Why your 7mm PRC is slow...
HTML-код
- Опубликовано: 9 фев 2025
- In this video I talk about why 7mm PRC can't get 3000 FPS with any other powder than RL-26 in a 24 inch barrel. I show the results I got with my 7mm PRC and talk about the ideal powders for 7mm PRC. Hope you enjoy the video.
The 7 PRC is a good cartridge, but not earth shattering. As you stated, it has a few grains less case capacity than the 7 mm Rem (I estimate 2-3 grains) and is a bit more efficient in a short barrel, but not as efficient as a 7 SAUM or 7 SS. I have a 7mm Rem mag with a 26 inch barrel and my friend has a 7 PRC with a 23 inch benchmark carbon on an impact action. Both shoot well with similar powders, but for sure the data you present is accurate regarding velocity, etc. My friend bought about 200 rounds of factory 180 ELDM and across his two lots, our average velocity was about 2810 fps, with a pretty high SD and ES. The load which replicated factory velocity is about 67.5 grains of H1000. We tested the loads in both Hornady and ADG Brass (way better brass) and their is no comparison. The Factory Hornady loads gave us loose primer pockets after resizing and loading the first handload. The ADG didn't show pressure signs until we really pushed it. We took the 180 ELDM up in 0.5 grain increments in the ADG from 67.5 to 71.5 grains H1000 and recorded the following velocities rounded to the nearest 5 fps with 2 shot groups to find pressure: 67.5: 2805 fps; 68: 2835 fps; 68.5: 2865; 69: 2885; 69.5: 2915; 70: 2940; 70.5: 2980 and 71.5 was 3010. I am certain this 71.5 grain load is around 68 to 70k psi, but the ADG brass can handle it short term. GRT might give us more exact pressure, but for sure it is over 65K psi. We got the best results for accuracy and consistency with 68 grains H1000 at 2835 fps, which is just over the factory velocity. With the180 Berger hybrid target, we used 68.5 grain H1000 to get 2840 fps. We tried a variety of seating depths, but found that 3.325 OAL worked well with both bullets. The factory ELDM load has a 3.290 OAL, so we were only slightly longer. The jam point of this barrel is 3.390 with the ELDM and 3.425 OAL with the Berger.
My friend has 8 lbs of h1000 or I would have tried the N565. You can almost interchange load data between H1000 and N565 but we have found N565 to burn a bit better in a shorter barrel and I prefer it over h1000 in most cartridges. I did not try the N560 in the 7 PRC, but it works well in short barreled short Mags and is the closest powder to R26. You can almost interchange the load data between the R26 and N560. I have used Staball HD in two different 7mm Rems and one 7 SS with 180 bullets and it takes about 2 to 2.5 grains of Staball HD than h1000 or N565 to get the same velocity and pressure. Like you said, it is too slow for the 7 PRC w/180 or smaller bullets but will work in a pinch. H4831sc is a great powder with the 168 LRX and other 150 to 160 Grain monolithic bullets. We took the 168 LRX to 69 grains of H4831sc, to check pressure, but it is too hot for long term use. We Settled at 67 grains and an OAL of 3.165 inch, which gave us 3015 fps. Jam into the lands was 3.325 inch an as usual, the Barnes bullets shoot well with at least 0.100 jump. The max load using H1000 (it is way too slow with a 168) was 72.5 gr and it showed pressure. There is about a 3.5 grain difference in powder charges between H1000 and H4831sc to get similar velocity and pressure with the 168 LRX. The final load with H1000 was 70.5 grain, but the H4831 at 67 grain is a much better powder with the 168 grain bullets. I would estimate n560 to give 65-85 fps more velocity over H4831sc based on my loading in a 6.5 PRC, 7 Saum and 7SS with copper bullets of 125 grain (6.5) and 145 grain (7mm) but the H4831sc is very easy to work with and my friend also had 8 lbs to use in his 7 PRC so we used the H4831sc. This powder will also work with a 175 or 180 Hornady, but it will pressure out faster than the h1000. I would guess it would work better in a shorter barrel too than H1000. In all loads we used WLR (Winchester Large Rifle primers) as he didn't have any Fed215 or CCI250 primers, but the WLR are one of the hotter standard large rifle primers and they work very well with this relatively short case. In my 7mm Rem, I usually use Fed215M but the CCI250 are great too. I found that the 7 Saum or 6.5 PRC cases perform a bit better with the standard Large Rifle primers than the Magnums, but the Magnums work fine for sure (use 0.5 to 1 grain less powder with the magnum primers)
I hope this information is helpful. I like your channel as you try to show real evidence without bias and you have a real passion for reloading and shooting. I know you like long barreled Magnums. My 300 WBY imp is 26 inch and they suck with short barrels, but the 7 PRC is fine with a 23 or 24 inch barrel when using the correct powders and can work not bad in a 22 inch. For guys wanting to shoot a shorter 20 to 22 inch barreled, 7mm caliber with a suppressor, the 7 SAUM is tough to beat and the 7-08 can work pretty well with an 18-20 inch barrel. Long powder columns and slow powders need longer barrels and shorter powder columns with faster powders work pretty good in short barrels. It is about balancing the bullet, powder, cartridge and barrel length to find an efficient and accurate combination.
I found it very helpful. Thank you for taking the time to write down all your results
Built my 7PRC knowing full well what to expect. But, I found a load of H4831 and a load of H1000 with 175grn Berger that will shoot to same point of impact out to 800yds. 2950fps validated with drops and both shoot well under 1moa w/24" barrel. Far surpassed my expectations. I credit my gunsmith for all the above. He also did a sort of stepped throat in my rifle.
Hornady's main problem is that they did not change the label on the box when their ammo no longer made the same velocity. The 7 PRC is still a good cartridge but the velocity claims were based on a single "unicorn" propellant. Ironically, Federal had better access to Reloader 26 since it was a sister company to Alliant, the importer of this particular propellant from Nitrochemie. Now that Federal has been sold by Vista Outdoors to another holding company, it will be interesting to see if preferred access to Alliant powders will continue.
