Lyrically I can see the GG comparison, but that’s it. Within 24 hours of doing the interview about Cobain he was found dead on train tracks. He wasn’t the only one that died in an odd way, the bassist from Hole supposedly had knowledge and was found in her bath tub.
So many people have been found in bathtubs- especially musicians, their relatives & lots of spouses- they should have warning labels for accidental drowning & don't get wasted in tub area without a professional
@@heric_ it was a week or so later. El Duce would think this is so funny. He made this up to get money from the inquirer. It was part of his schtick as a boogeyman trying to get outrageous publicity for his ridiculous band. Please don’t fall for this, it’s too embarrassing.
El Duce worked at a strip club called the Ivar Theatre. He was the spotlight guy. Talk about a perfect fit. I remember him standing in the middle of Sunset Blvd in front of the Whiskey wearing a Pickelhaube (Helmet with the spike on top) and dropping his pants...he was singing as well but have no idea what song it was.
What’s actually amazing is that GG Allin, a known poly drug abuser including multiple opiates which are known to cause severe constipation, was also known to be a prolific shitter on stage on demand. Truly a renaissance man beyond our comprehension.
Merle would take offence to the gg being a junkie thing.. I used to think that as well but after talking to Merle he assured me GG was an alcoholic.. I’ve been on opioids for twenty years and I still take a shit every morning after my first sip of coffee..
@@BLACKLAVENDERfilmscores Narduwar, of all people, would know all about the rumors of artists being "suicided" when their insurance payout becomes more valuable than their contract.
I knew Eldon well enough that I'd recognize his snoring if I heard it today. . . and those of us who knew him well knew when he was 'on' and just fucking around, and when he was serious. He was actually a very nice guy under all the obscene buffoonery. . . and he WAS NOT KIDDING about Courtney Love offering him money to kill Kurt Cobain. He told me about it privately and I am 1000% sure it wasn't a put-on. I knew him well enough to know the difference between him talking seriously and him screwing around.
yah man courtney only became a flash in the pan because everyone knew her because of Kurt. I was there at that time and they way she was acting after his "suicide" was really suspicious. I never listened to any of her shit music always seemed so contrived and fake.
I agree about Eldon beig a really down to earth nice guy when he wasn't out of his mind. Hung with him quite a few times in Hollywood. One time he crashed on my floor and the next morning before any booze we talked about life, smart "normal" guy. Did you hang with him in Hollywood? If so do you remember Bob Lush? Bob and Eldon were running mates for quite awhile. I knew Bob well, we live in the same apartment building on Franklin and Orchid in Hollywood. Absolutely insane times! We ALL did some absolutely insane shit on a nightly basis.
I met him a few times. I was friends with Moose back in the day and Eldon came over a few times. When sober, he was a very personable cat. I've seen him off the hook a few times, too. He was definitely unique.
@@Indygo9 I don't know man. I used to be friends with her first husband James the thing is she was already somewhat well-known actress as early as 80 something she was in Sid and Nancy and she was also in straight to hell. She probably would have eventually found some guy to latch onto.
El Duce is hilarious and early Mentors like the trash bag ep are some of my favorites. Yes their lyrics are fucked but that's part of why they're iconic. Some of their riffs and basslines are actually really good, coupled with the ridiculous lyrics what's not to love ?
He didn’t vanish from the scene in the early 90s; The Mentors were still playing shows in the mid-90s. I had him over my house in Upper Haight, in 1995, before a Mentors show - he wasn’t even drinking. I have a video I took of him in my bedroom, saying hi to my buddy in Detroit, and talking about how CL tried to hire him to do her bidding.
He actually told his best and most convincing lies when he was sober. He knew people would buy anything figuring “why would he make it up, he’s not drunk!” 😂 This whole thing is the biggest con he pulled off, and god bless him he’s laughing his ass off smoking a fatty with god right now 😜
When he told her you have to start somewhere I spat my coffee out 🤣😂. She had to be a plant , if anything she said was real your not going on Jerry springer to debate about morality
My ex-sister-in-law was on Jerry, she said the whole thing was staged. She was a replacement in a show where she was having a tryst with the wife and the husband finds out on the show. Sis in-law were friends in real life with the couple anyway and ex sis in-law is crazier than a long-tailed cat in a room full of rocking chairs
Before I even watch this El Duce certainly doesn’t put GG to shame! They just liked to be drunk and troll people. He used to play drums while singing but eventually became such an alcoholic he had to stop. Duce wasn’t an evil guy, just a mess and a troll. The controversy is the only reason they were getting so big so they kept it going.
Always good to form an opinion before assimilating the relevant data. That’s why we’re the greatest country on earth. Prejudice. Pre-Judgement. Plain & Simple. Murka!
@@tsquipnottsquip5128 I mean I already know most all there is to know about Duce & the comment stayed relevant as it was mostly relating to the title and his image but go off
It seems on interviews, El Duce seemed to know the people interviewing wouldn't get he had a dark sense of humor, and would just play into it by being dark in his responses. I give him credit for not breaking and apologizing for people not getting his humor.
I mean… even if Courtney tried to kill Kurt, she was too drugged up to actually orchestrate that shit. All they had to do was leaving him alone and using. He was really on a suicidal trip, had someone intervened, he might have stayed alive, but as a runaway is Seattle, he was just gathering the courage to kiss the gun. all his actions after escaping the rehab pointed towards it. And krist was an alcoholic, Courtney a druggie, and Dave thinking about being a frontman himself, nobody sober enough to get Kurt straight.
