on the failure and the cause: the torrential rainfall. I have a 11 years old Aprilia. 2 years ago we were riding with my son from Bayern to Hungary through Austria. 8 hours in biblical rain. To the point that the roads were closed around Graz because of flooding. And no, the bike didn't fail, didn't stop, didn't skip a beat, and started the next morning without problems. With that I'm not saying how brilliant Aprilia is because it is not faultless, but after four BMWs I owned, I had enough. They are really good bikes, but every single one of them had some issues that were typical for the model.
Hence itchy boots choosing the 1987 Teneree for her latest adventure starts off the kick even if the battery is dead, any electrical fault on modern bikes and its probably the end of your ride.
Ah, BMW making the classic mistake with "outsourcing" a service is thinking that you are also outsourcing the responsibility. BMW, the clues in the name "BMW International Assistance", it has your name on it, it represents you to the public, and if Allianz are dropping the ball you need to fix it because all anyone will see or hear is "BMW". Never buy year 1 of anything ;-)
Had a very similar issue / service with my KTM adventure. Ignition unit failed - it was immobiliser element in mine - rendering the bike a non starter. 60 kms north of León Spain, KTM outsource to AA breakdown. KTM in Leon fabulous service, AA not so good, but not in the Allianz league of incompetence!
I was looking forward to this part 2. I get where you’re coming from and I also really like my GSA. You have made us all much wiser to a severe lack of corporate organisation by BMW. It’s typical none engineering management organisation! On the up side it’s great they have great mech. and elect. engineers. Best of luck for the future with your new bike. I’m sure it will be ok in the long run. ✋ Wm.
I understand people love BMW. I really wanted to jump into the brand, but the stories just put me off. I'm glad you are happy and that you love your bike. I hope it really makes you happy for as long as you choose to have it, truly. Cheers.
Thanks Matey. I do think a lot of people go for the brand out of snobbery rather than because the bikes are good (I'd give the 310 models sold in the UK market as an example of this) but a lot of thier bikes are good....but only oif you buy them about 2 years into thier production cycle. If you buy a later R1250GS now I don't think you would have the same level of issues as R1300GS owners are getting (If you would get any at all!)
Yes they are different units between the RT and 1300GS. That also troubles me as it means that the same issue of moisture ingress is still there as part of the design or a manufacturing weakness in this newer module on the GS. I always figured that the button and rubber seal on the RT was the issue as it forms the top section of the Module, but the GS doesn't have that so i'm probably wrong. I hope that BMW have built in a fail safe that prevents such failures from shutting down the engine when the bike is in gear and moving. In my case it certainly didn't prevent the engine stopping, but it was in neutral on centre stand. Module identifiers below R1300GS Control Module Keyless Ride - Ece/Row - BMW-Motorrad (66125A9E8A1) 2022-2024 BMW-Motorrad - 66125a9e8a1 R1250RT Keyless Ride Control Unit - Ece/Row - BMW-Motorrad (66127108713) 2012-2025 BMW-Motorrad - 66127108713
That’s interesting, were you also able to see the location of the module? On my RT it’s very obvious, but I couldn’t see anything similar on the GS. Re stopping when you are riding, once started the system is designed to ride without the key, otherwise the spare key wouldn’t work. But it does warn the key isn’t there….not that that means it wouldn’t stop were the unit to fail!
@@whojamaflip1 Don't know about the GS but the RT is indeed obvious. Its a single unit incorporating the black button in the middle of the handlebars and the electronics are below that and face forward from the steering column. All very exposed to rain. I have no doubt that a module failure like I had would shut the engine down even while riding. I had a number of "fail to start" from off, in the months leading up to the big failure. Dealer thought it was a battery issue and replaced it under warranty first time it happened. Second time I disconnected and reconnected the battery and it then started. Both these times I got it to start after an initial dead response but it took hours of fiddling and in the end I think was pure luck with the voltage being removed and reapplied which might have jolted the "failing" module into life. A "sensor" failure within the module I wouldn't think would shut the engine down if running, as a lost key hence lost signal is something they program for as a safety measure. But a complete module shutdown deactivates the ECU as they are dependent systems. A bit like turning the ignition key off in a traditional system. the engine will stop.
Thanks for vid. My R1300gs is a superb motorcycle to ride. However, with only 5000km on the clock, rear suspension has failed (DSA without adaptive height). A new unit has been ordered from Germany, a 3 week repair. They are also doing the starter relay recall same time.. Mine is also an early build so likely has the same potential fault. I’m getting rid of the bike. Not prepared to be an inadvertent R&D guy, at my expense
Well done chaps. I was considering buying a new 1300 gs asa. 24,500 is expensive ! Sorry to hear about your experience. Kudos to your attitude. I shall wait for the gen two model, and reevaluate. Many thanks chaps.