The VihtaVuori 5XX series uses the same tech as Reloader 26 (made by Nitrochemie) of impregnating an extruded single-base powder with a small amount of nitroglycerine to get good temperature stability and ball powder-like energy density. Nitrochemie/Alliant calls it "EI Tech" (Extruded Impregnted) but VihtaVuori just call theirs "high energy powders". Unfortunately, it seems that VV they do not have a powder of the exact burn rate as RL 26.
This is an excellent, very thorough and accurate analysis. Unfortunately, VV does not have an exact match for RL26. However, at the same pressures, N560 will produce similar velocity with less powder and N565 will produce the same velocity with slightly more powder. N570 will produce even more velocity, if you have the room in the case to hit max pressure and the barrel length to burn it all at safe pressures.
@@LittleCrowGunworks Thanks. It is good to hear from someone with actual experience. My suppositions come from Recliner Research (the academic cousin of the Couch Commando).
@@jfess1911 😆 Bravo Sir.
@@LittleCrowGunworks Thank you for the truth, and being honest and a part of this thread on this site.
Merry Christmas to all.
I have got the same velocities with N560
If you didn’t have 150-200 rounds down range, your barrel hadn’t freed up yet. When it frees up, revisit the powder charges tested.
I 100% agree with those suggesting ADG and Peterson brass.
Fed 215m, H1000 or N565, GOOD brass, and 175 Elite Hunters. 3000 is doable in a 22” barrel.
I would think that a slower burning powder would create a better and more stable velocity,especially with the heavier bullet. I do agree that the 7 prc should’ve had a 26” barrel.
Well my seekins element 7prc, with a 21in barrel shooting the federal 175 eldx is coming out at 2968fps. I'm pleased with that velocity and a 22in barrel
Wow
My Seekins PH2 7prc 26" barrel shoots that same stuff at 2992. Darn accurate also.
Okay two folks same ammo similar velocities which means one of you is wrong. 21 vs 26 is a huge difference. I am betting one of you is either guessing your velocity or using a light chronograph.
Also getting 2940 with federal 175 eldx out of my 22in seekins element. Measured with garmin xero c1.
2950 fps avg for 10 shots with Federal 175gr ELD-X out of my 22" Savage Ultralite with it's PR barrel ..... Hornady ELDX 175gr Precision Hunter 10 shot average 2792 fps
The Federal was 158 fps faster side by side.
You’re one of the most sincere and truthful RUclipsrs !!
I appreciate that comment
I make fun of blue hair/🌈 Qeatherby cartridges but he really is one of the quality channels
@@aaronwilcox6417 yes, I too appreciate this kind of sentiment from the people who have experienced and willing to share their thoughts.
Wishing everyone all the best.
I'm honestly waiting for the Federal Premium 7PRC loaded with the terminal accent to see how it shoots. As far as brass I'm thinking about just buying some from Gunwerks.
Me as well
I was under the impression that the PRC was not developed for velocity, rather; it was meant for precision with longer bullets at slower velocity. Which is something I struggle to do with my RemMag.
Do you have a fast twist 7 mag?
@@ReloadingWeatherby 1:9 1/2 heavy barrel SAKO. I use 162 gr. @ 2750fps, mostly because I don’t like the recoil.
The 7 PRC is on my radar for a future purchase. I think the Hornady PRC lineup of factory ammo velocities and the global powder shortages gives context to my comments. I hand load for 300 PRC for my Bergara HMR 26 inch barrel. Using this rifle, often with Hornady factory ammo I had ejector marks and flattened primers. I started using Lapua 300 PRC brass did not see pressure signs like I did with the Hornady brass/ammo. The Hornady 300 PRC ammo I purchased two years ago I did see velocities within +-2% of what was on the box. However with newer Hornady 300 PRC ammo, I am seeing 125 - 150 feet/second slower. I am using H1000 and Retumbo for hand loads and it is 100 feet/second slower than the Hornady manual. I think Hornady should change the published velocities. However my accuracy has been consistently 0.7 - 0.9 MOA, so I am happy with the accuracy. I am working up 300 PRC loads now with the Winchester STABall HD and will chronograph those loads. My STABall HD load data came from the Hodgdon Reloading website with a velocity range of 2652 - 2898 feet/second. My rife ammo philosophy is chronograph your loads and zero your rifle for local atmospheric conditions, since velocity will vary in changes to the environment. As long as the rifle is accurate and has the necessary energy at hunting distances, I can live with lower but predictable velocities for my hand loads and factory ammo. Good video. Thank you for for taking the time and money to create it.
Thanks for sharing
I feel like too many people bought into the hype of the PRC and expected it to be overall numerically superior to the 7mm RM; faster, flatter, heavier, just MORE.
I'm building a rifle in 7mm PRC not because I want it to do more than my 7mm RM, but because I want to do mostly the same things as my RM with POTENTIALLY better accuracy, longer case life, and smoother feeding. If I can get similar velocities with slightly less powder, I'll be delighted, but I don't chase speed so much as I do accuracy. My go-to load for the RM has been a 160 AB @3025.
If the PRC can reach 3000 with a 160 class bullet or 2900 with a 180 class and be CONSISTENTLY sub MOA, it will meet my expectations.
I was planning on doing a 7mm build, for next years hunting season. I was going to go with the rem mag, until I started paying attention to the prc, then I thought its better to go with the more modern cartridge. But after seeing the rem mag continuely do better than 3000fps and the 7prc struggle to get up there. I think I’m going to stay with the tried and true 7mm rem mag in a 26” barrel Remington 700 sps stainless
Get a fast twist 7 mag and it will be one awesome combination
@ yea the 700 I’m looking at is available with a 26” barrel with a 1:8 twist rate, 5R rifling.
