends in high school were from a group that had com up from Mexico. Their parents were semi conservative but didn't mind how their children dressed. They spoke German and English well, but didn't speak much Spanish so you could tell their group hadn't integrated much in Mexico.
My dad owned several John Deere dealerships and Mennonites in the area were willing to pay the higher John Deere prices because they knew he wouldn't take advantage of them. Most businesses in the area know they are woefully undereducated and cannot function in mainstream society. He earned a lot of respect in the community.
We'd love to know more! We'd love to interview you on the channel! If that is something you are open to, please email us at growingupinpolygamy@gmail.com =)
I haven’t finished the video yet but when researching my ancestry, I found out the original Mennonites that came to the US were not the same as the ones now. They were actually considered progressive at the time.
There is a very wide variety of Mennonites. The ones I grew up around drove decent cars, bought regular clothing, and were college educated. They made a distinction between worldly technology and practical technology, worldly spending and practical spending. And many of them had and kept contact with cousins who were in the horse-and-buggy set or who were black-bumper (cars are practical, chrome is worldly, so they pain the chrome black). Amish are an offshoot of Mennonites, and they range from horse-and-buggy to black-bumper orders. Another Mennonite offshoot is the Church of the Brethren, of which almost all are in the practical-technology-accepting range but with similar emphases on peace, humility, and modesty and with similar anabaptist theology.
also, I was floored when I had a lead teacher transferred into a classroom where I was working complained that I encouraged the children to converse around the table. "they should be eating, not talking." This was the exact opposite of what our state food program required, which was to encourage children to spend at least half an hour in their seats with food in front of them, and to encourage conversation (both for politeness, to get dedicated time in adult-moderated conversations, and also to encourage them to eat slowly enough they had a chance to feel full and choose to stop eating at a reasonable time.). Also, I believe the instructions in the New Testament regarding "siblings who do not listen" when confronted/corrected by the congregation is to "treat them as a sinner or a tax collector." Shunning and excommunication results when people interpret this as, "sinners and tax collectors were outcasts, so we must cast them out of our community." Personally, I think this completely ignores the way CHRIST treated sinners and tax collectors, often making particular effort to pay attention to them and treat them with love and patience.
We love in rural Oklahoma we have a large Mennonite community here. Some of the women work in our school. The men do have trucks the women can drive at the school. They do only wear dresses. The girls leave school about 6 grade the boys go until they get jobs some do graduate but still only work in the order. They only use phones for work only and they have time of the day when everything turns off and days of the week where they don't use phones electric or cars
For family dinners we talk at dinner but once everyone starts eating it’s quiet and then someone will make a comment “I guess it’s good, no one’s talking.” 😂
JWs have a Bible verse about shunning. I think it is in Corinthians, and says something about distancing one's self from toxic people, it is a big jump!
For meal times. With that many kids they probably just wanted to get thru the meal. I imagine there wasn't an excess of food either. Hurry up and get your food in. And I was wondering about the age 13 education thing. Why are most stopping at 13. Sadly is it because of puberty. Or is there a biblical reason?
Yah, it is interesting that 13 seems to be about the age that a lot of groups stop formal education. It seems to us that at about 13 is when kids can start working more like adults.
Thank you for this video! I just wanted to specify that the group you covered here is often called ‘old order Mennonites’ to differentiate from the Mennonite denomination. Oddly enough, as a denomination, the non-old-order mennonites tend to be rather progressive. I went to Goshen College, which is a Mennonite affiliated Christian college, and it was considered far more progressive than most other private christian colleges. I chose Goshen because many of their core values aligned with mine even though it wasn’t my denomination. Goshen has a phenomenal science program, nursing program, Women’s studies program and Peace Justice Conflict Studies Program since the Mennonite denomination is still pacifist. Denominational mennonites like this still call themselves Mennonites and generally refer to groups you are speaking of ‘old order Mennonites.’ :)
I was JUST coming to comment on this. XD My best friend is ex-Mennonite and has been to all sorts of Mennonite churches from old colony to more progressive Mennonite churches. There are some things that stay the same, but Mennonites are a LARGE group so there is a lot of variety.
Thanks for the comments!
OK, so I told you I was Mennonite. Where is this video from?? Look up Russian Mennonites and follow them to Canada. My ancestors came in 1876 I will send you another email 📧
I’m glad you made this point. My step relatives are Mennonite and go to a large Mennonite church in Fresno CA. They are similar to every other Protestant denomination albeit a bit more xenophobic. They’re relatives are liberal, many scientists (genetics predominately), passivists. A lot of the core social services-mental health etc were started and funded by these mennonites. Growing up it was such a bizarre juxtaposition of beliefs.