I am an ex instructor, I have ridden numerous bikes in numerous countries. The all bikes have, at some point, certain issues but in my experience some are worse than others. BMW are great bikes WHEN THEY WORK. In my experience (54 years riding bikes) the most reliable bikes i have ridden (and owned) are, in order, Honda, Kawasaki, Suzuki, Triumph, Yamaha, Royal Enfield, BMW, KTM, Aprilia, Ducati, Harley Davidson, Moto Guzzi, MV Augusta. Least reliable ...chinese bikes but they are getting better year on year.
Thanks for the comment....must admit I'm suprised to see Triumph above Yamaha and also Royal Enfield being so high on your list...very interesting feedback.
It wasn’t your ignition module that failed it was the “keyless Ride” module which is the front line system that has to activate before the TFT or any other system will boot. My 2023 1250RT which was built in late 2022 had a keyless ride module failure while it was running on its centre stand after a wash. This was in May 2024. The dealer diagnosed the issue immediately and the replacement took exactly 6 weeks to come from Berlin via Asia where its code was programmed, to Sydney. Dealer said this was happening quite regularly to keyless ride modules. Unfortunately when it fails the bike is literally dead although the central locking still works as this is a separate system.
I take your point, but the dealer specifically stated it was the ignition module. Now it may be they are using layman’s terms incorrectly to describe the fault (though I can’t see why they would), or it may be that both units failure can have the same impact/symptom , but either way Mark was repeating exactly what he was told…and unless they correct us, that’s what we have to go with.
Anecdote: back in 2018 (if I remember correctly), my girlfriend worked as a sales person for a local BMW Motorrad dealership (we're talking Mexico here). Some days I made her company on the weekends (this dealership opened Saturdays and Sundays), and this dude parks his brand new golden BMW M3, enters the store and the first thing that comes out of his mouth is (I'm paraphrasing): "The motorcycles are as bad as the cars?"
I’ve had similar bad luck with mine, 8900miles in and it’s spent 2 months off the road. Starter relay issue caused it more or less catch fire in February and then a serious TFT issue recently which meant a replacement TFT needed which was also on back order. Still love the bike though.
Having ridden the bike, I can see why people do love them and are prepared to accept faults. I LOVE the feel of the new 1300 engine and am looking forwarc to trying it in the RT when the R1300RT arrives......though I think I might let things settle down a little before I consider upgrading my 1200RT!
Good follow up to the original video, whilst I don’t own a GS the issues highlighted would concern me and good though BMW have been from the U.K. service aspect the fact that an upgraded piece of hardware has again failed is a poor show. Sales were not flagging on the 1250, so why not test more thoroughly, they had the time I would’ve thought. Footnote regarding Honda, in 1979 (this is a long time ago) I purchased Honda’s all new first twin cam 16v 750, the bike was launched at the same time as the 900F and the CBX six. At 1200 miles the mainshaft seal blew dumping oil over the rear of the bike, it was off the road for 3 or 4 months waiting on parts (new model difficult to source), when the bike was returned to me it lasted about 48 hours before the cam chain failed at high rpm causing all kinds of internal damage, the supplying dealer went out of business and I ended up dealing with Honda’s HQ in Chiswick. They eventually arranged for another dealer to collect the bike (one of their so called premier dealers) to effect repairs, in the meantime all the internal baffles had detached in the exhaust system probably from corrosion, just sitting in my dads garage so that was also replaced. A real dog of a bike, put me off Honda as a brand for 23 years until I chose a Honda Civic Type R (EP3) as my company car (surprised the transport manager allowed it), it went on to rack up 100,000 very hard miles in just under 3 years - absolutely faultless zero issues which restored my faith in the brand. I’m glad you got the bike back, and you’re continuing to persist with your complaint - don’t let them off the hook you had a torrid time of it ( especially the female taxi driver) . Good luck, and a really well made easy to understand presentation without drama or being over emotional 👍
When i traveled from poland to Prague on AT i didn't even thought about potential failure of bike. Because i know it won't be issue it didn't even occured to me to consider it. Like its obvious, not even possibility. Ofc it is possibility, you can have tire puncture etc. broke right mirror offroad, bent center stand on huge washout. Bike was fine, took me back to home safety
Understood. The failure I believe we are talking about is that black box that sits at the front of the steering column below the start button. It detects the key and responds to the pressing of the start button by initiating a sequence of events which fires up the TFT and activates the ECU. Holding down the button also prompts the unit to engage or disengage the steering lock. I have called it a start button but it’s really a misnomer in that it only starts the computer, not the engine. Ignition is started by the red starter button which is what you would call the ignition process. I think his dealer had no idea what to call the failure. The fact that the TFT didn’t come to life at all is definitely a keyless ride module failure and hence a completely dead bike. Very frustrating I know and it obviously is a design or manufacturing issue which allows moisture to get into that black box. It failed while my bike was running on its stand and I wonder what grief it might cause if it happened on the highway at speed. This unit is the heart of the bike and the ECU shuts down without it. This issue needs a lot more consumer outrage because it is truly a time bomb.
