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She saw Jim for the catch he was, while Pam rejected him and stayed with Roy. She didn’t want Jim, but when he was with other women, she was a jealous shrew. She wasn’t nice when he dated Amy Adams either.
Wished I could visit a multiverse were they have an ending with Karen and Jim. I understand that oh Pam is the one for him though I wished shows did multiple endings were fans could pick which endings suits them.
She was a good fit for him, and he wasn't a good fit for her. The big problem with them is that he was still hung up on Pam. I know that's very obvious, but what I mean is that he wasn't truly over her. If he was, then I think that pairing would have lasted
When you write a character who has an amazing meant-to-be relationship with a woman, and you’re able to write him having another awesome and comparable relationship with another woman, yet still make the other relationship preferred, but at the same time having that second relationship enjoyable as a stand alone: you are some awesome writers.
@@bigbengamerno. if it wasn’t written this way his charisma and chemistry would mean absolutely nothing. the writing means everything for triangles like this
Man I just realised how much I reallllllllllly wanted them to be together. Jim and Pam are really really good don’t get me wrong but Karen and Jim just sound like the perfect teenage couple
That was a pleasant 8 minutes. I didn’t laugh hysterically or anything, but it was nice. Two people, behaving well in a relationship. Of course Jim ends up back with Pam, but Karen was a really good almost-the-one.
Nothing wrong with Karen as she was a good character in the show but........ she wasnt Pam. If someone else than Jenna had played Pam or Jim was with Karen in early part of show or Pam and Jim were never in the same scene or room then I think they would have been a good couple. Two seasons of chemistry like theirs is alot to bury in a storyline.
@mr.hardik6380 I honestly do not remember :-( it's been sooo long, I just remember she ends up getting management at her own branch, and is pregnant, when the main cast she's Karen again.
@@AichaCT true... yet serving unconditionally the person you love is a sweet thing Happy couples know that they don't owe each other anything, but choose to give each other everything
They were adorable together- they cut out what great lengths he went thru to find those Herrs chips for her. Ironically, Karen and Pam also could have been good friends if it wasn’t for Jim - LOL- Jim and Pam were just destined to be together from the start
Jim didn’t make things weird between Pam and Karen, that’s was 100% on Pam being very vocal about the fact she liked Jim and didn’t like the fact they were dating.
You can just tell that Jim is not into Karen like that off the bat. He adores Pam. This just goes to show that everyone has different preferences on who they like
Well he might not have been into her because it was written that way. But their relationship had more romantic spark in my opinion because Jim had more chemistry with Karen than he did with Pam. Might have been because John was actually attracted to Rashida while Jenna was just a friend to him.
@@jrt8268 The fact that John and Rashisa did date for a while as they've gotten to know each other through The Office audition process goes to show that It must have been near-impossible for him to not have more layered and authentic chemistry and just straight up more fun with Rashida on the set playing as a couple. (Jim and Karen)
Karen was much more of an 'alpha' woman, she was self assured and secure in herself, she also went after what she wanted. Pam is the classic type of person who will not go after anything at all but would rather sit and wait, pretty much the only actual action she took was not marrying roy, but afterwards she just stayed there wallowing. Anything after that was always Jim, either pushing her a lot or just deciding for her. Maybe it's because I identify way more with a person like Karen but I've always wished their relationship had more depth because someone like her might have been more suited to push him to become better a lot quicker than how it happened.
did we watch the same show? they made it a HUGE point of pams character development that she ended up pushing herself and not sitting around waiting. for example when she ran over the coal…
@@charliecurwood yeah the ONLY time she actually did something in 8 years… so while she did grow a little she would have always been a more passive person, you can work on yourself but the bases of who you are will always stay the same
Pam has a lot of growth after season 6. She made up a new job position and a made up her salary when DM got bought over. When she got Erin a new computer and Andy wanted a new one, she suggested to Andy that she can only buy one for him when "his computer really breaks". so they broke his computer together. Even before season 6, she went to NY to study graphic design funded by DM but chose to not continue instead.
@@se-mi1489 maybe it doesn't apply to everyone, but some people just need that extra push, could be from a person or an event, to have the extra confidence for themselves. For Pam, walking over the coal of fire gave her a boost of confidence and made her feel good in that moment as she was the type to not take risk.
@@geengengenahow exactly is that a different situation? She went away for months to pursue her dream. Compad to that his was very real and had much better pay/future for them. She had nothing to really stop her from going w him except ego and immaturity
Usually people say “oh I’ve matured and now I see Karen wasn’t the problem”. Exactly! Jim was the problem, yet people direct all the hate towards Pam, who actually tried to be friends with Karen. It is very unfair
Neither Jim nor Pam nor Karen was at fault. The real person to blame was Josh. Had he not bolted DM for Staples, they wouldn’t have closed the Stamford branch; Jim and Karen would have stayed together and perhaps even gotten married, and Pam would likely have been given a severance and moved on to some other company in Scranton.
Nobody was the problem. Jim was in a relationship, but realised he loved another woman so he broke that relationship. Of course it's sad, and I understand Karen was mad at him, but is there a correct way to act when this happens? You're gonna hurt someone's feelings whatever you do, and it's not like Jim and Karen were married with children.
Karen was great, and she didn't deserve Jim. And by that I mean she didn't deserve to be treated that way. Karen was nothing but good, and she still got dumped. Jim and Pam are meant for each other, ye, but that doesn't justify what happened to Karen.
But after it all we see that Karen seems happy with her partner, and has a child on the way. Who's to say that would have happened if she first didn't have to go through getting dumped like that? Also just because someone is purely good doesn't mean they deserve anything.
