What They Don't Tell You About Suppressors
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- Опубликовано: 11 янв 2024
- A lot of focus recently has rightfully been on sound proximal to the shooter.
But I want to give a bit of input on other aspects of suppressor ownership that, in my opinion, perhaps is a bit more relevant.
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Some people are thinking I am saying a suppressor is useless for the shooter on supersonic rifles.
That couldn't be further from the truth.
To be sure:
Basically all serious rifles probably need a suppressors, regardless of use case.
What I (clearly unsuccessfully) tried to say:
Relatively performance between cans, in my opinion, in the context of a fighting rifle. Is only one, less important, piece of the pie when compared to all of the other factors (flash, tone, signature etc.)
Also, the sound report were filmed with a nice studio grade mic, but absolutely isn't the correct mic for this type of work. There is a reason why I don't say "20%" better. I just used my personal anecdotal experience and notes from that day, which result in "slightly quieter" "functionally the same" etc. Which is the most I can do given my equipment.
It sounds like I should get a flow-through can for my PCC when I'm getting urban.
Then I should wear ear protection for pretty much anything bottlenecked when I need more velocity, penetration or range and I should get a big performance can for my 1,000 yard plus bolt actions when I'm getting rural.
What's the background music in your videos?
I appreciate your work and thoughts to create this video. Would appreciate the same topic but only include naturally subsonic rounds (.22, .45 acp, 300 blk, .38 spl, 45 colt. Suppressing a sub vs super down range sounds.
@@robertjeffries903”Taylor crane, is it a reflection” is some of what he uses. Other times it’s Rimworld music, the rest I haven’t identified
I mean from what I know it does depend a lot on the round and speed… 556 is hard to suppress as it’s a bullet designed for speed and speed is going crack and make noise… subsonic ammo as I’m going a lot slower, limits range capabilities really the only thing I see a suppressor for is 300bo subs or even 308 subs 556 subs are basically inefficient however if you have neighbors and shoot on your land a suppressor seems logical or even cqb scenarios without ears it’s a mine as well cut down on sound
Back in the Iraq war, I carried an M4 with a Gemtech Halo 5.56 can in the streets of Baghdad.
A few points-
1. A suppressed rifle virtually eliminates echo in the streets. The sound seems to be absorbed by the surrounding buildings, meaning it's harder to hear a street over. I took shots less than 100 meters from adjacent units and they had no idea
2. It heats the weapon up much quicker. Fine for most contacts, but in a break contact it could cook your gun after 2 or 3 mags pretty nicely
3. It makes a big difference when firing inside a building, especially through loop holes, masking the noise to the target as well as reducing the blast to the shooter
Those are good points, thanks for sharing.
How was the Gemtech HALO as far as ruggedness goes?
@@makevelicustoms
It had a pretty cool lock up. Worked straight onto the standard bird cage flash hider. We used them for a few years and they never wore out. We even used it on the SAW whenever we carried it for security. It got hot really quick, so you had to be careful with full auto. There are better cans now, as that was back in 2005-2008.
did you mean "eliminates echo"?
@@smalltowncop4907
Yeah, thanks. Autocorrect
I want to get a can but the cost and wait vs. how often and how far i can run my rifles is a losing battle. Just doesnt make sense financially for me. Great video and lots of solid info and graphics.
Side note: i lost my 9 year old greyhound to a violent dog attack recently. Added OC spray to my pockets now. The Nova footage is soothing and don't forget to hug her daily just in case.
dog has been hugged. Sorry for you loss :(
A can is really one of those things that will eventually prove its worth over time.
If you aren't sure which one is worth the dive, I highly recommend keeping an eye on the PewScience rankings for sound before evaluating weight, length and cost for your use case.
Crushed me to hear about your doggo. Ours are like kids to us and every time we lose one I wonder how I'll ever let go.
You can usually get the YHM 556 cans on silencer shop with a “free tax stamp” when they have sales. About 550 out the door. Sure you have to wait a bit but it doesn’t have to be mega expensive and burdensome. It’s worth getting.
Sorry about your pup dude.
You can get an Otter Creek Labs Polonium for ~$500, and the wait goes by fairly quickly if you don’t keep checking every day. (I just got a Form 4 back in 167 days). It’s worth it in the long run
Sound suppressor use also greatly helps team communication. Its a lot easier to talk to team members when you aren't deafened by gunshots.
