I'm a Christian "Protester" Outside LDS General Conference
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- Опубликовано: 15 июл 2024
- I'm one of the so-called "protesters" who stands outside of the Mormon (LDS) General Conference. Here's why I'm out here.
Tens of thousands of Latter-day Saints stream into the LDS Conference Center at Temple Square to hear the Mormon Prophets and Apostles speak. And each conference, there are hosts of Christians standing outside trying to get Mormons to talk to them. Why are we out there? What's our goal? In this video, I interview a bunch of the Christians outside General Conference to better understand what their motivations are for being outside of conference.
A number of people believe that being outside of the conference center is disrespectful. I hope to explain why we think that these topics are too significant to let people go without warning them of the eternal danger which they're in. We aim to dignify meaningful conversations with Latter-day Saints-even amidst theological disagreement.
(This video was filmed at the April 2024 General Conference).
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#lds #generalconference #christian #comeuntochrist #ldsconf #ldschurch #theology #apologetics #christianity #godlovesmormons
@GLM thanks for the interview i was a little nervous about doing it from people i did not know but you did not edit anything in a way to misrepresent what i said thank you for that and God bless yall. Hope you see yall out there again some time!
I just love you guys. Every time I watch your videos I'm so encouraged. Soli Deo Gloria.
What a great video; I loved it. Thank you for your work and passion for Mormons.
I remember going often to Temple Square as a kid with my family, and there were "protesters". We were taught that they were bad and that we shouldn't to talk to them and to be afraid of them. I didn't realize they were so kind and really just cared a lot. Now I'm on their side, wanting Mormons to come to the true Jesus.
You don't know the true Jesus. You definitely don't follow his commandments. In the end you will know how lost you really are. And all because you are afraid to let go of your vices.
Chieftess, I'm sorry that you were taught the fears and prejudices of those above you! satan has decieved so many of us. I see that many different churches claiming Christ teach fear and prejudice, including the Evangelical church. All of us are sinners and make mistakes that is why self- honesty in humility is so important. Our loving Savior and Father will always help us grow to more knowledge and maturity in Christ if we will honestly recognize and confess the defects of our own character an repent. That is the unifying truth for all God's children. This is why Christ taught us to Love His children and even our enemies. My story is that I sought churches until I found the one that has taught me what God's Love is. It turned out to be the Ladder Day Saints. It's the relationship and the freedom to grow in God's love, not just the idea of what God's love is but, the real heart changing experience recieving it that I found. Christ is about unity in God and unity in Him, not divisions and contentions. satan has decieved so many "christians" into believing that God is not big enough to bring us together in His love so we bid his contention among ourselves. We know that these are the Latter Days and that more and more of us will become decieved. It is our obedience to love one another that will protect us as our sure foundation in Christ when the world cries hate, hate. God wants as many of His children to enter His eternal Family as possible. He has a heaven big enough for all of us even if we worship Him a little differently. We are not perfect beings yet. Christs compassion is very broad and can cover the whole of humanity. Let us remember this truth. We will only really "know" when Christ returns to reveal Himself to the whole world. Even the most lost and other chiefest sinners will melt in His great love. All our silly arguements will make us see our own foolishness but, His Glory will allow us to rise from our knees and sing praises to Him.
@@nanizon Thank you so much for taking the time to write all that, and thanks for being kind. I appreciate you for it. Paul taught us in Galatians 1:8-9 that if anyone preaches a different gospel than what he preached, they would be cursed. Then 1800 years later, Joseph Smith came along preaching a different gospel and adding to what God had already said, deceiving millions into hell. The Bible is God's only word. He doesn't even speak through prophets anymore. It's all in the Bible. I believe you're in the worst kind of eternal danger. I don't want that for you. I always pray that I'll never be deceived. Please continually pray that for yourself as well. It can't hurt anything. Thanks again for your kind reply.
csszw gosh, I'm sorry you took my comment as disingenuous. It's hard to gauge sincerity when you can't hear someone's voice. I truly love Mormons. All my family and most of my friends are LDS, and I'm passionate for all Mormons to know the true Jesus. It's not that I chose to believe that most people go to hell. It's that I believe exactly what the Bible teaches. Mormonism contradicts the Bible. The Bible is the only word of God. Please don't think I don't care about you and your eternal destiny.
I am sorry for your childhood abuse and misinformation from your parents or your misconception of Jesus's life and message. being raised in no religion, I always have something in me that said there must be more. I have tried MANY religions and irreligions. i have been to many Christian churches. I have tried to be a good Christian since I asked Jesus to save me. I love thr portion of God's Spirit that He gives to His children who prasie Him in all of them. It wasn't until I wasn't getting the answers I needed and began a deep study on my own that I came to understand the "timed" dimensions of God as premortal - mortal - and eternal that we His children can exist in. I realized tha we are all His children and that He has Planned our journey through each of them. I had to really open my mind to recieve this understanding from God. it was at that time, when I was open-minded about God being greater than my understandinh and yearning to know more that 2 LDS Missionaries knocked at my door. I had been taught in the 1980's that Mormon's were a cult. But I was also taught that there was no God. I never tried Mormonism. Somehow these teenaged men had the answers to my then questions and it made sense. So I began to investigate their church. Even though I had never heard some of their understandings about God, I chose not to be afraid and give them a fair chance. I read the book of mormon with wothout prejudice as best as I could. I stopped and said how can this be of satan. it only ever talks about Christ. I mean the characters in the book all talk about Christ, like every other senyence,. And it's always about His Love for us. and how good it is to obey Him. Then it happened. I experienced in my mind and and body God saying theat these words were His. I literally felt a warm sensation cover my body. I didn't even have to think about it, I just knew that I knew this was truth from God. Since then, I have tried to live the life of a Latter Day Sainr of Jesus Christ. This is where I began to understand the Most High God as my Heavenly Father and that we are all His children. His desire is that we learn to recieve His love through Jesus Christ. It's Father's love for all His children that dwells in me and I can actually dwell in it and I am learning to truly love my neighbors, my fellow childrn of God and even (some) of my enemies. Actually I don't really have any enemies I just have mistaken siblings. satan has wounded all of us. Knowing that it is the highest desire of father to redeem as many of His children as will let Him through Christ's atonement and exxperiencing Christ's compassion for those who hated and mortally wounded Him that I am healed and I can know His Plaan and how to grow to my best self. No other congregation (and I say that loosely) has even conveyed that message so completely with the Holy Ghost to confirm it. You know the way you say you love us and don't want our worse? I know that. I feel the same way about yoiu and the rest of Father's children. I pray that you feel the witness of the One True Living God and find His healing, His restoration to the son He desires you to become. I bless you IHM Thank you for your love. It is a marvolous thing. May we meet ahead on the road to Heaven and are ready and open for our Father to show us a new mystery together. Oh and I so wish you would listen to some of the talks in the Convention on You Tube because you will be amazed at how the hand of God orchastrated the day to be exactly a day to meet in some level of His love. They talked about so much of what this thread is talking about! I now consider it a divine appointment and a break through in the Spirit. To groups of His childeen with two different mindsets meeting in some degree of love! It's a chain breaker who's sound pierces the ear of satan. (Insert Hallalujah) It's like we are both joining over Christ who is all truth - even the truths that we are afraid of knowing.
Praise God Brothers and Sisters the Blinders need to be removed from their eyes !
Keep dreaming pretender.
I praise God that the blinders need to be removed from all our eyes! For none of us know the whole Plan of the God of our salvation. We are all still imperfect children and never did God command that one of His children should tear the blinders off another of His children in such a manner. In fact, the only blinders we can remove are the ones we wear when we allow God to reveal them to us. when we can love God that much then we have the kind of Love that will melt hearts as we live our testimony of Christ and become better wittnesses of the works that He is doing on the earth today and in our personal lives. By the blood of the Lamb and the wors of their testimony they overcame and they loved not their lives unto death. Jesus went and dwelt among the poor in spirit and befriended them as He taught them His witness of His Father. Why do we not go and dwell with Mormons as their friends like Christ taught us? Give them the respect as children of God like we give to others? Maybe they have some knowledge that we don't. Father desires to gather His children together in unity not divide them. The time will come when Christ will separate the sheep from the goats. That is not our authority in our service to Christ. Our example is to feed His sheep the love that we witness that God has for us by loving our neighbors.
@@nanizonyour statement is false we can know the plan of salvation. It is easily found in Romans 10 :9 or John 3:15 -16
It's not a mystery even Ephesians 2:8-9 gives us more to know and understand.
@@georgebauerschmidt5289 I forgive you for disrespecting me and labelling my beliefs as false. Yes and His Plan is greater than what He reveals in these scriptures alone.
@@nanizon how is it disrespectful for letting anyone know their understanding is wrong? Isn't that what preaching is all about? Do you not talk to those that are atheists? why do you get to disrespect their concept they have chosen to believe?
The Bible is there for our purpose to know God's plan for our salvation and the idea is written in the scripture over and over. Just because you don't want to acknowledge doesn't mean it's not there. atheists don't acknowledge the truth either.
I give you my testimony that the Holy Spirit told me very clearly that the Church of Jesus Christ is the only true church in the world and it changed my life at the same time. I implore all of you to take an honest look at the church and open up your heart to the Holy Spirit. You are in for a huge surprise. I also want to say i have a testimony of Jesus Christ and that he did die for our sins.
Grateful for Christian brothers who love the LDS people.
It would be nice if Evangelicals stopped putting themselves on the Christian high horse when it comes to talking to Latter Day Saints. When talking to a Jew or Muslim it's perfectly fine to refervto yourself as a Christian but when you do it to us that's your way of talking down to us. We give you the benefit of calling yourselves Christian in that we hope you sincerely believe Jesus is your Lird and Savior but Evangelical Christianty is NOT the church in the Bible. The early Christian church was only split based on localities, not on doctrines. Any partisan division in the church was looked at as heresy.
@@BrianTerrillYou just refuted mormonism.
@@ChomoBidensMules I know because you can literally find two Mormon churches standing across the street from each other competing for business
@@BrianTerrill and as a former Mormon who is now a Christian by the grace of God, I think it would be nice if Mormons stopped blaspheming the name of my Lord and God by calling themselves Christians and then inventing a new god and Christ to worship while claiming to believe in the same things I do.
@@austinnajarI never thought of it that way before but that's a good point.
Is there any curriculum that you guys offer and follow to better understand the beliefs of the Mormon Church? I have a bunch of random things I follow which have been super helpful but just wanted to know if there is a specific set of curriculum you guys follow. Also love what you guys do, met y'all at the G3 conference this last year and can tell all that you guys do this in love and do not mean to offend anyone. Keep fighting the good fight and keep the faith. Trying to do the same in Texas.
Hm... We only have this video, which is a broad overview of LDS history and beliefs: ruclips.net/video/5wLnU1nHnP8/видео.html
But it might be worth producing a series of videos walking through particular elements of LDS theology (for Christians to understand). Something I'll bring up to our team!
I love you guys desire to show Our Lord Jesus for them. I was raised LDS and when someone tries to teach me about Jesus I was to worried about my vanity! If I was beautiful a lot or if I was able to get a good husband to make my own world. Vanity about vanity. This is what LDS faith is made 😢. For me to awake it took me 5 years of study. Jesus is my God! I’m still LDS but construct my way through catholic faith. ❤️🙏♥️
Excellent video.
What a well done video! Looks cold out there 🥶 It's funny to me that people think y'all get paid to do evangelism - I hope this will be a helpful video for lds members who are wondering why they see "protesters" at general conference or just evangelists in general! So very thankful for the brothers and sisters in Christ who spend their time sharing the good news with their lds neighbors.
Random question/thought: besides missionaries, do the lds people evangelize? Are there Mormon evangelists?
we talk to people about our beliefs just as you do. Is that what you mean?
@@seekingtruthinallthings3969 kind of - I mean more like street evangelism
@Marisa-yf1vc I suppose us LDS could do more street preaching. But I think it is more effective gaining a relationship of trust with people first before preaching to them.
I am starting to get to know the people of GLM better. They are good people.