That's life for you. Sometimes you do everything nicely and get dumped. Sometimes you act like garbage and a girl begs you for attention. Niceness doesn't correlate with jackshit.
I always felt bad for her. So before Jim drove back to Scranton from NYC to ask Pam out, he basically ditched Karen alone in the city? I know she had friends there, but that was pretty cold what he did to her.
I wish Jim and Pam hadn't been scripted from the start, so the writers could've given Jim and Karen a real shot. In Friends, Monica and Chandler weren't pre-planned, but the writers kept them together since they were great with each other and the fans loved it. Like how Jim and Karen could've been.
Friends also sucks you want a qualify show watch how I met your mother comparing friends to the office is like saying this sandwich taste bad and me saying but I found it in a hole
The dynamic with Jim, Pam & Karen show you how hard relationships are. When you are younger, as a guy, you think how cool this situation would be to have two wonderful women love you. If you have grown up, and are good person, nothing tears you to shreds worse.
Honestly, while Jim and Pam are sweet and loving and caring to each other, Jim and Karen actually are a better fit in terms of personalities and life goals.
Pam held Jim back for multiple seasons, didn’t entertain her own ambitions and attacked Jim when he asked her if she really wanted to be a receptionist forever. Jim’s ambitions were crushed by her influence too (Athleap is a huge deal, as was working in New York), and refused to make any adjustments in HER life for the fact Jim is a much more ambitious person than she is until the very last season. Remember how Roy’s life turned around after he and Pam broke up? Pam was holding him back too, and we know Roy wasn’t nearly as driven as Jim. Not to mention of course that Karen was nothing but faithful, compared to Pam who spent the first 2 seasons constantly almost cheating on Roy. I don’t understand all the hate Karen gets. She pushed Jim to be his best - the promotion, the moving to New York, etc. She was extremely tolerant of Pam as well despite knowing about Jim and Pam’s history. She was a much better partner for him.
Jim was far from driven and Pam is one of the few woman in this world not driven by money. She just wanted to be loved and have a simple life. What a crime!
@@jerilane4420 I disagree, Pam definitely cared about money, even if she wasn't driven by it entirely. She snuck herself the role of office administrator (motivated either by money or status), and complained about her pay to Michael. She definitely wanted more for herself - she already had a simple life, but wanted to have a terraced house, exhibit her art, etc. She just didn't have the willpower to carry it through imo, and then tried to hide it behind actually 'wanting' a simple life, but avoiding questions or getting upset whenever the absences of her successes in these endeavours were brought up. Of course she just wanted to be loved and be happy - but doesn't every human want this? So this doesn't make Pam unique in any way, imo. Add this to the fact she didn't actually want a simple life, but claimed to, I think the point about Pam still stands.
@@andrew3939 She wanted out of being a secretary thats all and having a way to do her art. She wasnt going to get rich. She just wanted some respect or recognition instead of the office gopher. The terraced house was a metaphor and not some pie in the sky material thing. Pam isnt unique nor is Jim really. Thats what makes them so realistic a couple and they are able to convey the simple parts of their relationship in a touching and loving way. The way their relationship is written and presented on screen is the unique part !
LMAO but can we talk about the guy in the background at 4:53 casually testing the stability of the stair banister by hanging off it? I swear it’s Dwight but I can’t tell. 🤣
Watched the early seasons of the show again recently and yea - Karen a much more worthy mate for Jim. Pam toyed with him, broke his heart with her gutlessness and cowardice, held him back, and forced him into decisions keeping him tethered to her mediocrity. Smart, ambitious and talented, Karen represented someone who was his equal and able to challenge him, and was fully committed to him from the get go. And was a hell of a lot more fun and charming. Lesson for the kids out there: don't confuse "soul-mate" for a choice of banal comfort. Jim choosing Pam over Karen was an anti-growth choice, and was a double-down on the lazy choice of staying at the Scranton branch instead of challenging himself and exploring his own potential. Would be interested to know if the writers found that they sort of caught lightning in a bottle with the Jim/Karen romance (thanks to the awesome Rashida Jones), but felt committed to following through with the Jim/Pam thing. If so, they made the lazy, fan-friendly choice.
No sorry John and Jenna are the real lightning in the bottle as they have a wow factor from the first time you see them on screen. Calling Pam gutless and a coward is harsh considering many woman settle and take a life they know and are comfortable with even though it doesnt have the sparks. She was engaged and couldnt just walk away. You make it sound like one is choosing a new cable company. And here is another news flash sometimes a career doesnt trump a family and challenging oneself doesnt always make you happy just more well off financially. Jim had the chance to work in New York but gave it up to be with his true love. Jim could never love anyone else like he did Pam and that was their "thing" as you refer to it. Scenes with him and Karen felt like she was his sister as they had zero passion or at least he acted that way around her. Not her fault as she did her best. What made Jim and Pam real is they didnt live a typical new york glitzy life. They werent overly ambitious or talented and without flaws. But we can relate to that as that is the way MOST people live. And they dont live in New York or LA but in Scranton. And their love story is way better because of it as the writers made their relationship so subtle and devoid of flash but few couples on TV can rival their connection!
I don’t think they are a good couple at all! It’s cringey how Jim hides things from her, letting her in the dark about his situation with Pam, and then Karen has to find out about it through Phillys! Yikes! Plus Jim treats Karen as a rebound. How is that cute?! She deserved way better
I gotta be honest, that scene where Jim's watching Karen singing... love right there Ignoring all of the canon for a second, I've had a moment . At that moment I knew I was in love. It was at very moment that I knew I was dating the mother of my children. 6 months after that I still stand by that statement. I rag on The Office a lot, but they got very specific moment right
I always loved seeing them together I've no idea wtf ppl were on about 😭 wish they had at least lasted longer than that season. She was a perfect fit, seeing them was always cute or fun.