Ammo is very important to apply to all of this. There are a lot of 77 grain rounds that have much less flash and will change the way many of these setups behave.
ammo with flash suppressant is what you want, and that's what we used for testing.
Ikr that aac 77 grain
@@kentanyamartin8313 AAC uses the SMK, right? I haven't tried AAC's, yet, but IMI Razorcore uses the same bullet, and it works great in 1:7 rifles.
EDIT: And there are many other offerings with that bullet, too. In my experience, the more expensive offerings make slightly smaller holes, but the cheaper ones I've tried are still excellent.
You are one of the only RUclipsrs I will generally stop whatever I’m doing to watch your upload. It’s always thought provoking and it’s clear you critically think about the topic. While I’d love more vids from you, if it’s ever at the cost of quality, please don’t change.
Another part of visual signature is dust during daylight hours. Pretty much all silencers dramatically reduce the dust kicked up in prone vs flash hiders, comps, and brakes.
Good point.
Hey, I know it has been a while since I have said it, but I love you.
On the flip side, dust/smoke reflecting off your own IR or white light will obscure your target. Not as big a deal if your moving but at Midnight Brutality you could see the obvious advantage for those who ran suppressors
"Electron soup and its consequences"🤣😂🤣😂🤣😂
"Have been a disaster for suppressorkind"
Props for discussing the glowing popsicle, while it may be far-from the here&now for this to impact a civilian. It's a clear and overlooked drawback outside of military uses.
How much would prices tank if suppressors became over-the-counter like they are across the pond? Do you think they'd become lower quality, borderline consumables like Hop alluded to in his Puppy Dog video?
I think we would certainly have those types of suppressors. The hearing safe act birthed a bunch of companies aiming to do exactly that.
But I we'd still have current high end suppressors as well.
I've worked on/with a number of suppressed designs, the thing in design meetings, is we can make really really good suppressors, but they aren't as durable, or won't last as long as another design. Or they require precision alignment to fit a tight bore, etc etc. Even then, the margins on suppressors is huge. except maybe for the 3d printed cans, anything conventionally machined is going to be fairly inexpensive to produce unless it's made out of space age unubtainium alloys. It's pretty easy to have a swissturn machine making 316 stainless baffles all day.
If we don’t have to wait any longer, I’m sure people would buy the high quality ones enough to lower the price on them in general. Scales of economy make things cheaper, but demand also makes price go up if supply is limited, especially if they can’t keep up with it. 🤷♂️
"Do you think they'd become lower quality, borderline consumables" PSA, BCA, Aero, and Anderson enters the chat...
@@railfanningpoints2.045 FWIW aero already makes a suppressor....and its fairly decent....
So many people told me the RC2 was a bad can. I still bought one for clone purposes and realized it’s actually lovely. It sounds great, it works well, and I haven’t carbon locked it yet, in part because I just keep it clean.
Embrace the RC2
People who say the RC2 sucks have never shot with one and likely are trying to make themselves feel better about their poor choice of can.
That being said, there are cans that perform better in different metrics at a much more reasonable price.
Those people were probably only considering decibel numbers and none of the other factors that the RC2 excels in. Some just smoked too much copium
gas leaking from the mount makes for a great can, sure.
I own several cans but still do not own an RC2 for various reasons. But anyone that says it's a bad can is braindead lol.
Bad? No. Overpriced? Yup, but that’s because of government contracts.
Cans are cool. Having shot them in the military and out...I have mixed feelings. And by that I mean I feel that they are a little bit overrated and that people overestimate what they actually do for you. That being said I feel that the pros of running them outweigh the few cons that exist. So hell yeah, run em. But seriously, don't feel like you'll die if you dont or that you'll magically become become a tier one guy if you do.
Our perception of suppressor relative noise level is greatly affected by the frequency tone of the suppressor. We perceive low frequency sounds as quieter, even if they are not. A good example was a 45 cal SMG that had a nice, low frequency report sounded quieter than a 9mm SMG that metered 10dB quieter. That is a big difference.
that's only true if your definition of "quieter" is peak sound pressure, which is a dumb definition. lower frequency sounds in fact will impart less stress and hearing loss on the cochlea than high frequency sounds of a lower dB. they are therefore in fact quieter if the definition of quiet is practical and sensible and not a ridiculous pedantic standard of what a meter can detect
@@Wilfmott The only problem with the introduction of frequency into the definition of "quieter" is that it is highly subjective. Two people will not perceive the same noise the same way. The sound meter is not subjective, which is why we use it.
