A proper “matched pair” have their response measured by the manufacturer to be consistently similar. ALSO worth mentioning is use of the MS technique allows for adjusting the amount of stereo width in post and the MS technique is very mono compatible.
With today's manufacturing processes, anything better than a dynamic element is going to be *pretty* close to each other - even across production runs.
This was a great re-learning or me and VERY clear and well presented. Although I dont remember anymore, if you did tell in the first part that in some of those sets cardioid works well better than omni! Thanks anyway!
Yes I’ve read this previously. I prefer using the AB concept but with Cardioid’s. I can never find a room with high ceilings, regarding the reflections. I also just use the Stereo Bar width so it’s under 1 meter wide..
Hi Iain, thanks for this very useful video. For you, what would count as a small ensemble vs large? I'm looking to record a group of 10-15 singers (4 parts). Thank you.
Hi - sorry just saw this! Yup thats a small ensemble in my book. For me, small ensembles are quartets up to maybe 20 or so, then you're into mid sized and finally full orchestras and even orchestras with choirs as very large ensembles.
Closeup placement is from the old days when microphones and recording equipment had much less signal to noise ratio. Now the microphones and equipment are much better, so when old techniques are used it sounds so unreal with exaggerated details you can not hear in a live performance. It's like looking at paintings with a magnifying glass.
Any of these techniques will work for a grand piano as they are mostly distance miking techniques. You have to remember with any of these techniques that they are designed to as naturally as possible pick up a live performance in an acoustically acceptable space. These are not for "close" miking whereby the engineer tries to eliminate room sound and get as close as possible (popo music recording of an acoustic piano for example). Personally, I would try the XY near coincident technique first and experiment with expanding that to the NOS and the ORTF techniques deciding which you like the sound of best. Having said that, for a single instrument like a piano in a nice acoustic, you may not hear a massive difference between these techniques - differences will be subtle. Simple rule - move the mics further away and you will pick up more of the "room" sound. Closer in and you will get a more positive sound from the piano. Experiment with the distance.
Thanks very much! That's a fantastic video with some very important concepts explained so well! I've got a question that I'm hoping you or someone here might answer :) I'm recording a small orchestra (minus strings section) and I'm hoping to use a pair of Rode M5 in either the XY or ORTF position. My question is do I record with Pan set to the Center for both Mics (on the mixer/recorder), or do I need to pan each mic left/right? Any help is much appreciated :)
Well it really doesn't matter to be honest. However, all stereo mic setups are assuming stereo monitoring and reproduction, so not panning them hard left and right kinda misses the point! Back in the day if you were using a mixing desk to send your mic signals to your recording device, then YES it would matter big time as you would remove all stereo imaging by NOT panning. Assuming you're using a 2 channel interface into a laptop running a DAW, you'll be golden.
Very helpful! Thank you so very much. How far the mics, for example, XY pattern, should be from an ensemble comprises of Trumpets, Trombones, Clarinets, flutes and violins? Should the mics be mounted in front of the band or overhead? Could you also give me some mics suggestions, if at all possible, that would work for such a band about 15 or more people please?
Hi Daniel. That's very dependent on the room they are playing in and how much of its ambience - the reverberation characteristic - you want to capture. The mics closer to the ensemble means more musician and less ambience, and further away means more ambience. The best approach is to move the mics forwards and backwards until you get the sound and balance you like in the space. Once you have found it, thats known as the "sweet spot". Note as well that the further away the mics are from your ensemble, your stereo image will diminish slightly as the left and right aspects of the signal become less exagerrated. This will mean that instruments on the extremes of your ensemble - the farthest left or right - move more towards the centre, while having the mics closer to the ensemble increases the stereo image somewhat. I cannot stress how important the room is that you record in with these techniques. Most of these techniques are attempts at emulating how the human ear works, so if a room pleases your ear, it should please the mics! Hope that helps. I.
We're not sensitive to phase, though. Humans and human hearing, I mean. Why the right channel? Would inverting the left channel make the stereo image seem reversed to the actual real-world stereo image while recording? If so... the same happens with X/Y. It doesn't really matter, does it? Swapping left and right.
@@HoboInASuit4Tune "why the right channel" The fig 8 diafragm is polarized, that's why it can discriminate left and right, that's why it let's you use 2 mics instead of 3.