As a kindergarten and first grade Montessori teacher, I can not imagine teaching children how to read from the Bible. There are no phonetic patterns to follow, no emphasis on basic sight words, and it is complicated text.
I grew up old order Mennonite!! Would love to help you out with covering this group!!!
We would love that so much! Would you mind sending us an email at growingupinpolygamy@gmail.com so that we can exchange info and set up a time! =)
There's a podcast called The Plain People's Podcast that interviews people who've left Amish, Mennonite, and Anabaptist sects and is hosted by former members (a la Sam -- grew up in the faith, now out but not necessarily atheist, critical of the organizational/misogynistic powers that be). They've got a ton of episodes and I can't think of a specific one to recommend, but it's a good place for people to start to get a "vibe" on that sliver of Christianity and how the various communities have similarities and differences if you're interested.
* And they feature the music of a variety of choirs from within the communities. My understanding is most music is not allowed (rebellion happens, variation per congregation), but they are generally allowed to sing hymns and play piano.
Great Job with this info! Idk a lot about the Mennonites but I did have a special interaction long ago. Back in the 80’s when I was around 12 or 13 my home suffered severe flood damage. My mom, a single mother, battling cancer, had no way to pay to fix our home. We were helped by 3 young mennonites on their mission. They came for several months and repaired everything. They were wonderful and a bit magical to my young mind. I remember that they dressed like everyone else while they were with us. I cannot tell you how much their help meant to us.
I enjoy that by doing these videos, Melissa is still learning new things about Sam.
Peter Santenello here on RUclips has done some videos on the Amish and Mennonite communities. I think he does a great job giving an objective view on things!
We will add him to the list!
Our dinner rules were no tv or books at the table (this was pre-cell phone days). It was family time to talk about our day with each other.
We definitely converse during meals, share, and laugh. Fellowshiping through "breaking bread together" is also a big thing within our church. Enjoying your exploration into other groups.
On the shopping on the sabbath thing I had a friend that grew up 7th Day Adventist and they would buy gift cards in advance to get around the "no shopping / purchasing on the sabbath rule.
I am a Mennonite so let me explain some things.
There are many different types of Mennonites, the main difference is what church you belong to.
My husband grew up in Bolivia in a group almost exactly like the group you talked about (which are traditional Mennonites)except for the silent dinner tables. I guess that is a rule in some families but not in my husband's family.
They are not allowed to have any technology, no music, no cars, no electricity, no rubber tires on your tractors so only steel tires and also no windows on your tractors or combines.
You would get in trouble for all of those things.
I grew up in Mexico with cars and phones and even a DVD player.
We were not supposed to have smart phones and TVs or DVD player's but my parents did not always follow those rules but they never got in trouble for it.
The only way you got in trouble was for cheating or something like that.
So you can already see that there are many different types of Mennonites.
If you don't want to follow all those rules in the church anymore you just leave that church and go to a different one and because the church doesn't own the properties they can't make you leave, but in these traditional communities a lot of people do leave because that makes it easier because a lot of times people like the parents or preachers will give you a hard time so leaving makes it easier.
The church we go to now has every type of technology and lives just like every other family in the United States does, the only way we are different is that we have our own christian schools and we wear head coverings and wear dresses or skirts but there are no rules on what type of dresses or anything like that.
I can answer some more questions if anyone is interested in hearing more.
We also live amongst all other people and not secluded like this group does.
We also didn't grow up hugging or kissing, I was just something that was past on from generation to generation, my parents have left that church I grew up in, but they still find it super awkward to show affection and tell their own children that they love them
This is all so interesting! Thank you for sharing! It seems very similar to the LDS in that there are so many break off groups that while sharing a lot of the core doctrine, do things very differently.
@@GrowingUpinPolygamy yes so true
In Kansas, there is a town that has at least 4 different Mennonite churches. They had different beliefs in technology and what they wore. I had a former coworker who was Mennonite who went to college and played basketball. He always wore button up shirts, but otherwise one could not have known he was Mennonite.
There are so many mennonites on youtube who aren't Old Order (the group talked about here). Would be great to do an interview with them! One woman in particular Lynnette Yoder was raised Amish and is now Mennonite!
Can you imagine sitting in silence at the table, listening to everyone chewing their food!? I would go mad!
