@@riccardomariani9648 why do you think they removed the tank? Does really good in downtiers, does really bad in uptiers. You can’t really balance it very well
The issue with Panther II in the game is that's it's improbable, it would have to have different turret to properly fit long 88. Given that some drawings of modified schmalturm for 88 actually exist, they could've remodel the tank to be at least realistic (even though not historically accurate), but decided not to.
@@CRL_One The Ho-Ri is more than improbable, it never existed. They have the "prototype" and "production" version, despite nothing ever being made, with only at most, paper plans to mount a large cannon on a tank. It's as fake as most wargaming tanks are.
@@dutchvanderlinde778 It never existed, the wiki says a 1/5 scale mockup was made, but it never happened, at least during the war. The gun itself had plans to be adapted, and a test bed was made, but it was never adapted to land vehicle use.
People like to cry about the Maus being removed and i understand why. But this, along with the Tiger II 105, is the Real treasure. If you have these tanks, you already got one of the best 6.7 lineups in the game.
@@xxxhentaiqueenxxx9809 agreed. The Tiger 105 really is overkill for its rating. I'd rather have the 88mm with a faster reload. The coelian is the TRUE hidden gem of the removed ones. That is my main squeeze AA for it's BR. I take it over the kugel at higher tiers for actually killing planes.
I just like how the Panther 2 feels. There are many tanks in this game, but there are few tanks that really feel different. Even with many sound changes and buffs or nerfs, Panther 2 still feels unique
Did Hispanos get nerfed? I mean they got a armor penetration buff, along with other calibers, but they seem spotty again, that is when facing aircrafts..
The panther 2 is the the tank in the game that feels most like a tank, the tankiest of all tanks if you would. Really love it, and with the 105 tiger lineup and 6,7 cas
I'd love to pick up the Panther II and Tiger II (10,5cm) if they release it again for an event. (Similar to what they did with the Maus). I got the Maus when it was re-released for an event. I kinda regret not playing War Thunder more years ago when those tanks were in the game but i had no idea they would remove those tanks. But they did so now i get to sit and regret my decision to not play.
Yep, I played WT back then and got to the Tiger II (H) and Panther G but then I stopped because I was tired of the game, now I'm sad I missed out on the Panther II and Tiger II 10.5 :(
yeah same story i have the maus from the re release and honestly i would pay money to gaijin for it if they re released it as a premium germany lacks premiums at 6.7 and while the tiger 105 seems fun the panther 2 is unique compared to its prdescessors and fills a tech tree black hole
I love the Panther 2, I was so glad I managed to get it before it disappeared. I hadn't played since 2015 at that point and when I heard it was about to be removed, I came back to grind out the tank.
I was like one vehicle away from starting the research when they removed it. Back then i had no idea and was just a casual player... now i have 1600 hours and just wish they'd add it back like they do with the Maus from time to time.
This is my exact scenario I’m stuck in I was only a couple thousand RP from finishing the tank below the panther 2 but I decided to get off and start the grind the next day but little did I know that very same day they REMOVED THE FUCKING TANK
Nice. When I saw they were removing the Panther II, I quit touching grass for a week just to rush getting atleast 1 RP in. I was really close and I knew I'd be mad at myself for not getting the best Panther in the game while I still could. Don't really care for the 105 KT but I really want the Coelian so I can complete my Panther collection.
Honestly since the last patch Warthunder is so far removed from historical accuracy and realism that I see no issue bringing this back. After 5 years I am one of the few out of my friends that still plays. Every one else has left because of numerous issues and complaints they have with the game that are never addressed. Warthunder for me is on its last leg, I too have major gripes with the game that are making want to leave it forever.
I wish I played more back when the Panther 2 was available. I started in 2019, but only got to like tier 3 Germany. Then I left and came back during quarantine and ended up grinding the entire Japanese ground tree. If only I knew back then.
You know I’ve been playing War Thunder since before ground forces were added. I’ve taken breaks from the game over the years and sadly when I came back from one of those breaks this tank was gone before I could get research points into it. I’m so disappointed that I missed out on this tank because it was the one I always wanted to play the most. I really hope one day they allow us to get it kinda like what they did with the Maus. I really want to play this tank and I kinda feel like it’s unfair that I’ve been supporting this game for around 10 years and I do not have access to it
same here. play since may 2014 and took a longer break from 2016 to 2019. never got there before it was removed and now im so angry at myself. together with the coelian and the 10.5 kingtiger this would be my dream lineup
Just from another comment I made in a reply, these are the differences between the Panther F and the Panther II that I know of and I may have some inaccuracies but feel free to correct me below. The differences between the Panther F and the Panther II are as such. Panther F: Had 25mm of roof hull armour, had the schmaulturm turret picked out for it but it is unknown if the turret and the hull was ever mounted together. There were a few Panther G/F hybrids where a G turret was placed on an F hull. The F also had a new version of the 75mm gun on the other panthers and had no muzzle break due to the improvements however there are several pictures out there with the muzzle break intact on the F for unknown reasons. Panther II: Had a 100mm upper hull, 60mm of side armour because of they wanted it to prevent soviet AT rifles and 30mm of hull roof armour. Had the same running gear as the King tiger to improve part comparability between the vehicles. The Panther II also never had a turret picked out for it. The singular prototype of the panther II had no turret and when captured by the Americans they put the G turret on the Hull and is now at the patton museum. The main erroneous mistake in war thunder is, there was not a Panther’s Schmalturm turret with night fighting equipment nor the 88mm gun from the King tiger. And the shmalturm turret was never placed on the panther II hull.