People were rooting for Pam and Kim because they pictured themselves as a Pam or a Jim - in the middle of a "ment to be" type of relationship. I usually see myself as the 3rd reel, so Karen and Jim ending up together is a more real relationship: you meet someone along the way, they already have a past, but you make it work and have a few laughs on the process.
Karen and Jim were more equals. Pam was more feminine and more emotionally needy more romantic. Karen was more of the fun freedom loving kinda of super cute tomboy. Pam was more cautious and insecure. Not that Karen didn't have her insecurities, but Pam needed Jim. Karen deserved honesty, integrity and was more straightforward. Pam played more coy flirty games. I think Jim liked being needed and liked being the alpha. I liked them both, and they were both good, but in different ways. It came down to Jim's need to be in charge.
Reminds me of how for the last couple years, feminist media critique has been obsessed with branding every remotely tomboyish character as an internalised misogynist who's "not like the other girls" while upholding more "traditionally" feminine characters (It is a valid point in some cases, but feminism has long had a problem with over-correcting its mistakes)
@morbidsearch I think you need to get your "feminist media critique" from websites other than buzzfeed. No, even slightly, knowledgeable feminist considers tomboys to have internalized misogyny.
I have the same problem with her that I have with Julie from friends. They were so good for Jim and Ross but they got in the way of what we all wanted.
I would Karen would be like Emily from friends in a way because Jim still had feelings for pan when he was with Karen and kare didn’t like that and that happened when Emily got married to Ross and she didn’t want Rachel to get in the way
Karen didn’t get enough attention. HERE’S when their relationship would start to fall apart: Jim forgets about loving Pam, until she confesses at the beach. Who the hell LET’S a creepy-looking stranger whack their house to test it’s integrity?🤣
He never forgot abt her, Jim straight up told Karen he still had feelings for Pam when she asked him. Tbh I would have broken up with him right then if I were her instead of being insecure and making up exes at David Wallace's party to make him jealous.
Karen is a bad fit for Jim because she doesn't have any overwhelming flaws and is genuinely a nice person. Jim is lazy, has a superiority complex and his favourite past time is bullying his mentally disabled co-worker, who in contrast to Jim, has an excellent work ethic, despite his limitations.
Karen was a perfect… rebound. It sucks but that’s sometimes how it is. But Jim loved Pam. It’s by coincidence he had to go back to Scranton and be reminded of it. That’s life. Karen and him were compatible, but there was no passion. You need both and he had both with Pam. Also Karen wasn’t as free spirited as Pam. I couldn’t see Karen passionately kissing in the rain or wanting to be proposed at a gas station. Pam was a lot more feeling and understood/appreciated those moments and Karen was a lot more thought. Logically Karen and Jim. But realistically Jim and Pam.
I personally wish that Karen and Jim could have influenced each other more. They both had ambition that pushed each other be better versions of themselves. I think Pam and Roy would have broken up no matter what after that kiss with Jim. It would have been cool to see her follow through with art school and earn her own confidence. Then whomever picks who at the end of the day I feel like it would have been healthier and more satisfying. What happened when Jim and Pam got together is a realistic view on how our personal growth can be stunted when we wrap our whole being into our relationship rather than being our own whole person who loves another healthy whole person.
I think most people were in a similar situation when somebody really likes us and we know we would be happy if we just give them a chance but for one reason or another, we're hung up on another person. Sometimes like in The Office, we make the right choice and we find everything we were looking for, and sometimes we realize we made a mistake until it's too late. Here the writers played it cool. Karen is beautiful, funny, hard worker and seems to genuinely like Jim but despite all of that Jim loves Pam and not much else will change that.
Jim and Karen were really cute but it was pretty clear that he was using her as a Pam stand-in at first. That being said, I did like Pam and Karen's friendship moments
Karen was actually really kind and sweet! I felt bad for her :/ I love Jim and Pam but I really don't have anything against Karen, she was great with Jim.
I just don't understand all these argue and attempts to blame the characters for their behavior and finding out who's negative or positive. Here is the thing - no one is absolutely right, this serial is about being a human and making mistakes and irrational decisions! Jim was rejected and tried to move on and let his feelings go. Pam was very lost, at that moment everything she had was ruined, she didn't know what to do, and I'm 100% sure she also wanted to let Jim go. She tried really hard to support him - she didn't mean to be bitchy, but ofc she couldn't be absolutely happy for Karen and Jim. But what could she do? And what I really love about her character, is that she overcame her fears and finally started doing what she wanted and telling what she has been unconsciously hiding all these time. She accepted herself and her desires! And Karen is a really nice and mature personality who wanted to be happy and solve all the problems with her beloved one with long and hard chats. But it's impossible to live happily when your bf is still not over someone. And ofc she couldn't accept that Pam was always somewhere around. But here is a good saying - everything will be as it must be
A Karen and Jim relationship could've only worked out if there was a storyline that allowed Jim to get over Pam, which could've been season 4 if there was enough fan demand but Parks & Recs called and she would get a main cast role
gotta say Karen over Pam for me. She genuinely loves Jim for who he is, not because he is with someone else all of a sudden. Karan and Jim are a good fit for one another and make a pleasant and compatible couple. I mean the fact that they really dated for realsies!
I actually like Karen a lot, she's a good person, fun and really cute. In fact, I felt bad for her, it wasn't her fault that she had fallen in love with Jim, who still had feelings for Pam.
