Watchmakers are forcing watch-lovers to go the watch-modding route with their insane pricing. As a watch collector myself since the 90s, I have sold off all my priced collection, buy cheap homage watches online and replace the crappy movements with good ones. I learnt more about watches and appreciate the hobby more that way.
And yet 2 years or more later these are going for more money . These sla models are unique , and compete with the Swiss for quality and value for money.
If only this had been released under Grand Seiko, with their superb build quality, outstanding case finishing, spring drive movement, a simple but high quality 3 link tappered bracelet, and a killer clasp with micro adjust. It would be the diver GS needs to bring the fight to the big boys! It even has heritage! It would be awesome!
Man, haven’t even watches the entire video but right off the bat you’re on point. I was telling a friend recently about how the SLA017 is a watch I would aspire to one day buy but it’s not possible because it’s a limited edition.
Definitely not a Seiko hater. You simply hate an overpriced, relatively inaccurate, and accessory shabby pretend exclusive luxury watch. Thanks for speaking the truth with love.
Seiko may not be the same value company since they've moved upmarket, but if they keep selling out of the limited release watches at their current asking price points are they really overprices?
Seiko will never compete with Rolex at any price point because people are sheep not wolves!!’Keep up the honest work. On a different note with the new grand seikos they are simply better in every aspect than a rolex!! Boom!
Nailed it. I just had this exact same conversation with my brother. We came to the same conclusion, that this should have been their flagship diver, not a limited edition.
Excellent evaluation, without choosing "nice words" for critique -and no, I'm not a Seiko or any brand "hater". I can't say how much "200m" increases the price, but the rest is just a 600€ watch IMO.
I was planning to buy the seiko sbdc051 then i watched your video 'has seiko jumped the shark'.You are right there is no more value added in their model despite the price increase.I bought the Mido ocean star instead.Glad and happy with my decision
Totally agree. I’m also a huge SEIKO fan and collector for precisely the reason that they are rugged, democratic and unpretentious. I loved Seikos honesty and integrity. Sucking up with Swiss brands feels insecure and aimless.
Totally agree. I keep going to my local Seiko AD, trying on watches and hoping to find the right balance of design, quality and price, and while the design element often woos my heart, the quality of materials is mostly a miss when it comes to straps, the quality of execution is downright laughable with respect to bracelets, most of the brand's movement tolerances are so-so at best (and can be horrible at worst - I'm talking to you 6R15), while the prices cause me to walk across the street to my local Swiss/German retailer and purchase something with an ETA or Sellita inside (my Seiko AD just became Canada's sole Damasko AD, and this German manufacturer's quality and execution is tough to beat for their prices). Seiko is becoming the best used watch to buy (unless discontinued), a sad fact that will hurt their ADs and eventually impact the brand. Fortunately, plenty of other good alternatives are quickly filling the void Seiko is unwittingly leaving behind, including micros using the reliable (if not accurate) NH35/36, etc. Let's hope someone in Tokyo wakes up before all their disenfranchised entry-level buyers leave Seiko for good. Thanks for the excellent review of a beautiful timepiece that will likely never end up on my wrist for all the reasons you clearly state.
I totally agree with you: Seiko is definetly going in the wrong direction..or...maybe...the way they see it is well out of ours understandings and I truly hope they're right, not us 🙁
"No one asked for that." You mean, watch nerds didn't ask for that -- but you have to admit that watch nerds only make up a tiny percentage of the watch market. Perhaps Seiko realized that smartphones, Apple Watches, and other wearables like Fitbit are destroying the low-end market. Fossil realized the same thing and have been trying to sell smartwatches to make up for their plummeting mechanical sales. Instead of going the smartwatch route, Seiko seems to think the key to their survival is to rebrand as affordable luxury (Presage) or luxury (Grand Seiko).
I totally agree! (check my comment above) This isbwhy they discontinued skx and expanded the entry level which is just 5 series now. All the others will be made to a higher standard and price.
I completely agree, Guy. I bought the 051MAS watch and I love it, but really wish it was a little smaller, had a 4 hz movement, and a better handset. Then it would be perfect! Oh wait, they did make that watch and called it the SLA017 and charge 4 times as much for it. If they would've made this a regular release and priced it at $2500 I think it still would've been a big seller. I would've purchased it.
@@JustBlueFish exactly. They really need to reevaluate themselves. I'm sure they made plenty of money with this release but they could've sold thousands more. I guess that takes the exclusivity out of it, but isn't that what Grand Seiko is supposed to be for?
With that said, I completely get the move upmarket and think if they handle it correctly it's a good move. BUT I think they're aiming a little too high too fast. Plus, I think Grand Seiko is aiming to compete with Patek and that's just silly (no matter how much I admire Grand Seiko).
It’s a beautiful watch and I agree with your feelings about the price tag and the fact that more and more watches come in limited editions making people want to pull the trigger without having the time to weigh in the pros and cons of buying a particular watch before it becomes unavailable.
Another great and honest video. I have the new Prospex version of the Seiko Marine Master and I love it. It is also pretty expensive. Mine is extremely accurate tested on various axis, and using real use timing against a atomic corrected quartz watch. I do agree Seiko are making their watches way too expensive. Mine runs well within COSC accuracy specifications. I might just be lucky. The quality of the watch head on my Prospex Marine Master actually feels better quality than a Tudor Black Bay. The bracelet is better than normal for a Seiko, but it isn't as good as a ETA movement Tudor black Bay bracelet. I really like Tudor watches too and I have three of them, so I am not a Seiko 'fanboy' , I am just telling people my own personal experience.
Clearly this watch is not for you. It’s another level of watchmaking which I won’t waste my time to explain to you. However, there is other lines you should consider as your reasoning- you clearly have no idea what you are trying to justify here - please take a look at the SNK line, the 5KX or their sister brand orient. These lines would serve someone like you- a person with a lobster apetite but a 2 minute noodle budget. You may have considered this watch but it most certainly has not considered you! Thanks
I would choose this piece over a Sub any day of the week. They should have made it $2500. 100% agree with you. It's as though Seiko doesn't want to compete with the lux brands and win.
