@@gurusson presta valves make it easier to pump tires up to a high pressure with less volume per pump. That's really the only benefit. But you also wind up pumping more. I'd hate to have a presta on this with the potential to hit it and bend valve cores. It's not going to be that hard to pump up
Matt, Thank you for taking the time to make this impressive review. It's really the first time we see someone using a manual bike pump on this machine. That's exactly our original intention - creating a system with some potential DIY methods. Also, we will have an upgrade kit for using the charger holder as a refillable cylinder in the future, so people don't have to waste so many small cartridges. Vincent & the Xbar team
I’ll leave this here…boom 🧨 Tire Booster Tubeless Tire Inflator. Lots of manufacturers making reusable inflators. Change your inline fitting to Presta and you’ll never look back.
Update to the product could be having a hpa tank that you can fill and that can come with a 3000 psi tank that sits in the back of the machine. This would make it slightly bigger to hide the tank but it would allow it to last and work much longer and if you don’t want to use a pump to fill it you can take it to a scuba shop and get it filled for 15 bucks and that would make at least somewhere around 50 shots if you have a 48 ci tank with 3000 psi of air pressure and knowing how long that last when using about 250 psi which is double that of espresso shots. Could even be more than that because in paintball that tank can last somewhere around 500 shots at 250 psi which I could see meaning 50-100 shots of espresso
Same thought or you can just get your own electric/battery pump. With a big enough compressor and tank, an espresso shop could be ran with these. The compressor and tank could be in a hidden room and run hoses to the machines. Less heat and noise for the customers. It’s crazy enough, it just might work.
A built in thermometer would have been great! The heat loss was actually quite manageable. The water chamber holds lots of heat, so its an par, or maybe even slightly better at pre heating than the Flair (non 58 versions)
fascinating. im obsessed with these machine-less espresso-maker contraptions because the cleanup and maintenance seems so much simpler which i personally find highly valuable. not needing to plug anything in or worry about batteries or boilers or descaling or inner parts i cant easily get to or fix myself seems more bothersome over time
perhaps a lever to replace the bicycle pump… a nice long lever that was very easy attached and detached this would be replacing compressed air with those compress-a-spring type lever machines
Interesting idea and nice design. I’d pump it too, the canisters would be my backup in case I’m too tired to work that hard for my espresso. By the way, your intro videos are getting better and better :))
of course, if you get this, you need to get a nice pump - either a Lezyne Y11 in the shiny chrome finish... But, what you should probably get instead, if there is such a thing, is a high-quality foot-operated pump. That would make it easier to watch the extraction, and leave your hands free to operate the pressure release.
Do you happen to have any source of pressurised gas, air compressor (oil free) or c02 tank? I'm curious if there's any sort of check valve or pressure profiler that would be able to step up (say from 3 bar or so) from a larger lower pressure source up to the 9 bar that's standard for espresso?
For using CO2, whether the 8 gram cartridge or a large refillable Sodastream bottle under the table but adapted by a pressure line, do you think this would work considering the refrigerant effect from releasing the cart pressure? That was something I had not considered and that you point out. Additionally, I was disappointed to learn from your video, that the flow pressure control paddle does not work when pressure is introduced through the Schrader valve. A modification by the creator for that would be great.
I agree, I really wish you could manually pressurize, and then use the flow control lever. That would be a killer feature. I spoke to the creators and there are plans to make a SodaStream adapter of some kind, which would be nice to make it less wasteful. But adapting it yourself is certainly an option if you're handy!