But it is plain as plain can be that they expect to only temporarily love most of mankind (in this life). They believe most of mankind will be in Hell after this life and they expect to be happy as can be in Heaven while most people are suffering in Hell. They appear to want the easiness of Heaven (enjoying God) and will not give that up to help most of mankind in the next life.
Now that is some ' outside of the box' conversation that I would love to engage in. I already know your basic beliefs.
These evangelists are false Christians. They know it.
The problem with the protestors is at least the time I went there were some street preachers calling Mormon women "whores" and weird abusive language like that. Even Pastor Jeff from Hello Saints has called out some of those street preachers for the poor behavior they show towards lds.
My brothers and sisters, I've known a Mormon family and have spoken about differences between our beliefs for years. Their son is going on his mission soon. His name is Noah. Please pray with us that he finds the true savior on this mission! In Jesus name I pray, Amen! Much love brothers and sisters! The temple in Jerusalem is more near now than ever before to being built! Do not be deceived by the anti-christ! The abomination of desolation!
I’ll be praying that you emerge from stifling ignorance.
@@Kapayapaanman ad hominem.
@@Kapayapaanman could you be more specific about what exactly you think I'm wrong about?
@@hisnameisiam808 so you can accuse people of being deceived by the Antichrist, yet, I can’t equally claim you are residing in stifling ignorance?
@@hisnameisiam808 that Noah hasn’t found the “correct” Jesus, that he and his family are being deceived by the antichrist.
Great video hopefully it allows for more conversations at conference
@6:29 Who are you and where is your church. I did that 100s of times on my mission and no one every seemed happy.
Hey! I asked this question on my comment, maybe you can answer: Do Latter Day Saints evangelize outside of their missions? Like does the LDS have Mormon evangelists/do street evangelism?
I'm from cache valley and go to gosple peace church and yes I'm really the guy from the video!
@@qgkyncy And have you read the book of Mormon?
@@Marisa-yf1vc Yes, we do it through oue Helping Hands department. we help locally and globally to literally feed the poor and needy and to help in diseaster relief. We have meetings with other Country's leaders to see how we can help their people ressspecting their rules. Some countries do not allow proslytizing and we respect that because Jesus said obey the laws of the land. We have mission on every continent except Antartica. We are all encouraged to be member missionaries in our daily lives to love our neighbors. We share our version of worship with as many as are willing to hear it as possible. We love when someone comes to Sunday service to see what we are about. We call them Investigators and encourage their questions. I was an investigator before I converted because I was taught that LDS was a cult in the 1970-80's. It's sad that all we lovers of Jesus can't just love each other even with our differences. God loves us all and His heart desires unity not division. We always try to look for our common shared beliefs with other folks and religions. We have good connections with all religions except some Christians. Crazy isn't it. The missionaries are our street evangelists. The thing we are big on is order and unity. We all serve the Most High God and we all share the same standards in the way we act as his childern. For example we believe it when God said he wants us to achieve a higher resurrection and become Priests and Priestesses and Kings and Queen in His eternity so we train oue young men and women to have God's values in themselves. One of them is based on God's value of Chastity. We encourage our young ones to dress modestly and respect their chastity as highly as God values it. That's why our missionaries always dress in ties and dresses, well slacks in winter. We believe that we are children of God and part of His eternal family. Our church organization is like a family structure. None of our missionaries is ever alone or out of contact with their Missionary Leader. They also conect with others to support each other as bro and sisters. Oue missionaries have to work and save $2000.00 before they go on a Misssion they take training course and committ 18mo-2yrs to the Mission going to where they are sent. Everyone of them has chosen to make being a Missionary a part of their earthly journey.Church families love to invite them over for a home cooked meal. we all love them.
@@Marisa-yf1vc
I'm not sure I understand exactly what you are asking so let me answer it in a few ways.
There are times in our lives when we serve full-time missions. Usually around 20 and in our 60s.. I that time you are usually assigned a specific geographical area, but often meet people that live outside those areas so you teach them and then hand them off to other people.
Other times when we're working and living more standard lives (like I am now) we share the gospel in "normal and Natural" ways with people we know and meet.
So for example "on my mission", I gave a Book of Mormon to someone, and they read all night and called me the next day and said they received revelation the book was true and from God.
And now, for example "in regular life" I work with people and my co-workers asked me about the restored Gospel of Jesus Christ over dinner. I told them I loved it and that Jesus has helped me Grow so much and has really changed my life. And invited them to learn more. I also gave one of them a book of Mormon.
Hopefully, that answers your question.
Good luck
Bradley, this is an important question... are my great grandparents as well as many other of my late family members in hell because they believed in the "wrong Jesus"?
We can't make a final pronouncement. Only God can.
But in principle, only those who had a saving relationship with the real Jesus are saved.
@AaronShafovaloff1 please don't sugarcoat it. Evangelicals say we're going to hell for believing in the "wrong Jesus," and then they turn around and say it's up to God to decide... so what is it???
I think Evangelicals expect to forget us Mormons while they are enjoying Heaven and we are being tortured in Hell. I do not understand why their love for us is temporary.
@@seekingtruthinallthings3969hey, we do care, but even our love for you is a gift from God. It breaks our hearts to think of anyone in hell. Everyone in heaven will not be able to be sad because that is just how amazing and wonderful God is and to be with God is the greatest joy and delight, enjoying the incomprehensible riches of God forever will be given to all the elect whom God the Father gave in eternity past to His Son Who purchased their salvation with His own blood, and whom the Holy Spirit made alive with a new heart of flesh and sanctified making them holy. This does not do away with man’s responsibility, and so all those who believe not on the Son shall not see life, but the wrath of God abides on them. Is God just for punishing the self-righteous for their pride as well as all their other sins that they have committed only against the only one true and holy God? If you can see yourself in the true light if God’s law, as a sinner deserving of hell, won’t you please surrender to Christ as Lord? Believe on His sufficient sacrifice for sins and give up on trying to save yourself? Jesus alone is able to save you. Come home. Come out of that man’s works righteousness and come to Christ and rest.
@@bryanpratt5850I see myself as a sinner but I don't see myself as someone deserving infinite torture in fire. I work in mental health and if my patient was to tell me, " I want to torture myself with fire," I would call the psychiatrist and get him the help he needs.
The thing I don't understand about Evangelicals is their lack of common sense. Do they really think we all deserve infinite torture by fire for living a finite life of sin?
Who is this God you talk of that tells us we deserve this torture?
I am thinking you are afraid of him.
Just like Germans were afraid to disobey Hitler.
I am so confused.
Are you telling me I deserve to be cast in a lake of fire for eternity because of my sin? Fire is the worst pain imaginable.
Where is the common sense sir?
Edit: Evangelical ideology has made me want to end my life. If everyone deserves eternal torture in fire, what is the point of going on. Is there really no good in me or anyone? Can I not trust anyone or anything?
GLM. Honest question to you: How did Satan come into existence?
God created Satan. Satan was sinless. (Ezekiel 28)
God did not create sin in Satan. Satan's sin was pride.
Angels were created before God created the universe. Job 38
Thank you for this perspective, I've been trying to understand the other side better in order to build bridges and connect with one another even if we disagree on a lot of things,
And if I may, I also want to make a video essay on my channel about how the Bible and Book of Mormon align with each other and why we believe these things, and I do this not out of contentiousness or wanting a fight, but simply for the sake of healthy conversation and wanting to share the Gospel.
Idk what else to say but have a great week, God bless you!
thank you for the charity. We can all learn from you.
The problem with the Evangelical side of the argument is it's contradictory in nature. He literally says he doesn't believe Mormons are saved and then presents the salvation by grace alone argument that we only need Jesus. Well we have Jesus, Catholics have Jesus, lots of other churches these Evangelicals say are not saved have Jesus. We accept his free gift of salvation but that's not enough for them. We need to agree with their interpretation of the Bible to be saved, that's what they really think.
The Mormons, JWs and Seventh Day Adventist are the low hanging fruit they can all gang up on, take that away they would just gang up on the Catholics, take those away and the conversations between Evangelicals will be like this:
Pastor A: let me tell you what the Bible says....
Pastor B interrupts Pastor A: "No! Let me tell you what the Bible says... "
Pastor C comes along and says "No, No! Let me tell you what the Bible says"
Next you'll have a screaming match and other pastors will jump in and have a competition to see who can scream the loudest and in the end they will all be shouting at each other:
"Damn you to hell" and the next one will say "No! Damn you to hell" and another one will say "no damn you all to hell"
In the true hearts of Evangelical Christianty the only ones in heaven will be Jesus and the particular individual, everyone else will in their mind, be roasting in hell.
@BrianTerrill You are so mean and so true and have the guts to say it.
I have nothing but respect for you
@BrianTerrill Brian you are horribly mistaken. All "evangelicals" agree on salvation the difference is that the LDS believe in a different Jesus and a different gospel one that is not by grace even though they say that. Because we are not interpreting the Bible we just Read it and let it speak for its self the cults on the other hand to tell you what it means and that their way is the only way.
@@BrianTerrill the "problem" is that we all do not believe well enough to stop finding fault with our neighbors and brothers and learn how to love and respect them in our own conversation. Does Father reject one of His children when they make a mistake? No He helps them see from His perspective the compassion and desire He has for them. He has not given any mortal human the authority to judge the eternal matters of another. That is His authority only and the judgement of Mercy that He gave His only begotton Son. Our greater good is to learn how to love His children in the right spirit of unity excepting the level of spiritual maturity they have at the time and still nurture them in the Love of Father given to us through Christ. There is no problem with them, there is only conditions with all of us. God loves me in spite of my conditions, including the ignorance I about Him because I do not know it all. He allows me to grow out of that ignorance at my own rate and is always ready to help me take one more step closer to Him. He loves all of His children who love His Son, Jesus regardless of their personal or corporate ignorance of Him. In fact, He tells us that we can't even concieve the whole of who He is and what He has in store for us. Unity vs division. satan is very busy keeping us divided and contensious, let's not help him. He is a liar and so not worthy.
Do you go to an islamic mosque to protest? Do you go to Jewish synagogues and protest?
So fun discussing all about God and Christ when none of us know all about God and Christ. And none of us know, nor can concieve what great things God has for those who love Him.
👍🏼
Bradley,
Can you tell me why your God created life and Myself, and what was it's purpose?
Yes indeed! The Westminster Catechism puts it really well:
> Q: What is the chief end of man?
> A: Man's chief end is to glorify God and enjoy him forever.
We made a video on this, if you're interested, check it out here: ruclips.net/video/bPrYdjdJ1Gc/видео.html
@@GLM That answers what man's roll is in the creation. That's not really in the bible though.
But Why did your God create the earth, you and life?
@@clearstonewindows To glorify Himself - to quote what he says, "for my own sake, I do it."
Romans 11:36 - "For from him and through him and to him are all things. To him be glory forever."
All things for *to him*.
1 Cor. 8:6 - "for us there is one God, the Father, from whom are all things and for whom we exist"
Col. 1:16 - "For by him all things were created...all things were created through him and for him."
All things were created by God for his glory.
@@GLM These verses say that we should Glory God and do not say he created the world and you for his own Glory.
But I'm okay with that if that's what you believe.
But doesn't really answer why. Why does he want or need Glory? What was his purpose in creating the heavens and the earth?
Clearstone...
Exactly! Exactly! Exactly!
Do you think you are better people than the Lds believers?
No - we've never claimed to be better. We are sinners-wicked people who have been rescued from that sin by the grace of God. We do NOT claim that we have better works than everyone else!
Rather, our claim is that we grasp Christ for complete forgiveness of sins. Our works are not a means to forgiveness or eternal life.
@@GLM Then practice what you preach in you own congregation and members in your church together with your family. If you realy love your brothers and sisters whatever denominations they belong, let them worship how,where or what they may.
We can lived in harmony and peace without telling them you are right and they are wrong, and you are going to heaven and they going to hell.
@@TheMowst Except, what if they are going to hell....? It would be unloving for us to just keep what would save them from it to ourselves. Did you watch the _full_ video?
@@GLMof course your works won't save you, you preach for money.