I've been getting into Orient more lately. I know, technically under the Seiko umbrella, but great peices for the money. And you don't see them out in the wild very often. I always like wearing a watch that only another watch person will recognize.
Thank you for providing us this review, Guy. 4 grand is simply too much for the SLA017, especially when you can buy a similarly specced Sinn 104, Oris Divers 65 or Zodiac Super Sea Wolf for less than half to 1/3rd the price. At this rate, I don’t see Seiko coming anywhere close to touching the Omega Seamaster or even the Tudor Black Bay with its fancier Prospex Divers.
Yeah it’s hard to justify the price and what’s more disappointing is all of the lost potential had they just made the bracelet better, the price lower, and made it a standard release. It would have been an icon to compete with the big boy dive watches.
Too expensive! Guy, I can guarantee you that you have genuine Seiko in your hand there. I know because the pip doesn't line up, lol! C'mon Seiko, you can do better!
I own the many higher end seikos such as all 3 sla models, mm300, mm600, 300m 600m 1000m tunas and i got say until you have handled some of these you won't be able appreciate how good the quality is compared to the lower end stuff. I do agree the 3 sla pieces are overpriced but I rather have the sla017 over something like the BB just for the fact its alot less common.
@@jeffliang1718 never had an omega but have a tudor Bb harrods and the mm300 case blows away the tudor blocky case in every way, not many ppl do but I prefer the mm300 adjustable clasp over the tudor one also...so awkfard to open so much easier if you have the dual triggers
Spot-on observations Guy... I don't consider you a Seiko-hater, you're just telling it like it is, nothing more, nothing less. I do feel the same way about Seiko nowadays...
I own the Seiko Prospex Divers 55th SBEX009; for sure it is a stunning watch, but I paid way less than the $6500 retail price. it's special but not at the level of Grand Seiko. I totally agreed with this gentleman.
What utter rubbish, it’s a great movement and by most peoples accounts these are generally extremely accurate.. There are plenty of these pieces if you include the difference versions. The only thing I agree with is the below par bracelet and I’m not really thinking a bracelet is so right for this piece anyway. It’s an awesome watch, practically GS level on most counts and and fabulous design. Seiko do actually know a thing or two about running a business in the watch world, other people often think they know better. But they don’t, it’s just opinions and don’t agree with most that was said in this post.
So true, couldn’t agree more with you. Seiko have started to forget their regular customer base. They already got Grand Seiko and Credo for super luxury buyers.
Looking for some insight on the 8L35 movement brought me here so video was very informative...i'm interested to know if you think for the price point of $2900 on the new limited edition SLA035J1 it's still a substandard movement? I've been really torn between the cheaper SPB125J1 and the higher spec SLA035J1 and not sure at 4x the price it can be a justifiable piece...i'm in agreement with your view about limited edition releases, so though it worth asking?!
Seiko always finds a way to disappoint. Adjust and regulate the movement and make a much better bracelet. This could be Seiko’s flagship watch at 2500-3000 dollar range- they would sell tons of them!! I totally agree with you Guy. Best regards
Grand Seiko commercials air on TV in Asia but is mostly unknown to the West. The quantity is there but the branding is is holding it back. They should reduce their lineup and stop with all of the special editions. Focus on branding a few models.
I couldn't agree more Guy. There are folks who defend Seiko for including a throw away bracelet with their 500 dollar watches, then their 800 dollar watches but it continues with their pricier watches. When they're still cutting corners at the 3000 to 4000 dollar mark, it's indefensible. I know people are paying it but I'm not sure why. At that price it should be a well rounded package with quality being consistent from the watch down to the spring bars.
This video sums up my thoughts on Seiko perfectly, if Seiko wants to compete with the swiss, there's many issues they have to address with there higher offering, poor packaging, poor customer service, poor braclets and clasps, non certified watches. There's many issues present that wouldn't exsist from let's say Omega at the same price level.
Honest review as always Guy. Could have taken down Oris and probably Tudor with this watch had it been a general release and with strap options. Sub par bracelet and Strap doesn't cut it for $4 grand
I couldn’t agree more. Seiko could have done the same with the 6105 as well. I would have purchased either one of these. To bad. Your critique is so on the mark excellent video. “Seiko are you listening “
Why does Seiko keep getting away with putting out watches with crappy accessories, bad quality control, and now with a price too high? Like even their low level watches are overpriced and not that well built now... I personally really don't understand the love for Seiko.
Luciole Dizerot Because 1) Seiko commands a cult of followers who constantly make excuses for their sub-par offerings, and will buy their watches regardless; and 2) Seiko is the Nissan of watch companies in that they are making sub-par quality products nowadays, while passing them off as having the reliability of the old ones.
Well said! My feeling is Seiko will have some trouble moving up market. Easy to go down, imagine a 3k Rolex sport's watch, however, Seiko is still viewed as a "mall watch" by the majority of people. Tell people you've got a 4k Seiko on your wrist, they'll tell you that you should have bought a Rolex. Having said that, it's a lovely watch, but I agree with all your points. For that kind of money or even much less, I want a + - 2 sec per day watch....with a really nice bracelet. Sinn does that for 1500 bucks.
Just recieved a Tandorio homage, yesteday lovely steel strap seiko movement, 30ATM ! (so it says) gorgeous workmanship, looks exactly the same, so far its keeping time with my Seamaster + - 2 secs Cost? just £70.00 GBP ,anyone who pays $4000.00 for an identical looking piece has been had....big time Seiko like a lot of manufactures and stores are getting very greedy ,everywhere you look someone getting ripped off. society has gone mad since Covid.... thanks China !