The 1300 GS doesn’t have the button configuration in the same way as the 1250 so I have no idea if it has the module you describe or if it’s in the same place. The 1250 has a start button where the ignition key usually sits and then the engine start on the handlebars. The 1300 has no start button of this type in the centre of the handlebars, rather it uses the same button as my 1200RT uses for the central locking but the 1300 uses it as a start button, steering lock button and (I think) central locking. The 1300 is a very different bike to the 1250 and I would not be at all surprised if they have combined the ignition module and keyless module together. (After all the 1250/1200s were designed with keyless as an option whereas you have no choice but to have keyless on a 1300 so it would make sense to reduce part count ) all that said it doesn’t mean I’m saying you or the dealer is wrong…I simply don’t know!
Just had a compare between my RT and the GS, the black box is there on my RT ….but no sign on the GS so the system definitely differs in some way to the 1250s
Hi I have a R1250GS Three years and two months old when I went to the Dutch TT stranded going for the boat on Monday morning. Exactly the same issue bike had seen a dousing of rain on the Sunday evening went to start nothing. I flew home and went back to recover in my van as my European AA cover let me down another story. The diagnosis was the ignition module so I believe the modules aren’t ip65 water tight. I was off the road for the whole of July and into August. Just to add AA Uk paid my expenses in full but only after I took the initiative.
Thanks for posting this, it's very helpful. I totally get the "Brand Loyalty" as with the GS you are also buying into a way of life/big club. For me there would come a point that if such an expensive motorcycle with such complicated electronics was breaking down whilst I was on a motorcycle trip I that I planned for a long time or whatever, I would look for another bike. I don't know how hard it would be for BMW to make a "Base model" of the GS, no electronic suspension, a key rather than keyless, etc etc, a bike that if something did go wrong it can be identified and maybe fixed. My concern would be reliability and costs of replacing expensive parts when the warranty runs out.
@frankspeakmore7104 I doubt his patience would be indefinite. From discussion I think if it has an aditional issue he's likely to demand a replacement bike...if that still proved unreliable he'd probably move away from the marque
BMW has always had problems with new models. I have had 4 new BMW boxers and have had good service from them. It takes them about to model years to get the bugs out except the drive shafts and final drives that took longer and a redesign.
The BMW assistance in the UK is outsourced to a third party. I have with my 2020 GS1250 had quite alot of contact with them. I have always found them to be very helpful. Obviously the standard of assistance in other countries is not so good. I hope you get some compensation for the way you've been treated.
Love the bmw R1250/gsa had a major problem in Europe and Allianz were terrible , once the bike back in UK all sorted . I agree bmw should own the problem. It’s sold as bmw European road side assistance . If I ran CS I’d swap your front wheel out , at no cost to you .
I bought a 1995 R100RT Classic because of issues like these. While I am not a professional mechanic at least I don't have so many potential electrical issues. With labor rates in the $150.00-$200.00 per hour range I can no longer risk the repair costs.
I've had 2 recalls for the starter relay can't get paniers rear shock replaced I've noticed it turns over very slowly even though it's kepted on a charger maybe another problem ?
@@whojamaflip1 How much ? What's the point of making a video if leave out the facts, surely this would help any other early GS owner who's going to run into this problem.
@Beeds5 Not my choice to say or not to say the amount. And as to the what’s the point of making the videos if I am not going to give the precise financial details you particularly want……you are somewhat missing the whole point! The videos flags up a significant fault with the bike, they flag up the issues you can face with international assistance, they flag up the issues around BMWs complaints procedure and they make it clear BMW are open to offer compensation….if that’s not enough for you…well sorry, but that’s all you are getting!
Bought and rode BMW's from the late 70s right up to the water cooled models. Ordered a water cooled when they were introduced, what a piece of junk it was ,how BMW could launch a bike which was not developed or tested properly........remember back to Kevin ash who was killed off one and that prompted a very quiet redesign for the 2014 model.
Agree they appear to be less good at testing now, or perhaps building to a lower quality. I was tald for example that Mercedes moved from a designed 21 year lifespan for the 190 to a designed 14 years for the C class because they thought customers wouldn't notice...turns out they did....perhaps BMW have folowed a similar route?
I had the Harley pan america before i bought the 1250 gsa now the pan america had one year of problems before i sold it at a great loss all new bikes have problems thats why i chose this time the 1250.
I got an R1200RT about 12 months after they came out. It had everything except the electronic suspension as it was an ex demo bike. When it worked, it was easily the best bike I've ever ridden. When it worked. In the time I had it, the following happened. The fuel sender unit failed 3 times. Both cam chain pensioners failed. The ignition switch immobiliser ring failed twice. The front brake discs had to be replaced. Twice. They had warped. The front part of the engine was replaced because of severe corrosion. Again, twice. The last straw was the output shift oil seal failing, fortunately just inside the warranty period (there's a story about the repair there as well). I got rid of it by part exchanging it against a K1200LTSE. After that, I had 3 K1100LT's (2 written off, 1 to vandalism, the other due to a woman who revered into it because she didn't see it) & an R1100RS (between the 2 written off K's & the last of the 3). For reasons too long to go into,I can no longer get on a regular bike, but I still love BMW's & have another if I could. These days I ride a 650 Burgman.