@@ExpatriotSilencersthere are very well defined “equal loudness” curves that map people’s perception across the frequency spectrum. You aren’t the special snowflake you think you are
bought your patch. not *only* because it's awesome (it is, i legit like the design} but because it's how i can support you. You bring clarity, honesty, purpose, focus, and thoroughness to the gun community. I chose those adjectives to specifically describe my perspective on your content. Thank you. Please keep it up . . . not because this content entertains me . . . but because this content informs US.
hello brock i am watching this while i poop
Awesome freakin video! Great to see the audible and visual effects down range, something hardly anyone thinks of or shows.
Suppressors are for home defense as well. Imagine something goes bump in the night. Next a window smashes, it's real bad guys are coming in. You grab your 556 unsuppressed 11.5 and fire it inside versus firing a suppressed 11.5 556 inside. One you might get some hearing damage the other you might not ever hear again. Suppressors while not hearing safe, certainly better than nothing and certainly will take the edge off in a home defense fight.
These days, despite that more jurisdictions have favorable use-of-force self-defense laws such as the castle doctrine (no duty to retreat in one's home or property), that anti-gun lib district attorney will still politically prosecute you for woke reasons.
You're not going to go permanently deaf from shooting a gun indoors once, there's plenty of legitimate pros to using a suppressor without resorting to blatant nonsense that a hundred million people can tell you from personal experience is just plain wrong. I've shot tons of guns without ear pro including up to .308 indoors and I have excellent hearing according to my yearly OSHA tests, I don't think my grandpa had literally ever worn hearing protection shooting even when taking CCW classes at crowded indoor ranges, and there's a ton of videos of FPSRussia shooting machine guns and blowing up cars with no ear plugs including a 3000 round belt dump from a minigun.
I don't choose to use a suppressor for home defense because it adds a bunch of length to the gun and hassle just to get in the first place, I wish I could get one in ten minutes at a gun shop but I'm not too broken up about not having one for home defense and neither should anyone else be because they're not going to need to learn sign language if they don't have one. Silencers were invented by the son of the guy who invented the machine gun because he went deaf after firing hundreds of thousands of rounds to showcase his cool new gun, that's not a realistic scenario for someone defending themselves who statistically will only ever fire two rounds if any at all.
I can personally confirm that you won't go deaf from firing a rifle indoors without hearing pro (based on experience, I'm not a doctor, so maybe "probably won't go deaf" since I've never even heard of such a thing). Now I do have some pretty epic tinnitus...
For the (potential) future video about suppressor covers: One option to look at is a carbon fiber cover. While hella expensive, and I think only made by one company, seems to me that would be the best option. They have models that mount to the rail or to the suppressor, and it allows air flow for the can while still shielding against both visual and heat.
Also, since shot show is coming up, check out the Senex Arms guy and his prototype AR(-ish) bullpup in the works if you can. Just watched Hop's video about the bullpups (again) and made me think of it.
my issues is all conversion dont work for lefties.
@@BrassFacts
Convert a BCA LH upper
@@BrassFacts Ah, that's fair. Hadn't even thought of that, my b
@@BrassFactsSenex is not a conversion, but it uses a standard AR 15 barrel, gas system, bolt and modified trigger group.
I have one. Its pretty neat. :)
Thanks for doing the audio right and not having music on pure audio segments like so many others do.
Also a point about suppressor flash signatures. The design of the end cap matters a lot. In my experience it is the most important thing. A flash suppression element at the end can mitigate all flash even on a normally "fireball" can.
Correct. There are a couple of different means to eliminate flash from a suppressor.
Your theory about combustion being mostly IR centric is certainly correct. Exact amount depends on the temperature of the combustion, but you can look at blackbody emission curves and compare the integrated power over the human visual spectrum and see how that compares to the sensitive region of your NODs
Suppressors glow pretty good in nods after a couple of shots, too
They are a freakin beacon through my thermals.
@@blackhawk7r221that's what suppressor wraps are for, not to mention keeping one from getting burned.
One of the most informative videos I have seen on the real world application of these devices.
One of the most informative videos I've seen. Answered many questions I've had. Thanks .
Love the videos Brass!… hope to see ya at the Show man!
Showing the waveforms and having them marked by barrel length and suppressor model on your timeline makes this one of the best videos are suppressor sound signature out there.
