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Why Fighters SHOULDN'T Train With Resistance Bands - They'll Ruin Your Technique!
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- Опубликовано: 26 июн 2019
- I’m often asked if it’s good training for fighters to throw punches and kicks with resistance bands connected to their arms and legs? You know, like in the Instagram posts?
The short answer is no!
Loading up skilled Muay Thai technique is never a good idea, because it changes how you move. An ill-informed attempt to produce the most sport-specific training method ever, actually creates several major problems.
Full text transcript at heatrick.com/2019/06/27/why-f...
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Working on technique and working out the muscles involved in technique are two different aspects
That's it! But, it's surprising how many fall into that "Specificity Trap". ;)
Ahhh I see. simplification ,
Game specifics !!
Thanks for clearing that up Champ !!
Legend
Always thought that. Now you've explained why! Thanks!
Confirmation is a good thing. 🙂👍
That was great, makes a lot of sense. thanks a lot.
Thank you, glad it helps. :)
I love your videos. I wish there was someone like yourself that did this type of work for BJJ with your emphasis on scientific training
Appreciate the feedback, cheers!
Yeh, I stick to upright grappling (clinch)... that's my bag! 😉
oh my god, i was about to buy one of these... but this sounds pretty scientific.
thanks a lot man
Glad to help. 👊👍😁
I just deleted resistance bands fromy cart..
Omg! This is a great video! 💯👌
Cheers! :)
What's your opinion on inverting the resistance of the bands for speed training ? I only used it for punches but I felt it really helped my speed develop.
Do you mean pulling your arm into extension, over-speed training style?
It teaches rapid contraction, but at the expense of an inherent "braking" at the end of the movement to protect the elbow joint from hyperextension injury. It also doesn't teach the inherent lower body drive from the floor. Again, it can alter your technique.
There are better exercises to develop punch speed and power in the weights room that don't interfere with punching skill... kettlebell swings, jump squats, landmine push press, single-arm push press, med ball shotput throws etc. 😉
@@heatrick wow, thanks again man,
What about ankle weights for kicks? Would those be better or is that also a no go? Thanks again for the upload 🙏
Very light ones (that don't alter your technique) would be ok. But in all honesty, if you're looking to build greater power or speed, I'd use supplement training exercises rather than loading Muay Thai techniques...
Check out the Muay Thai S&C 101 guide for much more on this here:
heatrick.com/2019/07/28/strength-and-conditioning-for-muay-thai-101/#6
Great video
Thank you Antonio 😁👊
You are right, you are not the only coach with the same opinion. Also shadow boxing with more than 500g dumbbells.
@@best4everkings759 1 pound = 453 grams
@じん You was lucky, think about where is main vector force when you hit a jab with 2,5kg dumbell in your fist, or a cross and where is vector force when you hit without dumbell and what is shock level to your shoulder joint...500g it is almost like 16oz sparring gloves.
I'm with you Don! I put 1.8kg weight bags each ankle then do shadow boxing, movement, kick and knee. even practice at the beach on dry/wet sand, kicks, knees in sea water with wave...stepping up to strengthen legs..very effective after training few years...
That sounds good for building some strength and stability, but do be careful adding ankle weights to strikes William... again, too heavy will alter movement mechanics. ;)
All this sounds best place in general blocks of training, furthest from the fight, as the transfer to actual fight performance is less than you may imagine - due to the completely different surface [sand] and medium [water].
@@heatrick hi Don, thanks for your quick reply. I also train in the gym with sparring partners. those on sand, water just some supplementary practice, apart from running....but definitely not like those shown on the video. have a good weekend mate ta :)
@@heatrick and also I don't use the weight for striking too long to avoid the change of movement mechanic, and I learned about the muscular memory that once striking power is dropped then the slower movement pace would be memorized. so I make a stop at the best form (before changing due to tiredness cos of the weight ). like to seek your advice as well. thanks a lot ta!🙏
Pls do a video on such exercises that improve technique and are recommended
I'm got a list building up... I'll get through them. 😉 But in the meantime, check out this one: ruclips.net/video/ErOHZHz50Sw/видео.html
Coach,is there exercises for strengthening and stablizing the elbow joints???i hurt my elbow joints throwing missed straight punches....How to prevent hurting joints???
Pushing and pulling exercises will strengthen and stabilise elbow joints, for example;
PUSH EXERCISES - Bench Press, Shoulder Press, Landmine Press, etc.