Back order BMW means the parts are in a container on the way from China and the ship takes 2 weeks to get to Rotterdam then another two days to BMW central warehouse in Bayern two more days to re-box into BMW packaging before shipping to UK where it then takes another three days to get sorted and sent to the dealer. It is a shame they cannot have a stock of parts which they now know are failing in the central warehouse but it is used for repacking and not storage or even in the UK warehouse in Northampton but that would take up valuable space used to store winter wheels and tyres for car owners.
@williamcoulter5462 you make a very good set of points, I think that they must have at least some stock in their manufacturing line and would do well to use them to get punters back on the road…..and I know it’s a stupid dream before you say it 🤣🤣
Been riding 50 years.. Never had a BMW.. Always had Japanese bikes.. (except Triumph).. Always had excellent reliability.. I suggest you look at the FEMA motorcycle manufacturer recall list.. Updated monthly I believe?)... BMW Harley KTM etc always on the list.. And these are supposed to be premium makes..
It is a brand new bike, most of them are going to be just fine , BUT a few of them will need a little time to "iron out" all the issues, if you're someone who wants the new bike NOW, you will assume some risks, but all will be ok in the end.🙂 To all the people with "my bike never stopped in the rain...bla, bla, bla!", I have 4 BMWs K1200 bikes RS, LT, S and a R1200RT, 01-07 years, none of them ever stopped in the rain, sometimes rode for 3-4 days in horrific rain and no issues, BUT I never had a NEW bike in my life and new bikes have new issues! 🙂
I simply cannot understand the rationale behind BMW brand loyalty . BMW produce an unreliable bike , fail to support their customers by farming out services to a budget 3rd party and yet owners come back for more mistreatment . These are not the high quality bikes of the 1960s and 70s . I wouldn't touch a modern BMW with a 10foot bargepole . ( make that a 20ft ).😅
Having ridden muttiple modern BMWs I can understand the loyalty even with some niggles. This is the 4th post 2010 BMW we have owner, and the only one which has had an issue (so far!)
adjective 1. more desirable, satisfactory, or effective. 2. partly or fully recovered from illness, injury, or mental stress. Just joking 😉 In seriousness though, I do agree. It does very much depend what you are comparing it to and what bits you are comparing
If I was you I'd speak to trading standards. Your dealer sold you a bike that was supplied with warranty and breakdown cover. If this does not live up to what they've advertised then I believe it will be covered by the sale of goods legislation, and regardless of who provides it your point of contact and resolution of the complaint would be on the seller.
Ask him if he'd buy one for a world tour . I think not. To many overcomplicated systems that BMW expects customers to test but we're seduced into thinking we need all this crap,then moan when it fails. Boo hoo😢
Absolute rubbish , had 27 bmws most new and had one spot lamp stop working , the customer service was outstanding! There are horror story's regarding all manufacturers.
And after I editied it down so much you still complain!....don't worry, I'm going to do a re-edit just talking about the fault and you will be able to comment on that one complaining I'm re-hashing material 😉🤣
on the failure and the cause: the torrential rainfall. I have a 11 years old Aprilia. 2 years ago we were riding with my son from Bayern to Hungary through Austria. 8 hours in biblical rain. To the point that the roads were closed around Graz because of flooding. And no, the bike didn't fail, didn't stop, didn't skip a beat, and started the next morning without problems.
With that I'm not saying how brilliant Aprilia is because it is not faultless, but after four BMWs I owned, I had enough. They are really good bikes, but every single one of them had some issues that were typical for the model.
Hence itchy boots choosing the 1987 Teneree for her latest adventure starts off the kick even if the battery is dead, any electrical fault on modern bikes and its probably the end of your ride.
Very true
Ah, BMW making the classic mistake with "outsourcing" a service is thinking that you are also outsourcing the responsibility. BMW, the clues in the name "BMW International Assistance", it has your name on it, it represents you to the public, and if Allianz are dropping the ball you need to fix it because all anyone will see or hear is "BMW".
Never buy year 1 of anything ;-)
Too right!
Quite happy with my year 1 Suzuki S1000 GX 😅 but I guess quite some of it's underpinnings are tried and tested.
@@BernardVisagie the. Are of the bike has been around for a while, stunning bike though 👍
Had a very similar issue / service with my KTM adventure. Ignition unit failed - it was immobiliser element in mine - rendering the bike a non starter. 60 kms north of León Spain, KTM outsource to AA breakdown. KTM in Leon fabulous service, AA not so good, but not in the Allianz league of incompetence!
I was looking forward to this part 2. I get where you’re coming from and I also really like my GSA. You have made us all much wiser to a severe lack of corporate organisation by BMW. It’s typical none engineering management organisation! On the up side it’s great they have great mech. and elect. engineers. Best of luck for the future with your new bike. I’m sure it will be ok in the long run. ✋ Wm.
Thanks mate, agree with everything you say 😊
Interesting videos. You seem to display incredible levels of naivety about the corporate world we live in. 🙏
🤣🤣🤣 Quite possibily!