@@AustinD1646 This is the bad thing about a religion, when you join a denomination, others will find fault with you regarding what you belong to. Many evangelist preacher saying your going to hell and were not, mormons are cult and we are true christian, JW is cult and we are a true christian, Catholic is pagan and we are true christians. Look you are lifting your own chair to make yourself look right and everyone else is wrong. At the end of the story, you just want them to be members of the church you belong to and teach them how to be like you
Just as you feel it is your moral obligation to reach out to members of The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints, the same is for us!
Bradley, at conference you did start to engage with me about Heaven and Hell. Thank you. But you did not respond to an email I sent you. Why? This would help build bridges between LDS and Evangelical beliefs.
Please explain degrees of Hell? Degrees of Hell describe a merciful God without having to throw reason out the window.
Please discuss common grace and why a merciful God will get rid of it for most people after this short life. Please discuss sanctification and how it applies to those who do not believe like you. Will they not have any sanctified qualities in Hell?
I truly would appreciate a video on these three topics.
Please think outside the box!
I emailed them years ago. They told me once they would like to have a conversation but never followed up. They act as their own version of God. Unilateral. Mike Winger has this approach too. It keeps the confirmation bias alive.
I wish we could build bridges with the Evangelicals. I am still trying to understand why they worship God believing he is the Way he is. I am trying to give them the benefit of the doubt but I think they have alot of fear of God, to the point where they will forget about most of mankind just so they can live in an easy heaven.
Here's at least how I would answer your question. There aren't degress of Hell just like there aren't degrees of Heaven. Heaven is eternity with God. Hell is eternity without God. Common grace is things we all experience that are good in this life, things like community, sunshine, but also the patience of God. God gives patience to all of us by not pouring out his justified wrath on all of us.
Sanctification is the second part of salvation. Eternal life is guaranteed at the moment of justification which is where we put our full trust in the finished work of Jesus and repent of our sins. At that moment we are forgiven of all sins past, present, and future and indwelt with the Holy Spirit and the Holy Spirit will sanctify us through the rest of our lives. That sanctification process can't take place for someone who hasn't been saved and justified and filled with the Spirit because it isn't us doing it ourselves, but God working in us. So no, they will not have sanctified qualities in Hell.
I hope that helps explain some of what you're asking. I would be more than willing to discuss these more in depth though a different forum if you're interested.
@austinnajar Thank you for your answer. I suppose I do not see the mercy in what you just said. It sounds methodical, void of empathy. As though God is a machine void of feelings and we are his means to an end of his selfish desires.
I understand where Agnostics come from when they refuse to worship this type of God.
Where is the empathy in all of this?
I don't see it.
If Evangelicals are right about God, he won't save most of his creation because they got their knowledge about him wrong. Yet he put them in the situations that fostered their beliefs in the first place.
Take the LDS for example. They believe a certain way because they were either brought up to believe it and/or they have accepted it and feel it is right. They believe in God, have accepted Christ's atonement (no matter how "flawed" you think their beliefs are).Yet God won't save them because they are too fallible?
Why is the one sin that Jesus' atonement will not cover, incorrect knowledge as to who he is?
No Evangelical has been able to answer this for me.
I think it is because no Evangelical has an answer.
The scary part is, Evangelicals sleep at night, eat, laugh, have fun, knowing that God is like this and that most people will be cast out by God to a place of complete darkness after 80 or so years of life.
And they are ok with it.
Are you OK with it? Why?
Because YOU are saved?
@@austinnajaradding on to my last answer, one of the reasons I am attracted to LDS beliefs because it helps make sense of a God who is as equally merciful as he is just. It appears that Evangelicals don't think God lives by the Golden rule which is to do unto others as you would have others do unto you.
Why would God not live by the rules he puts out for his creation?
Yes, he respects people's desire to choose. However, we are all fallible and will get out choices wrong at times. Why will he not forgive someone who does not understand exactly how he is in this life? We are all fallible!!!
Can an imperfect person perfectly reject God and his attributes in this life? Evangelicals seem to believe this.
This is why Evangelicalism does not make sense.
Is the "truth" that Jesus is God the uncreated creator more important than the truth that we need to love one another?
Will Evangelicals love everyone when they are in Heaven watching most people being tortured in Hell?
No Evangelical has answered that question and I don't know why.
You're protestant but you bear the emblems and creeds of them from who you broke off. Ye are witness unto yourselves that ye are the children of them which killed the prophets..
Here are some Bible verse Evangelicals seem to miss:
Book of the Wars of the Lord (Num. 21:14);
Book of Jasher (Josh. 10:13; 2 Sam. 1:18);
Book of the acts of Solomon (1 Kgs. 11:41); Book of Samuel the seer (1 Chr. 29:29);
Book of Gad the seer (1 Chr. 29:29);
Book of Nathan the prophet (1 Chr. 29:29; 2 Chr. 9:29); Prophecy of Ahijah (2 Chr. 9:29);
Visions of Iddo the seer (2 Chr. 9:29; 12:15; 13:22);
Book of Shemaiah (2 Chr. 12:15);
Book of Jehu (2 Chr. 20:34);
Sayings of the seers (2 Chr. 33:19);
an epistle of Paul to the Corinthians, earlier than our present 1 Corinthians (1 Cor. 5:9);
possibly an earlier epistle to the Ephesians (Eph. 3:3); Epistle to the Church at Laodicea (Col. 4:16); Bookof Enoch, known to Jude (Jude 1:14)
Assumption of Moses (Jude 1:9)
This and when I try to point out that the Bible was canonized by Pope Damasus in the Council of Rome in 382 AD, I usually just get attacked for not being a Christian etc and hear the "it's the Bible and the Bible only, turn or burn"
Other than those books being referenced in books we have as scripture, what evidence can you provide that they actually were to ever be considered scripture? Especially the books referenced from the Old Testament. The Jews were meticulous about what was considered scripture and what was not. Why should we believe those were meant to be scripture when the Jews didn't even consider them such?
@austinnajar that's a pretty weird question, and no, the Jews were not as meticulous about preserving the scriptures as you might want to think.
Tertullian wrote:
"I am aware that the Scripture of Enoch, which has assigned this order (of action) to angels, is not received by some, because it is not admitted into the Jewish canon either. I suppose they did not think that, having been published before the deluge, it could have safely survived that world-wide calamity, the abolisher of all things. If that is the reason (for rejecting it), let them recall to their memory that Noah, the survivor of the deluge, was the great-grandson of Enoch himself; and he, of course, had heard and remembered, from domestic renown and hereditary tradition, concerning his own great-grandfather’s “grace in the sight of God,” and concerning all his preachings; since Enoch had given no other charge to Methuselah than that he should hand on the knowledge of them to his posterity. Noah therefore, no doubt, might have succeeded in the trusteeship of (his) preaching; or, had the case been otherwise, he would not have been silent alike concerning the disposition (of things) made by God, his Preserver, and concerning the particular glory of his own house.
If (Noah) had not had this (conservative power) by so short a route, there would (still) be this (consideration) to warrant our assertion of (the genuineness of) this Scripture: he could equally have renewed it, under the Spirit’s inspiration, after it had been destroyed by the violence of the deluge, as, after the destruction of Jerusalem by the Babylonian storming of it, every document of the Jewish literature is generally agreed to have been restored through Ezra.
But since Enoch in the same Scripture has preached likewise concerning the Lord, nothing at all must be rejected by us which pertains to us; and we read that “every Scripture suitable for edification is divinely inspired. By the Jews it may now seem to have been rejected for that (very) reason, just like all the other (portions) nearly which tell of Christ. Nor, of course, is this fact wonderful, that they did not receive some Scriptures which spake of Him whom even in person, speaking in their presence, they were not to receive. To these considerations is added the fact that Enoch possesses a testimony in the Apostle Jude." (Tertullianus, Quintas Septimus Florens (c. 160-c. 225)
Furthermore, your assessment of how meticulously the Jews preserved scripture is easily debunked in 2 Kings 22 when they literally found a copy of the Law of the Lird and had it read to Josiah.
It can also be further evidenced that the Jews who worked on the Greek translation of the Old Testament felt inspired to use words such as "Crist" and "baptism" (the Greek words for those) and included what is now considered apocryphal works. The Jews after the time of Christ saw the Greek Septuagint as a threat and therefore only accepted the Hebrew Bible, which ironically is the Protestants Old Testament today. And yet, the Jews de canonized the apocryphal not because of any inspiration but out of fear over the influence of Christianity.
As for the books I mentioned, most of them are implied to be from the words of prophets which would imply their sacred nature, it's a funny thing for you to ask for "evidence" and pretend those books were not scripture just reference books.
@@BrianTerrill the Bible, which is God's word, says that God preserves and protects His word. So if it isn't in the Bible, God did not intend for it to be there. What Tertullian, an uninspired sinful man, says is completely irrelevant.
@austinnajar God does preserve and protect his word, but not through the Catholic and Protestant churches. He has other means of preserving and protecting it. Certainly part of that was by having them written down in what would become the Bible so honest seekers of truth would be aware of more out there than what is in the Bible. And where does it say in the Bible that the Bible is all of God's word? It doesn't, so you have added to the Bible the very thing you accuse Mormons of doing. How are you not going to hell for that?
Technically, the word we get Bible from means the books and is only used a few times in scripture:
"25 And there are also many other things which Jesus did, the which, if they should be written every one, I suppose that even the world itself could not contain the books that should be written. Amen." (JOHN 21:25)
In the Greek text, the word translated to "the books" is Biblia, so in essence, John is saying, "the world itself could not contain the Bible that should be written"
@@BrianTerrill so what you're saying is that God preserved and protected his word so that people would look for more of it even when there's no evidence we ever were meant to have more or need more than what we have? This is a fundamental flaw of Mormon theology. God can preserve and protect his word, and he does, but really he didn't and so that's why we need you guys, right?
There are different styles of protest. Some are blatantly rude and loud. Others are more subdued.
In talking with Latter Day Saints on the streets, I have sometimes been asked questions to the effect of, "Who sent you?" or, "who is paying you to do this?". It always struck me as odd.
Some LDS people think that paid clergy is wrong
Because it’s such a bizarre practice to go protest outside of another’s place of worship. Nobody sees what you are trying to do as respectable.
@@mytime3046 we recently worked on the home of a pastor. His brand new 2 million dollar home in a gated community. To me, this is the problem with paid clergy.
Lds can do everything other denominations do with mostly service hours. That way, the tithes go to the church organization, not the people.
Thank you to the LDS person talking about the million dollar home. GLM sees everything wrong with us LDS and nothing wrong with themselves.
@@KapayapaanmanPaul says that elders who labor in preaching and teaching should be paid (1 Timothy 5:17-18)
What exactly do you think the Gospel of Jesus Christ is? And why don't you think the church producing the best fruit of any church on earth?
What is the gospel? 'm glad you asked.😃 Here's the gospel. We are all wretched sinners and condemned to hell. We are all born sinners because of the fall of Adam. There's just one way we can escape hell, by putting ALL our faith in Jesus to save us from our sins because He took the wrath of God in our place. We can't do anything to save ourselves. No good deed, church attendance, baptism, sacraments, or obedience will add to what Jesus did on the cross.
Also, He lived a perfect life, and His righteousness is credited to our account when we trust in Him for salvation. Jesus overcame the world. He conquered death on the cross for us and rose from the dead on the third day.
The thing is, you have to believe in the true Jesus of the Bible (2 Corinthians 11:4). Jesus is the creator of all things, including Satan. He is the second person of the Trinity, equal to God the Father.