I actually think they should have just remained friends - in fact Jim, Karen and Pam's friendship back in Scranton would have been really cool to watch. I always liked Karen - she was level headed, smart, assertive and she was one of the few female characters in the show who was serious about her career aspirations. Pairing her up with Jim didn't really work well for her character overall anyway because besides Jim and Pam's prior relationship, she and Jim had a relationship like friends working in the same profession - it was fun and playful but never really serious, at least not from Jim's side.
Karen was a well written character. What I really loved about that the love triangle between her, Jim and Pam was that there was no antagonist. All characters were relatable and likeable. And I love Rashida Jones in everything. She was the reason I started watching Parks and Rec, then I fell in love with everything else there.
I don't think I've laughed so hard at Dwight putting glue in the bottom of the box and he just shakes his head...."nope one crisis at a time" lmaoooooooooo
I think the scene that proves they weren’t fully compatible was when she pranked Jim at the cocktail party. It was quite clear that their humor was good, but not on the level of connection that he had with Pam.
I think taking sides in this is useless. Jim could've been happy with both Pam or Karen. He chose Pam. We gotta respect that. Karen would've been a good match as well, but we all know Jim was in love with Pam.
So now that I’ve watched the entire story of them as a couple, it’s Jim who did wrong not Karen. She only turned mean after the beach day because she was fighting for her relationship. He didn’t flirt with Pam when with Karen but dumping her because she mentioned she was meeting up with friends in New York was cruel.
Karen's only fault was that Jim was in love with pam... Which isnt her fault... no one's fault... not hers not jim's not pam's...and that's fine... cuz that's how life and relationships sometimes go
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Actually... Karen was awesome 😂
Maturing is realizing Karen did nothing wrong
Huh? .. What did she supposedly do?
Maturing is realizing that Karen should've stayed with Jim.
Maturing is realizing Jim should've stayed with Karen!
Doesn’t mean I can’t hate on her still
She saw Jim for the catch he was, while Pam rejected him and stayed with Roy. She didn’t want Jim, but when he was with other women, she was a jealous shrew. She wasn’t nice when he dated Amy Adams either.
I really like how Karen brings out all the niceness and dorkiness of Jim... They're cute
I cannot argue with that
i mean... doesn't pam do that as well? and actually even more
@@bearsbeetsbattlestargalact3484 probably
@@bearsbeetsbattlestargalact3484 yes I agree except in the lasts seasons I think.
But it shows that the relationship between Karen and Jim was sincere
jim is naturaly like that.
Karen was a good fit for Jim, only reason everyone disliked her was that that she wasnt Pam
Yup
Wished I could visit a multiverse were they have an ending with Karen and Jim. I understand that oh Pam is the one for him though I wished shows did multiple endings were fans could pick which endings suits them.
Everyone dislikes her? Any piece of content mentioning Karen always talks about how much of a better girlfriend she is lmao
She was a good fit for him, and he wasn't a good fit for her. The big problem with them is that he was still hung up on Pam. I know that's very obvious, but what I mean is that he wasn't truly over her. If he was, then I think that pairing would have lasted
"Why then, if she's so perfect, do i still wish that it was you?"
When you write a character who has an amazing meant-to-be relationship with a woman, and you’re able to write him having another awesome and comparable relationship with another woman, yet still make the other relationship preferred, but at the same time having that second relationship enjoyable as a stand alone: you are some awesome writers.
Start a sentence, and don't even know where it's going, just hope find it along the way. Like an improv conversation. An improversation.
I'd say it speaks more to Krasinski's chemistry with others.
THIS
@@bigbengamer i meaaan.... Chemistry is one thing, the Dialogue and Scenes are another.
@@bigbengamerno. if it wasn’t written this way his charisma and chemistry would mean absolutely nothing. the writing means everything for triangles like this
Him falling off the bike is gold.
So Truth 😆
Were you meant to type ’Jim’ or did you actually mean to type ’him’ cause I’d honestly believe either one at this point😂
one of the funniest moments in the show. I can imagine the director telling John he was doing his own stunts and he asks "could I fall into a bush?"
"i'm a drunk driver" was so cute tbh
Never noticed her name in Call of Duty was "KarentheJimSlayer", hahaha.
This is hilarious
Dwight “one crisis at a time” I felt that
Man I just realised how much I reallllllllllly wanted them to be together. Jim and Pam are really really good don’t get me wrong but Karen and Jim just sound like the perfect teenage couple
"The perfect teenage couple" lmao
Nobody's getting you wrong for stating obvious dumbo
@@GustavRex exactly..”the perfect teenage” couple cause they looked cute while it lasted but it had a lot of faults too.
@@Gunnpreetkaur like?
@@simnikiwekaywood7878 Like the reasons they broke up for example?
Karen was always my favorite female character in The Office. She seemed more like a real person than all the others.
That was a pleasant 8 minutes. I didn’t laugh hysterically or anything, but it was nice. Two people, behaving well in a relationship. Of course Jim ends up back with Pam, but Karen was a really good almost-the-one.
Nothing wrong with Karen as she was a good character in the show but........ she wasnt Pam. If someone else than Jenna had played Pam or Jim was with Karen in early part of show or Pam and Jim were never in the same scene or room then I think they would have been a good couple. Two seasons of chemistry like theirs is alot to bury in a storyline.
Did you laugh hysterically when Pam was with Jim
@@ctorre Good question, maybe when they pulled pranks on Dwight together?
"That was a pleasant 8 minutes" that's what she said
@@Brenooomaniezo 😂💀
It's a good thing that both Pam and Karren ended up happy.
the good ending
What happened to Karen
@@Harrycurlsshe ends up having a kid.
@@BossyGerbasi OH that's nice in which she episode. Did she come back after 4tgh season ?
@mr.hardik6380 I honestly do not remember :-( it's been sooo long, I just remember she ends up getting management at her own branch, and is pregnant, when the main cast she's Karen again.