It is easier on the arms than something like the Flair Pro 2. But the Flair 58 looks much easier to compress, we'll be getting that in to test soon In terms of control, it's not really better or worse than a lever system, just different. Once pressurized you can calmly adjust instead of constantly needing to press a lever
It doesn’t work like this. Neither CO2, nor N2O, dissolves much in hot water. Meaning in the Xbar the CO2 (or N2O) stays on top of the hot water and pushes that through the coffee puck. If you’d use cold water (room temperature or below), the gas would dissolve into the water until the water is saturated with the gas. Whatever gas is then left in the cartridge, that cannot be dissolved, will then pressurise the brew chamber. But you cannot make espresso with cold water. And I don’t think you can make cold brew or nitro coffee in thirty seconds. Then again, you never know until you try… :)
The air coming out of any bike pump i’ve owned has always ended up smelling like crap. They aren’t really built to be food quality and gaskets and oil break down.
A better design would be a canister to store the air pressure like in those booster pumps for tubeless tires and a lever in the espresso machine to control the pressure you put out for the shot. Cool new design but I think control and consistency would be an issue.
when you use CO2 canister pressure control is very easy and consistency is no issue at all. It does not need your arm and body to pull a shot compared to manual lever. It can do either constant pressure or declined pressure profile compare to a spring lever. With a proper adapter you can use soda chargers as well.
Highly likely anyone that already hasan E61 portafilter has the machine it works with and using this is a downgrade. Need for compressed gas cartridges or external pump and no temperature control. Seems a handpresso like machine accomplishes the same thing in a similar way and is compact and light. Have to see a very meaningful pressure profiling result to go through all that.
This is how regress looks. It is like going back to feudalism. Lever things are also indicators of the same. $60 Chinese or Delonghi espresso machine is head and shoulders above this, even if not shiny enough. $70 one even will have pretty accurate pressure gauge and you can use steam valve for pressure profiling during shot. Lot of used Brevilles with gauge go at below $100 and with plastic bottomless portafilter they are astonishingly good. Refurbished Bambino Plus is below $200-240 and it is whole different league, where you actually make good coffee in seconds.
That's true only because those machines came down in price considerably over time. This concept should fundamentally be cheaper because the most expensive part of the machine is eliminated (the pump). This particular machine may not be cost effective, but the concept does have potential. Oh and I must admit I like the novelty of it, too.
@@laurensverheij921 Well, contrary to abstract novelty progress and regress have simple definitions. What you mean under " those machines came down in price considerably over time"? I mean here that you can actually buy very good $70-80 Chinese espresso machine, new, online. $120-140 are already range of 58mm models with thermoblock during usual sales. Lever machines here are expensive due very small amount of produced units, inefficient production (like CNC or similar). Also firms who sell they want really big profits and fast return on investments. Contrary to this approach simple looking Chinese machine can be made in city size huge factory that makes all parts inside and that is also full of modern robots and huge number of molding machines. Biggest hurdle in modern machines with pumps is that resellers, including large online retailers can't move progress any further as it means reduced profits for them. Hence, besides looks they barely move forward. Get even superb Descent machine - they managed to rise price 3.5x, and focused on commercial sector and niche buyers.
@Lifesyle Lab - CO2 has a very low heat capacity, less than 1/4 of water per unit mass. If you use half a canister (6 grams), then CO2 would have a del Cp of about 5 J/K, whereas a 120 ml shot of water would be ~501 J/K. In other words, the CO2 would not make a measurable difference to the temperature of the water shot, even if it was perfectly mixed (which it isnt, most of it sits ontop of the puck) :)
I have no qualms about using CO2 cartridges since I regularly consume them by making my own soda water at home with a soda siphon, and I found a brand that's pretty cheap as well. It also eases my conscience that the aluminum cartridges are 100% recyclable. I'm also a big fan of that price point. It seems I'm too late to back the kickstarter, and since it's been a full year and they haven't finished their website or shown any initiative to ramp up production, it looks like I'll never get my hands on one. Damn shame.
This machine must have been designed by a cyclist. It's really a dumb primitive idea to use Co2 cartridge or a bike pump to brew your coffee. Seriously no where cool about using this or showing off to your friends your new expresso gadget.
