Hey, a Taliyah one-trick here. Thanks a lot for making the video, i agree with the most points you said. At the begging with her, i was afraid to even use the ult, because it could lock my teammates in a bad spot (and that's exactly what happened when i did). But her unpopularity can also be a good thing since like a year ago, an enemy player typed: "i have never played against Taliyah, lol" into all chat. Thank u stranger for reading my comment.
My issue with Taliyah is she changed between Mid and jungle way too much. Not because the game changed, but because Riot changed her abilities. At that point it felt like riot was punishing me for trying to learn her, and so I don't want to go back. Instead I would just play a character like Ahri who has been viable in the position for a long time without riot changing her mechanics to move her role.
I was smurfing with taliyah as i usually do the other day. Somone typed in all chat ''Taliyah players are very rare''. That gave me powers unlike any other
I'm a Taliyah Main wannabe but actually a Jack of (almost) all trades... may i get some advice from you to effectively use taliyah? I usually do very good work with skillshots and in the teamfights but everything i learned about her is mostly from experience and intuition, is there some kind of trick for the early game when ganking or farming? I'm one of those guys who usually die in the jungle due to bad hp management with more fragile champions INSTAEDIT: and by "usually" i mean, more often than most, but not a lot, like 5 to 10 times a year if i play jungle often
@@BlaxeFrost-X getting comfortable kiting to full potential, using your abilities corretly/leveling the right ability depending on where you start your clear, smite usage etc. These are the things you may need to focus on on your first clear as taliyah. You tend to get a little low on hp on your first clear. But you should never die. try to getting hit as little as possible by the camps. Rememver that your E slows. Honostly you cant teach someone exactly how to do it over a youtube comment. Just practice in practice tool and watch Challenger replays.
Something about Taliyah I feel that makes her less appealing is although she has a lot of skins there is not a lot of variety. Aside from classic Taliyah you can get blue Taliyah, blue Taliyah 2, or blue Taliyah 3
a lot of skins?.... bruh i dont think you realize that her poolparty skin was her first real skin in years, if we discount her SSG skin which was only made because they won then she only has 2 lmao
Yeah that's the one point of this video where I disagree. It's not entirely the players fault that she is unpopular, don't forget the fact that they forcefully changed her identity. Creating a champion for a role and then nerfing her in that role and pushing her into another after a few years obviously creates a problem within her playerbase.
@@vairrow324 exactly, but didn't even some rioter state that they did that on purpose because she was So much popular after they put her in the jungle? that "popularity" was thanks to her buffs and not the role change, which we can definitely see after they nerfed her again.
I don’t play her often, but on occasion I will and enjoy her. She’s a good champion design. As intended, she’s not some blonde bimbo or atypical league female character. I respect them for making her like that and that’s also part of the appeal but also that detracts from the common appeal. I should play her a bit more, I really only do when we need AP. But she deserves more than that. I play most of the champions on this series sadly ahah
@@VarsVerum I'd beg to differ. The only significant difference between you is video length, but you make up for that by posting more than once every two months....which in my humble opinion makes you the superior youtuber xP
@@metaloom I appreciate that :) but Exil definitely performs better individually in terms of production quality per video, even if he uploads at a slower pace. Making 40-60 minute long videos with that level of editing takes way more time than you think.
@@metaloom Yeah, no offense to Vars. I prefer his more fun style of videos and pace of uploading but Exil's production and research are unparalleled. He'll pull up obscure ass tweets by pros or specific footage from a 2015 tournament to show when a champion was OP. If Exil is S tier then Vars is probably B+ to A as far as quality. But the consistency makes him better for me.
Because she's the only hero that get's punished for simply trying to play the game. Oh you used your Q once ? Well screw you, you can't use it on this large area again for like half the match. Other champions might have flaws or counters, but only she has her damage taken away as a feature.
Her q CD is 2 sec at max rank the problem is that she was a mid laner with aoe Q but then they reworked her into a jungler and nerfed her . She’s decent now but got nerfed some patches ago
@@theteamxxx3142 The duration of worked ground doesn't really affect her at all. It will never be low enough to be used in the same spot twice in 1 fight, but it goes away by the next fight. Also idk what u talking about MS on worked ground? thats her passive it works anywhere
Goddammit, this is another champ I feel like picking up now. For the same reason as Kled: playing around her spell's passive cooldown sounds so interesting, and her ultimate is pretty flexible. She also fits into my three favorite roles. I think I just like champs with a lot of micro-management. Azir, Kalista, Kindred, now Kled, and Taliya.
It's simple, she has a unique play style that takes a lot of time to master. So many easier junglers that are way easier and less demanding. She's really fun to play though!
I started picking up taliyah lately and yes she is fun to play albeit a bit odd to learn, but she really helps if you want to learn to correctly roam to other lanes
She contributes a lot in every teamfights it's either you flank or set-up your enemies with your ult, burst squishy targets or just skirmishing with your q that has less cd.
I mained Taliyah back when she released and honestly the removal of AOE on her Q was a huge nerf for her that she never recovered from. Also despite her being a more modern champion her kit always felt somewhat clunky to use, especially her W. Nowadays I think she's actually really good in mid lane though, especially in low elo where no one knows how to play against her.
Not really, she struggles a lot vs high mobility assasins like Zed/Yone or LB and long range artillery champs like Lux. She is ok against mid range midlaners like Lissandra, Viktor tho
She was my favorite champion when she was released, i used to have so much fun with her, like Zoe levels of fun, but once they changed the way her W was casted and removed the AOE Q i stopped playing her completely. Now she is one of my worst champions and i will miss her forever 😢
Just my Experience with Taliyah : I used to onetrick her and climb like crazy back in the days where she had the aoe Q. When it got removed i almost entirely forget she was even existing.
Her worked ground mechanic got a huge buff, instead of 45s cd its now 25s and instead of a 450 units radius for the effect, it got reduced to 300 units
Taliyah is what we know as a downward spiral of popularity and power She's unpopular because her gameplay is weird and her aesthetics is just Middle Eastern Toph (not the most inspiring fantasy when the vast majority of players are East Asian) so since she's not popular she doesn't get buffs or skins, so she stays weak, and since she stays weak less people are interested in playing her, meaning she'll get more weak and so on and so on It's similar to Aurelion Sol, he's VERY unpopular, specially in the various East Asian servers so he never gets buffed, so he becomes even more unpopular, so he never gets buffed so he, etc etc
Bruh i gotta say her Seismic Shove is one of the hardest abilities to land for new mains. Sure it has the same delay on Cho's Rupture, but thats only if u can input the location AND direction fast enough, and trying to not only mentally calculate where you want the target to go and where they will be in 1 second is NOT easy, sometimes the target won't move when u expect them to, and sometimes in a different direction. Having to juggle those two variables while trying to cast the spell fast is pretty difficult for new users. So in theory its intuitive, but in actual practice its anything BUT, that. Basically her low playrate comes down to her tools just being really hard to use if u don't know how to use them correctly, like u said u have to have MASSIVE amounts of game knowledge to be effective with her...and many people would rather just play an easy champ they can face roll with.
as a taliyah main since her release and otp since s8, I think that her problem comes from the fact that she was designed to be a roaming mid laner but ended up being pushed into the jungle. Her original Q was more intended to be used for poke but save on mana and cd, this not becoming a major issue in team fights because it made it so that you could fight on worked ground with less overall damage but able to maintain a solid dps as you got the first hit of her q off every time on a very spamable ability with aoe. I think the best thing riot could do for her as a champion is to find a way to merge the current q with the old one to keep her as a mid/jungle option but play more in line with her original kit.
Do you consider Xerath to be an Unpopular champion despite having the highest popularity compared to Ziggs and Vel’koz? Because I wonder, what is the exact play rate numbers would you consider to be unpopular? Personally I consider someone who has around 100,000 matches in Iron to be unpopular. Yeah that isn’t playrate, but often I see match numbers to be consistent with their pick rate.
