Since many people asked this question and I didn't mentioned it in the video I thought to write the answer here: yes, you can use active mixers but DON'T USE THE AMPLIFIED OUTPUTS to generate a feedback loop, because they will FRY your circuit. Use only the passive outputs.
@@PatternFactoryOperat Not necessarily. Depends on if you can defeat noise suppression and may need to seed the feedback loop with a noise input source. It happens to be self-starting on analog because of the noise floor properties.
@@PatternFactoryOperat you can do it on a computer with e.g. ableton live, an audio interface and mixing in some guitar effect pedals etc, routed in & out in a loop, and then performed with your imagination through a midi controller. Just be carefull with gain staging to protect your ears. Learn how your specific feedback system reacts. But yeah, some kind of analog/acoustic signal needs to be involved to make it feed.
Same Here!! Andreji, I had literally boxed up a xenyx1622fx on 2023-04-19 that was going to be thrown out this weekend. I had NEVER considered trying this! And I DO believe in your ethical reason too - at the very least, I will try. Thank You for honestly inspiring my to try this. I've subscribed!!
One of my favorite tricks for feedback loops is to put a stereo tremelo pedal at the end of a loop and split it to two different channels. Without turning on the pedal you can simply achieve a two channel loop from a single output which is cool, but when you turn it on you can get awesome rhythm! Unplug either channel with high depth in the tremolo to get hard chops. I use a behringer ultra tremelo pan for this method cheers to the freaks out there 🎉
@@baileyallenbaker You can connect a sequencer (or a drum machine trig out, as suggested) that sends a cv signal to any audio input of a no input mixer since it is a rather small voltage (usally 5v) and it will interact with the feedback loop in intersting ways with no damage to the circuit.
Very very cool! The example clips near the end blew my mind. Toshimaru Nakamura's "No-Input Mixing Board" albums are my favorite examples of this technique
I remember doing\discovering this by accident years ago with an old rackmount stereo equalizer. When I moved the EQ sliders it changed the sounds. I got some very interesting sound effects. It was feeding back on itself and playing through my home stereo. The EQ had inputs\outputs balanced and unbalanced connections. Yes, I hooked up something wrong but, that’s how I discovered you can make sounds with an EQ feedback. -Cheers!
really love the last part of the video, the idea of giving mixer a second life, probably the most touching idea i've been heard these years, your music philosophy was absolutely mind blowing, thanks andreij for this amazing video
Thanks for this. Seeing all the live jams at the end was awesome. What a concept! And just using what you have on hand - that is powerful. Looking forward to more.
This is quite fitting. I used to work at a music shop when the first behringer gear was coming through , we were laughing at the mixers quality because I noticed the cross talk was so bad you could use outputs as inputs and vice versa haha . So I suppose you could say this has come 'full circle' pun intended 🤣🤣
(And now I know I misspoke when I complained about consumerism on another post of yours -- you seem to have a similar approach to my own. There is a story by William Gibson where one of the characters is a musician/engineer/sculptor who uses disposed objects as his materials and who was referred to as 'sensei no gomi,' a master of garbage. I see that as aspirational.)
@@cravensean Sounds great! And I feel you, being a master of garbage in a world we fullfill with our trash is totally something meaninful. Let me know how it goes with the inherited mixer!
My music buddy and I tried this today and the results were spectacular. I'll be dragging out the old Alesis EQ out tomorrow so we can give that a shot as well. Holy smokes, this is fun. Thank you so much!
YT recommended the magpie vid which led here ... COOL ur inspiring others to get into circuit bending !! I'd also like to add, it's not that far off to just use the opamps themselves. It may seem remarkable/unfathomable to use the components themselves, but what is happening here is just adding wires. You can take the cover off the mixer and add single wires or alligator clips & passives(resistor/cap/inductor)... that will make even MORE sounds and get you into learning electronics
It brings me back a few decades ago (and some burnt tracks on my mixing tables (since of course, I tried on my main and only mixer first, excited and young sound maker, thinking naively I discoverd an uncharted territory (well, at least by me^^). That may be why I had shown so much interest in the japanese experimental scene (Rioji Ikeda, Otomo Yoshihide, Sachiko M, who were in analog works) and the "experimental" soundscapes of the 90's Try the excellent Solliloquy for Lilith by the mysterious Nurse With Wounds, a true ghost piece, with ni sound input, only pedals, feedbacks resonating to create a creepy melody.
Yeah, the Onkyo scene is an amazing source of inspiration. Toshimaru Nakamura is also one that works basically only with no input mixers. But yeah feedback techniques are such a vast field that they were used in many different contexts, like for example in Dub music, in Turntablism, etc etc etc. Such a simple and yet inspirational process that crossed the genres and the years.
