You might want to look into scentbird. I know you don’t support several of the CEO’s stances. But I know you’ve already signed a contract. Don’t break it, and now I’m realizing you’ve probably been alerted to this already & can’t talk about it, but hope to hear from you soon that you’ve ended the relationship. She believes eye color is connected to spirituality and guess which eyes are most spiritual? 🔵🔵🔵 big shocker…we know what that actually means…
I do wanna say yall, scent bird is freaking amazing. The perfumes say 1 month but u get them every month so they end up lasting closer to 3-4 months per perfume. The name brand ones are some that have up charges on them tho so be wary if ur joining just to get Chanel or Dior perfumes
@@sapphirethesapphic Unfortunately there's not that much more to tell, lol. A couple of posts went around of Superwholocks being like "omg we should adopt Hannibal fandom" (reasoning unclear) and others being like "OMG YES NEW LITTLE BROTHER" and then Hannibal fans getting on the post like "I would rather be fed a person than be part of whatever the fuck is going on over there" and that was more or less the end of that.
I keep on seeing "forced to be a teen in 2024" "born to be a teen in 2014" tiktoks on my fyp but they weren't in the tumblr trenches so they'll never understand
This is kind of unrelated but I think it’s funny that the one where they want to be, a teen in 2014, says ‘born to be a teen in 2014’, … even though,,, no,,, cause if you were born to be a teen in 2014, you would be a teen in 2014, that’s like the thing about being born at a specific time like I know thats just the turn of phrase / format for those types of posts but I think it’s funny also like who is forcing them to be be a teen in 2024? Their parents?
my hottest take about the queerbaiting in Supernatural and Sherlock is that I think the writers mostly intended it as 'funny' homophobia for their intended straight adult target audience to laugh at, but their surprise audience of queers and teens took it as hints of true feelings and representation. When there'd be a joke about John and Sherlock being mistaken for a couple or Dean being a fan of a hunky doctor in a tv show, the writers weren't hinting at endgames, they were trying to make you laugh. "These tough men looked kinda gay for a minute! Isn't that hilarious!" And then the people behind the shows had no idea how to deal with this very vocal audience they ended up with and kinda ended up fighting their own fandoms until they imploded.
I've always said this about those shows during that time. I truly think the queerbaiting started as "jokes/bits" that the male show runners probably either made with their friends or would have laughed at themselves, so expected their audience to also laugh at. The fact that so many actual queer people (and straight women who fetishized them) watched the show and took those moments seriously was a surprise they were not prepared for and clearly did not know how to handle. But I also feel that after a certain point, they knew where their bread was being buttered so it was easy to toss a queerbait bone every now and then to stay relevant with that very dedicated group of fans (while also getting to laugh at them).
As someone who grew up watching Friends and How I Met Your Mother, this was obvious even to teenage me. There were jokes about Chandler being gay and Phoebe and Lily thirsting over women but everyone knew these weren't hints at their endgame relationships. Sometimes Carol and Susan would show up and Barney had a gay brother so that was the gay representation box ticked off. Sherlock didn't do anything different to hint at Johnlock lol.
@@ghostinthecity Chandler was intended to be gay at the outset, but they chickened out or the network pressured them against it or something. Matt Baume has a video.
I distinctly remember thinking in high school, "wow my middle school interests were so cringe, good thing i like cool things now like superwholock i'll never be embarassed about this". and here we are now.
The wincest "so few women characters they have to ship the bros" thing reminds me of parrots plucking their feathers out of stress/boredom or octopuses eating their own arms because their tank sucks. You GOTTA put more developed women in these shows or it's bad fandom husbandry!
it does have to be said that the show canonically made them soulmates and also called them "Psychotically, irrationally, erotically co-dependent" on television. The Normal Brothers.
Honestly, if I were a supernatural fan looking at that post at the time I'd be pretty jealous. What do you mean you get cool weapons and I get "gun" Also I'm laughing that the weapon of choice for Whovians is like the TARDIS, not a sonic Screwdriver (Which does make sense) or anything like that
In Moffat's Supernatural, Charlie the lesbian is in love with Dean. In Moffat's Supernatural, Castiel and Mary Winchester are a couple and he met her on an angel mission when she was an infant. In Moffat's Supernatural, Sam is a Big Brain who always knows exactly what demon they're facing by name without having to research based on the flavour profile of the sulphur they leave behind and is unequivocably the Main Character. In Moffat's Supernatural, Ruby was never the mastermind and was actually being manipulated by Crowley the whole time.
Moffat is good as a one off episode writer, bad as a show runner. But ohhhhh look at all the nepotism! His wife and MIL are producers at the BBC WHAT A COINKIDINK!
@@dirtbagdeacon Moffat's a rare case of a writer actually getting better once his shows stopped being popular and he started on his midlife crisis arch. Genuinely the MOMENT Sherlock crashed and burned and Doctor Who's ratings dropped off a cliff he started actually making decent DW again (s9 and 10).
@@TheBridgieShow Its genuinely wild how true this is I watched Capaldi's last season years after it had aired because I'd just gotten so tired of all the Moffatt stuff That last season was genuinely one of the best seasons of Doctor Who, just, genuinely amazing stuff. No BS, no trying to outsmart the audience. Just good characters, good stories to support them. meaningful arcs...it was like, where the hell had this been hiding?!
@@TheBridgieShowseriously, it's my favorite show. Have seen every surviving episode since 1963. I skip the vast majority of Matt's run, but I think Capaldi is the height of the show.
It is very funny to me that Superwholock basically spanned the entirety of Sherlock's time on air but it's just a mere blip in the lifespan of Doctor Who. One day when the sun is dying they will still be making Doctor Who episodes and no one will remember what Superwholock was, and that is when we will know peace.
Sherlock and Supernatural relentlessly queerbaited through their whole runs while Doctor Who had Nine kiss Jack Harkness literally his first series back. Doctor Who is now the last one standing. Coincidence? I think not.
@@nomisunrider6472 Also, Sherlock is one of many adaptations of the character, which most likely will only be remebered for that fandom. Meanwhile, the original Doctor Who was one of the bases for modern fandom. It's a bit meta if you think about it. And Supernatural... it contributed to November 5th.
@@catvicddlm1884well since there are many adaptations maybe sometime in the future there sill be a new Sherlock and new teens will bring wholocke back, combining it with BTS or whatever kids nowadays are into
The knife really adds to the immersion that im being held captive and my kidnapper has adhd and just has to tell me about their niche interests,i applaud you
Made me think of the whole thing where Amy Pond's daughter essentially is a Time Lord herself because of being conceived aboard the TARDIS while it was in transit. I think they actually mentioned "made-up-word exposure" while discussing it.
Honestly, I don't think any shows can be again. TV has changed so much that fandoms can't survive year round like they used to. (RIP 22 episode seasons)
I do think the OurGoodShadows (our flag means death, good omens, and what we do in the shadows) fandoms kindaaaa mimic superwholock. They're linked by Taika Waititi the same way the ogs were linked by Moffat. That being said, the fandom insanity is nowhere near the same level
"Gleeks, grab your slushies" felt like a shot to the head. That's one subculture I rarely see people talk about, despite it being basically one of the main fandoms I saw constantly entrenched in discourse (which was also actually queer!) at the time.
@@newcamomile Hey, we are still there crying every June. But yeah, it went back to being a normal size fandom. No idea about Glee, not even the people I know IRL who were into it talk about it now.
Man the Jensen Ackles homophobia situation really shows how common casual homophobia still was just 10 years back. The audience is already gearing up for booing when all she's said is she's bi, her question could've been anything and they would've probably booed just because of that.
That literally made me so angry I had to pause the video. That poor girl. She apologized thinking being bisexual is disrespectful? And to be demeaned by a grown ass man who you idolize in front of a crowd of people??? Fuck that guy honestly
I graduated high school in 2013, & I vividly remember the boys who bullied me for shaving my legs in middle school doing the Day of Silence in our junior/senior year. I truly don't know how to express how rapidly things shifted here in the states.
coming from the SPN fandom: it wasnt entirely homophobia that got her booed. It's the fact she decided to take her headcanon IRL with the actors in front of an entire auditorium. There had already been several other past issues at cons of hardcore destiel-ers fully acting out IRL at cons (a few had to legit be banned), and at the point of this clip, regular attendees were sick of the discourse bc all it did was create controversy where it wasn't needed. That question should be saved for a private m&g, not put the actors on the spot in front of hundreds. Or (IMO) arguably shouldnt be asked at all as it's incredibly boundary-crossing of that invisible line where maybe your specific personal thoughts dont need to be validated by actors just doing a job.
Neil Gaiman has such a good response to this "I am not the arbiter of headcanons, you are allowed to interpret my work however you want" (paraphrasing, but that's always the sentiment) instead of shutting down the people who love your work enough that they want to explore the work in such a deep way and mocking them for doing so
No, the saddest part is her quickly saying she didn’t mean to offend him by deeming him bisexual-It went from “you suck for bringing your queer politics here” to “how dare you call the character bisexual? Disgusting!” 😬😬😬
They’re not booing her sexuality, they’re booing her bringing internet nonsense to a real-world event. I hope she was able to know that and didn’t see it as a reflection on her identity. I’m bisexual and I’d have been annoyed, too.
Life was a strange experience as a kid who was only allowed to have Pinterest from 2013-2017 because I just got A LOT of out dated tumblr posts on Pinterest and allowed that to form my identity so I was like 2 years behind on all of it, living in my own little world.
@@taniawania3008 Same thing with non-english speaking fans. We were two years behind on all of this in our own little bubble before we all learned English and went to the international spaces where stuff was up to date:D
Oooh, I had a v similar experience on Facebook, lol. I followed a bunch of Doctor Who meme pages and stuff and I think only got a Tumblr somewhere between 2014 and 2016, but even then, I used it a lot less
I've always wondered why BBC's Merlin wasn't included in 'SuperWhoLock'. It was quirky, starred a variety of generally attractive but quiky looking white men, and Merthur was an absolute success in fandom space. But then again, it had well written female characters. And it ended in 2012.
It had (and still has) it's own thriving fandom and the show was already kinda over. What I want to know is... in the alternate history where Once Upon a Time had a male protagonist, would it be in the group?
@@raes6546 Despite considering myself a superwholock fan as a teen, I never 'got' Supernatural, so I never read crossover fics. I did try to write a crossover where I replaced Supernatural with the anime Death Note, though. That was an odd one. (Also, you can't just bring up a fic without dropping the title 👀)
Ok, I get saying that Matt Smith or Benedict Cummerbund are not conventionally attractive and that was part of the appeal or whatever but Jensen Ackles was literally on Dawson's Creek and Smallville. Like he is the poster child of an actor who was hired for his looks. I'm not saying that to say he's bad actor I'm saying he very conventionally attractive, emphasis on the conventionally, there is not the slightest whiff of tumblr-sexyman-ness on this man. He looks like he used to beat up Matt Smith in high school. Edited for spelling.