Taliyah Mid Main here is sad because you are so correct, but still happy because she is not banned or picked very much. So I get to enjoy playing her often :D
where's the "why noone plays j4?? Haven't seen that champ since I played him in free rotation, and before that once in a sej j4 bot lane comp... and never before that...
I love J4 too! But I think it's cause he's more utility and less damage than other characters in the jungle. Like, all of his abilities carry a bit of utility in them, but unless you build lethality, you have a hard time outdamaging more oppressive/all-in characters, like Kindred, Graves, Olaf, Hecarim. It's not impossible, but Jarvan shines better in a fight alongside allies than by himself. And in solo q, you can only trust yourself with stuff, most of the time. But I'm iron, so don't take my word too seriously lmao
@@rodrigoportalesoliva897 As an adc main i'm really glad the assassin J4 meta is over. I could deal with Zed's jumping on me way more than J4 3 shotting me before I could move once.
it seems like worked ground mechanic being a huge handicap is her biggest problem so the new changes to her q should rise her popularity since now instead of being a handicap it changes her q and the fact that her e now stuns people who dash trough removes another problem she faced
1tricking taliyah support is a blast. support feels like a natural fit for her. her early damage is actually insanely high if you're not constantly on the verge of going OOM or dying just from trying to last hit. And, like you said in this video, she's incredibly macro intensive, which is exactly what support maine are usually about! In terms of being able to limit test and push the pace of games to insane degrees, there's really no support that comes close. You could say the same about battle mages and mages in general, taliyah is faster, more micro intensive, and more adrenaline fueled than most casters, who usually try to play at a very controlled pace. When she goes "WOHOO," you really feel it." Excited for the rework, even though i'm worried it will force her out of support, i think that the changes to her passive and ultimate in particular will make her much more intuitive and versatile, and the W change will help her stay relevant if she falls behind on damage output
I used to play her on support a lot, now that I've starting playing her again she doesn't really feel that great in support a lot since she deals 0 damage early on, plus she isn't as good for roaming early anymore. I miss the old taliyah and the oneshots but this new taliyah makes it so you don't have to make plays early on that much, you can just farm and scale really well, right now maybe too well. I play her mostly mid now, she's pretty fun!
The best way I can put it is that Taliyah's main burst is about as reliable as a crossmap Sion ult. You aren't hitting them without your team handing it to you for free, and if your champ can't have any potential without some specific champions like TF you won't get played.
Ok, great video, but correction right off the bat. She wasn't reworked to become a jungler (even though the whole "roaming" aspect of her kit and lore makes more sense there). She was reworked to be more general mass appealing to be more of a burst mage compared to a control mage. They increased her burst, and her out of combat passive speed, in exchange for less aoe damage and in combat ms. Junglers just happened to found success with her and she was really good for the meta. Players moved Taliyah into the jungle, not Riot. Riot just decided they liked her better there and balance her for it. And Taliyah mids have been salty ever since (even though a lot of champions are played more in roles other than their originally intended one).
The peoblem with Taliyah is: She struggles against anything thats not an immobile enemy , she is squishy so she can get the ADC treatment from assasins , and she HAS TO constantly move to avoid: HER OWN DAMN PASSIVE, hooks/stuns , and still have a good positioning in a fight. She is just damn hard to play and very picky with the enemy she can be good against. Unlike onetricks like Asol , Riven , Zed , Irelia , basically they can still be usefull when behind by tanking , just making the backline disappear , or just being an annoying piece of shit to play against , Taliyah can't do any of those when behind, and she is really bad with dueling early, scuttle crab fights at lvl3 are like trying to blow a brick wall away from between you and the scuttle , the brickwall being the enemy Xin Zhao that can almost kill you by just jumping onto you.But anyone who can pick her up an be consistent with her , she is a great champ with a lot of utility when fed early and anyone who masters her can be a nightmare of the enemy team. She has a great champ design thats a shame to go to waste with a 0.5% pickrate next to Aurelion Sol.
Man, Taliyah is such a great champ and it always pains me looking at her sad stage in game. Like many low playrate champs she seems abandoned by riot. In my opinion she just needs a few quality of life changes to make her more popular.
@@greatsoup7540 Yes please I've been saying this for awhile, some quality of life changes to make her w > e easier to hit but make her q weaker I would love that
Personally I wish they took a bit of damage out of her w and e combo and buff her in other places. Maybe in exchange for damage give her the movement speed buff on worked ground back, so its not just a debuff for her or maybe enable her to q zhonyas. I basically stopped playing her because she is so coinflip, either you oneshot someone with your combo or you just die.
@@vairrow324 tbh yea ur right, i didnt really mean more damage for her w > e i meant making it more consistent so like you said its not just miss > death hit > win
assassins ruin mid lane, even if they ddn't, tanks would ruin late game. dmg falls off so hard, one draven Q late game will heal the dmg he took from your entire combo. its tough out here for a pimp. i'm honestly glad i stopped playing this champ. something like prerework asol/velkoz/veigar scale harder and make it easier to climb lower elos.
Q: gain a charge every 15 sec, holds 3/3/3/4/5 charges, if first boulder hits a monster throw 2 more boulders and the ground around her becomes worked for 45 sec.(maybe add +1 charge per 100 ap) W: add charge ability to knock enemies in target direction, failing to charge just knocks up but is faster. E: add ring of boulders around where she was that cause cc duration based on how many boulders dashed over.
I think coming back to her would be good because even though her mid-scope update addressed a lot of the downsides talked about in the video, her pick rate is still quite low.
A Taliyah main here, soo I actually play her mid and last season I got to plat with her and this season my peak was Plat 1. If you can win early game, which is easy against many mages you can just gank botlane easily at lvl 6 or even earlier which is so op the adc often gets 2 kills and yeah. I think that worked ground isn't such a big problem you can cast enough q's in a teamfight if you walk a bit around or if the teamfight moves which is often the case. Another problem that you talked about are tanks and building liandrys is so good against them.
Finally its taliyah : best girl:^) I do hate the change from mid to jungle; not my playstyle. dont know how many agree but i think shell fit in well as a mid sup type of mage like zyra or brand, she has high base dmg and low ap ratios, can hold out well with free poke from single q and offers cc like vel koz, but she lacks significant impact and is easily minionblocked and engaged on, but now she is so nerfed shes basicly only a high elo jungler , which was a role riot already sorta forced her into after pros abused the wall and waveclear. im a neeko/ taliyah sup main/ fan so im biased ofc
i fucking love her. She's one of the hardest champs to play but also one of the most fun ones. It's just so fucking good to trap enemies and teammates with the ultimate
Did not think I would like this video but I did, I agree with most of your points, she is a great champion and a great mid laner and has been for a long time, the key to playing her is not being stuck in the mentality of being a battle mage, she is more optimally played with a burst roaming mage mindset and should mostly buy pure damage items, then you just run around oneshotting people.