Giving him a ride, picking up his bike, and treating him like a king was the sweetest thing
And what did he do in return? Use her as a rebound 😒
@@AichaCT true... yet serving unconditionally the person you love is a sweet thing
Happy couples know that they don't owe each other anything, but choose to give each other everything
They were adorable together- they cut out what great lengths he went thru to find those Herrs chips for her. Ironically, Karen and Pam also could have been good friends if it wasn’t for Jim - LOL- Jim and Pam were just destined to be together from the start
Jim didn’t make things weird between Pam and Karen, that’s was 100% on Pam being very vocal about the fact she liked Jim and didn’t like the fact they were dating.
You can just tell that Jim is not into Karen like that off the bat. He adores Pam. This just goes to show that everyone has different preferences on who they like
Well he might not have been into her because it was written that way. But their relationship had more romantic spark in my opinion because Jim had more chemistry with Karen than he did with Pam. Might have been because John was actually attracted to Rashida while Jenna was just a friend to him.
yea but Karen is hotter than Pam imma be honest
@@kidalcoholic4092they're both gorgeous women, just depends on preference ig
@@jrt8268 The fact that John and Rashisa did date for a while as they've gotten to know each other through The Office audition process goes to show that It must have been near-impossible for him to not have more layered and authentic chemistry and just straight up more fun with Rashida on the set playing as a couple. (Jim and Karen)
I love this comment 😭
From a writers perspective, I think Karen was truly good for him but Pam was better for the story .
Spot on
Nah, not the same chemistry.
respectfully, not sure how this makes sense, jim is a character IN the story, so whatever’s good for him would also be good for the story, correct?
@@zahrahayo Hamlet disapproves of this statement.
@@Ztam116 even negative events can be a good for a character
The chip thing was actually really cute
id fall for someone if they do the chip thing to me :((
@@elissesandra3013 tbh she did look like she fell in love with him right there
300th like
Karen was much more of an 'alpha' woman, she was self assured and secure in herself, she also went after what she wanted. Pam is the classic type of person who will not go after anything at all but would rather sit and wait, pretty much the only actual action she took was not marrying roy, but afterwards she just stayed there wallowing. Anything after that was always Jim, either pushing her a lot or just deciding for her. Maybe it's because I identify way more with a person like Karen but I've always wished their relationship had more depth because someone like her might have been more suited to push him to become better a lot quicker than how it happened.
did we watch the same show? they made it a HUGE point of pams character development that she ended up pushing herself and not sitting around waiting. for example when she ran over the coal…
@@charliecurwood yeah the ONLY time she actually did something in 8 years… so while she did grow a little she would have always been a more passive person, you can work on yourself but the bases of who you are will always stay the same
@@charliecurwood wow walking over a coal such a development as a person!!
Pam has a lot of growth after season 6. She made up a new job position and a made up her salary when DM got bought over.
When she got Erin a new computer and Andy wanted a new one, she suggested to Andy that she can only buy one for him when "his computer really breaks". so they broke his computer together.
Even before season 6, she went to NY to study graphic design funded by DM but chose to not continue instead.
@@se-mi1489 maybe it doesn't apply to everyone, but some people just need that extra push, could be from a person or an event, to have the extra confidence for themselves. For Pam, walking over the coal of fire gave her a boost of confidence and made her feel good in that moment as she was the type to not take risk.
Karen was willing to move to Scranton just to be with Jim, whereas Pam was not willing to leave Scranton to help Jim follow his dreams.
Jim and Karen weren’t married with kids. Different situation.
you serious?
@@geengengenahow exactly is that a different situation? She went away for months to pursue her dream. Compad to that his was very real and had much better pay/future for them. She had nothing to really stop her from going w him except ego and immaturity
ouch
@@Draco-999it’s so different when you build a family in one place
Her singing at the wedding is such a cool moment
Genuine spirit in the singing is what makes the scene so special. It’s just so charming.
Usually people say “oh I’ve matured and now I see Karen wasn’t the problem”. Exactly! Jim was the problem, yet people direct all the hate towards Pam, who actually tried to be friends with Karen. It is very unfair
Neither Jim nor Pam nor Karen was at fault. The real person to blame was Josh. Had he not bolted DM for Staples, they wouldn’t have closed the Stamford branch; Jim and Karen would have stayed together and perhaps even gotten married, and Pam would likely have been given a severance and moved on to some other company in Scranton.
No one was the problem really. I didn't see any faulty people in this entire season. It's just the situations which were unfortunate and kinda sad.
Nah Pam rubbed me the wrong way when she apologized to Karen but said “Im not sorry for saying it”
Nobody was the problem. Jim was in a relationship, but realised he loved another woman so he broke that relationship. Of course it's sad, and I understand Karen was mad at him, but is there a correct way to act when this happens? You're gonna hurt someone's feelings whatever you do, and it's not like Jim and Karen were married with children.
I feel like Jim was the common denominator and both parties problems so I totally agree with you.
Karen was great, and she didn't deserve Jim. And by that I mean she didn't deserve to be treated that way. Karen was nothing but good, and she still got dumped. Jim and Pam are meant for each other, ye, but that doesn't justify what happened to Karen.
But after it all we see that Karen seems happy with her partner, and has a child on the way. Who's to say that would have happened if she first didn't have to go through getting dumped like that?
Also just because someone is purely good doesn't mean they deserve anything.
It kinda does. If one couple is “meant to be”, then any third wheels are going to be casualties.
this is the perfect way to describe
That's life for you. Sometimes you do everything nicely and get dumped. Sometimes you act like garbage and a girl begs you for attention. Niceness doesn't correlate with jackshit.