@@Beesa10 yeah only the uninformed would say otherwise. Whether it was Courtney who had the most public motive, or some other unknown force its pretty clear Cobain didn't off himself. I don't want to really get into it here or drudge up the horrible sadness but look into it.
The absolute “matter of fact” look on Fat Mike’s face when he said “No, it was Courtney Love” says it all for me. Mike has made a living of being a goof & being a fan of NOFX for the last 30 years I think that was the most serious an answer I’ve ever heard from him
im inclined to believe him about her asking him to take kurt out, also. if you know her history in the punk scene prior to nirvana's emergence onto the scene, its pretty believable.
@@POTC unfortunately I do, I’m a big fan of Nirvana & have been for 30 odd years. I’ve tried to find everything I could about it the band over those years so consequently because she had near total control of his estate, she has woven her story into almost every aspect of his. I mean she auditioned for the roll of Nancy Spungen in “Sid & Nancy”! Says it all eh?
Another thing to note is that if he was hit by the train they wouldn't have found his head that close to his body, a guy in my home town was hit by a Trai and they found his head two blocks over
You didnt even talk about their music. Or Sickie being one of the most innovative guitarists ever. Or even that El Duce was a pretty bad ass drummer, himself. They might have been nothing but trolls and clowns when the cameras were on, but they could fuckin play.
Sickie is one of the most underrated guitarists in history. You should hear him jam to Hendrix and Creem. All talent. Duce was no slacker either - when he could keep his eyes open.
GG was way gnarlier. I loved El Duce. I remember hanging out with him. My girlfriend was drinking beer out of his pitcher. Dint have the heart to tell her he pissed in the pitcher🤣
@@KMc-cw3qt you're delusional. duce was a straight up piece of shit. I've hung with the dude, he was garbage wrapped in human skin. you idiots need to stop worshipping celebrities, they are the absolute worst specimens humanity has to offer. Especially shitbags like el duce. You're a complete fucking poser that's into his image but you've never actually experienced the truth of that image. he was straight scum
I would love to see the roll of film that the police department has never developed from Kurts death... I honestly think that Courtney had something to do with his death.. The whole case seemed suspicious and closed way to fast.... Billy Corgan has mentioned he had some information that isn't out there.. it would be nice to see and hear the truth.
Saw Pumpkins a few years ago on the Mellon Collie 25th tour and he started talking about how great Kurt was and how missed he was. My buddy elbows me and goes 'Did he forget Courtney cheated on Kurt with Him?"
Two things that crack me up is all the people that don't realize that he was putting them on and hearing that guy in the suit saying your face is my toilet paper that just gives me the giggles.
Tampa FL 1994 late spring, jamming with my band at our practice space when the door comes flying open and in walks El Duce, he comes right up without saying a word and grabs my microphone and starts bellowing, "I'm a white trash motherfucker yeah!" That was my introduction....He was with a mutual friend so I didn't think much of it but was curious as to why he was hanging around Tampa said he was hiding out from Courtney Love quite matter of fact. He said she approached him and offered him $50k to kill Kurt he said he laughed at her but she was serious and wanted it done asap, he told her to fuck off but she wasn't taking no for an answer, he said she scared the hell out of him so he begrudgingly agreed to do it then skipped town and wound up in Tampa. He was there till about November when somehow he wound up backstage at a Rolling Stones show at Tampa Stadium and Mick Jaggar's son took a liking to him and let him stay with them for a couple weeks till he wore out his welcome drinking all their booze and beer, then was sent back to California. I saw El several times over the course of his stay in Tampa and one of the times he said his buddy told him Courtney put the word out that she wanted him dead, and I'll be honest, I think she had him killed! One funny story, Cannibal Corpse were playing at a big club in town and during the middle of their set I see all this commotion up by the stage, there's El Duce standing in the middle of the pit with his pants down to his ankles, yikes!!! Along comes security and they're like, time to leave buddy, ok says El, they proceeded to slow walk him all the way through the crowd, up this ramp and out the front door the whole time his pants are still around his ankles, oh man!
@@Brumsly Dude had charisma. I hadn't seen him in a decade so I didn't recognise him, but when he asked me for change to get a beer I gave him that. I went home and dug up more change and a doobie, then we ended up back at my place for a night of drinking and conversation. An extremely thoughtful and well-informed guy.
I bought a 10 " they put out in the mud 80s I guess and was a Mentors fan immediately ! Punk can use more Mentors and less crying . Truly the good old days . Sorry I get a tear in my eye when I remember the good old days.
Well Gwar is arguably the most well known band in the "shock" genre. So I guess it's there as a point of reference. Like "if you thought Gwar was bad..." etc.😂
My band Bomb opened for them in Boston at TT The Bears. I wasn't impressed. But I do think that CL had him offed. Hey, does anyone know the talk show they're on in the second clip?
3:00 when will Guverment people realize that doing things like this is just free advertising? Here in germany you have to be watched by the "Verfassungsschutz" ("Office for the Protection of the Constitution") as a Punk Bands (happens really fast, you just have to write a song against Nazis) and Boom, free Fame.