Before the video premiers my personal take on taliyah. So i think she's a case of the devs werent really sure of what they wanted to make. And it took the community to actually design and adapt the champ into what she is now. Like she was supposed to be a mid lane mage that focused on roaming up and down the river but obviously that didnt work out cuz she didnt have consistent wave clear and her passive madr using her main damage ability really hard to use in the enclosed space of a lane. She was a top lanet for some time i beleieve but not too great there until she finally ended up in the champion junkyard which is jg. Jglers r always looking for champs to add to the jg since the roles so tight and im honedtly glad she found a spot there. Ive tried picking her up into my jg pool and one of the main things i noticed about her is she's a very high skill high reward champ. But if ur any less under that skill u get almost no value from her and in some cases get punished extremely hard. Like learning her is a lot like learning katarina or akali or irelia where u have to play atleast around 100 games to fully understand and get used to the micro in her kit to a playable level but unlike the previously mentioned she's not a laner she's a jgler. And inting to learn u can get away with on a lot of laners but inting as a jgler sets ur entire team back (jg diff amirite) so theres already a negative stigma against her cuz of her high skill cap theres also the matter of her utility and damage output her abilities are very clunky and lock u into only being able to damage ppl in certain areas/directions. Its admitably a hell of a lot of damage especially the q which has a low cool down but on their own they feel very clunky unless u weave it into her bread and butter combo weq for a complete one shot which is extremely satisfying to use. So its a case of either u can consistently hit her micro down to a tea or ur missing out on a hell of a lot of damage. Then there's her ult. Theres honestly a weird like drawback to none damaging mage ults. They r honestly some of the most op ults in the game from a macro stand point but it also pushes away ppl from the champ if they cant get the most of the macro. Like for example a lot of times youll see ppl playing tf or ryze and they simply use their ults to just tp back in lane if they arent using tp even tho they have insane roam potential and can be at almost anywhere on the map with their ults. Its as if if the ult doesnt deal damage ppl dont really get the satisfaction of leveling and hitting the 6/11/16 power spikes of other mage champs like say kassadin who is literally defined by his huge damaging ulty. So overall a combination of champion identity crisis upon release, the champion itself gatekeeping ppl through its kit, and the lack of satisfaction within her design outside of the one shot combo makes taliyah very off putting to ppl trying to learn her. This is all suggestive ofc and my personal observations. Im currently learning taliyah cuz i find her extremely fun to play and i like her kit and design but i cant say i dont see the constant restrictions i feel hen im playing her.
Will you ever make a series/episode on you designing your own champions as if they were to be thrown into League of Legends today? I have personally been recreationally designing MOBA champs in a Leagueish way for about 1.5-2 years so I'd love to hear your approach to designing kits.
Excelent video with an emphasis on Taliyah's main priority: position. Both in the teamfight and in the game in general. Just one note: Master Yi is anything BUT *early game* skirmisher. Yi notably struggles before getting his ultimate - has only 1 gap-close tool without follow up. Pre-level 6 Yi loses to Taliyah (and, actually, lots of junglers) really hard just because if they are in a bad spot when meeting him - they will just run away from Yi. Master can only burst them if their HP is too low, but then again every jungler can do that, so it doesn't count. Master Yi is post-6 champ, not early.
I think the reason why nobody plays her is because riot for some reason deleted her Aoe damage on her Q. That was the reason why i stopped. She used to be such a good midlaner
Your editing is on point, your thumbnails are great, your audio is crisp, your videos are interesting, the pacing is also good, and your accent is nice
As much as I love playing Taliyah, the fact that a lot of her damage output relies on her EW combo kills me, because I fucking *despise* the way that ability is cast. I try to practice it over and over and yet it always seems like when I need it to knock towards me, it knocks away, and vice versa. It can be frustrating to have such an easy disengage from ganks in mid lane and yet because the cast is functionally a coin-toss, unless you try to take the time to line it up properly (in which case you've likely missed), it feels like the game has cheated me into a death even when I know it's not the case. I wish there was a way to cast the ability that was intuitive like it is now, but a lot less clunky.
About Taliyah's W being the only ability in the game where you can choose where they're knocked back to I'd say Azir ult has the same kind of function. Not sure if it's the exact same thing, but you can choose which way to place it during a shurima shuffle.
WOW Vars this was really interesting! You definitely hit on the reason i didn't put much time into her (the worked ground). But the part that charged the diodes for me was when you said she is a macro and methodical champion. Think Graves is so cool and Ekko, but my mechanics are turraaash. But i feel i am a better macro player than micro player. And you pose her strengths of being able to move around them map quickly (i like speed), Global ult (more speed), and very high damage Q means that she's not a weak champ. I think you've convinced me to give her a try, seriously this time. Plus she's a unique champ. Like Azir (who i've wanted to play forever). Wonderful! Thank you Vars. Thank you Editor.
I adored taliyah on release, absolutely played her every game i could when she was one of the worst champs on release imo and didnt care. got her to m6 in a week and then i broke my laptop and when i came back they had reworked her w mechanics and she didn't feel right anymore. still played her just didnt feel the same. later when they moved her into the jungle, i just don't feel the same love for her kit anymore that i used to and even though i still try to give her chances any time riot buffs her, i just feel exiled from the champ i once loved to play so much. sometimes i just wish riot would hit the reset button with some champs. :c
The designer for Taliyah actually said that with the champ's q, it's pretty cumbersome to aim it and 'strafe' using a computer mouse, since intuitively players right click on their target to attack but with Taliyah if you're aiming your q and it misses you need to move perpendicular to where the target is. Riot actually expects champs like Taliyah and ASol to have a higher playrate on LoL:WR as it may be more intuitive to use a joystick to aim as opposed to mouse buttons
I really enjoyed this video. Right before this video came out I got a skin for taliyah from a re roll and was thinking about trying her out. I tried her out and now she is my favorite champ in the game
Missed point here - Worked Ground can be used as a zone defense tool - Once you've used the ability and worked ground is up, you can spam that one rock at a time endlessly for practically no mana cost, giving you a long range poke from a safe spot such as tower. This means early game, Taliyah running out of mana can rely on a worked ground patch to shoot off ocasional hits without soaking up their mana or running out
Why would I want a spammable nerf version of my wave clear ability when I was already behind? That kind of poke only benefits you when you can move around a lot like Ezreal, right?
at 7:47 as a top lane player this crushed me.... Renekton got Taliyah a double kill and she just HAD to ruin that perfect slow push into freeze for Renekton.... UGH. Great vid though :)
Her passive surprised me with how clever it was. I'm glad that League has champions which care about terrain. Dota2 is cool because it has heros who care about trees but I don't know if any of their heros care about like... the type of ground. I don't play league but I like how my favorite champions have also ended up being "good but high skill barrier". It makes me feel skilled as a league player... yes.
I'm a Taliyah one trick and I agree with a lot of things and disagree with some of them, i really hate that riot made her a jungler, i still play her every lane because she is so flexible lol. Idk why but her worked ground never bothered me, specially when i play mid because she is so mana hungry, her worked ground q is a nice poke to proc dark harvest, and she is too heavily dependent of her w (maybe because i like to play her as a burst mage), and i like dancing around the battlefield to get max damage on q, it makes you harder to get hit as you get to be moving all the time and worked ground gives you a little movespeed so its most of the time enough to get out of it or chase the enemy, just my thoughs into her, nice video :) pls rito give aoe q back
Firstly great video. I have my own idea why taliyah is not play much (she does not have another female champion assets...) and I can agree about almost every point except one. You see I main tali on top, and I can pretty confidently say that she is great in that role (I got diamond I with her last season) that is why I can't agree about that the one rock shot q is a curse, I think it is a blessing! Because of that I can easily farm and poke enemy laner dealing high dmg using almost no mana, which means that tali does not have all mages problem from early game - lack of mana. Ofcourse there is a risk that enemy will shorten the distance, that's why as my key rune I use speed bust from sorcery after three attacks, which are easy to land when enemy Darius/Garen/Fiora/any other champ try to attack. And if you are experienced enough it is easy to catch the fresh ground to deal max combo dmg. To get better sustain add bloody hunter rune and you get Perfect toplaner. : winner in every (except zed, kassaidyn and tryndamere but the last one is just banned every game) one v one duel, super sustainable (after one kill) toplaner with high mobility in late, great ganks in early and midgame and much, much bigger dmg output than any other toplaner (roughly 100k dmg in 35 minutes game). It's worth to add that the Spanish inquisition is more expected on top than her, so people even don't know how she works, or how to fight her.