The war was over and the plans for a Panther 2 were pulled back , sideskirts solved the problem with AT rifles and were much cheaper than a new tank . The Panther 2 should have the Schmalturm , wich was more narrow or slim at the front and was a smaller target . That's what " schmal" means and was easier to manufacture as the normal Panther turret . Still used the 75mm KwK 42 , no long 88 would fit in there . I heard of plans to shoot APDS as the Brits , this is maybe why the last models got no muzzle break . The Brits got problems with APDS and the muzzle break , as the sabot lefts the barrel . Not very accurate , later they build a new muzzle break for the 76mm . That's all I know . 😉
Part of the requirements for the schmalturm was to make it compatible with IR devises. It may not have happened, but it was planned. There were both drawings and a wooden mock up of a modified schmalturm with a 88mm kwk 43. The main issue is however that both were made after the cancelation of the Panther II in May 1943. Daimler-Benz made a wooden mock-up of a modified schmalturm mounting a 88mm, the biggest modification was a 100mm wider turret ring to a total of 1750mm. Krupp had made a sketch (Hln-130) of a modified schmalturm mounting a 88mm on October 18th in 1944. The trunnions on the 88mm were moved back 350mm, and the turret had a bulge on the front to accommodate the breach being moved. Effectively moving the gun forward, and creating more space in the back of the turret. The decision was made in February 1945 to combine the two and Daimler-Benz was to start production. But we all know how that went. But like you said, it would not have been mounted on the Panther II. Even then the turret doesn't have a bulge nor does it have a enlarged turret ring, making it entirely fictional. Just split the vehicle into two, a premium Panther II with a Ausf. G turret and make the now un-obtainable one a Panther mit 8,8cm Kw.K 43. A prototype with the wrong turret, but a real vehicle, and a paper/wooden mock-up tank. I know the community hates paper vehicles and prototypes, but it's better than pure fiction.
I started research on the Panther II, Tiger II 10.5, and MAUS when I heard they were removing them from the tech tree. Luckily just starting the research saved the progress and I was able to finish them last year
I got the Panther II within a bout two months after its initial release, I LOVE IT! good speed, great cannon, pretty accurate, I felt so glad to have gotten it before they removed it. I do feel bad for those who didn't get it in time, but i think Gaijin should allow players the chance to get it though, like through one of those chest where you use SL to get the chest and SL to get the key like the did with the April Chest in the inventory store. Like have vehicles like this or others from past events as a possible reward of getting like once a month for a week or something.
Lucky for me, I started playing WT shortly after they added the Ground Forces and I got myself all the removed german tanks, Panther 2, Tiger 10cm and the mighty Maus. But I didn't got that SPAA that was also removed. 6.7 is basically my main lineup that I truly enjoy, and they include the Panther 2 and the Tiger 10cm which I love the most.
Or the R2Y2's :D Atleast for the coelian (37mm) the gun and chassis existed and the turret was being worked on, and for the tiger 2 (105) both the tank and the gun existed (Krupp wanted to build it but it wasn't ordered, thats why it never got build/the gun never got integrated into the tiger 2). And the Maus was even build, goddamn. The only thing really fictional of the removed tanks is the this version of the panther 2 as it is an amalgation of several diffrent either build or proposed panther upgrades (but the turret is straight up wrong, the gun doesn't fit into the Schmalturm/s-turret).
@@rorymackinlay4077 This is a game and still one of its kind. A vehicle collector does not care about the performance of the vehicle. They just want to be able to own and use it.
@@rorymackinlay4077 indeed. In my opinion the Maus and others like the Panther II could just be premiums, no idea why Gaijin is so strongly against it.
I was fortunate enough too get some RP into the Panther II just before they removed it from the tech tree. I only now, years later, finally purchased it lol
I love the panther II, just like the tiger II 105MM, they don't have gun stabilizers but they do have extraordinarily excellent suspension which allows for nearly perfect stabilized fire when going 30kmh or less. Also, the rangefinder is good out to 2km, so you dont need to take any speculatice shots. Not that you really need it considering how easy the long 88mm is to aim.
Its weird, Gaijin brings back the Maus during their anniversary, but not Panther II, Tiger II(105) or the Flakpanzer 341? Why not all of them? Give us that missed out a chance to earn them again, like they do with the Maus. Kinda unfair to let some people have them, but others not - its not like they are event or premium vehicles.
I'd love to see a reinstatement of it, or like we get with the maus, when it comes back for a week, and anyone that researches it can get it at any time. then we get a more realistic version of the panther 2
@@aceofluftwaffe6444 I have heard a rumor they will being back the Panther 2, although I doubt it would come to be. Although if it did that would be nice
I love the Panther II, it's got some gaijin armor as well. I've tanked point blank IS-2 shots in the side. Hell i took an american 105 in the side of my turret and only the breech went out. I absolutely love my 6.7 Lineup with all the removed vehicles (Minus the Maus obviously)
I would literally sell a kidney to get the panther 2 and the Coelian. At least the Coealian would be more historically acurate than the Ostwind 2 and is desperatly needed with the new .50cal/hispano pen buff, that turns every allied plane into monsterous CAS.
@@rorymackinlay4077 the reason why i want the coelian to return is the armored turret, as now with that insane buff, even the kugelblitz turret is easily 50cal'ed from max range. Thus, over night, pretty much all axis AA became pointless. Also now, the entire german techtree to 7.0 can easily be 50.cal'ed excluding the Tiger 1 E and the Tiger 2's. And given how cheap fighters are, playing axis below 7.0 is now complete cancer. I mean, the .50cals and hispanos got such a massive penetration buff, that even the british and US wartime reports say it is bullshit. I mean fuck, even the Bf109 armored glass, specifically build to protect against .50cals you can now just shoot straight through. Personally, i just decided to stop grinding axis and just play US again and just be as annoying, cancerous and straight up toxic as possible. Maybe then, gajin realizes that they pulled their numbers out of their ass (i know that it is demarre, butt there is a reason why it is called an estimation). Don't get me wrong, spawncamping and killing the entire german team including all of those tiger 1H's with my P51 is fun, but i guarantee, those players didn't have any fun and ran straight to the forums.
6,7 germans with the 105 tiger the panther 2 and tiger 2 h with a pak puma a arado and a narwal is actually my favorite german lower tier line up to play if i want to have some actual fun in wt
@@GeneralArmchair Well for me it's not that bad, my Sl have stayed around 20 mil for a while now. But for people without premium it's prob pretty bad yes.
I get 3 kills and someone bombs me. Or I look around only to see my team has disappeared and then get obliterated from four angles. OR all of the above. But Odd is bulletproof. A bittersweet truth. I am happy to see you do well. I am sad to know that you are one of a few who get to do this well, this often. GG
@kartoffel Salat How many battles have you had that are like the ones he does show? For me there are not many. That is the point. In almost every video he has at least one such match. He is that good. And lucky.
@@danielmostert993 His skill allows him to capitalize on situations that have potential like those he shows in the videos, and while I cannot rule out luck, the 2nd part of the equation can just as well be effort and time spent until you get into such a battle instead of luck.