@@allie.1a There are some major problems with this, what the Bible says. According to Genesis, darkness existed before God spoke, a deep existed, that is described as waters, and still God hasn't said anything to start the creation. The first thing God creates is light, for God is light and in him is no darkness at all, which God then separates from the dark. According to Paul in order for sin to be counted against you, you have to be able to understand the laws, as he said "I had not known lust, except the law said, Thou shalt not covet." and "Where there is no law, sin is not counted." Now it is true that without Jesus Christ a single sin at any time during our life would cause us to be punished for ever, but once Jesus Christ took the punishment for EVERY sin, he then had the control to give rewards or punishments. And how does he determine which to give? By each person's obedience to his commandments. They are judged by their works. As Jesus Christ himself said, "He that hath my commandments, and keepeth them, he it is that loveth me: and he that loveth me shall be loved of my Father, and I will love him, and manifest myself unto him." How can you love Jesus Christ if you don't keep his commandments? And how can Jesus Christ be your personal Lord and Savior if you don't love him. "Faith worketh by love." and "Faith without works is dead." Does that mean we can work our way into heaven? No. As it shows in the parable of the servant, in which it asks if the servant will get special treatment for doing that which is his duty, and makes it clear he won't, he will just get his hire. But we know that servants who don't do what they are required will get punished. We are God's servants, and he has given us commandments. But he also showed that they reduce to two commandments, love God with all your might mind and strength, and your neighbors as yourself. Love fulfilleth the law and the prophets. But God does lay out his true gospel in several places in the New Testament, he gives the basics in Hebrews 6: 1-2. Faith in God, repentance, baptisms, which we know is always by immersion to symbolize the death, burial and resurrection of Jesus Christ, and the baptism is always by the laying on of hands, which at that time only the Apostles could do, nowhere is that power given to others, but it makes it clear this power cannot be bought or claimed, only given to those God chose in the way God commanded, then you have the resurrection, and finally judgement for works, whether someone endured in the teachings of Jesus Christ after their baptism in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of their sins. Again you get this gospel in Acts, right after the first converts ask Peter "What must we do?" Peter doesn't tell them to do the work of saying a man made prayer stating that they are sinners and accept Jesus Christ as their personal Lord and Savior, that isn't even hinted at ANYWHERE in the Bible. Peter tells them "Repent, everyone one of you, and be baptized in the name of Jesus Christ for a remission of your sins, and you shall receive the gift of the Holy Ghost." And Peter told them that this wasn't just for them to do, but their children had to do the same, and all that are afar off, as many as the Lord God shall call, which is everyone. And after they were baptized was that all they did? No! They continued steadfastly in the Apostles' doctrine and fellowship, and in fasting, and in prayers. Salvation is not one and done. Paul did "Press toward the mark of the prize of the high calling of God in Christ Jesus." He definitely didn't assume he was saved after saying one prayer, but never stopped doing the good works that he was created for, as it says right after it says "It is not of works lest any man should boast.", if Evangelicals would read the rest of the Bible, not just the bits and pieces they can twist out of context.
Fellow LDS members. Let us understand that Evangelicals do love us in this life and are showing that love for us by street preaching to us. That makes sense.
There is no need to ask them why they believe the trinity or why they believe Jesus is God. That is simply their interpretation of the Bible.
But, let us continue to ask then questions that don't make sense in their belief system. For example, why do they choose to worship a God that will send most people to a torturous Hell? Perhaps Evangelicals don't allow themselves to think beyond but I do think they could believe in degrees of Hell which correlate with our degrees of Heaven. They would just put us in a Hell instead of a Heaven. Yet there would still be a degree of the love of God there. Make sense? It sounds like our degrees of Heaven.
Let us as them about sanctification and how that works for all people in the life beyond. You see, most people go through some sort of sanctification in this life. Why would those traits not stick in the next life?
Let us help them focus on the most important universal truths which are to 'love your neighbor" and ' do unto others as you would have them do to you.' Those are the truths that truly matter. For what good is it that you have God's love, if you do not share it with others.
Let us help our Evangelical brothers and sisters to broaden their thinking just a little.
This will help build bridges.
God loves them. They are his children too.
Let us help our Evangelical brothers and sisters see that our beliefs can start to converge a little as we all recognize that God's mercy equals his justice.
Didn't our Prophet tell us it is the time for Unity? Find the things we have in common amd love through those.
@@nanizonYes!
Do you believe that you - you personally - deserve to go to hell? And that God would be just to do soon account of your sin?
@AaronShafovaloff1 I believe that I have to accept the consequences of my own actions and that Christ will save us from those consequences as we accept His grace, repent and change with his help.
For example, if I were to drink Alcohol, I have to accept the risks involved including addiction, drunkenness, liver cirrhosis, etc. No person in there right mind is going to sentence me to torture by fire because I drink alcohol. That makes no sense! Don't you see it? Or do you disagree?
Hell or damnation will be the consequences of our actions. Not being eternally tortured in fire for eternity. That makes no sense. People will still be a mixture of good and evil in Hell and they will experience consequences for their good and bad behavior. They will still have some light of God depending on what light they are willing to accept.
Wouldn't that describe a loving God who is as equally loving as he is just?
What do you believe?
Do you think God would take away all of his light from most of his creation in Hell? Why?
@@AaronShafovaloff1 Of course we each deserve to go to hell because we all are sinners. I deserve it. Christ didn't deserve to be put to hell and death. So I now serve Him. But I don't think we all understand the leves of both hell and heaven and the progression to a higher level we can achieve in this life.
Christ is your prophet, priest, and king and this explains why you believe there is no need for prophets..
But the Bible which you believe to be infallible doesn't say anywhere that there will never be prophets called ever again.. infact , the bible does teach how you will know true prophets from false prophets.. saying, by their fruits ye shall know them. For a good tree brings forth good fruit and a bad tree evil fruit..
Seems like unnecessary warning if there will never be a prophet again
John 14:15
I understand the desire to be respectful, but let me ask you a simple question. Did Jesus not speak plainly when he spoke about hell and how real it was? Did Jesus not speak boldly and plainly when confronting the Pharisees? Jesus always was bold and confident in his message when he shared the gospel, and we must be the same way.
Tip toeing around, trying not to hurt someone's feelings, since when did truth care about ones feelings? When did Jesus ever stop and decide to give an "easier" speech when confronting the Pharisees so as to not offend them?
Oh, don't misunderstand. We *do* want to speak plainly. We aren't trying to tiptoe around or shrink back from proclaiming what's true in order to save people's feelings. But we can proclaim what's true in a dignified and honoring manner. I don't think that being plain and straightforward = being disrespectful.
I often consider Paul's words in 2 Timothy 2:24-26 as a guide - "And the Lord’s servant must not be quarrelsome but kind to everyone, able to teach, patiently enduring evil, correcting his opponents with gentleness. God may perhaps grant them repentance leading to a knowledge of the truth, and they may come to their senses and escape from the snare of the devil, after being captured by him to do his will."
And also 2 Corinthians 4 - "But we have renounced disgraceful, underhanded ways. We refuse to practice cunning or to tamper with God’s word, but by the open statement of the truth we would commend ourselves to everyone’s conscience in the sight of God. And even if our gospel is veiled, it is veiled to those who are perishing" (2 Cor. 4:2-3).
Correcting, but with gentleness. No underhanded sly "strategies," but instead the open statement of the truth. Dignified and straightforward speech.
Please read the Bible. Jesus NEVER initiated the contention. The pharisees and seduces approached him or was doing things they knew were wrong at His temple. Know which side you are on.
At 1:34. I wonder if the protesters even are aware they are doing the exact same as the Latter-day Saints. In the pursuit of proclaiming the "truth", protesters are doing exactly what LDS members do. Both claim to have the "truth" of the gospel and feel it is their right to proclaim it to the other side.
The protestors largely understand the desire for Latter-Day Saints to evangelize and do not find fault with this.
@BNichols021 that is really nice that they understand. Thank you.
I am glad you have found happiness in Evangelical Christianity knowing YOU are saved. Now I have to wonder if I want to be happy in Heaven knowing I am saved when most people are not. Do I want that?
The CES letter is a real thing. History is messy and yucky. I hate it at times.
I don't think the LDS leaders are perfect and I cringe at things too.
But, I don't think the people who wrote the Bible were perfect either, and if they were not perfect, there is a possibility the Bible is not perfect.
I get why Evangelicals believe in and need an infallible Bible to stand upon. They would crumble without it.
But I equally get why the LDS talk about learning spiritual truth through the spirit even if we get it wrong at times.
So what do I conclude with this? I think about where my thoughts take me. When I put myself into Evangelical shoes, I think ME ME ME ME ME. GOD LOVES ME. I AM SAVED, I GET HAPPINESS IN HEAVEN. I CARE ABOUT ALL PEOPLE IN THIS LIFE BUT WHO CARES ABOUT MOST IN THE NEXT. I I I I I. All about ME.
When I put myself into the LDS shoes, I think YOU YOU YOU YOU YOU. GOD LOVES YOU. YOU ARE SAVED. YOU GET THE HAPPINESS YOU DESIRE IN THE NEXT LIFE, YOU WILL BE CARED FOR BY GOD AND OTHERS IN THE NEXT LIFE ( you know the LDS going to preach to others in spirit prison + temple work. IT IS ALL ABOUT YOU AND EVERYONE ELSE.
Everyone is fallible. Who and what do we trust? The Bible?
So, what do I choose to let eternally motivate my beliefs. What I get out of existence? Or what YOU, and all others, get out of existence?
I respect the Athiests who live their existence to better the lives of their posterity and all future generations. There is no greater love than that. And that, my friend, is what the Evangelicals are missing. To live their existence (eternity) for others.
I choose to believe in God.
But more importantly, I have had spiritual experiences with God that I can not deny. And it is everything to do with God's unimaginable love for everyone!
But are you aware that a few of them actually are Christians?
As Christians, we shouldn't just assume what all people of certain groups actually believe.
None of these people understand or know what the Latter Day Saints believe, they assume incorrectly.
Hi!
I'm open to the fact that we misunderstand things. Do you have things in particular in mind?
@@GLM I think seekingtruthinallthings brought up some great discussion ideas, you should start with him. I’m not looking to discuss with people who aren’t sorry if it is disrespectful or bothersome to Latter Day Saints to disrupt their meeting venue. The information and all our beliefs are easily accessible and if there was respect or a desire for understanding people would go there and learn before trying to engage.
It doesn't seem reasonable to throw out that I "don't understand or know" what Latter-day Saints believe, but then be unwilling to tell me (in at least general terms) what I've misunderstood. I may *disagree*. But disagreement ≠ lack of understanding.
If you're curious of a high-level view of what I understand the church to believe, I made this 20-ish min video explaining it (for other Evangelicals to better understand their LDS neighbors): ruclips.net/video/5wLnU1nHnP8/видео.html
I would be happy to seriously consider any points where I may be wrong!
Do you have specific examples?
@@GLM according to other people in this video, it is clear there is a lack of knowledge. What everyone needs to consider is how they are protesting against the Latter Day Saints. People go to churches usually to learn what that church is teaching not to tell them they are wrong. Missionaries knock on doors and people can agree or disagree to talk with them and the respect is there. Y’all are imposing yourselves on freedom of religion by holding signs and trying to engage as people are exercising their God given right to freedom of religion. Trying to shame people for their beliefs and calling it an act of love, around children as well, to me y’all lack some basic knowledge of what is right.
If this is about converting "Mormons" to believe in things like the holy Trinity & Sola Scriptura, we believe those are falsehoods & not biblical. We believe in the Jesus of the Bible, who is the Savior of the world, atoned for the sins of the world, & is the Son of God. You as "Christians" should know not to judge saying that Mormons are going to hell. Not very Christian to do that, but to follow the teachings of Jesus Christ.
Jesus said you must be born again (John 3:3) so those in this religion are following the words of Jesus and doing that?
At 1:30, the protestor makes I clear he doesn't believe that lds have obtained eternal life. We lds hear this over and over from so-called Christians with a second grade reading level in the Bible. On the one hand, they want to argue that Jesus is enough. On the other hand, we have to accept their extremely flawed interpretation of the Bible to be saved. In an earlier part a lady said most LDS don't know where they will go as somehow many Christians do. Unfortunately, many Christians thinking they will obtain eternal life will find themselves on the left hand of Christ, and he will pronounce "I never knew you"
The lady in the video’s experience is similar to mine: almost every time I have asked a LDS individual if they would be able to dwell with Heavenly Father if they were to die right now, they have responded by saying they don’t know for sure.