(I grew up Holdeman Mennonite in the USA...quite different from the mennonites you spoke about today.)
We have a fairly large population of Old Order Amish/ Mennonite in rural southern Indiana. It’s not uncommon to get stuck behind a buggy on a single lane highway. They are much more social than this particular group. Lots of quilt auctions and farmers markets. Always buy the pies 🥧 😉
I grew up in a very rural area in southwestern Pennsylvania and we had a large Mennonite population there. While they did dress in the way you’re describing, they drove cars, had phones (landlines back then) and were involved in business in the community. My parents put an addition onto our house around 1995-1996 and a Mennonite man built our entire kitchen - they do beautiful cabinetry work. He had a large family and would bring one of his daughters with him to play with me and my sister while he worked. A Mennonite family also owned the large farm behind my parents’ house and every year they would farm the fields on tractors. They had cows and sheep and peacocks that made loud noises at night, lol. You often saw them out in the community too. Sadly, the same man who made our kitchen had an accident in his large family van where he went over a bridge very close to our house and many of his children died. 😞
I was born in the US but grew up in several countries in South and Central America. When we lived in Honduras, we used to stop on our way in to the city at a Mennonite farmstand to buy Banana Bread. It was soooo good. One day we drove up the driveway, and tucked in behind the trees we were shocked to see a beautiful north american style house and barn. It was like stepping out of Honduras and into a barnyard in Vermont!
I lived in Honduras for a while and I know exactly where you are talking about because we would stop there between Teguc and Catacamas! There was also a Mennonite ice cream store in Siguatepeque that had amazing ice cream!
Just watched the youtube doc about them after watching this and it's so interesting! Hearing that their only time for leisure is in church speaks volumes..so it's only positive association. I absolutely think each to their own as long as people are safe and happy, but I can't help feeling for them having no music or a creative space. I know they know no different, but music brings a joy to the soul they'll never experience and it makes me sad for them!
Groups like this have a lot of abuse and alcohol issues.
There are many other mennonite videos out there
I love learning how other people live. Thank you for producing this content and for being so kind in how you react to different content.
Regarding what is or is not ok to buy...they have a meeting where new things are discussed and the community decides as a group. The key factor in deciding is whether or not it is deemed necessary.
My family never really use the dinner table, it was more of a desk lol, we all just grabbed our food and went to separate rooms
After the U.O. in FLDS we were required to eat the meal in silence. Also all meetings were in silence. No one talked before or after meetings, entered and exited in silence.
That was a really good discussion. I wonder why physical expressions of affection are discouraged in those communities. It would be interesting to know.
Enjoy your videos.
I've noticed many similarities in principle and practice between FLDs and Amish and Mennonites.
I am formerly Amish, so this one was interesting, and I'm looking forward to the one about Amish. ☺ There is a huge variety of these as well as Mennonites.
So growing up we always talked about our day at the dinner table. Usually it was my dad telling us about interesting or weird things about his job. There were only four of us (2 adults and 2 kids) so pretty quiet. However currently it’s only my husband and I which tends to be quiet. We usually talk when we get home before dinner so dinner tends to be quiet or watching out favorite show.
We definitely talk at dinner time and breakfast time at the table. I homeschool my kids, so when we're home for lunch, I'll usually play a show or movie for them while we eat. The kids especially need a break from each other come lunch time.😅There's an entire movement that is encouraging families to sit down and eat together, because they talk to each other during the meal. If you talk, you can work through the tough times, and families who eat (and talk) together actually have lower rates of all kinds of negative things - depression, anxiety, eating disorders, substance use, low self-esteem, etc.
Thanks for your input on these groups!
Thank you for discussing this group. I love you guys. I've watched their show, and to say I'm fascinated would be an understatement, so thanks again.
Some great regular Mennonite RUclipsrs are:
Megan Fox Unlocked
Lynette Yoder
The Mennonite Mom (currently on a break)
However these people are not old order like you are talking about here, but a more modern version.
Janine on Mennonite Mom has some fantastic vids about her brand of the M faith. Really really beautiful
Interesting to hear about these Mennonites. We have a big Mennonite community where I live in Canada and there are several differences between what I know about them compared to this group.
I am Mennonite, and I would have grown up like that if my parents hadn't moved to Canada with their families in the 60s. I would still be a Mennonite regardless of what church I would go to, since it's also a culture, a people, bloodline.