@@meffspa1465 So your point is that you have none. I get it. You are bored and want to argue over something. Go do it with someone else. Why is there always some dude who cant just hit the dislike and move on.
what baffles me is the amount of down-tiers and/or just .5 uptiers...when i am playing any line ups i am getting a 80-90% full uptier (+1BR) ratio. It's not even subjective, I made a list of about 20 battles each for different lineups and ended up at the 80-90% ratio... How do you get downtiered?? xD
@@flanganke I used to get down tiers by running smaller line-ups but that hasn't worked for over a year now. I am beginning to believe that high crew skills affect the no. of uptiers you get. When playing a new tech tree with low crew skills the no of uptiers are relatively small but as your crew skill increases the uptiers also become more prevalent.
Oh man I am so lucky I started researching this tank 3 years ago before going into a 2-year hiatus on WT. I love its reverse I can just peek, kill and run
this tank along with the 341 should be readded.. there is PLENTY of paper tanks in war thunder so there is no reason for such unique vehicles to be removed..
the 341 is real, and more real than the Ostwind 2. Like literally the Ostwind 2 had 1 MENTION EVER and it was a "hey yea we thought bout this but didn't do it". Maybe just give it worse turret armor or shit
this isn't even a paper tank, it's completely fictional. that's why it won't return. the real 1943 Panther II proposal did not have the 88mm gun or the Schmalturm turret. it did have the modified armour thickness, a new engine, and components taken from the Tiger II, but it had a new turret with the same 75mm gun. a prototype hull was completed but not the turret. a different project in 1944 tried to fit an 88mm gun into a Schmalturm Panther I, but got no further than a wooden model. this amalgamation comes from a mistake made by a German historian decades ago. he misunderstood a sentence and confused the two separate modification attempts for a single project. the mistake was corrected back in the 90s, but it was too late to stop this mythical Panther II from spreading.
@@magnum6763 the 'Ostwind II' had an unconfirmed prototype, whereas the ''Coelian'' had a confirmed wooden model. they're both about as real as each other.
@@iMoD190 many vehicles in WT had a wooden model or no model. Take the R2Y2s with jets and the Ho-Ri. At this point paper vehicles are going to end up being added.
@@iMoD190 the Ostwind 2 is unknown. It could have been one of those bs lies the germans made up, but there is 0 documentation of the thing existing. The 341 at least had a real hull with a wooden turret
Honestly, I think the panther line are my least favourite tanks, I suffer in them but my friend suffers in the Centurions, so it balanced itself out. But I do have this Panther II, the 105 Tiger and the Maus, sadly didn't get the Flakpanzer 341 though.
I remember the week before these tanks where removed from the tech tree, players where grinding the Germany like crazy to get these tanks before the removal, i already had all of them, i sometimes take them out to flex haha.
Funny enough, I started researching this when I at one point stopped playing WT. I occasionally go back to WT and have been playing it since the start really. Because of my points in research, it never left my tree and I just finished researching it :D
I wish it was unlocked to research for people who had the game before it was removed. I went with USSR instead of Germany and I regret it so much because of this getting removed
I not only got it but the game rewarded my rush to make sure I put at least a single point in all of them by giving me a Talisman for the Panther II and so I use it in every 6.7 lineup it got me to realise that it’s a very fun vehicle and that sometimes you should ignore repairs costs to get the big Dosh
i would pay an unreasonable amount to get this thing. forget the maus, panther a is one of my most played and liked tank. this at 6.7 with the king tigers would be my dream lineup
lucky enough i got it before it got pulled, my buddy just recently got up to 6.7 and ive been playing a bit with him and in about 2 weeks or so i havnt seen another one in the same game as me.
Don’t get me wrong he’s one of the best players out, I remember getting a game with him on enemy team he got 13 kills before he died he even killed me and to that I say well done odd
Well, I actually do own it. Playing with it is a pain as Germany suffers greatly in this game. It's expensive to run and, as every Panther, is a tank designed to fire over an open field at targets that are 2km away. The turret rotation speed is poor. Armor is only slightly better. The gunner has no night vision device as the UHU set was only for the commander and driver. The only improvement that I see is that it is way more dynamic even when stock. It moves way better than any other Panther. Gunner optics magnification is great but the tank really needs at least a vertical stabiliser. Otherwise the gun flops everywhere and the whole mobility advantage is ruined by really long stops to properly aim that monstrous barrel. Not to mention that the German wartime HEAT is almost useless and APCR is rather subpar.
Thank's for remembering me that I never get the Panther 2 you funny Scotsman XD . I would take a historical model , with more armor , 100mm front plate , 60mm side and 30 top . Schmalturm ,75mm KwK42 , range finder and maybe some APDS ammo . There were plans for APDS , not only the Brits know this type of ammo . But the normal AP is still very good with 190mm . Fun fact , the Panther F has a rangefinder as well up to about 1500m and I don't know if all tanks had this but some commanders had the Em 1M R 36 WWII Zeiss range finder wich you had to put at the top of your turret or outside . Schmalturm was the only turret that had this installed inside .
If you look well you will notice that this tank is closest to the E50 than the Panther 2 itself, actually this is the closest to the E50 we ever got in this game, it has the Tiger 2 roadwheels, improved armor, the 88mm cannon in the same turret the E50 was supposed to have and the improved engine with good reverse speed, it is a crossbreed between the "Panther 2 of real life" to the E50 project that would replace those tanks, a very unique tank that makes me having real fun while playing it, before dying and paying that expensive repair cost.
Thanks God I played the game and grinded German ground enough so I got all 4 of them. Jesus it was pain that time thanks to British Centurions being at the same br.
Unfortunately we probably won't ever see another Panther 2 in the game as, as far as I'm aware, the Panther 2 development only resulted in the new hull design. Would be nice if they were to at least go for a "more accurate" Panther 2 in the tech tree though, with the Panther F turret and gun on the Panther 2 hull. Would probably make a solid 6.3 vehicle.
I dont think a slightly better reverse gear and an extra 40/50mm of frontal armor (depends on variant) warrants a .3 BR increase. All that will do is create more spalling for AP, which only ups the chance of dying in one shot.
Man i missed this panther when it was still available, and i hate meself for not grinding harder for it when i heard it was going to get removed i rushed the maus over the panther 2 and i hate meself for not rushing Both 😭😭
you just had to spent 1 exp for researching the tank you are able to get it after removal. I had panther 2 and still can research KT 105 and Maus, because I spent few exp on their research, so I still have them in the tech tree.
@@davidutesil3838 this was back when i was a nooby in the game and i was rushing only the maus and nothing else. Did not know back then that research would stay if a little was added.