Every word is true - as always with this channel. This watch should indeed be Seiko's flagship diver, with the movement upgraded for accuracy, and going eyeball to eyeball with the Seamaster and Black Bay. I think if anything it has better pedigree than those watches because the Seamaster appearance has changed so much in its history and the BB is a derivative vintage sub homage (much as I love them). Great video again guy, I enjoy every upload to your channel.
You are spot on Guy. I have a lot of Seiko divers from £200 up to £500 but that's as high a price I'll pay. It hacks me off that Seiko can't align the chapter ring but Citizen and Orient can. I have watches at 25 to 40 pound that everything ligns up fine so why can't Seiko do it. Last 2 Seikos I bought are the Blue faced Turtle 5 and the Turtle PADI. I feel Seiko is trying to get rid of folk like me who buy what they call entry level. Think I'll stick with Orient, Citizen or a few micro brands.
I will agree with you to an extent like the price you can get a seamsaster or GS for this and I love Seiko I have an entire box of them and GS . but this definitely isn’t the pinnacle of Seiko divers the GS SBGA’s with spring drives as well as their prospex LX line that also have spring drives blow this away in most every detail besides nostalgia
Yes. A $4k watch should be a chronometer. And a tool watch should not be marketed expensive and limited. Honestly the San Martin NH35 watch is a very good recreation of the 62 MAS. I won't say replica. The 62 MAS is long retired and originally was a sub par diver. So I am quite happy to be wearing the San Martin. It's essentially the only reasonable 62 MAS watch for this day. Ridiculous to wear a $4k watch as a tool. TYVM.
I wholeheartedly agree with your your assessment of this Seiko SLA017. Beautiful watch, but for the $4K price, the accuracy and bracelet should be much better!
Clearly this watch is not for you. It’s another level of watchmaking which I won’t waste my time to explain to you. However, there is other lines you should consider as your reasoning- you clearly have no idea what you are trying to justify here - please take a look at the SNK line, the 5KX or their sister brand orient. These lines would serve someone like you- a person with a lobster apetite but a 2 minute noodle budget. You may have considered this watch but it most certainly has not considered you! Thanks
I completely agree with you. I don't buy Seiko anymore out of principle.... And also just feeling like they're really but good bang for buck anymore... Also... Grand Seiko is brand that completes with the likes of Tutor and Rolex.... Not Seiko. And Seiko still continue their epic QC fails in their watches that are now between one and two thousand dollars! ... I wouldn't be surprised if this marketing strategy ends ups costing them in the long run. Gauging usually does.
They really blew it with this faithful limited release. Should have been mass produced and a showcase to compete with Omega Seamaster, Rolex Submariner, Tudor Black Bay.
If this watch is a normal production watch that has it's original watch profile,price around $2000, you get yourself a watch that belongs on waiting lists.
This is how Seiko rewards brand loyalty with a $4K limited-edition watch that copies an affordable dive watch, a watch design that failed time and time again under actual dive conditions; a design that necessitated a revision and later, a follow-up design. Add an unregulated movement, an afterthought of a bracelet, and a dust-magnet of a strap. This reminds of the of people who pay too much for sushi. Sushi was a method for poor and middle-class people in old Edo to preserve leftover fish and rice. Today, pompous jerks will pay way too much money for it. You’re paying $4K for fish and rice. Kind of says it all.
Good take Guy. The bracelets on high end Seikos are shockingly awful. My MM300 bracelet makes the watch look like a sub $1000 piece but as soon as you take it off and put it on a higher end strap, suddenly it works with Omegas and Tudors. The 8L35 is in that watch as well and mine performs +2 to about -4 but mileage definitely varies.
Thanks Pete, appreciate the feedback. I imagine a lot of 8L movements preform well, but there’s no guarantee of it being better than the spec and I like a guarantee (or they’ll fix it).
I’d love one but certainly not playing the limited availability games all areas of the watch world seems to love. I’m about availability over exclusivity. That’s why I don’t complain about Omega and their many large runs of (not so) limited editions. If a watch is nice and sells keep knocking them out.
8rick1ane Good. Means more people can own them. I have an Omega. Don’t care if it’s resale if £5000 or 50p. I was happy with the watch and price when I bought it.
The thing that Seiko overlooked is the very excellent quality San Martin 62MAS microbrand ripoff. I got it for $210. The lume is amazing deep C3 Superluminova, sapphire crystal, NH35 movement, great bezel, amazing case and dial. The NH35 movement will never retire in your lifetime so getting it serviced is a snap. The ripoff is in fact a dive watch. San Martin is a dive watch company. It's my "one" watch EDC, and it really stands out on a $27 stainless bracelet. Oh and SM offers the watch in blue, green, gray dials with great sunburst. Did I mention that my watch is logo-less, now that is my favorite part, nobody's name on my watch. Seiko can KMA.
You didnt prepare yourself enough for this review. I am an professional expert for SEIKO in Europe. Accuracy for this watch is max. 15 sec in + direction only in extreme situations and time period longer then 5 to 7 days. In normal usage it is 15/6 = 2.5 sec. per day. Because of 6 phisical positions of watch. On average it is even less. There is reason for that. Approx. about 1.8 to 2.1 seconds in + direction and about 1.5 to 1.7 seconds in - direction.
Its obvious hes not prepared for horology as a whole it seems. His knowledge is highly lacking and I find it very cringey to watch his reviews but I do so for more of the visual enjoyment of the watch and to laugh at the lack of knowledge he has the so called "frantically uninformed idiot" . His explanation of unregulated and un-adjusted is just funny.
It's obviously not that accurate or else they would have advertised it as such. I'm sure most of them do run more accurately than the specs, but they skimped on quality control and let some less accurate ones still be sold. A run of the mil ETA 2824 that you can get in a sub $1000 watch is rated at +/-12 sec/day. This watch is not worth the price tag, simple as that.