Our history started after Martin Luther in the 1500s. Originally they were called Anabaptists (rebaptizers), a name given to them as a derogatory term, but they embraced it. Amish & Hutterites are also anabaptists. We derived our name from Menno Simon, a former Catholic priest from Friesland, Netherlands.
They were brutally persecuted by the Catholic church there, so when they were invited to north Germany by a rich landowner to live there, they did so. That is where I believe we get our German dialect from (low German, northern Germany is lower than southern Germany (?)).
That landowner passed away, and they needed to be on the move again, and they ended up in Prussia (modern day Poland). They ran out of land there, which was crucially important, since all Mennonites wanted to farm. Plus, they are pacifists, so they wanted exemption from enlisting in war, something Prussia wasn't wanting to give.
Catherine the Great found out about their plight and invited them to come to Ukraine. She gave them the war exemptions, and the right to school their own children, so they moved there.
My forefathers moved to Canada from the Ukraine in the 1880s, but many stayed there into the 2nd world War. That's when they suffered incredibly under the Bolshevik army, and later Stalin.
I believe there are still a few low German speaking Mennonites left living there 😔
In 1920, there was a mass exodus from Manitoba and Saskatchewan to Mexico, and then later other South American countries due to persecution in Canada (!)
German speaking people who didn't want to fight were looked down on by the government and their neighbours after fighting in a war against Germany.
This is a very condensed version. Trying to keep it short here 😁
@@linadyck3894 Excellent condensed history lesson on our people! Thank you!
The movie Women Talking is an imagined response to a situation that happened in a Mennonite group in Bolivia.
You should do the iblp which has been described as a cult by some who have left.
We will add it to the list!
This is curious to me and I’m only 3 minutes in lol!! I homeschool my kids and a substantial amount of our materials come from a Mennonite publishers (we are not Mennonite but the material is great.). So yes, they definitely have Mennonite textbooks. I’m sure whether or not they choose to use them varies from community to community, though.
I think the biblical argument for shunning/excommunication/etc. may come from one of Paul's epistles in which he discusses church discipline or what to do if someone in the church has wronged you. I remember it being the last step, where if after xyz, the person still won't repent, let them be like an outsider (maybe the word there is gentile) to you.
I'm terrible at remembering and finding verse references, so it would take me longer than I'm willing to spend rn to find the exact wording and context (and even then, it would be only the context of the surrounding text, not the full context of what was going on in the church Paul was writing to). My own nondenominational churches have had no policies related to that verse than I know of. The only church discipline I've witnessed involves church leaders who had to be confronted and then had to resign.
My husband and two boys chat like crazy at dinner. We also listen to music sometimes. 😂
I was in a youth symphony when I was in middle and high school. We had several members who were Mennonite. They wore very modest handmade clothes (long dresses/head scarves for the girls and long pants/long sleeve shirts for the boys) and all the girls had the most gorgeous long hair. They never spoke to anyone outside their group and sat out for songs that were too beat-heavy. One time we had a concert featuring several big band songs and they were excused from the stage during that part of the performance. Very interesting!
One of the weirder moments of my life was when I was with some friends on Hollywood Blvd and there was a Mennonite choir giving out CDs.
My parents would talk to us around the dinner table but we were only allowed to have one conversation at a time. We were a family of 5 and the only rule would be to let one person talk at a time. Then we would all end up talking quite a bit over the entire dinner.
Thank you for this. This group is very common in my area. I have no idea what they believe
Love your videos, something I wanted to add: I worked at a small coffee shop in the past and we had mennonites come in. They were nice and would converse, I always thought it was interesting though they seemed very strict, but were still allowed to come get a fancy blended drink
Thanks for making this video! My husband is from Pennsylvania near Lancaster, where there is a big Amish community. There was a Mennonite community around as well bc we would see them around some but definitely not as often as the Amish. My husband worked in construction for a few years and they had some Amish workers that he worked with everyday. He said they were really nice and obviously very hard workers. They made him a hat and we still have it haha.
As far as the dinner table conversation, we talk a lot in my family. Growing up I was only in a family of 5 but when my husband joined he always said he couldn’t keep up. We talk over eachother and have loud, constant conversation. My husbands family talked but they are much more quiet and keep to themselves. Either way, it’s very important, to all of us, to eat meals together at the table. Everyone let’s their guard down a little more, relaxes, and you can really bond. It’s great!
My family is a chatty dinner time family for sure! I love talking to my kids and husband about anything and everything. 😂
My family rarely ate together, my parents both worked different hours and I was involved in a lot of after school activities. But when we did all eat together we were quiet because there are only 3 of us! Usually my parents just complained about work. lol
Of course we talk around the table! How can you resist when you haven’t seen each other all day?