Also because there was footage of you listen to Halo music with the boys. :)
Fantastic video. Thanks to u and the team. Very much appreciated
I’m a PewScience Nerd and reference it for all of my purchases and then cross reference it with mounting,length, weight flash suppression etc. my most recent purchase was the new CAT WB QD in Inconel and the CAT ODB QD Ti. The Inconel WB is 0.8in shorter then an RC2, is at muzzle and flash suppresssion levels of of the RC2, backpressure/shooter’s ear level of suppression equivalent to the FLOW762 and Velos LBP. It will be replacing my CGS SCI SIX on my main squeeze 12.5 mid gas, and my SCI Six will go on my backup 11.5 LPVO Setup. I got the Ti ODB to go on a 8in 300BLK build and my 20in 6.5cm AR10.
Damn good video! You made some really good points about using a suppressor that I never really considered. Thanks for the valuable information.
Im so glad I found your channeland Hop. I am still very new to firearms, and you provide real experience and feedback from the items you use. I cannot have a lot of these nice things, but you provide so much insight for us laymen. Thank you! Definitely will be on SubscribeStar
This is Brass Facts. Hop has his own channel. They also have Nova Group channel (Nova is the name of Brock’s (BF) dog. Hop’s cat is Socko.
You’ve got a ton of binging to do. Enjoy!
@@williamflowers9435 thanks! I appreciate it. Thanks you for the additional cat lore!
Also noteworthy is the distance in milliseconds between the sonic boom of a bullet passing an object versus the muzzle report so as to determine the distance between the rifle and the first sonic boom location.
Thanks for the honest discussion!!!
Love the long form content!
Great video! I learned a lot, thank you keep making them
A lot of good info in here!
Shout out to John!
thank you for acknowledging the suppressor use with supers
Have a Surefire SB2 and AEM5 for my 5.56 rifles and Sandmans for my 30 cals and 6mm. Cans optimized for the cartridge fired significantly reduces the flash signature, but using universal or larger bore for smaller bullet cans will produce fireballs. 5.56 SBR's will always have a lot of flash. I've yet to shoot my SB2 at night, but on my 14.5 Geissele SD it is extremely pleasant to shoot even without ears. The AEM5 is the best, but optimized for longer barrels. The reversion chamber over the barrel plays a major part in reducing the fireball as well as the minimized bore on the front of the suppressor, but the downside is mounting it and needing absolutely perfect bore alignment. Ask me how I know.
I'm currently at the point of indecisive craze when it comes to suppressors. I've been trying to pick one for purchase for almost 6 months now but some kind of information or contradicting statement will come out about this or that...
Currently price isn't really a deterring factor but I'd like to pair a good, long lasting suppressor for my 16.1" LWRC IC DI for the majority of the suppressors use but would also like to use it on my 12.5" SOLGW. What would you recommend best for my situation? I almost decided upon a 5.56 surefire suppressor but then a buddy of mine said I should only stick to flow through suppressors only. Since sound mitigation between most major suppressor options is harder to distinguish I would like to keep flash down as much as possible.
@@TerminalM193 honestly bro, you need to choose what's most important to you, sound reduction or signature mitigation, or back pressure. Once you have your priorities, making a decision will be much easier.
@@USpatriot741776 I guess my answer would be one of the flow through suppressors since it helps with recoil, less gas to the face. Technology seems to be advancing yearly.
Glad I bought my 2 cans so far. Especially the one on my 300 blackout
This is why my "fighting" rifles are 1. short blackout w omega 300, 220gr. 2. 24" ar308 w 25x, 177gr and the same omega 300. Most effective use of suppresion for the equipment and usage. The blackout is solid and whisper quiet only good to ~100 yards so the 308 with can isnt quiet up close but at a couple hundred yards it would be nearly impossible to locate where its coming from. Effective.
I love my Velos LBP. Low gas, decent recoil reduction, near hearing safe when outside on 16 in barrel or longer, and the flash reduction at our last night match was impressive. I didn't check it for heat glow though. For a low back pressure can that can be mounted to other muzzle devices, it can't be beat right now.
Keep the info coming! Love the vids.
You are correct on night vision picking up the report due to combustion/heat seen in the gas exiting the barrel-night vision devices like yours can detect low into the IR spectrum, hence the higher report under NVGs.
For the cleaning issue, I swapped to Cherry Balmz and haven’t had any of the “dry bolt” issues. Highly recommend.
Is that guy actually back to shipping out orders, unlike the last couple of years? I still hesitate to use that website for fear of just pissing money on something that will never arrive.