If they will just price just between an Oris 65 and a Tudor BB.. I could be a hotcake. No need to limit the production to 2000 pieces..iconic reissues just need to be produce it in small batches for people to make reservations to amp up its demand.
Clearly this watch is not for you. It’s another level of watchmaking which I won’t waste my time to explain to you. However, there is other lines you should consider as your reasoning- you clearly have no idea what you are trying to justify here - please take a look at the SNK line, the 5KX or their sister brand orient. These lines would serve someone like you- a person with a lobster apetite but a 2 minute noodle budget. You may have considered this watch but it most certainly has not considered you! Thanks
Like the Q Timex, this thing is all about design, and it is absolutely gorgeous. Like you, I believe that Seiko has taken the wrong approach. As with the Q Timex, this should have been a mass market item and priced accordingly. Whether it could have realistically sold in decent numbers if it was priced north of $1500 is a separate discussion; simply because there a lot of excellent choices for dive watches in the $1500 - $3k range. So, finding that sweet spot would be for the marketing people to figure out. I would love to have one of those, but not at $4k. For that kind of money, I’d add another $1700 and go for an Oyster Perpetual, even though that is a very different watch. And as always, a great review.
How is an oyster perpetual in the same conversation as this? Price is irrelevant. One is targeted towards 21st birthdays and college graduates and the other is for die hard collectors.
Could it be said that Seiko is using the LX Model to be its premiere diver? I agree that this is a nice watch but the LX is the beast that is needed to challenge the Submariner? I am waiting for the LX to hit the pre-owned market. Yum Yum
Maybe they’ll try but I don’t think it’ll work. I don’t see a watch that is almost 45mm in diameter with nearly a 16mm thickness and a 51mm lug to lug having wide universal appeal.
@@JustBlueFish I think you are right. The size def can be an issue. But more for me and maybe others is that The LX is a looker and I think the redeeming quality for its size might be that it is titanium. Seiko makes Titanium look like SS. I always wanted an Orient OS 300 in that awesome red, but it is too heavy. But if it was titanium for me it would prob be in the box. The LX GMT in blue is a stunner.
I'm done buying Seiko. I'll just buy better built pieces, that come with Seiko movements. The name doesnt mean as much as the value at this price point.
I just paid $315 for a White Shark Turtle. Including tax and shipping. I'm pretty happy))) I also just unsubscribed. There's something AGGRESSIVELY off-putting about this guy. 😒 Sounds like he values his subjective opinions toooo much. And those irritating click bait titles... 💩💩💩
dmitriy40 then why’d you subscribe in the first place? Are you sure it’s not something to do with you being financially and emotionally invested in the brand he’s criticizing in this video?
![I.N "HALLUCINATION" | [Stray Kids : SKZ-PLAYER]](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/n5B5q1Hwt_U/mqdefault.jpg)
Thanks to my friends at Exquisite Timepieces for loaning me this watch for review.
www.exquisitetimepieces.com
Seiko hired a former Omega sales director, so reissues and special editions is what you can expect now.
Watchmakers are forcing watch-lovers to go the watch-modding route with their insane pricing. As a watch collector myself since the 90s, I have sold off all my priced collection, buy cheap homage watches online and replace the crappy movements with good ones. I learnt more about watches and appreciate the hobby more that way.
And yet 2 years or more later these are going for more money . These sla models are unique , and compete with the Swiss for quality and value for money.
If only this had been released under Grand Seiko, with their superb build quality, outstanding case finishing, spring drive movement, a simple but high quality 3 link tappered bracelet, and a killer clasp with micro adjust.
It would be the diver GS needs to bring the fight to the big boys! It even has heritage! It would be awesome!
At $4k the movement should be regulated, adjusted and delivered with a huge thank you
Man, haven’t even watches the entire video but right off the bat you’re on point. I was telling a friend recently about how the SLA017 is a watch I would aspire to one day buy but it’s not possible because it’s a limited edition.
Yeah I'd like to own one but I never will.
That shouldn’t stop you because it’s a ltd edition !
Definitely not a Seiko hater. You simply hate an overpriced, relatively inaccurate, and accessory shabby pretend exclusive luxury watch. Thanks for speaking the truth with love.
Thanks for seeing it for what it is!
Seiko may not be the same value company since they've moved upmarket, but if they keep selling out of the limited release watches at their current asking price points are they really overprices?
Seiko will never compete with Rolex at any price point because people are sheep not wolves!!’Keep up the honest work.
On a different note with the new grand seikos they are simply better in every aspect than a rolex!! Boom!
For 4000$ without even thinking i will buy a new seamaster in a heartbeat
Nailed it. I just had this exact same conversation with my brother. We came to the same conclusion, that this should have been their flagship diver, not a limited edition.
My thoughts exactly. You really hit the nail on the head.
Excellent evaluation, without choosing "nice words" for critique -and no, I'm not a Seiko or any brand "hater". I can't say how much "200m" increases the price, but the rest is just a 600€ watch IMO.
At the very least - if Seiko had priced this re-release correctly, they could have taken the Oris65 spot as the industry's affordable darling.
Elijs Dima check out the new SPB149. It’s the same watch but $2000
Shipmate 1350$
I was planning to buy the seiko sbdc051 then i watched your video 'has seiko jumped the shark'.You are right there is no more value added in their model despite the price increase.I bought the Mido ocean star instead.Glad and happy with my decision
Good choice I like that Mido.
Totally agree. I’m also a huge SEIKO fan and collector for precisely the reason that they are rugged, democratic and unpretentious. I loved Seikos honesty and integrity. Sucking up with Swiss brands feels insecure and aimless.
What are your thoughts on the new Seiko SJE093 released yesterday?
Doesn't seem to come with a bracelet, that's a shame.
Beautiful watch and very thorough video. Can't wait for the next one m8!