Pretty good video on El Duce, I've been a Mentors fan for years, in that time I've got to know one or two people who knew him, including Steve Broy. The funniest thing is the women who knew him always said he was the perfect gentleman in their company, yeah he was foul mouthed and rude but it was all a big act. I still own my Mentors three hoods shirt, which was always a pain in the arse to wear as idiots thought I was advertising the K.K.K. Also when talking about who wacked Cobain, he mentions his friend 'Allen'. That's Allen Wrench, who is a whole other rabbit hole to fall down. Overall other than lyrically he doesn't put G.G. Allin to shame (most of his songs are crap, but there's about an album or two worth of halfway decent stuff), but G.G. was mentally ill when it boils down to it.
Hoke passed a lie detector test when claiming that Love had offered him $50,000 to kill Kurt Cobain. In his interview in the Kurt and Courtney film, recorded on April 11, 1997, El Duce again claimed that Love had offered him $50,000 to "whack" Kurt Cobain, and further claimed that he knew who did kill Cobain (giving the name "Allen" some say from the band Kill Allen Wrench), but said he would "let the FBI catch him".On April 19, 1997, one day after his final performance and talking to Brent Alden, and eight days after filming his interview with Nick Broomfield for the Kurt & Courtney documentary, Hoke was found dead on the railroad tracks in Riverside, California. He was "decapitated in the accident - he was hit full on by a freight train doing 60 MPH", according to Steve Broy, the Mentors' bass player. Subsequent tests indicated a high blood alcohol content and thus Hoke's official cause of death was given by the coroner's office as "misadventure".[4] Al Jourgensen (of the industrial metal band Ministry) wrote in his autobiography that El Duce was killed by the train when some fans on the other side of the railroad tracks called his name and, as he attempted to cross to meet them, his toes became stuck in the track.[5] Another story is that he gave a Nazi salute in front of the train as it mowed him down. Due to the timing of his death (eight days after the Kurt and Courtney interview), conspiracy theorists have speculated that his death was related to the statements he made that Courtney Love offered him $50,000 to "whack" Cobain, and that someone named "Allen" took the offer.[4] According to the self-published book Truth Is Funnier Than Fiction by Mentors bass player Steve Broy, the whole story was concocted by Mentors associate Rev. Bud Green in order to sell to supermarket tabloids.
@@PunkTome Wrench is a real person, he's released a few albums. But as far as Duce and Cobain goes, from what I know of him he was probably just trolling and found the whole thing a good laugh. As he was known for some rather exaggerated stories that he told for his own amusement as much as other peoples.
@@craigengelman1369 Its insane how many places in the music world Al Jourgenson has been. He even did sound engineering for GWAR at one point. [Horror of Yig on Scumdogs of the Universe, Hypo Lua was a pseudonym for him and another guy from Ministry].
''us help us all always and expose evil always '' GREAT JOB ALL...THANX 4 MAKING Tee with LIONS NAMED LEO the music worldwide. LOVE YOU ALL...!!!....MUCH LOVE.!!
El Duce was the King of sleeze in L. A. Got to do a few backyard parties and out in Hollywood. Had a twisted sense of humor and was a lot of fun. An icon of epic proportions RIP
Gwar is a gimmick band they never tried to portray as hardcore, and GG Allin was the same as Eldon, act on stage, alcoholic off-stage. I don't see how the title is anything but clickbait.
I remember when punk was gritty like this. Today on Reddit, the punk subs are filled with young activists that think the scene was all about activism and equality. Couldn't be further from the truth. But it makes them feel good I guess....
There's a reason it stopped. If you try to make your sole musical identity being edgy and offensive, you already automatically lost in a world where Anal Cunt and GG Allin already existed. Also, no, guys like Mentors were the exception. The more political bands of the 80s just were more underground due to usually being anarchist orgs. They were constantly mocking the hardcore scene for selling out and getting filled with dumbass jocks. Think of i.E Crass, Apostles and the Ex. I personally love Mentors and Anal Cunt though.
I found out about El duce a while back and didn't really look into his story about kurt, just thought yep he's probably telling the truth. Years later I randomly saw the interview with fat Mike and it was like yep it's all true.
Doubt we'll ever know. He spent his life trolling people. On the other hand he is believable in this clip. It could also be partly true.. fairly easy to believe Courtney's anger if Duce was spreading rumours publicly true or not. If it is all true, it seems even more insane to do that.
Getting your explicit lyrics on an official US Senate hearing transcript is not the sort of publicity money can just buy! Well done El Duce! You may have actually saved rock n' roll by helping to demonstrate to the American public just how ridiculous the whole witch hunt was! 🤣🤣🤣
I remember a very long time ago seeing the mentors clip on wally george and being immediately captivated by them, just how hilariously edgy they were before the dawn of the internet age.
Yeah I don’t think ANYONE! Fahking NOBODY could come close to GG. I saw some of his videos back in the day and there was absolutely nothing he would not do on stage. And I mean nothing. Shit was filthy.. literally lol. It wasn’t that he was talented either. It’s the fact that no artist would or could do what he did today. Come to think of it I don’t think they would want to lol!
The Mentors were one of the best bands to see just hearing the stories is fun, I missed every Philly show at least got my hands on their good tapes- Whisky a Go Go & Cathey de Grande - The real Punk/Hardcore, up there with Circle Jerks & Black Flag
Underground, the"H" Brand" No Joke" putem down,you can hear them talkin about it when they walk thru N.y after that show got shut down, the part where they walk off after the Taxi drops them off the well known H Stamps in N.Y then, that put him underground.
I remember the first time I saw the Mentors. It was in 1981. A local punk zine noted that it made history when hard core punks walked out in disgust. That same night, I went to a party a post show, and he was there. A teenage girl was sleeping on the floor on her stomach, and he pantomimed fondling her butt. To be clear, he didn't do it. He just pantomimed it.
