I don't know who Biden's advisors are.. but having Biden doing 3 or 4 OTHER events THAT day, before this debate, is ridiculous & irresponsible for ANYONE!! Am I wrong? But is Ron Klain back in Biden's circle, advising him?? If he is, (after 'trash-talking' Biden) I'll be even more furious!!! I am so f-ing OVER the deflection of EVERYTHING tRump, is more than nauseating!!!! WTF!!!!!!
I agree, his team didn’t give him the rest and hydration and cough drop he needed. Never seen Biden like this. It’s too late now, but somebody is a saboteur in his team .
@gkniffen , unbelievable! I ASSUMED Biden would at least take a day of rest before that over-hyped, pointless, too late at night TV opp. Can't believe his people scheduled other stuff that day. How many of us can work all day and then do a major event at what is many people's bed time. I too felt so bad after the debate I couldn't sleep even though I normally go to bed around 9. Now I'm mad that Biden was done this way. Definitely won't change my support for him.
In December I will be 80 years old, my body is old my mind still works just fine. I have had occasion to tell my 53 yrs old daughter 'I'm old, I'm not stupid' don't discount Bidens' wisdom, the evil that is Trump et al is frightening.
Amen. You don't replace the good employee who got sick with the one you fired for his abysmal performance and trying to destroy your institution because he was angry that he got fired....(to use one analogy...there are numerous).
If Biden advisors had told us he was sick but refused to cancel, then have Biden tell us yes, he’s sick, not at his best, but loves American democracy more than life so he’s here, it would have changed the whole trajectory.
I don't know that we will ever hear the story of what happened behind the scenes, but the President ought to be able to make these common sense decisions himself - like don't do other events the day of a relatively late-night debate.
The election in France is being won in real time, by the far right's presently main platform, TIK-TOK. Actually, China is winning. Have always dreaded this 'Animal Farm' Orwellian dystopia manifesting. But here we are.
True, interspersed among the better interviews and speeches by Biden, and the many trial dates and revelations of Trump's near-limitless crimes, blatant lies, dwindling crowds, and his own lunacy, slurring, and sleeping in court. We have four more months of Trump's nonsense - more than enough to deter any independent or undecided from voting for him. Confused Joe can take a back seat in his second term, just like Bush Jr and Reagan's second term, while the administration arounds him continues to do good works. Whether it is a vote for the administration, or the lesser harm, the choice should be a simple one for any voter paying attention.
Obama was denied a Supreme Court appointment at the end of his term. Trump filled it. Then at the end of trump's term he was 'given' another appointment by Mitch Mcconnell. That was the problem.
I saw that President Biden also had 3 other events that day . That's a mistake they made as a team, surely, what was so important it couldn't have been rescheduled, since he wasn't feeling well..
Where did you see that? Do you think it was real/true or just some kind of made up excuse? Even if that was true it makes it look like Biden is just being rolled around from event to event and has no good judgement to say no? This makes me think of the last term of Reagan - which was not even as bad - and the negativity and anger that drew from the Democrats and affected his legacy and memory. Biden is much worse.
I've tried looking for that too and haven't found anything, let alone a source. It's possible they weren't public events. All I did find was that his staff tries to schedule things between 10am and 4pm when he's at his best. Obviously the state of the union was later than that and he did fine, but he also used a teleprompter most of the time. He did well off of it but.. not at the debate.
I agree with Catz...Why on earth did the Biden Team have Joe do 3 other events just before that Debate? ...Joe should have been resting that day--- not doing 3 events that same day.
@@dreamcoyote Biden reminded me of Capt. Queeg in the Caine Mutiny going kind of crazy and losing his mind. The way for every question he kept saying ... Number 1 ... Number 2 ... he sounded like a broken robot. The more I think about it, the more he needs to go. I remember arguing against him 4 years ago because of this. I voted for him, but also expected he would be a one term President. He lied about that. I detest Trump, but all the things Biden throws at Trump - lying and selfishness ... can be turned back on him now because of his egomania.
@@lindaAA3101 If Biden can be pushed around by his staff to do things that he should have known he cannot do - that is on him. That's why he is President and the staff is he staff.
al, i am saddened and upset - i spent the entire trump "presidency", stressed and nauseated. i can not face 4 years of him again. maybe it's time to leave the land of my birth.
Well, we have our problems, that's for sure. I guarantee you that the poor in the USA has far more than the poor in most every other country. We can absolutely do better, tho, that's for sure!
@@RodWilliams-m7r agree! If we worked together at the neighborhood level, I bet we could eliminate homelessness by keeping our neighbors from loosing their homes in the first place. 🥺 Americans are the most blessed people on the planet and yet we can't help our neighbors?
@Al : You don't 'replace Biden': You let Biden choose a worthy Champion to carry on with the torch. You make the Dem Congress a real Triumph, to celebrate Joe Biden of Scranton's long and outstanding service to the State and his party! He should go out for glory, with his arm around the shoulders of the next real people's champion. As an outside observer who started out just wanting to know more about the US system, now that communication is so easy, I have been hooked on the ongoing drama for some years, and, I would say, that one of the best possible people to hand on the torch to, would be the highly qualified, passionate, and charismatic, Jamie Raskin. He has the glory of youth, to outshine the Trump glamour that has his followers enthralled. He can break the spell: and Biden can be there as President Emeritus adviser, just as usefully as he is in the hot seat himself. He would benefit from not having to push so hard to turn out when he is not at his best. The public and the world at large need have no misgivings about disasters that might arise in the next four years due to inevitable declining health with age. A shiny new leader would be just the shot in the arm the jaded and scared electorate needs right now. What have you got to lose? Everything! If you get this wrong through baseless pride of party. Think about it. Good luck.
Raskin says he won't. He survived cancer but I'm sure it was an energy drain. I would vote fore Raskin, but can't count on my neighbors to be mature enough to elect him. Surveys say antisemitism is up.
The real issue is who would replace Biden… capturing independent voter’s (like myself) is the main goal to the presidency. I’ve never voted for a Republican anything. As I always said… voting Republican is like asking someone to beat you.
I would hope that making the focus an anti Trump message would be more persuasive. It probably won't happen since all of the things haven't moved the needle. But maybe the money mongers would see that and understand the consequences of an authoritative regime and the damage it would do to the country.
A common sense friend said "Well, he's past 80. What do people expect?" The democratic party should have never put themselves in this position. He should have served one term and stepped aside. Imagine how a Gavin Newsom would have wiped the floor with Trumps lies....
Newsom would be the option. But just wait, if it gets to that, trust me, forces from both the radical left and the center will make sure it doesn't happen.
@@bethmoseley1244 He may have a lot of baggage, which would have harmed him in normal times, but if he is up against Trump, Newsom's baggage will look like a coin purse.
thats false. I doubt you have a clue about it. If Chevron is overturned EPA wont be able to evaluate and develop regulations for pollution control unless the statute upfront specifies and mandates the control requirements for all sources.
The Former Guy: Convicted Felon, never won the popular vote for POTUS. Millions more people voted against him in 2016 as well as in 2020. Gerrymandering and the outdated Electoral College put him in the White House.
I've come to realize that Americans just want to be entertained. they don't really care about substance. I'm not sure what y'all think a debate is but it's not supposed to be exciting. I thought Biden did an okay job. I kind of think he acted frustrated. but then again who wouldn't be. nobody wants to stand next to a lying carnival Barker and have to try to refute the obvious. he was quiet and he looked tired but I appreciate that because he's actually working for us and not golfing. you know it's funny, we hold Biden to such a high standard that when he stutters and stammers and is obviously tired that somehow that's just so horrible but apparently mango Mussolini up there on that stage just telling lie after lie after lie is perfectly fine. I'm really disappointed in my fellow Americans.
I think many Americans and people around the world see it the way you do. I know I did. I thought President Biden held it together well, standing next to the firehose of lies. CNN pre-recorded and edited it before airing so we saw exactly what CNN wanted us to see.
I take your point about the substance of the debate. However, I think it’s unfair to put the burden of being understanding on Americans. Joe Biden is the President, he has unlimited resources and a week to prepare. He should have done better. I’m sorry but we all talk about looking the part, he didn’t. I doubt that most people will hire someone who comes or appears unprepared for a job interview regardless of the level of competence. The standards shouldn’t be lower for our Politicians. Having said that, the republicans should be equally concerned that they have a candidate who has no policy agenda and just lies about everything. In any case, America deserves better.
Al, it would be great to see you on the ticket. Of course I know this would not happen. But if you ever want to run for the Senate again, please do. I could not vote for your because I am from out of state. I would, however, contribute to your campaign. It was so sad when you so nobly resigned after that stupid sophomoric picture that was taken as a joke came to light. Your resignation was such an honorable Democrat thing to do. Even as a I strong feminist, I still can’t understand why some Democrats called for your resignation - thanks and good riddance to Krysten Sinema. You were one of the most cogent, intelligent, and effective members of the Senate. I love your podcast - never stop keeping your voice out there.