280 ai is a great choice as well
280 AI all day
I'll be building a 7 RSAUM in an existing short action I have at some point. If I go dedicated long action I'm not sure what I would do
I use H1000 in my 24 inch 7mmSAUM. 2900fps with 180 grain Bergers. I’ve also used h1000 in 7mags for years. If I owned a 7prc it would be the first powder I tried.
You do you...
I have a 7 prc browning xbolt 20” tube with N565 and 175 eldx im get 2850 is my average with honady brass I do have Peterson haven’t messed with it much. I do believe you are correct though I was messing around with grand and I was hitting pressure pretty early with it. I still like my 6.8 better it does have a 26” tube my hand load I’m getting right over 3000 fps with grand and 170 Berger
Interestingly enough I have a browning x bolt 7prc with a 26” barrel and was only able to get 2850 with the 180eldm factory match ammo. I’m only able to get about 3 loadings on that Hornady brass before the primer pockets loosen up. I’m on my 9th firing with Peterson. With grand and the 175 eldx im able to find a good node at 2,940 fps and I was able to achieve over 3000 with grand but the groups opened up. What charge wt are you using with the n565 and the 175 eldx?
@ with N565 I’m running 67.5 it’s 2 grains or so over book but I have no pressure. When I was messing with Grand and hornady brass I got an ejection mark and I had one with hard bolt lift at 71 grains of grand now I haven’t tried it with Peterson brass. I try not to shoot my prc to much because it shoots lights out with the N565 load worst group I’ve gotten was .5 moa most of the time it’s hole for hole but every barrel has there sweet spot in there barrel life and I didn’t break the barrel in I’ve got maybe 90 shots in my prc. I didn’t break my 6.8 in either I’m being to to thank it doesn’t even matter I was get .5 moa with factory ammo after I went to sight it in. Every browning I’ve had or been around shoots really good but when you burn out a barrel most smiths wont touch them around my area because the xbolt have thread locker on the barrel unfortunately but there are ways to get them off but after you break it loose if it gets really hard to turn put the barrel back on because there threads are fine and most of the time it’ll pull the threads out
I’ve read the barrels on brownings are a pain as well and I’m already looking into options for a new barrel just to see how much I need to save up. I’ve only shot n565 up to 67.2g with the 175g but only saw about 2900 fps, haven’t really pushed it. I’ve got about 600 rounds on my 7 PRC with various combos of powders and bullets. It’s always interesting to see what people are getting.
@ one of my buddies is shooting a 175g eldx and I believe his is a 26” barrel or 24” but he’s using Ramshot LRT out of his and he’s getting over 3100 out of his browning
26” Bartlein MTU contour barrel.
Peterson brass, 180gr ELDM, 69.7gr StaBallHD. Seating depth made a big difference in velocity and accuracy. Best 4 round group was .222 at 2950fps. The 7PRC has proven to be much more finicky than advertised.
Awesome load you have there.
Great video just presenting exactly what you experienced. It is always interesting to see reactions and positions on a topic like this.
Every rifle will be different. Thanks for watching
The best review of the 7 PRC to date! you're 100% correct Hornady brass is JUNK. Brass, barrel & bullets are the keys to success. The other thing I'm not sure that people aren't understanding, but not only do you need to spec your bullet to the powder but to your barrel as well. Short barrels need to be using a magnum power on the "faster" side of the scale. Powders such as Magpro, RL23, RL25, IMR7828 etc...etc.
I wouldn't lose any sleep over it if I were you, R. Dubb. 😂
my custom 7mm PRC hated factory ammo. shot the custom 173 ELD-X that came with less than .5 MOA at 2883.
Im a copper fan so I loaded the 168 gr LRX with 66 grs of H-1000 based off the Hogden load data. got that up to 2940. Once i got my seating depth correct, last group was .8 moa at 100, with 2 touching. Good enough for what need it to do.
Thanks for watching!
When you run out of those, you should try the 160 lrx they developed for that cartridge. They're getting really good velocity in their factory ammo with it.
@@robertmajors1737I've been trying to find the 160 gr LRXs with no luck
Glad to see that the 7 Prc videos and associated comments haven't changed. Lol
I'm hoping to get back to mine come spring but will be doing some racing as well so we will see.
Good to see you back!
So I'm running RL26 68gns and Berger 175EH ADG brass, MV 2970. That's at 23 rounds down the barrel . No pressure. I'm still fire forming the first 100 rounds but should be close to 3k after I hit 100 rounds. 26in barrel is the way to go!
You have a 26 inch barrel?
That ELD-X bullet is pretty impressive at long range.
N565 is quickly becoming my go to powder for 6.5 prc 7 prc and any short fat magnum. Even using the really heavy bullets like the 156 Berger in 6.5mm I get right at 3000 fps with single digit sds and sub half moa groups all day long.
Nice
I am in the market for a 28 caliber hunting rifle. I had narrowed it down to the 7mm WSM, 280 AI, and 7mm PRC. This info kind of dampens my enthusiasm for the PRC. Also, I am not looking to shoot the heavier projectiles that the PRC was specifically designed for. I am looking to shoot the 140g - 160g class as fast and accurate as I can using a monolithic construction such as a TTSX. The 7mm Rem Mag is great but, I dont like the belt. I like everything I read about the WSM but fear I would have trouble sourcing good quality brass. Alas...the search continues...
Sounds like 280 AI is what you're looking for.
@@ReloadingWeatherby
Exactly what I was going to say
There’s really not too much difference between 7 PRC and 280 AI. 7 PRC has a lot more support and is what I’d recommend if you’re buying a factory rifle. Run the new Barnes 160gr LRX load and call it a day.
Fyi I am getting 2866fps with my 280 ai with a 22" barrel with the 160 cx bullets, .5 grain less than max
If you wanna run 140's, 280AI will push them 3200. I run Nosler AB 160's in my 7mm PRC at 3102. I save the heavier bullets for my 28 Nosler, ELDX 175's at 3181fps. The most efficient is the 280 AI and also the least recoil to get 140s running 3200.