Totally agree. I keep going to my local Seiko AD, trying on watches and hoping to find the right balance of design, quality and price, and while the design element often woos my heart, the quality of materials is mostly a miss when it comes to straps, the quality of execution is downright laughable with respect to bracelets, most of the brand's movement tolerances are so-so at best (and can be horrible at worst - I'm talking to you 6R15), while the prices cause me to walk across the street to my local Swiss/German retailer and purchase something with an ETA or Sellita inside (my Seiko AD just became Canada's sole Damasko AD, and this German manufacturer's quality and execution is tough to beat for their prices). Seiko is becoming the best used watch to buy (unless discontinued), a sad fact that will hurt their ADs and eventually impact the brand. Fortunately, plenty of other good alternatives are quickly filling the void Seiko is unwittingly leaving behind, including micros using the reliable (if not accurate) NH35/36, etc. Let's hope someone in Tokyo wakes up before all their disenfranchised entry-level buyers leave Seiko for good. Thanks for the excellent review of a beautiful timepiece that will likely never end up on my wrist for all the reasons you clearly state.
I totally agree with you: Seiko is definetly going in the wrong direction..or...maybe...the way they see it is well out of ours understandings and I truly hope they're right, not us 🙁
Thanks for watching Carlo I appreciate it.
Great review Guy thanks for posting it I really enjoyed it
Thanks Eric.
"No one asked for that." You mean, watch nerds didn't ask for that -- but you have to admit that watch nerds only make up a tiny percentage of the watch market. Perhaps Seiko realized that smartphones, Apple Watches, and other wearables like Fitbit are destroying the low-end market. Fossil realized the same thing and have been trying to sell smartwatches to make up for their plummeting mechanical sales. Instead of going the smartwatch route, Seiko seems to think the key to their survival is to rebrand as affordable luxury (Presage) or luxury (Grand Seiko).
I totally agree! (check my comment above) This isbwhy they discontinued skx and expanded the entry level which is just 5 series now. All the others will be made to a higher standard and price.
DanfriedAce the answer is grand seiko
Excellent review, and spot on, as always
I completely agree, Guy. I bought the 051MAS watch and I love it, but really wish it was a little smaller, had a 4 hz movement, and a better handset. Then it would be perfect! Oh wait, they did make that watch and called it the SLA017 and charge 4 times as much for it. If they would've made this a regular release and priced it at $2500 I think it still would've been a big seller. I would've purchased it.
At $2500 especially with a bit better of a bracelet, I’d have been a buyer.
@@JustBlueFish exactly. They really need to reevaluate themselves. I'm sure they made plenty of money with this release but they could've sold thousands more. I guess that takes the exclusivity out of it, but isn't that what Grand Seiko is supposed to be for?
With that said, I completely get the move upmarket and think if they handle it correctly it's a good move. BUT I think they're aiming a little too high too fast. Plus, I think Grand Seiko is aiming to compete with Patek and that's just silly (no matter how much I admire Grand Seiko).
It’s a beautiful watch and I agree with your feelings about the price tag and the fact that more and more watches come in limited editions making people want to pull the trigger without having the time to weigh in the pros and cons of buying a particular watch before it becomes unavailable.
Ya all the limited watches has been like an avalanche the past year or two.
Well done and spot on. Thanks, Guy.
Thanks Joe!
Another great and honest video. I have the new Prospex version of the Seiko Marine Master and I love it. It is also pretty expensive. Mine is extremely accurate tested on various axis, and using real use timing against a atomic corrected quartz watch. I do agree Seiko are making their watches way too expensive. Mine runs well within COSC accuracy specifications. I might just be lucky. The quality of the watch head on my Prospex Marine Master actually feels better quality than a Tudor Black Bay. The bracelet is better than normal for a Seiko, but it isn't as good as a ETA movement Tudor black Bay bracelet. I really like Tudor watches too and I have three of them, so I am not a Seiko 'fanboy' , I am just telling people my own personal experience.
I just got a San Martin 62mas watch. It’s 40mm, sapphire, ceramic bezel, C3 luminova, and with Seiko NH35a movement. It was only $235!!!!!!!!
Clearly this watch is not for you. It’s another level of watchmaking which I won’t waste my time to explain to you. However, there is other lines you should consider as your reasoning- you clearly have no idea what you are trying to justify here - please take a look at the SNK line, the 5KX or their sister brand orient. These lines would serve someone like you- a person with a lobster apetite but a 2 minute noodle budget.
You may have considered this watch but it most certainly has not considered you!
Thanks
I would choose this piece over a Sub any day of the week. They should have made it $2500. 100% agree with you. It's as though Seiko doesn't want to compete with the lux brands and win.
I've been getting into Orient more lately. I know, technically under the Seiko umbrella, but great peices for the money. And you don't see them out in the wild very often. I always like wearing a watch that only another watch person will recognize.
Any 6R15 can be regulated to run well inside COSC. $4,000 + ⁉️❓‼️
Thank you for providing us this review, Guy. 4 grand is simply too much for the SLA017, especially when you can buy a similarly specced Sinn 104, Oris Divers 65 or Zodiac Super Sea Wolf for less than half to 1/3rd the price. At this rate, I don’t see Seiko coming anywhere close to touching the Omega Seamaster or even the Tudor Black Bay with its fancier Prospex Divers.
Yeah it’s hard to justify the price and what’s more disappointing is all of the lost potential had they just made the bracelet better, the price lower, and made it a standard release. It would have been an icon to compete with the big boy dive watches.
I just picked up the SLA047J1 limited edition Seiko Marine Master from Exquisite Timepiece’s. They’re awesome to deal with and buy from 👍🏻💯
I have sbdx041(mat black 62mas) which only 300 piece in the world (sla017 is 2000 piece in the world lol)
Too expensive! Guy, I can guarantee you that you have genuine Seiko in your hand there. I know because the pip doesn't line up, lol! C'mon Seiko, you can do better!
