Did the Little Hope twist suck?
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- Опубликовано: 17 окт 2024
- We recently asked you if you love or hate the Little Hope twist. We react to the poll and your comments!
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#supermassivegames #littlehope #littlehopegame #videogames #analysis #willpoulter
I personally think that the twist wasn't a bad idea, but because SMG made the decision to have LH be the game that comes after MOM, that's the reason as to why the twist's so divisive.
Agreed. For me its certainly a massive factor why it gets the hate it does. Like if MoM came second I feel like it would get more hate instead. ~ Jack
The problem supermassivegames seems to never realise is why Until Dawn's narrative was successful. The people playing through the game expected a lower tier threat like a psychopathic human but had their expectations overthrown by Wendigos a much more threatening foe. Little Hope and Man of Medan are less sought after games because it flips this narrative by preparing the player for possessed ghouls or ancient torture beasts just for them both to be hallicunations. You can even bring this philosophy into the "Devil in Me" where we start with the legendary HHH Homles only for the rest of the game to be against a knock off rival. Despite its very poor dialogue this is why quite a few people consider House of Ashes the best of the Dark Anthologies. It promised a terrifying threat, set it up well and delivered for the player.
I've never seen this point before but wow you're so right. Totally agree. ~ Jack
IMO it would've been better as a real ghost story spanning multiple reincarnations as implied until the end. Especially since the game directly before did the same not real bait and switch but was arguably better in execution. It was an interesting premise wasted for a discount M Night Shamalan twist.
There should be no twist past the bar scene. Imagine you're in a pub and a guy comes in with a head wound saying "we" and "us" and talking to himself playing darts with himself, wandering around etc, you'd probably say "uh you alright man? there's no body here but us. Lemme call you an ambulance." That he didn't is the tail wagging the dog just so the story can take place.
Instead of the twist, the characters should've been real and players could've played the different incarnations and those choices in the past affecting the future. It could still end up almost the same minus the unnecessary twist. That would be cool. My opinion of course.
I agree. One of the rules for twists is leave the story in a MORE interesting or better place than before. This twist left it in a less interesting plce for me personally - i was more engrossed in demons, time travel, witches, possible reincarnation and a kittle creepy girl tying it all together than the failing mental state of a bus driver with a traumatic past. The latter is still interesting, just less so than the former
It's a good point. Also like how does Anthony, who's supposed to be Andrew, know what Daniel and Taylor are doing when they split up. It's like we have to look away from certain plot holes in order to make it work. ~ Jack
I think what upsets me more in this twist is not even the fact that the characters aren't real, but THE WHOLE PLOT was just a hallucination. I was loving the narrative, the world bulding, the soundtrack, the plot with the people from the past was pretty developed, the design of the creatures were amazing and then we get to the ending were absolutely none of that was real.
The message that they were trying to pass is kinda cool with the whole trauma and PTSD thing, but in a game were the replayability is a major feature this type of twist just doesn't work for me. After the ending i just lost any interest to play again knowing that everything was kinda pointless. I LOVE the witch trials theme but in the end a history about ghosts, demons, reincarnations and time travel become a history about an old guy running around an abandoned town imagining dialogues between imaginary people.
And for the last, i always thought how weird it was that a guy over 60s was walking around after an bus crash imagining super tense chase scenes in places that he dosen't even visited. Like Anthony didn't even get near the store and still manage to create an entire sequence there.
But in the end i really like Little Hope (besides the whole critiscizing text) but i think that liking everything else in the game is what makes this twist so dissapointing for me.
(Sorry for the long text i kinda needed to vent 😂)
We love the vents on this channel Bruno! Thank you for sending this in! Loved reading it!
I do agree the fake out makes replayability value fall out the window when these games struggle with that aspect alone. I always thought that was the biggest plot twist with the group splitting. How is this dude imagining 2 separate groups and what they're going through? Style over substance is an understatement.