I always felt bad for her. So before Jim drove back to Scranton from NYC to ask Pam out, he basically ditched Karen alone in the city? I know she had friends there, but that was pretty cold what he did to her.
Karen was perfect. I really liked her character
I wish Jim and Pam hadn't been scripted from the start, so the writers could've given Jim and Karen a real shot. In Friends, Monica and Chandler weren't pre-planned, but the writers kept them together since they were great with each other and the fans loved it. Like how Jim and Karen could've been.
Friends also sucks you want a qualify show watch how I met your mother comparing friends to the office is like saying this sandwich taste bad and me saying but I found it in a hole
Jim and Pam had crazy chemistry from day one!
@@JoeDirt-ti7gr Yeah but in only a few episodes Jim & Karen got even the same chemistry
Pam was cute but always found Karen more attractive in both terms of personality and looks.
I really liked it when Karen and Pam came together to form the committee to plan parties 🥳
The dynamic with Jim, Pam & Karen show you how hard relationships are. When you are younger, as a guy, you think how cool this situation would be to have two wonderful women love you. If you have grown up, and are good person, nothing tears you to shreds worse.
Jim was too immature for Karen
Honestly, while Jim and Pam are sweet and loving and caring to each other, Jim and Karen actually are a better fit in terms of personalities and life goals.
Pam held Jim back for multiple seasons, didn’t entertain her own ambitions and attacked Jim when he asked her if she really wanted to be a receptionist forever. Jim’s ambitions were crushed by her influence too (Athleap is a huge deal, as was working in New York), and refused to make any adjustments in HER life for the fact Jim is a much more ambitious person than she is until the very last season.
Remember how Roy’s life turned around after he and Pam broke up? Pam was holding him back too, and we know Roy wasn’t nearly as driven as Jim.
Not to mention of course that Karen was nothing but faithful, compared to Pam who spent the first 2 seasons constantly almost cheating on Roy.
I don’t understand all the hate Karen gets. She pushed Jim to be his best - the promotion, the moving to New York, etc. She was extremely tolerant of Pam as well despite knowing about Jim and Pam’s history. She was a much better partner for him.
Jim was far from driven and Pam is one of the few woman in this world not driven by money. She just wanted to be loved and have a simple life. What a crime!
@@jerilane4420 I disagree, Pam definitely cared about money, even if she wasn't driven by it entirely. She snuck herself the role of office administrator (motivated either by money or status), and complained about her pay to Michael.
She definitely wanted more for herself - she already had a simple life, but wanted to have a terraced house, exhibit her art, etc. She just didn't have the willpower to carry it through imo, and then tried to hide it behind actually 'wanting' a simple life, but avoiding questions or getting upset whenever the absences of her successes in these endeavours were brought up.
Of course she just wanted to be loved and be happy - but doesn't every human want this? So this doesn't make Pam unique in any way, imo. Add this to the fact she didn't actually want a simple life, but claimed to, I think the point about Pam still stands.
@@andrew3939 She wanted out of being a secretary thats all and having a way to do her art. She wasnt going to get rich. She just wanted some respect or recognition instead of the office gopher. The terraced house was a metaphor and not some pie in the sky material thing. Pam isnt unique nor is Jim really. Thats what makes them so realistic a couple and they are able to convey the simple parts of their relationship in a touching and loving way. The way their relationship is written and presented on screen is the unique part !
Loren Michaels casually walks up right behind him after he said he thought he saw him 😂
Lorne Michaels, and that wasnt him. Lorne looks like Dr. Evil
im pretty sure its just someone who looks a lot like him when he was younger. Date this episode aired he was almost 70, but still super funny.
I would have chosen Karen over Pam in a HEARTBEAT
LMAO but can we talk about the guy in the background at 4:53 casually testing the stability of the stair banister by hanging off it? I swear it’s Dwight but I can’t tell. 🤣
It’s dwight
Only Dwight
They’re just two cool people who will be good to their partners.
The bit where she pretends to’ve slept with everyone only to flip it and pretend he was her first? Incredible.
🤣
Watched the early seasons of the show again recently and yea - Karen a much more worthy mate for Jim. Pam toyed with him, broke his heart with her gutlessness and cowardice, held him back, and forced him into decisions keeping him tethered to her mediocrity. Smart, ambitious and talented, Karen represented someone who was his equal and able to challenge him, and was fully committed to him from the get go. And was a hell of a lot more fun and charming. Lesson for the kids out there: don't confuse "soul-mate" for a choice of banal comfort. Jim choosing Pam over Karen was an anti-growth choice, and was a double-down on the lazy choice of staying at the Scranton branch instead of challenging himself and exploring his own potential. Would be interested to know if the writers found that they sort of caught lightning in a bottle with the Jim/Karen romance (thanks to the awesome Rashida Jones), but felt committed to following through with the Jim/Pam thing. If so, they made the lazy, fan-friendly choice.
no
Yesss, finally
its not all about challenges and business
@@juanb116 actually that’s exactly what love is my friend
No sorry John and Jenna are the real lightning in the bottle as they have a wow factor from the first time you see them on screen. Calling Pam gutless and a coward is harsh considering many woman settle and take a life they know and are comfortable with even though it doesnt have the sparks. She was engaged and couldnt just walk away. You make it sound like one is choosing a new cable company. And here is another news flash sometimes a career doesnt trump a family and challenging oneself doesnt always make you happy just more well off financially. Jim had the chance to work in New York but gave it up to be with his true love. Jim could never love anyone else like he did Pam and that was their "thing" as you refer to it. Scenes with him and Karen felt like she was his sister as they had zero passion or at least he acted that way around her. Not her fault as she did her best. What made Jim and Pam real is they didnt live a typical new york glitzy life. They werent overly ambitious or talented and without flaws. But we can relate to that as that is the way MOST people live. And they dont live in New York or LA but in Scranton. And their love story is way better because of it as the writers made their relationship so subtle and devoid of flash but few couples on TV can rival their connection!