Cool idea but kind of absurd when you think about practicality. Who wants to pump a bike to make coffee in the morning. I’m guessing it won’t be cheap either. Probably better off getting a flair.
What a silly design. $16 for a CO2 canister 12 pack, you need boiled water and a whole lot of nerd pride just to take three times longer to make a mediocre espresso. I suppose you could hook it up to a compressor, which again, who in their right mind would do any of this? OR you could buy a garbage espresso machine on Amazon and get the same level of disappointment one tenth of the effort.
@@LifestyleLab_ I guess it depends on how you define less work. Is using a bicycle pump less work than a lever? Probably not. Is using a CO2 canister less work? Indeed it is. That said, I suppose the proof is in the proverbial pudding. If you’re enjoying the results that speaks volumes. 👍🏽
Wondering how you know it makes a mediocre espresso if you haven't used this type of machine? When using a co2 canister it is equal to (if not better than) a spring lever espresso machine and make excellent espresso. btw you can buy 100 canisters for $45 that will give 400+ shots.
Bike pump and CO2 is a buzz kill. Bike pumps are not sterile. CO2 is nice but as stated, wasteful has hell. Aesthetically nice. corners should be softened a bit IMO. Also, it would seem that temperature management would be an issue with the metal body. soooo...they will need to explain why this is better than a good Moka Pot. Nice Metal Art but not practical..It will wind up in a design museum. Stick with your Aeropress and do better use case analysis for the 'Mark II' ;-)
![Is the world ready for bike pump espresso? [Maespresso 58 Review]](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/aGOwo3-BEXI/mqdefault.jpg)
Would you back the Xbar?? Why or why not!
X Bar Kickstarter: bit.ly/3o8BI7u
No. The killer is the schrader valve. Most good bike pumps are presta valve
@@gurusson Plenty of good pumps using presta / schader combo valves! Mountain bikers deserve good pumps too ;)
@@LifestyleLab_ Yeah, I have a schrader pump. I use it for my shocks.
@@gurusson presta valves make it easier to pump tires up to a high pressure with less volume per pump. That's really the only benefit. But you also wind up pumping more. I'd hate to have a presta on this with the potential to hit it and bend valve cores. It's not going to be that hard to pump up
Wish I had seen thise before would have made a ks account to get one
Matt,
Thank you for taking the time to make this impressive review. It's really the first time we see someone using a manual bike pump on this machine. That's exactly our original intention - creating a system with some potential DIY methods.
Also, we will have an upgrade kit for using the charger holder as a refillable cylinder in the future, so people don't have to waste so many small cartridges.
Vincent & the Xbar team
I’ll leave this here…boom 🧨
Tire Booster Tubeless Tire Inflator.
Lots of manufacturers making reusable inflators.
Change your inline fitting to Presta and you’ll never look back.
Why on earth schrader valve? Presta would definitely bethe correct choice
Every investors from Kickstarter still waiting this machine, they didn't update anything since Apr. 2022 that they said ready to ship.
Next product: a grinder that can engage to a bike roller/trainer so that you can crank your coffee powder on your own power.
Haha!
The Weber Workshops HG2 is some clever gearing away from doing it!
Update to the product could be having a hpa tank that you can fill and that can come with a 3000 psi tank that sits in the back of the machine. This would make it slightly bigger to hide the tank but it would allow it to last and work much longer and if you don’t want to use a pump to fill it you can take it to a scuba shop and get it filled for 15 bucks and that would make at least somewhere around 50 shots if you have a 48 ci tank with 3000 psi of air pressure and knowing how long that last when using about 250 psi which is double that of espresso shots. Could even be more than that because in paintball that tank can last somewhere around 500 shots at 250 psi which I could see meaning 50-100 shots of espresso
Same thought or you can just get your own electric/battery pump. With a big enough compressor and tank, an espresso shop could be ran with these. The compressor and tank could be in a hidden room and run hoses to the machines. Less heat and noise for the customers.