We Christians want our LDS neighbors to have the same assurance of faith that is promised in John 6:47, “He that believeth on me hath everlasting life.” In Christ, we need not worry if our works are good enough to get us into the highest level of Heaven, because we have Christ’s righteousness imputed to us, and He is more than worthy to have us enter in to the presence of the Father forever.
@@BNichols021 most people who think they have eternal life are actually lukewarm in their faith, you and I both know that to be true. Jesus taught to be his disciples we must forsake all and follow him. He also taught that we must endure to the end to be saved and that is why you won't hear many lds give cocky answers about being assure wternal life because we must endure this life and be faithful.
@@BrianTerrill Where is the study that suggests that most people that believe they have eternal life are lukewarm in their faith? You can't just make assertions.
@@blusheep2 I don't need a study, I see it in my own family.
@@BrianTerrill Exactly. You are only going off anecdotal evidence from your own family. A study of 1. Not a real good sample size.
People have the right to worship God in any way they choose. It actually disgusts me that you would go out there on one of their important days and disrupt things. The LDS people know the differences and choose for themselves how they want to live, you have no right to go out there and bother them. They don't just read the Book of Mormon, they read the Bible, too. You go out there because you think Mormons are going to hell but you are wrong. God is a God of love. What you are doing is not love.
So when those in this religion do the same going to visit people who are doing their own thing, isn't that hypocrisy?
@@georgebauerschmidt52892 things.
1). Do LDS members or missionaries stand outside Evangelical churches filming people who come out?
2). The LDS want to add more knowledge onto other belief systems. They are offering that. They still believe God loves all people and will save most of them to a final state of happiness. They just want to help people understand that.
@@seekingtruthinallthings3969 add more knowledge? How do you know that 'knowledge' is legit or better than what other beliefs systems have?
Perhaps Bible Christians have more 'knowledge' to share with LDS? Don't you think Bible Christians already know that God loves all people?
I'm not sure how you are making any case for these excuses just yet.
@georgebauerschmidt5289 Evangelicals believe that God will not save most of his creation because they don't have correct theology. Otherwise they would not be out preaching to people. It is a miserable thought and probably causes many to turn hostile against a God who they think is the cause of torturing people forever.
The LDS think most of God's creation will be saved, they want people to know that. They believe God's love is big enough to encompass all.
@@seekingtruthinallthings3969 let's correct your first error. You keep using "evangelicals" many of us like myself are just Bible Christians. No denomination or religion. So let's just sort that out first. You seem to have some hang up with that.
The Bible teaches that those that reject Jesus He will reject them before His Father in Heaven. That is not something anyone just made up, it's in the scripture. (Matthew 10:33) so I don't know why you think that is made up.
Have you ever read Jude 7? Ever in your life? Let's do that now, together, shall we? I'll post it here:
_just as Sodom and Gomorrah and the surrounding cities, which likewise indulged in sexual immorality and pursued unnatural desire, serve as an example by undergoing a punishment of eternal fire_
the torture of eternal fire is set for all eternity for those that were caught up in Sodom and Gomorrah. This is fact you can read from these verses also: Matthew 25:41, 46; Mark 9:42-48; 2 Thessalonians 1:5-10; Revelation 14:9- 11; and Revelation 20:10, 14-15
Jesus depicts “hell” as a place “where their worm does not die, and the fire is not quenched” (Mark 9:47-48). Paul’s reference to “eternal destruction” in 2 Thessalonians 1:9, indicates a figurative devastation that the damned will experience forever in hell, separated from the Lord’s royal presence.
Revelation 14:10, where we read that the impenitent “will be tormented with burning sulfur,” depicts the hellfire imagery as agony, not annihilation. John speaks of everlasting torment when he adds, “and the smoke of their torment rises for ever and ever” (v. 11).
Everything always has the opposite. Up/down, back/front, good/evil, love/hate, heaven/hell
If there is eternal life
then there is also eternal death.
God bless GLM ministry as they share the truth and shine the light of Jesus, I pray many seeds would be planted and watered, open their eyes Lord to the truth, to the One and True Living God. Amen.
Hit that like button people, we love the LDS, our battle is not against flesh and blood.
Only the thumbs down.. there is no friendly dialogue. You don't have a very reputable history.. You're all about the peace, but for the last 2,000 years it wasn't so peaceful.. ✝️.. then our people were driven out of a free country and murdered now you're just a bunch of soft core religious, intolerant, bigots.. facts!
If you love them be friends with them regardless of the differences. Find the Unity and be like Jesus showed us. When God looks down on us the first thing He will see is the unity with Christ all His children have not the differences. He doesnot judge differences like men do. Get to know your mormon brothers and sisters. You can't save them. you can only plant the actual living word of God's love for them into them. This is how we become mature witnesses of Christ. It is through seeing the Christ who died for us in living action through those who love Him that will allow the Spirit of God to reveal Christ. You may be surprised what Father will reveal to you in this service of Jesus' Mission. Nothing is impossible for our God. his ways are not our ways. His ways are higher that our ways. A little here, alittle there, line upon line and precept upon precept. Love us into understanding you convictions in Christ and do not fear our convictions. Find Unity not fault. Thank you for your love of the Godhead. And declaring love for Latter Day Saints.
Here's one Major reason why i could never be a contemporary Christian.
1. The history of church and state.. the union of a corrupt church ✝️ and a corrupt gov't ✝️.. and for what they did to the prophets and to the poor.. I'm too American. I'm not a trader.. goes against every fiber in my being. I hate tyranny
With that being the case, you would likely love biblical Christianity😊
I’d encourage you to look into it, as it is very distinct from the Roman Catholic Church (which I also reject as being tyrannical and corrupt) and not about forcing anyone into anything.
As long as your priests wear the cross around their necks and your churches bear the cross, all i see are traders to God and the people.. i can't do it.. my history goes back to the early saints who would rather die than submit.. that is my bloodline.
2,000 years of persecution.. now it's soft core bigotry and intolerance.. you guys are part of something special
I'm not really sure where you are coming from? Bigotry? Intolerance? What does sharing the gospel have to do with bigotry and intolerance?
Did you watch a different video and then comment on this one? Have you ever had a conversation with one of these people? They love you?
It reminds me of Jews for Jesus who think they are only doing good. Yet they are creating more conflict through their so-called ministry. It is their tactics many Jews don't appreciate.
Yea now their persecuting Mormons..lol
Do you consider it persecution, bigotry and intolerance when Mormon missionaries go door to door sharing Mormonism and trying to convert Christians?
Great to share the true gospel with the mormons, but given the many different protestant church and their wild ways of twisting scripture, mormons might be better off remaining ignorant and staying mormon. If there was only one protestant church, then maybe, but the many different churches with ‘Faith Alone’ is equally false and based entirely on ‘lack of faith’ that our Lord Jesus Christ could establish his one true Church which is the ‘pillar and bulwark’ of truth. One comment near the end disagreeing with mormons believing they must obey the commandments is ridiculous. You better obey the commandments if you have any hope of inheriting the kingdom of heaven someday.
God requires perfection to get into heaven. We need the righteousness of God. Matthew 5:48 Be ye therefore perfect.
Have you kept the commandments perfectly?
@@Elizabeth-rk3do Have kept them as best as I know. But it is the Lord who judges us, we cannot even judge ourselves.
As Paul says in 1 Corinthians 4: 3 But with me it is a very small thing that I should be judged by you or by any human court. I do not even judge myself. 4 I am not aware of anything against myself, but I am not thereby acquitted. It is the Lord who judges me.
Paul also says in Philippians 2: 12 Therefore, my beloved, as you have always obeyed, so now, not only as in my presence but much more in my absence, work out your own salvation with fear and trembling; 13 for God is at work in you, both to will and to work for his good pleasure.
How about you? Have you kept the commandments perfectly?
Funny thing but the Book of Mormon tells us the same thing about salvation as the Bible tells us. Unfortunately Brigham Young hijacked the church upon the murder of Joseph and Hyrum Smith (It may have even been an inside job with Brigham at the forefront). Brigham did everything the Book of Mormon said not to do. He went against God on everything.
The Book of Mormon contradicts the Bible.
@@Elizabeth-rk3do Please give me some examples.
@icecreamladydriver1606
According to the Bible, God commanded that only one temple was to be built. It must be in Jerusalem. There was only one high priest at a time.
According to the Book of Mormon, there were multiple temples and multiple high priests. This violates God's command.
*******
According to the Book of Mormon, God cursed people with dark skin. Dark skin can turn white. 3 Nephi 2:15
According to the Bible, God never cursed anyone with dark skin. Dark skin can not turn white.
********
According to the Bible, it took over 153,600 men seven years to build Solomon's temple.
I Kings 5; 2 Chronicles 2:1-7
According to the Book of Mormon, a few men built a replica of Solomon's temple soon after they arrived.
@icecreamladydriver1606
In I Nephi 1, 600 BC, it talks about the language of Reformed Egyptian. Egyptians speak Arabic. Hebrews living in Jerusalem spoke Hebrew. No Israelite would be recording their history in a fictional language.
In I Nephi 1, it has a prophecy concerning the destruction of Jerusalem. According to the Bible, the first deportation from Jerusalem occurred nine years prior in 609 BC. There would be no need to prophesy the destruction of Jerusalem. It was well under way.
In 6:21 he calls Mormonism "this false doctrine of Mormonism" do you know where you can learn more about the false doctrine of Mormonism, by reading the entire Bible and actually making an effort to understand it instead of repeating the easily refuted verses always quoted from Galatians about "another gospel" seriously if you just read the next chapter in Galatians youll find Paul accusing Peter of teaching that other Gospel
Peter doesn't accuse Paul of teaching another gospel, in Galatians. He accuses him of not following it. Peter was fellowshipping with the uncircumcised Gentiles and when some Circumcised believers came he withdrew for fear of the judgments of that crowd. That is not Peter preaching or teaching a different gospel. That was Peter in sin.
It saddens me that you would be so flippant about the Galatians verse to begin with.
Paul begins by showing his surprise that some believers would be swayed by a different gospel by "distort[ing] the gospel of Christ." He then tells them to reject any new gospel that is presented to them even if its from them or an angel. Many focus on the circumcision topic, but this isn't the gospel that Paul is speaking about. The Gospel he is speaking about is found in verse 2:4 where Paul writes about false brothers who had snuck in and tried to enslave them in their freedom. Essentially, Paul's gospel is one of freedom from a works based salvation and these breatheren were trying to enslave people to the Law once again. Now in this case the topic was circumcision but circumcision isn't the gospel. Our freedom in Christ is the gospel. So Peter doesn't get opposed by Paul because Peter was teaching we all had to get circumcised but because he wasn't living in fear of those who were.
The entire Bible tells us, according to God that "before [God] there was no god formed, nor will any be formed after [God]."
Lucifer was exiled from heaven because he said in his heart, "I will rise above the clouds. I will be like the Most High."
"rise above the clouds," "riding on the clouds of heaven," "coming on the clouds of heaven," were ancient idioms used only for the gods/God. Knowing this we can rephrase Lucifer's ambition thus: "I will become a God. I will be like the Most High." Joseph Smith and his church today teach this very ambition. Don't tell us that Mormonism conforms to the Bible because it doesn't. It distorts it, just like Galatians warned us about.
Have you ever read Joseph Smith's translation of the Bible. Its disgusting. I just purchased it. I feel guilty even laying it beside my real Bible. Most of his changes are just modern language updates to make it read easier but when he starts into passages he removes Jesus from them. Completely distorts and changes the most credible ancient text on the planet.
@blusheep2 What saddens me is that you post a long post that you e expect me to read, and you start it off talking as if it was Peter who wrote Galatians.
" 7 But contrariwise, when they saw that the gospel of the uncircumcision was committed unto me, as the gospel of the circumcision was unto Peter" (Galatians 2:7)
Paul makes the distinction himself right there. "The gospel of uncircumcision" he was teaching vs. "The gospel of circumcision" Peter was teaching.
You can spin it all you want and use botched modern translations, but this is not dealing with the Bible vs. Book of Mormon at all. It's dealing with those presenting the idea that Gentiles need to be circumcised to be saved.