- Liam
It was good but it was just the way they excute its like you have 3 endings one you die or you live anx you can just go to jail. But it felt weird like after learning it was for basically nothing
It's one of those things where you had so many plot threads, i.e the witch trials, the demons following them, the fog, the missing bus driver and so on, that the only way to resolve it was to say it was a dream. Now I did like it from a story perspective but I completely understand why people have their grievances. ~ Jack
It's not for nothing the curator dosent say alive just redeemed
You can visible see Andrew blaming himself he'll say in the prison ending ether "You mean Angela? It was an accident" or
Those things aren't people the cast of 4 might not mean much to you but in the self inflicted death ending he feels he caused all there deaths he can't recover because them living means he can forgive himself when they die he blames himself in my run
He talked about Taylor and was sad but he still recovered from talyor John and angela
Yes. yes it did suck
When I first saw the ending I thought it was good but after the credits I realized how much the choices didn’t really matter in the game because with these kind of games you want to be invested in the characters and keep the characters alive with the choices you make and when 4/5 characters didn’t exist, it makes the hours spent playing the game trying to save these characters feel pointless to me and that’s something that I think hurts little hope in terms of replay ability
I think little Hope should have been either a show, movie, or book and not a game you spend hours playing for a twist that makes you feel like you wasted your time playing it. It also doesn’t really help that the characters aren’t really interesting In my opinion.
100% agreed. Honestly just anything that's 100% linear because what's ruining this story is the illusion of choice...they focused on the wrong kind
@@akaiyoru2681 shakes hand agreeing
@@LagoStudios That's why I think House of Ashes is the best in the series. There's actual consequences, real deaths, people actually turn into something inhuman
@@LagoStudios If anything Andrew is harder to kill than a cockroach so that makes it even worse as a horror game with a butterfly effect
It's such a tough one because remove the twist and the game doesn't make sense meaning that I think to reduce the critique, you have to almost start from scratch.
- Liam
I think the reason you might have seen less hate is because there's no separate options for like, dislike, or unsure. Also, on a channel for finding the positives in these games, it allures people who already like the games.
It's a valid point Alex!
- Liam
Y'know I feel like something that lends to Little Hope's twist being way more badly received, It's to do with what you said about the clues. I personally love that they're actually needed in some of these games to understand the story sometimes, but I think with Little Hope because people take the twist at actual face value without finding the clues, or even piecing together parts of the story they've already seen. it makes them think the twist is WAYYYY more non-sensical that it really is. like some people leave the game thinking the bus driver was just some random guy and not part of the house fire at the start lol. obviously the twist isn't great but the perception of it for some people makes it way worse lol
Which is a shame because the complexity of it (albeit I don't find that difficult to grasp lol) is one of the things I love about this twist. So perhaps there is an argument for replayability, so you can piece together the clues and things you might have missed to get the whole picture in the first playthrough. ~ Jack
I've been thinking on the ways we could fix the ending without deminishing the twist (we could get rid of the plot twist but that's an easy way out and would require rewriting the whole story):
- we know Anthony was interested on the occult during the prologue, so we could make The witch trails actually real with Anthony fusing this historical event, as a cope mechanism for his trauma, making him believe that his family's death was part of a cycle of tragedies, we could push further with this idea, if you collected enough clues, maybe the manifestations gets more frequent and specific based on what he saw throughout the story.
- The curator (RIP for the model) mentionned a fate worse than death so what if, all of the characters (except Anthony) are actual ghosts, spirits trapped on a limbo, whether by the town or Anthony, and the choices determines their fate; finally released from their torment or tortured for eternal damnation. It would be more satisfying than just it was in his head.
- I realized while writing this that we could mix both of those options by making the town history real and the spirits forced to confront the horrors of Anthony's psyche. And at the end, the twist would show all the ghosts comforting Anthony as they fade away signifying that they went to the afterlife.
This doesn't fix the issues with Little Hope but it is a good start. I'd be interested if you want to make a video on fixing the game.
It's certainly something we'll consider doing! Its a tough nut to crack because I do love the twist but I wish the scenes in the witch trials and the characters were real. Maybe trapped souls in a time loop is a happy middle ground? Some great pitches here btw! :) ~ Jack
With how Little Hope’s twist is implemented, it leaves you feeling cheated of all your work, especially in event of the (attempted) suicide endings. I do not like how the “jumping between different lifetimes” aspect was handled since you never got the chance to see non-Andrew characters before their gristly ends. You couldn’t play as the Clarke family past the prologue, and it was to the detriment of players who did not take time to read notes, find weapons, and collect secrets.
The good ending where everyone survives, Anthony is not arrested, and the spirits pass on works the best with how the game is. I wish the ending where ghosts are real (but maybe not visible), reincarnation to try and get trauma/sins resolved, was handled better. I also have since gone to the Silent Hill franchise and have seen the concept of “horrors in another time/world, with larger symbolic meaning” executed better in all of the numbered games.