@@HoboInASuit4Tune what I meant is that you pan the sum to the left and the difference to the right (because of diafragm/capsule polarization). M+S to the left and M-S to the right to decode to LR-stereo. So it's not "one of the channels" : )
@@HoboInASuit4Tune XY are just two mics pointing to one side each, of course you can interchange them, but then you'll have to change your panning, obv.
Why do they have to cross? for example the XY pattern-- why cant you just angle the leftside mic facing left, and right mic to right side? Am I just overthinking this?
They don't have to, that's just one of the other techniques. The point of the XY is to get the capsules of the mics as close as physically possible to minimize potential phasing issues.
@@blakestone75 totally! Thanks, as I was experimenting I realized that the crossing was more of a byproduct of getting the capsules close and 90degrees
I don't like the sound of XY on guitar personally. The engineer at NAXOS uses A B 1.5m out and slightly above the guitar itself. He also selected from a range of mics depending on the sound of the player and their classical guitar.
You didnt mention anything about interchannel level difference and interchannel time difference - inportant topic which makes these techniques more undestandable. And if you are talking about audio, your sound quality should be nice, but it is really hard to to listen - its quiet and your voice is unnaturally bassy and causes resonance
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What a great channel. I'm very glad to have found you.
Absolutely brilliant walk-through. Thank you very much.
A proper “matched pair” have their response measured by the manufacturer to be consistently similar.
ALSO worth mentioning is use of the MS technique allows for adjusting the amount of stereo width in post and the MS technique is very mono compatible.
With today's manufacturing processes, anything better than a dynamic element is going to be *pretty* close to each other - even across production runs.
Great overview of the different techniques.
This was a great re-learning or me and VERY clear and well presented. Although I dont remember anymore, if you did tell in the first part that in some of those sets cardioid works well better than omni! Thanks anyway!
Well made! Thanks mate
Cool channel and mission, dude.
AB technique requires use of omni microphones not cardioid.
Yes I’ve read this previously. I prefer using the AB concept but with Cardioid’s. I can never find a room with high ceilings, regarding the reflections. I also just use the Stereo Bar width so it’s under 1 meter wide..
man this is a lot of really usefull information on one video... good job... this was actually taught on my university
Hi Iain, first of all, amazing way to explain miking techniques.
Secondly, weird question, what program did you use to make the video?
Hi Jasper. I used a whiteboard programme called Doodly. Takes a bit to get into it, but the outcome is usually pretty satisfying
Excellent explanation and well produced video. Thank you!
Hi, Do you have a video about how to place Condensor Microphone for a small Choir with 15 people standing in 3 rows or general setup?.
Hi Iain, thanks for this very useful video. For you, what would count as a small ensemble vs large? I'm looking to record a group of 10-15 singers (4 parts). Thank you.
Hi - sorry just saw this! Yup thats a small ensemble in my book. For me, small ensembles are quartets up to maybe 20 or so, then you're into mid sized and finally full orchestras and even orchestras with choirs as very large ensembles.
Awesome thank you!
excellent video explanation. thank you!
I got a lot done with one stereo mic and have over thirty videos showing the process if anyone is interested.
Closeup placement is from the old days when microphones and recording equipment had much less signal to noise ratio. Now the microphones and equipment are much better, so when old techniques are used it sounds so unreal with exaggerated details you can not hear in a live performance. It's like looking at paintings with a magnifying glass.
Excellent to the point
Great video, thank you!
really helpful, thank you
Wtf where has this video been all my life
very helpful! Thanks so much!
great video , please , could you tell me which is the best position to record Grand coda Piano ? thank you so much
Any of these techniques will work for a grand piano as they are mostly distance miking techniques. You have to remember with any of these techniques that they are designed to as naturally as possible pick up a live performance in an acoustically acceptable space. These are not for "close" miking whereby the engineer tries to eliminate room sound and get as close as possible (popo music recording of an acoustic piano for example). Personally, I would try the XY near coincident technique first and experiment with expanding that to the NOS and the ORTF techniques deciding which you like the sound of best. Having said that, for a single instrument like a piano in a nice acoustic, you may not hear a massive difference between these techniques - differences will be subtle. Simple rule - move the mics further away and you will pick up more of the "room" sound. Closer in and you will get a more positive sound from the piano. Experiment with the distance.