Norm's ideas 💡 are brilliant. The Biden people or the new candidate's people need to meet with Norm immediately. It's time for the former Trump officials to step up collectively and go public in a unified manner.
Agree Norm is always a great listen, but disagree on the uniting behind Kamala Harris idea. Not because she isn't competent, it's she has no real appeal as a candidate. Biden selected her because of his promise to select a woman as Vice-President back in 2020. She was selected for various reasons, including her closeness to his deceased son Beau. However, I think she was far from the strongest candidate for the job. Biden already had the African-American vote, and she probably cost him a few percentage points lost in African American males due to her prosecutorial background. Her own campaign fizzled and never made it to primaries. She had no real constituency.
Kamala has a weak voice. She doesnt connect with people. Hillary didnt either but for different reasons. Now, you put Stormy Daniels in there and she'd out perform them all. Haha
@@cmPe6an I really hope he can. Beyond concerns about whether he can win re-election, he needs to do it to assuage fears that he can even go on till Nov.
Yeah, Ornstein's point about that was totally on point. If he does the interviews and blows it - he will be out. It was so embarassing to see Biden on stage looking like a zombie after the debate and his wife firing up the crowd, and Joe looking around like he did not know what was going on. Awful and disgusting.
I've turned off every post that brings out the piranhas. What do you mean what do WE do? Are WE in the administration? Are WE going to call for his removal? NO, WE ARE NOT!! Faint on your couch and get over it. The debate was an embarrassing moment. It's not game 7 in the world series. If anything it's game 1. Let's quit trying to undo his accomplishments from one bruised finger. Al, stop piling the sh!t on, as Norm is explaining the actual facts in history.
This debate is being super- hyped up! In reality Biden was not all that bad! Yes, Biden is a senior citizen and he has only been trying to save modern civilization from WW3! Give our President a break!
Wow. I guess having a neurodegenerative disease that progressively impairs your memory while in charge of the nuclear weapons is not worrisome to you. Ok!
If I was Biden, I would do weekly fireside chats because we are in a crisis and we’re about to go to Civil War. This is not funny. This is not a joke. This is a crisis. Every week, America should see its president.
A Jewish man in the oval office? That was laughable before the "free Palestine" bs. Now you have people on the left who won't vote for a Democrat unless he pledges loyalty to radical Islamists. Up is down and down is up.
Biden needs to do a televised Town Hall with Kamala at his side, answering people's questions and showing that they really are a team working together. This lets Joe be spontaneous and think on his feet without the pressure of having to argue next to a lying bully and restrained to a one-minute response. This is how Joe is at his best: talking to people.
Joe does not look good next to Kamala. She treats him like an old grandpa. Reaching arms out to help, a natural response, makes him look weak. Reinforcing what he says makes it look like his answers need clarification.
not only was it a disaster .. but what does it tell us about the team behind the curtain .?? and how they bungled the entire opportunity & process .. scheduling multiple events prior to the show .. feeding him facts & figures like a policy wonk .. with all the resources at their disposal to have such a colossal failure reflects so poorly on them knowing they have an old guy and behaving as if he's 20 years younger .. if they get this wrong what else will they fail at .. ??
Agree. But with regard to Biden running, he was forced to b/c his designated successor Harris is DEEPLY UNPOPULAR + CAN'T WIN FROM TOP OF TICKET. (HER NET UNFAVORABLES ARE HUGE.) Replace the VP nominee with somebody popular with Dems + Independents + the whole issue of Joe's health goes away.
I wonder what they were thinking. Oh, we'd better not offend Trump because the polling says he is going to win, and if we are mean to him he'll come after us next term?
@@justgivemethetruth I suspect they pre-planned exactly how they would proceed. Then knew there is basically one debate between these two. Trump supporters hate them. If they fact check Trump etc, then that could show bias, and people iffy about Trump but potential Trump voters might just say the whole thing was skewed. They set a strict process and it was Biden's to win.. and he didn't.
@@justgivemethetruth They were thinking that this was a debate between Trump and Biden, not between Trump and CNN. They had announced beforehand that they weren't going to fact-check either candidate, so the onus was on Biden to counter Trump's lies. They probably had no idea that Biden would fail this hard.
Wait for the dust to settle. Nobody knows what the impact will be. Give Biden a few weeks to prove himself however possible, otherwise convince him to let someone younger take over. If this is old age, he won't be able to. Then we'll know. Nominating a new person won't be easy, and they'll be starting from scratch financially (a huge disadvantage), and will be stepping over a black woman (sure to alienate a big part of the base). Replacing Biden sounds wonderful, but it could be just as painful and divisive as letting an old man past his prime continue. There are no good options, only bad and worse ones. Democrats are surely heading for defeat, even with a new candidate, it might not change the outcome.
Every single president since FDR had a weekly address to the American people, until Trump stopped it. Biden -- to my amazement -- failed to restore it. One would think that talking to the American people on a regular basis while thousands are dying during a pandemic would be the highest priority. My speculation is that giving an address EVERY Saturday would have revealed Biden's condition FAR sooner. Which also would have been a good thing.
If he's up to it he has to address the American people regularly from now on. If he's up to it and decides not to present himself regularly, nobody will believe him. He declined to run in 2016 because his son died & he was mourning so because of that I have accepted him saying he is up to 2 full terms. Now he has to win back my trust but I still think the debate was a tie, neither of them would have won an elementary school debate.
Agree with blowing up Chevron Doctrine is a disaster. Re the Grant's Pass anti camping laws, you have to realize that billions of $$ have gone toward the homeless in Los Angeles and most will NOT go into beds offered. They fuel crime. It is a terrible situation. I do think we need mental institutions and rehab to open. It is a housing problem, but not JUST a housing problem. Very complex.
These are ( sad to say ) useless messed up people who are liabilities and endless costs to society. Not all of them, but many of them. Some are people living in their cars who hold down jobs but just cannot afford to pay for housing that is outrageously expensive - and will not be coming down in price ever. So rephrasing the problem as - the country does not want to see or have to step over, or experience the crime or unpleasantness of these homeless people. I will never forget I had an interview in downtown SF, CA, and got there and parked on the street, and had to walk past a whole contingent of drugged out creeps lying on the sidewalk to get there. Then when I left and returned to my car the car just parked behind me had been broken into and the police were telling the lady who owned it there's nothing they can do. That was 10 years ago. Even putting them in camps is going to cost too much and will be a bonanza for corruption and abuse. This is mostly happening I think because the economic squeeze and defunding of the civil infrastructure. The decay of the family, institutions and morals - due to the abusive form of capitalism and no democracy in the last 30 years.
It's a terrible problem, the literal fallout of decades of misguided socio-economic priorities. The obvious to me answer is housing, some kind of low cost, low maintenance, yet still monitored basic shelter with beds, bathrooms, and privacy. New York City used to have SRO hotels, Single Room Occupancy, that kept a lot of people off the street. They were not nice places but they served a function. Some sort of basic, cheap place to sleep and wash is what's needed. I hope something like that arises from this Grant's Pass ruling. My first thought however, is it will be a boon to the prison-industrial complex, and most likely lead to an increase in private corporate run jails.
@@sydgriffin7591 Agree with you... basic, functional housing with no frills. Here the city is building units at $600,000. Insane. They don't imprison most anyone, here, even criminals! That scares the middle class which is being reduced to nothing.
I voted Biden in 2020. I am for small d democracy and capital D Democratic agenda, but this awful performance is hard to unsee. I agree a town hall is a good idea, but it appears he just can't do it. I am sure his inner circle has thought of this but know that he can only read off a prompter now. His campaign and people have put us all in a bad spot. No other way to put it.
Trump would love to debate and/or run against Harris. She's a non-starter. She never connected with voters and it was political malpractice to pull her off the trash heap and put her on the ticket when Biden's NUMBER ONE WEAKNESS was his age. If Joe had a running mate with any political skills whatsoever as his number two, he'd be in a MUCH better position right now. 🤷♂️
@@gkniffen I think the best option at the moment is for Harris to step down and Biden to name an excellent campaigner as a replacement. They should be more centrist-friendly (don't go for DNC base) and be able to pull in the numbers. The largest consensus among voters is that we don't want this matchup in the first place. Trump will pick a lump for a VP (can't give up the spotlight at all), so an impactful pick for DNC VP would have people thinking they will be POTUS soon(er) so vote that way. It would avoid the issues with the convention. Agreed, Harris can't pull in the numbers. She's fine as a person, but this isn't about her. I don't care if her political career ended tomorrow. After Al's show, I think the DNC should plan that out, have the talks, and schedule a town hall. If Biden does it again, replace Harris. If he knocks it out of the park (and he would have to), maybe he goes on. Either way, we know in a couple of weeks. A lot depends on superdelegates telling Harris it's not that she's a bad person, but she doesn't have the numbers and won't.
Harris's net unfavorables are HUGE! She can't win from top of ticket. Harris is the reason Joe was forced to run for 2nd term because SHE is currently his defacto successor and SHE CAN'T WIN! Swap out the VP candidate for somebody popular with Dems + Independents, then Biden's health will be a non-issue.
