Battle for the Minds
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- Опубликовано: 12 сен 2024
- Battle for the Minds is a powerful documentary produced by our colleague, Steve Lipscomb, and broadcast on POV/PBS back in 1997. Profiling key leaders of the Southern Baptist Convention during the conservative take over of SBC, PBS writes, Battle for the Minds chronicles Steve's "mother's recent struggle to become a Southern Baptist pastor.."Lipscomb uncovered a whirlwind of change and a rising tide of opposition to women as senior church leaders. Part of a broader, highly-charged ideological debate, leading voices on both sides of the divide to speak out about practical interpretation of Biblical scripture and the contemporary role of women in the ministry."
The documentary focuses on the early days of the Southern Baptist Convention's conservative resurgence. This included a "biblical mandate" that women could no longer be preachers. Women were purged from faculty positions, and emphases was placed on women's need to submit to their husbands and male church leadership. In disagreement with the conservative resurgence was one reason why Jimmy Carter left the SBC after 70 years of membership.
Some key individuals in the film are still in SBC leadership today.
Steve has given us permission to upload his film for your viewing.
This is so well done! I feel extremely fortunate to have been taught by Dr. Marshall, and I will be forever grateful to her for her intellect, her compassion, and her courage. SBTS M.Div. 1991
I'm in the middle of Dr. Beth Barr's book and she mentions this documentary so I thought I'd give it a watch. Thanks for posting.
Let us know what you think!
it's almost impossible to miss the linkage between complementarianism and white male power... I think most who hold to it do not see it this way nor would they want to. But the smugness of some of the older men and the young men having the discussion as though it was a mere theological topic with all callousness makes it clear. And it breaks my heart.
Well, considering the God of the Bible who all Christians believe is the creator and supreme ruler of the universe has revealed Himself as masculine I believe that male power is absolute in the sense that God is himself absolutely powerful. So therefore, feminism is forever fighting an uphill battle. Equality and dignity are yours but Superiority is never to be yours.
@@matthewsheppard7050 God is not masculine or moreso masculine then feminine. Those descriptors cannot be applied to God because God is SPIRIT. He is outside of sex/gender. Just because he chose to reveal himself using masculine imagery (not even exclusively) does not indicate anything about his essence. How else was God supposed to reveal himself to finite human minds? Especially in a fallen world where maleness has always been linked to power? (And evils such as greed, violence, abuse, lust and so on). I'd suggest you be careful about the sort of comments you leave and claim are truth words. You will be held accountable if anything you've said has caused someone to stumble.
Edit: your last sentence so shows not only a misunderstanding of feminsm but some kind of underlying belief that men are indeed superior, contrary to the humility and equality amongst ALL people championed in the NT.
@@contrarian9999 you are welcome to believe what you wish about your particular God. However, if you are talking about the God of the Bible you are sorely mistaken. God is indeed Spirit and He is also incarnated in Christ and Christ is a man. Christ gave instructions to pray to "Our Father who is in Heaven..." Not, "Our Parent who is in heaven." God created Adam first and and Eve second. These are not mere trifles. God is masculine in his revealed nature not feminine. Although, I will grant you that that may not look how we expect it to look. Your argument fails flat in that it is not backed by anything Biblical. It's not even a strong logical argument. Plenty of Pagan deities were females. It would not be unreasonable for a God to be female. But the Bible does not even hint of God as a woman. It doesn't grant room for the modern paradigm of gender fluidity. It simply states that God is addressed as masculine. But you are welcome to think whatever you want. I am not going to step down from historic Christianity.
@@matthewsheppard7050 Historic Christianity also stated that women were ontologically and spiritually worth less than men. Hebrew does not have pronouns to denote a non-gendered being. That's a linguistic limitation. God uses female imagery several times to describe aspects of himself in scripture but ALL langage is a poor means of describing heavenly realities. What would have happened if Jesus were indeed incarnated as woman, given how they were treated in 1st century Greco Roman culture? Women werent even allowed to study Torah. There were affordances lent to being male in a culture and time period that devalued and disenfranchised women. The important part is that Christ was fully HUMAN, not that he was fully male. Adam was created first . . . And animals were created before Eve too so does that mean women are worth less than them? Because that's the logical conclusion of primacy given according to the created order. And what is masculine anyway? People are either male or female. That is all that makes you a man or a woman, what you are born as. The attributes we give to each gender changes over time and culture. What "masculine" looked like in biblical times is different to what it looked like in medieval times is different to what it looks like today. God explicitly even stated that he is not a man.
@@contrarian9999 I'm sorry but we are to the point where we are not even going to reach common ground. You say that the important part was that Christ was fully human, not that he was fully male and I say that Christ was fully human and that he was male. That doesn't seem to bear any weight to you so this conversation is going to go nowhere. You are welcome to continue in the butchery of the text but not with me.
Praise the Lord for His mercy and His powerful work back in the 1980's-90's in the SBC.
Can we a talk about the married southern baptist ministers who make sexual advances on women….who aren’t their wives? Just saying.
So much abuse and infidelities!