Duce is a legend, and punk/hardcore/grind/death metal fmusic amd scenes by far outlived grunge in Seattle and the Pacific Northwest; and in general. The Mentors were highly influential and made awesome music; competent musicians. RIP
''what does your mother think of you!?""
"She thinks i'm a doctor somewhere in Argentina"
can relate.
Lyrically I can see the GG comparison, but that’s it. Within 24 hours of doing the interview about Cobain he was found dead on train tracks. He wasn’t the only one that died in an odd way, the bassist from Hole supposedly had knowledge and was found in her bath tub.
It wasn’t 24 hours
So many people have been found in bathtubs- especially musicians, their relatives & lots of spouses- they should have warning labels for accidental drowning & don't get wasted in tub area without a professional
@@opaljk4835 Not 24 but 48 or 72...He was hit by a train in the middle of the night. He definitely knew who killed Kurt.
@@heric_ it was a week or so later. El Duce would think this is so funny. He made this up to get money from the inquirer. It was part of his schtick as a boogeyman trying to get outrageous publicity for his ridiculous band. Please don’t fall for this, it’s too embarrassing.
1 week later. but doesn't matter.
The fact that the media didn't realize that these guys were all just a pack of trolls boggles my mind.
My thoughts exactly. They hooked people with sensationalism and those people took, the bait, hook, line and sinker every fucking time.
All those shows were like a showcase for the original trolls. Factories for manufacturing "controversy." Good times.
I think the media often had a clue. Either way, it was in their benefit to present these people as the real deal to shock audiences and do numbers.
It was the fucking 80's. More than half of the country still thought pro wrestling was real.
@@drewdunn2066 They would be perfect for current day Twitter actually.
El Duce worked at a strip club called the Ivar Theatre. He was the spotlight guy. Talk about a perfect fit. I remember him standing in the middle of Sunset Blvd in front of the Whiskey wearing a Pickelhaube (Helmet with the spike on top) and dropping his pants...he was singing as well but have no idea what song it was.
Similar memories
Thought you were gonna say he was the stripper 😂
The fact that so many people couldn't tell the guy was playing a character embarrasses me deeply.
Was he though?
yeah the homeless unemployed drunk thing was all an act
What’s actually amazing is that GG Allin, a known poly drug abuser including multiple opiates which are known to cause severe constipation, was also known to be a prolific shitter on stage on demand. Truly a renaissance man beyond our comprehension.
Well yeah laxatives exist for a reason.
He wasnt a junkie he was an alcoholic he did drugs if they were around but didn't seek them out all day everyday like people think he did
But this is about El Duce
@@_munkykok_ my wife.
Merle would take offence to the gg being a junkie thing.. I used to think that as well but after talking to Merle he assured me GG was an alcoholic.. I’ve been on opioids for twenty years and I still take a shit every morning after my first sip of coffee..
No way. This dude DID NOT put GG Allin to shame. He is a puppy dog compared to GG.
Exactly
El Duce was the original shock rocker! Comparing him to GG is a insult. And I actually got to meet both. Both are Awesome!
agree....
They were all buds together.. I was into all of these guys in high school, most punks had no clue about the mentors and GG
One of my past times was getting punks off of the GG and Duce trip ha ha…, those guys were a stain on the scene
Nardwuar wanted none of that smoke.
No he did not.
Notice he didnt go anyyyyy further with that question after he heard Courtney's name. Hmmmmm Nardwuar knows something.
Too bad. He'd get chewed up.
@@BLACKLAVENDERfilmscores Narduwar, of all people, would know all about the rumors of artists being "suicided" when their insurance payout becomes more valuable than their contract.
I knew Eldon well enough that I'd recognize his snoring if I heard it today. . . and those of us who knew him well knew when he was 'on' and just fucking around, and when he was serious. He was actually a very nice guy under all the obscene buffoonery. . . and he WAS NOT KIDDING about Courtney Love offering him money to kill Kurt Cobain. He told me about it privately and I am 1000% sure it wasn't a put-on. I knew him well enough to know the difference between him talking seriously and him screwing around.
yah man courtney only became a flash in the pan because everyone knew her because of Kurt. I was there at that time and they way she was acting after his "suicide" was really suspicious. I never listened to any of her shit music always seemed so contrived and fake.
I agree about Eldon beig a really down to earth nice guy when he wasn't out of his mind. Hung with him quite a few times in Hollywood. One time he crashed on my floor and the next morning before any booze we talked about life, smart "normal" guy. Did you hang with him in Hollywood? If so do you remember Bob Lush? Bob and Eldon were running mates for quite awhile. I knew Bob well, we live in the same apartment building on Franklin and Orchid in Hollywood. Absolutely insane times! We ALL did some absolutely insane shit on a nightly basis.
@@Bryan-jd7os Yes, I was a Hollywood punk until about 1985.
I met him a few times. I was friends with Moose back in the day and Eldon came over a few times. When sober, he was a very personable cat. I've seen him off the hook a few times, too. He was definitely unique.
@@Indygo9 I don't know man. I used to be friends with her first husband James the thing is she was already somewhat well-known actress as early as 80 something she was in Sid and Nancy and she was also in straight to hell. She probably would have eventually found some guy to latch onto.
El Duce is hilarious and early Mentors like the trash bag ep are some of my favorites. Yes their lyrics are fucked but that's part of why they're iconic. Some of their riffs and basslines are actually really good, coupled with the ridiculous lyrics what's not to love ?