I got the panther 2, it's awesome and it has quite good reverse speed -15 km/h (much better than -2 km/h xd) I wish i could take off this night vision devices to better camouflage my tank.
tbh never understood removing tanks in the game they shoulda just made it pay to obtain or at least make it random event tank. its not fun to play against people who have these special tanks when i my self cant get one just cuz i didnt grind at the timeof it coming out cuz ya know life stuff. but i did finally obtain the maus after missing it for several years so i wont whine to much. also i hope they bring back chat :C
I feel old that I not only have this tank. I have a tailsman on it. Used it in squad event battles and seen it go from 7.0 to 6.3 back to 6.7 then vaulted away 😭
I had it and the Tiger II (105) on an old account that got stolen, along with the VFW, Katyusha, and a couple other rare event vehicles. As well as a few prems and almost all nations ground trees researched to at least 9.0. Brits, Germany, USSR, and Italy all had almost fully researched and halfway through US. After the naval update my 2-step auth got disabled and then somehow changed so I couldn't get back in and gaijin wouldn't do shit. GIVE BACK THE PANTHER II AND KING TIGER 105 GAIJIN!
The problem with Panther 2, that is only the hull was completed before project was cancelled, the turret was never build, in WoT you can see what the turret could look like it is the stock turret I believe.
I love your Scottish accent! ❤ Imo the Panther II is really hard to play as the BR is 7.0. The armour is thin like paper and every tank in that tier can penetrate the turret and hull with ease. The only thing I really like is the fast reverse. I wish all the Panther I models have that too.
I have all these early removed German tanks. I didn't use the maus too much, but I spent a lot of time in Panther2 and Coelian. I still have a line up with Panther2, Jagdpanther, Tiger 105, and coelian. Panther2 was the perfect MBT of the early Warthunder. Outstanding mobility, both forward and back, awesome firepower, good armor and it was present in game long before all the HEATFS, APDS and post war bullshit invasion happened at 6.7. Those were the Good times.
Great mobility, great gun above average armour. Soon as I got use to it I bought a talisman and grinded out the tech tree. I’m talking like 16000 rp with a good game
DID YOU MANGE TO GET THE PANTHER 2? WOULD YOU LIKE TO SEE A MORE HISTORICALLY ACCURATE ONE OR HAVE THIS ONE INSTEAD?!
Nope, cuz i dont got the game
How i can get this nose paint?
I would prefer this is just cooler but maybe also have the historically accurate version as well
I got the panther 2 and all the hidden German tanks Bc I’ve been playing since 2017, god help me
Definitely rather them add this one back, its super unfair that people who had it get to keep it when it's unavailable now
*"It's not historically accurate"* but last I recalled world war II tanks weren't fighting up against atgms
-be me
-be a maus player
-get constant up-tiers
-have a 1945 tank facing 1970's MBTs for "historical reasons"
@@manaintolerantmage I know right 🙃🙃🙃
@@riccardomariani9648 it be like that sometimes
so you want king tigers and Maus’s to go against 75mm sherman?
@@riccardomariani9648 why do you think they removed the tank? Does really good in downtiers, does really bad in uptiers. You can’t really balance it very well
Love how this was removed for "historical inaccuracy" yet the Ho-Ri is still in the game despite having less planning done on it than the Panther 2.
Ho Ri had less than the panther?
Jesus why is it in the game then even
Gaijin: Do not ask the snail
The issue with Panther II in the game is that's it's improbable, it would have to have different turret to properly fit long 88.
Given that some drawings of modified schmalturm for 88 actually exist, they could've remodel the tank to be at least realistic (even though not historically accurate), but decided not to.
@@CRL_One The Ho-Ri is more than improbable, it never existed. They have the "prototype" and "production" version, despite nothing ever being made, with only at most, paper plans to mount a large cannon on a tank. It's as fake as most wargaming tanks are.
@@dutchvanderlinde778 It never existed, the wiki says a 1/5 scale mockup was made, but it never happened, at least during the war. The gun itself had plans to be adapted, and a test bed was made, but it was never adapted to land vehicle use.
@@volatile100 Bruh moment right there it's in the game but never really happened then right?
People like to cry about the Maus being removed and i understand why. But this, along with the Tiger II 105, is the Real treasure. If you have these tanks, you already got one of the best 6.7 lineups in the game.
I'd still pick Tiger II H over 10,5cm.
The 16k repair cost for Maus doesn’t help either lmao
@@xxxhentaiqueenxxx9809 agreed. The Tiger 105 really is overkill for its rating. I'd rather have the 88mm with a faster reload.
The coelian is the TRUE hidden gem of the removed ones. That is my main squeeze AA for it's BR. I take it over the kugel at higher tiers for actually killing planes.
@@xxxhentaiqueenxxx9809 the 105 is better because it actually pens the lower plate of the t29/34 and the 88 can sometimes not
and it sounds incredible
I just like how the Panther 2 feels. There are many tanks in this game, but there are few tanks that really feel different. Even with many sound changes and buffs or nerfs, Panther 2 still feels unique
Ay ngl, ive play alot tank, but panther 2 is just lovely mbt ngl
Its like using ak47 u need to know how to use it 'properly'
Did Hispanos get nerfed? I mean they got a armor penetration buff, along with other calibers, but they seem spotty again, that is when facing aircrafts..
One of my best KDs is in this thing
This is the one single tank that I want because it would make 6.7 Germany much better
I love playing the Coelian, King Tiger 105mm and Panther II. A shame Germany lost these vehicles. The reverse on the Panther II is a dream.
Can we all tank a moment to appreciate the 4 reverse gears this Panther 2 has man it's the most useful thing in history
It was a problem before, where they modern post war tanks.
I got it long ago, back when Maus vs IS 4 was top tier tanks. Keep up the good work, glad you're back to uploading more often.
aka fun times, I got it around the time brit apds was added
Dead a$$ same
Back when the game was fun.
Same.
That sounds like early WoT lol
The panther 2 is the the tank in the game that feels most like a tank, the tankiest of all tanks if you would. Really love it, and with the 105 tiger lineup and 6,7 cas
I'd love to pick up the Panther II and Tiger II (10,5cm) if they release it again for an event. (Similar to what they did with the Maus). I got the Maus when it was re-released for an event. I kinda regret not playing War Thunder more years ago when those tanks were in the game but i had no idea they would remove those tanks. But they did so now i get to sit and regret my decision to not play.