Thing with tali is, pretty much anything and everything can gang up on her and she will be pretty darn powerless to do anything against champions who have multiple dashes and are also quite tanky (lee, vi, etc)
She is one of my mains, but they just make it a chore to play her. Like why does she leave the worked ground circles while other champions can spam their abilities, if the team doesn't know how Taliyah works and they stall the fight in one position she runs out of space to poke with Q.
taliyah is the perfect example of low playrate != unfun or poorly designed. she just has a playstyle that resonates with a very small, but dedicated niche of players. she doesn't need to be changed to make her more broadly appealing, because she isn't meant to be broadly appealing. she's meant to deliver a satisfying experience for people who enjoy the macro and control aspects of the game, and that's fine.
her lack of popularity isnt due to the players its due to the devs constantly taking care of assassins and mobile\bursty champions and neglecting champions who actually need brains to play them, you can totally notice how when tali or karthus rose to the top tier champion lists they were instantly nerfed but champions like yasou, lee sin, or JHIN and such who are on the top tier lists literally permanently at this state are never nerfed or adjusted and even if they get nerfed the devs never really try to touch their gameplay design and only nerf some numbers or cooldowns but in the case of taliyah they removed the splash dmg of her Q and changed so much about her Q for " balance reasons " and lets not forget what happened to poor Aurlion Sol and his W changes. so basically its not JUST US its also the developers of the game themselves.
It’d be awesome if there was a way to interact with the warped ground. Maybe make it unwarped or have some sort of bonus or interaction with another ability
I think a good buff without making her oppressive is to add another rock throw or two in her q on worked ground. She can spit out damage fast but in those moments she needs a tiny extra damage
You should remake this video. After the rework like all champs she was BUSTED and a ton of people played her because she had a new kit and was strong, but it seems like now again she has fallen out of the meta. I love her gameplay and kit myself and I would love to see a rework of this video
Hey, are you going to make a video about Taliyah's Mid-Scope Rework? I'd love to watch it as a Taliyah player that played both version of the champion and hear your take on it. I greatly enjoyed Taliyah's early kill pressure with the old Taliyah by being able to all in mid laners level 3 or level 3 ganking as a jungler. But there is not such a thing anymore. Now the champion is better in other areas as opposed to early kill pressure. It was extremely fun, I'll truly miss the old Taliyah but thankfully the new one is just as good as the old one. Hence why I'm not complaining. She is actually viable in both the mid lane and jungle as opposed to her old rework where she was a jungle/support. I felt a little nostalgic even though this wasn't so long ago, thank you for the video!
Well, I'm a Taliyah main playing in gold/plat games. I just loved her design the day she was released, so I played her no matter the role I mastered or riot wanted her to master, even nowadays. I am playing her on jungle, midlane and mostly on support just because i want to play/see her ingame. The thing is that riot really screwed up almost everything they released late2015/2016. Every single chamion they released had an incredibly unique kit and playstyle, but besides of Jhin none of these champions can get Riot's attention. Ivern, Kled, Illaoi, Kindred and of course Asol and Taliyah are so rare to see in the rift nowadays. 99% of my games since 2018 only got Taliyah or Aurelion in them if I played those champs. And I don't even wanna talk about both terribly anti-playerbase mini-reworks.
I mained this chick back when this video was released and while she was fun to play, I can agree knowing more about the general game would increase your ability to play her well.
Takilah likes yasuo in the lore. And thats enough to make me hate her lol
Bold choice of words for someone within last breath range
In the lore Yasuo is a chill guy, if a bit drunk, but he's cool
@@leodiusd4858 given the range of this ultimate - you're almost always in a Last Breath range :D
@@leodiusd4858 malzahar passive go brrr
Well... she learned from him about how to control her powers. He didn't teach her the double-crit passive ;)
Hey, a Taliyah one-trick here. Thanks a lot for making the video, i agree with the most points you said. At the begging with her, i was afraid to even use the ult, because it could lock my teammates in a bad spot (and that's exactly what happened when i did). But her unpopularity can also be a good thing since like a year ago, an enemy player typed: "i have never played against Taliyah, lol" into all chat.
Thank u stranger for reading my comment.
My issue with Taliyah is she changed between Mid and jungle way too much. Not because the game changed, but because Riot changed her abilities. At that point it felt like riot was punishing me for trying to learn her, and so I don't want to go back. Instead I would just play a character like Ahri who has been viable in the position for a long time without riot changing her mechanics to move her role.
I was smurfing with taliyah as i usually do the other day. Somone typed in all chat ''Taliyah players are very rare''. That gave me powers unlike any other
I'm a Taliyah Main wannabe but actually a Jack of (almost) all trades... may i get some advice from you to effectively use taliyah? I usually do very good work with skillshots and in the teamfights but everything i learned about her is mostly from experience and intuition, is there some kind of trick for the early game when ganking or farming? I'm one of those guys who usually die in the jungle due to bad hp management with more fragile champions
INSTAEDIT: and by "usually" i mean, more often than most, but not a lot, like 5 to 10 times a year if i play jungle often
@@BlaxeFrost-X getting comfortable kiting to full potential, using your abilities corretly/leveling the right ability depending on where you start your clear, smite usage etc. These are the things you may need to focus on on your first clear as taliyah. You tend to get a little low on hp on your first clear. But you should never die. try to getting hit as little as possible by the camps. Rememver that your E slows. Honostly you cant teach someone exactly how to do it over a youtube comment. Just practice in practice tool and watch Challenger replays.
@@donalddank9070 afraid of anyone that is not bronze? lmao
Something about Taliyah I feel that makes her less appealing is although she has a lot of skins there is not a lot of variety. Aside from classic Taliyah you can get blue Taliyah, blue Taliyah 2, or blue Taliyah 3
Blue Taliyah 1, 2, and 3 LMAO
She doesn't have a lot of skins at all. She went three years without getting one. Pool Party is the first real skin she got.
a lot of skins?.... bruh i dont think you realize that her poolparty skin was her first real skin in years, if we discount her SSG skin which was only made because they won then she only has 2 lmao
@@Firellius Just more proof that Riot likes to milk the popular champs. Ornn finally got a 3rd skin after all these years.
At least they gave us chromas......
Because riot decided that she’s not a midlaner but she’s a jungler . Rip Taliyah aoe q
Yeah that's the one point of this video where I disagree. It's not entirely the players fault that she is unpopular, don't forget the fact that they forcefully changed her identity. Creating a champion for a role and then nerfing her in that role and pushing her into another after a few years obviously creates a problem within her playerbase.
Remember wen graves was an adc senna was a adc and seraphine was a support
@@naseweis7821 Yeah I agree and it is not like she is even popular in jungle either except when she is broken due to her fast clear.
@@vairrow324 exactly, but didn't even some rioter state that they did that on purpose because she was So much popular after they put her in the jungle?
that "popularity" was thanks to her buffs and not the role change, which we can definitely see after they nerfed her again.
@@Betroid as a senna main and also in senna mains servers, we don't have any problem with adc nerfs for her
Taliyah is such an amazing champion and it pains me that not many people play her
but she is a common pick in high elo korea
I don’t play her often, but on occasion I will and enjoy her. She’s a good champion design. As intended, she’s not some blonde bimbo or atypical league female character. I respect them for making her like that and that’s also part of the appeal but also that detracts from the common appeal. I should play her a bit more, I really only do when we need AP. But she deserves more than that. I play most of the champions on this series sadly ahah
She was my favorite mid, but she was gutted to much for me to use her. I was not a good mid.
i really would love to play her but i cant if i die to krugs ;-;
as a taliyah main i must say that recently i have been finding a good amount of success with her *on mid , cause i dont play jg* and im quite happy
You and Exil make the best League content. Actual structured discussions instead of character "guides" that are just a 30 minute live game commentary
That means a lot to hear, but Exil is in a caliber of his own. I'm not quite at his level of quality and production yet :P
@@VarsVerum not yet.