I think a lot of people back in the day didn't consider Jensen Ackles conventionally attractive because they wheren't aware of how tall Jared Padalecki actually is in real life. So they saw Jensen standing like a head-and-half bellow the guy playing the "nerdy" brother and thought "this guy is way too short to be conventionaly handsome". Nowadays we have more acceptance for short men, but back in 2011 Hollywood was forcing Tom Cruise to stand on a stool every time he had to film a scene next to a woman because it was unnaceptable for a hot guy to be bellow a certain height... that's just my theory, of course
Right?? My heart broke for the fact that she felt like seeing hersef in a character could be disrespectful because of her identity. I even feel like jared felt bad based on his reaction time and tone when he said "no.." but jensen shut that down. So sad i hope that persons doing well
Imagine watching a show where the characters intentionally make references to one of the main characters being into both men and women, show him flirt with both men and women, throw sneaky gay culture references, have the character’s brother say lines that seem to have him be aware that said main character is into both men and women, then tease a mlm ship for the majority of the shows length - and then have the people who made this show you adore mock you for thinking that character is bisexual. That is so disrespectful to your fans, to bisexual people, and to media literacy. It shattered my heart seeing her go through that, especially so young. And the fact that some people still act like she had it coming for -checks notes- thanking creators she admired for representing her marginalized community, is just wild
the girl herself came forward afterwards and said it seemed from her perspective like that part was actually directed at the audience in general after the booing and he more seemed like he wanted to bury it to stop all the inter-fan unpleasantness. IDK if that's really what he meant, but she said she didn't feel like he was telling her off specifically as that he was refusing to engage with potential shipping discourse because (as shown by the booing) things could get very ugly if actors or con staff were seen to be taking one side or another by allowing it. If I remember rightly, he also recognised her at the signings or something and was perfectly nice to her about it all. Don't get me wrong, he was absolutely never going to answer that question, and fans routinely got told by convention staff that they straight up weren't allowed to ask questions about Destiel even AFTER the canonical love confession, but going off other fan interactions and panels he probably would have just played it off with a slightly mocking joke and/or an uncomfortable "well he definitely isn't bisexual and you're seeing subtext that isn't there because you're crazy, but if it makes you happy to think so then whatever" type of response.
When I was a teenager, I was only into M/M ships. The reason for this was because F/M het relationships made me uncomfortably aware of the fact that I was growing up into an age where I could plausibly be in a relationship and that made me extremely unnerved. Idk if other ppl went thru this as well but I had a phase where I found that thinking of participating in sex acts made me viscerally disgusted for a while lmao
Oh man yes, I felt this! And then when I was 23 or something I realized that I am sex repulsed aroace. Being biologically female meant that it feels "safer" to ship M/M and specifically cis M/M because female bodies in sexual scenarios was straight up a "Nnnnnnnnnnnnnope bye" moment for me. Nowadays I don't feel as strongly repulsed (towards het ships), but het ships are still a pretty hard sell for me. Maybe because it can still feel so writing-checklist-mandatory-love-interest at times.
@@bamioayam eyyy fellow sex-repulsed aroace woman it's always nice to see my kin out there in the wild (also same, but I've gotten way comfier with F/F ships or stories nowadays since they're usually not written in this icky sexual way you know what I mean? like stories about women and their bodies and how they really are instead of this dominant man x submissive woman get pregnant bullshit)
I did not because I am dude, but I grew up in fandom circles where a lot of girls where like this and I didn't get what caused some to go into the "shipping Disney princesses with the princes or shoujou lead with the guy they preferred"-camp or the camp you described (and very few other camps that I could discern) and never had the guts to ask what motivated them. So if nothing else I thank you for providing some extra context to the draw of almost solely focusing on M/M shipping while female, I've got some reflection to do now.
@@theoture732eyyyy, fellow ace/aro woman who loves wlw or F/F stories and ships here too! I used to be into M/M more than het in my late teens but before my late teens I was repulsed by almost EVERY relationship in media. I kind of blame kids cartoons in the 2000s really liked the stalker love interest trope where the guy protag is extremely not into it but basically I was only into the super healthy and fluffy relationships. I hated anyone even implying a man would come into my life too. Then it was m/m storiee when I was discovering myself and then I found wlw finally where I got to see more relatable characters and situations to myself.
"Ohhhhh", I say, as I re-evaluate my confused feelings towards "why did I find M/F or F/F ships uncomfortable when M/M ships were fine, as a teen?" - As an aroace nonbinary person whose aesthetic attraction is only towards the feminine side of things 😅 I think you probably nailed it with that train of thought, pretty much. That, and the F/F ships at the time seeming like uncomfortable eye candy for men which icked me 😬
Never forget me commenting on a tiktok about how I went to dashcon (as my first convention) and actually enjoyed it and I had to delete it because everyone jumped down my throat saying I was insensitive to those who had a terrible time :,) Brother I was a extremely sheltered CHILD
@@johnsmith2875her video forced him to kinshift into vriska homestuck, so to get revenge the croaker brotherhood went to war on strange in the astral plane, killing her and replacing her with a muppet
@@stellasdoesstuffMy partner is very upset that he chose Vriska as it is unrealistic to his character, a known misogynist. I believe that it is actually secret character development.
@@catgod6531 the thing is he's still a misogynist as vriska, and being a misogynist is part of why he hates kinning vriska and hates strange for "forcing" him to kin vriska . That being said, I've noticed a few croaker posts that suggest he may be a very closeted and self-hating trans woman. Search "#oh well. it must be the joker." on his blog and two of these posts should pop up
Just gonna say, as a straight dude, Sam and Dean Winchester are definitely conventionally hot. The CW seems to only hire models for their lead actors. Vampire Diaries, Supernatural, The Originals, Smallville, etc. everyone including the women tended to be exceptionally attractive. Tom Welling, Ian Somerhalder, Daniel Gillies, Stephen Amell, Nina Dobrev, Claire Holt, Laura Vandervoort, Willa Holland, Katherine McNamara list goes on. The casts of Sherlock and Doctor Who are considerably more average looking, but Benedict Cumberbatch and Matt Smith have their devotees
Yeah US television is much more focused on having conventionally hot actors than UK television is. Never watched Supernatural but the tall guy is gorgeous, definite underwear model type. But it makes sense that tumblr type girlies often prefer the weird-cute actors.
I’ll be honest I don’t get it, but I’ve seen the Destiel news meme and the stupid wig so many times maybe I just can’t imagine them as attractive anymore. Then again I think I’ve found about 5 men attractive in general so I’m not an expert here.
Okay, so I communed with the spirit of my 14 year old self and would like to offer some perspective on why I think superwholock was a thing! All 3 of these shows have a very "episodic" quality to them centering around "cases." the Doctor arrives to a new setting, there is a problem or mystery he must resolve; Sam and Dean arrive at a new setting, problem or mystery they must resolve; Sherlock gets prompted to look into a mystery he must resolve. While there are overarching storylines, some of the shows' best material is actually in their one-off cases (imo, subjective opinion lol). In a way, they're all just different forms of investigators which makes crossover scenarios really easy to envision. To add, I get how superwho colliding w/ the Sherlock universe seems reality breaking BUT the Doctor is an interdimensional time traveler; you could bring him into any universe you want. Sherlock would honestly be easy since they're both UK shows and the Doctor is a frequent visitor of modern day England. And supernatural is largely confined to the US w/ monsters being a hidden underworld that no one would know about. I'm willing to bet that there is Sherlock Holmes media that has him encounter the paranormal so it's not much of a stretch to imagine, and it's a fun exercise in "what would the logical skeptic do when confronted w/ evidence of magic?" Anyway, all this is to say that in addition to these shows currently airing at the same time right as Tumblr culture was really solidifying, I think this is why fangirls liked to mash them up. I was primarily a supernatural girlie but did follow Sherlock up to episode 1 of s3 and the early RTD Era of nu-who. This is just my analysis in addition to the meta reasons for the creation of a joint Fandom! (Addendum: I really cannot believe we used to willingly use a webbed site that made long reblog chains essentially unreadable... ah, good times /j)
Lumping Who in with Sherlock and Supernatural in saying it doesn’t have well written female characters breaks my heart. Sarah Jane, Martha, Donna, River (sometimes), the Master (Gomez), Bill Potts?!? Not well written!?! Seriously
@@molly21w He's "univquitous" because Hbomberguy has one of the worst fanbases on the internet who spam him everywhere. Every time Harris makes a video, his subreddit mods have to repeatedly tell his fans to stop sending death and r@p3 threats to people.
also an unknown corner of the superwholock fandom is a thing I like to call Pinterest Piracy, my friends in middle school were FULL ON superwholockians with absolutely zero tumblr access, we got our gif juice through PINTEREST of all places. I didnt get too much of it bc I was the token anime kid (which also had the fandom soup thing of being into the concept of anime as opposed to any specific anime) but I watched just enough of all three superwholock shows to be Burdened with Knowledge
It is really if you look at majority, but this was the time when Matt smith was the doctor on air and when the show suddenly blew up worldwide due to teenage girls in America finding smith hot, and the best and worst doctor at any given point is the current one lol
I know very little about the Supernatural side of it, but I definitely think Harry's Sherlock vid was the final nail in the coffin for the fandom. Series three was the mass exodus, series four crushed the few hopefuls, but Harry's "Sherlock is Garbage and Here is Why" vid blew up on my corner of tumblr and really solidified the scorn we'd all started to have for the show.
the fact that sherlock and supernatural spent actual money from their budget to shoot those scenes making fun of the people who made their shows so popular is just. wow
@@joseaguilar3323it’s like insulting your waiter. Those fans are funding the show by watching. If you disrespect a waiter, they might spit in your food. If you make fun of your OWN fanbase, they’re gonna leave your show behind
Damn there's another famdom that got really out of control. I just started re-watching Glee and also found out that OTT fans were so obsessed with wanting Chris Colfer and Darren Criss to date in real life they tried to sabotage the actors real life relationships. Stuff like threats, creating fake accounts of Chris' boyfriend to make it look like he was cheating, sending people boxes of hair. What was up with overzealous fan girls in the early 2010s.
@@pajamaparty01 unfortunately there are still crazed fangirls, cf the letter from the 30yo to Chris Evans when he and his now wife went public as a couple
Worth mentioning that tumblr's most recent, rather heated shipping popularity poll saw Destiel get dethroned. The gundam lesbians absolutely trounced it in the finals.
@@Edgeworth99 The guy underneath you, ville__ posted the exact same pro-normalizing altar boy shenanigans post that I already reported on a completely different video. I think they're a bot, but I don't have the energy to get them blocked rn
you forgot to mention how most of the user base also hated when they changed how posts looked so longer reblog chains no longer became impossible to read
i remember joining tumblr in like early-mid 2016 after the redesign and being confused and disappointed why the posts didn't look like the pinterest screenshots
I haven’t seen the super or lock, but I’ve seen all the who, and there are absolutely amazing female characters in Dr who. Amy was an interesting character with a complex important background, and River Song existing and dropping clues while on a backwards timeline was always engaging, unique, and fun. You also have the female companions from old seasons returning for guest features and carrying whole episodes. Martha erasure. I love Martha jones.
Sorry for the incel Reddit rant , but as a lesbian who grew up on Dr who I can’t take the slander 😭😭 Dr who is messy and a lot of things but it’s definitely not misogynistic, objectifying, or dumbing female characters down.
Agreed! Martha Jones is my all time fave companion and i'd argue, one of the best female characters from that era of television. DW has its own problems but its definitely better than sherlock and supernatural when it comes to meaningful and well loved female characters.
I love Martha Jones but the women from the Moffat's era all suffer from being written by Moffat. Verilybitchie has a good video about some of his writing women problems.
I’m still not over how I consumed and loved the supernatural fandom content and then tried to watch the real thing only to be severely disappointed on what was on tv 💀💀💀💀
I was sure SuperWhoLock was just being a fan of all three. Hearing that people tried to combine the three, which can't be combined, is so Tumblr. It almost couldn't have come from anywhere else.
despite never watching the show Sherlock, I always thought Sherlock and Doctor Who would have been the easiest to cross over since at the time they were showrunner by the same guy
I came here to mention this! Rise of the Brave Tangled Dragons (later changed to Rise of the Brave Frozen Tangled Dragons when Frozen came out and was added to the mix). I was super into that in the early early days.