It’s crazy enough, it just might work.
@@mcmigs1725 it could work but then what’s the point. It’s smaller and more tested to just have a normal style of machine
@@adamhartman4312 agreed. Didn’t say it was smart or made sense. Just that it’s possible 😅
@@mcmigs1725 😂lmao true
How about heat loss? I think they should add built in thermometer for showing the temperature.
A built in thermometer would have been great!
The heat loss was actually quite manageable. The water chamber holds lots of heat, so its an par, or maybe even slightly better at pre heating than the Flair (non 58 versions)
fascinating. im obsessed with these machine-less espresso-maker contraptions because the cleanup and maintenance seems so much simpler which i personally find highly valuable. not needing to plug anything in or worry about batteries or boilers or descaling or inner parts i cant easily get to or fix myself seems more bothersome over time
Love the skit, it’s nice seeing more of you/personality in your videos. For the price, looks like something worth giving a try!
perhaps a lever to replace the bicycle pump… a nice long lever that was very easy attached and detached
this would be replacing compressed air with those compress-a-spring type lever machines
I had the same idea years ago I knew it would just work. Glad someone really made it.
What about an air compressor? I'm guessing you could get one for $30, or a slick, quiet one.
Interesting idea and nice design. I’d pump it too, the canisters would be my backup in case I’m too tired to work that hard for my espresso.
By the way, your intro videos are getting better and better :))
of course, if you get this, you need to get a nice pump - either a Lezyne Y11 in the shiny chrome finish... But, what you should probably get instead, if there is such a thing, is a high-quality foot-operated pump. That would make it easier to watch the extraction, and leave your hands free to operate the pressure release.
Do you happen to have any source of pressurised gas, air compressor (oil free) or c02 tank?
I'm curious if there's any sort of check valve or pressure profiler that would be able to step up (say from 3 bar or so) from a larger lower pressure source up to the 9 bar that's standard for espresso?
What's the brew temperature if the unit is maximally pre-heated and you're adding boiling water just before brewing? With bike pump..
Thanks. Backed this few days ago, so will be interested to see how production versions differ and how it compares to results from my La Pavoni...
Nice!! Definitely a little more niche than the La Pavoni, but I think you'll have fun!
For using CO2, whether the 8 gram cartridge or a large refillable Sodastream bottle under the table but adapted by a pressure line, do you think this would work considering the refrigerant effect from releasing the cart pressure? That was something I had not considered and that you point out. Additionally, I was disappointed to learn from your video, that the flow pressure control paddle does not work when pressure is introduced through the Schrader valve. A modification by the creator for that would be great.
I agree, I really wish you could manually pressurize, and then use the flow control lever. That would be a killer feature.
I spoke to the creators and there are plans to make a SodaStream adapter of some kind, which would be nice to make it less wasteful. But adapting it yourself is certainly an option if you're handy!
Thanks for the review.
Can you comfortably control and decrease the pressure, after pumping, by opening the valve partly?
Yes, the outlet valve on the back allows you to "ramp down" the pressure as desired :)
@@LifestyleLab_ Thanks, and if I can ask one more question - do you think this way of controlling the x bar is convenient enough, like using a lever?
It is easier on the arms than something like the Flair Pro 2. But the Flair 58 looks much easier to compress, we'll be getting that in to test soon
In terms of control, it's not really better or worse than a lever system, just different. Once pressurized you can calmly adjust instead of constantly needing to press a lever
how to get this and ship to korea?!
Pretty sick, looks amazing, would buy!
What brand and model pump was that?
if it retails for $200 or below (if the kickstarter goes well) i would love to buy this. I have both a hand pump and a xiaomi electric bike pump.
Anyone remember the mypressi twist? It was pretty good at making spro and used co2 as well (was better for travel).
If you prefer using the manual bike pump, it may be easier and much cheaper to just replace the safety valve of a Moka pot with a Schrader valve.