Buddy bought and shipped a few weeks ago. Good to go. Product really helped my reliability. @@ericmckinley7985
“Nice fireballs, Jackass”
That made me spit ma beer!
😂
Always good content. I'm happy with the performance of my Sandman L and my RC2. I use my Sandman L on 30 Cal's (and have a 556 end cap if I stray), with the 300BO Subs, it is amazingly quiet.
Excellent. Lots of food for thought here!
I'm really excited about additive manufacturing with advanced plastics and polymers. Ivan made a video explaining the basic thermodynamics of plastics and why they don't melt into goo like people think they would. Also, I'm sure Griffin would love to get you some cans. Even if you're not an 07. They may be able to help! My HRT 556 is phenomenal for flash. From what I hear, they have some cool stuff in the works.
4:33 I appreciate the graphic utilizing the army men figurines.
This channel needs more subs ✊🏾
THANKS! You are appreciated HOMIE!
I always find your videos to be very calming. You mind putting up a spotify playlist with some of the songs you’re using in your videos?
I like how you brought in the audio files to analyze
Would be cool to see a flash comparison with flash hiders with the same methodology as these tests, since most of the stuff online is up close, perpendicular to the muzzle etc.
I’ve dabbled into this a bit, and can give a meh quality answer. I tested using nods and slow mo IPhone camera at a 90° offset of the muzzle at 5 feet. All were on 14.5s except the CTN Keymo A1
Direct thread suppressors were outshined by A1 birdcages(didn’t have a milspec A2), the keymo/polonium with a 3P, FCD A2 and CTN A1L flash hider was less flashy. Same with the 3P and surefire RC2. The RC2 mini was actually worse but it was the oldest cam with caked on carbon so I’m unsure about its accuracy, same think with the YHM 5.56 can(I forget the model)
Its not perfect but KitBadger has some flash tests. He got a bunch of people from classes to shoot their setup in the fadeling/faded light, pretty enlightening no pun intended.
This video was fire🎉 great work!
I buy cans that take dead key mo. Its what all my rifles have for muzzle devices and I think they work great. I don't do mag dumps though mostly just shooting prone. Works for me and I enjoy them and keeping my hearing while still enjoying my hobby. Nomad L is stupid quiet on a lot of guns. If your barrel is 16in or under, nothing will make a huge difference. Just my experience.
As a Marine Corps Veteran, if you want to look authentic, wear your uniform “get up” all the time. 5 mile forced march, little run along the beach in San Diego, bout a year in Pendleton and a couple few years in the sand box. Then your camis’s in my opinion would look cool.
MP5SD, old school I know, is a unique weapon in that you use super sonic and the weapon is designed to scrub the speed off the projectile thereby reducing the speed to subsonic which make it decently quiet. I can also attest that a large can reduces flash and sound by quite a bit. I fired a Remington 700 in 5.56 modded by LaFrance with a super long can that was both threaded at the front of the muzzle and well down the barrel which helped to reduce the overall length of the rifle with suppressor, when shooting non-subsonic you could hear the mechanics on trigger squeeze and you'd only hear the projectile as it was headed down range, basically it only sounded like a supersonic air rifle.
Something that is grossly misunderstood in the suppressor realm is also that 3db+ is DOUBLE THE SOUND PRESSURE. So 97db to 100db is double the SPL. it's approximately every 10 db with no change in distance from sound source that the perceived volume doubles. But SPL kills hearing, so saying every 3db increase is twice as loud is true in the sense of hearing loss potential!
I only have one right now. I went the utilitarian route of a 30cal so I could swap it between 90% of my rifles. Even though it's oversized for my 556 guns, it does a pretty good job suppressing them, and my 300blk is stoobid quiet. I have no idea how well it does under nv because well, I don't have any, nor do I have any local places where I'm even allowed to shoot after dark.
I'm considering picking up a 9mm can sometime this year; I'd like to have something for my subgun and carry guns.
Honestly though, the suppressor market is mostly fluff marketing based on a couple factors that realistically are so minimally different it doesn't matter which ones you choose. There are a few standouts that really min max to do something special, but most suppressors do a pretty decent job at pretty much everything.
Thanks. I learned a useful bit of info in from this one.
Primordial Florida is a hilariously accurate description of the first time I cleaned my non-piston AR post-honeymoon range trip with my can.