@@VarsVerum I'd beg to differ. The only significant difference between you is video length, but you make up for that by posting more than once every two months....which in my humble opinion makes you the superior youtuber xP
@@metaloom I appreciate that :) but Exil definitely performs better individually in terms of production quality per video, even if he uploads at a slower pace. Making 40-60 minute long videos with that level of editing takes way more time than you think.
@@metaloom Yeah, no offense to Vars. I prefer his more fun style of videos and pace of uploading but Exil's production and research are unparalleled. He'll pull up obscure ass tweets by pros or specific footage from a 2015 tournament to show when a champion was OP. If Exil is S tier then Vars is probably B+ to A as far as quality. But the consistency makes him better for me.
Because she's the only hero that get's punished for simply trying to play the game.
Oh you used your Q once ? Well screw you, you can't use it on this large area again for like half the match.
Other champions might have flaws or counters, but only she has her damage taken away as a feature.
Her q CD is 2 sec at max rank the problem is that she was a mid laner with aoe Q but then they reworked her into a jungler and nerfed her . She’s decent now but got nerfed some patches ago
@@theteamxxx3142 Either they removed the worked ground mechanic she had or you didn't understand what i was complaining about.
@@rdsasuke1 the ground debuff got buffed some time ago ( more MS and last less )
@@theteamxxx3142 The duration of worked ground doesn't really affect her at all. It will never be low enough to be used in the same spot twice in 1 fight, but it goes away by the next fight. Also idk what u talking about MS on worked ground? thats her passive it works anywhere
@@ewiky The worked ground also actually gives her additional move speed, in addition to her passive. It's not a lot, but it's there.
Goddammit, this is another champ I feel like picking up now. For the same reason as Kled: playing around her spell's passive cooldown sounds so interesting, and her ultimate is pretty flexible. She also fits into my three favorite roles.
I think I just like champs with a lot of micro-management. Azir, Kalista, Kindred, now Kled, and Taliya.
Pick her up! She's a great champion to play :3
It's simple, she has a unique play style that takes a lot of time to master. So many easier junglers that are way easier and less demanding. She's really fun to play though!
I started picking up taliyah lately and yes she is fun to play albeit a bit odd to learn, but she really helps if you want to learn to correctly roam to other lanes
She contributes a lot in every teamfights it's either you flank or set-up your enemies with your ult, burst squishy targets or just skirmishing with your q that has less cd.
Let's sum it up this way. Taliyah would be a great pick if this game was actually balanced.
exactly - she has clear weak and strong sides....unlike some champs in the current meta (i wont say names cause i would have to write a whole day)
@@moonlight8451 your and yasuo still come to mind
So taliyah needs to play 4D chess while everoyne else wants to play soccer. Got it.
Shes already one parallel universe ahead of everyone
Everyone’s learning to walk at the same time she’s rock surfing
I love this champion so much that i even ahve dedicated account just to play her, mainly Mid/support
Thats funny, becouse I have an account named "Talyah gaming" and yes, I forgot i in taliyah
So i am not alone to play her supp
I find her very good at the role with poke,burst and her roams are increadible
LOL that's kind of sad
@@jmoa5758 Talking of you ?
Taliyah is weak support, sorry.
I mained Taliyah back when she released and honestly the removal of AOE on her Q was a huge nerf for her that she never recovered from. Also despite her being a more modern champion her kit always felt somewhat clunky to use, especially her W. Nowadays I think she's actually really good in mid lane though, especially in low elo where no one knows how to play against her.
Not really, she struggles a lot vs high mobility assasins like Zed/Yone or LB and long range artillery champs like Lux.
She is ok against mid range midlaners like Lissandra, Viktor tho
I love how u said ROCKY history lol.I saw what u did there.
She didn't even get into the ring or anything.
So I'm not the only one?
She was my favorite champion when she was released, i used to have so much fun with her, like Zoe levels of fun, but once they changed the way her W was casted and removed the AOE Q i stopped playing her completely. Now she is one of my worst champions and i will miss her forever 😢
"the highest damage on a basic ability"
-Corki package: am I a joke to you?
he actually puts cooldown in the damage equation... si package aint the one
Rumble's q heat gauge >50%: am I the whole ass circus???
meanwhile Sivir Q with 260% AD ratio
@@mateturbo-q1v She puts out alot of damage at level 1, compared to something like sion that requires a wind up before max damage.
I remember I asked for this in one of your poles that contained azir, I’m so happy I finally get to see my girl taliyah get some time to shine
Kindred, Azir and now Taliyah, man you're listing down all the characters I play
Imagine if we got Why NO ONE Plays: Braum... Even Unbreakable wouldn't block all that "WHAT ?!!"
Just my Experience with Taliyah :
I used to onetrick her and climb like crazy back in the days where she had the aoe Q.
When it got removed i almost entirely forget she was even existing.
Her worked ground mechanic got a huge buff, instead of 45s cd its now 25s and instead of a 450 units radius for the effect, it got reduced to 300 units
Taliyah is what we know as a downward spiral of popularity and power
She's unpopular because her gameplay is weird and her aesthetics is just Middle Eastern Toph (not the most inspiring fantasy when the vast majority of players are East Asian) so since she's not popular she doesn't get buffs or skins, so she stays weak, and since she stays weak less people are interested in playing her, meaning she'll get more weak and so on and so on
It's similar to Aurelion Sol, he's VERY unpopular, specially in the various East Asian servers so he never gets buffed, so he becomes even more unpopular, so he never gets buffed so he, etc etc
Bruh i gotta say her Seismic Shove is one of the hardest abilities to land for new mains. Sure it has the same delay on Cho's Rupture, but thats only if u can input the location AND direction fast enough, and trying to not only mentally calculate where you want the target to go and where they will be in 1 second is NOT easy, sometimes the target won't move when u expect them to, and sometimes in a different direction. Having to juggle those two variables while trying to cast the spell fast is pretty difficult for new users. So in theory its intuitive, but in actual practice its anything BUT, that.
Basically her low playrate comes down to her tools just being really hard to use if u don't know how to use them correctly, like u said u have to have MASSIVE amounts of game knowledge to be effective with her...and many people would rather just play an easy champ they can face roll with.
Karthus and Taliyah being the only Battlemage junglers?
Malzahar Jungle players rise up.
Um, is it actually starting to become somewhat OK?
Jungle Brand..?
Lillia and fiddle? (And i also play neeko jungle, with dark harvest her damage is crazy)
Morgana jungle
RIP AD malz jungle tho :
I just want to say this video got me VERY interested in Taliyah months ago and now I can play them mid and its awesome so thanks for making this
as a taliyah main since her release and otp since s8, I think that her problem comes from the fact that she was designed to be a roaming mid laner but ended up being pushed into the jungle. Her original Q was more intended to be used for poke but save on mana and cd, this not becoming a major issue in team fights because it made it so that you could fight on worked ground with less overall damage but able to maintain a solid dps as you got the first hit of her q off every time on a very spamable ability with aoe. I think the best thing riot could do for her as a champion is to find a way to merge the current q with the old one to keep her as a mid/jungle option but play more in line with her original kit.
Give back her Q aoe dmg and just reduce her dmg to monster so she doesn't become a clear jungle challenger
Do you consider Xerath to be an Unpopular champion despite having the highest popularity compared to Ziggs and Vel’koz?
Because I wonder, what is the exact play rate numbers would you consider to be unpopular? Personally I consider someone who has around 100,000 matches in Iron to be unpopular.
Yeah that isn’t playrate, but often I see match numbers to be consistent with their pick rate.
mfw my only main left for him to cover in the "why no one plays" is lissandra: 🤡🤡🤡🤡
She always pops up in pro play.