Still mad this Jack Frost is the most boring representative. First time I've heard of Elsa X Jack Frost, I thought it was a MegaTen crossover, and you can guess how disappointed I was when I checked up. Anyway, my take is that those crossovers should come back and be even weirder.
i know "rise of the brave tangled dragons" (rise of the guardians, brave, tangled, how to train your dragon) was another fandom smash that happened around the same time in dreamworks and disney animation. definitely never got as big as superwholock but i VIVIDLY remember those gifsets.
That clip of Jensen Ackles and the crowd at the panel made my whole body cringe. The second hand embarrassment is absolutely horrible. I can't imagine how that lady asking the question felt.
Cringe is dead. That was something that helped you traverse part of your life. ...Besides there's plenty of worse things with worse conventions you could have been at! You're doing great!
my theory is that there is a spectrum of fandom-able works, from "so bad no one watched it" to "perfect media no notes" - both ends of the spectrum get little fandom interaction, but the more a work falls to the middle the more compelling parts of a potential whole. moffat may not have made masterpieces, nor totally ruin established franchises, but he did give us some cool new action figures to play with
And the JohnLock Shippers were doing the same with Sherlock. And those were the sane ones. The worst ones were sending death threats to Martin Freeman's wife for being cast as Watson's wife (he was married in the books) and tried to break them up so he could be with Benedict
it's still crazy to me that doctor who was included in this grouping of fandoms when it started in the 1960's and was inevitably going to outlive both other shows lol
Supernatural tried its fucking damndest though, it lasted 15 seasons and I think they’re still making spinoffs. The original showrunner went off to make The Boys too.
You say that, but theres talk about a supernatural revival and 16th season and one of the actors is actively pushing for it supernatural is like a cockroach. it might go into hiding for a bit but you cant kill it
I do think it's interesting how people see superwholock as this "crazy rabid fan base" that happened in the past, but I honestly think it formed the way fandoms act now and isn't far off from fandoms of today. Like look at TikTok comments of literally any male celebrity or fandom. But if you compared the way TikTok comments act to 2010's Tumblr? They'd call you insane.
it’s like the dream smp fandom when it was in its peak, around 2020-2021. shit is so fucking wild. the content (in my humble opinion) is absolutely great, but the fandom is so weird and parasocial, and honestly it can be very draining at times.
Im not like a Fandom PhD or anything but as half inside, half outside observer it seems to me stuff like RPF boundry crossing has gotten worse and noticeably so. You can track the escalation of wincest to One Direction-ers leaving inappropriate comments in Louis Tommlinson's child social media and publishing reworded fanfic, to hockey players getting lewd things shouted at in their games
as someone who was an active member of the MHA fandom back in 2020, things have not changed at all, except for the platform on which the fandom misbehavior occurs. Shipping is just as toxic now as it was 10 years ago
To a lesser extent, there was the Frozen, Brave, How to Train your Dragon and Rise of the Guardians fandom. Elsa, Merida, Hiccup and Jack Frost all hanging out. Closest thing to SuperWhoLock I've seen. Also, yay, Baby Man in Blankie!
One thing that added to the fandom dying around 2014 is the big yahoo buyout of tumblr. That caused a massive decline in tumblr in general but especially in fandoms that revovled around shipping who tended to have more sexually explicit content and were upset of the new path that yahoo seemed to be taking tumblr to. I remember the massive blog deletion that happened following yahoo's "we want tumblr to be family friendly" post
I ran a sketch comedy show in college. The script we used for auditions mentioned SuperWhoLock, and the underclassmen always stumbled over it and didn’t know what it was. The next generation will never understand 😢
This video just about brought me to hysterics. Getting flashbanged with superwholock posts and raw 2012 tumblr. And then bingus walks in with his little blanket for cuddles. I’m on the ground. I’m chewing glass. I can’t see.
As a gay teen, I definitely found Jensen Ackles conventionally attractive. But I think that was part of what attracted me to Destiel - Dean looked like the kind of guy who would at the very least bully gay people, but was constantly put in queercoded moments with Castiel. It was absolutely queerbaiting, and I think a lot of us knew it was queerbaiting, but as a lonely gay college student into SFF, and who really didn't relate to the gay characters on shows like Glee or whatever stereotypical gay profession Bravo was doing this week, I was eating it up. At least they were getting romantic moments, which is more than I can say about 3/4 of the gay characters in mass-media SFF at the time. It seemed like there were two options: queer-coded, queerbaited moments between two characters you knew would never be canon, or you got the Informed Homosexual trope, where a character was canonically gay (generally informing the viewer directly, hence the name of the trope) but it was never otherwise addressed or made relevant (Agent Jinks on Warehouse 13 or Vince on Eureka).
i'd just like to add that lately, jensen ackles has been far more open to queer readings of dean and cas's relationship than in previous years- the reason he was making that expression in the confession scene was not because he was 'holding back a slur' as a lot of people seem to think, but actually because he was imagining the times they'd spent together (when he first met cas in the barn, etc.) also, he and misha collins recently did a panel that opened up with a destiel montage, and jensen said that 'it wasn't subtext, it was clear text' so. yknow 4 years later and we're finally getting somewhere
Its also that since the searies ended fandom harrasment ended. I think being shipped irl must be super exhausting. Yes maybe he could have worded annoyence differently, but if you and your friend (both happily married) are shipped irl (not as characters but also as people) and people making conspiracies that theyre dating irl and then asked if your character is bi you may get annoyed if youre used to people shipping you with your friends. He was kinda rude and audience booed ( i dunno why they booed since people ship Destiel) but maybe he was annoyed that first question already sounds like smb is asking about the ship (especially if its been going for years)
@@Whimorbood I do think any analysis of the spn-fandom relation is not entierly complete without the aknwoledgment that certains where VERY weird towards the actors. And like, yeah, the show's writting didnt help matters, nor did some of the interations initiated by the creators themselves - Misha Collins Im looking at you! - but when weird, creepy anons online are sending you porn and harrasing your wife, its understandable some nerves might be fried
@@emiliobustamante2401 i posted a similar comment under this video "i mean i kinda get why Jensen was annoyed with people shipping him in the searies because it would bleed into real life (same with Martin Freemans wife playing Mary his inshow wife people were sending her deaththreats because she was in their mind sabotaging Johnlock ship i think?) like yeah people can be tolerant but still be uncomfortable with being shipped with their costar for years and years. Its a very long searies and people are shipping him (a married man) with another married man and sometimes i feel like (expecially the fact that it gets out of fandom into public spaces) people start blurring the line between them shipping Destiel and them shipping Jensen and Misha who are real people and not fictional characters. Its giving "oh so when are you getting married" comment from some aunt that sees you have a friend and already sees you two getting married. Showing an actor a NSFW fanart may make them uncomfortable. Which isnt homophobic or biphobic itself. Those are their faces after all and putting them in these positions is strange to me (expecially if the fandom does this thing where they ship actors in the fic and not characters) i dont think its much better than AI generated porn of people who never consented to be put in situation like that and sharing it. (im not saying dont draw fanarts or write fanfictions but showing it to actors is like bordering on parasocial? you dont know that person and they dont know you, you wouldnt show a nsfw drawing of a person on a bus and show it to them its weird, there is a difference between public figures and private citizens of course but still just a comparison) Someone may not feel comfortable expecially the way Supernatural fans were so obsessed about main cast making rounchy fanarts or fanfics and showing them to the actors (which happens in other fandoms too i think its just weird and may make someone uncomfortable expecially because on screen sex is fake and is meant to only look like that) and saying that they had sex or speculating sometimes with them. I DONT THINK they shouldve booed the bi person and asking if the character is bi is absolutely valid, but i get the annoyance expecially how the fandom can be very offputting. Asking about characters sexuality isnt off limits but people doing that for years and speculating about your own sexuality can be uncomfortable. I havent watched all cast interviews tho but watched enough to see how ppl act even in other fandoms."
@@Whimorboodyeah, I’ve seen entire Tumblr threads dedicated to bullying the Supernatural leads’ children, even, never mind their poor wives, because the children existing were a threat to the ships, somehow, I guess? Bullying someone’s actual irl partner because you want to smash two actors together like Ken dolls is already weird and creepy enough, but seeing people rip into these actual toddlers made *me* not want to interact with the Supernatural fandom, so I can fully appreciate that having all that posted about your family online, with the justification of “I want those two to fuck irl”, and then constantly being asked about it in panels too would have gotten infuriating. Very “this is why we can’t have nice things”.
it feels kind of like doctor who aged the best out of the three shows? but this might just be because there's so much of it. idk. it's got a higher ratio of Actual Gay Kisses that Actually Happened within the show when compared to supernatural & sherlock if that means anything at all
@@ghostmoth-g9t Yeah, Doctor Who had a bit of a slump for a few years there, but they still had the occasional banger episode, and the new season is pretty good on the whole.
I feel like the fact that Doctor Who was on air before the two other shows were created and was still on air when the two other shows ended definitely helps with the feeling of distance from Sherlock and Supernatural.
Definitely not the same, but in like 2017 there was definitely a joint fandom space with Hamilton, Heathers, Be More Chill, Dear Evan Hansen, etc. That was my middle school experience lol
I definitely know what youe talking about but I would iike to add that at least from my perspective, the creators of those shows where either much more kind or even just indifferent to the fandoms. Maybe it was because it was in later years, or theater is just such a different space than tv production
@@ampix4669 the current Doctor is heckin' gay. Has no romantic vibes with his companion at all but last week's episode introduced a less creepy Captain Jack type that he immediately fell for. (the Doctor before him was Fourteen played by David Tennant again! Seperate incarnation, not Ten again, the returning face was a plot point)
the funniest thing to me about doctor who losing peoples interest in peter capaldi's era on tumblr is that genuinely i think that era of the show was like 10x queerer than the matt smith seasons?? like they first started floating time lords messing with gender in peter capalidi's run probably because they already knew the next doctor would be a woman, like we see time lords jumping genders, the doctor explicitly states he had a crush on the master at a time that they were both men - while making sure the audience got that he didn't really put much stock in the concept of gender which makes time lords pretty inherently queer?, he says all of this to his companion that is canonically a lesbian and leaves the show when she becomes an immortal puddle travelling around as a puddle with her puddle girlfriend (goals) . even before that clara is also canonically bisexual (even if they do a poor job at showing it - its still a moffat show ya know). like i feel like if people actually looked at that era they'd go oh hey! the queer stuff we were looking for before is kinda here? but they didnt which is a shame. i will defend peter capaldi's era as the doctor until my dying breath. clara oswald i love you you funky little morally ambiguous mess of a person, i rlly liked when you and the doctor started to become so codependent that you almost tore the universe apart that was awesome
I'm so glad you brought up the misogyny thing - I Honestly think part of the appeal of these fandoms WAS the Misogyny for the "not like other girls" crowd. A lot of them were pretty resentful towards the female characters in these franchises and adjacent ones, Sherlock fans were especially notorious for it. Part of it was seeing the women as just being "There" and getting in the way of their ships. It really bothered me at the time so much I even was going to do a big video essay about it that never materialised.
"Nothing like that has ever happened before and nothing like that has happened since." This is Rise of The Brave Tangled Dragons erasure and I will not stand for it
It’s interesting that the two seem to be so close in terms of time frames with each other (2010-2013 era). RtBTD at least has the connection of all being standalone animated movies that look kinda similar, so having those characters interact had some connective tissue. I’m also thinking about the Avengers fandom from 2012, now, which basically did the big fandom fusion directly in a way viewers hadn’t experienced before. Something in that early 2010s water made mass crossovers all the hotness.
i remember doing insane quotev quizzes with lengthy one-shot-esque results to tell me am i a doctor, a hunter or a genius and who my love interest was. also the roleplays. the fucking roleplays.