This was an amazingly informative video
From what an old SF veteran told me when I was in the Cav, suppressors reduce muzzle flash and report enough that it makes it harder for the enemy to pinpoint your location past 300yds using standard ammo. And for anything within 200yds you need to use subsonic ammo. Keep in mind that the standard firefights the grunts ran into were at ranges of 300yds or more.
Midnight Brutality also demonstrated the value of a suppressor when shooting at night, with or without nods and with white light.
you know its a week when brass facts uploads
another great vid, mainn reason I purchased my can was to reduce recoil, yes I know that .223/5.56 and 5.45 have little recoil HOWEVER after spending years shooting 1500-2000 rounds of rifle and pistol ammo monthly, I developed carpal tunnel and cubictle tunnel. I had surgery so every bit helps. What also affects tone of suppressor is DI vs piston. My supressed DI Stag Arms AR has a higher pitch compared to when I suppress my PWS piston AR and 5.45 ak105. Yet my supressed DI Stag has less felt recoil compared to the suppressed piston guns. I run the flow 556k.
"1500-2000 rounds of rifle and pistol ammo monthly" Uh huh, sure you did. How much was your yearly ammo cost for the 18,000 rounds of ammo you claimed to shoot?
@@railfanningpoints2.045You're aware that some of us can afford that, right?
@@railfanningpoints2.045 Which discipline does he compete in? How often? Is he sponsored?
@jhutch1470 Few people shoot as much as they claim on the internet
@@railfanningpoints2.045 my Chase Sapphire Preferred Credit card and 4 days a week shooting and 2 club memberships. 5.45x39 was easy to stockpile and shoot years ago. Tula and SGT Major was far cheaper too. None if ky guns are safe queens. I’m on ky second Radian Afterburner and Ramjet due to wearing off the finish on my Glock.
There really isn’t any downsides of using a suppressor though. Sure it adds weight but like… workout. You shouldn’t only be good at shooting, fitness is important.
It’s easier on your ears shooting suppressed, makes communication with teammates easier, masks your signature more, the list goes on.
I'm at 13 months waiting for the release of my suppressor.
It took half this time to get my TS/SCI, which I've held for over 20 years.
As a non-vet civilian multi suppressor owner some things not addressed in the video: First the likelihood of using your suppressor in a combat scenario is virtually non existent and hopefully even less than that. So really the combat effectiveness and benefits are not really a driver for evaluating a purchase. (Not saying don't be prepared, just being real). Secondly for those that really only have the ability to shoot at public ranges a suppressor is basically useless. What is the point of shooting suppressed when everyone around you is not? Thirdly if you are able to shoot on non-public ranges suppressors are a HUGE benefit. Friends/family etc not on the shooting line can congregate and socialize without needed to constantly wear hearing protection. This makes such outings FAR more enjoyable for those going with you and makes for non shooting females to be far more inclined to agree to this type of event far more often. It's a win win. And for this reply lastly, suppressors make hunting outings far more enjoyable for those that stalk rather than target shoot deer from a stand. While stalking you can communicate without the need to carry/wear ear/comms headgear and the like. And a point about heat signature and seeing a suppressor with NV. That's great and all, but when you finally switch to THERMAL it is no longer about the suppressor showing, but YOU and your GUN and everything else giving off heat. Thermal sees this DAY & night. The BEST point made in the video comes at the end: "Just Buy One". Once you go suppressed you don't go back.
Garand Thumb made a quite long video on "being shot". Quite interesting and adds a different perspective
Have a flow 556k on my 16in rifle. With trijicon TR24. Love it
My flow 556k is on my 13.9 “go to gun” rio cord rail, MAWL, TA02/MPS combo, ariska light with clicky tail cap. Damn it’s sweet.
I have been able to shoot a SBR with 2 different uppers and the same suppressor. A 8in 300blk, and a 11.5in 5.56 with a silencerco omega 300. My experience, both were surprisingly quiet. The suppressor is longer than I would personally want. and it fouls the guns insanely quickly to an unreasonable level. I would like to get a suppressor and sbr some day. It will be some kind of flow through or reduced back pressure system, as i want to reduce the excessive fouling as much as possible.
As a general rule, a bad suppressor is better than no suppressor. Just get a suppressor. Fuck the NFA
If you are running supers through A suppressor A long barrel will meter (present) quieter. Run the suppressor on A 20 inch barrel and burn off more gas.