Now Norma made 7 mm prc.. and then you have exelent bras 👍👍👍
Peterson brass is nice and heavy in my opinion like Lake City 5.56 brass.
I hit high pressure with mid range loadings
I’m getting 3008 with RL26 /69 grains and grouping well with 175 Eld in a 22 inch barrel
You're 2gr over max
@ no real pressure signs though
@@ReloadingWeatherbyI got the Cx bullets to group well and out of my gun with just about every powder I tried. Out of the weatherby 307 alpine
I use Hodgdon's Retumbo in almost everything that has a "Magnum" reference to the caliber with excellent results. I'm using 68gr of Retumbo in my daughter's 7mm Rem Mag with 180gr Hornady ELDM at 2995 fps, from a 24" barrel, and with Hornady brass... It should work just as well in the PRC case I would think.
@@dougroope8040 you’d be surprised what a small difference in case volume does with powder selection. 7 mag is not picky and will accept a lot of powders with great results. PRC was designed specifically for RL26 which is so unnatural on how it burns. It really does produce great velocity. However. Powders below it will burn to fast and not get the same speed. Powders above it will burn to slow. It’s quite the conundrum. Which is why I’m irritated with Hornady. They should have picked more common powders when designing the case volume. RL26 works great in my 25 creedmoor and my 6.5 creedmoor. But doesn’t work at all in my 7 saw. Which is only 4 grains of powder capacity more. It wants h4350 or n550.
I Picked up ADG brass and Grand. Going to try that. I’ve heard good feedback with it.
Have fun
Hell yes, I'm using Peterson brass but I'm getting 2980 out of 195s with Grand.
7 PRC does what it does, not what Hornady says it does. I think it is a very good cartridge.
For everyone out there who believes that a 175gr bullet going 3000fps is the second coming of the messiah… and their calling in life is to achieve this…
Get a 300WSM and some H100V and you will be happy when you discover it is easy to push 175gr bullets to 3100fps with a 24” barrel.
Cheers!
Yes you have reason,i have 2 300wsm,one 23 inch barell,other 26 inch,90 fps difference with same load,7 prc not for me!!!
"Just shoot a larger belted magnum loaded with ridiculously light bullets" why not piss into the wind as well?...
@@jonnybgoode7742 nah man… screw guns… hunt with a sword.
@@jonnybgoode7742 the wsm isn't a belted magnum....
You are right on with hornady brass ive had to down load 2 of my guns to use the brass and that takes away my accuracy
It's to bad that Reloader 26 isn't available any more, I do have some :). My Seekins Precision Havak PH2 in 7PRC with 26" barrel using said powder (68.5 grains and cci mag 250 primers in my rifle, worked up load), Averages right at 3070 fps (@ 3200feet elevation) using 175gn ELD-X hand loaded using Hornady brass. Absolutely no pressure signs and groups great. Worked fantastic on a bull elk I shot in October.
Sweet
Interesting video, Austin. Good job!
Thanks
great video! love 7828ssc. Just curious if you've tried Retumbo? I know it works like magic in my 6.8W....thinking it'd be the boss for available powders for the 7PRC.
Retumbo is a good powder, but it's also really slow burning. So if you use it, use it on the heaviest bullets.
I have a Christiansen Arms Mesa 22" barrel using the Hornady 175gr ELD X projectiles, cci magnum primers and Hornady brass.
The velocities I am getting are as follows.
4831SC 64 grains of powder Average velocity is 2855 there are ejector marks on all 5 pieces of brass.
H1000 67 grains of powder Average velocity is 2900 there are ejector marks on all 5 pieces of brass.
Retumbo 70 grains of powder Average velocity is 2960 there are ejector marks on all 5 pieces of brass.
I should mention that with all three of these powders that I tested I was seeing ejector marks as well on the brass at 1.5 grains less than the aforementioned charges.
I have also shot several boxes of Hornady Match 180gr ELD M's, the average velocity is 2790. Out of each box of ammo approximately 15 of the cartridges also have ejector marks.
It seems that I am seeing ejector marks very early in the charge weights.
I ran into a fella at my local range that was seeing ejector marks on a lot of his factory loaded ammo, He had a 7mm PRC Browning rifle I'm not sure what model.
I hear that the Hornady brass is soft as you mentioned.
Please comment I would like any information that you have to offer.
Thank you for the clip it is very well done and informative.
Honest question here; what's the obsession/fixation with muzzle velocity? I've always been pragmatic with my cartridge choices and muzzle velocity isn't really a factor, at least not directly. For hunting applications it comes down to the effective velocity window of the bullet you've chosen to hunt with, and what distances that correlates to in whatever cartridge you're looking at. Most hunting bullets function down to 2k fps (some as low as 1600) and you have to look at what distance that is for a given projectile. In most cases that's longer than most people would be willing to take an ethical shot. A 175gr ELD-X with a 2800fps muzzle velocity gets you out to about 600 yards at 2k fps, 3000fps muzzle velocity takes you out to about 750. Unless you expect to/want to be about to take a shot between 600 and 750 yards with that cartridge, only thing you're getting with that extra 200 fps is significantly greater throat erosion.
If any of you understand the logic of chasing velocity I'd love to hear it. I primarily bow hunt, only time I use rifles is for varmint/predator hunting, long range target shooting, or just plain for fun. But I've been shooting for almost 30 years and hand loading for maybe 15 now. I've owned and shot 308s, 300 Win Mags, 7mm mags, 30-30s, 223s/5.56s, 6.5 Grendels and 6.5 Creedmoors.
What is the difference between a 7mm PRC and a 28 Nosler? They both have fast twist barrels... It's the velocity. It's how we have always talked about cartridges.
@ReloadingWeatherby Yeah but my question is why people think a few hundred feet per second actually matters when it comes to actual, practical usage
@@DanielReyes-hz1qk Very true... but people are very tribal about their cartridges. For a lot of people it's fun to see the little differences that don't really matter.