How DARE you say that teenagers did not want to get it on with Peter Capaldi because I can 100% guarantee we were out there fighting in the trenches on that front
i remember circa 2015 i went to a supernatural fan convention and a good amount of the people i talked to said they weren’t even watching the show anymore
God this gave me such cringe flashbacks hahaha One thing i need to point out though is that, fandom disinterest in women wasn't only due to bad writing but also like...outright misogyny and internalised misogyny in fandoms. People were really out there hating female characters for "getting in the way" of male ships. A male character could commit crimes and people would be like "Aw my poor little pookie baby" and a female character would be roasted to hell and bad for the crime of being annoying.
That's every fandom. A woman who is in a relationship with a man who is part of a popular gay ship... Especially a woman of color. Best case scenario, she gets forgotten, worst case you get people writing thousands of words about how the relationship is toxic actually.
anyways. nine was never really involved in superwholock, it was just matt smith and david tennant, i suppose because they were more quirky hot and young
@@risxra Tbf Nuwho season one (and two) are pretty rough on rewatch. When RTD returned to the show and started the series off with Space Babies I had a war flashback to the farting aliens.
Does anyone remember there was a person on RUclips who made EXTENSIVE video essays analysing every frame of Sherlock to prove johnlock was canon and deleted their channel after season 3 premiered?? I’m unconvinced I didn’t hallucinate it
Reminds me of the avatar fandom! My friend shipped Zutara hard, so she kept sending me videos of this one creator analysing frame by frame why its OBVIOUS that the creators were planting hints for Zutara. Why zutara was Canon. But I knew Katara was gonna end up with Aang because... main character? Of course he gets the girl. But idk, guess she thought those videos were gonna convince me. Seemed like a lot of cope to me lol
What I liked best about this fandom personally is that it was, to me, in a time before fandom was taken seriously, before creators listened to fandoms and who was "right" didn't matter. Sure, theres always fighting and shipwars, but as a teen on tumblr it didnt seem to even matter if you watched the show (this part specifically for supernatural) because the best parts of supernatural were what the show left underdeveloped. We could yell into the void and no one was listening but our fellow degenerates and that was GOOD.
I never realized it before but you’re right: Destiel on Tumblr was only my second seeing that it’s okay to be queer and out, with the first being Frikey on AO3 •war flashbacks•
Some of the greatest fandom experiences come from some of the worst source material. The "I can fix you" (or the more self-aware "I can make you worse") aspect makes for some of the best engagement with such.
Love the approach of this that emphasies the Intertextuality of fandom. I actually wrote my dissertation about it and it's a really cool phoemomenon. I also got to write"Moffat is a Cunt Biscuit" in that dissertation, which was neat
0:37 Not to disagree right out the gate, but there’s another fandom merge called the “Emo Trinity” from around the same time. Fans of Fall Out Boy, My Chemical Romance, and Panic! At the Disco (w/ Twenty One Pilots added later making it the “Emo Quartet”) were normally also fans of the other bands. And if you wanna widen the scope further, when you included other emo bands like BMTH, PTV, BVB, you were considered to be in the “Bandom”.
@@sasha-is-eepy they toured together occasionally and i think panic! and FOB were on the same label at one point, but MCR were definitely on the periphery of that circle. its absolutely criminal, imo, that bands like Thursday (whose lead singer literally produced their first album and is the reason frank joined the band) got left in the dust by this "emo trinity" nonsense in favour of bands that were musically very different
@@lordarthur2165 I don’t think they would be defined as an emo band, but a lot of emo kids liked them. Their songs share a lot of the same themes as songs from emo bands, especially on Blurryface.
When you got to the (fandom) get your (weapon) post I physically recoiled, even though I knew it was coming and that I def reblogged it back in the day
Use STRANGE to get 55% off your first month at Scentbird sbird.co/4bCtAUm
Hi yeah thanks for smacking me across the face with "how do you smell today" I choked on my water
Scentbird ceo is a cult leader 😬 sorry friend
You might want to look into scentbird. I know you don’t support several of the CEO’s stances. But I know you’ve already signed a contract. Don’t break it, and now I’m realizing you’ve probably been alerted to this already & can’t talk about it, but hope to hear from you soon that you’ve ended the relationship. She believes eye color is connected to spirituality and guess which eyes are most spiritual? 🔵🔵🔵 big shocker…we know what that actually means…
There's also the "Is Hi*ler evil? Not really" statement
I do wanna say yall, scent bird is freaking amazing. The perfumes say 1 month but u get them every month so they end up lasting closer to 3-4 months per perfume. The name brand ones are some that have up charges on them tho so be wary if ur joining just to get Chanel or Dior perfumes
I can't believe you didn't even mention the time Superwholock tried to absorb Hannibal and the Hannibal fandom gave a resounding "fuck no."
please tell me more i must know more
Wait, Hannibal is that old?!?!?
@@cargoliner24601 it premiered in 2013!
@@cargoliner24601 Hannibal is from the mid-10s, superwholock was pretty clearly on its way out by the time this happened.
@@sapphirethesapphic Unfortunately there's not that much more to tell, lol. A couple of posts went around of Superwholocks being like "omg we should adopt Hannibal fandom" (reasoning unclear) and others being like "OMG YES NEW LITTLE BROTHER" and then Hannibal fans getting on the post like "I would rather be fed a person than be part of whatever the fuck is going on over there" and that was more or less the end of that.
I keep on seeing "forced to be a teen in 2024" "born to be a teen in 2014" tiktoks on my fyp but they weren't in the tumblr trenches so they'll never understand
if they only knew the trauma
This is kind of unrelated but I think it’s funny that the one where they want to be, a teen in 2014, says ‘born to be a teen in 2014’, … even though,,, no,,, cause if you were born to be a teen in 2014, you would be a teen in 2014, that’s like the thing about being born at a specific time
like I know thats just the turn of phrase / format for those types of posts but I think it’s funny
also like who is forcing them to be be a teen in 2024? Their parents?
today’s youth are too feeble and would break under the pressure that was the text post format change of 2015
@@FallenDivaLabRat I don't think they'd survive a single second of davekat discourse
@@FallenDivaLabRat I don't think they'd survive a single second of davekat discourse
Repeating "white men in trench coats" in answer whenever Strange asks why these fandoms in particular got mashed together
LMAO REAL
First name Strange, last name Æons
@@thebaseandtriflingcreature174what you dontk now is that his real name is strange aeons
@ville__bot
and me, a lesbian, going "wait a second... did they think they were... hot???" lol
my hottest take about the queerbaiting in Supernatural and Sherlock is that I think the writers mostly intended it as 'funny' homophobia for their intended straight adult target audience to laugh at, but their surprise audience of queers and teens took it as hints of true feelings and representation. When there'd be a joke about John and Sherlock being mistaken for a couple or Dean being a fan of a hunky doctor in a tv show, the writers weren't hinting at endgames, they were trying to make you laugh. "These tough men looked kinda gay for a minute! Isn't that hilarious!" And then the people behind the shows had no idea how to deal with this very vocal audience they ended up with and kinda ended up fighting their own fandoms until they imploded.
I've always said this about those shows during that time. I truly think the queerbaiting started as "jokes/bits" that the male show runners probably either made with their friends or would have laughed at themselves, so expected their audience to also laugh at. The fact that so many actual queer people (and straight women who fetishized them) watched the show and took those moments seriously was a surprise they were not prepared for and clearly did not know how to handle. But I also feel that after a certain point, they knew where their bread was being buttered so it was easy to toss a queerbait bone every now and then to stay relevant with that very dedicated group of fans (while also getting to laugh at them).
As someone who grew up watching Friends and How I Met Your Mother, this was obvious even to teenage me. There were jokes about Chandler being gay and Phoebe and Lily thirsting over women but everyone knew these weren't hints at their endgame relationships. Sometimes Carol and Susan would show up and Barney had a gay brother so that was the gay representation box ticked off. Sherlock didn't do anything different to hint at Johnlock lol.
Sounds exactly like the kind of thing an out-of-touch, fully-normative writers' room would do.
Was it really queerbaiting, or were they just gay jokes that (possibly gay fetishists, among others ) took too seriously?
@@ghostinthecity Chandler was intended to be gay at the outset, but they chickened out or the network pressured them against it or something. Matt Baume has a video.
I distinctly remember thinking in high school, "wow my middle school interests were so cringe, good thing i like cool things now like superwholock i'll never be embarassed about this". and here we are now.
that’s incredibly funny
This actually made me laugh out loud, thank you 😂
I need to know what the hell you were into in middle school for science
My teen years are ending this year but I'm still a massive spn, dw and sherlock fan 😭
It was the my little pony friendship is magic to superwho(lock) pipeline for me.
(I never actually watched Sherlock, I didn’t have Hulu at the time)
the light going off when you said "eighth grade" was very approproate . evilest time of any queer neurodivergent persons life
yeah. yeah… it’s always specifically the eighth grade. the seventh also sucked though
It was 9th grade for me 😐😥 7th was pretty bad too. 8th was like the eye of the storm
True
6th grade was the worst for me, but 8th and 10th were bad too. 😂
can confirm
“RUclipsr explains something crazy while pointing a knife at a wall” is my favorite genre
I like how the camera is so low. Really feels like I'm sitting on the floor tied up being forced to listen to this at knife point 👍
james tulios vibes
@@kerricaine how did you read my mind
@@Methus3lah I'm not sure how many other RUclipsrs threaten their walls at knifepoint
I don't know if it counts but Ethan Becker threatens the viewers (the camera) with a knife while teaching them drawing tips.
The wincest "so few women characters they have to ship the bros" thing reminds me of parrots plucking their feathers out of stress/boredom or octopuses eating their own arms because their tank sucks. You GOTTA put more developed women in these shows or it's bad fandom husbandry!
Respect the octopus.
*"Aha, they can't mistreat me if I cease to exist!!"*
A well written and gender balanced show is needed for good fandom health. And salt balance.
it does have to be said that the show canonically made them soulmates and also called them "Psychotically, irrationally, erotically co-dependent" on television. The Normal Brothers.
“fandom husbandry” is genius holy shit
@@smartichokethey what
Making a conspiracy board on the wall and gesturing at it fervently with a knife is very former Sherlock fangirl coded behaviour
I love how on the "Fandoma grab your weapons post" that everyone else gets thier specific thing and supernatural just gets a shotgun.
It’s not even like salt to burn demons just… shotgun
Honestly, if I were a supernatural fan looking at that post at the time I'd be pretty jealous. What do you mean you get cool weapons and I get "gun" Also I'm laughing that the weapon of choice for Whovians is like the TARDIS, not a sonic Screwdriver (Which does make sense) or anything like that
When you misspoke and said Moffat wrote Supernatural I was suddenly plagued by hellish visions from which I will never recover
The Dark(er) Timeline
In Moffat's Supernatural, Charlie the lesbian is in love with Dean.
In Moffat's Supernatural, Castiel and Mary Winchester are a couple and he met her on an angel mission when she was an infant.
In Moffat's Supernatural, Sam is a Big Brain who always knows exactly what demon they're facing by name without having to research based on the flavour profile of the sulphur they leave behind and is unequivocably the Main Character.
In Moffat's Supernatural, Ruby was never the mastermind and was actually being manipulated by Crowley the whole time.
@@katharineeavan9705no no no STOP it makes TOO much sense for Moffat and I hate it😭😭😭😭
super hellish one might say
Look the show is bad but at least it's entertaining, Moffat could never
Honestly the fact that they accused Moffat of plagarizing their fanfics? Powermove. I take it all back Superwholock is based actually bring it back.
Moffat is good as a one off episode writer, bad as a show runner. But ohhhhh look at all the nepotism! His wife and MIL are producers at the BBC WHAT A COINKIDINK!
@@dirtbagdeacon Moffat's a rare case of a writer actually getting better once his shows stopped being popular and he started on his midlife crisis arch. Genuinely the MOMENT Sherlock crashed and burned and Doctor Who's ratings dropped off a cliff he started actually making decent DW again (s9 and 10).