I think your brand conscious... For the finish, its a bargain... Looks and finish is better than rolex sub...
I own the many higher end seikos such as all 3 sla models, mm300, mm600, 300m 600m 1000m tunas and i got say until you have handled some of these you won't be able appreciate how good the quality is compared to the lower end stuff. I do agree the 3 sla pieces are overpriced but I rather have the sla017 over something like the BB just for the fact its alot less common.
Jaspal Dhillon agree. I much prefer a seiko prospex to the black bay
how's the mm300 build quality compare to Tudor Black Bay and new Omega Seamaster?
@@jeffliang1718 never had an omega but have a tudor Bb harrods and the mm300 case blows away the tudor blocky case in every way, not many ppl do but I prefer the mm300 adjustable clasp over the tudor one also...so awkfard to open so much easier if you have the dual triggers
Very well put together and honest video.
Spot-on observations Guy... I don't consider you a Seiko-hater, you're just telling it like it is, nothing more, nothing less. I do feel the same way about Seiko nowadays...
Thanks buddy!
I own the Seiko Prospex Divers 55th SBEX009; for sure it is a stunning watch, but I paid way less than the $6500 retail price. it's special but not at the level of Grand Seiko. I totally agreed with this gentleman.
Great video, and I agree 100% with what you said. Keep up the good work.
Thanks buddy.
Great content. Appreciate the candor.
What utter rubbish, it’s a great movement and by most peoples accounts these are generally extremely accurate.. There are plenty of these pieces if you include the difference versions. The only thing I agree with is the below par bracelet and I’m not really thinking a bracelet is so right for this piece anyway. It’s an awesome watch, practically GS level on most counts and and fabulous design. Seiko do actually know a thing or two about running a business in the watch world, other people often think they know better. But they don’t, it’s just opinions and don’t agree with most that was said in this post.
So true, couldn’t agree more with you. Seiko have started to forget their regular customer base. They already got Grand Seiko and Credo for super luxury buyers.
Is that the same bracelet as the samurai?
Not sure, looks like it.
Looking for some insight on the 8L35 movement brought me here so video was very informative...i'm interested to know if you think for the price point of $2900 on the new limited edition SLA035J1 it's still a substandard movement? I've been really torn between the cheaper SPB125J1 and the higher spec SLA035J1 and not sure at 4x the price it can be a justifiable piece...i'm in agreement with your view about limited edition releases, so though it worth asking?!
This watch should not cost more than a black bay lol
Thanks for watching tynan.
This is an original. Black Bay is a Rolex copy,one of thousands Submariner wannabe. As for the price,yes,Seiko lost this one.
Dead Monk ok
@@tynannida9642 No prob Bro.
Dead Monk I put my black bay in the garbage disposal, I feel a lot better now. Thx for setting me straight.
What do you think of Seiko SBDC065?
Seiko always finds a way to disappoint. Adjust and regulate the movement and make a much better bracelet. This could be Seiko’s flagship watch at 2500-3000 dollar range- they would sell tons of them!! I totally agree with you Guy. Best regards
Seiko took the Omega route, when they could have gone Rolex.
They did hire an Omega exec to head up the Seiko USA unit.
Omega's marketing department are all sore losers
Um, isn't this more of a Rolex manoeuvre? I.e. making it overpriced and limited?
Trev Barlow The difference is that Omega and Seiko outright say their products are limited, whereas Rolex keeps us guessing.
Grand Seiko commercials air on TV in Asia but is mostly unknown to the West. The quantity is there but the branding is is holding it back. They should reduce their lineup and stop with all of the special editions. Focus on branding a few models.
I couldn't agree more Guy. There are folks who defend Seiko for including a throw away bracelet with their 500 dollar watches, then their 800 dollar watches but it continues with their pricier watches. When they're still cutting corners at the 3000 to 4000 dollar mark, it's indefensible. I know people are paying it but I'm not sure why. At that price it should be a well rounded package with quality being consistent from the watch down to the spring bars.
Well said, and thanks for watching!
This video sums up my thoughts on Seiko perfectly, if Seiko wants to compete with the swiss, there's many issues they have to address with there higher offering, poor packaging, poor customer service, poor braclets and clasps, non certified watches. There's many issues present that wouldn't exsist from let's say Omega at the same price level.
A very articulate critique, JustBlueFish.
Another really good video. Great job!
Thank you sir!
I couldn't agree more. I wish blind RUclips Seiko fanboys finally figure it out as well.
Spread the word!
We are just fine, paying at or near retail, while you Rolex fanboys wait 300 years on the waiting list.
I love the handset AND the waffle strap… but the price???
Thanks for watching!
JustBlueFish Watch Reviews great review… thanks for sharing.
Honest review as always Guy. Could have taken down Oris and probably Tudor with this watch had it been a general release and with strap options. Sub par bracelet and Strap doesn't cut it for $4 grand
This sla017 is really nice
As a seiko fan, your words ring so true.
I couldn’t agree more. Seiko could have done the same with the 6105 as well. I would have purchased either one of these. To bad. Your critique is so on the mark excellent video. “Seiko are you listening “
Why does Seiko keep getting away with putting out watches with crappy accessories, bad quality control, and now with a price too high? Like even their low level watches are overpriced and not that well built now... I personally really don't understand the love for Seiko.
I honestly have no idea.
Luciole Dizerot Because 1) Seiko commands a cult of followers who constantly make excuses for their sub-par offerings, and will buy their watches regardless; and 2) Seiko is the Nissan of watch companies in that they are making sub-par quality products nowadays, while passing them off as having the reliability of the old ones.
Well said! My feeling is Seiko will have some trouble moving up market. Easy to go down, imagine a 3k Rolex sport's watch, however, Seiko is still viewed as a "mall watch" by the majority of people. Tell people you've got a 4k Seiko on your wrist, they'll tell you that you should have bought a Rolex. Having said that, it's a lovely watch, but I agree with all your points. For that kind of money or even much less, I want a + - 2 sec per day watch....with a really nice bracelet. Sinn does that for 1500 bucks.