I feel attacked just a tiny bit. I play literally only all the champs on this list except a few. But if lissandra was disrespected like that 🕵
And the upcoming video is on Lissandra now xdd
@@masene4121 o h f u k
Can’t wait to enjoy this one.
Taliyah Mid Main here is sad because you are so correct, but still happy because she is not banned or picked very much. So I get to enjoy playing her often :D
I'd love to know what your thoughts are now that she received her mini rework. She feels a lot better to play imo
Yeah! last year I could barely play her at all, now I am fed every time I play her. I LOVE her new q and e.
I've never been more excited for a RUclips video
Hope I do you proud! :D
Loved and will continue to main this champ. So saitsfying to see the video and to hear enemy junglers compliment you on playing unique junglers.
where's the "why noone plays j4?? Haven't seen that champ since I played him in free rotation, and before that once in a sej j4 bot lane comp... and never before that...
Yea idk why either I love j4 he is strong asf. But slept on heavy. Great ganking and can chase down ppl easy.
I love J4 too! But I think it's cause he's more utility and less damage than other characters in the jungle. Like, all of his abilities carry a bit of utility in them, but unless you build lethality, you have a hard time outdamaging more oppressive/all-in characters, like Kindred, Graves, Olaf, Hecarim. It's not impossible, but Jarvan shines better in a fight alongside allies than by himself. And in solo q, you can only trust yourself with stuff, most of the time.
But I'm iron, so don't take my word too seriously lmao
@@rodrigoportalesoliva897 As an adc main i'm really glad the assassin J4 meta is over. I could deal with Zed's jumping on me way more than J4 3 shotting me before I could move once.
it seems like worked ground mechanic being a huge handicap is her biggest problem so the new changes to her q should rise her popularity since now instead of being a handicap it changes her q and the fact that her e now stuns people who dash trough removes another problem she faced
1tricking taliyah support is a blast. support feels like a natural fit for her. her early damage is actually insanely high if you're not constantly on the verge of going OOM or dying just from trying to last hit. And, like you said in this video, she's incredibly macro intensive, which is exactly what support maine are usually about! In terms of being able to limit test and push the pace of games to insane degrees, there's really no support that comes close. You could say the same about battle mages and mages in general, taliyah is faster, more micro intensive, and more adrenaline fueled than most casters, who usually try to play at a very controlled pace. When she goes "WOHOO," you really feel it." Excited for the rework, even though i'm worried it will force her out of support, i think that the changes to her passive and ultimate in particular will make her much more intuitive and versatile, and the W change will help her stay relevant if she falls behind on damage output
I used to play her on support a lot, now that I've starting playing her again she doesn't really feel that great in support a lot since she deals 0 damage early on, plus she isn't as good for roaming early anymore. I miss the old taliyah and the oneshots but this new taliyah makes it so you don't have to make plays early on that much, you can just farm and scale really well, right now maybe too well. I play her mostly mid now, she's pretty fun!
I would play Taliyah if her W didn't feel like such a weird spell to use for me.
yeah. U need to use normal cast instead of quick cast on it. Its one of those rare abilities that needs normal cast to not feel weird
@@donalddank9070 from a tal otp this is the complete opposite LMAO. you need it on quick cast for instant reactions to follow up on CC
@@adam-ns1he to each his own I guess. I play like that and im plat
@@donalddank9070 1 input vs 2. that time it takes will cost you in the long run giving people time to flash etc
@@donalddank9070 no, definitely quick cast
I loved Taliyah when her Q had that small explosion when she'd hit something. When that was removed it killed the champion completely for me
2070: Why no one plays Darius
If I live to see that moment it will be a 24h party for a whole week at my house
@@emanuelstornello8009 but that mean there will be way more annoying champions to replace darius
20XX: Why no one plays Viego
The best way I can put it is that Taliyah's main burst is about as reliable as a crossmap Sion ult. You aren't hitting them without your team handing it to you for free, and if your champ can't have any potential without some specific champions like TF you won't get played.
Ok, great video, but correction right off the bat. She wasn't reworked to become a jungler (even though the whole "roaming" aspect of her kit and lore makes more sense there). She was reworked to be more general mass appealing to be more of a burst mage compared to a control mage. They increased her burst, and her out of combat passive speed, in exchange for less aoe damage and in combat ms. Junglers just happened to found success with her and she was really good for the meta. Players moved Taliyah into the jungle, not Riot. Riot just decided they liked her better there and balance her for it. And Taliyah mids have been salty ever since (even though a lot of champions are played more in roles other than their originally intended one).
The peoblem with Taliyah is:
She struggles against anything thats not an immobile enemy , she is squishy so she can get the ADC treatment from assasins , and she HAS TO constantly move to avoid: HER OWN DAMN PASSIVE, hooks/stuns , and still have a good positioning in a fight. She is just damn hard to play and very picky with the enemy she can be good against. Unlike onetricks like Asol , Riven , Zed , Irelia , basically they can still be usefull when behind by tanking , just making the backline disappear , or just being an annoying piece of shit to play against , Taliyah can't do any of those when behind, and she is really bad with dueling early, scuttle crab fights at lvl3 are like trying to blow a brick wall away from between you and the scuttle , the brickwall being the enemy Xin Zhao that can almost kill you by just jumping onto you.But anyone who can pick her up an be consistent with her , she is a great champ with a lot of utility when fed early and anyone who masters her can be a nightmare of the enemy team. She has a great champ design thats a shame to go to waste with a 0.5% pickrate next to Aurelion Sol.
Thank you Afro we appreciate your choice and the editing.
Keep this editor, the guy is good.
Man, Taliyah is such a great champ and it always pains me looking at her sad stage in game. Like many low playrate champs she seems abandoned by riot. In my opinion she just needs a few quality of life changes to make her more popular.
Nerf to a bit of damage but some change with her w maybe? Or q unload speed change speed? I dunno
@@greatsoup7540 Yes please I've been saying this for awhile, some quality of life changes to make her w > e easier to hit but make her q weaker I would love that
Personally I wish they took a bit of damage out of her w and e combo and buff her in other places. Maybe in exchange for damage give her the movement speed buff on worked ground back, so its not just a debuff for her or maybe enable her to q zhonyas. I basically stopped playing her because she is so coinflip, either you oneshot someone with your combo or you just die.
@@vairrow324 tbh yea ur right, i didnt really mean more damage for her w > e i meant making it more consistent so like you said its not just miss > death hit > win
@@vairrow324 movement speed whilst in or reducing the size of worked ground would be a neat way of buffing her without just making the numbers bigger.
Well, it's sad that you only talk about the jungle Taliyah when a few of us still manage to find ways to go mid :/
assassins ruin mid lane, even if they ddn't, tanks would ruin late game. dmg falls off so hard, one draven Q late game will heal the dmg he took from your entire combo. its tough out here for a pimp. i'm honestly glad i stopped playing this champ. something like prerework asol/velkoz/veigar scale harder and make it easier to climb lower elos.
Good luck on climbing with her
Q: gain a charge every 15 sec, holds 3/3/3/4/5 charges, if first boulder hits a monster throw 2 more boulders and the ground around her becomes worked for 45 sec.(maybe add +1 charge per 100 ap)
W: add charge ability to knock enemies in target direction, failing to charge just knocks up but is faster.
E: add ring of boulders around where she was that cause cc duration based on how many boulders dashed over.
I think coming back to her would be good because even though her mid-scope update addressed a lot of the downsides talked about in the video, her pick rate is still quite low.
A Taliyah main here, soo I actually play her mid and last season I got to plat with her and this season my peak was Plat 1. If you can win early game, which is easy against many mages you can just gank botlane easily at lvl 6 or even earlier which is so op the adc often gets 2 kills and yeah. I think that worked ground isn't such a big problem you can cast enough q's in a teamfight if you walk a bit around or if the teamfight moves which is often the case. Another problem that you talked about are tanks and building liandrys is so good against them.