@@TheBridgieShow Its genuinely wild how true this is
I watched Capaldi's last season years after it had aired because I'd just gotten so tired of all the Moffatt stuff
That last season was genuinely one of the best seasons of Doctor Who, just, genuinely amazing stuff. No BS, no trying to outsmart the audience. Just good characters, good stories to support them. meaningful arcs...it was like, where the hell had this been hiding?!
@@TheBridgieShowseriously, it's my favorite show. Have seen every surviving episode since 1963. I skip the vast majority of Matt's run, but I think Capaldi is the height of the show.
How does s9 and 10 compare to s1/Nine? I’m intrigued.
It is very funny to me that Superwholock basically spanned the entirety of Sherlock's time on air but it's just a mere blip in the lifespan of Doctor Who. One day when the sun is dying they will still be making Doctor Who episodes and no one will remember what Superwholock was, and that is when we will know peace.
That's on brand with Doctor Who, honestly.
Sherlock and Supernatural relentlessly queerbaited through their whole runs while Doctor Who had Nine kiss Jack Harkness literally his first series back. Doctor Who is now the last one standing. Coincidence? I think not.
@@nomisunrider6472 Also, Sherlock is one of many adaptations of the character, which most likely will only be remebered for that fandom.
Meanwhile, the original Doctor Who was one of the bases for modern fandom. It's a bit meta if you think about it.
And Supernatural... it contributed to November 5th.
@@nomisunrider6472 and Doctor Who will continue to have canonically queer characters until the day the universe ends
@@catvicddlm1884well since there are many adaptations maybe sometime in the future there sill be a new Sherlock and new teens will bring wholocke back, combining it with BTS or whatever kids nowadays are into
I love the montage of edited kisses with the very real Ninth Doctor/Captain Harkness kiss just dropped in there
I literally laughed out loud because one of those was not photoshopped or drawn.
The knife really adds to the immersion that im being held captive and my kidnapper has adhd and just has to tell me about their niche interests,i applaud you
the only way I actually want to learn anything
"SuperWhoLock exposure at a young age" is an absolutely insane sentence
slightly more damaging than radiation exposure at a young age
@@texasred8424 holy shit Texas Red
🍳 this is your brain on Superwholock
Made me think of the whole thing where Amy Pond's daughter essentially is a Time Lord herself because of being conceived aboard the TARDIS while it was in transit. I think they actually mentioned "made-up-word exposure" while discussing it.
y'all think you've written a bad crossover? you have NOTHING on me and my friend's SHERLOCK AND WARRIOR CATS crossover fanfiction
i want to read that SO BADLY
????????? I took psychic damage reading that 😵
I love literature (I wanna read it so bad)
Oh girl that is absolutely something my friend and I would've pulled in middle school
Do you remember their Warrior names, I must know this
The amount of people who are like "these three fandoms are the new superwholock" and I'm like... no, they aren't. they really aren't.
And the never will be
Honestly, I don't think any shows can be again. TV has changed so much that fandoms can't survive year round like they used to. (RIP 22 episode seasons)
I do think the OurGoodShadows (our flag means death, good omens, and what we do in the shadows) fandoms kindaaaa mimic superwholock. They're linked by Taika Waititi the same way the ogs were linked by Moffat. That being said, the fandom insanity is nowhere near the same level
@@agstars258 see, the problem is that they're good and have legit queer rep
@@agstars258 It helps each has canon m/m relationships.
"Gleeks, grab your slushies" felt like a shot to the head. That's one subculture I rarely see people talk about, despite it being basically one of the main fandoms I saw constantly entrenched in discourse (which was also actually queer!) at the time.
similarly the Les Mis fandom really came and went, didn't it
@@newcamomile Hey, we are still there crying every June. But yeah, it went back to being a normal size fandom.
No idea about Glee, not even the people I know IRL who were into it talk about it now.
"No one has ever done it since"
*Rise of the Brave Tangled Dragons enters the room*
**the Big Four crashes open the door**
Don't forget when Frozen got added to make it the Rise of the Brave Tangled Frozen Dragons.
I really feel like Rise of the Brave Tangled Dragons was the heterosexual version of SuperWhoLock
14:42 "I rolled up to eighth grade" and then half the lights shut off, showing just how evil and dire the situation of eighth grade was
Man the Jensen Ackles homophobia situation really shows how common casual homophobia still was just 10 years back. The audience is already gearing up for booing when all she's said is she's bi, her question could've been anything and they would've probably booed just because of that.
Yup, we've come a long way.
That literally made me so angry I had to pause the video. That poor girl. She apologized thinking being bisexual is disrespectful? And to be demeaned by a grown ass man who you idolize in front of a crowd of people??? Fuck that guy honestly
That made me sad. Like come on.
I graduated high school in 2013, & I vividly remember the boys who bullied me for shaving my legs in middle school doing the Day of Silence in our junior/senior year. I truly don't know how to express how rapidly things shifted here in the states.
coming from the SPN fandom: it wasnt entirely homophobia that got her booed. It's the fact she decided to take her headcanon IRL with the actors in front of an entire auditorium.
There had already been several other past issues at cons of hardcore destiel-ers fully acting out IRL at cons (a few had to legit be banned), and at the point of this clip, regular attendees were sick of the discourse bc all it did was create controversy where it wasn't needed.
That question should be saved for a private m&g, not put the actors on the spot in front of hundreds. Or (IMO) arguably shouldnt be asked at all as it's incredibly boundary-crossing of that invisible line where maybe your specific personal thoughts dont need to be validated by actors just doing a job.
the fact that that girls question started with her saying SHES bi is so fucking heart breaking
Literally, my heart absolutely broke for her when the crowd started booing her and JA said "don't ruin it for us all" like damn
Neil Gaiman has such a good response to this "I am not the arbiter of headcanons, you are allowed to interpret my work however you want" (paraphrasing, but that's always the sentiment) instead of shutting down the people who love your work enough that they want to explore the work in such a deep way and mocking them for doing so
No, the saddest part is her quickly saying she didn’t mean to offend him by deeming him bisexual-It went from “you suck for bringing your queer politics here” to “how dare you call the character bisexual? Disgusting!”
😬😬😬
the person near the camera going "ay, dios mio" in a clearly annoyed tone along with everyone else booing her actually made me want to explode
They’re not booing her sexuality, they’re booing her bringing internet nonsense to a real-world event. I hope she was able to know that and didn’t see it as a reflection on her identity. I’m bisexual and I’d have been annoyed, too.
Life was a strange experience as a kid who was only allowed to have Pinterest from 2013-2017 because I just got A LOT of out dated tumblr posts on Pinterest and allowed that to form my identity so I was like 2 years behind on all of it, living in my own little world.
Oh my god, same. I had huge pinterest boards full of superwholock gifsets and reposts from Tumblr
@@taniawania3008 Same thing with non-english speaking fans. We were two years behind on all of this in our own little bubble before we all learned English and went to the international spaces where stuff was up to date:D
Oooh, I had a v similar experience on Facebook, lol. I followed a bunch of Doctor Who meme pages and stuff and I think only got a Tumblr somewhere between 2014 and 2016, but even then, I used it a lot less
THIS WAS ME IN 2020 OH MY GOD
I had similar experiences on google images 😅
I've always wondered why BBC's Merlin wasn't included in 'SuperWhoLock'. It was quirky, starred a variety of generally attractive but quiky looking white men, and Merthur was an absolute success in fandom space.
But then again, it had well written female characters. And it ended in 2012.
it occasionally was, but it never fully got absorbed
It had (and still has) it's own thriving fandom and the show was already kinda over. What I want to know is... in the alternate history where Once Upon a Time had a male protagonist, would it be in the group?
one of the most well written crossover fics ive ever read was superwhomerlock!
@@raes6546 Despite considering myself a superwholock fan as a teen, I never 'got' Supernatural, so I never read crossover fics. I did try to write a crossover where I replaced Supernatural with the anime Death Note, though. That was an odd one.
(Also, you can't just bring up a fic without dropping the title 👀)
Ok, I get saying that Matt Smith or Benedict Cummerbund are not conventionally attractive and that was part of the appeal or whatever but Jensen Ackles was literally on Dawson's Creek and Smallville. Like he is the poster child of an actor who was hired for his looks. I'm not saying that to say he's bad actor I'm saying he very conventionally attractive, emphasis on the conventionally, there is not the slightest whiff of tumblr-sexyman-ness on this man. He looks like he used to beat up Matt Smith in high school.
Edited for spelling.
see this is why these guys are all not actual sexymen, they are like. some weird prototype. i don’t believe any Real Person can be a sexyman
i was thinking the same thing, and i have lesbian cred backing me up. dude looks like a ken doll
"Jensen Ackles looks like he used to beat up Matt Smith in high school" ... yes. that is. that is correct. i can never unrealise this-
lol Cummerbund
I think a lot of people back in the day didn't consider Jensen Ackles conventionally attractive because they wheren't aware of how tall Jared Padalecki actually is in real life. So they saw Jensen standing like a head-and-half bellow the guy playing the "nerdy" brother and thought "this guy is way too short to be conventionaly handsome". Nowadays we have more acceptance for short men, but back in 2011 Hollywood was forcing Tom Cruise to stand on a stool every time he had to film a scene next to a woman because it was unnaceptable for a hot guy to be bellow a certain height... that's just my theory, of course
I'm sorry I know there's more going on in this video but I can't move past that BABY BOY BROUGHT YOU HIS BLANKIE???
IKR
Baby wanted to cuddle NOW and he was ready to take the steps to ensure mom would know that 😭
AND HER HOLDING HIM THE REST OF THE TIME?! HIS LITTLE FACE OF CONTENTMENT?! IM CRY, HE IS TOO GOOD!!
He's such a good Boi ❤
Baby boy wanted to cuddle with his mama…
"don't ruin it for everyone" jensen's homophobic glare is killing me 😭 that poor girl
getting shot down like that then boo'd is INSANE I feel so bad for her omg
Right?? My heart broke for the fact that she felt like seeing hersef in a character could be disrespectful because of her identity. I even feel like jared felt bad based on his reaction time and tone when he said "no.." but jensen shut that down. So sad i hope that persons doing well
Imagine watching a show where the characters intentionally make references to one of the main characters being into both men and women, show him flirt with both men and women, throw sneaky gay culture references, have the character’s brother say lines that seem to have him be aware that said main character is into both men and women, then tease a mlm ship for the majority of the shows length - and then have the people who made this show you adore mock you for thinking that character is bisexual. That is so disrespectful to your fans, to bisexual people, and to media literacy. It shattered my heart seeing her go through that, especially so young. And the fact that some people still act like she had it coming for -checks notes- thanking creators she admired for representing her marginalized community, is just wild
the girl herself came forward afterwards and said it seemed from her perspective like that part was actually directed at the audience in general after the booing and he more seemed like he wanted to bury it to stop all the inter-fan unpleasantness. IDK if that's really what he meant, but she said she didn't feel like he was telling her off specifically as that he was refusing to engage with potential shipping discourse because (as shown by the booing) things could get very ugly if actors or con staff were seen to be taking one side or another by allowing it. If I remember rightly, he also recognised her at the signings or something and was perfectly nice to her about it all.