I don’t think they are a good couple at all! It’s cringey how Jim hides things from her, letting her in the dark about his situation with Pam, and then Karen has to find out about it through Phillys! Yikes! Plus Jim treats Karen as a rebound. How is that cute?! She deserved way better
She ended up with better. Regional Manager of Utica branch, happily married and with a kid.
She GOT something better, but people are still bitter.
I gotta be honest, that scene where Jim's watching Karen singing... love right there
Ignoring all of the canon for a second, I've had a moment . At that moment I knew I was in love. It was at very moment that I knew I was dating the mother of my children. 6 months after that I still stand by that statement. I rag on The Office a lot, but they got very specific moment right
Other than that he really treats Karen as a rebound and he has WAY more of those types of moments with pam.
I always loved seeing them together I've no idea wtf ppl were on about 😭 wish they had at least lasted longer than that season. She was a perfect fit, seeing them was always cute or fun.
People were rooting for Pam and Kim because they pictured themselves as a Pam or a Jim - in the middle of a "ment to be" type of relationship. I usually see myself as the 3rd reel, so Karen and Jim ending up together is a more real relationship: you meet someone along the way, they already have a past, but you make it work and have a few laughs on the process.
You essentially described Jim, from the perspective of Pam, when she was with Roy.
The nicest Karen in the history of Karens
6:26 i don't know why its so satisfying to watch pam like that 😂😂
Her line about garlic bread is one of my favourites in the whole show
The only Karen I'm alright with. Even though she isn't Pam. 👀
Karen Smith
Karen Carpenter
She's much better than Pam
5:37 her smile man 🥵 I’m so glad Karen, Jim and Pam all ended up happy in the end
Karen and Jim were more equals. Pam was more feminine and more emotionally needy more romantic. Karen was more of the fun freedom loving kinda of super cute tomboy. Pam was more cautious and insecure. Not that Karen didn't have her insecurities, but Pam needed Jim. Karen deserved honesty, integrity and was more straightforward. Pam played more coy flirty games. I think Jim liked being needed and liked being the alpha. I liked them both, and they were both good, but in different ways. It came down to Jim's need to be in charge.
Reminds me of how for the last couple years, feminist media critique has been obsessed with branding every remotely tomboyish character as an internalised misogynist who's "not like the other girls" while upholding more "traditionally" feminine characters
(It is a valid point in some cases, but feminism has long had a problem with over-correcting its mistakes)
@morbidsearch I think you need to get your "feminist media critique" from websites other than buzzfeed. No, even slightly, knowledgeable feminist considers tomboys to have internalized misogyny.
Poor Karen. She was such a good person
Why poor Karen? She ends up getting married, has a kid, and seems to be very happy! Things turned out great for her!
I honestly thought Jim and Karen had a much healthier relationship untill pam started getting into the mix
I’m glad that things turned out good for Karen, she really deserved it.
karen's got older sister/cool cousin vibes, fun to hang out with and play video games
I always liked Karen. One of the benefits of their relationship is that you see it start and sort of develop.
Kevin totally ruined Jim and Karen...
I have the same problem with her that I have with Julie from friends. They were so good for Jim and Ross but they got in the way of what we all wanted.
I would Karen would be like Emily from friends in a way because Jim still had feelings for pan when he was with Karen and kare didn’t like that and that happened when Emily got married to Ross and she didn’t want Rachel to get in the way
@@nvm9040 that apply to everyone whos in a relationship lol. no one want to couple with someone who still havent move on from their ex/crush
@@jukkininth4837 I know I have been there before
@@nvm9040pan?
Leaving Karen for Pam was the most basic move ever made in sitcom history. Bad move Jim….
Karen was so amazing. Loved her
Karen so fine 😩
Karen didn’t get enough attention. HERE’S when their relationship would start to fall apart: Jim forgets about loving Pam, until she confesses at the beach.
Who the hell LET’S a creepy-looking stranger whack their house to test it’s integrity?🤣
Jim never forgot about Pam. He was just using Karen.
@@NicoleCzarnecki I’m saying that’s what SHOULD’VE happened.
@@NicoleCzarnecki Yeah unfortunately Karen was like long term rebound for Jim even though she seemed good for him
He never forgot abt her, Jim straight up told Karen he still had feelings for Pam when she asked him. Tbh I would have broken up with him right then if I were her instead of being insecure and making up exes at David Wallace's party to make him jealous.
@@NicoleCzarneckiHey.
Karen is a bad fit for Jim because she doesn't have any overwhelming flaws and is genuinely a nice person. Jim is lazy, has a superiority complex and his favourite past time is bullying his mentally disabled co-worker, who in contrast to Jim, has an excellent work ethic, despite his limitations.
Karen was a perfect… rebound. It sucks but that’s sometimes how it is. But Jim loved Pam. It’s by coincidence he had to go back to Scranton and be reminded of it. That’s life. Karen and him were compatible, but there was no passion. You need both and he had both with Pam. Also Karen wasn’t as free spirited as Pam. I couldn’t see Karen passionately kissing in the rain or wanting to be proposed at a gas station. Pam was a lot more feeling and understood/appreciated those moments and Karen was a lot more thought. Logically Karen and Jim. But realistically Jim and Pam.
karen acts almost exactly like how ann would act from parks and rec
Is it just me or was Karen the best person for jim
I still prefer Karen over Pam honestly. As the series moved on I really started to dislike how needy and non supportive Pam was.