Finally its taliyah : best girl:^)
I do hate the change from mid to jungle; not my playstyle.
dont know how many agree but i think shell fit in well as a mid sup type of mage like zyra or brand, she has high base dmg and low ap ratios, can hold out well with free poke from single q and offers cc like vel koz, but she lacks significant impact and is easily minionblocked and engaged on, but now she is so nerfed shes basicly only a high elo jungler , which was a role riot already sorta forced her into after pros abused the wall and waveclear. im a neeko/ taliyah sup main/ fan so im biased ofc
legitimately the most fun character in the game, so rewarding to play
i fucking love her. She's one of the hardest champs to play but also one of the most fun ones. It's just so fucking good to trap enemies and teammates with the ultimate
Did not think I would like this video but I did, I agree with most of your points, she is a great champion and a great mid laner and has been for a long time, the key to playing her is not being stuck in the mentality of being a battle mage, she is more optimally played with a burst roaming mage mindset and should mostly buy pure damage items, then you just run around oneshotting people.
OH MY GOD LISSANDRA AND TALIYAH, TWO OF MY FAVOURITE CHAMPIONS EVER OH MY GOOOOOOOOOOOOOD
-one of, like, 10 Lissandra OTPs in North America.
*in the world
Ow. True.
Before the video premiers my personal take on taliyah. So i think she's a case of the devs werent really sure of what they wanted to make. And it took the community to actually design and adapt the champ into what she is now. Like she was supposed to be a mid lane mage that focused on roaming up and down the river but obviously that didnt work out cuz she didnt have consistent wave clear and her passive madr using her main damage ability really hard to use in the enclosed space of a lane. She was a top lanet for some time i beleieve but not too great there until she finally ended up in the champion junkyard which is jg. Jglers r always looking for champs to add to the jg since the roles so tight and im honedtly glad she found a spot there. Ive tried picking her up into my jg pool and one of the main things i noticed about her is she's a very high skill high reward champ. But if ur any less under that skill u get almost no value from her and in some cases get punished extremely hard. Like learning her is a lot like learning katarina or akali or irelia where u have to play atleast around 100 games to fully understand and get used to the micro in her kit to a playable level but unlike the previously mentioned she's not a laner she's a jgler. And inting to learn u can get away with on a lot of laners but inting as a jgler sets ur entire team back (jg diff amirite) so theres already a negative stigma against her cuz of her high skill cap theres also the matter of her utility and damage output her abilities are very clunky and lock u into only being able to damage ppl in certain areas/directions. Its admitably a hell of a lot of damage especially the q which has a low cool down but on their own they feel very clunky unless u weave it into her bread and butter combo weq for a complete one shot which is extremely satisfying to use. So its a case of either u can consistently hit her micro down to a tea or ur missing out on a hell of a lot of damage. Then there's her ult. Theres honestly a weird like drawback to none damaging mage ults. They r honestly some of the most op ults in the game from a macro stand point but it also pushes away ppl from the champ if they cant get the most of the macro. Like for example a lot of times youll see ppl playing tf or ryze and they simply use their ults to just tp back in lane if they arent using tp even tho they have insane roam potential and can be at almost anywhere on the map with their ults. Its as if if the ult doesnt deal damage ppl dont really get the satisfaction of leveling and hitting the 6/11/16 power spikes of other mage champs like say kassadin who is literally defined by his huge damaging ulty. So overall a combination of champion identity crisis upon release, the champion itself gatekeeping ppl through its kit, and the lack of satisfaction within her design outside of the one shot combo makes taliyah very off putting to ppl trying to learn her. This is all suggestive ofc and my personal observations. Im currently learning taliyah cuz i find her extremely fun to play and i like her kit and design but i cant say i dont see the constant restrictions i feel hen im playing her.
Taliyah is such a wonderful champion. So different and so unique... I love her.
i love your videos . they're very insightful . thank you for all the hard work you put into them !
Will you ever make a series/episode on you designing your own champions as if they were to be thrown into League of Legends today? I have personally been recreationally designing MOBA champs in a Leagueish way for about 1.5-2 years so I'd love to hear your approach to designing kits.
i had a ton of success with taliyah mid when her q had aoe. hasnt been the same since :( it was a fun time
Excelent video with an emphasis on Taliyah's main priority: position. Both in the teamfight and in the game in general.
Just one note: Master Yi is anything BUT *early game* skirmisher. Yi notably struggles before getting his ultimate - has only 1 gap-close tool without follow up. Pre-level 6 Yi loses to Taliyah (and, actually, lots of junglers) really hard just because if they are in a bad spot when meeting him - they will just run away from Yi. Master can only burst them if their HP is too low, but then again every jungler can do that, so it doesn't count. Master Yi is post-6 champ, not early.
Absolutely love the vids, your channel is criminally underrated.
Thanks :)
I think the reason why nobody plays her is because riot for some reason deleted her Aoe damage on her Q. That was the reason why i stopped. She used to be such a good midlaner
Your editing is on point, your thumbnails are great, your audio is crisp, your videos are interesting, the pacing is also good, and your accent is nice
Thanks haha XD
@@VarsVerum Keep up the good work, I just wanted to tell you you're appreciated
As much as I love playing Taliyah, the fact that a lot of her damage output relies on her EW combo kills me, because I fucking *despise* the way that ability is cast. I try to practice it over and over and yet it always seems like when I need it to knock towards me, it knocks away, and vice versa. It can be frustrating to have such an easy disengage from ganks in mid lane and yet because the cast is functionally a coin-toss, unless you try to take the time to line it up properly (in which case you've likely missed), it feels like the game has cheated me into a death even when I know it's not the case.
I wish there was a way to cast the ability that was intuitive like it is now, but a lot less clunky.
About Taliyah's W being the only ability in the game where you can choose where they're knocked back to I'd say Azir ult has the same kind of function. Not sure if it's the exact same thing, but you can choose which way to place it during a shurima shuffle.
WOW Vars this was really interesting! You definitely hit on the reason i didn't put much time into her (the worked ground). But the part that charged the diodes for me was when you said she is a macro and methodical champion. Think Graves is so cool and Ekko, but my mechanics are turraaash. But i feel i am a better macro player than micro player. And you pose her strengths of being able to move around them map quickly (i like speed), Global ult (more speed), and very high damage Q means that she's not a weak champ. I think you've convinced me to give her a try, seriously this time. Plus she's a unique champ. Like Azir (who i've wanted to play forever). Wonderful! Thank you Vars. Thank you Editor.
I adored taliyah on release, absolutely played her every game i could when she was one of the worst champs on release imo and didnt care. got her to m6 in a week and then i broke my laptop and when i came back they had reworked her w mechanics and she didn't feel right anymore. still played her just didnt feel the same. later when they moved her into the jungle, i just don't feel the same love for her kit anymore that i used to and even though i still try to give her chances any time riot buffs her, i just feel exiled from the champ i once loved to play so much. sometimes i just wish riot would hit the reset button with some champs. :c
It's so weird hearing her talked about in terms of a jungler when I've only played her mid.
The designer for Taliyah actually said that with the champ's q, it's pretty cumbersome to aim it and 'strafe' using a computer mouse, since intuitively players right click on their target to attack but with Taliyah if you're aiming your q and it misses you need to move perpendicular to where the target is. Riot actually expects champs like Taliyah and ASol to have a higher playrate on LoL:WR as it may be more intuitive to use a joystick to aim as opposed to mouse buttons
Oh that explains why Asol is so popular in wild rift! :o
I really enjoyed this video. Right before this video came out I got a skin for taliyah from a re roll and was thinking about trying her out. I tried her out and now she is my favorite champ in the game
Missed point here - Worked Ground can be used as a zone defense tool - Once you've used the ability and worked ground is up, you can spam that one rock at a time endlessly for practically no mana cost, giving you a long range poke from a safe spot such as tower. This means early game, Taliyah running out of mana can rely on a worked ground patch to shoot off ocasional hits without soaking up their mana or running out
Why would I want a spammable nerf version of my wave clear ability when I was already behind? That kind of poke only benefits you when you can move around a lot like Ezreal, right?