The NyQuil vs. DayQuil hypothesis is plausible. At any rate, he acted very much like someone who had taken an older-generation antihistamine. Those drugs also have anticholinergic effects, which, in addition to reducing mucus (the desired effect) can cause dry mouth and cognitive impairment (some of the anti-dementia meds currently available are pro-cholinergic). Myself, I think he would have been better off canceling or dripping with snot.
@@cassandratq9301 is that a vote for Biden not having done the debate or a correction of my spelling? (If the latter, I’ll point out that I live in the U.S., where both spellings are accepted 😉.)
I will vote for Biden even though he will lose by more than 30% in my State. This is my last election, I'm not maga or progressive so I'm out of politics.
Ha ha, very good Al and Norm! I'm listening to this early Sunday morn. I've listened to it all, for a couple of days. I'm amazed with your prescience. You guys did well to pull the curtains back on all the Ozes, so close to the event. Applause from me
I disagree, These conversations need to take place. It was a mistake to put someone forward who has clear cognitive decline, unable to communicate or defend positions. Ignoring the problem, pushing through, and only talking about how bad Trump is, only makes voters feel like they are being deceived by the DNC and Biden administration.
Not great. I am surprised that Senator Franken and Mr. Ornstein are amongst the Democratic bedwetting. It was 90 damn minutes versus a lifetime of achievements. Get a damn grip.
For me, the problem with that is the Senate. More justices, more balance, until it isn't. It makes it harder to skew to one party, but if they get there, it takes a lot longer to bring it back into balance. Senate confirmation would need to be cleaned up. The Turtle's BS showed how faulty that is, and there's no guarantee the Senate isn't 50/50 or goes GOP. The DNC can, unlike the GOP, put forward actual competent centrist justices but if the GOP can just stall until they get to make the picks..
@@dreamcoyote True, but everything that has happened in recent years has really made clear how much our country has depended on both sides being cooperative and civil. The Republicans broke that when the center of the party moved to the deep south and fascist billionaires. I don't see a continuous smooth in-system way out of this.
Can anyone explain to me why a “chaotic” convention would be any worse than the chaos of that debate? I’d like to hear an argument as to why a chaotic convention is more threatening to our chances than a candidate who was already losing continuing to prove the Republicans’ case against him (and I’d like that argument to be something other than a cautionary tale about the 1924 Democratic convention, a la David Frum’s latest appeal based on what is at this point ancient f’ing history).
Being pre-retired. (Old and out of work and not wealthy enough to retire) I don't know what day of the week it is anymore except for "Franken Day," formerly known as Sunday. Thanks Al. Also, we need serifs. I can't tell the difference between AI and Al.
The vote of anyone listening to this podcast is not in question. The few as yet undecided voters are in question. These people will decide the election and that is the problem.
It’s time to have a serious discussion on releasing the delegates. I am Gavin Newsom supporter but I want to win. Josh Shapiro and Gretchen Whitmer shoud be nominated for the sake of our country.
Expatriating to another country is becoming a viable alternative to living in the USA. I just don't see, given our dysfunctional politics, how it gets any better.
Run!! Run!! Run!!! Too many weak people in this country. My grandfather, mom and dad, son, and hopefully not for years my brother, who all served this country, who put their lives on the line..... ARE SPINNING IN THEIR GRAVE!! RUN Forrest, RUN!!
@@dawnoceanside7300 My grandparents came to this country with their family at the beginning of the last century because they felt they could make a better life for themselves and a better future for their children here. And it was true! But I don't think it's true any more. That's not running, that's looking ahead with eyes unclouded by nationalism.
@@James-hd4ms ---I am voting BLUE no matter who is on the ticket against Trump. Joe could decide to step down. So if so, then there will be a replacement, and I will vote for whom ever is the Dem candidate because my vote is to STOP Trump since we all now know what he has in mind in his "Project 2025 Agenda"--which he has made public. And if Trump enacts that Proj-2025, then our Democracy is gone. Thus, I'm voting BLUE---so Trump can be stopped. #VoteBlue
@@James-hd4ms I would be surprised if Joe steps down. And I looked at the "POLLS" that have been coming out, and one was from BRAZIL, another one was this questionable Poll company, and the other one was an on-line Polling company that is new....So really ,the so-called "polls" that are saying that Biden's popularity dropped "Tremendously" are all questionable. And more time passes,more people are saying they'll stick w/ Biden. Plus he got $30 million since that Debate & that SCOTUS decision from Donors!...I'm voting BLUE to stop Trump...no matter what. JMHO.
Hoping for massive turnout in favor of Biden is not a viable strategy. Biden and Harris should stand aside together so that someone else can step forward and name their own VP. Although they would have only a few months to win over the electorate, just think of the spark it would give to an otherwise dull, awful election.
How about a known quantity, someone who’s been on message his whole life. But the party would sooner descend into fascism then give Bernie a fair chance.
Al , your show was really discouraging and frightening. It was disappointing to hear about the Supreme Court recent rulings. I still think that Biden has a chance to win in November. You can't judge him because he didn't do well during his first debate. Second, there were a number of factors why I believe Biden didn't do so well. 1. Biden has been traveling, not stop with meetings in Israel, France. Attending memorials to honor our falling heroes and veterans who fought and sacrificed their life's for our Democracy. 2. Biden needs to fire his campaign manger and staff. They're are partly responsible for Biden not getting enough rest. They should of had the foresight and common sense to realize he was sick with a cold. The debate should of been canceled by Biden's campaign.. This was poor judgment and it backfire and Biden paid the price.
For people that were voting "for a ham sammich as long as it's not Trump", having one bad debate won't change that (much). This wasn't a poor performance like other bad debates and the question of his aging won't improve despite any other performances. This one reinforced their argument that he's too old and can't get do the job. I get what he was trying to say, know about the stutter, have experienced full dementia with elderly family. I'm NOT the anti-Biden guy. Most people don't follow politics like we do, won't even see the changes made/better performances, and their votes are needed for him to win.
I think you’re missing the point here. It’s not enough for Biden to be a good President, he needs to show that he can continue doing the job. Performances like Thursday do not help those who doubt he can do it. One remedy is for him to be out more and do interviews in unfriendly outlets. Hiding is no longer a reasonable option if winning in 2024 is really important to him and all those who care about democracy
@@phemykadri9487 Agreed. The best way for him to salvage his reelection hope is to get out in public and show what he's got. If he doesn't have it, then decisions need to be made. Another Tr*mp presidency is too dangerous to allow.
I love you Al, this country misses you as a senator. I watched your show for the first time last week and heard the finger picking at the start and wondered, since you are from Minnesota, whether that was kottke. You verified it was on the extro. Kottke is a forgotten man these days, didn't make it on the top 250 guitarists, but neither did tommy bolin, from iowa. Keep up the good work.
I was reminded this week of the 110th anniversary of the flashpoint of World War One in Sarajevo. This calamity was possible because all involved parties were too afraid to say stop this escalation right here, right now. Thus many historians can say that an assassin became the single most important person of the 20th century. Don't let another person become the most important person for the 21st century just because we were afraid to say NO to him.
No sense in wrestling in the mud as to how the Democratic Party got here but rather how to get out of the mess. This will take heads beyond Biden’s inner circle to figure out.
Yes, the President’s decisions can be supremely important. When, in the course of the job is that decision needed with in 2 minutes and without notes or advisors? The day to day work of the job is NOT in debate format.
@@James-hd4ms I must just be stupid. But isn’t using the same methods over and over again expecting a different outcome is insanity? I cannot believe that 90 minutes of a stupid debate is THE deciding factor for people. I’ve heard comments relating back to perception from the debate. The “winner” shows strength (it matters to few people what is actually said). Then there are criticisms that certain details were not mentioned, like Project 2025 or multiple indictments, etc. So is it bigger that the detail or perception was so terribly off the mark? For those paying attention it is the lack of detail that produce the most criticisms, however those paying attention to detail have probably already selected their next president. This brings us to those not paying attention so it is the perception that was paramount. For those not paying close attention, what do they see? They’ve bought into the republican marketing. Trump is MAGA. He has sold his MAGA followers on their own fame, fortune or security fears. They seemingly are mostly insane, but they make him look bigger than he is. Make him look more forceful than he is. It looks determined. Trump looks like its leader. It is all built on fluff and bullshit, lies and evil. It is insanity at its strongest. It is dangerous. What do those same people see when they look at Biden? They see an individual. An old man, singular. They have not been shown the power behind everyone that is the Democratic Party. The sales pitch for the election cannot be one man against a movement. It has to be Biden and the group he LEADS and LEADS WELL to beat Trump and the band of self-serving lunatics who fall in line behind him.
@@lorraineh9083 The debate doesn’t matter. The visuals will be seen over and over of a clearly enfeebled slack mouthed gazing off possibly drooling creepy looking senile man. And of course I will vote for him if I have to. Step down, shake things up with an exciting convention and go on to win easily and crush the MAGA party, securing a beautiful future for our country and the world. Or loose.