PULL EXERCISES - Pull Ups, Rows, etc.
But hyperextending your elbow when missing straight punches is not something that strength alone will minimise. Improving punching technique (including correct use of distance, throwing the punch from the shoulder rather than the arm/elbow) is necessary to reduce likelihood of injury.
I find Jerk Press exercises coach effective elbow straightening without hyperextending the joint. I recommend developing this movement in your gym sessions to better coordinate power transfer from the body "through" the arm rather than focusing on the elbow straightening.
Heatrick Strength & Conditioning। Thank you very much coach for the information👌👌✌✌👊
@@mdjonayed5033 You're welcome! :)
What if you can’t spar, do heavy bag work or do mits for about two months? Is just shadowboxing okay for two months or will it ruin your progress?
Before I answer, why can't you spar, do heavy bag work or mits for two months? Is there a specific injury?
No. I’m just going on vacation and there’s no Muay Thai gym anywhere near.
@@tonybrynolf9980 Got it, thank you. Yes, if there's nothing you can hit, then shadow boxing will keep your technical movements flowing... If you can to touch sparring with a partner, that would be very helpful.
To maintain strength, power, and speed, consider a bodyweight program using exercises like these here: heatrick.com/2020/08/02/bodyweight-training-for-fighters-how-to-do-it-properly-what-you-should-shouldnt-do/
What if fighters alternate between resistance banded movements and completely free movement? Will that help? Just curious.
Good question! It will reduce the contamination of striking technique, but it still triggers conflicting motor patterns... When there are better ways of increasing striking power with explosive lifts and med ball throws etc.
@@heatrick seems legit!
then if your saying resistence bands aren't good, is it better to just buy wrist sandbags that weight 1-3kg each ? and just put it on both of your hands and legs ?
I honestly wouldn't recommend wrist weights (or punching with dumbbells) either... Overloading sport skill movements is generally not a good idea as it alters your technique. Here's an older video that explains further here:
ruclips.net/video/K_bDW7hr90Q/видео.html
@@heatrick thank you!
I think a lot depends on how u use bands. On 1, the key is trajectory of movement. Elliptical movements are harder to train this way than more straight movements. On 2, u dont need to punch to full extension. but even then, i think the final resistance at full extension can help break plateaus, just dont overuse them. Same with pushing thro that last bit to finish a rep in a bench press or squat or pull up does not need to affect your fight technique. Resistant band training helps in many sports, judo has been using them for decades attached to walls to practice throws.
I agree that the pattern of the strike matters, and so does the number of repetitions. Thanks for sharing your thoughts.
But for me, for striking techniques, I just feel this kind of increasing resistance throughout the strike extension isn't helpful. For grinding strength movements, like bench presses and throws (against a non-compliant opponent), I believe bands can be helpful.
@@heatrick hmm im reminded of parachute resisted sprints and sled pulls or pushes, but they decrease in resistance as u go. I wonder if we can invent something like that for striking. Ive tried boxing in the pool before. Though there lacks grounding to get any real mechanics going, and the resistance is too evenly spread across arm and body.
My other tht is that i think they train some core capacity at the expense of some technique. Ive seen/heard many pros n old timers punch w dumbbells, which many dislike, but perhaps they r training that compressive tension in the forearms to hands, and they need to understand it with respect to their technique before they can translate it over. I know traditionally in china many taichi guys carry bricks in their hands while doing forms, and hunggar guys train w iron rings in their forearms. We may think the bench press is more relatable to overall strength, but it also can easily be tht of as a largely generic strength routine, esp since the average bench presser cant punch. And so perhaps the dumbbell punching is more relevant. The same we use explosive sledgehammer slams n samurai used to strike a tree w a stick to develop arm power for striking.
Just mulling. Interesting discussion, as ive many bands n gadgets and have wondered at their use some times.
I also have doubted how safe this is. Also the angle of the bands pulls your fists down so you don't even punch straight but upwards. And if you try to punch straight I can imagine it definitely can cause injury and and mess up muscle development In the shoulders and delts.
Good point! How you mount the fixed end of the band creates a specific force vector or direction of 'pull'. Mounting the fixed end way too low, and performing too many reps, will certainly negatively alter you skilled technique.