I actually wished if Jim and Karen continued their relationship.
I personally wish that Karen and Jim could have influenced each other more. They both had ambition that pushed each other be better versions of themselves. I think Pam and Roy would have broken up no matter what after that kiss with Jim. It would have been cool to see her follow through with art school and earn her own confidence. Then whomever picks who at the end of the day I feel like it would have been healthier and more satisfying. What happened when Jim and Pam got together is a realistic view on how our personal growth can be stunted when we wrap our whole being into our relationship rather than being our own whole person who loves another healthy whole person.
I think most people were in a similar situation when somebody really likes us and we know we would be happy if we just give them a chance but for one reason or another, we're hung up on another person. Sometimes like in The Office, we make the right choice and we find everything we were looking for, and sometimes we realize we made a mistake until it's too late. Here the writers played it cool. Karen is beautiful, funny, hard worker and seems to genuinely like Jim but despite all of that Jim loves Pam and not much else will change that.
They were really cute and beautiful couple.
Jim definitely saw her as a good friend. He looks at Pam way differently. He clearly cares for Karen, but the passion is not there.
Jim and Karen were really cute but it was pretty clear that he was using her as a Pam stand-in at first. That being said, I did like Pam and Karen's friendship moments
These two were very good together. As much as I loved Pam I think Jim and Karen were great together
Oh god to that vampire prank
Karen was actually really kind and sweet! I felt bad for her :/
I love Jim and Pam but I really don't have anything against Karen, she was great with Jim.
Admit it , if you didn’t know about Pam , you’d like Karen
Karen was a great person and jim didn't deserve her
I just don't understand all these argue and attempts to blame the characters for their behavior and finding out who's negative or positive. Here is the thing - no one is absolutely right, this serial is about being a human and making mistakes and irrational decisions!
Jim was rejected and tried to move on and let his feelings go.
Pam was very lost, at that moment everything she had was ruined, she didn't know what to do, and I'm 100% sure she also wanted to let Jim go. She tried really hard to support him - she didn't mean to be bitchy, but ofc she couldn't be absolutely happy for Karen and Jim. But what could she do? And what I really love about her character, is that she overcame her fears and finally started doing what she wanted and telling what she has been unconsciously hiding all these time. She accepted herself and her desires!
And Karen is a really nice and mature personality who wanted to be happy and solve all the problems with her beloved one with long and hard chats. But it's impossible to live happily when your bf is still not over someone. And ofc she couldn't accept that Pam was always somewhere around.
But here is a good saying - everything will be as it must be
A Karen and Jim relationship could've only worked out if there was a storyline that allowed Jim to get over Pam, which could've been season 4 if there was enough fan demand but Parks & Recs called and she would get a main cast role
That drunk bike fall is amazing 😂 1:24
gotta say Karen over Pam for me. She genuinely loves Jim for who he is, not because he is with someone else all of a sudden. Karan and Jim are a good fit for one another and make a pleasant and compatible couple. I mean the fact that they really dated for realsies!
I actually like Karen a lot, she's a good person, fun and really cute. In fact, I felt bad for her, it wasn't her fault that she had fallen in love with Jim, who still had feelings for Pam.
Rashida Jones ıs such a pretty woman. It's a pleasure to see her in this series.
Ann you beautiful tropical fish
I really liked them together
I actually think they should have just remained friends - in fact Jim, Karen and Pam's friendship back in Scranton would have been really cool to watch.
I always liked Karen - she was level headed, smart, assertive and she was one of the few female characters in the show who was serious about her career aspirations. Pairing her up with Jim didn't really work well for her character overall anyway because besides Jim and Pam's prior relationship, she and Jim had a relationship like friends working in the same profession - it was fun and playful but never really serious, at least not from Jim's side.
Karen was ambitious supported Jim with the corporate job. Never got why she was disliked, she never even kept any hard feelings against Pam.
Don't forget she left him in the interview to go hang out with her friends.
Karen was a well written character. What I really loved about that the love triangle between her, Jim and Pam was that there was no antagonist. All characters were relatable and likeable.
And I love Rashida Jones in everything. She was the reason I started watching Parks and Rec, then I fell in love with everything else there.
*Pam has left the chat*
I don't think I've laughed so hard at Dwight putting glue in the bottom of the box and he just shakes his head...."nope one crisis at a time" lmaoooooooooo
I developed a crush on Karen when I first saw her on The Office.
I think the scene that proves they weren’t fully compatible was when she pranked Jim at the cocktail party. It was quite clear that their humor was good, but not on the level of connection that he had with Pam.
Karen didnt even do anything wrong 😂
Jim fumbled the bag hard with Karen but i guess it worked out at the end with pam
I think taking sides in this is useless. Jim could've been happy with both Pam or Karen. He chose Pam. We gotta respect that. Karen would've been a good match as well, but we all know Jim was in love with Pam.
PAM AND JIM FOR EVER
wow that's their entire screen time together
They were actually really good together. Wish their breakup was less than sudden and not off-screen basically but oh well.
Karen was truly a great counterpoint to Pam’s character.
Yknow what Karen deserved better than Jim
Definitely, worked out in the end for her though which is good
I personally liked Karen for Jim WAY more then Pam.
So now that I’ve watched the entire story of them as a couple, it’s Jim who did wrong not Karen. She only turned mean after the beach day because she was fighting for her relationship. He didn’t flirt with Pam when with Karen but dumping her because she mentioned she was meeting up with friends in New York was cruel.
Karen's only fault was that Jim was in love with pam... Which isnt her fault... no one's fault... not hers not jim's not pam's...and that's fine... cuz that's how life and relationships sometimes go