I always thought of them as particularly indecent comedians who played more than decent sludge metal
He didn’t vanish from the scene in the early 90s; The Mentors were still playing shows in the mid-90s. I had him over my house in Upper Haight, in 1995, before a Mentors show - he wasn’t even drinking. I have a video I took of him in my bedroom, saying hi to my buddy in Detroit, and talking about how CL tried to hire him to do her bidding.
He LOVED the fact that people wouldn't let this die, loved playing it up.
He actually told his best and most convincing lies when he was sober. He knew people would buy anything figuring “why would he make it up, he’s not drunk!” 😂
This whole thing is the biggest con he pulled off, and god bless him he’s laughing his ass off smoking a fatty with god right now 😜
@@KMc-cw3qt 77 brigade?
@@rickstalentedtongue910 Missing the reference....little help?
@@KMc-cw3qt Use the interwebs. And yes, Kourtney offered him money to kill Cobain.
El duce started a rumor in Austin that he was my father.
On the Jerry Springer clip the woman who said she was raped at 12 was obviously an actor.
He probably knew it, too, which is why he didn't take her the least seriously.
When he told her you have to start somewhere I spat my coffee out 🤣😂. She had to be a plant , if anything she said was real your not going on Jerry springer to debate about morality
My ex-sister-in-law was on Jerry, she said the whole thing was staged. She was a replacement in a show where she was having a tryst with the wife and the husband finds out on the show. Sis in-law were friends in real life with the couple anyway and ex sis in-law is crazier than a long-tailed cat in a room full of rocking chairs
It was Jerry Springer. Most of those people were actors.
She is like a character straight off of Saturday Night Live lol.
Before I even watch this El Duce certainly doesn’t put GG to shame! They just liked to be drunk and troll people. He used to play drums while singing but eventually became such an alcoholic he had to stop. Duce wasn’t an evil guy, just a mess and a troll. The controversy is the only reason they were getting so big so they kept it going.
Always good to form an opinion before assimilating the relevant data. That’s why we’re the greatest country on earth. Prejudice. Pre-Judgement. Plain & Simple. Murka!
@@tsquipnottsquip5128 I mean I already know most all there is to know about Duce & the comment stayed relevant as it was mostly relating to the title and his image but go off
sanest and least egotistical punk rocker.
?
Drunkest is more like it...
i can tell from that statement that you never met the guy. he was the scumbag he appeared to be on his mentors albums
@@jimbeam-ru1my I can tell from your statement than you don't understand sarcasm. That being said they're all assholes so my point still stands.
how so?@@jimbeam-ru1my
It seems on interviews, El Duce seemed to know the people interviewing wouldn't get he had a dark sense of humor, and would just play into it by being dark in his responses. I give him credit for not breaking and apologizing for people not getting his humor.
"You look kinda familiar" 😂 fuck thats an extreme joke. Haha
Duce's death was as much an accident as Kurt's was a suicide ...
So it was 100% a proven accident
Well said
I mean… even if Courtney tried to kill Kurt, she was too drugged up to actually orchestrate that shit.
All they had to do was leaving him alone and using. He was really on a suicidal trip, had someone intervened, he might have stayed alive, but as a runaway is Seattle, he was just gathering the courage to kiss the gun. all his actions after escaping the rehab pointed towards it.
And krist was an alcoholic, Courtney a druggie, and Dave thinking about being a frontman himself, nobody sober enough to get Kurt straight.
@@mjfan653 There is a significant amount of circumstantial and anecdotal evidence which points towards foul play.
@@Beesa10 yeah only the uninformed would say otherwise. Whether it was Courtney who had the most public motive, or some other unknown force its pretty clear Cobain didn't off himself. I don't want to really get into it here or drudge up the horrible sadness but look into it.
The absolute “matter of fact” look on Fat Mike’s face when he said “No, it was Courtney Love” says it all for me. Mike has made a living of being a goof & being a fan of NOFX for the last 30 years I think that was the most serious an answer I’ve ever heard from him
im inclined to believe him about her asking him to take kurt out, also. if you know her history in the punk scene prior to nirvana's emergence onto the scene, its pretty believable.
@@POTC unfortunately I do, I’m a big fan of Nirvana & have been for 30 odd years. I’ve tried to find everything I could about it the band over those years so consequently because she had near total control of his estate, she has woven her story into almost every aspect of his.
I mean she auditioned for the roll of Nancy Spungen in “Sid & Nancy”! Says it all eh?
Another thing to note is that if he was hit by the train they wouldn't have found his head that close to his body, a guy in my home town was hit by a Trai and they found his head two blocks over
Yeah I agree 💯
@@kainflynn1430you should also know Kurt played right handed guitars and have horrible back pains due to posture
Another banger video Tome, you should do one about the late great Erik Petersen from Mischief Brew and the Orphans 👍
Thanx, bro. El Duce and The Mentors were a really good band. Far better than most today. I really enjoy the attitudes and personalities......
You didnt even talk about their music. Or Sickie being one of the most innovative guitarists ever. Or even that El Duce was a pretty bad ass drummer, himself. They might have been nothing but trolls and clowns when the cameras were on, but they could fuckin play.
I'd never heard about him drumming for the Screamers. That's awesome
Sickie is one of the most underrated guitarists in history. You should hear him jam to Hendrix and Creem. All talent. Duce was no slacker either - when he could keep his eyes open.