Simple man like big number. Me bullet go fast so me good hunter. Me shoot bigger bullet than you so me more manly. That kind of simple shit. You’re being far too logical and understanding of nuance. You’re not a rube to be suckered in by marketing for every new thing the industry wants to sell you to make more money. All that being said, your ability to consistently hit a non-static target at a range that you don’t have 100% confidence in is significantly improved by better ballistics and bc only goes so far. Velocity makes up a lot for ranging errors and can save your bacon well before you’re at 600.
@Snailz5 Well said. Does velocity really make that much of a difference in ranging errors? I'll plug numbers into a ballistics app later. I'm an old Mil-Dot scope guy my range estimation is probably better than average lol. But I used to shoot in the practical/tactical matches that eventually became PRS
Great video. Such a Focus on speed. Reality is 90% don’t shoot over 400 yds. And while 10% may, I am sure they train extensively on it.
Thanks for watching
My brand new MPA Matrix gun is probably not a good example as it has a straight profile 30" barrel. Just completed it's first powder test and with CCI 250 primers, 69.5gr of H1000, 180gr Berger Hybrids and ADG brass, I easily got 3,117fps with absolutely no pressure indicators. The 100yd, 3-shot groups, even at various powder measures (65.9 to 69.5grs) ranged from 0.14" to .74" with 9 of the 16 groups under 0.35", I was ecstatic. I could have easily gone to 70.6gr, but my goal was to get over 3,000fps that day. The common word out is that Hornady was originally using RL26 for their box velocity numbers, but then had to change to another powder. While my groups were exception the SD's weren't the best. we'll see what Seating Depth testing brings next. A Garmin Xero was used to record velocities, and it didn't miss a shot. BTW, Hawkins posted a load development on the 7PRC early on from a 24" and 180gr bullets with 71grs of Retumbo at 3,045fps, 67.0grs of H4831 at 3,041fps and 70.0 grs of H1000 at 3045.
Now that is the proper barrel length. Thanks for sharing
Thanks for this info!
My 22 inch gun never got the velocities that Hornady predicted or that Hodgdon predicted, even accounting for 2 in shorter barrel.
Even the vaunted 175ELDX loaded by Federal only got to 2850.
Strangely enough though, with Factory Barnes ammo and Factory terminal Ascent ammo it shot exactly where predicted velocity said it should be
Feel like they may have brought this thing out too soon. A little more research and development may have helped
They made all of their claims off of one powder that is extremely difficult to get
What kind of ending is that!? What were your speeds with the two powders you recommended? Did you even try them? I highly doubt those are faster than h1000, n570 or rl26.
You have to backup final statements like that.
I would think that IMR 7828 would work well for your 7 mm PRC, for velocity anyway. However 7828 is equally scarce.
Not sure if you tried it , but ramshot Grand is similar to reloader 25 and 26 burn wise
That Outfitter Ammo sucks in my rifle. Will not group and the velocity was in the tank.
Most rifles won't like outfitter ammo.
@@ReloadingWeatherby I’m hesitant to purchase Hornady CX bullets for/as a reloading component, as these bullets in their factory fodder showed no value.
Barnes has been working great for me. I have no problem getting .5” groups with their bullets in various rifles I own.
Their BC value is a bit higher than Barnes, accuracy rules over a bit of BC value difference.
I’d like to try their 130 grain CX bullets for my 6.5 PRC and their 190 grain CX for my 300 PRC and my Win. Mag.
I’ll probably try them, I’m just a bit stubborn.
I have no need to buy them as I have many Barns on hand that’s doing great for me.
I hope others are enjoying great accuracy with them as I wish no Ill will.
I hope you and your followers are enjoying this new year. If you haven’t found Jesus Christ as your Savior let this be the year you find Him as your Savior.
Find yourself an Independent Bible believing church.
The Lord has done great things in my life, I know He can do the same for you.
Blessings your way.
If you had a 26” barrel what powder would you have gone with. That’s the barrel length my 7prc is chambered in. Waiting on good brass. All my factory Hornady Ammo ended up getting ejector marks like yours showed. Junk
Buy 7mm STW and you are good
The newbies and fan boys don’t know what they are missing by not using the 7 STW ! It will shoot 200 fps more than a 7 REM mag or the 7 PRC !…… Sorry the truth is not always pleasant ……….
I had Hornady outfitter ammo group terrible for me too. Then i watched a Ron spommer video that explained how solid copper needs a cleaned to bare metal barrel and after trying it....... It worked? Maybe you should try it and then hopefully explain why this is?
Possibly... the gun I had didn't like any bullet I tried
I think the Hornady CX is the problem. I haven’t been able to get them to shoot with factory or hand loads in 3 different rifles, even with cleaned barrels.
@@KMV-49 what caliber and rifle. I've seen this on a few threads and I've been rolling on the cleaned down to bare metal bore concept that worked for me but apparently that's not always the case?? I sort of assumed that the 7mm was at least stable
I have a 7PRC with a 24” barrel. I also had the same results.
What rifle do you have?
Great video. From what I can tell, the 7PRC has the potential to be great, but it needs everything to be perfect to pull it off. It is the MG of cartridges.
Hornady shouldn't have released it as a 3000 FPS cartridge.
@@ReloadingWeatherby Bingo! And we all need to remember a 175 is a heavy bullet.
@@nt3523huh???
@@ReloadingWeatherby Yeah but spin doctors gotta spin.
@@SpudOutdoors So, you thought the 7prc was gonna get 3000fps? As soon as I got my hands on it I knew it was a stretch. 7 Rem Mag barely gets there with a 175.
I rebarreled to a 27 inch 1:7 twist. Shooting 180s outfitters at 3046 10 shot average. It’s alerting built barrel and fitted to a M77 rugger skeleton stock mark 2.
