Ok, I'm actually liking the new 12 speed system. The only thing that would make it perfect is disc brakes (for those downhill sessions). Good job Brompton.
I personally think this is fantastic. Especially since it can be an option to existing P and T line bicycles. The real advantage is this will be one bike for all needs - except carrying weight. But then, the Brompton is about cycling anywhere and everywhere in an urban environment. So cities with steep slopes and those that need speed on weekends etc are all covered.
Brompton is chanelling down to have a too complex product range/system in my optinion: Want 3 gears? Oh, there is a 'C-Line' and a 'A-Line', but no P and T. What the hell is the difference between A and C? Want just 2 Gears? Take a 'C-Line'. And a C only. Why? Want 6 speeds (which for me is the perfect range for all my trips up to 100km)? - Take a 'C-Line' but no lighter version of course. No P or T. OK... Or try the 12 speed? - Oh, we can offer the extremly expensive T-line or the somehow lighter P-Line... Want the C-Line? No problem, take the C-Line electric and remove the electric... Want the lightest possible with lights and rear rack and 6 speed out of the box? - No problem - take nothing. Less weight isn't possible... Want just something out of the box with a rear rack in 2024? - Ok - take an electric one or a P with 4 speeds.... Product range and system is far too complex and lacking logic now in my opinion (and it was much easyer without this A, C, P, T). Would it not be better e.g. switching to a 'customice your Bromton' system with transparent informations? At least the web-site could have a reliable clear system. Concerning 12-speed: I am not very convinced... I waited for a titanium-6-speed and now there is this 12-speed-thing instead. The 6-speed-range is very clear and more ore less simple and CONSISTENT to use after a while over the whole range of gears. Not the 12-speed. If you have bad luck you constantly have to switch gears of the internal hub in combination with changing 2 or 3 gears of the external hub - this could be no fun any more. As long as you are able to use just the range of the 4 outer gears most of the time - no big deal. But if your personal favorite gears overlap somehow the three internal ranges - changing just ONE GEAR every time you have to: 1) Change internal 1 gear one up 2) Change external gear 2 or 3 down the same time... Switching back: 3) Change internal 1 gear down 4) Change external 2 or 3 up All this for just changing ONE gear. The need of changing gears this way was even not much fun with the 6-gear-system. But somehow OK because this system is CONSISTENT and there is just ONE OUTER GEAR to switch. Up-down, high-low. Now you have to go up and down 2 or 3 gears left and one on the right. Every time you have to think and count gears on the left side. And maybe you have to switch gears more often due to the narrower steps of the 12-speeds. In my case 12 speed would just bring a bit more range on the lower side. There is no need for more range on the speed-side for me with a folding bike. With 6 gears I can easyly go up to 45km/h when paddling downhill. Which is not very often the case. On the high-gear-side there would be place for one more gear (7 instead of 6). But even that would not be necessary. How slow do you want to drive before simply just step down an walk? This is a folding bike which should be simple, quick and easy to use. What are the strong points of such a folding bike? 1) Size in folded condition 2) Whight when carrying or pulling half folded 3) Speed and ease of folding If I want to have all those 3 points together - there is no such product in the whole line: Going light? Now you have to pull one pedal in and out every time folding and unfolding and having all this hassle with 12 speed I do not need. Want to use it half folded when pulling it a short way when in a railway-station or when buying grocery? - Buy a rear rack first, mount it yourself... Then fiddle around with the pedal. Exactly this was the reason NOT buying a Dahon but a Brompton instead. I would not hesitate to buy a T-Line (even at this price-point which is 1/3 of the cost of my new car!). But then it should be without compromises.
Like my Brompton Electric P Lin. For cycling with motor support there's not really a need for the 12 gears, might be interesting fot the case, when leaving battery @ home
Hello, may I know how to tighten the 12 speed rear wheel nut? Because I followed the manual to tighten in 8nm, it will get loose when I ride it around one week. My bike is 12 speed T line. Thanks
I love that you are continuing to develop and to offer choice BUT you took away the only choice I personally wanted - the three speed hub. Still scratching my head as to why you would do this when it is the perfect gearing for people who aren’t “cyclists”. Please restore my faith in you and bring it back.
The hub is expensive. It's cheaper for them to get rid and use a heavier, clunkier derailleur. All about the bottom line my friend. 99% of my bromptons problems are due to the bodged derailleur.