@@kathrynhohmann5697 You're a bit dim and too quick on the blurt. I thought you knew more than you do. When Bush was running, the tell that Dick Cheney was going to be VP was his move from Texas, where both he and Bush resided, to Wyoming.
@@dreamcoyote Dude, it was me making the joke suggesting she move to the same state as Cheney did when he ran with Bush. I think Kamala is extremely unpopular ... but it is problematic for minorities if she is not the candidate. This is a real screwed-up mess Biden has created from his own selfish vanity.
I think it's all hands on deck, get our best surrogates out there with the policies, the issues and what they are going to do, what's been done, the infrastructure projects, the cool stuff that's starting up..
The Hitler parallel comments by Norm are just chilling. I wonder what is the foreign involvement and foreign money is in all this. Like we have seen how close Hamas has been in the UN ... what is going on in our country?
I would prefer a good man who sometimes is a bit senile to a crook who is driven by greed Consider the experience factor. Consider the kindness factor, which in my mind is always first, and above all else, the central and most important quality among all men, woman, and nations.
We’re watching the debate with family members of all legal voting ages where my youngest nephew is 28, we all agreed that we vote to save DEMOCRACY, we are not voting for a candidate. All that says, Trump is out of the picture, he’s a destroyer not a builder, a dictator/fascist written on his forehead. VOTE BLUE 💙💙💙💙💙💙💙💙💙
Its distressing that half of this discussion is about how to --with baling wire, gorilla glue, and duct tape--put Joe Biden together again. Like Humpty Dumpty. Seems to me that these pundits should be more serious about how a replacement can be found besides just saying how difficult it would be.
Everything will be OK. Too much freakout over one debate. The voters who need to flip were expecting Joe to sound the way he did so they were not surprised and were not concerned. They could hear Trump loud and clear, and they were not impressed. Trump lost support and that is what matters.
This is just me, but whom ever is on the ticket (DEM-wise) against Trump in November, well that Dem is whom I will vote for. Trump and his Project 2025 agenda must be stopped. So we will see in the next week or so what Joe decides to do. If Joe decides to step down--- then the DNC needs to come up w/ an alternative quickly. Anyhow, Trump cannot win, or our Democracy will be destroyed, imho. #voteBlue
@@James-hd4ms I tried. It was too much of a train wreck. But rumor has it, Dems are taking it harder than never Trumpers. FOX had conditioned their viewers to not expect much from Biden so they didn't and Trumps hateful, lying rhetoric turned them off. I have talked to Republicans who will vote for Biden regardless. I remain optimistic.
@@James-hd4ms === I watched it and it was a horror. Joe was in a bad state and could not articulate anything....But then let's not forget Trump & his 30+ lies. The whole thing was hard to watch.
Could someone please help Doc and Marty get the almanac back and unskew this awful alternate timeline? Pretty please? With sugar on top? For the love of God…
Wouldn’t it be best if the presidential incumbent had to compete for the nomination when he/she runs again just like every other candidate? Sure would make it harder for an incumbent to hide and rest on laurels.
There is no turning this around. It was not just bad, it was not just awful, it was lethal. "We finally beat Medicare." This is not stuttering, or just a "gaffe." If he had started out 5 points ahead, I would STILL think he should drop out after this.
Most people look at it all wrong. The format favored the serial liar. The presidency is about principled, deep, measured thought and action, not fast talk. Biden isn't great at fast talk, and he's actively suppressing a profound stutter he's had all his life. Not easy, and he's past the point of appearing sharp because of it. And a presidency is not just about one person... There may be a better candidate, but given the choices I'm fine with Biden.
Thank you Al for not making excuses nor pulling punches about Biden's performance. // Kamala Harris approval rating is below Biden's. Whoops... Al just said that.
NASCAR with 100 million+ viewers. Watching two politicians going around in circles is like NASCAR. You're not going to "learn" anything, you're only watching to see the crash.
![Morning Joe [6AM] 11/5/2024 | 🅼🆂🅽🅱️🅲 BREAKING NEWS Today November 5, 2024](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/zRUrio3M_z8/mqdefault.jpg)
I don't know who Biden's advisors are.. but having Biden doing 3 or 4 OTHER events THAT day, before this debate, is ridiculous & irresponsible for ANYONE!!
Am I wrong? But is Ron Klain back in Biden's circle, advising him?? If he is, (after 'trash-talking' Biden) I'll be even more furious!!! I am so f-ing OVER the deflection of EVERYTHING tRump, is more than nauseating!!!! WTF!!!!!!
I agree, his team didn’t give him the rest and hydration and cough drop he needed. Never seen Biden like this. It’s too late now, but somebody is a saboteur in his team .
Thought about this too. Were those other events more important than resting up for the debate? Of course not.
Wait, wait, wait ... Biden was doing other events THE DAY OF THE DEBATE?!? 😳
@gkniffen , unbelievable! I ASSUMED Biden would at least take a day of rest before that over-hyped, pointless, too late at night TV opp. Can't believe his people scheduled other stuff that day. How many of us can work all day and then do a major event at what is many people's bed time. I too felt so bad after the debate I couldn't sleep even though I normally go to bed around 9. Now I'm mad that Biden was done this way. Definitely won't change my support for him.
Did Biden have a full schedule Thursday? I didn't know that.
In December I will be 80 years old, my body is old my mind still works just fine. I have had occasion to tell my 53 yrs old daughter 'I'm old, I'm not stupid' don't discount Bidens' wisdom, the evil that is Trump et al is frightening.
Ukraine and gaza evil, absence of any wisdom
Good for you. Keep on thinking Pauline!
Amen. You don't replace the good employee who got sick with the one you fired for his abysmal performance and trying to destroy your institution because he was angry that he got fired....(to use one analogy...there are numerous).
I'm voting for cornel west or jill stein - they arent senile yet.
@@rd264 Tell me you are voting for Trump without telling me you are voting for Trump.
If Biden advisors had told us he was sick but refused to cancel, then have Biden tell us yes, he’s sick, not at his best, but loves American democracy more than life so he’s here, it would have changed the whole trajectory.
Good point!
Yes, you have to wonder who his advisors are letting him go out like that! Seems he is getting really bad advice.
I don't know that we will ever hear the story of what happened behind the scenes, but the President ought to be able to make these common sense decisions himself - like don't do other events the day of a relatively late-night debate.
Something has to have happened. Maybe cold n flu tabs? Don’t know but something went terribly wrong.
My advisors never take responsibility.
Not just 70 million people watched the debate. Social media is and will continue to magnify the debate until election night.
The election in France is being won in real time, by the far right's presently main platform, TIK-TOK. Actually, China is winning. Have always dreaded this 'Animal Farm' Orwellian dystopia manifesting. But here we are.
to the extreme elation of the billionaire class
True, interspersed among the better interviews and speeches by Biden, and the many trial dates and revelations of Trump's near-limitless crimes, blatant lies, dwindling crowds, and his own lunacy, slurring, and sleeping in court. We have four more months of Trump's nonsense - more than enough to deter any independent or undecided from voting for him. Confused Joe can take a back seat in his second term, just like Bush Jr and Reagan's second term, while the administration arounds him continues to do good works. Whether it is a vote for the administration, or the lesser harm, the choice should be a simple one for any voter paying attention.
Remember, it was RBG staying on the court instead of retiring that has brought us the nightmare Supreme Court we now have.
Good point.
Exactly
Obama was denied a Supreme Court appointment at the end of his term. Trump filled it. Then at the end of trump's term he was 'given' another appointment by Mitch Mcconnell. That was the problem.
It would not have made a difference. 5-4 is still a maga win. Expand the court to 13.
Sounds a bit like Biden not stepping aside. I see a pattern with boomer Democrats or politicians in general
Skipped the short, easy, softball question Superbowl interview, 123 million viewers. That was a red flag.
I saw that President Biden also had 3 other events that day . That's a mistake they made as a team, surely, what was so important it couldn't have been rescheduled, since he wasn't feeling well..
Where did you see that? Do you think it was real/true or just some kind of made up excuse?
Even if that was true it makes it look like Biden is just being rolled around from event to event and has no good judgement to say no? This makes me think of the last term of Reagan - which was not even as bad - and the negativity and anger that drew from the Democrats and affected his legacy and memory. Biden is much worse.
I've tried looking for that too and haven't found anything, let alone a source. It's possible they weren't public events. All I did find was that his staff tries to schedule things between 10am and 4pm when he's at his best. Obviously the state of the union was later than that and he did fine, but he also used a teleprompter most of the time. He did well off of it but.. not at the debate.
I agree with Catz...Why on earth did the Biden Team have Joe do 3 other events just before that Debate? ...Joe should have been resting that day--- not doing 3 events that same day.
@@dreamcoyote
Biden reminded me of Capt. Queeg in the Caine Mutiny going kind of crazy and losing his mind.
The way for every question he kept saying ... Number 1 ... Number 2 ... he sounded like a broken robot.
The more I think about it, the more he needs to go. I remember arguing against him 4 years ago because
of this. I voted for him, but also expected he would be a one term President. He lied about that.