Sinn makes some nice watches. Good call.
A typical reply from a frequent mall goer. This watch or any other high end Seiko was not made with you in mind.
Great review as always! Did you update your lighting/gear? Everything pops a lot more and looks nicer than usual!
I have this watch, it is beautiful. My only gripe is that for the price it should have an applied logo and would be truer to the original.
I agree. I wanted to buy one, I didn’t like the price and did not like the limited edition.
I wanted one when they released but he LE and price put me off.
JustBlueFish Watch Reviews I can see why. Thanks for the video Guy.
Just recieved a Tandorio homage, yesteday lovely steel strap seiko movement, 30ATM ! (so it says) gorgeous workmanship, looks exactly the same, so far its keeping time with my Seamaster + - 2 secs
Cost? just £70.00 GBP ,anyone who pays $4000.00 for an identical looking piece has been had....big time
Seiko like a lot of manufactures and stores are getting very greedy ,everywhere you look someone getting ripped off.
society has gone mad since Covid.... thanks China !
Every word is true - as always with this channel. This watch should indeed be Seiko's flagship diver, with the movement upgraded for accuracy, and going eyeball to eyeball with the Seamaster and Black Bay. I think if anything it has better pedigree than those watches because the Seamaster appearance has changed so much in its history and the BB is a derivative vintage sub homage (much as I love them). Great video again guy, I enjoy every upload to your channel.
4k for a watch like that.... Holy moly. Microbrands offer so much more for a quarter of the price. I used to love Seiko but this is absurd.
You are spot on Guy. I have a lot of Seiko divers from £200 up to £500 but that's as high a price I'll pay. It hacks me off that Seiko can't align the chapter ring but Citizen and Orient can. I have watches at 25 to 40 pound that everything ligns up fine so why can't Seiko do it. Last 2 Seikos I bought are the Blue faced Turtle 5 and the Turtle PADI. I feel Seiko is trying to get rid of folk like me who buy what they call entry level. Think I'll stick with Orient, Citizen or a few micro brands.
Nice looking San Martin homage.
I will agree with you to an extent like the price you can get a seamsaster or GS for this and I love Seiko I have an entire box of them and GS . but this definitely isn’t the pinnacle of Seiko divers the GS SBGA’s with spring drives as well as their prospex LX line that also have spring drives blow this away in most every detail besides nostalgia
Yes. A $4k watch should be a chronometer. And a tool watch should not be marketed expensive and limited. Honestly the San Martin NH35 watch is a very good recreation of the 62 MAS. I won't say replica. The 62 MAS is long retired and originally was a sub par diver. So I am quite happy to be wearing the San Martin. It's essentially the only reasonable 62 MAS watch for this day. Ridiculous to wear a $4k watch as a tool. TYVM.
I wholeheartedly agree with your your assessment of this Seiko SLA017. Beautiful watch, but for the $4K price, the accuracy and bracelet should be much better!
Clearly this watch is not for you. It’s another level of watchmaking which I won’t waste my time to explain to you. However, there is other lines you should consider as your reasoning- you clearly have no idea what you are trying to justify here - please take a look at the SNK line, the 5KX or their sister brand orient. These lines would serve someone like you- a person with a lobster apetite but a 2 minute noodle budget.
You may have considered this watch but it most certainly has not considered you!
Thanks
I completely agree with you. I don't buy Seiko anymore out of principle.... And also just feeling like they're really but good bang for buck anymore... Also... Grand Seiko is brand that completes with the likes of Tutor and Rolex.... Not Seiko. And Seiko still continue their epic QC fails in their watches that are now between one and two thousand dollars! ... I wouldn't be surprised if this marketing strategy ends ups costing them in the long run. Gauging usually does.
They really blew it with this faithful limited release. Should have been mass produced and a showcase to compete with Omega Seamaster, Rolex Submariner, Tudor Black Bay.
If this watch is a normal production watch that has it's original watch profile,price around $2000, you get yourself a watch that belongs on waiting lists.
It would be an icon and their best diver of all time.
This is how Seiko rewards brand loyalty with a $4K limited-edition watch that copies an affordable dive watch, a watch design that failed time and time again under actual dive conditions; a design that necessitated a revision and later, a follow-up design.
Add an unregulated movement, an afterthought of a bracelet, and a dust-magnet of a strap.
This reminds of the of people who pay too much for sushi. Sushi was a method for poor and middle-class people in old Edo to preserve leftover fish and rice. Today, pompous jerks will pay way too much money for it.
You’re paying $4K for fish and rice.
Kind of says it all.
Guy, you are absolutely correct . Fabulous looking watch. But the price is too high. And the bracelet sucks. $4000 and they put a crap bracelet on it.
Thanks Ben!
Good take Guy. The bracelets on high end Seikos are shockingly awful. My MM300 bracelet makes the watch look like a sub $1000 piece but as soon as you take it off and put it on a higher end strap, suddenly it works with Omegas and Tudors. The 8L35 is in that watch as well and mine performs +2 to about -4 but mileage definitely varies.
Thanks Pete, appreciate the feedback. I imagine a lot of 8L movements preform well, but there’s no guarantee of it being better than the spec and I like a guarantee (or they’ll fix it).
Very well said.
Wonder how limited is this anyway
Their movement quality control is also
another thing to consider before paying high price for this brand
Good video
I wouldn't worry about the QC on a piece like this one. I'm sure they're they're pour over it like it were a GS.
I hear you Guy, case in point my Seiko Marine Master SBDX001 w/8L35 hi- beat movement. It gains over 15s/d. It boggles the mind.
Is that bezel misaligned?