2:04 I respectfully disagree with this take. I feel like it's about how many reps of form and technique you do VS how many reps of resistance training you do. Shadowboxing, padwork and sparring will help establish form and keep it. A few sets of resistance band training in between all of that can only complement it. The thing about the resistance bands versatility is you could load the movement in such a way that it puts resistance on the retraction of the legs and arms, it just depends on which direction you're facing and which direction the band is pulling. Your points make sense but we can take them as cautionary advice on how NOT to use resistance brands.
Yes, you’re right. It’s the relative volume of reps with an excessive resistance that can make the poison. And the direction of loading matters greatly. Just be weary of the other negative effects of loading the striking limb too.
I see these Punch Power Pro ads often enough that I started questioning if I was the idiot for thinking they were stupid.
Thanks for clarifying.
Glad to have helped clarify things for you. Your gut feel was right! :)
Wrestlers world class been using bands since way back. I'd ike to see the results of scientific method tests for all combat sports for an actual researched study for jits/wrestling/striking
Good point... Wrestlers will find an increasing level of resistance during the movement sport specific, whereas striking athletes won't.
I've not found a much in the way of research on this, other than with Taekwondo athletes. I've looked at a couple of those in these highlighted comments here:
ruclips.net/video/Iqvt-Zpo2eQ/видео.html&lc=UgxJW6Y7U_YbV7w7GHJ4AaABAg
ruclips.net/video/Iqvt-Zpo2eQ/видео.html&lc=UgwUPn_x4OmbsxPlQhd4AaABAg
Some of the best training instructions on the net and this guy has only 10k followers. There is no justice.
😁🙏 Thanks, Christopher!
Thanks so much! You just saved me 50 bucks!
That’s great! I hate wasted investment, wether that’s time or money... and especially when it’s both! 😉🙏
Yea, he is absolutely right. Your coordination and proprioception is screwed. I used to do it and felt really off balance when throwing techniques at times.
I'm glad my round up has matched your practical experience too. Thanks for sharing. :)
Thank you for saving me money coach!
Glad to help! :)
I get u , it’s all about technique, in punching and kicking, it’s about the freedom of motion , to help with speed power and snap , Techniques and timing will be hindered, with resistance bands 👍
You've got it. And there are better ways to train to increase power in the gym. Keep your striking technique clean. :)
A speed drill by a boxing coach uses light band punches holding the band from anchor away from us vs from behind. Interesting 🤔
Interesting!
As a lightly loaded movement, you can benefit from a temporary PAP (post activation potentiation) effect... something looked at in this highlighted comment:
ruclips.net/video/Iqvt-Zpo2eQ/видео.html&lc=UgxJW6Y7U_YbV7w7GHJ4AaABAg
I hate to disagree with you bud, but using bands made a world of difference in tkd, before i got into thai boxing. But it was just one of several modalities we used over time. I still spent hours a week with just heavy bag, pad, and sparring. I still use bands today, theyre a part of the puzzle. But youve got a point, until youve dedicated time to proper form, making the mind muscle connection, bands arent ideal for explosive movements. So i guess more for intermediate, definitely new people should get the coordination down long before adding any sort of augmentation
Thanks for sharing your thoughts Adam. There's of course a spectrum of training effects from using bands during striking technique... depending on the resistance levels used, the quantity of reps used in relation to the rest of training volume too etc.
If you're invested in using bands for striking, then at least you're aware of the potential negative effects too.
I don't agree with this, he is saying that the bands make you slow down as you get to the end of your punch and this is true if you are using a band that is too strong. If you use a band that you can accelerate all the way through with it will help power tremendously over time. I recommend the monster mini bands from elitefts. Yes it can change your movement pattern but it's not like your gonna use the bands 24/7. I'd recommend 5sets of 5 full speed and power punches on each side but I wouldn't try it for kicks because I've never attempted that and idk how you would set it up but for punches its golden.
Thanks for sharing your opinion, and I'm sure many other feel the same way too. This was the reason I put out this video, to try to explain why using bands like this wasn't the best approach.
Although lighter bands don't slow you down as much, they still exert more force as you stretch them (tension spring rate). This increase in resistance MUST slow you down. The stronger the resistance band, the more you slow down.
If developing power is your objective, explosive exercises that don't increase resistance as you extend are better choices, such as push presses and med ball shot put throws.