Dr. David Miller lays out the reasons for Molly Marshalls dismissal. This doc tries to make it out like it was only about her being a woman but the truth is that she rejects very fundamental Christian doctrine, not just Baptist doctrine but Biblical doctrine. Her actions and beliefs exoressed since leaving Southern confirm that they were right to ask for her to resign.
religionnews.com/2020/03/31/president-of-central-baptist-theological-seminary-steps-down-due-to-ethical-lapse/ Molly Marshall had to resign
Title should be “Battle for the Minds”
I was going to say the same thing. :) Thanks for uploading this! What a fascinating documentary.
thank you! we fixed..
It’s disappointing to see scripture misquoted and inaccurately quoted. Praise God for Dr Albert Mahler.
It's also hilarious to see Mohler's name misspelled in a comment complaining about inaccuracy. :-)
As I wrote to the Louisville Courier-Journal when the SBC "apologized" for slavery more than 150 years after the fact, I suppose we can look forward to the SBC's apology to women and the LGBTQ+ community around the year 2150 or so. SBTS MDiv 89
thanks for your thoughts Dan!
Anyone here raised in the SBC? Do they still have M Night?
Hmm, when a seminary, or other Christian institution, goes liberal/secular I wonder if PBS would do a similar documentary portraying the conservatives being pushed out with such sympathy?
If the main goal of such a movement, when and if it occurs, is to marginalize an entire group of people, I would hope they do.
This seemed like an accurate portrayal of each viewpoint, so if that makes one side look bad to you, maybe there's a reason for that.
As young women called of God, many of us in Baptist colleges were so hopeful in the 1960's. By 1982, when home on furlough in discussions with SBC pastors, I began to realize that the conflict being framed as one of inerrancy was actually a reaction to "the women's issue." Now, more than fifty years after the resurgence was dreamed up by two bigoted men, it is chilling to see how they "succeeded" in their goal to use the SBC as a instrument for turning "America back to God." Yet, nobody could have predicted in 1997, when this documentary was made, that in Donald Trump's first months in the White House, Pressler and Patterson would each have their true characters revealed to the entire world.
The SBC was formed, not for the cause of missions, but for the cause of sending a slave-holder to the mission field. Even in this documentary this truth is being distorted.
thanks for your insights and personal perspective.
Thank God for Al Mohler!!!!
Amen!
In 2021 do you still feel the same? I sure don’t.
My mom was a SS teacher for many years. The adult morning SSs’ were single sex.
The SBC is due for another resurgence from the social gospel, egalitarianism & pragmatism
Unlikely
The sbc will fall
Ok...(pulls out planner, Bible, and chocolate) Imma gonna attack this tomorrow. :)
God will not be mocked.
On the fruit...
There should be NO questions as to why the SBC is in crisis with sexual abuse. Shut out the women and the results are fairly predictable.
QUESTION: As an outsider. How does clear biblical teaching that women are not to be elders or ministers over men to blame for the sexual abuse crisis in SBC?...
Women in the Church (Third Edition): An Interpretation and Application of 1 Timothy 2:9-15 3rd Edition
by Andreas J. Köstenberger (Author), Thomas R. Schreiner (Author), S. M. Baugh (Contributor), Denny Burk (Contributor), Albert Wolters (Contributor), Robert W. Yarbrough (Contributor), Theresa Bowen (Contributor), Monica Brennan (Contributor), & 5 more
@@rbmath This is easily researched if you care for answers. ( I have that book on my shelf.) I'm not interested in investing time here.
The ONLY place you find women “pastors” is charismatic churches and churches that are liberal and redefine biblical orthodoxy. You NEVER ever find women pastors in churches that are completely orthodox. That says it all...
@@timcannon6814 COMPLETELY uninterested in investing time with hidden identities. Wisdom and experience tell me it is a waste of my valuable time.
@@rbmath The book you cite is written by authors who support your conclusion. Have you read others?
This video is heavily weighted by liberal women; lacking is a balance with conservative women.
Gods word is clear. A seminary has to follow and teach Gods word not man’s. Nor capitulate to the current culture.
The men got rid of women preachers for the children 🤫
The question is, do you bow to culture and allow culture to decide your path, or do you allow scripture, the word of God? No woman was ordained until the late 1800's and it was because of the early Progressive Movement, began to break down society and especially biblical norms and they continue today with the cultural issues of the day.
Are you sure about your facts?
@@contrarian9999 Look it up, if you dont believe it.
@@contrarian9999
connecticuthistory.org/americas-first-ordained-woman-minister-olympia-brown-and-bridgeports-universalist-church/
@@rgiardelli Your source excludes global history. Christianity is not native to America and excluding other places only leaves your argument intellectually bereft.
@@contrarian9999 lol lol The fact that you are making claims with no proof or showing any evidence to the contrary makes your argument non existent. The reason I use America is because it is the first instances of woman being ordianed as Pastors/ Elders/ Bishops, the same position.
I was looking for a discussion of both sides and heard about feelings on the feminist side and partial reasoning on the conservative side. Waist of time!
I don't know how much time a christian need, in order to see clearly how bad it is when a women, fight for being a pastor. Is that not enough?
†hey failed †
This is so sad for me to watch, I lived thru what those wretched feminists and liberal democrats did to our county and our churches. Look at America now and pray. The division and error that Satan started in the churches is full circle, If God doesn't punish America it is only because He "is" the God of mercy and grace.
You’ve lived a sad life. The god you believe in will cast you to hell just so you know
God made woman for man not man for woman