I detest Trump, but all the things Biden throws at Trump - lying and selfishness ... can be turned back on
him now because of his egomania.
@@lindaAA3101
If Biden can be pushed around by his staff to do things that he should have known he cannot do - that is on him.
That's why he is President and the staff is he staff.
Al, you are seriously missed by the few Americans who are aware that these are precarious days. Come back.
OMG Yes! We really need him.
Al...DON'T
al, i am saddened and upset - i spent the entire trump "presidency", stressed and nauseated. i can not face 4 years of him again. maybe it's time to leave the land of my birth.
US wealth and its treatment of the poor is disgusting.
Ongoing for SEVERAL DECADES.
Well, we have our problems, that's for sure. I guarantee you that the poor in the USA has far more than the poor in most every other country. We can absolutely do better, tho, that's for sure!
@@sumiland6445 My point was that criminalising people for being poor is disgusting...sorry if I didn't get it right in the comment
@@RodWilliams-m7r agree! If we worked together at the neighborhood level, I bet we could eliminate homelessness by keeping our neighbors from loosing their homes in the first place. 🥺 Americans are the most blessed people on the planet and yet we can't help our neighbors?
Punishing poor people for the crime of being poor (and rewarding rich people for the virtue of being rich) is very much what this court has decided.
@Al : You don't 'replace Biden': You let Biden choose a worthy Champion to carry on with the torch. You make the Dem Congress a real Triumph, to celebrate Joe Biden of Scranton's long and outstanding service to the State and his party! He should go out for glory, with his arm around the shoulders of the next real people's champion. As an outside observer who started out just wanting to know more about the US system, now that communication is so easy, I have been hooked on the ongoing drama for some years, and, I would say, that one of the best possible people to hand on the torch to, would be the highly qualified, passionate, and charismatic, Jamie Raskin. He has the glory of youth, to outshine the Trump glamour that has his followers enthralled. He can break the spell: and Biden can be there as President Emeritus adviser, just as usefully as he is in the hot seat himself. He would benefit from not having to push so hard to turn out when he is not at his best. The public and the world at large need have no misgivings about disasters that might arise in the next four years due to inevitable declining health with age. A shiny new leader would be just the shot in the arm the jaded and scared electorate needs right now.
What have you got to lose?
Everything!
If you get this wrong through baseless pride of party.
Think about it.
Good luck.
Raskin would be my choice too.
Raskin says he won't.
He survived cancer but I'm sure it was an energy drain.
I would vote fore Raskin, but can't count on my neighbors to be mature enough to elect him.
Surveys say antisemitism is up.
Seems like there is only upside to Biden stepping down. Anyone who is planning to vote for Biden, would vote for any Democrat... except maybe Harris.
and who might that be?
@@tallSycamore
Raskin's a good man.
A Republican Senate and House is the real nightmare. 😮
The whole effing thing is a nightmare.
Trump in the White House is the nightmare. The people like Stephen Miller who would be running the country is the nightmare.
The real issue is who would replace Biden… capturing independent voter’s (like myself) is the main goal to the presidency. I’ve never voted for a Republican anything. As I always said… voting Republican is like asking someone to beat you.
I would hope that making the focus an anti Trump message would be more persuasive. It probably won't happen since all of the things haven't moved the needle. But maybe the money mongers would see that and understand the consequences of an authoritative regime and the damage it would do to the country.
We are fucked!! We are so fucked.
A common sense friend said "Well, he's past 80. What do people expect?" The democratic party should have never put themselves in this position. He should have served one term and stepped aside. Imagine how a Gavin Newsom would have wiped the floor with Trumps lies....
Newsom would be the option. But just wait, if it gets to that, trust me, forces from both the radical left and the center will make sure it doesn't happen.
I live in San Francisco. Gavin Newsom would be a terrible choice for president. Lots of baggage... empty suit.
@@bethmoseley1244 He may have a lot of baggage, which would have harmed him in normal times, but if he is up against Trump, Newsom's baggage will look like a coin purse.
D.N.C.=DOES NOT Care
Chevron is a power grab.
Is there anything left in this country that has not been grabbed?
And a dangerous one for Americans
thats false. I doubt you have a clue about it. If Chevron is overturned EPA wont be able to evaluate and develop regulations for pollution control unless the statute upfront specifies and mandates the control requirements for all sources.
If 45's presidency was as fabulous as he claims,why was he trounced in the 2020 bid for reelection?
The Former Guy: Convicted Felon, never won the popular vote for POTUS. Millions more people voted against him in 2016 as well as in 2020. Gerrymandering and the outdated Electoral College put him in the White House.
Don’t you remember the election was stolen 😂🤣😂
Trounced? I think it was closer than you think.
Add Rick Wilson to the campaign team.
I've come to realize that Americans just want to be entertained. they don't really care about substance. I'm not sure what y'all think a debate is but it's not supposed to be exciting. I thought Biden did an okay job. I kind of think he acted frustrated. but then again who wouldn't be. nobody wants to stand next to a lying carnival Barker and have to try to refute the obvious. he was quiet and he looked tired but I appreciate that because he's actually working for us and not golfing. you know it's funny, we hold Biden to such a high standard that when he stutters and stammers and is obviously tired that somehow that's just so horrible but apparently mango Mussolini up there on that stage just telling lie after lie after lie is perfectly fine.
I'm really disappointed in my fellow Americans.
I think many Americans and people around the world see it the way you do. I know I did. I thought President Biden held it together well, standing next to the firehose of lies. CNN pre-recorded and edited it before airing so we saw exactly what CNN wanted us to see.
❤
DITTO!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
*We hold Biden to...
I take your point about the substance of the debate. However, I think it’s unfair to put the burden of being understanding on Americans. Joe Biden is the President, he has unlimited resources and a week to prepare. He should have done better. I’m sorry but we all talk about looking the part, he didn’t. I doubt that most people will hire someone who comes or appears unprepared for a job interview regardless of the level of competence. The standards shouldn’t be lower for our Politicians. Having said that, the republicans should be equally concerned that they have a candidate who has no policy agenda and just lies about everything. In any case, America deserves better.
Al, it would be great to see you on the ticket. Of course I know this would not happen. But if you ever want to run for the Senate again, please do. I could not vote for your because I am from out of state. I would, however, contribute to your campaign.
It was so sad when you so nobly resigned after that stupid sophomoric picture that was taken as a joke came to light. Your resignation was such an honorable Democrat thing to do. Even as a I strong feminist, I still can’t understand why some Democrats called for your resignation - thanks and good riddance to Krysten Sinema. You were one of the most cogent, intelligent, and effective members of the Senate. I love your podcast - never stop keeping your voice out there.
Norm's ideas 💡 are brilliant. The Biden people or the new candidate's people need to meet with Norm immediately. It's time for the former Trump officials to step up collectively and go public in a unified manner.
@melissawilliamson8871 I totally agree with you!! Thank you Al and Norm.The best post debate conversation I've listened to
Agree Norm is always a great listen, but disagree on the uniting behind Kamala Harris idea. Not because she isn't competent, it's she has no real appeal as a candidate. Biden selected her because of his promise to select a woman as Vice-President back in 2020. She was selected for various reasons, including her closeness to his deceased son Beau. However, I think she was far from the strongest candidate for the job. Biden already had the African-American vote, and she probably cost him a few percentage points lost in African American males due to her prosecutorial background. Her own campaign fizzled and never made it to primaries. She had no real constituency.
The former Biden officials' idea is a great one, though.
looks like Bidens staff are worthless. I didnt see any real WH plan for the Debate.
Thanks, Al, I agree Kamala is not the answer, she would never beat Trump!!!!!
💯%
Please see my comments elsewhere. HARRIS must be ditched as VP nominee. It solves everything.
It’s not entirely her fault but people don’t like her.
It would help for her to step down and be replaced by Newsom or Raskin.
Kamala has a weak voice. She doesnt connect with people. Hillary didnt either but for different reasons. Now, you put Stormy Daniels in there and she'd out perform them all. Haha
@@brianlooksaround6125You want the first black woman VP to step aside for another white man?
He should be out doing interviews everywhere including Fox News and everywhere. Hiding is no longer an option for him
@@cmPe6an I really hope he can. Beyond concerns about whether he can win re-election, he needs to do it to assuage fears that he can even go on till Nov.
Yeah, Ornstein's point about that was totally on point.
If he does the interviews and blows it - he will be out.
It was so embarassing to see Biden on stage looking like a zombie after the debate and his wife firing up the crowd, and Joe looking around like he did not know what was going on. Awful and disgusting.
I've turned off every post that brings out the piranhas. What do you mean what do WE do? Are WE in the administration? Are WE going to call for his removal? NO, WE ARE NOT!!
Faint on your couch and get over it. The debate was an embarrassing moment. It's not game 7 in the world series. If anything it's game 1. Let's quit trying to undo his accomplishments from one bruised finger.
Al, stop piling the sh!t on, as Norm is explaining the actual facts in history.
@@cmPe6ana debate is different. He speaks perfectly to an audience or interview. Let the man breathe.