Don't get me wrong, he was absolutely never going to answer that question, and fans routinely got told by convention staff that they straight up weren't allowed to ask questions about Destiel even AFTER the canonical love confession, but going off other fan interactions and panels he probably would have just played it off with a slightly mocking joke and/or an uncomfortable "well he definitely isn't bisexual and you're seeing subtext that isn't there because you're crazy, but if it makes you happy to think so then whatever" type of response.
like she walked up, came out as bisexual, and started getting booed before she could ask her (valid) question???? goddamn
When I was a teenager, I was only into M/M ships. The reason for this was because F/M het relationships made me uncomfortably aware of the fact that I was growing up into an age where I could plausibly be in a relationship and that made me extremely unnerved. Idk if other ppl went thru this as well but I had a phase where I found that thinking of participating in sex acts made me viscerally disgusted for a while lmao
Oh man yes, I felt this! And then when I was 23 or something I realized that I am sex repulsed aroace. Being biologically female meant that it feels "safer" to ship M/M and specifically cis M/M because female bodies in sexual scenarios was straight up a "Nnnnnnnnnnnnnope bye" moment for me. Nowadays I don't feel as strongly repulsed (towards het ships), but het ships are still a pretty hard sell for me. Maybe because it can still feel so writing-checklist-mandatory-love-interest at times.
@@bamioayam eyyy fellow sex-repulsed aroace woman it's always nice to see my kin out there in the wild (also same, but I've gotten way comfier with F/F ships or stories nowadays since they're usually not written in this icky sexual way you know what I mean? like stories about women and their bodies and how they really are instead of this dominant man x submissive woman get pregnant bullshit)
I did not because I am dude, but I grew up in fandom circles where a lot of girls where like this and I didn't get what caused some to go into the "shipping Disney princesses with the princes or shoujou lead with the guy they preferred"-camp or the camp you described (and very few other camps that I could discern) and never had the guts to ask what motivated them. So if nothing else I thank you for providing some extra context to the draw of almost solely focusing on M/M shipping while female, I've got some reflection to do now.
@@theoture732eyyyy, fellow ace/aro woman who loves wlw or F/F stories and ships here too!
I used to be into M/M more than het in my late teens but before my late teens I was repulsed by almost EVERY relationship in media. I kind of blame kids cartoons in the 2000s really liked the stalker love interest trope where the guy protag is extremely not into it but basically I was only into the super healthy and fluffy relationships. I hated anyone even implying a man would come into my life too.
Then it was m/m storiee when I was discovering myself and then I found wlw finally where I got to see more relatable characters and situations to myself.
"Ohhhhh", I say, as I re-evaluate my confused feelings towards "why did I find M/F or F/F ships uncomfortable when M/M ships were fine, as a teen?" - As an aroace nonbinary person whose aesthetic attraction is only towards the feminine side of things 😅 I think you probably nailed it with that train of thought, pretty much. That, and the F/F ships at the time seeming like uncomfortable eye candy for men which icked me 😬
Never forget me commenting on a tiktok about how I went to dashcon (as my first convention) and actually enjoyed it and I had to delete it because everyone jumped down my throat saying I was insensitive to those who had a terrible time :,) Brother I was a extremely sheltered CHILD
Glad to see the muppet joker’s claims that you were killed on the astral plane and replaced with a muppet are untrue!
Did he react to her video 😞
@@johnsmith2875her video forced him to kinshift into vriska homestuck, so to get revenge the croaker brotherhood went to war on strange in the astral plane, killing her and replacing her with a muppet
@@stellasdoesstuffMy partner is very upset that he chose Vriska as it is unrealistic to his character, a known misogynist. I believe that it is actually secret character development.
@@catgod6531 the thing is he's still a misogynist as vriska, and being a misogynist is part of why he hates kinning vriska and hates strange for "forcing" him to kin vriska
.
That being said, I've noticed a few croaker posts that suggest he may be a very closeted and self-hating trans woman. Search "#oh well. it must be the joker." on his blog and two of these posts should pop up
the what. please tell me everything about this because this and the comments above sound suspiciously like evilmario666 lore
You said a fandom crossover like that hasn't happened since, but I present to you: rise of the brave tangled dragons.
YEAH lmao.. to be fair this did also happen largely around the time superwholock was booming so
our good shadows is a semi-popular one i believe (our flag means death, good omens and what we do in the shadows)
God I had forgotten about this, thank you for reminding me
@@lidaw.5145I don’t even think I’ve ever seen people with are into that fandom fusion even agree on what the name for it should be
and the occasional add in of frozen
Just gonna say, as a straight dude, Sam and Dean Winchester are definitely conventionally hot. The CW seems to only hire models for their lead actors. Vampire Diaries, Supernatural, The Originals, Smallville, etc. everyone including the women tended to be exceptionally attractive. Tom Welling, Ian Somerhalder, Daniel Gillies, Stephen Amell, Nina Dobrev, Claire Holt, Laura Vandervoort, Willa Holland, Katherine McNamara list goes on. The casts of Sherlock and Doctor Who are considerably more average looking, but Benedict Cumberbatch and Matt Smith have their devotees
Yeah US television is much more focused on having conventionally hot actors than UK television is. Never watched Supernatural but the tall guy is gorgeous, definite underwear model type. But it makes sense that tumblr type girlies often prefer the weird-cute actors.
David Tennant was considered hot also for sure just in in chalamet way
I’ll be honest I don’t get it, but I’ve seen the Destiel news meme and the stupid wig so many times maybe I just can’t imagine them as attractive anymore. Then again I think I’ve found about 5 men attractive in general so I’m not an expert here.
2010's tumblr girlies also simped over a fucking triangle so like, having thirsty fans does not necessarily mean one is attractive
Bi woman, Jensen is hot. Ignoring politics, he's a pretty guy.
Okay, so I communed with the spirit of my 14 year old self and would like to offer some perspective on why I think superwholock was a thing!
All 3 of these shows have a very "episodic" quality to them centering around "cases." the Doctor arrives to a new setting, there is a problem or mystery he must resolve; Sam and Dean arrive at a new setting, problem or mystery they must resolve; Sherlock gets prompted to look into a mystery he must resolve. While there are overarching storylines, some of the shows' best material is actually in their one-off cases (imo, subjective opinion lol). In a way, they're all just different forms of investigators which makes crossover scenarios really easy to envision.
To add, I get how superwho colliding w/ the Sherlock universe seems reality breaking BUT the Doctor is an interdimensional time traveler; you could bring him into any universe you want. Sherlock would honestly be easy since they're both UK shows and the Doctor is a frequent visitor of modern day England. And supernatural is largely confined to the US w/ monsters being a hidden underworld that no one would know about. I'm willing to bet that there is Sherlock Holmes media that has him encounter the paranormal so it's not much of a stretch to imagine, and it's a fun exercise in "what would the logical skeptic do when confronted w/ evidence of magic?"
Anyway, all this is to say that in addition to these shows currently airing at the same time right as Tumblr culture was really solidifying, I think this is why fangirls liked to mash them up. I was primarily a supernatural girlie but did follow Sherlock up to episode 1 of s3 and the early RTD Era of nu-who. This is just my analysis in addition to the meta reasons for the creation of a joint Fandom!
(Addendum: I really cannot believe we used to willingly use a webbed site that made long reblog chains essentially unreadable... ah, good times /j)
Not Martha getting passed over, one of the best Dr Who companions 😢
preach, I loved her!!
super underrated, for sure
Lumping Who in with Sherlock and Supernatural in saying it doesn’t have well written female characters breaks my heart. Sarah Jane, Martha, Donna, River (sometimes), the Master (Gomez), Bill Potts?!? Not well written!?! Seriously
a lot of people in the fandom qwhite interestingly HATED Martha, she deserved way better
seeing hbomberguy’s sherlock video pop up here is like walking into a restaurant and seeing an old friend dining right when you walk in.
YES!!!!
i swear he’s ubiquitous in youtube video essays
Only if that old friend was a serial harasser whose fanbase doxes the friends and families of everyone he makes videos about
@@molly21w He's "univquitous" because Hbomberguy has one of the worst fanbases on the internet who spam him everywhere. Every time Harris makes a video, his subreddit mods have to repeatedly tell his fans to stop sending death and r@p3 threats to people.
@@Abcdefg-tf7cu that's not his fault tho, he mentioned in multiple videos that he doesn't condone his fans going out and harassing anyone.
also an unknown corner of the superwholock fandom is a thing I like to call Pinterest Piracy, my friends in middle school were FULL ON superwholockians with absolutely zero tumblr access, we got our gif juice through PINTEREST of all places. I didnt get too much of it bc I was the token anime kid (which also had the fandom soup thing of being into the concept of anime as opposed to any specific anime) but I watched just enough of all three superwholock shows to be Burdened with Knowledge
This! This was me! I didn't have an actual Tumblr blog, but damn if I didn't get my prime content through Pinterest!
Searching “tumblr funny” on Pinterest was PEAK.
But eventually I made a Tumblr account to get it straight from the source.
I was a victim of Pinterest Piracy.
I still have a crush on Benedict Cumbersquatch to this day.
lmaooo me too, with screenshots from iFunny too 😭
@@chloestewart2842wishing you a fast recovery
i was always under the impression that David Tennant was the one the superwholock girlies liked, the more you know
It is really if you look at majority, but this was the time when Matt smith was the doctor on air and when the show suddenly blew up worldwide due to teenage girls in America finding smith hot, and the best and worst doctor at any given point is the current one lol
David Tennant is popular in other Tumblr ships
@@demetriam2408 Tennant and Michael Sheen get that now don't they, despite both being, if anything, slightly too heterosexual
Same, I thought the tumblr girlies hated Smith
he had too good a season to be liked by superwholock
I know very little about the Supernatural side of it, but I definitely think Harry's Sherlock vid was the final nail in the coffin for the fandom. Series three was the mass exodus, series four crushed the few hopefuls, but Harry's "Sherlock is Garbage and Here is Why" vid blew up on my corner of tumblr and really solidified the scorn we'd all started to have for the show.
Still can't believe that Nutella was part of that iconic tumblr fandom island map
For a while Nutella was a meme food like bacon. This is extremely cringe now but it was a pretty banal thing at the time.
the fact that sherlock and supernatural spent actual money from their budget to shoot those scenes making fun of the people who made their shows so popular is just. wow
supernatural did it MULTIPLE TIMES. every time they reference the "supernatural books" is just another dig at female and queer fans
@@planetaryray7119 dont forget the musical episode as well, just an excuse to make fun of fans and theatre nerds
@@mayarussell4763 unironically a great episode though. and I of course say this as a theatre nerd
I don't know how you can see anything abouy the tumblr fandoms and think that's something to be taken seriously
@@joseaguilar3323it’s like insulting your waiter. Those fans are funding the show by watching. If you disrespect a waiter, they might spit in your food. If you make fun of your OWN fanbase, they’re gonna leave your show behind
5:20 "Gleeks grab your slushies" will forever be ingrain in my brain
Damn there's another famdom that got really out of control. I just started re-watching Glee and also found out that OTT fans were so obsessed with wanting Chris Colfer and Darren Criss to date in real life they tried to sabotage the actors real life relationships. Stuff like threats, creating fake accounts of Chris' boyfriend to make it look like he was cheating, sending people boxes of hair. What was up with overzealous fan girls in the early 2010s.
@@pajamaparty01 unfortunately there are still crazed fangirls, cf the letter from the 30yo to Chris Evans when he and his now wife went public as a couple
Worth mentioning that tumblr's most recent, rather heated shipping popularity poll saw Destiel get dethroned. The gundam lesbians absolutely trounced it in the finals.
Wait, has yuri finally defeated BL?
@@beeaggro2593 anticapitalist yuri featuring giant robots, no less
@@Edgeworth99 The guy underneath you, ville__ posted the exact same pro-normalizing altar boy shenanigans post that I already reported on a completely different video.