Honestly, if you gave another rifle a good review, you may be surprised. I bought a 6.5 creed in the patriot rifle and it was a disaster. Horrible speed, accuracy and just overall cheap garbage. SOLD the gun quickly. I bought 7 PRC in a Bergara and it shoots really good. Sub MOA all day with most ammo. Founds some Terminal bullets from federal and they were surprisingly accurate - .5 inch groups @ 2960 with a 22inch barrel.
Keep up the great reviews though!! I love your channel.
I've shot a Fierce in 7mm PRC. It was a little faster and a whole lot more accurate
Keep telling the truth
I’m going through the same thing right now. Going to try Ramshot Grand and Accurate Magpro next
Good luck and have fun!
It’s slow because all of Hornady calibers 6.5 need more and the PRC calibers suck. Stick with what’s been killing game for decades. 270,30/30,308,30/067 mag etc. this new miracle rounds hornady has are junk. A 270 out preforms a 6.5 at any distance. A 6.8 western out preforms the 7prc at any distance. Facts
I personally have always favored the 7 Rem Mag. I have my 2nd rifle I got in mid 90s(700 BDL) to replace my first that I sadly traded at a gun show. A few years ago I bought the Savage Storm in 7 Rem Mag. I am curious why the manufacturers aren't at least producing the RemMag with a 1:8 twist barrel and optimizing the chamber for the heavier longer bullets. Is there really a need to produce a "new" cartridge that doesn't provide any advantage over a tried and true existing cartridge? Is the old magnum belt really an issue at all?
I have played with ballistics on paper quite a bit and I personally have no reason to look beyond my 2900-2980 loads with various powders and the 162 ELDX. I am good out to 600 yards for up to bull elk. I doubt I will ever shoot beyond 400 on any game I hunt. How many folk are out there like that?
Maybe the PRC is primarily a long range match option. Thank you Sir.
Almost half of the companies do provide a fast twist in 7 Mag. Savage isn't one of them. Companies with fast twist 7 Rem Mag
Fierce
Christensen
Remington
Ruger
Browning
Weatherby
The only advantage is the beltless design. Ammo is rare,very expensive etc here in Norther Canada. 7 mm Rem is daily bread and butter at Canadian tire or Wally world.
What are your thoughts on the 300 PRC. I'm looking for a do it all Cartridge. I believe in Velocity and energy.
Great option. I think it's the best PRC.
#1 , while CVA makes some accurate rifles, it's not a custom cut rifled barrel. I personally saw a 150 fps different between a custom cut rifled brux barrel and a bergarar barrel of the same length with the same brass and load. #2 that barrel could speed up with more rounds. Enjoy the content form you, thank you.
My 7mm PRC out of a 26” barrel shooting Federal Premium terminal ascent 170g bullet. My average was 3090 fps with a standard deviation of 13
Very nice!
Will watch for sure
When switching from a cup and core bullet to a solid copper, you should clean your barrel down to bare metal before shooting the coppers. i dont know the science behind it, but thats probably why those cx shot so bad out of your gun
Possibly, I have other guns that don't need to be cleaned to shoot copper really well. The truth is this gun I had was shot terrible with all bullets
There's videos that disprove that myth.
@@MatthewKyle-sg5uo There are others that prove it. its one of those things that could work for someone, and its a very easy thing to try
@jdennis513 meh it's a myth. I have tried it with both my 7prc and my 6.5 prc. I have notice no difference in accuracy switching back and forth between barnes lrx and hornady coppers to eld x and m'S.
@@MatthewKyle-sg5uo 👌
Hornady did a podcast talking about how certain rifle manufacturers don’t have the correct tolerance specs to handle 7 prc. Not to discredit mossberg but that is definitely one of the cheapest options you could have gone with. When you look at people shooting seekins, bergara, Christensen and the customs, everyone is not having pressure problems and is having good velocity.
I've shot a 7mm PRC from Fierce and it wasn't much faster than my rifle. Go do some RUclips searches on 7mm PRC velocity. It's not just the cheap budget rifles getting bad velocities
@ if that’s the case then I would say it may have to do with powder shortages. Try the federal load with the hornady eldx. I ready they are a sister company with reloaded 26 and they don’t have any shortages and are getting the advertised velocities. But too rifle companies having problems is more concerning then I thought.
One of the reasons the 7PRC is supposed to be so accurate, and a huge leap over the 7mm rem.mag is because of the tight saami specs on all Chambers. But then hornadysays a comes out and says Chambers are all different and causing massive differences.. more of their marketing BS and lies.
@ReloadingWeatherby I can second that. 175 eld x out of my ct carbon rival with a 24 inch barrel is going on average 2850. It's criminal. Everyone who has purchased a 7prc and hornady ammo ought to get together and sue hornady. Liars. Blatant....
@@MatthewKyle-sg5uo I’ve shot 3 rifles with hornady factory ammo and while yes velocities have been below the marketed 3000 fps, all of them were sub .75 moa shooters. Two of them were sub half all day long and even the ES and SD were pretty good for factory ammo. One was a browning, the other my custom and a seekins
I think I'll get a 7 PRC and load it with H1000 see what happens. Also have Magpro that has worked well for me in 6.5 PRC. Just to see what happens. You can kiss any case capacity benefits from the 7RM when shooting a 170 or 180 class bullet. I concur with your statements about brass. I always have primer pocket issues with Hornady brass.
ruclips.net/user/shortsR4Lm-2R4Y5o?si=3vI7QNfPP3gz4weB
Back fife did a vid on this also. People who actually chronograph their loads have been complaining a lot.
Little crow gunwerks has done a series on the 7mm 's alot of data great stuff ,, whats your thoughts on retumbo shooting the 162 gr eldx??
Tim is a wealth of knowledge. Little Crow Gunworks would advice not to use Retumbo with that light of a bullet. Use a faster burning powder.
@@ReloadingWeatherby What he 👆 said. 😆
Everyone wants to run 20" barrels for suppressors, magnums always had 26" barrels.