@@justgivemethetruthembarrassing. So what? We don't need to micromanage the election! Move on in full support. Anything else is empty air.
This debate is being super- hyped up! In reality Biden was not all that bad! Yes, Biden is a senior citizen and he has only been trying to save modern civilization from WW3! Give our President a break!
ABSOLUTELY AGREE. Your comment is too intelligent for most people in this gncrzythird-worldcountry offirst-worldcountriesto comprehend.
Wow. I guess having a neurodegenerative disease that progressively impairs your memory while in charge of the nuclear weapons is not worrisome to you. Ok!
Yes, and trump is a Senior Citizen as well, whose agenda is to destroy everything everyone else has done so he can put his stink on it!
@@rmzidannit scares me to death if trump’s rabid temperament would have his finger on the nuclear button is terrifying.
Yeah, but the overwhelming issue is the four years after.
Al and Norm should go on a stadium tour with Mark Elias and Dahlia Lithwick to explain the dangers of a second Trump administration.
If Biden runs, his legacy will be Trump's win. That was NOT just a cold or being tired or a gaffe..
"Full" 60 min. No conditions? No notes?
The only ones who will go to see them would be people who already agree with them.
b/c the MSM would never bother to have them on
@@gheller2261 you underestimate independent voters.
If I was Biden, I would do weekly fireside chats because we are in a crisis and we’re about to go to Civil War. This is not funny. This is not a joke. This is a crisis. Every week, America should see its president.
Franken is the one who should be president. God forbid we put a brain in the oval office.
I was thinkin the same thing
A Jewish man in the oval office? That was laughable before the "free Palestine" bs. Now you have people on the left who won't vote for a Democrat unless he pledges loyalty to radical Islamists. Up is down and down is up.
he had a career going that way until he got hit.
Except he is Jewish. Proud Boys, Oath Keepers, maga cultists would NEVER allow for his Presidency. I'd rather he were kept alive, than President.
Franken speaks too slowly to beat Trump - he is SLOW
Biden needs to do a televised Town Hall with Kamala at his side, answering people's questions and showing that they really are a team working together. This lets Joe be spontaneous and think on his feet without the pressure of having to argue next to a lying bully and restrained to a one-minute response. This is how Joe is at his best: talking to people.
Joe does not look good next to Kamala. She treats him like an old grandpa. Reaching arms out to help, a natural response, makes him look weak. Reinforcing what he says makes it look like his answers need clarification.
He wont
It would backfire. Just as a June debate has.😮
There’s only GREED that Google interrupts with SO MANY advertisements ‼️
not only was it a disaster .. but what does it tell us about the team behind the curtain .?? and how they bungled the entire opportunity & process .. scheduling multiple events prior to the show .. feeding him facts & figures like a policy wonk .. with all the resources at their disposal to have such a colossal failure reflects so poorly on them knowing they have an old guy and behaving as if he's 20 years younger .. if they get this wrong what else will they fail at .. ??
Agree. But with regard to Biden running, he was forced to b/c his designated successor Harris is DEEPLY UNPOPULAR + CAN'T WIN FROM TOP OF TICKET. (HER NET UNFAVORABLES ARE HUGE.) Replace the VP nominee with somebody popular with Dems + Independents + the whole issue of Joe's health goes away.
Not since Uvalde have I been more disappointed.
Trump just spewed his rally misinfo. This prep wasn't difficult.
His staff should be fired. They had him running around all day at events.
Fire his staff. Hire the Lincoln Project folks.
Biden should have said no and he should have taken a LONG nap - if he can't say no - wtf?
Have a source?
there's no good reason for trump to do a 2nd debate .... don't count on it ......
agreed. Why should he?
Agreed he is ahead no reason to gamble- which is exactly what Biden did. Duh.
Jake and Dana are lightweights.
I wonder what they were thinking. Oh, we'd better not offend Trump because the polling says he is going to win, and if we are mean to him he'll come after us next term?
@@justgivemethetruth I suspect they pre-planned exactly how they would proceed. Then knew there is basically one debate between these two. Trump supporters hate them. If they fact check Trump etc, then that could show bias, and people iffy about Trump but potential Trump voters might just say the whole thing was skewed. They set a strict process and it was Biden's to win.. and he didn't.
They are stooges. Highly paid stooges.
They are dimwit failures.
@@justgivemethetruth They were thinking that this was a debate between Trump and Biden, not between Trump and CNN. They had announced beforehand that they weren't going to fact-check either candidate, so the onus was on Biden to counter Trump's lies. They probably had no idea that Biden would fail this hard.
Love you, Al. You’re one of the good guys 🙋🏻♀️
I am very disappointed
I am very disappointed in Franken
"It was a bad debate." Greatest understatement ever. Like saying the titanic had a tiny leak.
-_- Still better than Trump.....man I need a drink
Wait for the dust to settle. Nobody knows what the impact will be. Give Biden a few weeks to prove himself however possible, otherwise convince him to let someone younger take over. If this is old age, he won't be able to. Then we'll know. Nominating a new person won't be easy, and they'll be starting from scratch financially (a huge disadvantage), and will be stepping over a black woman (sure to alienate a big part of the base). Replacing Biden sounds wonderful, but it could be just as painful and divisive as letting an old man past his prime continue. There are no good options, only bad and worse ones. Democrats are surely heading for defeat, even with a new candidate, it might not change the outcome.
Makes me long for the old days when the party brokers picked the candidate instead of endless campaigns.
Increasingly it seems like more democracy is not always better
Every single president since FDR had a weekly address to the American people, until Trump stopped it. Biden -- to my amazement -- failed to restore it. One would think that talking to the American people on a regular basis while thousands are dying during a pandemic would be the highest priority.
My speculation is that giving an address EVERY Saturday would have revealed Biden's condition FAR sooner. Which also would have been a good thing.
If he's up to it he has to address the American people regularly from now on. If he's up to it and decides not to present himself regularly, nobody will believe him. He declined to run in 2016 because his son died & he was mourning so because of that I have accepted him saying he is up to 2 full terms. Now he has to win back my trust but I still think the debate was a tie, neither of them would have won an elementary school debate.
@@isko00011 -- We both want what is BEST for our country.
Thank you for the blunt scary truth of the future. Love that you keep it real! Still time to change it up!! Let's go🎉
No choice: Fascist Authoritarian Dictator Wabna be Monarch OR
Experienced Constitutional man of Honor
Agree with blowing up Chevron Doctrine is a disaster. Re the Grant's Pass anti camping laws, you have to realize that billions of $$ have gone toward the homeless in Los Angeles and most will NOT go into beds offered. They fuel crime. It is a terrible situation. I do think we need mental institutions and rehab to open. It is a housing problem, but not JUST a housing problem. Very complex.
These are ( sad to say ) useless messed up people who are liabilities and endless costs to society.
Not all of them, but many of them. Some are people living in their cars who hold down jobs but just cannot afford to pay for housing that is outrageously expensive - and will not be coming down in price ever.
So rephrasing the problem as - the country does not want to see or have to step over, or experience the crime or unpleasantness of these homeless people. I will never forget I had an interview in downtown SF, CA, and got there and parked on the street, and had to walk past a whole contingent of drugged out creeps lying on the sidewalk to get there. Then when I left and returned to my car the car just parked behind me had been broken into and the police were telling the lady who owned it there's nothing they can do. That was 10 years ago.
Even putting them in camps is going to cost too much and will be a bonanza for corruption and abuse. This is mostly happening I think because the economic squeeze and defunding of the civil infrastructure. The decay of the family, institutions and morals - due to the abusive form of capitalism and no democracy in the last 30 years.
It's a terrible problem, the literal fallout of decades of misguided socio-economic priorities. The obvious to me answer is housing, some kind of low cost, low maintenance, yet still monitored basic shelter with beds, bathrooms, and privacy. New York City used to have SRO hotels, Single Room Occupancy, that kept a lot of people off the street. They were not nice places but they served a function. Some sort of basic, cheap place to sleep and wash is what's needed.
I hope something like that arises from this Grant's Pass ruling. My first thought however, is it will be a boon to the prison-industrial complex, and most likely lead to an increase in private corporate run jails.
@@sydgriffin7591 Agree with you... basic, functional housing with no frills. Here the city is building units at $600,000. Insane. They don't imprison most anyone, here, even criminals! That scares the middle class which is being reduced to nothing.
I voted Biden in 2020. I am for small d democracy and capital D Democratic agenda, but this awful performance is hard to unsee. I agree a town hall is a good idea, but it appears he just can't do it. I am sure his inner circle has thought of this but know that he can only read off a prompter now. His campaign and people have put us all in a bad spot. No other way to put it.
--------Im voting West or Stein
Democracy cannot survive unbridled capitalism.
Id rephrase it as: Capitalism cannot tolerate democracy.
I wouldn't mind seeing Harris v Trump in debate.