I've seen the same documentary and it was great hearing your perspectives on it. Love your content!
My family are southern baptists and the men and women sit at opposite sides and ends of the table, so partners sit together. Except typically the genders speak to each other so we end up yelling across the table and above the other so we can hear each other. My poor boyfriend was shook at the first family dinner. He was like y’all are really loud and talk a lot. 😂
Just along the discussion of the groups splitting off calling themselves Mennonite, my great grandparents to my understanding are german mennonites, as such my extended family refers to themselves as Mennonite, attending Mennonite schools etc. I was not raised religious and unfortunately my grandparents did not pass the german language along to their kid. While a lot of the religious aspects for us have fallen off, a lot of the cultural traditions such as recipes remain. In fact we have a german prayer we will say before family meals.
I do remember seeing the old order mennonites at a livestock auction once and it was fascinating.
Please do the 12 Tribes of Israel! They are a very interesting group and I almost joined when I was a teenager in Rutland, Vermont. I'd love to hear your reaction. They pool their property, and have many successful businesses. They were raided as well (in Vermont) and all their kids were returned.
We will add them to the list!
We have some here in Delaware as well as Amish. We talk around the table especially during holidays!
My s/o grew up Eastern Mennonite. I'm curious to hear your take.
Growing up, my dad lead the conversation. We listened. Mostly polite not big conversation. I grew up in the South but to both parents from NYC/Northern Jersey Protestant.
In a nursing home where I worked a Mennonite group came out one Sunday a month and sang hymns (in four part harmony) to our residents. I went to a commencement ceremony at a Mennonite college that included hymns (again in four part harmony). Maybe voices are okay but instruments are not?
I know of someone (not personally) whom is established with His own Internet Blog who is an Ex-Amish. He's a hoot, his style is a perfect match for what you 2 are asking here for a Source to speak to you. I'd have to reach out to him first, of course. Let me know if you are interested. You guys will love him. He's honest as honest can be. This Man is also very open to talk. Love and Hugs to you both with your podcasts. I recognize the 2 of you are open and love all people. Thanks 4 your work.
The nurse who cared for me when I was pregnant and had to be in the hospital for a week before delivering my baby 6 1/2 weeks early was Mennonite. They can have educations, drive cars use technology. There are many Mennonite people in the US
My cousin married a former Mennonite. She said once every month or two someone would go into a closer town to the community PO box and they would get and send mail that way.
growing up we didn't eat around the table even at the holidays. with my family now we talk around the table and have just wonderful fellowship time, I hope my kids look back on our family dinners with the best memories. I don't know if you have ever thought about comparing some of the FLDS patterns to any other non-christian groups around the world. I know so many religions have so many things similar as far as standards and rules they abide by.
We would definitely love to compare to non-christian groups as well. Our list of groups to cover is just getting so long haha, but as we hear of any we will definitely add them as well! =)
If we didn't talk to our teenager during dinner we would probably never know anything!! The rest of the day everything is either "fine" or "no, thank you"!
I followed a Mennonite woman who had a RUclips channel. I was always under the impression that mennonites use some technology but otherwise live similarly to the Amish. The show “leaving Amish” had a one or two mennonites who said that as well.
Agree with Kanna below...this is just one of several branches..the Old Brethern are as origional as they can be. Growing up Baptist ,my father had been raised newer Mennonite,we didnt speak much at the table either
When I was about seven my grandfather was dying from lung cancer and a lady affiliated with hospice would come visit. She was Mennonite. She drove a car and had enough education to be a part of hospice. She was a very kind lady.
I’m intrigued by this because I’m from Pennsylvania and there’s a prominent Mennonite/ Amish community and even some in Northeastern & Central Pennsylvania. I don’t really like their beliefs but their food they sell at market is hella good😂
So, my mother is from Colombia (South America) and one of 16 children! Same two parents (Catholic). They always spoke at the table, and family reunions are LOUD as you can imagine! Lots of excitement and shouting over one-another. When I brought my first husband to his first family reunion (he didn't speak much Spanish) he was concerned and asked me what they were arguing about. I started laughing and said "oh, no, they're not arguing they're just reminiscing!" So that was my mom's side of the family. My father is from Connecticut, and protestant, and one of 2 siblings. Their household growing up was much quieter, and there were more strict rules about how to behave at the table, and as children we were reminded children were to be seen and not heard. Also, politics, religion, etc. were not topics at the table, whereas my mom's family spoke about all kinds of things at the table. Growing up, my mother tried her best to teach us proper table manners, and I was often sent to the kitchen to eat by myself because I would put my elbow on the table, or my fingers in my food. However, there were no restrictions on talking at the table.