I think it looks great and is a great idea and design.
Like Michael Shanks said, is the air coming out of a bike pump "food safe"? Oils and other contaminants?
OH, "you want one", you killed it:)
How about using one of those small electric compressors?
This is a suggested method from the manufacturer! But kind of defeated the purpose of a manufacturer machine imo
Can this make nitro coffee if you replace CO2 cartridges with N2O?
It doesn’t work like this. Neither CO2, nor N2O, dissolves much in hot water. Meaning in the Xbar the CO2 (or N2O) stays on top of the hot water and pushes that through the coffee puck. If you’d use cold water (room temperature or below), the gas would dissolve into the water until the water is saturated with the gas. Whatever gas is then left in the cartridge, that cannot be dissolved, will then pressurise the brew chamber.
But you cannot make espresso with cold water. And I don’t think you can make cold brew or nitro coffee in thirty seconds.
Then again, you never know until you try… :)
How about using an electric air pump?
Awesome video content!
They would have to add a small hand pump with which you can "pre-charge" a pressure canister. Or else it is the Flair or Robot for me.
The air coming out of any bike pump i’ve owned has always ended up smelling like crap. They aren’t really built to be food quality and gaskets and oil break down.
They have a pocket size electric pump in their demo video on kickstarter.
Is the PORTA-FILTER 58mm?
Yes it is
A better design would be a canister to store the air pressure like in those booster pumps for tubeless tires and a lever in the espresso machine to control the pressure you put out for the shot. Cool new design but I think control and consistency would be an issue.
when you use CO2 canister pressure control is very easy and consistency is no issue at all. It does not need your arm and body to pull a shot compared to manual lever. It can do either constant pressure or declined pressure profile compare to a spring lever. With a proper adapter you can use soda chargers as well.
Lovely and no electricity that amazing 😍
Just to heat the water before pouring it in the machine.
Try hooking it up to a portable tyre inflator, effectively you have a vibratory pump driven Breville Barista Express in pieces!
I hope somebody could design a food-rated bicycle/air pump for this purpose.
Highly likely anyone that already hasan E61 portafilter has the machine it works with and using this is a downgrade. Need for compressed gas cartridges or external pump and no temperature control. Seems a handpresso like machine accomplishes the same thing in a similar way and is compact and light. Have to see a very meaningful pressure profiling result to go through all that.
Maybe they could come up with a small electric pump
You mean just make a regular coffee machine?
Nah, you gotta find something odd to make people believe it's a genius idea.
They have a pocket size electric pump in their demo video on kickstarter.
Want to have some triceps gains? Make a coffee.
Having issues with the Xbar team fulfilling this project. Has anyone seen or heard any developments into this machine?
I'm not sure why this makes me think of the 9Barista
This is how regress looks. It is like going back to feudalism. Lever things are also indicators of the same.
$60 Chinese or Delonghi espresso machine is head and shoulders above this, even if not shiny enough.
$70 one even will have pretty accurate pressure gauge and you can use steam valve for pressure profiling during shot.
Lot of used Brevilles with gauge go at below $100 and with plastic bottomless portafilter they are astonishingly good.
Refurbished Bambino Plus is below $200-240 and it is whole different league, where you actually make good coffee in seconds.
Fully agree!
That's true only because those machines came down in price considerably over time. This concept should fundamentally be cheaper because the most expensive part of the machine is eliminated (the pump). This particular machine may not be cost effective, but the concept does have potential.
Oh and I must admit I like the novelty of it, too.
@@laurensverheij921 Well, contrary to abstract novelty progress and regress have simple definitions.
What you mean under " those machines came down in price considerably over time"? I mean here that you can actually buy very good $70-80 Chinese espresso machine, new, online. $120-140 are already range of 58mm models with thermoblock during usual sales.
