Federal Shorty 00 buck and #4 buck. Shockwave. Clear Ballistics Gelatin.
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- Опубликовано: 28 авг 2022
- Testing the terminal ballistic and pattern performance of the Federal Shorty 12 gauge ammunition number 4 buckshot and 00 buckshot offerings using man sized silhouette targets and clear ballistics gel.
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Excellent job. Proves that the combination of the Shockwave and Shorty shells is a capable home defense combination.
That's what I'm going to use!
@@god-gunsmerica9043 Excellent choice!
#4 is perfectly capable. It’ll generally stop in the exit side hide of a deer from a broad side shot. It’ll most definitely reach vitals in a soft squishy brittle human lol
This man is firearms content king. Literally comes up with defensive shotgun content as I'm thinking of it. Been debating 4 buck vs short shells from a shockwave for a minute. Bravo sir.
4 buck is it for me.
What is the attachment on the side of the pump?
@@soonerfrac4611 The recoil strap that he puts his hand in? He sells it on his website, they’re like $35 or something. Demonstrated Concepts
High winds, subwoofer is not trying to topple my house. Someone did some EQ on the audio! NICE!
Thanks. Trying. Our winds are… aggressive.
"What we got here is a gel block dressed in a Canadian tuxedo." Good stuff.
If you're "blown away" by their performance, you're holding the gun BACKWARDS!!!
That was pretty awesome. I've wanted to try the cheek shotgun for some time now, and that #4 buck might have just tipped me over the edge. If only federal used the copper plated shot in the 00 buck. It would also be pretty cool if they went with #1 buck instead of the #4 and get something like 9 pellets in a load.
The 00buck load is absolutely perfect for most IF they give it regular solid plated shot.
Federal just released some #1 buck for hunting, I believe they're 16 pellets in a shell. I'm interested in getting them for home defense to get the best of both worlds in terms of power and not over penetration.
This is exactly the testing people need to do. Every gun is different. Well done.
My shockwave is threaded for chokes. I've only tested one type at 70' due to availability but so far so good. But mine isn't for home defense.
Your shockwave came from the factory threaded for chokes? Or did you have that done by a custom shop? Is it the 14” barreled shockwave?
Outstanding as always. Thank you!
This is the exact video review I was wanting. Thank you for this!!!
This is another great vid I dont miss anything you put out please keep sending out common sense vids its refreshing in a time of tactical ninjas every place you look on youtube
I love how genuinely excited you are haha!
I truly hope Federal makes #1 buck.
A fantastic round.
Thank you for your tests and discussion.
I have the 18.5 inch barrel shockwave. I shoot standard 00 Buck, 2.5 inch...and find the recoil to be minimal. This is one of the main reasons I chose the 18.5 inch over the more popular 14 inch featured in this video. I feel that with the 18.5 inch barrel, I don't compromise on maneuverability or penetration. I enjoyed your video.
Your the first U tuber that I've seen that made a vid about these, I was impressed for a house load or a truck gun load, thx for the vid P.S. I just subbed you after reading some of the other comments, thx
hi, love love love your video great information really thanks for sharing
Thanks Good video and great products
Educational as always, thanks!
Fantastic thank you
What a great video on this
thanks for sharing.
Another cool thing about the 590S is that it can load/feed/cycle any combination of shell sizes you put into it :) if you're into that sort of thing.
Teaching my grandkids shooting. When it came to shotgun, the 20 gauge did not go over well. Switched to a Keltec KS7 with the mini shells. The 12 gauge was very popular. Used birdshot, buckshot, and slug.
great test. I have considered shorties even in a full sized 590 just for some increased capacity. the FPS on the box of federal shells is similar to many 2&3/4" loads, and I figure out of a 20 inch barrel vs 14 they'll probably hit that minimum 12 inch penetration. problem is I never see them locally and don't feel obligated enough to switch away from 2&3/4 00 or #1 buck shells i've trained with and know how they pattern at my needed ranges.
Great video buddy, Federal needs to sponsor you, I just bought a case based on your video!!
Thank you! Excellent video!
actually kinda the video we have been looking for!