Yeah I get you! Very marmite the twist. Hence why I don't think as a game it works, but as a movie or book, it certainly would. ~ Jack
The main problem of the twist is that it doesn’t make the game playable again, cause u know already is useless to save or let die the characters. Cause they are not alive, but like at all😅💀
Where the story is good, the replayability does suffer, I do agree. It's a linear game as well which doesn't help. Only Andrew's death actually matters. ~ Jack
Can help but wonder if the game would’ve been more interesting if they kept the twist but also the supernatural cursed souls angle too. Like each previous iteration of the character experienced the same tragic events and the bus driver is just the first to survive and it keeps the themes of mental illness and guilt etc.
It is an idea I could run with! I've heard something similar before and I do dig the trapped souls vibe. It changes up the 'everything is imaginary' twist from Medan. ~ Jack
Short answer: Yes
Long rant answer: Little Hope draws you in with the promise of choice and consequence. For hours, you're deeply immersed in a narrative full of time-hopping doppelgangers and terrifying monsters, all while trying to keep your characters alive. But then the twist comes, and it’s revealed that there are no doppelgangers, no monsters, and none of the characters are actually alive. The whole experience was bullshit, a psychedelic trip experienced by a bus driver wandering through his old town. That reveal completely undermines the entire game’s narrative. On top of that, once you know the twist, replaying the game becomes almost pointless. The incredibly boring and tedious character interactions feel utterly meaningless. Knowing that the characters are not real makes their struggles and relationships feel irrelevant. Why should you care about who they are or their fate when they don’t actually exist? Even if Man of Medan had a weak plot, it at least had a tangible threat and at least something actually HAPPENED. In contrast, Little Hope reduces its stakes to a mere illusion, making the entire experience feel like an elaborate, pointless exercise. The twist gets defended as "symbolic commentary on survivor’s guilt and overcoming personal demons" and blah blah blah whatever. While this might sound cool on paper or in a RUclips essay, it fails as a story, especially in a video game context. It feels like a lazy narrative device used to escape from the plot holes and inconsistencies that plague the game. All in all, little hope is a prime example of how an intriguing premise can unravel into a frustrating experience when executed poorly.
I do think because of the mixed and negative reviews, Supermassive Games have now learned from it and I doubt they will pull a similar stunt to be honest!
- Liam
I really hate the twist i can't go back to the game or characters with how annoying that twist.
Yeah the twist suck to me
Fair enough Javon! I do get the impression it's a very Marmite thing. You love it or hate it. ~ Jack
Before I start I just want to say I thought the game was great up until the ending. The twist that all the supernatural events were just hallucinations of the protagonist, Andrew, felt like a cop-out. It made everything I'd done throughout the game seem pointless, as none of my choices really mattered in the end, which it being a choice based game I was disappointed. Learning that the other characters weren't real also made the emotional investment in their survival feel wasted leaving me unsatisfied, especially when I “saved” everyone my first play through.
Yeah because it only really matters if Andrew doesn't kill himself. Everyone else is imaginary so why should people care. I do understand your point as much as I like the twist from a story sense. Again, probably better as a book or film. ~ Jack
Twist was a SMH moment but honestly it's fitting
I love the twist but a way to fix the entire twist would be to pull a escape the night s4 where there all already dead but they will be put to a fate worse than death if they die again like instead of oh there already dead or there only fake
Its "oh i like these guys i want them to rest not suffer😢"
I like it. Putting their souls to rest kinda thing. Nice! ~ Jack
I'm sure you know my feelings on this, since I made a whole video on it. XD I still believe the twist isn't what people think, but feel like the game could have handled its plot better.
I rarely play the game but when I do I don’t like it but I think it’s ok if everyone dies because I think that’s what makes most sense
When you know that it doesn't matter if 4 of the 5 characters die, it does sting. Although Andrew/Anthony dying is hard hitting and as a dark ending, works really well so I do understand your point. ~ Jack
@@ButterflyEffectPodcastI think the kind of perfect ending would be everyone dying because I was annoyed the first time when I had John and Andrew alive then when everyone died I wasn’t annoyed
It could have been better, but i accept it for what it was. I wouldnt ask for a twist like that again. They could have kept the twist and rewrite the game and change it up a bit to make it better which would have made the game my number 1 game for SMG:)
I agree that this certainly should be a one off! No more dream trope endings please SM 🙏 ~ Jack