Yep, I played WT back then and got to the Tiger II (H) and Panther G but then I stopped because I was tired of the game, now I'm sad I missed out on the Panther II and Tiger II 10.5 :(
They most likely will never be coming back sadly, only the maus will be the yearly thingy you can get
yeah same story i have the maus from the re release and honestly i would pay money to gaijin for it if they re released it as a premium germany lacks premiums at 6.7 and while the tiger 105 seems fun the panther 2 is unique compared to its prdescessors and fills a tech tree black hole
I love the Panther 2, I was so glad I managed to get it before it disappeared. I hadn't played since 2015 at that point and when I heard it was about to be removed, I came back to grind out the tank.
The only tank I don't have for the former German Tech Tree is the Coelian :(
As someone who is in the 6.7 German tree, I want this tank so bad. :(
Can we all take a moment to appreciate that oddBawZ is finally playing a tank that he loves and enjoying it?
Agreed
@@Electro3Strike lol my man is here
@@Geniusinventor lol
I do have the Panther 2 and I love it. Wouldn't mind if they brought it back for other folks though.
I wish :( played air back then, came to ground far to late for the removed classics
instead of just the maus every year, rotate through the removed ones. give us the 105 tiger, panther 2, flak 341, etc
@@TheGrace020 same lol
Its br would need an increase if it was brought back in, it should not be 6.7. Should be 7.0 or 7.3 like the centurions are now.
@@cerdic6867 why lol
I was like one vehicle away from starting the research when they removed it. Back then i had no idea and was just a casual player... now i have 1600 hours and just wish they'd add it back like they do with the Maus from time to time.
This is my exact scenario I’m stuck in I was only a couple thousand RP from finishing the tank below the panther 2 but I decided to get off and start the grind the next day but little did I know that very same day they REMOVED THE FUCKING TANK
@@Justagiraffe06 this hurts. Like I’m in pain for you
@@Justagiraffe06 literally same. I didn't even know they would remove it. A few weeks later I log back in and see the vehicles have disappeared.
It's fukin dawg that they didn't give a heads up warning or grace period for players to panic grind those last few couple of research points
Nice. When I saw they were removing the Panther II, I quit touching grass for a week just to rush getting atleast 1 RP in. I was really close and I knew I'd be mad at myself for not getting the best Panther in the game while I still could. Don't really care for the 105 KT but I really want the Coelian so I can complete my Panther collection.
The King Panther Arrives! Another awesome video inbound by Odd, keep it up!
Honestly since the last patch Warthunder is so far removed from historical accuracy and realism that I see no issue bringing this back. After 5 years I am one of the few out of my friends that still plays. Every one else has left because of numerous issues and complaints they have with the game that are never addressed. Warthunder for me is on its last leg, I too have major gripes with the game that are making want to leave it forever.
Left last year, best thing I have done for mental health 😅 can only recommend it
@Lord Terra people wanted those German tanks removed yet they never complain about WW2 tanks going against post war tanks
@@CN7810-X
One of the many issues with the game. I agree!
@@CN7810-X There is a name for these kind of peoples, they are hypocrites.
I really want the old German tanks like the panther 2 and king tiger and flakpanther especially since they are adding proto tanks to WT
I wish I played more back when the Panther 2 was available. I started in 2019, but only got to like tier 3 Germany. Then I left and came back during quarantine and ended up grinding the entire Japanese ground tree. If only I knew back then.
You know I’ve been playing War Thunder since before ground forces were added. I’ve taken breaks from the game over the years and sadly when I came back from one of those breaks this tank was gone before I could get research points into it.
I’m so disappointed that I missed out on this tank because it was the one I always wanted to play the most. I really hope one day they allow us to get it kinda like what they did with the Maus.
I really want to play this tank and I kinda feel like it’s unfair that I’ve been supporting this game for around 10 years and I do not have access to it
I feel you, many years ago I remember playing this game for fun, and not for grind. Now I really regret that...
@@bartek2431 same. So many missed vehicles as a console player….
same here. play since may 2014 and took a longer break from 2016 to 2019. never got there before it was removed and now im so angry at myself. together with the coelian and the 10.5 kingtiger this would be my dream lineup
Just from another comment I made in a reply, these are the differences between the Panther F and the Panther II that I know of and I may have some inaccuracies but feel free to correct me below.
The differences between the Panther F and the Panther II are as such.
Panther F: Had 25mm of roof hull armour, had the schmaulturm turret picked out for it but it is unknown if the turret and the hull was ever mounted together. There were a few Panther G/F hybrids where a G turret was placed on an F hull. The F also had a new version of the 75mm gun on the other panthers and had no muzzle break due to the improvements however there are several pictures out there with the muzzle break intact on the F for unknown reasons.
Panther II: Had a 100mm upper hull, 60mm of side armour because of they wanted it to prevent soviet AT rifles and 30mm of hull roof armour. Had the same running gear as the King tiger to improve part comparability between the vehicles. The Panther II also never had a turret picked out for it. The singular prototype of the panther II had no turret and when captured by the Americans they put the G turret on the Hull and is now at the patton museum.
The main erroneous mistake in war thunder is, there was not a Panther’s Schmalturm turret with night fighting equipment nor the 88mm gun from the King tiger. And the shmalturm turret was never placed on the panther II hull.
The war was over and the plans for a Panther 2 were pulled back , sideskirts solved the problem with AT rifles and were much cheaper than a new tank .
The Panther 2 should have the Schmalturm , wich was more narrow or slim at the front and was a smaller target . That's what " schmal" means and was easier to manufacture as the normal Panther turret . Still used the 75mm KwK 42 , no long 88 would fit in there . I heard of plans to shoot APDS as the Brits , this is maybe why the last models got no muzzle break . The Brits got problems with APDS and the muzzle break , as the sabot lefts the barrel . Not very accurate , later they build a new muzzle break for the 76mm . That's all I know . 😉
Part of the requirements for the schmalturm was to make it compatible with IR devises. It may not have happened, but it was planned.
There were both drawings and a wooden mock up of a modified schmalturm with a 88mm kwk 43. The main issue is however that both were made after the cancelation of the Panther II in May 1943.