That pattern at 25yds is pretty impressive. Shoot that a few more times to see if you get the same result. The devastating effect of s shotgun is due to the number of rounds put on target. It is not necessarily about the location of the hits. As a civilian defense, one wants to stop an assault not kill, per se.
Great vid 👍😃✌️🇺🇸
That's excellent spread for that #4 buck
I wonder if the minimum 12” from the FBI is really as necessary with buckshot? They were testing performance of single shots to stop a fight. But your chest getting hit by 6-15 pellets, I would imagine even 8+ inches is more than enough. Of course I’m just speculating.
I think you are right, the entry alone is gonna disrupt pretty much everything going on inside you.
its more for big fat folks. there has been cases where larger people didnt have vital organs hit because the bullets get blocked by fat. think about it.. if someone has a 1 foot or larger belly, most of its fat and skin, some muscle, but vital organs are more then a foot tucked behind the gut. chest is harder to be that thick, but in the winter time, with lots of layers, and thick puffy winter coats.. you really do want 12-18 inches even with buckshot, in my opinion. really want to be sure you wont fail to stop them even in the worst case scenarios
I almost typed out the same comment! I agree penetration only matters when it’s a single projectile. Mangling a two inch area of flesh on someone’s chest and pellets in all the major organs would be the end.
Man is that a flying Goat t-shirt? It would be great if we had a local. I have had a nightstick for about 2 years now have been running the shorty shells with one of the adapters from Texas. Great to teach younger and weaker family members to shoot it. But alas I'm the only one that loves the little Mossberg.
This is what I’ve been thinking about too, glad you did all the testing! I might go with the side saddle laser but I like that strap you rigged on it.
Demonstratedconcepts.com for the strap
@@demonstratedconceptsllc4918 ahh cool didn’t know you had products too! Keep up the great work. Subscribed.
Damn, the mini X2’s are 3x the price of the #4B shorties!
Last I had purchased mini shells, federal had nothing but #8 available for months. I reluctantly stocked up in the Aguila #1B/#4B but I totally agree: they pattern like shit.
Anyway, glad to see the federal #4B is bountiful at the moments, I wouldn’t have thought to search if not for your video.
Super cool !
Aw, look at that cute little shotty. I'm liking what I'm seeing here. That'd be suitable for me and my wife. Maybe we can do a his 'n' hers set. I just need to raise some funds first...
I just bought some of the #4 buck to try out - perfect timing! I think if they just put the flight control wad on the 00 buck it would be perfect.
I think that wad may be too large for a short shell to have 6 pellets still.
for the al gore rhythm
Thanks for the video. I know a lot goes into any video. You had lots of good information without a lot of fluff. It kept me watching. Fluff without editing or bad editing just turns me off. I don't want to waste my time watching fluff. But this was not you. I just bought the Shockwave 590S and was looking for number 4 buck when this came up. Great video, keep up the good work.
Whoa..I’m done searching for my HD load..thanks
thanks!
I wonder how this would work around cars (doors & windows) + gel.
Might be something for patrol officers to have in the drivers door or on the person with a good carry/retention option.
It would be interesting to see what Federal could do if they loaded 00 or # 1 copper plated buck, grex buffer and the Flitecontrol wad in these shorties. Now if there was a simple mod to make Rem 870s run them. Blasting new Wrangle jeans is triggering.....
Fantastic testing, love the low recoil shells. How did you create/attach that little grip stud thing to the shotgun and is it for a more stable/vertical grip posture?
Good info
The local store has the mini shells from both Federal and Aguila, but only the birdshot...
*GROAN*
If Federal modified their flight control pellet control system to fit the shorty (and they made the pellets non-splitting), I would load nothing but shorty in my home defense shotgun. AND-I would probably add a couple mossberg shockwaves to my collection. As it stands, I like and use their shorty slugs but don't bother with the buck shot shells. I'm hoping others buy the shotshells. I'd hate to see Federal shelve the shorties, rather than tweek it a bit to get better performance, due to low sales.
Good luck finding these mini shells. I purchased my Mossberg shockwave 590 12 Gauge about a year ago and then purchased the Op Sol Flex Adapter, only to find I can't find Mini Shells anywhere..