@SwissMoutain Just add a dual chain ring to the brompton and that upgrades it to twelve speed and a WAY better gear ratio. Also it is much better for hills. Check for H&H 54/30. Very affordable upgrade
Well done brompton, by the look of this "no mountain is too high and no horizon too far " and with that many gears we wont need public transport anymore. What is the reason brompton do not produce a 20" version (tri-fold) .
Missed the mark here Brompton an internal hub gear with more gears not this monstrosity of overly complexity with 4 derailleur gears and 3 hub gears ... one propper 8/9/11 speed hub gear would have been better, less complex, easier to operate and way less maintenance required.
They don't want to cut into their huge margins per bike by buying in 8/9/11 speed hubs. Hence we get the heavy, clunky, issue prone dual derailleur/hub system. Because it's cheap. They don't care about giving us a light low maintenance bike.
Hey Brompton 👋🏻 Love this was filmed in Bristol (Bristol + Brompton = 🩷). Is that the electric he took up Vale street though? We did it on our P6r here: ruclips.net/video/ODhjbAzy3bY/видео.htmlsi=cQ8GiBTnJdn3G6T5
Honestly, for what use? When I first got my Superlight, 6 speed I wondered for what use I had the low gears, till I met an absurd steep hill and had to walk on top! And a Brompton isn't a racing bike, but far from it.
So it looks like it's across the whole range, including Electric and Titanium. Excellent!
There's just one last thing for them to make a model with a 20" wheel.
This is Amazing, Now all that is left is to Please make a 20" wheel version as well 🙏
Ok, I'm actually liking the new 12 speed system. The only thing that would make it perfect is disc brakes (for those downhill sessions). Good job Brompton.
I personally think this is fantastic. Especially since it can be an option to existing P and T line bicycles. The real advantage is this will be one bike for all needs - except carrying weight. But then, the Brompton is about cycling anywhere and everywhere in an urban environment. So cities with steep slopes and those that need speed on weekends etc are all covered.
Nice. But I’m sticking to my Swiss Mountain Drive. Since 2004. Once you get used to it, you’ll want one on all of your bikes.
Brompton is chanelling down to have a too complex product range/system in my optinion:
Want 3 gears? Oh, there is a 'C-Line' and a 'A-Line', but no P and T. What the hell is the difference between A and C?
Want just 2 Gears? Take a 'C-Line'. And a C only. Why?
Want 6 speeds (which for me is the perfect range for all my trips up to 100km)? - Take a 'C-Line' but no lighter version of course. No P or T. OK...
Or try the 12 speed? - Oh, we can offer the extremly expensive T-line or the somehow lighter P-Line... Want the C-Line? No problem, take the C-Line electric and remove the electric...
Want the lightest possible with lights and rear rack and 6 speed out of the box? - No problem - take nothing. Less weight isn't possible...
Want just something out of the box with a rear rack in 2024? - Ok - take an electric one or a P with 4 speeds....
Product range and system is far too complex and lacking logic now in my opinion (and it was much easyer without this A, C, P, T). Would it not be better e.g. switching to a 'customice your Bromton' system with transparent informations? At least the web-site could have a reliable clear system.
Concerning 12-speed:
I am not very convinced... I waited for a titanium-6-speed and now there is this 12-speed-thing instead.
The 6-speed-range is very clear and more ore less simple and CONSISTENT to use after a while over the whole range of gears.
Not the 12-speed. If you have bad luck you constantly have to switch gears of the internal hub in combination with changing 2 or 3 gears of the external hub - this could be no fun any more. As long as you are able to use just the range of the 4 outer gears most of the time - no big deal. But if your personal favorite gears overlap somehow the three internal ranges - changing just ONE GEAR every time you have to:
1) Change internal 1 gear one up
2) Change external gear 2 or 3 down
the same time... Switching back:
3) Change internal 1 gear down
4) Change external 2 or 3 up
All this for just changing ONE gear.
The need of changing gears this way was even not much fun with the 6-gear-system. But somehow OK because this system is CONSISTENT and there is just ONE OUTER GEAR to switch. Up-down, high-low. Now you have to go up and down 2 or 3 gears left and one on the right. Every time you have to think and count gears on the left side. And maybe you have to switch gears more often due to the narrower steps of the 12-speeds.