I understand people love BMW. I really wanted to jump into the brand, but the stories just put me off. I'm glad you are happy and that you love your bike. I hope it really makes you happy for as long as you choose to have it, truly. Cheers.
Thanks Matey. I do think a lot of people go for the brand out of snobbery rather than because the bikes are good (I'd give the 310 models sold in the UK market as an example of this) but a lot of thier bikes are good....but only oif you buy them about 2 years into thier production cycle. If you buy a later R1250GS now I don't think you would have the same level of issues as R1300GS owners are getting (If you would get any at all!)
Yes they are different units between the RT and 1300GS. That also troubles me as it means that the same issue of moisture ingress is still there as part of the design or a manufacturing weakness in this newer module on the GS. I always figured that the button and rubber seal on the RT was the issue as it forms the top section of the Module, but the GS doesn't have that so i'm probably wrong. I hope that BMW have built in a fail safe that prevents such failures from shutting down the engine when the bike is in gear and moving. In my case it certainly didn't prevent the engine stopping, but it was in neutral on centre stand.
Module identifiers below
R1300GS
Control Module Keyless Ride - Ece/Row - BMW-Motorrad (66125A9E8A1)
2022-2024 BMW-Motorrad - 66125a9e8a1
R1250RT
Keyless Ride Control Unit - Ece/Row - BMW-Motorrad (66127108713)
2012-2025 BMW-Motorrad - 66127108713
That’s interesting, were you also able to see the location of the module? On my RT it’s very obvious, but I couldn’t see anything similar on the GS.
Re stopping when you are riding, once started the system is designed to ride without the key, otherwise the spare key wouldn’t work. But it does warn the key isn’t there….not that that means it wouldn’t stop were the unit to fail!
@@whojamaflip1 Don't know about the GS but the RT is indeed obvious. Its a single unit incorporating the black button in the middle of the handlebars and the electronics are below that and face forward from the steering column. All very exposed to rain. I have no doubt that a module failure like I had would shut the engine down even while riding. I had a number of "fail to start" from off, in the months leading up to the big failure. Dealer thought it was a battery issue and replaced it under warranty first time it happened. Second time I disconnected and reconnected the battery and it then started. Both these times I got it to start after an initial dead response but it took hours of fiddling and in the end I think was pure luck with the voltage being removed and reapplied which might have jolted the "failing" module into life.
A "sensor" failure within the module I wouldn't think would shut the engine down if running, as a lost key hence lost signal is something they program for as a safety measure. But a complete module shutdown deactivates the ECU as they are dependent systems. A bit like turning the ignition key off in a traditional system. the engine will stop.
Thanks for vid. My R1300gs is a superb motorcycle to ride. However, with only 5000km on the clock, rear suspension has failed (DSA without adaptive height). A new unit has been ordered from Germany, a 3 week repair. They are also doing the starter relay recall same time.. Mine is also an early build so likely has the same potential fault. I’m getting rid of the bike. Not prepared to be an inadvertent R&D guy, at my expense
Its a real shame to hear stories like that and couldn't agree more about not being an inadvertent R&D guy.
Well done chaps. I was considering buying a new 1300 gs asa. 24,500 is expensive ! Sorry to hear about your experience. Kudos to your attitude. I shall wait for the gen two model, and reevaluate. Many thanks chaps.
I am an ex instructor, I have ridden numerous bikes in numerous countries. The all bikes have, at some point, certain issues but in my experience some are worse than others. BMW are great bikes WHEN THEY WORK. In my experience (54 years riding bikes) the most reliable bikes i have ridden (and owned) are, in order, Honda, Kawasaki, Suzuki, Triumph, Yamaha, Royal Enfield, BMW, KTM, Aprilia, Ducati, Harley Davidson, Moto Guzzi, MV Augusta. Least reliable ...chinese bikes but they are getting better year on year.
Thanks for the comment....must admit I'm suprised to see Triumph above Yamaha and also Royal Enfield being so high on your list...very interesting feedback.
I've had multiple problems too. Video out on Friday!
It wasn’t your ignition module that failed it was the “keyless Ride” module which is the front line system that has to activate before the TFT or any other system will boot. My 2023 1250RT which was built in late 2022 had a keyless ride module failure while it was running on its centre stand after a wash. This was in May 2024. The dealer diagnosed the issue immediately and the replacement took exactly 6 weeks to come from Berlin via Asia where its code was programmed, to Sydney. Dealer said this was happening quite regularly to keyless ride modules. Unfortunately when it fails the bike is literally dead although the central locking still works as this is a separate system.
I take your point, but the dealer specifically stated it was the ignition module. Now it may be they are using layman’s terms incorrectly to describe the fault (though I can’t see why they would), or it may be that both units failure can have the same impact/symptom , but either way Mark was repeating exactly what he was told…and unless they correct us, that’s what we have to go with.