Love your content. It’s been incredible watching your channel develop and grow!
Thank you so much!
Mi Husband grew up in Belize in the Colony little Belize and he did go to the same doctor you are talking about, and some of mi Husbands Siblings are born at that doctors place
Wow! That is so cool!
There is a lady - Megan fox unlocked on RUclips - she gives a really great personal view on growing up Mennonite and her current life being Mennonite ! I highly recommend looking her up if you’re looking for more about Mennonite life!
Lynette Yoder also has a great RUclips channel with insight on growing up Amish and later becoming Mennonite! She shares a lot of interesting details of her current life as a Mennonite!
Came here to say the same thing! I love her videos! She’s so open and honest!
They aren't from the same group of Mennonites though then the documentary they are talking about! My ancestors are the Mennonites they are talking about.
I love her channel
Megan and Lynn aren't Old Order Mennonite though. They belong to the Mennonite church
My parents were raised Mennonite and there are 7 children in each of their families. We were not raised Mennonite but many of the principals were followed by my parents including no physical affection. I recall shaking hands with my grand parents as well.
Love hearing about the other groups! One of my other favorite RUclipsrs is a Mennonite and very modern like mommy blogger and i love it! Her name is Megan Fox unlocked here on RUclips. From what I’ve learned from her there are several groups and churches and each one has different rules.
I have a dear friend, who is a Mennonite. She is very progressive. They believe in education, and they use technology. She has two daughters. What is a college professor with a PhD and one is a nurse practitioner! She has worked in a public school for many many years. This looks like a very small amount of the Mennonite church. Them and the German Baptist have a lot of members in the Ohio, Indiana and Pennsylvania
Hey Sam and Melissa! Would you be interested in interviewing a Catholic residential school survivor? Talk about a system of religious control and indoctrination! Or even the daughter of one? (It's me, hi, I'm the daughter 😂)
Absolutely! Please email us at growingupinpolygamy@gmail.com and we can chat!
Well this should be interesting! My partner was raised mennonite
IF I remember, and probably had already been mentioned in the comments, they only use their voices for music.
A coworker of mine grew up in the mennonites. He left when he realized he was gay.
Your story about your dad breaking the Sabbath to do shopping brings to mind the concept of the Shabbos Goy, where some practicing Jews literally employ a non-Jewish person to perform tasks that they aren't allowed to do on the Sabbath (which, depending on how strictly they interpret the rules can even include things like turning on and off lights etc). It's a very controversial practice because the argument against it is that you're obeying the word of the rules but not the spirit, and it's the spirit that matters. The first time I ever heard about this concept was when an Australian football team whose President at the time was an Orthodox Jew got into the Grand Final (our version of the Super Bowl) for the first time in a while - the Grand Final is played on a Saturday afternoon, so there was a lot of media attention on the fact that the club President wouldn't be able to watch or directly listen to it, even at home (I mean, he was accustomed to not being able to watch Friday night or Saturday afternoon games, but this was no ordinary game). There was a lot of talk about what he might do and one of the suggestions was to have a Shabbos Goy watch it and give him a play-by-play second-hand. My dad, whose father was Jewish, had to explain it all to me and, as someone who was raised without any religious beliefs, it just all seemed so weird and hilarious that people can be so devout until they encounter an inconvenience that they don't want to live with and then they tie themselves in knots trying to find loopholes.
🤣My husband and I can identify with you two about dinner table conversations. I come from an extended family that has dozens of conversations going on at once; bairly a few seconds in-between people talking at most. 🙄 My husband's family is old school Norwegian Lutheran; a little conversation is normal but oh boy the disciplinary looks and occasionally disciplinary words from my husbands parents when I talk too much or don't allow several minutes between asking questions 🤦♀️
The shunning aspect is 100% an aspect of Behavior and Emotional control, as seen in the BITE model, a model which breaks down common traits of high control groups and religions (aka cults). Shunning discourages doubters from leaving- do you really want to be cut off from your entire community? Additionally, it makes it more difficult for leavers to come back and rescue their friends and family.
Check out Steven Hassan's work on the BITE model (he created it and has spent his academic career working on this).