She would kick his arse from one coast to the other 👍🤪🎇
Trump would love to debate and/or run against Harris. She's a non-starter. She never connected with voters and it was political malpractice to pull her off the trash heap and put her on the ticket when Biden's NUMBER ONE WEAKNESS was his age. If Joe had a running mate with any political skills whatsoever as his number two, he'd be in a MUCH better position right now. 🤷♂️
@@gkniffen I think the best option at the moment is for Harris to step down and Biden to name an excellent campaigner as a replacement. They should be more centrist-friendly (don't go for DNC base) and be able to pull in the numbers. The largest consensus among voters is that we don't want this matchup in the first place. Trump will pick a lump for a VP (can't give up the spotlight at all), so an impactful pick for DNC VP would have people thinking they will be POTUS soon(er) so vote that way. It would avoid the issues with the convention.
Agreed, Harris can't pull in the numbers. She's fine as a person, but this isn't about her. I don't care if her political career ended tomorrow.
After Al's show, I think the DNC should plan that out, have the talks, and schedule a town hall. If Biden does it again, replace Harris. If he knocks it out of the park (and he would have to), maybe he goes on. Either way, we know in a couple of weeks. A lot depends on superdelegates telling Harris it's not that she's a bad person, but she doesn't have the numbers and won't.
Harris's net unfavorables are HUGE! She can't win from top of ticket. Harris is the reason Joe was forced to run for 2nd term because SHE is currently his defacto successor and SHE CAN'T WIN! Swap out the VP candidate for somebody popular with Dems + Independents, then Biden's health will be a non-issue.
She is not ideal but I think her youth alone paints a nice contrast to Trump.
It can't be a Harris-Newsome ticket because the law says the president and vice president can't be from the same state.
The NyQuil vs. DayQuil hypothesis is plausible. At any rate, he acted very much like someone who had taken an older-generation antihistamine. Those drugs also have anticholinergic effects, which, in addition to reducing mucus (the desired effect) can cause dry mouth and cognitive impairment (some of the anti-dementia meds currently available are pro-cholinergic). Myself, I think he would have been better off canceling or dripping with snot.
Cancelling.
@@cassandratq9301 is that a vote for Biden not having done the debate or a correction of my spelling? (If the latter, I’ll point out that I live in the U.S., where both spellings are accepted 😉.)
I will vote for Biden even though he will lose by more than 30% in my State. This is my last election, I'm not maga or progressive so I'm out of politics.
Ha ha, very good Al and Norm! I'm listening to this early Sunday morn. I've listened to it all, for a couple of days. I'm amazed with your prescience. You guys did well to pull the curtains back on all the Ozes, so close to the event. Applause from me
Ozes?
You don't know what to do? To quote something someone said recently. "When you get knocked down, you get back up!!!"
Not a slam on the show, but this is not a great one. For a change.
Why? I thought Ornstein was pretty good. I have no interest or affection for Franken after he dumped on Israel.
I disagree, These conversations need to take place. It was a mistake to put someone forward who has clear cognitive decline, unable to communicate or defend positions. Ignoring the problem, pushing through, and only talking about how bad Trump is, only makes voters feel like they are being deceived by the DNC and Biden administration.
@@moe_bee And he can’t remember if his mouth is open.
I've always enjoyed hearing Al's chatter.
Not great. I am surprised that Senator Franken and Mr. Ornstein are amongst the Democratic bedwetting. It was 90 damn minutes versus a lifetime of achievements. Get a damn grip.
What about adding more justices to the court
Biden did not do that either.
We'll have to add many, many judges; based on the recent, ridiculous rulings.
For me, the problem with that is the Senate. More justices, more balance, until it isn't. It makes it harder to skew to one party, but if they get there, it takes a lot longer to bring it back into balance.
Senate confirmation would need to be cleaned up. The Turtle's BS showed how faulty that is, and there's no guarantee the Senate isn't 50/50 or goes GOP. The DNC can, unlike the GOP, put forward actual competent centrist justices but if the GOP can just stall until they get to make the picks..
@@dreamcoyote
True, but everything that has happened in recent years has really made clear how much our country has depended on both sides being cooperative and civil. The Republicans broke that when the center of the party moved to the deep south and fascist billionaires. I don't see a continuous smooth in-system way out of this.
Considering this has been talked about since at least FDR and has never been done.. should tell you something
Can anyone explain to me why a “chaotic” convention would be any worse than the chaos of that debate? I’d like to hear an argument as to why a chaotic convention is more threatening to our chances than a candidate who was already losing continuing to prove the Republicans’ case against him (and I’d like that argument to be something other than a cautionary tale about the 1924 Democratic convention, a la David Frum’s latest appeal based on what is at this point ancient f’ing history).
Geez Al, I didn’t think YOU’D panic.
Being pre-retired. (Old and out of work and not wealthy enough to retire) I don't know what day of the week it is anymore except for "Franken Day," formerly known as Sunday. Thanks Al. Also, we need serifs. I can't tell the difference between AI and Al.
I'm Sticking with JOE, Not the psycho!
Stick with a democrat who can win!
The vote of anyone listening to this podcast is not in question. The few as yet undecided voters are in question. These people will decide the election and that is the problem.
It’s time to have a serious discussion on releasing the delegates. I am Gavin Newsom supporter but I want to win. Josh Shapiro and Gretchen Whitmer shoud be nominated for the sake of our country.
Nobody remembers Amy Klobachar. Great nobody hates her smart well spoken very likable female.
@@James-hd4ms amy is not in a swing state. this is raw political calculus
Ornstein proposes some excellent scenarios. Except one: Kamala Harris as replacement. That would be quite unhelpful.
Expatriating to another country is becoming a viable alternative to living in the USA. I just don't see, given our dysfunctional politics, how it gets any better.
Have a 😂trip.
I did a long time ago. I was outsourced because I'm not fluent in Spanish, the first language of the country.
Run!! Run!! Run!!!
Too many weak people in this country.
My grandfather, mom and dad, son, and hopefully not for years my brother, who all served this country, who put their lives on the line..... ARE SPINNING IN THEIR GRAVE!!
RUN Forrest, RUN!!
@@dawnoceanside7300 My grandparents came to this country with their family at the beginning of the last century because they felt they could make a better life for themselves and a better future for their children here. And it was true!
But I don't think it's true any more. That's not running, that's looking ahead with eyes unclouded by nationalism.
I'm Ridin' with Biden, because I deeply value my democracy.
I'm voting BLUE...all the way.
You’re going to the nursing home?
@@James-hd4ms ---I am voting BLUE no matter who is on the ticket against Trump. Joe could decide to step down. So if so, then there will be a replacement, and I will vote for whom ever is the Dem candidate because my vote is to STOP Trump since we all now know what he has in mind in his "Project 2025 Agenda"--which he has made public. And if Trump enacts that Proj-2025, then our Democracy is gone. Thus, I'm voting BLUE---so Trump can be stopped. #VoteBlue
@@lindaAA3101 I agree. It only takes the 7 states.
@@James-hd4ms I would be surprised if Joe steps down. And I looked at the "POLLS" that have been coming out, and one was from BRAZIL, another one was this questionable Poll company, and the other one was an on-line Polling company that is new....So really ,the so-called "polls" that are saying that Biden's popularity dropped "Tremendously" are all questionable. And more time passes,more people are saying they'll stick w/ Biden. Plus he got $30 million since that Debate & that SCOTUS decision from Donors!...I'm voting BLUE to stop Trump...no matter what. JMHO.
Hoping for massive turnout in favor of Biden is not a viable strategy. Biden and Harris should stand aside together so that someone else can step forward and name their own VP. Although they would have only a few months to win over the electorate, just think of the spark it would give to an otherwise dull, awful election.
How about a known quantity, someone who’s been on message his whole life. But the party would sooner descend into fascism then give Bernie a fair chance.
Al , your show was really discouraging and frightening.
It was disappointing to hear about the Supreme Court recent rulings. I still think that Biden has a chance to win in November. You can't judge him because he didn't do well during his first debate.
Second, there were a number of factors why I believe Biden didn't do so well.
1. Biden has been traveling, not stop with meetings in Israel, France. Attending memorials to honor our falling heroes and veterans who fought and sacrificed their life's for our Democracy.
2. Biden needs to fire his campaign manger and staff. They're are partly responsible for Biden not getting enough rest. They should of had the foresight and common sense to realize he was sick with a cold.
The debate should of been canceled by Biden's campaign..
This was poor judgment and it
backfire and Biden paid the price.
Yes it was political malpractice but firing the people who hid his decline does not improve his cognition
For people that were voting "for a ham sammich as long as it's not Trump", having one bad debate won't change that (much). This wasn't a poor performance like other bad debates and the question of his aging won't improve despite any other performances. This one reinforced their argument that he's too old and can't get do the job. I get what he was trying to say, know about the stutter, have experienced full dementia with elderly family. I'm NOT the anti-Biden guy.
Most people don't follow politics like we do, won't even see the changes made/better performances, and their votes are needed for him to win.