I bought a case of the mini slugs not too long ago. You just gotta shop around online.
@@MegaAppleshit I ended up finding some at Outlaw Guns
I was sold until the gel test. Looks like I’ll be sticking with a 12ga shotgun for home defense instead of a 12ga firearm. Thanks for the great work!
Wrong takeaway. It’s the shells tested- not the barrel length. You see identical performance to the 18 and 20 inch barrels when the same loads are used.
If you don’t like this gel, stick to 00 buck
@@demonstratedconceptsllc4918 Fair point.
#1 buckshot seems to be perfect for self defense. Unfortunately I don't know of any mini shells that are made as such.
Solid content, have a 590s I recently purchased and bought your strap. What pic rail, sight, and light/rail do you have on your 590s?
The Fed 4 buck mini is a solid round, and still recoil manageable. We at OPSol Flex Adapter created the adapter specifically for low recoil users....wives and daughters. Many write about what is the best shotgun for home defense. It's not the shotgun, per se, but the user paired with the shell. Your (my) 12 year old daughter with a Mossberg, and adapter, and Aguila or Federal mini buck rounds is how you should look at the equation of "best". Home defense is a family affair.....you may very well be away.
Sure you can have a full power shotgun for you, but they need something too.
5:10 Sold! Wife and daughter approved!
love me some shorty shells
Thanks...needs to be a Semi-Auto designed specifically for Minishells...almost all places I've lived 11 yards seems the farthest Likely long shot used that distance in my Buckshot Size Selection video so I'm OK w #1 buck or the Aguilla Mixed #1/#4 minishell is tight enough for me w the #1s going deeper.
I’ve always loaded the Aguila 1B/4B in my shockwave, but this video convinced me to buy a bunch of federal’s #4B shorties.
The Aguila buck patterns unpredictably and their muzzle velocities are often significantly underpowered. True, for most common home distances all shot will probably hit target, but I’ll trade their 4 additional 1B’s (which may not actually penetrate deeper than federal’s 4B’s if they’re underpowered) for the the peace of mind of federal’s consistent patterning and penetration, plus 4 more pellets overall to boot.
It’s awesome to know that even if I had to stretch out to 20 yards, I could with federal’s 4B’s! That’s very impressive for a short buck load.
@@goodnessgraciousitellya5004 I'm thinking of getting one of the shorty shotguns for home defense. Do you know any minishell loads that are cheaper than Federal's that I could use for training? Or would you stick to the cheapest Federal shorties for training as well?
@@AzayBaeost will say to train with what you will use for defense. You at least want the recoil to be the same, so I see no harm in training with a similar load.
I'm looking forward to the semi-auto version of this soon!
Not from Mossberg. Their semi system is a little different. Maybe Remington would step up to the challenge and make a TAC-13 S???
@@DeathValleyWarthog Ideally beretta 1301... but yes the tac 13 s would be lovely
@@joeld008 If you want to go that route, I have something better: Benelli M3. Conversion shotgun.
It's windy as hell out there. That's a big factor
Great job.
The fact that you were shooting in a tornado may have affected your groupings.
Glad somebody finally put some of the Federal Shorty shells in gelatin. Bought 100 rounds after I saw this video.
Where did you find them? I haven't even been able to find them online. Thank you.
@@johnpalmer3411 Check Midway USA. They had the self defense 00 buck that was expensive, but the #4 buck and #7 buck was just $8 per box of 10.
@mini14jac yep that is where I got my number 4 buckshot, good price to
The Smartest Man in Colorado, America, and maybe the Planet Earth!
Guaranteed
I make wax slug shorties out of cheap birdshot rounds. They have excellent accuracy, and cycle perfectly in my 500.
Federal #4 buck in my cheap Stevens 320 fed well and tore the chest out of my targets. Might be good for home use in small houses
It may make an interesting video to compare the 3 ways to run minishells in a Mossberg under potential real-life conditions. How you are holding the gun (barrel/ejector port pointed down/up), how hard you are racking it (pistol grip racking is different from 3-point racking), and if you are running or crawling all impart forces on a minishell as it leaves the mag tube.