Definitely. And their fear of apostates being a "bad influence" is a euphemism for fearing that people will hear alternative viewpoints or learn that what they've been told about the outside world is an outright lie.
I turn barely 12 then I had to stop going to school, boy go till 13. If a Girl starts her piriod before 12 she have to stop going to school
There’s quite a few Mennonite and Bretheren families in the town that I live in. They don’t come off as isolated from the rest of the community or to try and be as far from the rest of us at all.
Children were seen and not heard at our dinner table in the 1970s, my parents tried it at times and it didn’t last too long, I think my dad was just tired and stressed, so it was a good excuse to use!
You should watch Peter Santenello on RUclips. He had an entire Amish series
We will put it on the list!
Ok, so this will be a long post lol. First let me introduce myself. I'm a young mom from a Mennonite community..and surprise surprise I am using the internet and clothing like anybody else does haha.
There are many different kinds of Mennonites first of all. There are these ones in documentary (Russian Mennonites) and then there are the amish-mennonites that live mostly in the USA. And there are a ton of others as well. My ancestors are from the same group as these are.
I grew up in a Mennonite community in Mexico. My parents both grew up in a very traditional way (kind of like the people in the documentary) but these are the most extreme ones out there. There are very few left that are still like this. If you were to go to Mexico to the Mennonite community there in Chihuahua, you wouldn't believe that they are the same kind. But sadly they only make documents of the extreme ones. I would say about 50 percent of Mennonites you wouldn't even recognize as Mennonites from the way they are dressed or live. Another 30 percent that still dress somewhat traditional but are living normal lives other then there believe. But they have contact with the "outside world". They have electricity and work normal jobs. They do however still have their own schools and traditional church.
And then the rest are the more extreme ones. It's a very complex group of people! It would take hours to explain the whole thing lol
But hey if anyone has any questions..I'll try to answer them.
That is so interesting! If you would ever be willing to be on our channel and chat with us, we would love to hear more straight from the source! Please email us if that is something you would be open to at growingupinpolygamy@gmail.com
I live in Northern California and I see the Mennonites all the time. They shop in the same shops I do and this morning I went to a Mennonite cafe for breakfast today. They drive the same cars we do. Many wear calico dresses. The little children wear the same clothes that the other kids do.
Growing up I was the youngest of 5 and we all talked at the dinner table. But in the early 2000’s my great grandmother came to live with us for a week. She was born in 1903 in England . At the dinner table the first day she scolded us children for talking at the table without first being addressed. (Only able to talk if an adult talked to you first) My mom then yelled at HER for yelling at as telling her that her kids are allowed to talk at the table.
BTW this is my great grandmother on my dad’s side
Interesting. I've definitely heard, "Children are not to speak unless spoken to first," and "Little children should be seen and not heard." Both seem horrible to me, but I think it wasn't uncommon in the past to expect kids to be silent.
@@LivetolearnMama yeah. My grandfather (her son) didn’t raise my dad as strictly. So when it got to my generation talking at the table was normal. We still had to ask to get up from the table, etc.
We talk around the table.
Interesting! I live in Canada and we have a lot of mennonites. Some of them are just as modern as everyone else but go to a Mennonite church, so it’s more just about their religion. Some live without electricity and use horse and buggies. But they don’t live far away from everyone else and they often sell their goods at farmer’s markets. My brother is a contractor and works with a Mennonite that build cabinets and he uses electricity and has a phone but doesn’t have a computer and some other modern things. Around here people love to buy Mennonite furniture for the quality.
The Old Order is the more strict group of Mennonite I have encountered. Most I have lived near in both NNY and KY are not Old Order and have phones, drive cars and use electricity which non of the Amish I lived near used. The Amish folks would accept rides in cars very rarely (extreme emergency) from select people. The Mennonites operated many open to the public businesses such as general stores, bakeries and meat processing. The Amish folks would have road side stands (at the end of their driveways) where people could come buy extra baked items, produce, honey, maple syrup and home canned items like pickles. My son misses the maple cinnamon rolls and peach pies from our time in KY
I follow Ruthann Zimmerman (Homesteading With The Zimmermans on RUclips) and she used to be Mennonite. She may still be in some ways but I'm not sure how that breaks down. Would love to see you guys collab with her!
We would love that as well! It would be so great to interview someone that is from that community!
We talk.I thought everybody did!
I have relatives who became Mennonites in the late 1800’s after fleeing Brigham Young and Utah. The funny thing is they are music teachers 🤷♀️
I also know someone who is Mennonite and is an educated engineer
There used to be the old school philosophy that children should be seen & NOT heard.