Daimler-Benz made a wooden mock-up of a modified schmalturm mounting a 88mm, the biggest modification was a 100mm wider turret ring to a total of 1750mm. Krupp had made a sketch (Hln-130) of a modified schmalturm mounting a 88mm on October 18th in 1944. The trunnions on the 88mm were moved back 350mm, and the turret had a bulge on the front to accommodate the breach being moved. Effectively moving the gun forward, and creating more space in the back of the turret. The decision was made in February 1945 to combine the two and Daimler-Benz was to start production. But we all know how that went.
But like you said, it would not have been mounted on the Panther II. Even then the turret doesn't have a bulge nor does it have a enlarged turret ring, making it entirely fictional.
Just split the vehicle into two, a premium Panther II with a Ausf. G turret and make the now un-obtainable one a Panther mit 8,8cm Kw.K 43. A prototype with the wrong turret, but a real vehicle, and a paper/wooden mock-up tank. I know the community hates paper vehicles and prototypes, but it's better than pure fiction.
@@kael180 and ngl... my Panther II sometimes outpaces my Leopard 1, it also has better survivalability.
I started research on the Panther II, Tiger II 10.5, and MAUS when I heard they were removing them from the tech tree. Luckily just starting the research saved the progress and I was able to finish them last year
I got the Panther II within a bout two months after its initial release, I LOVE IT! good speed, great cannon, pretty accurate, I felt so glad to have gotten it before they removed it. I do feel bad for those who didn't get it in time, but i think Gaijin should allow players the chance to get it though, like through one of those chest where you use SL to get the chest and SL to get the key like the did with the April Chest in the inventory store. Like have vehicles like this or others from past events as a possible reward of getting like once a month for a week or something.
Lucky for me, I started playing WT shortly after they added the Ground Forces and I got myself all the removed german tanks, Panther 2, Tiger 10cm and the mighty Maus.
But I didn't got that SPAA that was also removed.
6.7 is basically my main lineup that I truly enjoy, and they include the Panther 2 and the Tiger 10cm which I love the most.
Honestly love this tank because it's the closest thing we got to the E-50 lol
i wish gaijin would just bring this back bc clearly they dont care about historical accuracy anymore
They removed the Maus from the researchable tech tree, and yet they have the Ho-Ri Production in the tech tree and Ho-Ri Prototypes as a premium
Or the R2Y2's :D
Atleast for the coelian (37mm) the gun and chassis existed and the turret was being worked on, and for the tiger 2 (105) both the tank and the gun existed (Krupp wanted to build it but it wasn't ordered, thats why it never got build/the gun never got integrated into the tiger 2). And the Maus was even build, goddamn. The only thing really fictional of the removed tanks is the this version of the panther 2 as it is an amalgation of several diffrent either build or proposed panther upgrades (but the turret is straight up wrong, the gun doesn't fit into the Schmalturm/s-turret).
@@rorymackinlay4077 This is a game and still one of its kind. A vehicle collector does not care about the performance of the vehicle. They just want to be able to own and use it.
@@rorymackinlay4077 indeed. In my opinion the Maus and others like the Panther II could just be premiums, no idea why Gaijin is so strongly against it.
I was fortunate enough too get some RP into the Panther II just before they removed it from the tech tree. I only now, years later, finally purchased it lol
GAIJIN PLEASE BRING BACK THIS TANK
I love the panther II, just like the tiger II 105MM, they don't have gun stabilizers but they do have extraordinarily excellent suspension which allows for nearly perfect stabilized fire when going 30kmh or less. Also, the rangefinder is good out to 2km, so you dont need to take any speculatice shots. Not that you really need it considering how easy the long 88mm is to aim.
The Panther 2 is one of my favorite tanks, along with the Tiger 10.5cm
I remember this tank from a few years back. This is like re-unlocking a core memory.
Its weird, Gaijin brings back the Maus during their anniversary, but not Panther II, Tiger II(105) or the Flakpanzer 341?
Why not all of them? Give us that missed out a chance to earn them again, like they do with the Maus.
Kinda unfair to let some people have them, but others not - its not like they are event or premium vehicles.
Maus was removed cuz "balance"
The others were.removed cuz they kinda didn't exist
Maus was real.
After its BR got "balanced" that thing was almost unstoppable, fast, agile, good reverse speed, well armored and ridiculos gun
I'd love to see a reinstatement of it, or like we get with the maus, when it comes back for a week, and anyone that researches it can get it at any time. then we get a more realistic version of the panther 2
The war thunder 10th anniversary is coming this year, so why not bringing them back for that special date. i really hope they do !
@@aceofluftwaffe6444 I have heard a rumor they will being back the Panther 2, although I doubt it would come to be. Although if it did that would be nice
@@TheT-90thatstaresintoyoursoul Oh that's interesting... where have you heard that rumor may i ask ?
@@aceofluftwaffe6444 First I heard it from a reply.
Then I heard/saw someone ask on a WT stream and it wasnt confirmed nor denied
@@TheT-90thatstaresintoyoursoul Ok thanks for the info
My heart warms each time I get a discord messege of ur new vids man keep up the good work
I got the panther 2 just before it went away. Its great, but I kinda wish I got the Flakpanzer 341
I love the Panther II, it's got some gaijin armor as well. I've tanked point blank IS-2 shots in the side. Hell i took an american 105 in the side of my turret and only the breech went out. I absolutely love my 6.7 Lineup with all the removed vehicles (Minus the Maus obviously)
I would literally sell a kidney to get the panther 2 and the Coelian. At least the Coealian would be more historically acurate than the Ostwind 2 and is desperatly needed with the new .50cal/hispano pen buff, that turns every allied plane into monsterous CAS.
@@rorymackinlay4077 the reason why i want the coelian to return is the armored turret, as now with that insane buff, even the kugelblitz turret is easily 50cal'ed from max range. Thus, over night, pretty much all axis AA became pointless. Also now, the entire german techtree to 7.0 can easily be 50.cal'ed excluding the Tiger 1 E and the Tiger 2's. And given how cheap fighters are, playing axis below 7.0 is now complete cancer.
I mean, the .50cals and hispanos got such a massive penetration buff, that even the british and US wartime reports say it is bullshit. I mean fuck, even the Bf109 armored glass, specifically build to protect against .50cals you can now just shoot straight through. Personally, i just decided to stop grinding axis and just play US again and just be as annoying, cancerous and straight up toxic as possible. Maybe then, gajin realizes that they pulled their numbers out of their ass (i know that it is demarre, butt there is a reason why it is called an estimation). Don't get me wrong, spawncamping and killing the entire german team including all of those tiger 1H's with my P51 is fun, but i guarantee, those players didn't have any fun and ran straight to the forums.