I’m going to have to get one soon, do a lot of hunting up here in AK and my ears have payed the price, actually building a 6 ARC for coyote/wolf/deer and plan on running a direct thread can on it
I’ve lived in Vegas for a decade and never been to SHOT show. Definitely on my bucket list.
My last one took the ATF 14 months then the ffl didn't call me for another 4 months when the stamp was delivered to them. Never again. I'm done with the NFA. 👎👎👎
25:50 #1 reason for the forward assist imo.
One thing ive been trying to figure out. Is it better to put a full size can on an 11.5 or put a K can on an 18 inch? Or is it the only winning combo a full size rifle with a non k can?
Something for people who intend to build an AR for suppressor use as in leave the can mounted on that rifle, forever, should consider IMO. Is ordering a barrel WITHOUT a gas port drilled, then have a competent gun smith bore the gas port UNDER sized.
Just my two cents, it’s. It hard to increase an undersized gas ports size, hard to make it smaller though…. Though there is a couple companies who offer non adjustable solutions there where it’s effectively a captured bushing between the gas port and gas block that restricts the gas ports diameter. Just thought I’d put that out there as no one likes gas to the face.
Until you need to run it unsuppressed, now you might have to deal with short stroking.
The main issue using one value to report suppressor performance such as dB is like @brassFacts said the human perceived audibility of the muzzle report is very dependant on the frequnecy content produced by the suppressor. Human hearing follows a dBA curve where the human ear is much less sensitive to low frequency compared to midrange frequncies. Also perceived loudness at the shooter and positions around the shooter are highly dependent on the geometry of the can muzzle causing variation in the directionality of the sound propagation. Also as you pointed out the sound drops off much quicker when further from the shooter compared to near the shooter. This is due to being in the far field vs the near field of the acoustic source. In the far field the sound level drops by 6 dB every doubling of distance. In the near field this is usally closer to 3 dB. If you ever plan to do a future video simular to this there are pretty simple apps and or software to analyze the frequncy content of the audio recording. It would be interesting to see if there was a correlation to your preceived loudness to the tonal content.
Literally just got my sandman s out of atf prison two days ago after waiting for 7 months.. what a well timed video
for flash recording use camera mode on phone for fast movement - ergo it will record 120 240 some even more than 300 frames per second basicaly "slow motion"
thanks alot for this amazing video. I got a question regarding NV glow. if you put a very good cover on the can, like a libertys defense straightjacket for example, will the cover itself start glowing after 3-4 mags or is this only the case with the can itself because it's made out of metal?
it will hide it 100% Or at least enough to not matter.
But you run into issues where the shroud keeps the can hot, and begins to melt and such. A issue when these things cost 100 bucks per. I keep one on hand for exactly that but I don't typically run it. More of a emergency thing
16:51 where would you rank the surefire rc300 mini on this, and would some flash hiding shortcomings be mitigated by using a piece of cloth over the muzzle and secured to a suppressor cover?
When Paul Harrell says he has a speech impediment: you know he's just being polite and asking you to excuse his minor mistakes and Shatner-esque... pauses.
When Brass Facts says he has a speech impediment: you're just shocked when he says "impediment" correctly.
lmao love your vids man jk
Ik the video was getting long but I think you should have covered can covers (pun intended), how much do they alleviate visual signature/what does a hot can with a cover look like under NV? do you think the signature reduction, burn protection, and mirage reduction are worth the weight at the end of your barrel? Goob Video regardless thanks for your efforts :3
I have a YHM Turbo T3 that's been in ATF limbo since the start of december. It's my first NFA item and I'm ballin' on a budget so cost was a major overriding factor in my choice.
Good vid as always
I think I’m arriving at the wrong conclusion from this, but given all you’ve said is a suppressor even worth considering before owning NV, LAM, ammo, preps, etc.? It seems like the advantage of having a suppressor relative to the cost and wait time is marginal at best compared to a plethora of other things that money could be spent on. I’m only asking this with the hope of being educated. This isn’t a topic that I’m experienced in. Thanks for all the hard work!
NV should be way the fuck behind in priority
People will tell you it's a must have and that anything less is like being blind but won't tell you that you DO key your IR illum ALL THE TIME for contrast or that they literally stick IR strobes on themselves because even at 50m distinguishing a target painted white and your buddy in a grey hoodie without active illum is impossible
Get SURVIVAL SKILLS. Learn how to set a broken bone using both an ACE and improvised slings/splints. Know all your knots and have good cordage. Learn how to sew and have a kit. Learn how to read a map or communicate in morse code. Learn the basics of electrical work or carpentry.