Agreed!
GG didn't fake anything at all. He used him real shit and blood on stage.
This guy lived off of sensation like a dog does of treats.
see where it gets yeah
murdered by courtney love for telling a documentary crew that she offered him 50,000$ to "whack Kurt Cobain"
*for not "off of"
@@BulkernatorKerb Alright, he lived off sensation, when most people live off canned peas, beans and spaghetti. @BulkernatorKerb
" I was only 12 years old ". " Well, you gotta start sometime ". lmfao El Duce is a badass.
I like to read Mentors lyrics by candlelight with incense burning. 🖤
You are just a hopeless romantic
So, in the end, El Duce, who wears the executioners hood, has his own head severed at the train tracks? 😮
no he had to catch a train with his face
@@MegaWolf5741 As Al Jourgensen of Ministry (a friend of El Duce) once put it!
@@mrconfusion87 and Dave brockie
Thats a crazy cosmic connection.
GG was way gnarlier. I loved El Duce. I remember hanging out with him. My girlfriend was drinking beer out of his pitcher. Dint have the heart to tell her he pissed in the pitcher🤣
"I remember hanging out with him."
Bullshit. If you had ever really hung out with him you would think he's a piece of shit.
Boyfriend of the year right there.
What made Duce much cooler was that he didn't take himself seriously. GG was a douche.
@@KMc-cw3qt you're delusional. duce was a straight up piece of shit. I've hung with the dude, he was garbage wrapped in human skin. you idiots need to stop worshipping celebrities, they are the absolute worst specimens humanity has to offer. Especially shitbags like el duce. You're a complete fucking poser that's into his image but you've never actually experienced the truth of that image. he was straight scum
You know you drank it.
I would love to see the roll of film that the police department has never developed from Kurts death...
I honestly think that Courtney had something to do with his death..
The whole case seemed suspicious and closed way to fast....
Billy Corgan has mentioned he had some information that isn't out there.. it would be nice to see and hear the truth.
Saw Pumpkins a few years ago on the Mellon Collie 25th tour and he started talking about how great Kurt was and how missed he was. My buddy elbows me and goes 'Did he forget Courtney cheated on Kurt with Him?"
@@dank6852 haha, Billy said an interview that he knew things that weren't in the public ear... I'd like to know more lol
I wish her the most horrible things in life!!! Cowpoke!
@@dank6852she was with billy b4 kurt.she was also singer of faith no more.she did However have an affair with evan dando when she was with kurt.
Two things that crack me up is all the people that don't realize that he was putting them on and hearing that guy in the suit saying your face is my toilet paper that just gives me the giggles.
Tampa FL 1994 late spring, jamming with my band at our practice space when the door comes flying open and in walks El Duce, he comes right up without saying a word and grabs my microphone and starts bellowing, "I'm a white trash motherfucker yeah!" That was my introduction....He was with a mutual friend so I didn't think much of it but was curious as to why he was hanging around Tampa said he was hiding out from Courtney Love quite matter of fact. He said she approached him and offered him $50k to kill Kurt he said he laughed at her but she was serious and wanted it done asap, he told her to fuck off but she wasn't taking no for an answer, he said she scared the hell out of him so he begrudgingly agreed to do it then skipped town and wound up in Tampa. He was there till about November when somehow he wound up backstage at a Rolling Stones show at Tampa Stadium and Mick Jaggar's son took a liking to him and let him stay with them for a couple weeks till he wore out his welcome drinking all their booze and beer, then was sent back to California. I saw El several times over the course of his stay in Tampa and one of the times he said his buddy told him Courtney put the word out that she wanted him dead, and I'll be honest, I think she had him killed! One funny story, Cannibal Corpse were playing at a big club in town and during the middle of their set I see all this commotion up by the stage, there's El Duce standing in the middle of the pit with his pants down to his ankles, yikes!!! Along comes security and they're like, time to leave buddy, ok says El, they proceeded to slow walk him all the way through the crowd, up this ramp and out the front door the whole time his pants are still around his ankles, oh man!
Duce was living with the Jaggar family? There’s no way lmfao, you’re serious?
@@Brumsly Yes for two weeks.
@@Brumsly Dude had charisma. I hadn't seen him in a decade so I didn't recognise him, but when he asked me for change to get a beer I gave him that. I went home and dug up more change and a doobie, then we ended up back at my place for a night of drinking and conversation. An extremely thoughtful and well-informed guy.
He'd be a presidential candidate today!
Most accurate comment here LOL!
Or he'd be working alongside Steve Bannon! 🤣🤣🤣
GG Allin and Charles Manson would be more sane and less dangerous picks than Donald Trump.
This band could easily be an opening band from the show Metalocalypse
This band should be the opening act for Miley Cyrus
Vinnie Mac must have loved the Mentors.
My first thought when he read the lyrics lol
Cmon GG Allin puts this guy to shame.
they where in kinda the same music scene
They deserve catalogued in the annals of history, like the Mozarts and Beethovens of our time. Truly...
anals of history ... low hanging fruit, man.
Read the book Love and Death. It's all in there
Authors name???
He’s was a misunderstood genius
7:54 Holy shit it's uncle Leo from Seinfeld! 😂
I never missed a Mentors show once I moved to L.A. from Seattle. I was at their last show at Al's Bar downtown before he met that train in Riverside.
Haha. I’ve opened for the Mentors twice after Duce died. The dudes are pretty nice guys off stage.