I’d love one but certainly not playing the limited availability games all areas of the watch world seems to love. I’m about availability over exclusivity. That’s why I don’t complain about Omega and their many large runs of (not so) limited editions. If a watch is nice and sells keep knocking them out.
8rick1ane Good. Means more people can own them. I have an Omega. Don’t care if it’s resale if £5000 or 50p. I was happy with the watch and price when I bought it.
8rick1ane I like the fact that we all like different things. It’s how it should be.
I wish Seiko would give you a seat on their board....
Great insights.
They should release a grey dial, 38mm true reissue with a HI-Beat movement.
The direction they are going in is the Sieko 5 Sports lineup.
All valid points. Great video.
The thing that Seiko overlooked is the very excellent quality San Martin 62MAS microbrand ripoff. I got it for $210. The lume is amazing deep C3 Superluminova, sapphire crystal, NH35 movement, great bezel, amazing case and dial. The NH35 movement will never retire in your lifetime so getting it serviced is a snap. The ripoff is in fact a dive watch. San Martin is a dive watch company. It's my "one" watch EDC, and it really stands out on a $27 stainless bracelet. Oh and SM offers the watch in blue, green, gray dials with great sunburst. Did I mention that my watch is logo-less, now that is my favorite part, nobody's name on my watch. Seiko can KMA.
You didnt prepare yourself enough for this review. I am an professional expert for SEIKO in Europe. Accuracy for this watch is max. 15 sec in + direction only in extreme situations and time period longer then 5 to 7 days. In normal usage it is 15/6 = 2.5 sec. per day. Because of 6 phisical positions of watch. On average it is even less. There is reason for that. Approx. about 1.8 to 2.1 seconds in + direction and about 1.5 to 1.7 seconds in - direction.
Its obvious hes not prepared for horology as a whole it seems. His knowledge is highly lacking and I find it very cringey to watch his reviews but I do so for more of the visual enjoyment of the watch and to laugh at the lack of knowledge he has the so called "frantically uninformed idiot" . His explanation of unregulated and un-adjusted is just funny.
It's obviously not that accurate or else they would have advertised it as such. I'm sure most of them do run more accurately than the specs, but they skimped on quality control and let some less accurate ones still be sold. A run of the mil ETA 2824 that you can get in a sub $1000 watch is rated at +/-12 sec/day. This watch is not worth the price tag, simple as that.
Thank you. So many people speak out of turn without true understanding! You sure helped to set the record straight. Seiko has won. Deal with it!
I like it alot Fish. The design and quality seems nice, but expensive. What's your opinion on Perrelet Seacraft??
If they will just price just between an Oris 65 and a Tudor BB.. I could be a hotcake. No need to limit the production to 2000 pieces..iconic reissues just need to be produce it in small batches for people to make reservations to amp up its demand.
Clearly this watch is not for you. It’s another level of watchmaking which I won’t waste my time to explain to you. However, there is other lines you should consider as your reasoning- you clearly have no idea what you are trying to justify here - please take a look at the SNK line, the 5KX or their sister brand orient. These lines would serve someone like you- a person with a lobster apetite but a 2 minute noodle budget.
You may have considered this watch but it most certainly has not considered you!
Thanks
Like the Q Timex, this thing is all about design, and it is absolutely gorgeous. Like you, I believe that Seiko has taken the wrong approach. As with the Q Timex, this should have been a mass market item and priced accordingly. Whether it could have realistically sold in decent numbers if it was priced north of $1500 is a separate discussion; simply because there a lot of excellent choices for dive watches in the $1500 - $3k range. So, finding that sweet spot would be for the marketing people to figure out. I would love to have one of those, but not at $4k. For that kind of money, I’d add another $1700 and go for an Oyster Perpetual, even though that is a very different watch. And as always, a great review.
How is an oyster perpetual in the same conversation as this? Price is irrelevant. One is targeted towards 21st birthdays and college graduates and the other is for die hard collectors.
Good watch ? Check. Good lightning ? Check. Drilled lugs ? Check. Trimmed beard ? Uh oh... 😂
Totally agreed !
Sadly agree. They did the same with the 6105. What they are offering for the price, regardless of exclusivity, is absurd. Go with a Sharkey instead.
Could it be said that Seiko is using the LX Model to be its premiere diver? I agree that this is a nice watch but the LX is the beast that is needed to challenge the Submariner? I am waiting for the LX to hit the pre-owned market. Yum Yum
Maybe they’ll try but I don’t think it’ll work. I don’t see a watch that is almost 45mm in diameter with nearly a 16mm thickness and a 51mm lug to lug having wide universal appeal.
@@JustBlueFish I think you are right. The size def can be an issue. But more for me and maybe others is that The LX is a looker and I think the redeeming quality for its size might be that it is titanium. Seiko makes Titanium look like SS. I always wanted an Orient OS 300 in that awesome red, but it is too heavy. But if it was titanium for me it would prob be in the box. The LX GMT in blue is a stunner.
Price
Seiko hired a guy from Omega.
$4k gets you a grand seiko, I don't see how this is worth that much
Or a seamaster, as you say!
It’s really not.
Seiko insulated their fanbase. I don't buy Seiko anymore.
I'm done buying Seiko. I'll just buy better built pieces, that come with Seiko movements. The name doesnt mean as much as the value at this price point.
Ya I haven’t bought one in a long while. Still love a lot of them but they lost me as a customer for now.
I just paid $315 for a White Shark Turtle. Including tax and shipping. I'm pretty happy)))
I also just unsubscribed. There's something AGGRESSIVELY off-putting about this guy. 😒
Sounds like he values his subjective opinions toooo much. And those irritating click bait titles... 💩💩💩
dmitriy40 then why’d you subscribe in the first place? Are you sure it’s not something to do with you being financially and emotionally invested in the brand he’s criticizing in this video?
@@RickDeckardMemories Bye bye, Seiko fan boy.