Spending $5000+ total (NV, helmet, the $550 mount, J arm, LAM, etc) on something that literally dies in the daylight when you can't read a topographical map or have 1 yr of food and water is retarded
it entirely depends what your objective is.
Between the two (NV vs Suppressor)
In the context of fighting other dudes with rifles. NV wins by a massive margin, it's not even close.
For mostly everything else, the suppressor is very nice.
@@DD-hz3tsNODs and survival skills are not competing priorities...
@@IronFish87 opportunity cost exists.
If your budget is so low that you are setting aside $100 every week to eventually buy NODs, you aren't buying $100 of canned food every week
If you make over $40k/yr and have no dependents then sure you can just deep dive into it. But it is stupid to pretend a $5000+ total buy in isn't inhibiting other purchases, and $5000 goes way farther in almost every other prep including skill building
You can literally get paramedic certified for that amount and many people buy used cars for that amount
Etc
Flash suppression is the first attribute I look for for any can going on a battle rifle. Sound suppression is usually #3. Am I doing it right coach?
pay tax stamp get on registry list = doing it right ....think of all the up votes
@officecomputer8887 imagine thinking the 4473s you fill out aren't being filed by the feds...
Thanks for all this.
Key hole shooting is a big factor. That’s why in urban settings shooting from the back of a room out a window, cuts down the signature quite a bit, especially if the interior doors are open. You have a physical barrier, as well as a lot of volume to encapsulate the sound. This is what I’ve seen in documentaries about sniper schools, I am by no means an expert or cool guy.
556 flight noise is approx 155 dB 10 feet from the flight path. I sound tested this effect with Alan Paulson
Gonna add this to the list of super underrated brass facts videos!
I recently ordered a few cans. I wanted the Huxwrx Ventum 762, guy at Silencer Central steered me into the Banish gold 30. Of course he did I thought, because it’s their house brand. However, I wanted the Banish .45, and he steered me into the Rugged Obsidian.45. I wanted the B&T for the APC10, and I’m waiting for B&T USA to get some in later this month. I’m trying to mitigate some sound, not go full stealth. I’m looking for some personal experience on the FN9-Ti, before I pick one up for some experimental fun with my 509. No matter how you slice it, suppressed fire is better than unsuppressed fire, in almost every scenario. Now, how much in comparison to the additional length of your weapon system is a variable that is subjective. For me, I’m keeping one on an FNX45 for home defense. I’m bringing one in the bag with the APC10, and I’ll take one along with the DD5v3 for range use and in the event of things having gone to crap.
Great video. Would you ever consider doing a video about cold weather gear?
my cold weather gear is 50% good stuff, 50% me layering a shitload of normal clothes
Just want to mention how impressive the polonium’s are in their tone. Side by side 10.5”s sandman s and polonium k respectively everyone in the vicinity agreed the polonium sounded considerably less offensive. Very high pressure cans.
What are you thoughts on a 10/22 pistol with a suppressor? Mine is stupid quiet and reliable with bulk. Even better when i use the good stuff.
Does the lightsaber glow effect under NV of the Flow 556k give you enough pause to not buy again? That can is probably top of my list right now.
no. But it does mean I probably won't buy a second one. I want my other rifle to have a large double walled can
I really like the technical approach to this study, but there's something that could be done to make it a little better.
First, a microphone that can handle high SPL (150dB or something) would be a plus, so you wouldn't have to sacrifice the weakest sounds to avoid clipping. However, this kind of equipment isn't cheap, I can only remember DPA 4062 which is $500 when new (but a used one is perfectly fine for this task).
Second, instead of the sound level graph, it would look a little more informative with both sound level and spectrogram. Audacity (freeware) has an option like that. Sonic Visualiser is a little more capable. The reason for this is that on a spectrogram, you can recognize even a scaled-down sound peak as an echo by its spectral signature just visually, so it's easier to distinguish between the different (original) sources of sound.
....an SM58 is $90
Zoom F3 is $200
@@DD-hz3ts that is curious, I haven't used that one so had no idea that it works that high even not being advertised for high SPL.
@@sciloj dynamic range has always been rated hilariously high but until 32 bit float we were physically incapable of picking up all its data
With the zoom F3 you can pick up things from 20 METERS away
On a mic normally used less than 20 cm lol
That clip of hop had me dying