Title: You will never own this Panther!
Me: Ersatz M10?
Video: Panther II
Me: *Just barely started researching it before they removed it
6,7 germans with the 105 tiger the panther 2 and tiger 2 h with a pak puma a arado and a narwal is actually my favorite german lower tier line up to play if i want to have some actual fun in wt
And the me262 A2 Sturmvogel, also a gem.
@@Gameplaym0ments Just a shame what they've done to the repair costs.
@@GeneralArmchair Well for me it's not that bad, my Sl have stayed around 20 mil for a while now. But for people without premium it's prob pretty bad yes.
Some german inf. in WWII also had night vision, but it was big and clunky. They also had to carry a huge battery backpack thing around to power it.
I get 3 kills and someone bombs me. Or I look around only to see my team has disappeared and then get obliterated from four angles. OR all of the above.
But Odd is bulletproof.
A bittersweet truth. I am happy to see you do well. I am sad to know that you are one of a few who get to do this well, this often.
GG
@kartoffel Salat How many battles have you had that are like the ones he does show? For me there are not many. That is the point. In almost every video he has at least one such match. He is that good. And lucky.
@@danielmostert993 His skill allows him to capitalize on situations that have potential like those he shows in the videos, and while I cannot rule out luck, the 2nd part of the equation can just as well be effort and time spent until you get into such a battle instead of luck.
@@meffspa1465 So your point is that you have none. I get it. You are bored and want to argue over something. Go do it with someone else.
Why is there always some dude who cant just hit the dislike and move on.
what baffles me is the amount of down-tiers and/or just .5 uptiers...when i am playing any line ups i am getting a 80-90% full uptier (+1BR) ratio. It's not even subjective, I made a list of about 20 battles each for different lineups and ended up at the 80-90% ratio...
How do you get downtiered?? xD
@@flanganke I used to get down tiers by running smaller line-ups but that hasn't worked for over a year now. I am beginning to believe that high crew skills affect the no. of uptiers you get. When playing a new tech tree with low crew skills the no of uptiers are relatively small but as your crew skill increases the uptiers also become more prevalent.
Oh man I am so lucky I started researching this tank 3 years ago before going into a 2-year hiatus on WT. I love its reverse I can just peek, kill and run
this tank along with the 341 should be readded.. there is PLENTY of paper tanks in war thunder so there is no reason for such unique vehicles to be removed..
the 341 is real, and more real than the Ostwind 2. Like literally the Ostwind 2 had 1 MENTION EVER and it was a "hey yea we thought bout this but didn't do it". Maybe just give it worse turret armor or shit
this isn't even a paper tank, it's completely fictional. that's why it won't return.
the real 1943 Panther II proposal did not have the 88mm gun or the Schmalturm turret. it did have the modified armour thickness, a new engine, and components taken from the Tiger II, but it had a new turret with the same 75mm gun. a prototype hull was completed but not the turret.
a different project in 1944 tried to fit an 88mm gun into a Schmalturm Panther I, but got no further than a wooden model.
this amalgamation comes from a mistake made by a German historian decades ago. he misunderstood a sentence and confused the two separate modification attempts for a single project. the mistake was corrected back in the 90s, but it was too late to stop this mythical Panther II from spreading.
@@magnum6763 the 'Ostwind II' had an unconfirmed prototype, whereas the ''Coelian'' had a confirmed wooden model. they're both about as real as each other.
@@iMoD190 many vehicles in WT had a wooden model or no model. Take the R2Y2s with jets and the Ho-Ri. At this point paper vehicles are going to end up being added.
@@iMoD190 the Ostwind 2 is unknown. It could have been one of those bs lies the germans made up, but there is 0 documentation of the thing existing. The 341 at least had a real hull with a wooden turret
Thanks for this upload odd. I’ve had the worst few months. Seeing any ww2 planes or vehicle videos really make my evenings 🙏
Hi
Hello
@@chris.76256 hi
"You will never own this panther."
You underestimate how much of a wehraboo i am.
Panther II and Tiger II 105mm is how you discern who is a true enjoyer and who is a fan
I'm still researching it. I started when it was still in the tech tree. Now it has moved to the premium vehicles list.
Same for me, but i never done researching it, also same with Maus
That night vision device is huge, its too easy to spot, I think I'd prefer the Panther 2 with out it!
Honestly, I think the panther line are my least favourite tanks, I suffer in them but my friend suffers in the Centurions, so it balanced itself out. But I do have this Panther II, the 105 Tiger and the Maus, sadly didn't get the Flakpanzer 341 though.
I remember the week before these tanks where removed from the tech tree, players where grinding the Germany like crazy to get these tanks before the removal, i already had all of them, i sometimes take them out to flex haha.
"YOU WILL NEVER OWN THIS WARTHUNDER TANK"
*_Takes control of Odd's body_*
The "just in case if we get uptiered" tank
Funny enough, I started researching this when I at one point stopped playing WT. I occasionally go back to WT and have been playing it since the start really. Because of my points in research, it never left my tree and I just finished researching it :D
I wish it was unlocked to research for people who had the game before it was removed. I went with USSR instead of Germany and I regret it so much because of this getting removed
I not only got it but the game rewarded my rush to make sure I put at least a single point in all of them by giving me a Talisman for the Panther II and so I use it in every 6.7 lineup it got me to realise that it’s a very fun vehicle and that sometimes you should ignore repairs costs to get the big Dosh
I have a feeling that for the 10th anniversary all removed vehicles will be brought back kind of like the maus does but only once.
i would pay an unreasonable amount to get this thing. forget the maus, panther a is one of my most played and liked tank. this at 6.7 with the king tigers would be my dream lineup
Sell you my account with it for 4k ?
lucky enough i got it before it got pulled, my buddy just recently got up to 6.7 and ive been playing a bit with him and in about 2 weeks or so i havnt seen another one in the same game as me.
Don’t get me wrong he’s one of the best players out, I remember getting a game with him on enemy team he got 13 kills before he died he even killed me and to that I say well done odd
Well, I actually do own it.
Playing with it is a pain as Germany suffers greatly in this game.
It's expensive to run and, as every Panther, is a tank designed to fire over an open field at targets that are 2km away.
The turret rotation speed is poor. Armor is only slightly better. The gunner has no night vision device as the UHU set was only for the commander and driver.
The only improvement that I see is that it is way more dynamic even when stock. It moves way better than any other Panther.