Anecdote: back in 2018 (if I remember correctly), my girlfriend worked as a sales person for a local BMW Motorrad dealership (we're talking Mexico here). Some days I made her company on the weekends (this dealership opened Saturdays and Sundays), and this dude parks his brand new golden BMW M3, enters the store and the first thing that comes out of his mouth is (I'm paraphrasing): "The motorcycles are as bad as the cars?"
Nice 😂👍🏿 I like him already
I’ve had similar bad luck with mine, 8900miles in and it’s spent 2 months off the road. Starter relay issue caused it more or less catch fire in February and then a serious TFT issue recently which meant a replacement TFT needed which was also on back order. Still love the bike though.
Having ridden the bike, I can see why people do love them and are prepared to accept faults. I LOVE the feel of the new 1300 engine and am looking forwarc to trying it in the RT when the R1300RT arrives......though I think I might let things settle down a little before I consider upgrading my 1200RT!
Good follow up to the original video, whilst I don’t own a GS the issues highlighted would concern me and good though BMW have been from the U.K. service aspect the fact that an upgraded piece of hardware has again failed is a poor show.
Sales were not flagging on the 1250, so why not test more thoroughly, they had the time I would’ve thought.
Footnote regarding Honda, in 1979 (this is a long time ago) I purchased Honda’s all new first twin cam 16v 750, the bike was launched at the same time as the 900F and the CBX six.
At 1200 miles the mainshaft seal blew dumping oil over the rear of the bike, it was off the road for 3 or 4 months waiting on parts (new model difficult to source), when the bike was returned to me it lasted about 48 hours before the cam chain failed at high rpm causing all kinds of internal damage, the supplying dealer went out of business and I ended up dealing with Honda’s HQ in Chiswick.
They eventually arranged for another dealer to collect the bike (one of their so called premier dealers) to effect repairs, in the meantime all the internal baffles had detached in the exhaust system probably from corrosion, just sitting in my dads garage so that was also replaced.
A real dog of a bike, put me off Honda as a brand for 23 years until I chose a Honda Civic Type R (EP3) as my company car (surprised the transport manager allowed it), it went on to rack up 100,000 very hard miles in just under 3 years - absolutely faultless zero issues which restored my faith in the brand.
I’m glad you got the bike back, and you’re continuing to persist with your complaint - don’t let them off the hook you had a torrid time of it ( especially the female taxi driver) . Good luck, and a really well made easy to understand presentation without drama or being over emotional 👍
Thank you so much for both a really interesting read and the kind comments.
When i traveled from poland to Prague on AT i didn't even thought about potential failure of bike.
Because i know it won't be issue it didn't even occured to me to consider it. Like its obvious, not even possibility.
Ofc it is possibility, you can have tire puncture etc. broke right mirror offroad, bent center stand on huge washout.
Bike was fine, took me back to home safety
Understood. The failure I believe we are talking about is that black box that sits at the front of the steering column below the start button. It detects the key and responds to the pressing of the start button by initiating a sequence of events which fires up the TFT and activates the ECU. Holding down the button also prompts the unit to engage or disengage the steering lock. I have called it a start button but it’s really a misnomer in that it only starts the computer, not the engine. Ignition is started by the red starter button which is what you would call the ignition process. I think his dealer had no idea what to call the failure. The fact that the TFT didn’t come to life at all is definitely a keyless ride module failure and hence a completely dead bike. Very frustrating I know and it obviously is a design or manufacturing issue which allows moisture to get into that black box. It failed while my bike was running on its stand and I wonder what grief it might cause if it happened on the highway at speed. This unit is the heart of the bike and the ECU shuts down without it. This issue needs a lot more consumer outrage because it is truly a time bomb.
The 1300 GS doesn’t have the button configuration in the same way as the 1250 so I have no idea if it has the module you describe or if it’s in the same place.
The 1250 has a start button where the ignition key usually sits and then the engine start on the handlebars. The 1300 has no start button of this type in the centre of the handlebars, rather it uses the same button as my 1200RT uses for the central locking but the 1300 uses it as a start button, steering lock button and (I think) central locking. The 1300 is a very different bike to the 1250 and I would not be at all surprised if they have combined the ignition module and keyless module together. (After all the 1250/1200s were designed with keyless as an option whereas you have no choice but to have keyless on a 1300 so it would make sense to reduce part count ) all that said it doesn’t mean I’m saying you or the dealer is wrong…I simply don’t know!
Just had a compare between my RT and the GS, the black box is there on my RT ….but no sign on the GS so the system definitely differs in some way to the 1250s
Hi I have a R1250GS
Three years and two months old when I went to the Dutch TT stranded going for the boat on Monday morning.
Exactly the same issue bike had seen a dousing of rain on the Sunday evening went to start nothing.
I flew home and went back to recover in my van as my European AA cover let me down another story.
The diagnosis was the ignition module so I believe the modules aren’t ip65 water tight. I was off the road for the whole of July and into August. Just to add AA Uk paid my expenses in full but only after I took the initiative.
Amazed that the ignition modules wouldn't be ip65 or in enough of a position of protection from significant weather!