In my case 12 speed would just bring a bit more range on the lower side. There is no need for more range on the speed-side for me with a folding bike. With 6 gears I can easyly go up to 45km/h when paddling downhill. Which is not very often the case. On the high-gear-side there would be place for one more gear (7 instead of 6). But even that would not be necessary. How slow do you want to drive before simply just step down an walk?
This is a folding bike which should be simple, quick and easy to use.
What are the strong points of such a folding bike?
1) Size in folded condition
2) Whight when carrying or pulling half folded
3) Speed and ease of folding
If I want to have all those 3 points together - there is no such product in the whole line:
Going light?
Now you have to pull one pedal in and out every time folding and unfolding and having all this hassle with 12 speed I do not need.
Want to use it half folded when pulling it a short way when in a railway-station or when buying grocery? - Buy a rear rack first, mount it yourself... Then fiddle around with the pedal.
Exactly this was the reason NOT buying a Dahon but a Brompton instead. I would not hesitate to buy a T-Line (even at this price-point which is 1/3 of the cost of my new car!). But then it should be without compromises.
I❤my Brompton 🚴🏼
However, I need a 12 speed Brompton now.
Like my Brompton Electric P Lin. For cycling with motor support there's not really a need for the 12 gears, might be interesting fot the case, when leaving battery @ home
Hello, may I know how to tighten the 12
speed rear wheel nut? Because I followed
the manual to tighten in 8nm, it will get
loose when I ride it around one week. My
bike is 12 speed T line. Thanks
Man hope I can buy one soon
Love it! but I dont think my P line need 12s at this time 😂
Would like to see a making of Vale Street. Must be funny ;)
I love that you are continuing to develop and to offer choice BUT you took away the only choice I personally wanted - the three speed hub. Still scratching my head as to why you would do this when it is the perfect gearing for people who aren’t “cyclists”. Please restore my faith in you and bring it back.
The hub is expensive. It's cheaper for them to get rid and use a heavier, clunkier derailleur. All about the bottom line my friend. 99% of my bromptons problems are due to the bodged derailleur.
Very interested in this...
So , something that the aftermarket offers for years and with 17 and more gears even more. 😐 so they are slowly catching up on aftermarket tuning.
Awesome!
I am actually shocked that Brompton added a 3-speed inner hub with only 0.14 lbs weight increase. HOW?
Time for the ultimate exploration to begin!
Compact bike adventure awaits...
What about standard C Line explore ? Coming soon or we'll need to be patient ?
Nevermind, I tested a 6 speed C Line explore steel version today, will fit my needs :-)
@SwissMoutain Just add a dual chain ring to the brompton and that upgrades it to twelve speed and a WAY better gear ratio. Also it is much better for hills. Check for H&H 54/30. Very affordable upgrade
Well done brompton, by the look of this "no mountain is too high and no horizon too far " and with that many gears we wont need public transport anymore.
What is the reason brompton do not produce a 20" version (tri-fold) .
The obvious question is: Why? The original Andrew Richie vision was 3-speed.
Hills mate.
Progress.
The obvious question is "why did it take so long?
@@FOXMAN09 the real obvious question should be why not a propper 8/9/11 speed hub
Missed the mark here Brompton an internal hub gear with more gears not this monstrosity of overly complexity with 4 derailleur gears and 3 hub gears ... one propper 8/9/11 speed hub gear would have been better, less complex, easier to operate and way less maintenance required.
They don't want to cut into their huge margins per bike by buying in 8/9/11 speed hubs. Hence we get the heavy, clunky, issue prone dual derailleur/hub system. Because it's cheap. They don't care about giving us a light low maintenance bike.
A video of people cycling. Well done.
Calm it down there Pat.
Technicaly , ıt is not necessary..
Hey Brompton 👋🏻 Love this was filmed in Bristol (Bristol + Brompton = 🩷). Is that the electric he took up Vale street though? We did it on our P6r here: ruclips.net/video/ODhjbAzy3bY/видео.htmlsi=cQ8GiBTnJdn3G6T5
When the brief was 'city hills' we knew we had to get to Bristol. Chapeau for getting there first - strong legs required without electric support!
@@bromptonbicycle very true! 🦵
Не понимаю, зачем велосипеду с таким диаметром колеса нужно 12 передач. Думаю, что 8-9 передач покрывают все требования.
Honestly, for what use? When I first got my Superlight, 6 speed I wondered for what use I had the low gears, till I met an absurd steep hill and had to walk on top! And a Brompton isn't a racing bike, but far from it.
my brompton...2 speed...ㅠㅠ