The Old Colony don't have everything in common like the Hutterites. But they do create self-sustaining colonies or community with land connected to the other families.
I grew up in Southwest Kansas where there are a lot of Mennonites, but they weren't on the traditional end of the spectrum. The town I lived in was heavily Mennonite, but you wouldn't know it unless you were there for a while. They dressed just like everyone else and didn't have an practices that were outside the norm for the average American. They did eat certain traditional Mennonite foods and they intermarried a lot (in fact this had gotten be to a genetic problem so for a while they were encouraging people to go up to Mennonite communities in Minnesota and Canada to look for spouses). In other communities nearby there were other Mennonites who were more traditional. They could have cars, but they had to be black. The women wore a certain style of floral dresses and black caps. In recent years the women from these groups have started wearing more mainstream clothes that have been adapted to fit their modesty requirements (like maybe a modest shirt with long jean skirt). Some of my friends in high school were from a group that had com up from Mexico. Their parents were semi conservative but didn't mind how their children dressed. They spoke German and English well, but didn't speak much Spanish so you could tell their group hadn't integrated much in Mexico.
My dad owned several John Deere dealerships and Mennonites in the area were willing to pay the higher John Deere prices because they knew he wouldn't take advantage of them. Most businesses in the area know they are woefully undereducated and cannot function in mainstream society. He earned a lot of respect in the community.
I grew up with those Mennonites and the same clothes and Rules. I can answer a lot if you want to know more
We'd love to know more! We'd love to interview you on the channel! If that is something you are open to, please email us at growingupinpolygamy@gmail.com =)
I haven’t finished the video yet but when researching my ancestry, I found out the original Mennonites that came to the US were not the same as the ones now. They were actually considered progressive at the time.
Talking around the table is normal for our family of 9 who are 13 and up
There is a very wide variety of Mennonites. The ones I grew up around drove decent cars, bought regular clothing, and were college educated. They made a distinction between worldly technology and practical technology, worldly spending and practical spending. And many of them had and kept contact with cousins who were in the horse-and-buggy set or who were black-bumper (cars are practical, chrome is worldly, so they pain the chrome black). Amish are an offshoot of Mennonites, and they range from horse-and-buggy to black-bumper orders. Another Mennonite offshoot is the Church of the Brethren, of which almost all are in the practical-technology-accepting range but with similar emphases on peace, humility, and modesty and with similar anabaptist theology.
also, I was floored when I had a lead teacher transferred into a classroom where I was working complained that I encouraged the children to converse around the table. "they should be eating, not talking." This was the exact opposite of what our state food program required, which was to encourage children to spend at least half an hour in their seats with food in front of them, and to encourage conversation (both for politeness, to get dedicated time in adult-moderated conversations, and also to encourage them to eat slowly enough they had a chance to feel full and choose to stop eating at a reasonable time.).
Also, I believe the instructions in the New Testament regarding "siblings who do not listen" when confronted/corrected by the congregation is to "treat them as a sinner or a tax collector." Shunning and excommunication results when people interpret this as, "sinners and tax collectors were outcasts, so we must cast them out of our community." Personally, I think this completely ignores the way CHRIST treated sinners and tax collectors, often making particular effort to pay attention to them and treat them with love and patience.
Also watch the documentary Sins of the Amish.
Old oder is the ones who use candles in their homes but the new order use electrictristy for their homes
We love in rural Oklahoma we have a large Mennonite community here. Some of the women work in our school. The men do have trucks the women can drive at the school. They do only wear dresses. The girls leave school about 6 grade the boys go until they get jobs some do graduate but still only work in the order. They only use phones for work only and they have time of the day when everything turns off and days of the week where they don't use phones electric or cars
For family dinners we talk at dinner but once everyone starts eating it’s quiet and then someone will make a comment “I guess it’s good, no one’s talking.” 😂
JWs have a Bible verse about shunning. I think it is in Corinthians, and says something about distancing one's self from toxic people, it is a big jump!
For meal times. With that many kids they probably just wanted to get thru the meal. I imagine there wasn't an excess of food either. Hurry up and get your food in.
And I was wondering about the age 13 education thing. Why are most stopping at 13. Sadly is it because of puberty. Or is there a biblical reason?
Yah, it is interesting that 13 seems to be about the age that a lot of groups stop formal education. It seems to us that at about 13 is when kids can start working more like adults.