This is the elephant that is now out of the room, @@thesimulation9651...could not agree more
I think you’re missing the point here. It’s not enough for Biden to be a good President, he needs to show that he can continue doing the job. Performances like Thursday do not help those who doubt he can do it. One remedy is for him to be out more and do interviews in unfriendly outlets. Hiding is no longer a reasonable option if winning in 2024 is really important to him and all those who care about democracy
@@phemykadri9487 Agreed. The best way for him to salvage his reelection hope is to get out in public and show what he's got. If he doesn't have it, then decisions need to be made. Another Tr*mp presidency is too dangerous to allow.
Add 4 justices to SCOTUS asap
There’s no question. Wake the f up for anyone who thinks otherwise. There is NO downside to replacing him.
I love you Al, this country misses you as a senator. I watched your show for the first time last week and heard the finger picking at the start and wondered, since you are from Minnesota, whether that was kottke. You verified it was on the extro. Kottke is a forgotten man these days, didn't make it on the top 250 guitarists, but neither did tommy bolin, from iowa. Keep up the good work.
I was reminded this week of the 110th anniversary of the flashpoint of World War One in Sarajevo. This calamity was possible because all involved parties were too afraid to say stop this escalation right here, right now.
Thus many historians can say that an assassin became the single most important person of the 20th century.
Don't let another person become the most important person for the 21st century just because we were afraid to say NO to him.
Some of us (me) have been saying this since 2022. He’s not just old he’s creepy old.
No sense in wrestling in the mud as to how the Democratic Party got here but rather how to get out of the mess. This will take heads beyond Biden’s inner circle to figure out.
I wish everyone had taken the day after the debate off, including you, Al, to get some perspective.
Yes, the President’s decisions can be supremely important. When, in the course of the job is that decision needed with in 2 minutes and without notes or advisors? The day to day work of the job is NOT in debate format.
It’s about getting elected!
@@James-hd4ms I must just be stupid. But isn’t using the same methods over and over again expecting a different outcome is insanity?
I cannot believe that 90 minutes of a stupid debate is THE deciding factor for people. I’ve heard comments relating back to perception from the debate. The “winner” shows strength (it matters to few people what is actually said). Then there are criticisms that certain details were not mentioned, like Project 2025 or multiple indictments, etc. So is it bigger that the detail or perception was so terribly off the mark?
For those paying attention it is the lack of detail that produce the most criticisms, however those paying attention to detail have probably already selected their next president.
This brings us to those not paying attention so it is the perception that was paramount.
For those not paying close attention, what do they see? They’ve bought into the republican marketing. Trump is MAGA. He has sold his MAGA followers on their own fame, fortune or security fears. They seemingly are mostly insane, but they make him look bigger than he is. Make him look more forceful than he is. It looks determined. Trump looks like its leader. It is all built on fluff and bullshit, lies and evil. It is insanity at its strongest. It is dangerous.
What do those same people see when they look at Biden? They see an individual. An old man, singular. They have not been shown the power behind everyone that is the Democratic Party. The sales pitch for the election cannot be one man against a movement. It has to be Biden and the group he LEADS and LEADS WELL to beat Trump and the band of self-serving lunatics who fall in line behind him.
@@lorraineh9083 The debate doesn’t matter. The visuals will be seen over and over of a clearly enfeebled slack mouthed gazing off possibly drooling creepy looking senile man. And of course I will vote for him if I have to. Step down, shake things up with an exciting convention and go on to win easily and crush the MAGA party, securing a beautiful future for our country and the world. Or loose.
Biden did not fair too well, but still can be an effective president over the next term.
Only if he discovers the Fountain of Youth.
True, but he has to get there first.
You have to get elected! Why is that such a difficult concept?
Wheres Ponce de Leon & that fountain of youth?
@@lisica8458Where's Ponce de Leon at?
Well done. Thank you kindly.
The Democrats could draft Al Franken. Someone with a comedy background, an American Volodymyr Zelenskyy, Putin's worst nightmare.
Biden needs some new handlers for these political events and, to be fair, a lot more rest!
Like retirement.
Shady Rest Home 4 Life
Gavin and Harris are from CA which is against the Constitution to have a ticket with bith from the same state, so they can't run together.
Harris could move out of CA, to Wyoming for example ;-) like Cheney did.
@justgiveyou clearly know nothing about wyoming...lol
@@kathrynhohmann5697
You're a bit dim and too quick on the blurt.
I thought you knew more than you do. When Bush was running, the tell that Dick Cheney was going to be VP was his move from Texas, where both he and Bush resided, to Wyoming.
@@justgivemethetruth I think they were making a joke more specifically about Harris living in Wyoming than her having to move at all.
@@dreamcoyote
Dude, it was me making the joke suggesting she move to the same state as Cheney did when he ran with Bush.
I think Kamala is extremely unpopular ... but it is problematic for minorities if she is not the candidate.
This is a real screwed-up mess Biden has created from his own selfish vanity.
AL...!!! Please ,Please, Please, Come back to Office....
Terrifying.
I think it's all hands on deck, get our best surrogates out there with the policies, the issues and what they are going to do, what's been done, the infrastructure projects, the cool stuff that's starting up..
The Hitler parallel comments by Norm are just chilling. I wonder what is the foreign involvement and foreign money is in all this. Like we have seen how close Hamas has been in the UN ... what is going on in our country?
Well Putin's plane was parked next to Trump's on VA runway. Just sayin'
I would prefer a good man who sometimes is a bit senile to a crook who is driven by greed
Consider the experience factor.
Consider the kindness factor, which in my mind is
always first, and above all
else, the central and most
important quality among
all men, woman, and nations.
We’re watching the debate with family members of all legal voting ages where my youngest nephew is 28, we all agreed that we vote to save DEMOCRACY, we are not voting for a candidate. All that says, Trump is out of the picture, he’s a destroyer not a builder, a dictator/fascist written on his forehead. VOTE BLUE 💙💙💙💙💙💙💙💙💙
"TrumpAConvictedFelon" enters dictionaries as a 21st Century noun....
Its distressing that half of this discussion is about how to --with baling wire, gorilla glue, and duct tape--put Joe Biden together again. Like Humpty Dumpty. Seems to me that these pundits should be more serious about how a replacement can be found besides just saying how difficult it would be.
Will the story change if Merchan sentences Trump to Jail?
He can't now, although he does have the power to postpone sentencing until after the election.
It occurs to me that we are in a crazy situation when the fate of the world depends on Jill Biden.
How about this one: If Adam Kinzinger changed parties just for this election. He would pick up all the moderate republicans and dems.
Norm Ornstein is one of the very best. Norm and Al Franken together are the best and offer some much needed humor too.
Great interview with Norm, one of my favorite Nerd Avengers.
As a 65 YO fart, I say. Too risky. Get a grip.
Everything will be OK. Too much freakout over one debate. The voters who need to flip were expecting Joe to sound the way he did so they were not surprised and were not concerned. They could hear Trump loud and clear, and they were not impressed. Trump lost support and that is what matters.
This is just me, but whom ever is on the ticket (DEM-wise) against Trump in November, well that Dem is whom I will vote for. Trump and his Project 2025 agenda must be stopped. So we will see in the next week or so what Joe decides to do. If Joe decides to step down--- then the DNC needs to come up w/ an alternative quickly. Anyhow, Trump cannot win, or our Democracy will be destroyed, imho. #voteBlue
You should have watched the debate. The reviews were pretty much “horrifying shit show”.
@@James-hd4ms I tried. It was too much of a train wreck. But rumor has it, Dems are taking it harder than never Trumpers. FOX had conditioned their viewers to not expect much from Biden so they didn't and Trumps hateful, lying rhetoric turned them off. I have talked to Republicans who will vote for Biden regardless. I remain optimistic.
@@James-hd4ms === I watched it and it was a horror. Joe was in a bad state and could not articulate anything....But then let's not forget Trump & his 30+ lies. The whole thing was hard to watch.
Would love to see a 60 min. interview with John Stewart. Have him interview both Biden and that other guy!
Could someone please help Doc and Marty get the almanac back and unskew this awful alternate timeline?
Pretty please? With sugar on top? For the love of God…
A summit could be posted in segments on the internet by topic, consolidated, by "expert," etc.
That was depressing.
Wouldn’t it be best if the presidential incumbent had to compete for the nomination when he/she runs again just like every other candidate? Sure would make it harder for an incumbent to hide and rest on laurels.
There is no turning this around. It was not just bad, it was not just awful, it was lethal. "We finally beat Medicare." This is not stuttering, or just a "gaffe." If he had started out 5 points ahead, I would STILL think he should drop out after this.
This is a nightmare. Biden should have never been the nominee.
Most people look at it all wrong. The format favored the serial liar. The presidency is about principled, deep, measured thought and action, not fast talk. Biden isn't great at fast talk, and he's actively suppressing a profound stutter he's had all his life. Not easy, and he's past the point of appearing sharp because of it. And a presidency is not just about one person...
There may be a better candidate, but given the choices I'm fine with Biden.
Thank you Al for not making excuses nor pulling punches about Biden's performance. // Kamala Harris approval rating is below Biden's. Whoops... Al just said that.
NASCAR with 100 million+ viewers.
Watching two politicians going around in circles is like NASCAR.
You're not going to "learn" anything, you're only watching to see the crash.