In short, how does the minishell solutions from the 590S, the OPSol Flex Adapter, and the Defender Tactical stack up against each other in simulated real home defense situations?
Obviously, if you already own one of these, you can test yourself. Like a poorly secured pistol holster flopping around, a minishell rattling around in the receiver as you are defending yourself is not desirable.
I've got some Winchester super x #4 that throws foot wide patterns from something like 5 yards. It's ridiculously impractical unless I want to demonstrate a video game analog.
Do you have a video on the grip modification? I'm talking about the finger rest that you are resting your middle and ring finger on. Not the strap. Thank you!
Great Video Sir, what hand stop are you using on the OEM fore-end?
Great video, Mini shells are not made for 25 yd shots. For home defense distances at about 25' they are perfect. I put them through half inch plywood at 20' they blow through with no problem.
If you find this impressive, you might try Federal 410 000 buck (specifically, there's nothing better) out of a governor. It's a 4 pellet 000 buck load with a flight control wad that groups very tight, even out to 25 yards. In gel they beat the 12 inches no problem.
That's a big might. Haven't checked in a while but 410 ammunition is hard to find, section is limited, and it's not cheap.
Just got my 590s shockwave and am super interested to know about your accessories (especially that little nob on the bottom of your rear grip).
Check out defender tactical
Premieres in 22 hours.Too long to wait.
Keep doing the Lord’s work Rhett!
Engineer tape measure tenth of an inch....... .5 = 6" more penetration, great video.
Thanks for the great video content! Love what you do! The biggest problem, though, seems to be the availability of those rounds. I have not been able to find those federal 00 buck rounds anywhere.
On a separate note, which optic are you running on your shockwave and what optic do you generally recommend on 12ga?
The Holosun 507c on a low mount and the PA SLX1x are my choices at the moment.
@@demonstratedconceptsllc4918Between the Holosun and the Primary Arms, do you have a favorite? I’ve always stuck with the bead sight, as I do a lot of trap shooting so I’m comfortable with bead sights. But now I want to upgrade to a good optic.
I am gearing up my Shockwave in preparation for your Bennett CO course in August. I already bought my ticket for the course and figure it’d be best to have an optic.
Love this concept. What are you using as a handstop?
I think its a flashlight, with the side GG&G mount from amazon
I use 00, slugs in this. I have no qualms with #4 0 from a 16" tube on a 590
What, if any, additional penetration/velocity do the 4B shorty shells get from a “full-size” 18.5” Mossberg 590s?
The pellets that split didn't penetrate as well.
They should make them in 2" and pack a bit more of punch and payload.
Good summertime load when bad guys are wearing less clothes !
Have you tried War Wolf short shells? They make several short shell loads you might like.
I’ve not found them available. Interested though
That is sweet. I shot my first shockwave the other day. They had a pistol grip and a brace on it. With the brace collapsed all the way it was rough. But with it extended all the way it was not hitting me in the face. It looks like these shorty shells maybe the way to go.
6 pellets 00 are 0.73 ounce.
15 pellets #4 buck is 0.7095 ounce.
#4 buck uses a tough wad like steel shot
Do you have a video that explains how you mounted the vertical piece extending from the bottom of the birdshead grip?
@TaoFledermaus ... does anyone know WHY the industry standard for 12ga shorty shells is 1 3/4" ? Why not 2" ?
Id like to see how that groups after Vang Comp backbored it!
Have you tested the defender tactical adapter for taking a normal shockwave and allowing it to use all 3 cartridge lengths?
Do they offer a Flite Control Wad in the mini shell?
Seems hard to get the short shells. Any idea where to get them?
I would have taken a marker and circled the first load. It is much better to follow and for the presentation.
I would like to see these loads tested w/a ballistic gel dummy
The gel dummies are great entertainment and fun targets to illustrate anatomical targeting.
They are not at all indicative of ballistic performance of any round.
i wanna see a magazine fed shorty shotgun SMG
If you are testing a "home defense" load at 25 yards, you either:
1) Have NO idea what you're doing.
2) Are wildly biased AGAINST short, home defense ammunition by asking waaay too much of it. or
3) You have a HUGE house to defend and should be using 3 1/2 inch magnum loads to keep your pattern tight enough in the shot sleeve, longer, to reach the other end of the house.