Barnes 160gr LRX factory ammo is awesome in my rifle. .4” groups and 2996 fps out of a 22” barrel.
Nice! They use RL-26 as well
@ yes, unless RL26 becomes available again, I don’t see myself ever reloading for my rifle. The Barnes ammo is just too good.
@@danjuteau7368 Ageed, I am getting sub half MOA out of a Proof barrel 0 2,980 FPS - I purchased 10 boxes and my press is gathering dust.
Dude, I also have issues with getting the advertised velocity on my 7mm PRC. We should all launch a class-action lawsuit against Hornady! It is pure false advertising.
Meh... just buy Federal ammo
Does it really matter that it’s not going 3000fps, im pretty sure a deer or elk isn’t going to complain, by the way I don’t own a 7prc, never even shot one, just seems to be a lot of noise over a couple hundred feet difference, keep up the great content mate,cheers Yogi
No... but since when has any of the topics I cover matter?
Lapua is making 7 prc brass this year. I have 8 lbs rl26 7 lbs rl23 from 2019 ish and just got 3 lbs n565. Just getting back into reloading.....
Just waiting patiently for someone to develope the 7prcAI.
That would be the 7mm Rem mag
@ReloadingWeatherby not really. It would be an improved 7 prc that could go toe to toe with the rem mag.
This is old news when it comes to Hornady ammo.
I'm not talking about Hornady ammo in this video
My 180gr with 64.8 grains of h4841sc out of my 24 inch mossberg was getting around 2860 fps was very underwhelmed. But the accuracy is top tier and no animal is going to buck a 175-180 gr at 2700-2800 fps. Wish i had more but it is what it is
I built a 7 PRC and have had a similar experience. 2850 fps from a 175 gr Berger EH out of a 22 inch Proof barrel. 65.1 gr H4831SC. ES: 13, SD: 5.6. Not nearly as fast as my son's 7 Rem Mag, but definitely more accurate. Best group has been 0.07" (3 shots, yes i know thats an outlier) Average/typical group is around 0.50-ish give or take (10 shots). Great rifle, but it's not a speed diamond by any stretch of the imagination.
Thanks for sharing
I have never thought that you were faking lower speeds to stick it to Big Red and 7 PRC Fanboys.
Pretty interesting breakdown. It will be a couple years before I can get another firearm since I ordered a lever gun in 360 Buckhammer to be my legal in Ohio gun since I moved there last year. But I do want to get a left hand 7 PRC to fit in between my LH 270 Win and RH 300 WSM. But unless I was able to spend $2000+ on either a Weatherby or Fierce or go custom I won’t find a 7 PRC in LH with more than a 22” barrel. I want to eventually hunt suppressed so I am ok with that. But a 24 in would work ok for that application and get more velocity.
Thanks for watching and commenting
My 22 inch 7 PRC with 180 grain Berger handloads running N565 average 2975 fps. No signs of pressure and it shoots great 🤷♂️
What brass you using?
ADG
@@brinkerhoff8 Makes sense
Try retumbo powder. I love it.
Good luck finding it, i haven't seen retumbo since like 2018 it's extinct
Really? I bought so many 8 lb tubs years ago I haven't had to purchase any in a very long time. Thank you for the information.
It's all in how you define 'efficient'. I shoot 7Rum. Most cartridges need to fill the whole case with expensive powder. No room for improvement, is how I like to think about it. My cases aren't even close to full and I'm screaming at 3250 fps. Plenty of room for improvement. Very 'efficient'. 😁
Love my 30 30.
I think I'll just build myself a 7-300 PRC and call it a day.
Why fight tooth and nail with a 175gr bullet to get 3000 fps when I could just neck down a 300 PRC case and get 3200?
Well, there are actually a lot of reasons to go with the 7 instead of a 7-300 PRC lol. But it would be a fun project
Federal 175 ELDX , Bergara HMR Hunter 24” averaging 2989fps, Hornady 175 ELDX 2808fps. Did not complete break in due to last minute purchase for hunting season because my fierce twisted rival won’t group without a foul/pre heat shot.
Federal uses RL-26.
All but identical results for me , just extrapolated down a bit for my 22" barreled Savage Ultralite with it's Proof Research barrel.
I waited a good 90-100 rounds of Hornady Precision hunter before I broke out the Chrono to let it settle a bit.
Federal 175gr ELDX was 2950fps 10 shot average. Hornady Precision Hunter 175gr ELDX was 2792 for a 10 shot average.
They are slow because Hornady overhyped their creation. They do that across the board with all their ammo, especially with the "new" cartridges. Hornady is about as honest as CNN.
Ramshot grand got me 2950 all day today. 1/2 grain off starting pressure marks worked best for accuracy. 22'' barrel. Got 3000 with an ejector mark. 175eldx. Ended the day on Nosler 168 ablr with a 3/8'' group. 4831sc was way way slower.
Grand should get faster velocities than RL-26
Even at 2800fps, high BC bullets pay their dividends over farther ranges. Example.
Do a ballistic chart for 300RUm, 180gr Barnes TSX .458 BC AT 3150FPS and then 7MM PRC 175 ELDX with .672 BC @2800 FPS. Im fine with a 2800fps high BC bullet
Why on earth would you shoot a 180 TSX for long range? And only at 3150 FPS? That's 300 Win mag velocity. You can easily get 3350 FPS with a 300 RUM and 180 gr. Let's use a 178 ELD-X in the 300 RUM at 3350 FPS. The 300 RUM has only 20 MOA of drop at 1000 yards vs 27 MOA with the 7mm PRC. Wind drift would be almost identical
Got a 22” Bergara I’m about to start load development on. Going to try N570 first. If I can’t get a full case I’ll drop to 565.
I would recommend a faster burning powder for your shorter barrel. Something like N560 or H4831SC
@ I appreciate that. I was debating that as well. My original goal was 565 to start. Luckily the vv powders are pretty easy to get ahold of and I already have some sc kicking around
@chasehunt6497 565 and 570 are way too slow for a 22" 7 PRC.