The Book of Mormon validates Paul's gospel:
"...and the law of circumcision is done away in me." (Moroni 8:8)
Do you know who presents a contradictory gospel? Evangelical Christianty does. You have adopted the unbiblical "Sola scritura" gospel that no one with authority ever declared, and you limited the scriptures to the late 4th century canonization minus the Apocrypha. It's a false gospel.
@@BrianTerrill Brian, that was not a long post. If you can't have the patience to read 3 paragraphs and a couple sentences then you are probably just forming your beliefs on emotion which isn't a good way to discover truth. If you don't want a longer response then don't make to many claims because I'm going to answer all of them.
I understand that Paul wrote Galatians. That was just a typo. Two names starting with "P". This is obviously the case since I say it correctly in the following paragraphs.
You quoted Galatians 2:7 incorrectly. What it says is _...seeing that I had been entrusted with the gospel TO the uncircumcised..._ That is the Gentiles. You are reading the KJV which isn't always clear. Here are how more modern Bibles translate it:
NASB, NIV, ESV, LSB, NET, RSV, "...to the uncircumcised."
NKJV, CSB, "...for the uncircumcised..."
If you doubt this then you can just read the rest of the verse in the KJV... _that the gospel of the uncircumcision was committed unto me, as the gospel of the circumcision was unto Peter;_
The verse validates both Paul's and Peter's ministry. One to the Gentiles and one to the Jews. You can't have 2 gospels yet the verse said one gospel was to the uncircumcised and the other to the circumcised. Do you see?
You've already demonstrated that you can't read anything for more then a minute or two so I guess I shouldn't be disappointed with your hermeneutical skills. This is simple context my friend. It isn't butchering anything. Be honest with yourself.
We can even see it at the beginning of the letter. Verses 1:6 _I am amazed that you are so quickly deserting Him who called you by the grace of Christ for a different gospel._
See? The gospel is about the "grace" of Christ. "Grace" means that you are receiving something you don't deserve. Its a gift.
I agree with Moroni's take on Paul and circumcision. But "circumcision" is NOT the gospel.
Bringing up Sola Scriptura was just a deflection from the proof I provided through scripture that Joseph taught Luciferian doctrines that you now believe.
@blusheep2 correction, I don't read anything that's not factual. There is a difference.
If you start a long post with typos, that's a turn-off. And lecturing me about it would be like lecturing someone about why they didn't read a long post by Joe Biden despite the typos which would abound.
Plus, only a small part of your post actually deals with Galatians, and you showed that A) you didn't read it and B) you made the long winded commentary as a substitution to actually reading Galatians and rely once again on people not going back and reading the Bible itself
The rest of your post was so incoherent that you may as have written "blah blah blah blah blah blah blah"
@@BrianTerrill Come on, do better then that. You said, "I don't read anything that's not factual. There is a difference." How do you know something is not factual until you read it?
Are you really going to be so uncharitable that you are going to judge a response on its typos? Especially, when the next few lines make it clear that a typo was all it was?
What is going on, is that you know what I'm saying is reasonable. That backs you into a corner, because no one wants to be wrong, including myself. So instead of adapting your views to new information, you go after all the meaningless things instead.
Since you've decided to attack my grammar instead of interacting with the Bible, I can only ask that you think about these things carefully. Don't be flippant about them and don't just forget our conversation. Joseph and the LDS church teach the ambition and sin of Lucifer. They directly contradict that God is the only one that was, is, and will be. All Mormonism is, is a guide to your own downfall. Even if, right now, you are in the act of denying this, you better think hard about it because you have no excuse. Don't follow your desire. Follow the truth of the written word of God.
@12:40 and there is the devilish doctrine the opposite of "if ye love me keep my commandments" This individual wants us to stop loving Jesus Christ. That is not of Jesus Christ. The Unknown God has a great hold on so many.
@14:00 I don't think any of us would call you anti Mormon but your words seem Anti Jesus and love for him.
We absolutely affirm that we demonstrate love for God by keeping His commandments. But that doesn't necessitate that such obedience is the means by which we have eternal life.
You really can believe you're justified by faith alone, and ALSO that you should do good works in love to God without conflating those two categories.
@@clearstonewindows Interesting, how does he seem anti Jesus?
@@GLM Well, finally we agree on one doctrine! We aquire salvation by the power of the Grace of God as brought to us by Christ. I agree. Many of Christ's followers obey less than other's. Obedience is our offerring to Him of sacrifice. God still requires our obedience. He tells us that obedience is better than sacrifice and we aught to sacrifice our old nature on the alter to be able to mature in Christ. Our works are what we will be rewarded or punished for when we stand face to face. He will not deny us entrance into His eternity because we were not 100% obedient. He loves us too much for that. But, if we want to progress to a higher resurrection that Paul strived for then our obedience plays a big factor in the reward we will recieve. His apsoltles were obedient unto death and their reward is Crowns and seats near the King. God desire is to see us develop to our highest level of glory in His family and in our eternity. Obedience is the key we need to unlock our potential.
The idea is mutual, the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter Day Saints has many reasons to believe that your doctrine and creeds made by councils of men who were only ordained to repeat the message they were given, not determine doctrine, are so different from what is taught in scripture that they have gone astray. The comparison comes down to who has the more consistent claim according to what scripture says calls a prophet, Protestants and Orthodox don’t have a consistent claim, they have gone their own way.
LOL 😂 the Trinity comes from the TWO Powers in Heaven: that is israelite theology of the 2nd temple period and is what Genesis 19:24 states the visible YHWH on Earth sent distruction from the Invisible YHWH in Heaven to destroy Sodom and Gomorrah.
@@davidjanbaz7728 Something that shows two powers does not support the Trinitarian creed. The claim of the creed is that God the Father and the Son are consubstantial, one Lord on Earth and one Lord being in Heaven does not give meaning toward both being singular in substance anywhere. It supports the doctrine of the Godhead, God the Father and the Son, the perfect heir, given as shadow of Abraham and Isaac, a father and son tested by shadowing the sacrifice of the heir. Two beings of separate substance but one in glory, authorship of Creation, doctrine, and judgement. Paul teaches that Jesus is the heir along with faithful followers in Romans 8: 14-18. Jesus prays that His disciples will be one with Him and the Father as He and the Father are one in John 17: 20-24.
@@boltrooktwoword salad
@@ChomoBidensMules It is a response to something in the video. If you know history and what the creeds are I am referring to it isn’t word salad.
The protesters really help me to know that I am in the right church. They are fulfilling prophecy. Greater the truth, greater the opposition.
Logical fallacy. The Jehovah's Witness believes the exact same thing.
@@BrendonKing its amazing when you actually attend conference. When you are walking in you get yelled at, abused, told you are going to hell. They burn sacred things on the streets and you can feel the evil from most of the people claiming to love us and want us to know the truth. But then you go inside the walls of the conference centre and its just so peaceful. You feel love and happiness. You quickly forget about the abuse outside. By the way the church does not say anything about whats outside except to be nice and dont be mean to any of the protesters. I know the feelings i get outside are far from christlike, compared to how i feel when i enter the conference centre. Protesters should go about their day and worship how they feel they should. Dont spend time putting down others beliefs .
@@BrendonKingwhat kind of service and humanitarian aid does you and your congregation give? I am looking for fruits.
Although I understand why you do street preaching, I think we need to explore this a little more. You are very simple thinkers and it is a bit scary. You see, one of you said " the meanest thing you can do is let people believe wrong and go to Hell." or something like that. You used a "bus coming at someone " analogy.
BUT, isn't the meanest thing you can do, choosing to worship a God that will allow most people to go to a torturous Hell for not having correct knowledge in this 80 years of life? You worship God believing he is like that! THAT is not mercy in anyway that anyone can understand. Yet you call it mercy???
You throw reason out the window with your thought processes and that is hard to respect.
When I talked to a few of you this General conference (I was there), I asked you if you will think about the Mormons (and most of mankind who you naturally believe are not saved because they got it wrong) when you are in Heaven and they are being tortured in Hell. I would like an answer.
I will give my own bus anology. If you saw your family being driven away to a torture camp (in a bus), leaving you at an all inclusive resort on a beautiful beach, would you do anything and everything to save them even if it meant giving up your own comfort forever. Would you leave that luxury resort and venture on a very unsure path of risk and harm. Would you offer to go to the torture camp instead of them? Would you fight for them forever?
I find your love for all mankind temporary. It will only last a life time. I will give you the benefit of the doubt in thinking perhaps you are simple thinkers, but there is NO respect in your belief system when it comes to Heaven and Hell and this grace of God that makes no sense.
Please explain Heaven and Hell to me. Please explain common grace and why it only lasts a life time.
U seem to be confused : Grace leads us to Heaven so its Eternal.
@@davidjanbaz7728 I don't understand.
Edit. Are you saying common grace is eternal? That is wonderful news. Because common grace is the type of grace that every single person is able to experience in this life. So you are saying it continues in the next life for all people? That is wonderful.
@@seekingtruthinallthings3969based on your questions, which can be found using a simple search, you have a hard time grasping concepts yet arrogantly imply others think very simple.
The hypocrisy seems to be obvious.
@@georgebauerschmidt5289I guess I do have a hard time understanding a God who finds pleasure in torturing most of his creation for eternity. Maybe I am too stupid to understand this.
@@seekingtruthinallthings3969 your words not mine. Agree.
I am LDS and i believe in God the Father and his Son Jesus Christ and in the Holy Ghost. I believe Paul when he said that if it wasn't for the atoning sacrifice of Jesus Christ there would be no need for Baptisms for the dead. Why were these people practicing baptisms for the dead during Christ time? Why were five of the 10 virgins locked out of the wedding? Christ said he didn't know them because they were late because they had no oil for their lamps. Christians always say they believe in the Bible, yet they don't understand and don't want to understand the bible. Noah only had all of 8 people on the boat because of how wicked the world was at that time. Why do christians believe they would have helped build the ship if they were asked to, they would of been hanging around on the ground telling Noah that he believes in a different Jesus than they do. He would have been right. Christ did a LOT to make it possible for us to return to him, however he requires that we step in the water to show faith or take a step towards the mountain before he will move it or clear the water for us to walk across the land. Why did Jesus go to Prison for three days after he died and before he was resurrected? Why didn't he go to heaven? He went to Prison because he still believes all can be saved, this is one reason the Temples are being built and Isreal is being gathered. LDS people are so far ahead of the rest of the churches and is the reason the world hasn't been distroyed yet by the god himself. The Son of Man is real, he has a body of flesh and blood. He loves all of us . I would seriously start studying the bible for what it is really about. Christians have no problem ignoring Abraham being told by God to sacrifice his son, why did Abraham have to do this, but all Christians have to to is say they believe in the Jesus that is in the Bible? Too easy just to do that.
exactly!!!! This is 'outside of the box' thinking and it is amazing!
Yes but there’s a difference between being logistically saved & spiritually. Technically anyone who climbed aboard the ark would’ve survived the flood. In terms of baptism, that’s simply a representation of living a pure life. As for your comment that God would’ve destroyed the earth had it not been for the restoration, that’s quite the dangerously bold & flawed claim. Not sure I’ve heard that one before. Making detrimental & cutthroat assertions is exactly why Mormons have dealt with such a target on their backs yet ironically believe they’re “victims”. Gee I wonder why. I’ll defend Mormonism here & there when Christians become unhinged & hypocritical but when you guys start becoming outlandish yourself that’s where I draw the line. As for your opinion about why Jesus stopped by Hell, first off he didn’t go to hell he went to sheol which is the temporary place for disembodied spirits to reside. So he wasn’t with the demons. He was there to offer a way out for the wicked (perhaps from the flood) & maybe some righteous too who were there.
@@coppersky awesome. So he will do the same for people who go to sheol in our time too. Correct? If not, why?
You’re right Royce. As a fellow member I stand by what you say.