@@heatrick I respectfully disagree. The difference between a push and a punch is that a push decelerates and a punch accelerates. I loop the band around a strong post, step a couple steps out and punch with a band. The banded punch doesn't have as much acceleration as a regular punch but it still accelerates. The band does not slow you down in comparison to the start of the banded movement but this is only true if you are punching with the band opposed to pushing the band. The progressive added force throughout a banded movement is good for developing acceleration because in time you will be able to accelerate the band as much as your movement without the band and this is when you see the gains in power. The reason you don't slow down on a banded punch is because the momentum and speed builds up as you reach the end of the punch.This momentum and speed building is why you accelerate through the strength curve of the band opposed to slowing down.
@@jm9200 Good point. I can understand what you're saying... A strike using a light band, that isn't significantly stretched, can still be accelerated by virtue of the momentum gained from the body segments involved during the strike.
Something to consider though, is that although there may still be an average increase in velocity (acceleration) throughout the strike, the rate of acceleration is reduced as the band is stretched and the resistance force increases at the end of the strike.
So I guess the same goes for lying on a bench and punching semi-light weights into the air?
It's a less sport specific position, so there will be less skill "contamination". But I'd personally still prefer to use other methods to develop power or speed if that was my objective...
Such as the Push Press or Med Ball Shotput Throws for example.
@@heatrick Okay thank you.
I tried bands. I found they made it so much worse. I felt way slower after . It was not good
It always worth experimenting to find out what's true for you. But it's also valuable to cross-reference to make sure your subjective feel is on track or not. :)
This video completely misses the point of training with resistance band they are meant to slow you down to throw off you balance so that you can build up the streets and explosiveness of your kicks and punches as well as improving your balance so that you don't get taken down easily by getting swept I do my shadow boxing and my training with resistance bands and IT has done nothing but improve my striking and balance this video is very misleading
Hi Jesus, thanks for contributing. And I understand your viewpoint - especially as you've invested in training in this manner using resistance bands.
My hope is that this video will help fighters to weigh up the pros and cons of loading striking-skill with resistance bands like this. Especially when there are far more effective methods of developing explosive power, stability, and reactive balance without potentially compromising hard-earned Muay Thai technique.
Thank you.. I just deleted resistance bands from my cart..
Glad to have helped out if striking training was your objective. :)
There still a good workout
@@greasler6135 There are plenty of ways to tire yourself out, that's for sure. ;)
finally someone saying sensible clever things about these rubber band shits!
Haha! Thank you… I know it’s an unpopular topic with many, but it needed to be discussed. 😁👍
@@heatrick well done !!
very true the bands as well as those Oxygen depletion mask are all nonsense the hamper your performance and skill more than improve your skill and performance.
Totally agree! I actually took the opportunity to mention this in a previous video too: ruclips.net/video/5wqSpX-mWwI/видео.html
Bad for those just Learning MUAY THai.. This should be reserved for Advanced practitioners to fine tune . It greatly improved my balance and standing leg coordination using bands and limb weights. I'd put it up there with Olympic style weight training where they break the movement down into parts and just work certain movement ranges. BUt i was using them in coordination with NASM guidelines, and had certs from ACSM, AFPA, was a fitness mgr at fortune 500 company and muay thai coach, but what the hell do I know.
Thanks for sharing your experience Damien. I agree the motor patterns are going to be less affected in advanced practitioners, due to the relatively large number of banked correctly executed techniques.
I just personally believe there's no need to risk polluting good Muay Thai technique with bad patterns when there are far more effective strength and conditioning exercises that achieve the same balance and coordination more effectively. Just personal preference I guess.
I'm interested to hear there are some NASM guidelines referring to band-resisted combat sports strikes. Any chance you can point me toward them? 🙏
@@heatrick can I use bands for developing speed of punches by shadow boxing in stationary position as shown in video ruclips.net/video/geELkxI51v8/видео.html
Its a good thing to use a LIGHT resistance band which doesnt fuq up your technique. Pro athletes do it all the time
Agreed, light bands are fine. Anything too heavy, that changes your technique, is to be avoided. :)
Oh no I've already bought resistance band and planning to use it on these😂 gladly its just a cheap one that ive bought
You can still use it in lots of other exercises to great effect! Just applying it striking technique isn’t so hot. 👊👍
I like resistance band training for punches and kicking.
Whatever you decide is good. At least you're making an informed decision.
@@heatrick ok
Nong O trains with resistance bands
Kalim a lot of fighters do, or have, but that doesn’t mean it has helped them -or is beneficial to their long-term effectiveness as a fighter.
Consider that all the benefits you may gain from training striking technique with bands can be more effectively developed using other exercises... without any of the negatives explained in the video.