@@snatcher8517 imagine it's early game and you've run out of mana, you now have this instead of only auto attacks
at 7:47 as a top lane player this crushed me.... Renekton got Taliyah a double kill and she just HAD to ruin that perfect slow push into freeze for Renekton.... UGH. Great vid though :)
Man she used to be so good at the beginning of s11 but riot doesnt like champions that arent graves and hecarim in the jungle
Graves is legit broken, still. I don't know why he's allowed to exist as he is.
She's literally sitting at a near 60% winrate rn with a decent playrate. So she's still good
"bad vs tanks like rell"
casually oneshots a rell in the background some minutes later
Her passive surprised me with how clever it was. I'm glad that League has champions which care about terrain. Dota2 is cool because it has heros who care about trees but I don't know if any of their heros care about like... the type of ground.
I don't play league but I like how my favorite champions have also ended up being "good but high skill barrier". It makes me feel skilled as a league player... yes.
Some Doto heroes can just ignore pathing altogether. That's caring - or not caring - enough about terrain for me.
Hey, this is pretty good. You're underrated; I hope you get more visibility.
Thank you so much! :D I'm working towards it haha!
Great video! You should do one on Lissandra, her highest pick rate is 2.2% in plat.
Working on it!
I'm a Taliyah one trick and I agree with a lot of things and disagree with some of them, i really hate that riot made her a jungler, i still play her every lane because she is so flexible lol.
Idk why but her worked ground never bothered me, specially when i play mid because she is so mana hungry, her worked ground q is a nice poke to proc dark harvest, and she is too heavily dependent of her w (maybe because i like to play her as a burst mage), and i like dancing around the battlefield to get max damage on q, it makes you harder to get hit as you get to be moving all the time and worked ground gives you a little movespeed so its most of the time enough to get out of it or chase the enemy, just my thoughs into her, nice video :)
pls rito give aoe q back
would be nice to have Worked Ground MS back, in some capacity, either reduced bonus MS, or reduced in combat CD.
Firstly great video. I have my own idea why taliyah is not play much (she does not have another female champion assets...) and I can agree about almost every point except one. You see I main tali on top, and I can pretty confidently say that she is great in that role (I got diamond I with her last season) that is why I can't agree about that the one rock shot q is a curse, I think it is a blessing! Because of that I can easily farm and poke enemy laner dealing high dmg using almost no mana, which means that tali does not have all mages problem from early game - lack of mana. Ofcourse there is a risk that enemy will shorten the distance, that's why as my key rune I use speed bust from sorcery after three attacks, which are easy to land when enemy Darius/Garen/Fiora/any other champ try to attack. And if you are experienced enough it is easy to catch the fresh ground to deal max combo dmg. To get better sustain add bloody hunter rune and you get Perfect toplaner. : winner in every (except zed, kassaidyn and tryndamere but the last one is just banned every game) one v one duel, super sustainable (after one kill) toplaner with high mobility in late, great ganks in early and midgame and much, much bigger dmg output than any other toplaner (roughly 100k dmg in 35 minutes game). It's worth to add that the Spanish inquisition is more expected on top than her, so people even don't know how she works, or how to fight her.
Thing with tali is, pretty much anything and everything can gang up on her and she will be pretty darn powerless to do anything against champions who have multiple dashes and are also quite tanky (lee, vi, etc)
She is one of my mains, but they just make it a chore to play her.
Like why does she leave the worked ground circles while other champions can spam their abilities, if the team doesn't know how Taliyah works and they stall the fight in one position she runs out of space to poke with Q.
taliyah is the perfect example of low playrate != unfun or poorly designed. she just has a playstyle that resonates with a very small, but dedicated niche of players. she doesn't need to be changed to make her more broadly appealing, because she isn't meant to be broadly appealing. she's meant to deliver a satisfying experience for people who enjoy the macro and control aspects of the game, and that's fine.
"Taliyah has had a rocky history" I see what you did there.
her lack of popularity isnt due to the players its due to the devs constantly taking care of assassins and mobile\bursty champions and neglecting champions who actually need brains to play them, you can totally notice how when tali or karthus rose to the top tier champion lists they were instantly nerfed but champions like yasou, lee sin, or JHIN and such who are on the top tier lists literally permanently at this state are never nerfed or adjusted and even if they get nerfed the devs never really try to touch their gameplay design and only nerf some numbers or cooldowns but in the case of taliyah they removed the splash dmg of her Q and changed so much about her Q for " balance reasons " and lets not forget what happened to poor Aurlion Sol and his W changes. so basically its not JUST US its also the developers of the game themselves.
Actually excited for this one -- I love taliyah as a champion, but she just feels bad to play
Because she has the most broken kit that a juggler can have so Riot doesn't know what to do with her, something like ryze
Well no but actually yes
It’d be awesome if there was a way to interact with the warped ground. Maybe make it unwarped or have some sort of bonus or interaction with another ability
now we need: WHY EVERYONE PLAYS TALIYAH?
I think a good buff without making her oppressive is to add another rock throw or two in her q on worked ground. She can spit out damage fast but in those moments she needs a tiny extra damage
My answer to the current meta and Yone!
No more dashes!
Plus a great personality and face, it’s something else than perfect model faces.
You should remake this video. After the rework like all champs she was BUSTED and a ton of people played her because she had a new kit and was strong, but it seems like now again she has fallen out of the meta. I love her gameplay and kit myself and I would love to see a rework of this video
Your videos rekindled that feeling I got watching league videos back when I first started playing, amazing content!
2016 imaqtpie was truly the golden age... Q~Q
Hey, are you going to make a video about Taliyah's Mid-Scope Rework? I'd love to watch it as a Taliyah player that played both version of the champion and hear your take on it. I greatly enjoyed Taliyah's early kill pressure with the old Taliyah by being able to all in mid laners level 3 or level 3 ganking as a jungler. But there is not such a thing anymore. Now the champion is better in other areas as opposed to early kill pressure. It was extremely fun, I'll truly miss the old Taliyah but thankfully the new one is just as good as the old one. Hence why I'm not complaining. She is actually viable in both the mid lane and jungle as opposed to her old rework where she was a jungle/support.
I felt a little nostalgic even though this wasn't so long ago, thank you for the video!
correct me if I'm wrong, but Isn't Taliyah more of a burst/control than a battle mage?
I've been playing league for about 2 months now and this is honestly the first time I've heard of this champ
Well, I'm a Taliyah main playing in gold/plat games. I just loved her design the day she was released, so I played her no matter the role I mastered or riot wanted her to master, even nowadays. I am playing her on jungle, midlane and mostly on support just because i want to play/see her ingame. The thing is that riot really screwed up almost everything they released late2015/2016. Every single chamion they released had an incredibly unique kit and playstyle, but besides of Jhin none of these champions can get Riot's attention. Ivern, Kled, Illaoi, Kindred and of course Asol and Taliyah are so rare to see in the rift nowadays. 99% of my games since 2018 only got Taliyah or Aurelion in them if I played those champs. And I don't even wanna talk about both terribly anti-playerbase mini-reworks.
I mained this chick back when this video was released and while she was fun to play, I can agree knowing more about the general game would increase your ability to play her well.
Taliyah is one of those champs that riot periodically guts. I had a lot of fun playing her in the jungle last season (Rylias first kite queen)
I played Taliyah for a while when she was buffed into a strong jungler. She's a ton of fun to play and absolutely worth picking up!
Please, despite what a lot of people think, "casted" isn't a word. It's still cast.
Cool vid as always!