I think they're a bot, but I don't have the energy to get them blocked rn
It's odd to think that supernatural is what indirectly got me into gundam
FUCK YEAH YURI
you forgot to mention how most of the user base also hated when they changed how posts looked so longer reblog chains no longer became impossible to read
i remember joining tumblr in like early-mid 2016 after the redesign and being confused and disappointed why the posts didn't look like the pinterest screenshots
I haven’t seen the super or lock, but I’ve seen all the who, and there are absolutely amazing female characters in Dr who. Amy was an interesting character with a complex important background, and River Song existing and dropping clues while on a backwards timeline was always engaging, unique, and fun. You also have the female companions from old seasons returning for guest features and carrying whole episodes. Martha erasure. I love Martha jones.
Sorry for the incel Reddit rant , but as a lesbian who grew up on Dr who I can’t take the slander 😭😭 Dr who is messy and a lot of things but it’s definitely not misogynistic, objectifying, or dumbing female characters down.
Agreed! Martha Jones is my all time fave companion and i'd argue, one of the best female characters from that era of television. DW has its own problems but its definitely better than sherlock and supernatural when it comes to meaningful and well loved female characters.
I love Martha Jones but the women from the Moffat's era all suffer from being written by Moffat. Verilybitchie has a good video about some of his writing women problems.
Martha sucked in her seasons because she was literally just "Rose but the crush is one-sided," but she got to be cool later on
“Steven Moffat cared more about tricking and outsmarting fans than making good storylines” omg he and Marlene King would get along perfectly 😅
them and jason rothenberg would make a horrifying screenwriting trio
J.J Abrams has a couple things to say too lmfao
All of these guys plus the Game Of Thrones showrunners are the blunt rotation of my nightmares. The SuperWhoLock of bad writing trying to seem smart.
The supernatural Winchester Brothers:
The bad one: Dean
The other bad one: Sam
as a still sort of supernatural fan this is the correct opinion
sadly the only correct answer
adam :(
@@static2735Adam from Bible?
@@static2735this made me laugh out loud thank you
Knowing dashcon and the release of the first two fnaf games happened in the same year feels like cursed knowledge
If dashcon happened like a month or two later there would have been a FNAF cosplay. And I think that's tragic
@@deadmeme9031 Tragic that it didn't happen or is that such a cursed idea that it almost happening is enough to be a tragedy?
@@therealjohnrenzi1817 both
it has to be related right?
@@deadmeme9031 We missed a chance to see people be attacked by Freddie Fazbear in the ball pit
I’m still not over how I consumed and loved the supernatural fandom content and then tried to watch the real thing only to be severely disappointed on what was on tv 💀💀💀💀
Are you saying you didn't like the show??!? Spn as a show is so good though 😭
@@luna-mo3ol I tried I’m sorry 😭😭
@@olivercetus6956 can I ask what you didn't like about it??
I was sure SuperWhoLock was just being a fan of all three. Hearing that people tried to combine the three, which can't be combined, is so Tumblr. It almost couldn't have come from anywhere else.
despite never watching the show Sherlock, I always thought Sherlock and Doctor Who would have been the easiest to cross over since at the time they were showrunner by the same guy
"we know how that went. it went to superhell" is gonna be added to my vocabulary thank you
Dr Who and Supernatural naturally coming together and then Sherlock forcing themselves in later is so typical lol
Don't forget the How to train your dragon, Tangled, Frozen, and whatever movie Jack Frost was from cross overs. That fandom was everywhere
I came here to mention this! Rise of the Brave Tangled Dragons (later changed to Rise of the Brave Frozen Tangled Dragons when Frozen came out and was added to the mix). I was super into that in the early early days.
Still mad this Jack Frost is the most boring representative.
First time I've heard of Elsa X Jack Frost, I thought it was a MegaTen crossover, and you can guess how disappointed I was when I checked up.
Anyway, my take is that those crossovers should come back and be even weirder.
That fandom had me in such a chokehold and I went to war over JackxRapunzel lol
RIGHT my first thought during the intro was "What about Rise of the Brave Tangled Dragons!!!"
I've never been in this fandom. Is the Brave referencing the Pixar movie brave? Like Merida?
i know "rise of the brave tangled dragons" (rise of the guardians, brave, tangled, how to train your dragon) was another fandom smash that happened around the same time in dreamworks and disney animation. definitely never got as big as superwholock but i VIVIDLY remember those gifsets.
love that bingus decided he needed some love in the middle and there he was
That clip of Jensen Ackles and the crowd at the panel made my whole body cringe. The second hand embarrassment is absolutely horrible. I can't imagine how that lady asking the question felt.
i find most fan panels with actors in general cringy af. but that was particularly awful
Cringe is dead. That was something that helped you traverse part of your life.
...Besides there's plenty of worse things with worse conventions you could have been at! You're doing great!
I left the room when that clip played in this video. It's so bad.
As someone who was DEEP into the sherlock fandom in early 2010s tumblr, this feels like being back at war
TRULY. the psychic damage this video dealt me is unspeakable
you do look like someone who would be into Sherlock as a teenager
this is so backhanded
@@phantomology13 it's not even backhanded, it's straight up reading her for filth (with love from another gremlin on Tumblr of course)
Top ten most devastating insults of this century
my theory is that there is a spectrum of fandom-able works, from "so bad no one watched it" to "perfect media no notes" - both ends of the spectrum get little fandom interaction, but the more a work falls to the middle the more compelling parts of a potential whole. moffat may not have made masterpieces, nor totally ruin established franchises, but he did give us some cool new action figures to play with
Ok but people legit were handing over their wincest fic to Jared and Jensen at conventions to sign…when online gets offline it’s like oh god no
And the JohnLock Shippers were doing the same with Sherlock. And those were the sane ones. The worst ones were sending death threats to Martin Freeman's wife for being cast as Watson's wife (he was married in the books) and tried to break them up so he could be with Benedict
it's still crazy to me that doctor who was included in this grouping of fandoms when it started in the 1960's and was inevitably going to outlive both other shows lol
Supernatural tried its fucking damndest though, it lasted 15 seasons and I think they’re still making spinoffs. The original showrunner went off to make The Boys too.
You say that, but theres talk about a supernatural revival and 16th season and one of the actors is actively pushing for it
supernatural is like a cockroach. it might go into hiding for a bit but you cant kill it
Sherlock Holmes has had obnoxious fans who hassled the author as far back as 1893
I do think it's interesting how people see superwholock as this "crazy rabid fan base" that happened in the past, but I honestly think it formed the way fandoms act now and isn't far off from fandoms of today. Like look at TikTok comments of literally any male celebrity or fandom. But if you compared the way TikTok comments act to 2010's Tumblr? They'd call you insane.
Absolutely.
it’s like the dream smp fandom when it was in its peak, around 2020-2021. shit is so fucking wild. the content (in my humble opinion) is absolutely great, but the fandom is so weird and parasocial, and honestly it can be very draining at times.
Real!! Like, it’s not like we were at all /normal/ about any of it, but we at least had a little restraint
Im not like a Fandom PhD or anything but as half inside, half outside observer it seems to me stuff like RPF boundry crossing has gotten worse and noticeably so. You can track the escalation of wincest to One Direction-ers leaving inappropriate comments in Louis Tommlinson's child social media and publishing reworded fanfic, to hockey players getting lewd things shouted at in their games
as someone who was an active member of the MHA fandom back in 2020, things have not changed at all, except for the platform on which the fandom misbehavior occurs. Shipping is just as toxic now as it was 10 years ago
STRANGE O'CLOCK
For a hot minute after seeing this comment I thought: "Oh yeah, because Benjamin Custardpatch played Dr. Strange."
The best time of day!
To a lesser extent, there was the Frozen, Brave, How to Train your Dragon and Rise of the Guardians fandom. Elsa, Merida, Hiccup and Jack Frost all hanging out. Closest thing to SuperWhoLock I've seen.
Also, yay, Baby Man in Blankie!
That cat walking up with his blankie and snuggling up for half the video is the cutest thing I've ever seen
There's no way this video is ONLY half an hour long. That's nowhere near enough time to delve into this insanity.
Right , i want a 2 hour video on this !!!
One thing that added to the fandom dying around 2014 is the big yahoo buyout of tumblr. That caused a massive decline in tumblr in general but especially in fandoms that revovled around shipping who tended to have more sexually explicit content and were upset of the new path that yahoo seemed to be taking tumblr to.
I remember the massive blog deletion that happened following yahoo's "we want tumblr to be family friendly" post
Strange, you don't seem to understand the power you have over Tumblr, this video could very well genuinely resuscitate the superwholock fandom
I’ll be honest, I’m tempted in an evil way
can we?
@@bellabelle8490 please no
@@bellabelle8490 dont put that evil on strange. dont make her responsible for it
It'd be funnier to do Fandomstuck instead pffft
dude that clip of jensen ackles awnsering that girl… and the crowd BOOING? I would kms I’m being so fr now
I ran a sketch comedy show in college. The script we used for auditions mentioned SuperWhoLock, and the underclassmen always stumbled over it and didn’t know what it was. The next generation will never understand 😢
This video just about brought me to hysterics. Getting flashbanged with superwholock posts and raw 2012 tumblr. And then bingus walks in with his little blanket for cuddles. I’m on the ground. I’m chewing glass. I can’t see.
As a gay teen, I definitely found Jensen Ackles conventionally attractive. But I think that was part of what attracted me to Destiel - Dean looked like the kind of guy who would at the very least bully gay people, but was constantly put in queercoded moments with Castiel. It was absolutely queerbaiting, and I think a lot of us knew it was queerbaiting, but as a lonely gay college student into SFF, and who really didn't relate to the gay characters on shows like Glee or whatever stereotypical gay profession Bravo was doing this week, I was eating it up. At least they were getting romantic moments, which is more than I can say about 3/4 of the gay characters in mass-media SFF at the time. It seemed like there were two options: queer-coded, queerbaited moments between two characters you knew would never be canon, or you got the Informed Homosexual trope, where a character was canonically gay (generally informing the viewer directly, hence the name of the trope) but it was never otherwise addressed or made relevant (Agent Jinks on Warehouse 13 or Vince on Eureka).
i'd just like to add that lately, jensen ackles has been far more open to queer readings of dean and cas's relationship than in previous years- the reason he was making that expression in the confession scene was not because he was 'holding back a slur' as a lot of people seem to think, but actually because he was imagining the times they'd spent together (when he first met cas in the barn, etc.)
also, he and misha collins recently did a panel that opened up with a destiel montage, and jensen said that 'it wasn't subtext, it was clear text'
so. yknow 4 years later and we're finally getting somewhere
Poor guy had an existential crisis in that moment.
Its also that since the searies ended fandom harrasment ended. I think being shipped irl must be super exhausting. Yes maybe he could have worded annoyence differently, but if you and your friend (both happily married) are shipped irl (not as characters but also as people) and people making conspiracies that theyre dating irl and then asked if your character is bi you may get annoyed if youre used to people shipping you with your friends. He was kinda rude and audience booed ( i dunno why they booed since people ship Destiel) but maybe he was annoyed that first question already sounds like smb is asking about the ship (especially if its been going for years)
@@Whimorbood I do think any analysis of the spn-fandom relation is not entierly complete without the aknwoledgment that certains where VERY weird towards the actors. And like, yeah, the show's writting didnt help matters, nor did some of the interations initiated by the creators themselves - Misha Collins Im looking at you! - but when weird, creepy anons online are sending you porn and harrasing your wife, its understandable some nerves might be fried
@@emiliobustamante2401 i posted a similar comment under this video
"i mean i kinda get why Jensen was annoyed with people shipping him in the searies because it would bleed into real life (same with Martin Freemans wife playing Mary his inshow wife people were sending her deaththreats because she was in their mind sabotaging Johnlock ship i think?) like yeah people can be tolerant but still be uncomfortable with being shipped with their costar for years and years.
Its a very long searies and people are shipping him (a married man) with another married man and sometimes i feel like (expecially the fact that it gets out of fandom into public spaces) people start blurring the line between them shipping Destiel and them shipping Jensen and Misha who are real people and not fictional characters. Its giving "oh so when are you getting married" comment from some aunt that sees you have a friend and already sees you two getting married.