@@seekingtruthinallthings3969 I'm not sure what you're asking. If you're asking me if he'll return to sheol during these times I have no idea. It's certainly true that LDS theology indicates a "spirit prison/paradise" before judgement but I don't know if that's the same.
this guy refuses to answer my questions. He cannot tell us if Jesus is or is not God the Father. He does not know the Bible.
The Christian belief is that Jesus is a separate person from God the Father. The belief that the Father “turns into the son or spirit and back again” is a heresy called “modalism”.
The Trinitarian belief is that all 3 are separate persons, but all 3 equally God. And I think key to point out to LDS, is that all 3 have ALWAYS been God. That’s really where the key differences show. A lot of confusion can be present when “3 separate persons” SOUNDS like the “Godhead”. Yet, the description in scripture is that all 3 are God and there was never a time where they were not God. None of them BECAME God, they always were.
@@carderprice8495 Jesus was not always God. Revelations 3:21 makes that clear.
@@michaelparks5669 what we read in Revelation 3:21 is a reminder that Jesus did overcome. He overcame death. There was a time where Jesus took human form and was not physically at the right hand of the Father. But then he overcame death and was seated again. Hebrews paints this beautifully. That the high priests of old never had a seat in the temple, as their work was never finished. But Jesus as Hebrews says, is the “once and for all sacrifice”. He sat down when it “was finished”.
”Every priest stands daily ministering and offering time after time the same sacrifices, which can never take away sins; but He, having offered one sacrifice for sins for all time, sat down at the right hand of God,“
Hebrews 10:11-12
Also, John 1:1 is very clear in showing Jesus has always been God.
@@carderprice8495 clearly you are confused. Revelation 1-3 chapters are about Jesus telling John to tell the saints to obey the commandments Jesus gave. Overcoming is to overcome sin. Those that overcome sin will Jesus grant to sit next to him as He overcame sin, and he sits next to the Father. He is not the Father. In the garden of Gethsemane Jesus does not do his own will but the Fathers. They are not the same person. On the cross Jesus is speaking to the Father saying "why have you forsaken me" Jesus is not the Father After the resurrection Jesus says to Mary Magdalene in John 20:17 that he ascending to her Father and his Father her God AND HIS GOD. Thus Jesus has a God.
John 1:1 is about the logos which means the plan. Jesus was chosen before the world to be the savior. Who chose him? Therefore Jesus has a God that chose him to be a savior. That person is Heavenly Father. The person Jesus sits next to on the throne. The person Jesus is at the right hand of. The person that Jesus did the will of. The person Jesus prayed to. The person who is our Father and our God, and Jesus Father and Jesus God.
Just because you don’t mean to be disrespectful, doesn’t mean that you aren’t.
You have been disrespectful to Historical Christians since Joseph Smith's comment that God told him all Christians R in the mother church of Abominations.
So you attacked us first!!!
Do you think Paul and other early Christians were disrespectful when they would go to the Jewish synagogues and preach the gospel, as recorded throughout the book of Acts?
Instead of protesting, you should be celebrating everyone's constitutional right to worship according to the dictates of their own conscience and not yours. Especially since we're not burning infants, praying to idols, or forcing our religion onto anyone.
If, on the other hand, you want everyone to bow down to your version of God and without any differences of opinion, then you might consider moving to Iran.
Allahu Akbar.
It’s sad that you believe that you can branch off from the Catholic Church and believe you would be correct. If the Catholic Church is wrong, so are you. You can’t reform something that is false.
You need a restoration. The restoration happened which leaves you in the cold.
Either the Catholic Church is Christ’s church or The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints is the restored church. All others are false man made churches.
the lds church was started by a man not christ or god
@@geoffreypalmer2661How was your belief system started by God then? Is the Bible infallible, allinclusive and are the men who interpret it infallible?
@@seekingtruthinallthings3969 yes the bible is infalibale is the book of mormon infailabe nope because its made up by a con artist
Since you guys botch Galatians so bad, let's go through it step by step (using King James Version only):
Paul says:
"6 I marvel that ye are so soon removed from him that called you into the grace of Christ unto another gospel:
7 Which is not another; but there be some that trouble you, and would pervert the gospel of Christ.
8 But though we, or an angel from heaven, preach any other gospel unto you than that which we have preached unto you, let him be accursed. (Galatians 1:6-8)
Who is Paul talking to? Galatians, who happen to be Gentiles. Paul clarifies that the other gospel being preached isn't necessarily another, but that which he has preached is being perverted. Who is the WE Paul is implying here? There were certain Jews who were telling Gentiles they needed to be circumcised to be saved, and that issue was brought up to the church in Jerusalem. It was settled doctrine by the apostles that Gentiles were not obligated to keep the Torah just the Noahide laws, which is why they were still forbidden from drinking blood, committing murder, fornication, and worshipping idols.
Paul was going to the other extreme, though, and also teaching Jews that they should do the sane, which he was rebuked for by James the last time he was in Jerusalem.
A significant part of this Gospel Paul preached was that he learned it not by studying the scriptures or seeking other apostles but by personal revelation:
"12 For I neither received it of man, neither was I taught it, but by the revelation of Jesus Christ." (Galatians 1:13)
What is ironic is how Evangelicals actually discourage personal revelation and knock it down when latter day saints share their experiences. Evangelicals always fall back on their interpretation of the Bible over prompting from the Holy Ghost, so in a certain way, preach a different Gospel from Paul.
"15 But when it pleased God, who separated me from my mother’s womb, and called me by his grace,
16 To reveal his Son in me, that I might preach him among the heathen; immediately I conferred not with flesh and blood:
17 Neither went I up to Jerusalem to them which were apostles before me; but I went into Arabia, and returned again unto Damascus" (Galatians 1:15-17)
The above verses, actually reveal Paul's own pride. He says he immediately conferred not in flesh and blood but the fact is he was blinded and commanded to go to to Damascus and it would be told him what to do. The Lord also sent Ananias to heal his sight and baptize him. Next in Acts, it reads:
"19 And when he had received meat, he was strengthened. Then was Saul certain days with the disciples which were at Damascus" (Acts 9:19)
The account of him going to Arabia isn't told in Acts, which would have been a serious omission.
"1 Then fourteen years after I went up again to Jerusalem with Barnabas, and took Titus with me also" (Galatians 2:1)
The problem is that Paul did go to Jerusalem at least once in between this time in verse 1 and when he departed after seeing Peter and James the first time.
"6 But of these who seemed to be somewhat, (whatsoever they were, it maketh no matter to me: God accepteth no man’s person:) for they who seemed to be somewhat in conference added nothing to me:" Galatians 2:6)
He is not naming names but the animosity between him and Jesus brother James is pretty obvious.
In the very next verse Paul distinguished his gospel, the gospel of uncircumcision to what Peter was teaching, the Gospel of circumcision:
" But contrariwise, when they saw that the gospel of the uncircumcision was committed unto me, as the gospel of the circumcision was unto Peter" (Galatians 2:7)
And note
"The gospel of circumcision unto Peter" there is your other Gospel, it's not the Book of Mormon brilliant people.
When Paul speaks respectful of Peter he refers to him as Cephas as ge does in this verse:
"9 And when James, Cephas, and John, who seemed to be pillars, perceived the grace that was given unto me, they gave to me and Barnabas the right hands of fellowship; that we should go unto the heathen, and they unto the circumcision." (Galatians 2:9)
I find it interesting that Paul wrote Timothy and said:
"15 This thou knowest, that all they which are in Asia be turned away from me; of whom are Phygellus and Hermogenes" (2 Timothy 1:15)
Yet John, many years later, is leading the churches in Asia and using Jewish lingo.
Back to Galatians
"11 But when Peter was come to Antioch, I withstood him to the face, because he was to be blamed.
12 For before that certain came from James, he did eat with the Gentiles: but when they were come, he withdrew and separated himself, fearing them which were of the circumcision. 13 And the other Jews dissembled likewise with him; insomuch that Barnabas also was carried away with their dissimulation.
14 But when I saw that they walked not uprightly according to the truth of the gospel, I said unto Peter before them all, If thou, being a Jew, livest after the manner of Gentiles, and not as do the Jews, why compellest thou the Gentiles to live as do the Jews?" (Galatians 2:11-14)
So this other Gospel Paul is preaching about absolutely has nothing to do with the Book of Mormon at all. It has to do with Paul's spat with Peter and James specifically, and John implied.
Paul wrote Galatians while in Rome and he got to Rome after going to the temple in Jerusalem following these verses:
"18 And the day following Paul went in with us unto James; and all the elders were present.
19 And when he had saluted them, he declared particularly what things God had wrought among the Gentiles by his ministry.
20 And when they heard it, they glorified the Lord, and said unto him, Thou seest, brother, how many thousands of Jews there are which believe; and they are all zealous of the law:
21 And they are informed of thee, that thou teachest all the Jews which are among the Gentiles to forsake Moses, saying that they ought not to circumcise their children, neither to walk after the customs.
22 What is it therefore? the multitude must needs come together: for they will hear that thou art come.
23 Do therefore this that we say to thee: We have four men which have a vow on them;
24 Them take, and purify thyself with them, and be at charges with them, that they may shave their heads: and all may know that those things, whereof they were informed concerning thee, are nothing; but that thou thyself also walkest orderly, and keepest the law.
25 As touching the Gentiles which believe, we have written and concluded that they observe no such thing, save only that they keep themselves from things offered to idols, and from blood, and from strangled, and from fornication. (Acts 21:18-25)
There is evidence of the animosity between James and Paul in their other epistles as well, for example Paul wrote:
"3 For what saith the scripture? Abraham believed God, and it was counted unto him for righteousness.
4 Now to him that worketh is the reward not reckoned of grace, but of debt.
5 But to him that worketh not, but believeth on him that justifieth the ungodly, his faith is counted for righteousness.(Romans 4:3-5)
So Paul teaches that Abraham was justified by faith alone, contrast this to what James says:
"20 But wilt thou know, O vain man, that faith without works is dead?
21 Was not Abraham our father justified by works, when he had offered Isaac his son upon the altar?
22 Seest thou how faith wrought with his works, and by works was faith made perfect?
23 And the scripture was fulfilled which saith, Abraham believed God, and it was imputed unto him for righteousness: and he was called the Friend of God.
24 Ye see then how that by works a man is justified, and not by faith only. (James 2:20-24)
I know some Evangelicals try to harmonize what Paul says to what James and the others say by making simple statements such as "well if you are truly saved you'll naturally want to do good works" I'd just point out that being asked to sacrifice our son is not a good work. God will test our OBEDIENCE.
I like what you are doing Brian.
Maybe read Ephesians 2:8-9 and see how it contradicts 2 Nephi 25:23
That was all I needed to read to know in my prayer to know the b/M was not true. The Holy Spirit doesn't contradict His words.
@georgebauerschmidt5289 Ephesians 2:8-9 contradicts the rest of the Bible, let's be honest.
@BrianTerrill thank you Brian. Thank you for standing with me in this. The Bible is all about works and so ephesians would contradict that. There are so many apparent contradictions in the Bible. We don't need to mush them together to try to make sense of them. Fallible men wrote the Bible, we are all trying to make sense of it, we are all fallible and it is the Spirit that teaches spiritual truth. We obviously were put on this earth to walk by faith, not having all the answers. But what do we do with that faith?
@@BrianTerrill then you don't know the Bible. It fits perfectly with John 3:15-16, Romans 10:9, Galatians 2:16, Acts 16:31, John 3:22, Romans 4:4-5, Romans 5:1, Titus 3 :4-5 and many others verses that are in the Bible. Read these verses I listed which ones are contradicting Ephesians?
All these are not supporting works. Just read Romans 5 :1 and tell me what that says....
Bradley, why do you feel the need to film people? That makes me uncomfortable.
Definately. If a church filmed me and said my faith in Christ was wrong, I would be uncomfortable too. I just can't see Jesus in that behavior. It's not something He did as a money making venture in His earthly life. You tube monetization changes people. we are all failable.