Thanks for posting this, it's very helpful. I totally get the "Brand Loyalty" as with the GS you are also buying into a way of life/big club. For me there would come a point that if such an expensive motorcycle with such complicated electronics was breaking down whilst I was on a motorcycle trip I that I planned for a long time or whatever, I would look for another bike. I don't know how hard it would be for BMW to make a "Base model" of the GS, no electronic suspension, a key rather than keyless, etc etc, a bike that if something did go wrong it can be identified and maybe fixed. My concern would be reliability and costs of replacing expensive parts when the warranty runs out.
The big problem there would be Mark couldn't fit on a base GS as he needs the lowering suspension to be able to flat foot on it.
I have to say - The "Base Model" makes sense - I bet you that all their rally bikes are prepped to exactly that !
@@whojamaflip1 So even if this GS keeps breaking down and recovered, he would still buy another GS. OK I get it now.
@frankspeakmore7104 I doubt his patience would be indefinite. From discussion I think if it has an aditional issue he's likely to demand a replacement bike...if that still proved unreliable he'd probably move away from the marque
BMW has always had problems with new models.
I have had 4 new BMW boxers and have had good service from them. It takes them about to model years to get the bugs out except the drive shafts and final drives that took longer and a redesign.
The BMW assistance in the UK is outsourced to a third party. I have with my 2020 GS1250 had quite alot of contact with them. I have always found them to be very helpful. Obviously the standard of assistance in other countries is not so good. I hope you get some compensation for the way you've been treated.
Thanks Matey
Love the bmw R1250/gsa had a major problem in Europe and Allianz were terrible , once the bike back in UK all sorted .
I agree bmw should own the problem. It’s sold as bmw European road side assistance . If I ran CS I’d swap your front wheel out , at no cost to you .
I tour extensively. Iceland, remote Turkey, North Africa… the bike has to be 100% reliable. No ifs or buts. I’ll give BMW a pass.
I bought a 1995 R100RT Classic because of issues like these. While I am not a professional mechanic at least I don't have so many potential electrical issues. With labor rates in the $150.00-$200.00 per hour range I can no longer risk the repair costs.
With that sort of extreme touring, I certainly would be going for something more basic and easily repairable.
Nutting is 100% reliable. You'll never live your life with that mindset.
@@expatbiker6598that’s like saying nothing is 100% safe so ignore the risks….not an attitude to take you to a long and happy life! 😂😂😂😂
I've had 2 recalls for the starter relay can't get paniers rear shock replaced
I've noticed it turns over very slowly even though it's kepted on a charger maybe another problem ?
It is surprising how many similar reports there are.
Very frustrating!
Look on the bright side though, Mark will be able to dine out on this one for as long as is his want.
Join the club mate, own a 2nd hand GS1250 so much has gone wrong it's not funny
😱 not a good thing to hear!
Sure have drank the BMW. Koolaid . Had one, won’t have another.
Can understand where you are coming from, I don’t think I’d be as forgiving as Mark.
How much compensation did BMW pay out for 39 days without the new 24k GS1300 ?
Not enough in my opinion, but Mark was happy.
@@whojamaflip1 How much ? What's the point of making a video if leave out the facts, surely this would help any other early GS owner who's going to run into this problem.
@Beeds5 Not my choice to say or not to say the amount. And as to the what’s the point of making the videos if I am not going to give the precise financial details you particularly want……you are somewhat missing the whole point! The videos flags up a significant fault with the bike, they flag up the issues you can face with international assistance, they flag up the issues around BMWs complaints procedure and they make it clear BMW are open to offer compensation….if that’s not enough for you…well sorry, but that’s all you are getting!
Bought and rode BMW's from the late 70s right up to the water cooled models. Ordered a water cooled when they were introduced, what a piece of junk it was ,how BMW could launch a bike which was not developed or tested properly........remember back to Kevin ash who was killed off one and that prompted a very quiet redesign for the 2014 model.
Agree they appear to be less good at testing now, or perhaps building to a lower quality. I was tald for example that Mercedes moved from a designed 21 year lifespan for the 190 to a designed 14 years for the C class because they thought customers wouldn't notice...turns out they did....perhaps BMW have folowed a similar route?
I had the Harley pan america before i bought the 1250 gsa now the pan america had one year of problems before i sold it at a great loss all new bikes have problems thats why i chose this time the 1250.
I got an R1200RT about 12 months after they came out. It had everything except the electronic suspension as it was an ex demo bike. When it worked, it was easily the best bike I've ever ridden. When it worked. In the time I had it, the following happened. The fuel sender unit failed 3 times. Both cam chain pensioners failed. The ignition switch immobiliser ring failed twice. The front brake discs had to be replaced. Twice. They had warped. The front part of the engine was replaced because of severe corrosion. Again, twice. The last straw was the output shift oil seal failing, fortunately just inside the warranty period (there's a story about the repair there as well). I got rid of it by part exchanging it against a K1200LTSE. After that, I had 3 K1100LT's (2 written off, 1 to vandalism, the other due to a woman who revered into it because she didn't see it) & an R1100RS (between the 2 written off K's & the last of the 3). For reasons too long to go into,I can no longer get on a regular bike, but I still love BMW's & have another if I could. These days I ride a 650 Burgman.