Lever machines here are expensive due very small amount of produced units, inefficient production (like CNC or similar). Also firms who sell they want really big profits and fast return on investments. Contrary to this approach simple looking Chinese machine can be made in city size huge factory that makes all parts inside and that is also full of modern robots and huge number of molding machines.
Biggest hurdle in modern machines with pumps is that resellers, including large online retailers can't move progress any further as it means reduced profits for them. Hence, besides looks they barely move forward.
Get even superb Descent machine - they managed to rise price 3.5x, and focused on commercial sector and niche buyers.
Dude you should make more skits or funny shorts. Theyre gonna make your videos way cooler!
Glad you enjoyed!
Wish it had a lever
Check out our flair 58 review then! Might be just what you're looking for
Wow
Nice looking espresso machine! Thanks , but no thanks!
The intro! AHaha
@Lifesyle Lab - CO2 has a very low heat capacity, less than 1/4 of water per unit mass. If you use half a canister (6 grams), then CO2 would have a del Cp of about 5 J/K, whereas a 120 ml shot of water would be ~501 J/K. In other words, the CO2 would not make a measurable difference to the temperature of the water shot, even if it was perfectly mixed (which it isnt, most of it sits ontop of the puck) :)
Great breakdown!
They have a pocket size electric pump in their demo video on kickstarter.
"But does the xbar actually make good espresso? " Yeah, does it?
Good espresso machine for the price you pay
This machine sounds like a skit from the show portlandia
Most investors are didn't get this macheine.
I have no qualms about using CO2 cartridges since I regularly consume them by making my own soda water at home with a soda siphon, and I found a brand that's pretty cheap as well. It also eases my conscience that the aluminum cartridges are 100% recyclable. I'm also a big fan of that price point. It seems I'm too late to back the kickstarter, and since it's been a full year and they haven't finished their website or shown any initiative to ramp up production, it looks like I'll never get my hands on one. Damn shame.
I wouldn’t pay more than 100 bucks for this.
co2 cartridge is agonizingly wasteful
Thanks for showing how useless this is!
Any time!
This machine must have been designed by a cyclist. It's really a dumb primitive idea to use Co2 cartridge or a bike pump to brew your coffee. Seriously no where cool about using this or showing off to your friends your new expresso gadget.
Cool idea but kind of absurd when you think about practicality. Who wants to pump a bike to make coffee in the morning. I’m guessing it won’t be cheap either. Probably better off getting a flair.
What a silly design. $16 for a CO2 canister 12 pack, you need boiled water and a whole lot of nerd pride just to take three times longer to make a mediocre espresso. I suppose you could hook it up to a compressor, which again, who in their right mind would do any of this?
OR you could buy a garbage espresso machine on Amazon and get the same level of disappointment one tenth of the effort.
Except this actually makes quite good espresso and the work involved is less than most other manual systems like the Cafelat, Rok, Flair, etc...
@@LifestyleLab_ I guess it depends on how you define less work. Is using a bicycle pump less work than a lever? Probably not. Is using a CO2 canister less work? Indeed it is. That said, I suppose the proof is in the proverbial pudding. If you’re enjoying the results that speaks volumes. 👍🏽
Wondering how you know it makes a mediocre espresso if you haven't used this type of machine? When using a co2 canister it is equal to (if not better than) a spring lever espresso machine and make excellent espresso. btw you can buy 100 canisters for $45 that will give 400+ shots.
@@jameschang8174 not claiming to. I suppose I was being a bit too gruff in my assertions. I apologize!
Bike pump and CO2 is a buzz kill. Bike pumps are not sterile. CO2 is nice but as stated, wasteful has hell. Aesthetically nice. corners should be softened a bit IMO. Also, it would seem that temperature management would be an issue with the metal body. soooo...they will need to explain why this is better than a good Moka Pot. Nice Metal Art but not practical..It will wind up in a design museum. Stick with your Aeropress and do better use case analysis for the 'Mark II' ;-)