Showing an actor a NSFW fanart may make them uncomfortable. Which isnt homophobic or biphobic itself. Those are their faces after all and putting them in these positions is strange to me (expecially if the fandom does this thing where they ship actors in the fic and not characters) i dont think its much better than AI generated porn of people who never consented to be put in situation like that and sharing it. (im not saying dont draw fanarts or write fanfictions but showing it to actors is like bordering on parasocial? you dont know that person and they dont know you, you wouldnt show a nsfw drawing of a person on a bus and show it to them its weird, there is a difference between public figures and private citizens of course but still just a comparison)
Someone may not feel comfortable expecially the way Supernatural fans were so obsessed about main cast making rounchy fanarts or fanfics and showing them to the actors (which happens in other fandoms too i think its just weird and may make someone uncomfortable expecially because on screen sex is fake and is meant to only look like that) and saying that they had sex or speculating sometimes with them.
I DONT THINK they shouldve booed the bi person and asking if the character is bi is absolutely valid, but i get the annoyance expecially how the fandom can be very offputting. Asking about characters sexuality isnt off limits but people doing that for years and speculating about your own sexuality can be uncomfortable.
I havent watched all cast interviews tho but watched enough to see how ppl act even in other fandoms."
@@Whimorboodyeah, I’ve seen entire Tumblr threads dedicated to bullying the Supernatural leads’ children, even, never mind their poor wives, because the children existing were a threat to the ships, somehow, I guess?
Bullying someone’s actual irl partner because you want to smash two actors together like Ken dolls is already weird and creepy enough, but seeing people rip into these actual toddlers made *me* not want to interact with the Supernatural fandom, so I can fully appreciate that having all that posted about your family online, with the justification of “I want those two to fuck irl”, and then constantly being asked about it in panels too would have gotten infuriating.
Very “this is why we can’t have nice things”.
My favorite thing is that in the compilation of gay kisses at 8:43, only the Doctor Who one is an actual screenshot from the show
the way I unironically reblogged the "fandoms, grab your ' '" post and thought "hell yeah" when I did it
I love how the dynamic is just "super natural and sherlock, fuck yeah. bros. homies. doctor who? also there"
dr who is always Also There i love dr who
that’s how i feel having not seen dr who.
it feels kind of like doctor who aged the best out of the three shows? but this might just be because there's so much of it. idk. it's got a higher ratio of Actual Gay Kisses that Actually Happened within the show when compared to supernatural & sherlock if that means anything at all
@@ghostmoth-g9t Yeah, Doctor Who had a bit of a slump for a few years there, but they still had the occasional banger episode, and the new season is pretty good on the whole.
I feel like the fact that Doctor Who was on air before the two other shows were created and was still on air when the two other shows ended definitely helps with the feeling of distance from Sherlock and Supernatural.
Definitely not the same, but in like 2017 there was definitely a joint fandom space with Hamilton, Heathers, Be More Chill, Dear Evan Hansen, etc. That was my middle school experience lol
Yeah I probably wouldn’t define it as the same thing, like you said. I see that more as gen z theater kid tumblr and less as a crossover of fandoms
I definitely know what youe talking about but I would iike to add that at least from my perspective, the creators of those shows where either much more kind or even just indifferent to the fandoms. Maybe it was because it was in later years, or theater is just such a different space than tv production
I WAS THERE AS A 10 YEAR OLD LURKER! oh my god the memories
lol same, i was a heathers fan and my friend was a hamilton fan and we forced each other to listen to the soundtracks
RIP superwholock tumblr, you would’ve loved ncuti gatwa’s gay doctor
so fr last week i was watching the new episode and i just kept thinking HAPPY PRIDE MONTH. HAPPY PRIDE MONTH
Or that morbius scene with Matt Smith
Wait what did I miss im like 2 doctors behind
@@ampix4669 the current Doctor is heckin' gay. Has no romantic vibes with his companion at all but last week's episode introduced a less creepy Captain Jack type that he immediately fell for.
(the Doctor before him was Fourteen played by David Tennant again! Seperate incarnation, not Ten again, the returning face was a plot point)
To be quite honest, I'm not sure us fans were mature enough at the time to have been able to handle him without things getting racist really fast...
the funniest thing to me about doctor who losing peoples interest in peter capaldi's era on tumblr is that genuinely i think that era of the show was like 10x queerer than the matt smith seasons?? like they first started floating time lords messing with gender in peter capalidi's run probably because they already knew the next doctor would be a woman, like we see time lords jumping genders, the doctor explicitly states he had a crush on the master at a time that they were both men - while making sure the audience got that he didn't really put much stock in the concept of gender which makes time lords pretty inherently queer?, he says all of this to his companion that is canonically a lesbian and leaves the show when she becomes an immortal puddle travelling around as a puddle with her puddle girlfriend (goals) . even before that clara is also canonically bisexual (even if they do a poor job at showing it - its still a moffat show ya know). like i feel like if people actually looked at that era they'd go oh hey! the queer stuff we were looking for before is kinda here? but they didnt which is a shame. i will defend peter capaldi's era as the doctor until my dying breath. clara oswald i love you you funky little morally ambiguous mess of a person, i rlly liked when you and the doctor started to become so codependent that you almost tore the universe apart that was awesome
I'm so glad you brought up the misogyny thing - I Honestly think part of the appeal of these fandoms WAS the Misogyny for the "not like other girls" crowd. A lot of them were pretty resentful towards the female characters in these franchises and adjacent ones, Sherlock fans were especially notorious for it. Part of it was seeing the women as just being "There" and getting in the way of their ships. It really bothered me at the time so much I even was going to do a big video essay about it that never materialised.
"Nothing like that has ever happened before and nothing like that has happened since." This is Rise of The Brave Tangled Dragons erasure and I will not stand for it
It’s interesting that the two seem to be so close in terms of time frames with each other (2010-2013 era). RtBTD at least has the connection of all being standalone animated movies that look kinda similar, so having those characters interact had some connective tissue. I’m also thinking about the Avengers fandom from 2012, now, which basically did the big fandom fusion directly in a way viewers hadn’t experienced before. Something in that early 2010s water made mass crossovers all the hotness.
“Have you ever wondered why I’m fucking like this? Superwholock exposure at a young age!” I’ve never felt more attacked in my life.
i remember doing insane quotev quizzes with lengthy one-shot-esque results to tell me am i a doctor, a hunter or a genius and who my love interest was. also the roleplays. the fucking roleplays.
your documentation of and commentary about c. 2011 tumblr culture is so validating and healing for my depressed teenage heart
How DARE you say that teenagers did not want to get it on with Peter Capaldi because I can 100% guarantee we were out there fighting in the trenches on that front
i remember circa 2015 i went to a supernatural fan convention and a good amount of the people i talked to said they weren’t even watching the show anymore
God this gave me such cringe flashbacks hahaha
One thing i need to point out though is that, fandom disinterest in women wasn't only due to bad writing but also like...outright misogyny and internalised misogyny in fandoms. People were really out there hating female characters for "getting in the way" of male ships. A male character could commit crimes and people would be like "Aw my poor little pookie baby" and a female character would be roasted to hell and bad for the crime of being annoying.
That's every fandom. A woman who is in a relationship with a man who is part of a popular gay ship... Especially a woman of color. Best case scenario, she gets forgotten, worst case you get people writing thousands of words about how the relationship is toxic actually.
unfortunately it still happens
@@Ceruleansquid-lo3iv That's every fandom for every ship or just for not being a little angel to the fandom's darlings.
Hearing the name Homestuck uttered out loud triggers my fight or flight instinct
Lol
Awww what a good cat, bringing his own blanket to cuddle with you!
22:23 I feel like this clip traumatized me and I wasn’t even there😅. Took me right back to dealing with bullies in middle school
loving the inclusion of the completely real ninejack kiss that happened on screen in doctor who in the compilation of ship edits
anyways. nine was never really involved in superwholock, it was just matt smith and david tennant, i suppose because they were more quirky hot and young
@@lis5731we all cried “don’t skip Nine!!!” And then we never talked about him. It was sad
@@risxra Tbf Nuwho season one (and two) are pretty rough on rewatch. When RTD returned to the show and started the series off with Space Babies I had a war flashback to the farting aliens.
@@toyotatacoma1616 farting aliens are good, actually
@toyotatocoma1616 excuse you, they are CALLED Raxacoricofallapatorians. Put some respect on their name!
Does anyone remember there was a person on RUclips who made EXTENSIVE video essays analysing every frame of Sherlock to prove johnlock was canon and deleted their channel after season 3 premiered?? I’m unconvinced I didn’t hallucinate it
Reminds me of the avatar fandom! My friend shipped Zutara hard, so she kept sending me videos of this one creator analysing frame by frame why its OBVIOUS that the creators were planting hints for Zutara. Why zutara was Canon.
But I knew Katara was gonna end up with Aang because... main character? Of course he gets the girl. But idk, guess she thought those videos were gonna convince me. Seemed like a lot of cope to me lol
The videos r still up!
Oh wait I'm thinking s4, probably a different person by bad :3
There was a Tumblr blog called The Loudest Subtext in Television that had a similar shtick
@@Kintsugi23 this might have been it actually
What I liked best about this fandom personally is that it was, to me, in a time before fandom was taken seriously, before creators listened to fandoms and who was "right" didn't matter. Sure, theres always fighting and shipwars, but as a teen on tumblr it didnt seem to even matter if you watched the show (this part specifically for supernatural) because the best parts of supernatural were what the show left underdeveloped. We could yell into the void and no one was listening but our fellow degenerates and that was GOOD.
I never realized it before but you’re right: Destiel on Tumblr was only my second seeing that it’s okay to be queer and out, with the first being Frikey on AO3 •war flashbacks•
Some of the greatest fandom experiences come from some of the worst source material. The "I can fix you" (or the more self-aware "I can make you worse") aspect makes for some of the best engagement with such.
Exhibit A: the Miraculous fandom
Love the approach of this that emphasies the Intertextuality of fandom. I actually wrote my dissertation about it and it's a really cool phoemomenon.
I also got to write"Moffat is a Cunt Biscuit" in that dissertation, which was neat
Can we read it?
@@everyonesfavoritesidechara3816I respectfully second this request
@@everyonesfavoritesidechara3816it was. So bad. One day I'll make it a worthy written paper,
I’m forever waiting for the day when Strange tries to explain Homestuck
It's gonna have to be an 8 hour video.
0:37 Not to disagree right out the gate, but there’s another fandom merge called the “Emo Trinity” from around the same time. Fans of Fall Out Boy, My Chemical Romance, and Panic! At the Disco (w/ Twenty One Pilots added later making it the “Emo Quartet”) were normally also fans of the other bands. And if you wanna widen the scope further, when you included other emo bands like BMTH, PTV, BVB, you were considered to be in the “Bandom”.
absolutely criminal that mcr got lumped in with 21 pilots 💀
as someone who only consistently listens to mcr, i do not understand how these bands got grouped together
@@sasha-is-eepy they toured together occasionally and i think panic! and FOB were on the same label at one point, but MCR were definitely on the periphery of that circle. its absolutely criminal, imo, that bands like Thursday (whose lead singer literally produced their first album and is the reason frank joined the band) got left in the dust by this "emo trinity" nonsense in favour of bands that were musically very different
No hate, but since when 21 pilots are a emo band?
@@lordarthur2165 I don’t think they would be defined as an emo band, but a lot of emo kids liked them. Their songs share a lot of the same themes as songs from emo bands, especially on Blurryface.
When you got to the (fandom) get your (weapon) post I physically recoiled, even though I knew it was coming and that I def reblogged it back in the day