@@nanizon I can tell you 💯% it's not for money. Where do you get the idea it's for money?? Did you watch the whole video? Is it that crazy to believe that Christians actually want to share the good news of the gospel with their Mormon neighbors? RUclips is a fantastic platform to reach people along side street evangelism and personal relationships. If GLM wanted to make money they wouldn't take the time to make a channel about teaching Mormons the gospel - they would make videos like Mr Beast.
@@Marisa-yf1vc Ask him how much money he makes from his you tube content; that's what I meant. No, it's not crazy to believe that some Christians want to share their version of the Gospel of Christ with other Christians. We all feel that way, including Latter Day Saints because we all experience the love of God in our worship of Christ and want others to feel it. What's crazy is to think that just because another Christian doesn't worship like you, they are not Christ's and to judge them to hell. Only our Father will judge His children not other men. It's the way he's going about trying to share that is unbecoming a servant of the Lord. Heavenly Father and Jesus never tresspass on others to teach or share. They don't try to force others to gear The Word and think that it qualifies as spreading the Gospel or that others have not heard the Good News. How would you feel if LDS "protested" outside your church when you finished your worship service, telling you you were wrong about how you believe Christ? If you want to have a sharing moment, ask them. Go to their Sunday service and talk calmly one on one. The LDS Church welcomes Investigators to come and see for themselves. That's just one of the things I love about loving our neighbors. I would love to share beliefs back and forth in a mutually respectful manner. Mostly because I love Jesus and He is my favorite topic. I never deny Jesus the opportunity to enlighten me in some knowledge I don't yet have. I believe Father has created us all with a spark of His Divinity and that there are no bounds for God to teach us something new about Himself. We can inspire each other to understand and love Christ more in the right divine spirit.
@@nanizonhow much money does this organization make from the malls and shopping centers?
@@georgebauerschmidt5289 The money I'm reffering to comes from you tube content.
The saddest part of this whole video, Bradley, is that you actually believe such nonsense. That you actually believe your God is going to condemn people to eternal hell. Your God is not worthy of worship. Repent, and turn to a God that would never condemn somebody for a simple belief, based on a book full of contradictions from thousands of years ago.
Also, you guys can’t be surprised when so many people are leaving evangelicalism.
Do you think God will condemn anyone?
@GLM will God condemn a Buddhist who died in 50 AD for not hearing and accepting Jesus?
@@GLMnot anyone that is sincerely seeking god, or has love in his heart for his fellow man. I think you will be sorely surprised that god is far more loving that you give him credit for.
Your position is no different that the brother of the prodigal son. You, too, are missing the whole point.
Thank you so much Kapaya! That is mind blowing.
In that parable, the Prodigal Son *returned home*. You have taken God's love and let it run amok and destroy the justice and holiness of God. Mankind is sinful and wicked, and we are all deserving of judgment and wrath.
The God of Love is the same God who commanded that Israel wipe out the Canaanites. He is the same God who wiped Sodom and Gomorrah off the face of the planet. The same God who turned against Judah so harshly, that their desperation made them eat their own children for sustenance. This God poured out His mighty wrath upon His son-that all who believe in Him may have eternal life... He was crushed for our iniquities.
But the Bible is equally clear-all those who do NOT believe in Him will perish beneath the incredible weight of God's just judgements-just as those peoples in the Old Testament did.
Our view of God must encompass and consider the entirety of the Biblical narrative - God is not a man that He should lie, and He does not change. If He was full of hot anger towards unrepentant sin yesterday (as demonstrated by the Old Testament stories)-then He is *still* full of anger towards unrepentant sin today.
Wow... that's not a very loving Heavenly Father if he is automatically sending people to hell for not 100% knowing him. I really feel bad for 3rd world countries who will never hear the word of God....
Also, this is not an appropriate way to spread the gospel.. that's like if LDS members stood in front of an Evangelical church and handed out Book of Mormons
1) We'd really love to have LDS members come outside our churches to talk with us!
2) LDS Missionaries come to my house - which is arguably more intense than coming to my church.
3) Yes - that's why we send many missionaries to 3rd world countries, so that the people can hear the Gospel and be saved. Romans 10:14-15 - "How then will they call on him in whom they have not believed? And how are they to believe in him of whom they have never heard? And how are they to hear without someone preaching? And how are they to preach unless they are sent? As it is written, 'How beautiful are the feet of those who preach the good news!'"
You come to our houses and try to handout the Book of Mormon: which is worse!!!
@davidjanbaz7728 but you have the right to have a no soliciting sign or your door, or you can politely ask them to leave. They don't have that option ar general conference
@GLM Is my Great Grandma as well as many of my other ancestors in Hell because they believed in the "wrong Jesus"?
@@austineastman777 GLM. please answer this question. It is important.
This is not respectful or loving. It would be like other denominations standing outside of your church and trying to preach to you, while you are trying to go worship. Not nice “christians” - you should allow for LDS people to have their meetings in peace. What a horrible thing to do in front of children.
For what it's worth - we would really like people to come to our churches and talk with us. If eternal life is at stake, it's worth conversing about these things in tons of different contexts!
Also, LDS Missionaries come to our houses, which (arguably) is MORE intense than even coming to our churches. That's not offensive to me - because these are important things to discuss.
I think finding contexts to talk to people is less significant than the content of what we talk about.
@@GLM so when should we allow for others to worship in peace?
@@GLM when do we allow freedom of religion if we go to places of worship to tell people they are wrong?
@@GLM so actually you are a protestor of religion, trying to stop members from exercising their beliefs, since you try to engage them as they exercise their freedom.
ha ha its a great thing to do lds missionarys should let people live their life in peace with out knocking on their doors and bothering them and trying to preach to them
Is this the onion
Babylon Bee is way better.
Atleast with missionaries, they come bearing name tags. It's no secret. You all are like wolves in sheep's clothing
How many of the apostles wore name tags? Didn't think so. Just making stuff up.
Arrogant people
The church remains true. It’s a fact that we Latter-day Saints believe in Jesus and we believe in the bible. Those of you who say it’s a different God, it’s a different Jesus, you are mistaken. Why? Because it’s the same God, the same Jesus. We just simply don’t believe in Catholic doctrine such as the trinity, the Nicene creed etc. The Catholic Church is not the true church on this earth. I have spoken absolute objective universal truths. The church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints is Christ’s church. He presides over it because He is the way, the life and the truth. Latter-day Saints are Christlike all the way. The Latter-day Saints are not only the kindest, they’re the best Christians I’ve ever met and I’m glad to be one of them. I will never leave the true church of Christ. I believe in God the eternal Father, His son Jesus Christ and the Holy Ghost. D&C 20:28 doesn’t support the trinity. The Godhead makes sense 100%. The trinity is false doctrine.
George Baucher Schmidt Once again, you aren’t only wrong about the church and me, you are stubborn. I am right. Your ignorance is as high as the Tower of Babel. I give my testimony of Jesus Christ. He is the Son of God, the Messiah, the Lord of Lords and my Savior. Nothing will ever make me leave His true church that was restored upon the earth. Your problem is that I’ve proven you wrong in every way that you won’t admit it. Your false assumptions about the church can’t break my faith and have been debunked years before. The Catholic doctrine of the trinity is false. Constantine was a pagan. Apostasy did happen all those centuries back. The truth was lost until it was restored through Joseph Smith. The Godhead is the true nature of God. Not only have I spoken eternal truths, you remain wrong in your ignorance. Members leave because they apostatize. They return when they realize they were wrong and that’s happened over millions of times. A truth that you deny. I’ve denied nothing. The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints is the true church restored upon this earth. I’ve spoken absolute objective universal truths. You can’t handle the truth. You whine and cry just because I’m a member of the church that has loving members who demonstrate Christlike love. You are hereby declared a false Christian who believes in pagan doctrines made up by the Catholic Church which is the false church on this earth. All Christian denominations bow to Rome because of the trinity doctrine. You’re one of the blind sheep. Not only have I beaten you in this debate, you don’t have a testimony of Jesus Christ and you have no evidence against the church. In fact no one has evidence against the church. But against the Catholic Church? Plenty of historical events point towards burning innocence for disagreeing with Catholic authorities. All you do is judge and attack. I will continue to defend the restored faith because it is the true faith on this earth restored through Jesus Christ and all His prophets, Joseph Smith included. Also don’t pull this crap about Joseph being in hell. You aren’t God and you clearly have zero knowledge about our church history. Joseph Smith was martyred. One day, you will learn the errors of your ways. For now, you will die in your sins until you realize you must repent. I suggest you repent now rather than later. May God bring you to the truth and open your eyes as Jesus opened the eyes of Saul who continuously persecuted the Saints of God. I know you are wrong and every member knows it too. Every member who’s returned knows you are also wrong. Every member who’s left and stayed that way doesn’t have the truth anymore. You can’t win because you’re on the wrong side and I will continue to defend the church because it’s the one true church restored upon this earth. I’ve witnessed several baptisms and have had visions of God and Heaven so I know the church is true. For those who leave the true church and stay that way, not only have they decided to deny the truth, they’ve also decided to separate themselves away from God. Ever heard of the saying that not every member of the church are true members? Those who leave and stay that way were never true members of Christ’s true church. The true members stay and follow Christ. Every member I’ve met have true Christlike behaviour. Every other Christian of other denominations have presented themselves poorly with no Christlike behaviour. Every misjudgement you make towards me, I will deflect with truth. I will remain in Christ’s true church.
So you are trying to lump Christianity as Roman Catholicism? Are you not aware, Catholicism does not teach correct doctrine, and preach also a works based theology. No, the Bible was never corrupted, there are many remnants that went through the dark ages, who always had the Holy Spirit guide good men in all truths, to safe guard the word of God against heretics and heresies.
The Holy Spirit even tells us this plainly that he would always raise up good men into all truths, to safeguard against the evils and false doctrines, to expose the darkness and false teachings.
No, Mormonism does not believe in the same God or Jesus of the Bible. You willfully choose ignorance and believe in Mormon theology, that God was once a man who had to prove his worthiness and gain "Exaltation" and obtained Godhood status, and then became our God. That is NOT Biblical doctrine, for there are no other Gods as our Lord God clearly stated so in Isaiah.
Isaiah 43:10 “before me there was no God formed, neither shall there be after me.“
Isaiah 44:6 “ I am the first, and I am the last; and beside me there is no God. “
Isaiah 44:8 “ Is there a God beside me? yea, there is no God; I know not any. “
Mormonism takes these passages in Isaiah and because you are spiritually blind, you add to these words and declare that God is only talking about "this world" which is just sad to hear, for if our Lord God was actually a man, and had a God he once worshipped, then he would have said so in the Bible, but we see he clearly tells us he knows of NO other Gods... full stop!
When you stand before the judgement seat of Christ, you will have no excuses, no reasonable explanation for rejecting God's inerrant word which is the Bible alone.
You use the same Christian language, but it means very different things. Stop pretending it means the same thing, it doesn't.
Learn to be honest, and speak honestly about the deeper theology that Mormonism teaches, like how they did back in the early 1980's when I was heavily indoctrinated into Mormonism. We were taught everything I stated about Mormonism and it is all documented in many LDS teaching manuals and official LDS printed sources from the LDS church.
If you want to know the truth, then focus solely on the Bible and trust in God's word, for he cannot lie, he never changes, and he keeps all his promises.
I used to think the same, that Jesus was the same, i am a 43 year old mormon background and went to a mission, and this year i finally realized why Christian denominations Say mormon Jesus is not the same as Christian Jesus. So, yeap it's not the same. I don't really think it Will be grounds for "not being saved" or receive "celestial Glory" whatever These two things mean. I'm just saying it's correct, it is NOT the same Jesus.
@@brotherinchrist72 The trinity came from the Catholic faith. Yet the Catholic faith is wrong. So what is it??? You can't just cherry pick what you like
Your god is not The God of the Old Testament. Your god was once a human and subsequently became a god. That is completely unbiblical. Please stop misleading people by saying you believe in the same things as they do when you don't (and you know that you don't).
As a LDS myself, I do not necessarily agree with this comment. But I totally see where you are coming from.
Give me a break...leave the Mormons alone..their religion might be a little nuts but not much more then the rest..peace😂🔯☪️✝️☯️☮️