One can buy the cheapest shells out there and re-cast the lead to what size and cut down the shells to whatever size....something to do with the hands while watching TV.
Do you have any similar videos of proper gel tests done with the Aguila minshells? I've been looking everywhere and can't find any good ones. I'm ok with the spread on the Aguila minishells. I just want to see how far the #1 and #4 buckshot penetrates on those.
saying you’re ok with that spread is saying you are fine betting your family’s/neighbors’ lives on errant pellets not hitting them… or that you don’t care if they are hit.
This is why I haven’t bothered gel testing any other #4 buck loads or the aguilas. If I can’t guarantee I can keep ALL of my shot where I want it, I won’t use it.
@@demonstratedconceptsllc4918 Sir please don't make assumptions about my living situation or say that I don't care about my family members. I only have one other person living in my house and their bedroom is not in a direction that I'd be likely firing towards from the position of my bedroom doorway unless an intruder was in their room. That is unlikely however as they have an indoor bedroom lock just as I have on mine. If I heard them in a physical altercation with an intruder I would not grab any shotgun, but rather my short-barreled AR-15 pistol with a red dot.
Also in my own patterning on my Maverick 88 with a 18.5" barrel, while it does spread quite a bit, I've not had the shot spread quite as extreme as you experienced at 7 yards. In my house likely engagement distances would be more like 4 yards That being said, I actually prefer the larger spread as it means more of a chance that multiple critical organs will be hit. It also means that if my aim is not perfect under stress, that at least some of my shot will hit the target.
Currently there are absolutely ZERO good ballistic gel tests of the aguila minishells that show clearly the penetration. I only found one, but they didn't show a close up of the gel block and didn't measure the penetration. It looked to me like between 10 and 12" of penetration but I couldn't be sure.
Anyways... I was just wondering if you had any such videos. I'm not demanding you make any as I have no right to do so and I understand that gel blocks are expensive.
It would however be educational to show both the spread of Aguila buckshot on cardboard (showing why you hate it) as well as the penetration doing a proper FBI protocol gel test like you did with the Federal shorties.
That's all I'm saying. I know there's a lot of people like myself wondering the same thing.
@@wigon would be hilarious and interesting to send a barrel off to VangComp to specifically pattern with those shells.
Your reasoning on larger pattern giving greater hit probability is logical but neglects consideration that those large patterns give very little wiggle room for unexpected changes in distance or ‘hits’ slightly off center which throw errant shot- which would still be a concern for errant shot at 4yd out of the 20”, 18.5” 12” and 14” guns I’ve run them out of.
There’s still plenty of spread that happens inside the body when a tightly concentrated shot column hits a bad guy. One entrance, many exits, several inches apart. The bigger the bad guy, the greater the internal spread. The smaller the bad guy, the less likely you are to need said spread.
If you wanna tight group it depends what choke tube you’re using. You can test all you want the footage you want your patterns are going to very if you wanna tight group it’s what choke tube.⁉️
Anyone have a link for his raptor grip strap and stick underneath?
IDK if anyone else noticed, but the tape measure is showing tenths of feet, not inches in the beginning. I'm okay with that since I'm used to this kind of division, but he should made it very clear to the viewer. Later in the video he shows tenths of feet, then flips the tape around to feet and inches. Except for that, great content.
That was driving me nuts, too. So glad he flipped it.
Is that shotgun legal without some kind of special paper work, like for sn SBR?
Wouldn't the No.1 buck be best number of pellets/depth of penetration wise?
I've been loading 12 pellets of 1b in 2 1/4" shells. I believe you're right, it seems to be the best
#4B is my go-to minishell. Curious what a 10-11 pellet #1B minishell would do.
You’d only get about 6 in a mini. I’d much prefer it over 4
@@demonstratedconceptsllc4918should be more than 6. The 00 shorty shells have 6.
Dude, it’s not the “.22 of shotguns “, if anything it’s the.22 of 12ga ammo. Try a turkey load in your shockwave and hold it like you did with the shorty shells.
What's on the front of the firearm, on the left side? Is that a handguard? Flashlight?