Back order BMW means the parts are in a container on the way from China and the ship takes 2 weeks to get to Rotterdam then another two days to BMW central warehouse in Bayern two more days to re-box into BMW packaging before shipping to UK where it then takes another three days to get sorted and sent to the dealer. It is a shame they cannot have a stock of parts which they now know are failing in the central warehouse but it is used for repacking and not storage or even in the UK warehouse in Northampton but that would take up valuable space used to store winter wheels and tyres for car owners.
@williamcoulter5462 you make a very good set of points, I think that they must have at least some stock in their manufacturing line and would do well to use them to get punters back on the road…..and I know it’s a stupid dream before you say it 🤣🤣
And the moral of the story is, don’t buy a BMW until they can produce a new with no faults!!
Been riding 50 years.. Never had a BMW.. Always had Japanese bikes.. (except Triumph).. Always had excellent reliability.. I suggest you look at the FEMA motorcycle manufacturer recall list.. Updated monthly I believe?)... BMW Harley KTM etc always on the list.. And these are supposed to be premium makes..
It is a brand new bike, most of them are going to be just fine , BUT a few of them will need a little time to "iron out" all the issues, if you're someone who wants the new bike NOW, you will assume some risks, but all will be ok in the end.🙂
To all the people with "my bike never stopped in the rain...bla, bla, bla!", I have 4 BMWs K1200 bikes RS, LT, S and a R1200RT, 01-07 years, none of them ever stopped in the rain, sometimes rode for 3-4 days in horrific rain and no issues, BUT I never had a NEW bike in my life and new bikes have new issues! 🙂
I wouldn’t really expect teething issues on a bike which has been out for a year….its very 1070s BL rather than 2020s BMW
BMW aren't the people to ask about product testing on the components ... find out which Chinese company supplied the component !
White Elephant.....25K ! wow
I never use the fork lock on my 2015 GSA because I don’t trust it.
My insurance policy won’t pay out if my bike is stolen and the steering lock is off.
Bikes with the keyless ignition fork locks have been known to hang up.
@MrGus4440 indeed, but I don’t think my insurance will buy that as an excuse for not having it on.
You could always park beside a Harley
I will take my chances verses being stranded.
I simply cannot understand the rationale behind BMW brand loyalty .
BMW produce an unreliable bike , fail to support their customers by farming out services to a budget 3rd party and yet owners come back for more mistreatment .
These are not the high quality bikes of the 1960s and 70s .
I wouldn't touch a modern BMW with a 10foot bargepole .
( make that a 20ft ).😅
Having ridden muttiple modern BMWs I can understand the loyalty even with some niggles. This is the 4th post 2010 BMW we have owner, and the only one which has had an issue (so far!)
People buy bmw because they think they are better. Sadly they aren’t .
Definitely not when it comes to reliability!
Define 'better'
adjective
1. more desirable, satisfactory, or effective.
2. partly or fully recovered from illness, injury, or mental stress.
Just joking 😉
In seriousness though, I do agree. It does very much depend what you are comparing it to and what bits you are comparing
They are 🤣
Oh dear, not a very good experience, not a very good advert either 😮
Indeed, and I have been suprised at quite how many similar stories have been in the comments about this type of thing.
If I was you I'd speak to trading standards. Your dealer sold you a bike that was supplied with warranty and breakdown cover. If this does not live up to what they've advertised then I believe it will be covered by the sale of goods legislation, and regardless of who provides it your point of contact and resolution of the complaint would be on the seller.
Ill keep my old oilheads thanks lol
@@andymcnaughton7745 many would agree with you!
Had a Hayabusa for 8yrs gen 2 no probs at all just saying
Most Jap bikes are pretty much 100% reliable
Ask him if he'd buy one for a world tour . I think not. To many overcomplicated systems that BMW expects customers to test but we're seduced into thinking we need all this crap,then moan when it fails. Boo hoo😢
Not just BMW….look at the amount of tech on pretty much every bike….even a Honda super cub has keyless ignition !
= buy an Africa Twin
The AT is a great bike, but you have to be tall enough to ride it…Mark isn’t!
NEVER EVER buy a BMW car or motorcycle for the first 2 years of production.
Absolute rubbish , had 27 bmws most new and had one spot lamp stop working , the customer service was outstanding! There are horror story's regarding all manufacturers.
The only widescale JD power type survey of reliability for motorcycles would argue that BMWs are one of the less reliable motorcycles....
@@markshirley7639 I worked for the company for 40 years.
@@vanislandsteve Mic drop moment! 😁
10 minutes talking about repatriating……pfff get a life
And after I editied it down so much you still complain!....don't worry, I'm going to do a re-edit just talking about the fault and you will be able to comment on that one complaining I'm re-hashing material 😉🤣
" 👄 I didn't make it for YOU! 👄" 🤣
Thing is, he’d clearly been waiting for part two with antici…………..
…….pation!