Almost like it's a joke band, but badass
These days were pushing boundaries, and someone like el duce was more like a comedy act, to wind up the squares, I doubt he hurt anyone
I bought a 10 " they put out in the mud 80s I guess and was a Mentors fan immediately ! Punk can use more Mentors and less crying . Truly the good old days . Sorry I get a tear in my eye when I remember the good old days.
The performance outrage of TV show hosts is hilarious!
How dare you!
Why’s Gwar in the title?
Yeah, GWAR is like Donny Osmond compared to this guy.
Because they think the greatest band in the universe fits into this nonsense somewhere. Maybe it's the feces.
Well Gwar is arguably the most well known band in the "shock" genre. So I guess it's there as a point of reference. Like "if you thought Gwar was bad..." etc.😂
Saw the Duce with the Mentors open for the Revolting Cocks in 90. Best falling off my drum stool routine ever. R.I.P. IL DUCE.
Now the Mentors is what Rock music is all about.
15:15 "and you are fat?" then cutting away was a genius edit
This was a damn good video man!
Keep up the good work!
The funny thing is El Hoke looked the camera in the eye with this accusation knowing that he could lose his life!
What life?
those lyrics are even funnier when they are read by someone completely straightfaced
Ben Shapiro report to HR!
Sober life is the best life
*Nobody* puts GG Allen to shame, man.
He didn't commit any SA on stage like GG
G.G makes Douche look like Donny Osmond
Gigi 💩master
My band Bomb opened for them in Boston at TT The Bears. I wasn't impressed. But I do think that CL had him offed. Hey, does anyone know the talk show they're on in the second clip?
I'm not sure, but I think Ric Flair might.
....I remember this band...LMFAO....My boy Andy turned me on to him back in the early 90s....ahhh...the good ole days.
3:00 when will Guverment people realize that doing things like this is just free advertising? Here in germany you have to be watched by the "Verfassungsschutz" ("Office for the Protection of the Constitution") as a Punk Bands (happens really fast, you just have to write a song against Nazis) and Boom, free Fame.
I've never seen El Doochy.
But the dude seems like he's following a marketing gimmick, 100%.
GG seemed like an actual crazy.
We opened for them in Slovenia 2021, absolute legendse
During the interview at his house you can hear a female scream " help us"
She screams his name 'Eldon'. ELLLLLLL--DOOOOOOONNNN.
Is the Bam Margera?
It's the 2025 version of Bam.
Bam bam biggalow...
Pretty good video on El Duce, I've been a Mentors fan for years, in that time I've got to know one or two people who knew him, including Steve Broy. The funniest thing is the women who knew him always said he was the perfect gentleman in their company, yeah he was foul mouthed and rude but it was all a big act. I still own my Mentors three hoods shirt, which was always a pain in the arse to wear as idiots thought I was advertising the K.K.K.
Also when talking about who wacked Cobain, he mentions his friend 'Allen'. That's Allen Wrench, who is a whole other rabbit hole to fall down. Overall other than lyrically he doesn't put G.G. Allin to shame (most of his songs are crap, but there's about an album or two worth of halfway decent stuff), but G.G. was mentally ill when it boils down to it.
Hoke passed a lie detector test when claiming that Love had offered him $50,000 to kill Kurt Cobain. In his interview in the Kurt and Courtney film, recorded on April 11, 1997, El Duce again claimed that Love had offered him $50,000 to "whack" Kurt Cobain, and further claimed that he knew who did kill Cobain (giving the name "Allen" some say from the band Kill Allen Wrench), but said he would "let the FBI catch him".On April 19, 1997, one day after his final performance and talking to Brent Alden, and eight days after filming his interview with Nick Broomfield for the Kurt & Courtney documentary, Hoke was found dead on the railroad tracks in Riverside, California. He was "decapitated in the accident - he was hit full on by a freight train doing 60 MPH", according to Steve Broy, the Mentors' bass player. Subsequent tests indicated a high blood alcohol content and thus Hoke's official cause of death was given by the coroner's office as "misadventure".[4] Al Jourgensen (of the industrial metal band Ministry) wrote in his autobiography that El Duce was killed by the train when some fans on the other side of the railroad tracks called his name and, as he attempted to cross to meet them, his toes became stuck in the track.[5] Another story is that he gave a Nazi salute in front of the train as it mowed him down. Due to the timing of his death (eight days after the Kurt and Courtney interview), conspiracy theorists have speculated that his death was related to the statements he made that Courtney Love offered him $50,000 to "whack" Cobain, and that someone named "Allen" took the offer.[4]
According to the self-published book Truth Is Funnier Than Fiction by Mentors bass player Steve Broy, the whole story was concocted by Mentors associate Rev. Bud Green in order to sell to supermarket tabloids.
@@PunkTome Wrench is a real person, he's released a few albums. But as far as Duce and Cobain goes, from what I know of him he was probably just trolling and found the whole thing a good laugh. As he was known for some rather exaggerated stories that he told for his own amusement as much as other peoples.
@@craigengelman1369 Its insane how many places in the music world Al Jourgenson has been. He even did sound engineering for GWAR at one point. [Horror of Yig on Scumdogs of the Universe, Hypo Lua was a pseudonym for him and another guy from Ministry].
@15:24
El Duce is wearing a GG Allin t-shirt!
I'd guess he was a fan.
I wouldn't say I like this guy - but he for sure knew how to play the media circus.
''us help us all always and expose evil always ''
GREAT JOB ALL...THANX 4 MAKING Tee with LIONS NAMED LEO the music worldwide.