Thank you!!!
Thanks very much! That's a fantastic video with some very important concepts explained so well!
I've got a question that I'm hoping you or someone here might answer :)
I'm recording a small orchestra (minus strings section) and I'm hoping to use a pair of Rode M5 in either the XY or ORTF position.
My question is do I record with Pan set to the Center for both Mics (on the mixer/recorder), or do I need to pan each mic left/right?
Any help is much appreciated :)
Well it really doesn't matter to be honest. However, all stereo mic setups are assuming stereo monitoring and reproduction, so not panning them hard left and right kinda misses the point! Back in the day if you were using a mixing desk to send your mic signals to your recording device, then YES it would matter big time as you would remove all stereo imaging by NOT panning. Assuming you're using a 2 channel interface into a laptop running a DAW, you'll be golden.
@@bigiainsmusictechnologycha7704 Thanks so much for that! Much appreciated.
great explanation, thank you!!!!!
Awesome
Very helpful! Thank you so very much. How far the mics, for example, XY pattern, should be from an ensemble comprises of Trumpets, Trombones, Clarinets, flutes and violins? Should the mics be mounted in front of the band or overhead? Could you also give me some mics suggestions, if at all possible, that would work for such a band about 15 or more people please?
Hi Daniel. That's very dependent on the room they are playing in and how much of its ambience - the reverberation characteristic - you want to capture. The mics closer to the ensemble means more musician and less ambience, and further away means more ambience. The best approach is to move the mics forwards and backwards until you get the sound and balance you like in the space. Once you have found it, thats known as the "sweet spot".
Note as well that the further away the mics are from your ensemble, your stereo image will diminish slightly as the left and right aspects of the signal become less exagerrated. This will mean that instruments on the extremes of your ensemble - the farthest left or right - move more towards the centre, while having the mics closer to the ensemble increases the stereo image somewhat.
I cannot stress how important the room is that you record in with these techniques. Most of these techniques are attempts at emulating how the human ear works, so if a room pleases your ear, it should please the mics!
Hope that helps.
I.
Love this
Your eraser technique is impeccable
I want to record stereo in my phone with leveler mics what can I do z I am actually looking forward to make asmr
MS, inverting phase to decode to LR : not "one of the channels" but the one panned right.
We're not sensitive to phase, though. Humans and human hearing, I mean.
Why the right channel? Would inverting the left channel make the stereo image seem reversed to the actual real-world stereo image while recording?
If so... the same happens with X/Y. It doesn't really matter, does it? Swapping left and right.
@@HoboInASuit4Tune "why the right channel" The fig 8 diafragm is polarized, that's why it can discriminate left and right, that's why it let's you use 2 mics instead of 3.
@@HoboInASuit4Tune what I meant is that you pan the sum to the left and the difference to the right (because of diafragm/capsule polarization). M+S to the left and M-S to the right to decode to LR-stereo. So it's not "one of the channels" : )
@@HoboInASuit4Tune XY are just two mics pointing to one side each, of course you can interchange them, but then you'll have to change your panning, obv.
Why do they have to cross? for example the XY pattern-- why cant you just angle the leftside mic facing left, and right mic to right side? Am I just overthinking this?
They don't have to, that's just one of the other techniques. The point of the XY is to get the capsules of the mics as close as physically possible to minimize potential phasing issues.
@@blakestone75 totally! Thanks, as I was experimenting I realized that the crossing was more of a byproduct of getting the capsules close and 90degrees
Although we are talking about stereo here there may be people listening in mono. The close XY pattern translates better to mono.
most excellent
🎉 hcigabtt weip 🎉😊
Well presented.
Audio is so complicated. Thanks for the lessen.
I don't like the sound of XY on guitar personally. The engineer at NAXOS uses A B 1.5m out and slightly above the guitar itself. He also selected from a range of mics depending on the sound of the player and their classical guitar.
hi
You didnt mention anything about interchannel level difference and interchannel time difference - inportant topic which makes these techniques more undestandable.
And if you are talking about audio, your sound quality should be nice, but it is really hard to to listen - its quiet and your voice is unnaturally bassy and causes resonance
One question...
Why should someone accept audio advice from someone who can't even get the audio level for their video correct?
Theory only, no sound examples. This could have been a web page.
and?