Gunner optics magnification is great but the tank really needs at least a vertical stabiliser. Otherwise the gun flops everywhere and the whole mobility advantage is ruined by really long stops to properly aim that monstrous barrel. Not to mention that the German wartime HEAT is almost useless and APCR is rather subpar.
Thank's for remembering me that I never get the Panther 2 you funny Scotsman XD .
I would take a historical model , with more armor , 100mm front plate , 60mm side and 30 top . Schmalturm ,75mm KwK42 , range finder and maybe some APDS ammo . There were plans for APDS , not only the Brits know this type of ammo . But the normal AP is still very good with 190mm .
Fun fact , the Panther F has a rangefinder as well up to about 1500m and I don't know if all tanks had this but some commanders had the Em 1M R 36 WWII Zeiss range finder wich you had to put at the top of your turret or outside . Schmalturm was the only turret that had this installed inside .
If you look well you will notice that this tank is closest to the E50 than the Panther 2 itself, actually this is the closest to the E50 we ever got in this game, it has the Tiger 2 roadwheels, improved armor, the 88mm cannon in the same turret the E50 was supposed to have and the improved engine with good reverse speed, it is a crossbreed between the "Panther 2 of real life" to the E50 project that would replace those tanks, a very unique tank that makes me having real fun while playing it, before dying and paying that expensive repair cost.
I got the Panther II at the time I got the Tiger II 10.5cm. I can still finish research the Coelian as well.
Best 6.7 Tank period
The fact odd never clickbaited us is just impressive, keep it going dude!
Thanks God I played the game and grinded German ground enough so I got all 4 of them. Jesus it was pain that time thanks to British Centurions being at the same br.
that decal combined with the rangefinder "eyes" looks hilarious
Unfortunately we probably won't ever see another Panther 2 in the game as, as far as I'm aware, the Panther 2 development only resulted in the new hull design. Would be nice if they were to at least go for a "more accurate" Panther 2 in the tech tree though, with the Panther F turret and gun on the Panther 2 hull. Would probably make a solid 6.3 vehicle.
I dont think a slightly better reverse gear and an extra 40/50mm of frontal armor (depends on variant) warrants a .3 BR increase. All that will do is create more spalling for AP, which only ups the chance of dying in one shot.
I wish they bring it back along with the Tiger 2 10.5cm. I want to see more of them in battles.
I had this thing. The I rage quited WT and deleted my account. And after a while I wanted it back. What a mess I am
Man i missed this panther when it was still available, and i hate meself for not grinding harder for it when i heard it was going to get removed i rushed the maus over the panther 2 and i hate meself for not rushing Both 😭😭
you just had to spent 1 exp for researching the tank you are able to get it after removal. I had panther 2 and still can research KT 105 and Maus, because I spent few exp on their research, so I still have them in the tech tree.
@@davidutesil3838 this was back when i was a nooby in the game and i was rushing only the maus and nothing else. Did not know back then that research would stay if a little was added.
Please Gaijin let us have another shot at getting this.
Glad you are back and feeling somewhat better Odd.
"SO I HAD IT CUSTOM MADE" the thing looks like something vandiesle would drive
it makes me so happy to see the “target destroyed” message with the satisfying sound. your videos make my day, thanks
i have it! loved that one, untill they removed it. then i loved it more.
I thought the RAREST Panther was the Warcrime Panther? Even versus Tech Tree.. And I have both.
I got the panther 2, it's awesome and it has quite good reverse speed -15 km/h (much better than -2 km/h xd)
I wish i could take off this night vision devices to better camouflage my tank.
I own it luckily. And damn its good when the enemy thinks you are a normal one
"Oh No. A Child" *Deleates from Existance*
This guy looks so cool, such latewar loveliness. If It came back, I'd def grind it.
happy they let you grind it out if you started the research, i would have been livid if i couldnt.
tbh never understood removing tanks in the game they shoulda just made it pay to obtain or at least make it random event tank. its not fun to play against people who have these special tanks when i my self cant get one just cuz i didnt grind at the timeof it coming out cuz ya know life stuff. but i did finally obtain the maus after missing it for several years so i wont whine to much. also i hope they bring back chat :C
OddBawZ - "Check out this awesome tank....No you can't have it!"
Me - "NOOOOOOO!!!"
Thank you for this great video! This is the best WT video i've ever seen! I enjoyed its every minute. Thank you!
Really like that paint job you've got on that
I'm sad this tank is no longer obtainable... I just got the Panther F and love sniping with it. This would have been a dream~
18:10 perfect concrete block jumpscare
I feel old that I not only have this tank. I have a tailsman on it. Used it in squad event battles and seen it go from 7.0 to 6.3 back to 6.7 then vaulted away 😭
I had it and the Tiger II (105) on an old account that got stolen, along with the VFW, Katyusha, and a couple other rare event vehicles. As well as a few prems and almost all nations ground trees researched to at least 9.0. Brits, Germany, USSR, and Italy all had almost fully researched and halfway through US. After the naval update my 2-step auth got disabled and then somehow changed so I couldn't get back in and gaijin wouldn't do shit. GIVE BACK THE PANTHER II AND KING TIGER 105 GAIJIN!
The problem with Panther 2, that is only the hull was completed before project was cancelled, the turret was never build, in WoT you can see what the turret could look like it is the stock turret I believe.
Glad I've got all those removed vehicles. Good time was had mate, a removed vehicle sized like applied!
I love your Scottish accent! ❤
Imo the Panther II is really hard to play as the BR is 7.0. The armour is thin like paper and every tank in that tier can penetrate the turret and hull with ease. The only thing I really like is the fast reverse. I wish all the Panther I models have that too.
“YOU WILL NEVER OWN THIS PANTHER TANK IN WAR THUNDER”
Damn the Panther II in my hangar is another illusion
Currently playing this. Love it. Not played it in ages and doesn't disappoint👍
I have all these early removed German tanks. I didn't use the maus too much, but I spent a lot of time in Panther2 and Coelian. I still have a line up with Panther2, Jagdpanther, Tiger 105, and coelian.
Panther2 was the perfect MBT of the early Warthunder. Outstanding mobility, both forward and back, awesome firepower, good armor and it was present in game long before all the HEATFS, APDS and post war bullshit invasion happened at 6.7.
Those were the Good times.
Great mobility, great gun above average armour. Soon as I got use to it I bought a talisman and grinded out the tech tree. I’m talking like 16000 rp with a good game