N560, 7828SSC & 4831SC are your powders.
26" = N565
28"+ = N570 if you can get enough in there. Otherwise still N565.
@ really? From what I’ve read 565 is really the sweet spot for the 7. I know with the shorter barrel 570 is probably too slow but I’ve had very good luck with “too slow” powders with very full cases. We will see, but I’ll get a pound of 560 on the way. I’ve read 4831 is consistently slow, but hey maybe everything is in the PRC
@chasehunt6497 N565 isn't ideal until you get to a 24" barrel at 63k psi or more. Thats maximum charge territory.
In a 26" barrel that's a little better for N565.
N570 is basically never good in a 7 PRC unless you have a 26" or longer barrel, and exclusively shoot a 195gr Berger OVER 65k PSI.
THEN it actually all burns. Otherwise your always going to have inconsistencies in one form or another.
Look at Ultimate Reloaders 280AI video. He had horrible ES and group sizes on almost everything he tested. Why? Because he doesn't know what he's doing.
He used H1000 which is WAAAAYYYY too slow for a 280AI under ANY circumstances. It's never going to burn 100%. Hence the shitty ES numbers and groups.
If your ES numbers aren't ALWAYS under 15 for 3 shots. It's not all burning and there are better choices.
I got 3000 with older Hornady eldx in my 7prc “26inch barrel” now it’s more like 2900-2985.
Older Hornady ammo was loaded with RL-26. Newer ammo is loaded with H1000 or Staball HD
My experience with Hornady 7PRC brass showed me it's junk. It's one and done unless you want to load your 7PRC at 708 velocities.
Thanks for sharing!
Hornady brass is not that good but i'm on my 3rd reload on it (still good). shooting 175's at around 3070fps
@@GaryEberhardt It seems to be ok for my 708 but for unknown reasons, in 7PRC I couldn't even seat a primer in many of the once fired factory brass. By the way, Hornady makes some nickel brass for Barnes factory ammo
@@Accuracy1stI'm not having that problem yet. I wont be using Hornady brass much longer as I will will get something else.
When I got my seekins the only way to get brass for reloading was to buy hornady factory loaded stuff.
Lol. The 7PRC is everything it was ever promised to be… with a musket length barrel 😂
You can get into mid 29’s with a 175/180 loading it. Takes a little work but you can. Certainly the hornady is anemic from what I’ve seen.
Yep
Reloader 26 , the fabled Unicorn powder 😂 . Save money, keep your 7 rem mag !
Did a test today. Hornday new ammo.26 inch barell was 2970 old ammo new 2870..i.was 30 fps slower on 24 inch my.3 guns getting .29 to 39. Super accurate just little slow
I.shot 4 round ot of 8 boxes all different speeds
Going to try 175 federal.eld x hear it's getting 3000.fps
In the end you should of got a 7 rem mag.
You don’t think Hornady had a proprietary powder made in the early days that they can no longer get their hands on?
You mean RL-26? Yes they developed this cartridge off of RL-26 and now can't get it
When the 7MM PRC was introduced, the impression that I got, and probably others, was that it was going to be a modern, efficient, slightly less recoiling ultimate North American big game hunting cartridge, a genuine replacement for the 300win mag, a 180 gr (ish) bullet at 3000 ft/sec Instead, what everyone ended up with was a 30-06 😂 another fine, North American big game hunting cartridge, a 180gr bullet at 2800 ft/sec I’m not against modern technologies. I think it can be quite useful. It’s a shame that the 6.8 western hasn’t taken off yet. There’s a saying in backpacking that “every ounce counts” I truly believe that! And the more time you hike in the western mountains, you may come to appreciate that too? Having a slightly smaller action, and yet a cartridge with plenty of power, very close to your 7 mm magnums, would be amazing!
Thanks for your comment
Exactly. I initially thought they were going the Nosler route and putting a 7mm bullet into a 300 PRC cartridge. Unfortunately, they made a sub par 7mm wsm
Not only is the action shorter, but I'm getting box velocity out of one load and only losing 60fps in another with a 20" barrel. I think the 6.8 western does what the 6.5prc and 7prc are supposed to do at the same time. I have a 20" barrel in each of those on the way to do direct comparisons.
175gr at 3k fps is damn near 300 win mag numbers. I would just get a 28 nosler if I needed that. I think people are just disappointed the new hyped cartridge probably isn’t any better than 7mm rem mag or wsm, barely better than 6.8 west or 270 wsm, definitely not 7mm weatherby except with heavier bullets.
I shoot less than a 1/4 moa consistent with a M24 Bartlein barrel 26 / impact precision action. Agd brass/ berger hybrid/ h1000. 64.8 grains. Col 3.32.6 . Velocity 2780 average. It's really accurate at 900 yards
That's a nice load... but I think you could keep with the accuracy and get a bunch more velocity
You will love the 7mm-378 weatherby magnum ultimate hunting round and I mean hunting no one will shoot this in competition barrel life is the worst ever but accuracy is nuts
Think Weatherby would send me one?
Each rifle is slightly different. H870 in a 300 win mag gave 2700 fps. 30-06 performance. I started using IMR 4831 and got 3100. Same bullet.
Follow the recipes and work up your loads. Find the accuracy and velocity that works for you. I always wanted tight groups and high velocity , but in reality, a 2" group at sizzling velocity is adequate for hunting. You should always find a way to get inside 300 yards, 400 at the most.
Thanks for watching
7 prc is within 1% case capacity of the 7WSM.
did you try the barnes 160g lrx
No, that bullet and ammo wasn't available when I had the gun
@ReloadingWeatherby ive switched my 7mm prc and 300 prc both to barnes big improvement over hornadys inconsistent loads. even norma bondstrike has been better
@@gerardcorreale7760the 160gr is working amazingly well for me also.