LOVE YOU ALL...!!!....MUCH LOVE.!!
El Duce was the King of sleeze in L. A. Got to do a few backyard parties and out in Hollywood. Had a twisted sense of humor and was a lot of fun. An icon of epic proportions RIP
Freedom of speech at its finest!!
What's that song at the end?
rape victim- "i was raped when i was 12!"
El Duce- "well, you gotta start sometime"
Had to laugh at the title of chapter3. Funny. Bless and Takecare from U.K.
I miss Seattle during the 80's. Magical times back then. The Band would come to after show party's and just wreck havoc.
I miss Seattle drugs back in 80's.....damn !!
Dude can you make a video on the brainbombs?
way ahead of their time!
I had the honor/dishonour to be in the room with El Duce and Pinhead. "Piss Power!"
"on your face I leave a shit tower." brilliant poetry
Anthrax actually paraphrased Golden Showers in a joke track ("Im The Man").
Holy shit that was incredible ☺️
I remember seeing hims on Talk Shows back in the day, when I was a kid. Seeing this stuff now, I realize his art was a cry for help 😢
This guy was not and is not worse than GG Allin. GG Allin was the worst punk rock musician ever known so far.
Living in a box in LA: Ahead of his time. He led the way for thousands of imitators
Was that Tommy Lee yelling at him backstage?
Gwar is a gimmick band they never tried to portray as hardcore, and GG Allin was the same as Eldon, act on stage, alcoholic off-stage. I don't see how the title is anything but clickbait.
Literally the only relation is that both mentors and GWAR were on Jerry Springer at the same time once.
I remember when punk was gritty like this. Today on Reddit, the punk subs are filled with young activists that think the scene was all about activism and equality. Couldn't be further from the truth. But it makes them feel good I guess....
There's a reason it stopped. If you try to make your sole musical identity being edgy and offensive, you already automatically lost in a world where Anal Cunt and GG Allin already existed.
Also, no, guys like Mentors were the exception. The more political bands of the 80s just were more underground due to usually being anarchist orgs. They were constantly mocking the hardcore scene for selling out and getting filled with dumbass jocks. Think of i.E Crass, Apostles and the Ex.
I personally love Mentors and Anal Cunt though.
AND IN THE WORDS OF SOUTHPARK EVERYTHING IS NOW JUST REHASHED SHIT~
I found out about El duce a while back and didn't really look into his story about kurt, just thought yep he's probably telling the truth. Years later I randomly saw the interview with fat Mike and it was like yep it's all true.
Doubt we'll ever know. He spent his life trolling people. On the other hand he is believable in this clip. It could also be partly true.. fairly easy to believe Courtney's anger if Duce was spreading rumours publicly true or not. If it is all true, it seems even more insane to do that.
The Mentors 🤘🤘 I seen them up in Long Beach CA 1987.
Getting your explicit lyrics on an official US Senate hearing transcript is not the sort of publicity money can just buy! Well done El Duce! You may have actually saved rock n' roll by helping to demonstrate to the American public just how ridiculous the whole witch hunt was! 🤣🤣🤣
I remember a very long time ago seeing the mentors clip on wally george and being immediately captivated by them, just how hilariously edgy they were before the dawn of the internet age.
lol this dude didn't come close to GG much less put him to shame
BIG FACTS
Yeah I don’t think ANYONE! Fahking NOBODY could come close to GG. I saw some of his videos back in the day and there was absolutely nothing he would not do on stage. And I mean nothing. Shit was filthy.. literally lol. It wasn’t that he was talented either. It’s the fact that no artist would or could do what he did today. Come to think of it I don’t think they would want to lol!
The Mentors were one of the best bands to see just hearing the stories is fun, I missed every Philly show at least got my hands on their good tapes- Whisky a Go Go & Cathey de Grande - The real Punk/Hardcore, up there with Circle Jerks & Black Flag
Underground, the"H" Brand" No Joke" putem down,you can hear them talkin about it when they walk thru N.y after that show got shut down, the part where they walk off after the Taxi drops them off the well known H Stamps in N.Y then, that put him underground.
El Duce was a poet.
1 of the true lyrical geniuses of his generation. Amazing drummer as well.
I had you axed for it when I was like 14 years old! Remembered seeing them on springer with gwar..
he said he claimed to know who took the hit but didnt say the name when he was being interviewed at his house.
I remember the first time I saw the Mentors. It was in 1981. A local punk zine noted that it made history when hard core punks walked out in disgust.
That same night, I went to a party a post show, and he was there. A teenage girl was sleeping on the floor on her stomach, and he pantomimed fondling her butt. To be clear, he didn't do it. He just pantomimed it.
This guy wasn’t as extreme as gg. He seems all talk. A good east-coast comparison would be Seth Putnam
We need this guy in 2024 to really shake things up and make people's heads explode.
Nothing is hardcore in 2024. It's all been done.
He already did it back then
Imagine if El Duce lived long enough to be a SocMed star.... 🤣🤣🤣
Mentors is still making music, even with El Duce dead.
Duce is a legend, and punk/hardcore/grind/death metal fmusic amd scenes by far outlived grunge in Seattle and the Pacific Northwest; and in general. The Mentors were highly influential and made awesome music; competent musicians. RIP
So many people were there when Courtney offered him the money. As for GG Duce loved GG
Nobody puts Allin to shame and Gwar are pretty chill dudes when offstage.