I just want to thank you, this video was in my recommended and I tried this today and it was the most fun I had in a while Tried it just with just a few pedal for now, I’m gonna try it next with the rc202 and the Syntakt to see what shenanigans I can make but it scares me a bit more because my mixer is an old mackie, the ones with the crazy gain, lot of character to it but also powerful Thanks again 🙏
You explain in a very easy to understand way and I appreciate that. I have an old mixer and I have to experiment with that too. Great video, thanks for sharing! :)
This is one of thd best Nimb I have seen. I got hooked on diy electronic music years ago and I fully embrace reusing old gear. With new stuff released each day we ard knee deep in yesterdays "hot new item". I repair and hack old pedals radio and tape. You really have mastered shaping this unweildly technique. I have been using filters for a while,The Blurst and Gristliser. Im definitely going to look up that Waldorff. Im looking forward to checking your albums.
@Andreij Rublev I've managed to get some quite varied sounds by patching two mixers together in various ways. Recently I've been exploring no input with guitar pedals too (using a passive matrix mixer or stereo splitter to create feedback loops with them). There are some which give quite interesting results even on their own, such as the Boss MO-2.
I didn't know there were demonstrations of this technique, Ive heard about it many times from noise musicians, particularly Richard Ramirez, it's nice to see a comprehensive demonstration such as this
Andreij, thanks so much for sharing your knowledge and experience. I saw this today and immediately set up my old mixer and spent a few hours having a great time. I’ve recently been using Berna3 and have been looking for a similar approach in Ableton live. This may be it, along with some creative thinking on my part. It is unpredictable but I’m in the mood for a challenge. I’ve subscribed and will be watching for some more insights and inspiration :)
I greatly enjoyed listening to you talking about your passion and philosophy at the end of the video at least as much as the practical tutorial itself.
@@0CETI absolutely, and feedback is used in electroacoustic and electronic music since the beginning of electronic music itself. I didn't invented anything obviously, just showed it in a simple way!
@@0CETI maybe I can add a couple of references in the video's description to make it more clear and help people to explore different ways it was used in the past and nowadays. There are tons of amazing artists who worked with this technique!
It's a new technique for me, and I've been making electronic music since the 1980s. I guess it's similar to tape loops and "pinging" - ideas that go back to the musique concrete era, but never achieved mainstream recognition.
Yup. At the end of the day it is all nothing but voltages inside an audio circuit that are being altered. The basics of how a sound is created and shaped inside an analog synth :) Even without an actual raw-sound generating oscillator. A Feedback loop is a great idea. You can even use a ground-hum noise as a sorta source for a raw sound that you can shape. And turning an often unwanted humming buzz into a usable sound to shape and alter.
I agree, I use feedback and pedals. Sometimes I'll use a cheap unfiltered non isolated power supply alongside high gain units like Metal Zone and Tube Screamers, you can really start to work that 50hz when you clip it hard.
obligatory Merzbow would be proud comment interesting video, never knew how they make those sounds, and really appreciate the bands and projects at the end, definitively worth a listen. Maybe I'll pick up on it if I find a used mixer at dirt cheap or happen to know someone who has no use for it anymore, who knows
First thanx for the entry into the no input world. Your Video for Simon the Magpie flashed me and inspired me to use this technique with my old back up dj-mixer, a reloop scratch pro dj-battlemixer... Now my question: Which output you prefer to grab the sound?! Make it any diffrent if i use the master-out, the booth-out or the headphone-out? Ask cause i use the headphone-output to grab the sound out of my reloop scratch pro dj-battlemixer i use for N.I.M.B. technique. ...i use the headphone-out cause it's on frontside and all other in's and out's are on the back. Greetz
Thank you for the kind words! Yes, you can use whatever output you prefer. Usually the main one or the phones one are ok because you can easily control their volume, but of course it depends also on the patch and on the mixer's routing possibilities! There is no wrong or right, it's just a matter of finding your own way to use it!
Can it damage the mixer that he's allways in the redlight zone by using em that way? Heard in a video that some mixer's are killed by it quickly. That's why i don't try it with my good old yamaha mg10/6 (sometimes still need him). ...anyway, it's absolutly fun to play with N.I.M.B. technique.
@@3-ZEE In my personal experience I've never damaged any mixer in years and years (and some of them have literally hundreds of continous hours of feedback on their back). But of course my suggestion is always to use partially broken mixers, cheap second hand ones, etc. Something you won't use for any other purpose.
Good to know ...but yes it makes sence to use cheap used or broken once. Have 2 other old dj-mixer's which crossfader's are no longer in good conditions and one of them have balance problems with the panning. This one should be interesting to use. It's a bit crazy, i run through the day and in my mind i hear me allways asking "what can you turn into a modular synth like instrument?". I mean it should work even with an HiFi Amplifer if you use the tape out. This technique is in my eyes as easy to start with, as it is freaky and nerdy (in the best way).
i love this so much. frying squeal synth at 7:00 and others reminds me of 2000s kinda sonig/sun papi ok ko/jab mica och el/ Nathan Michel and stuff scene
Hello. I dare saying I did not know this technic despite making electronic music during 50 years and I have an old Spirit Folio Lite Soundcraft 12 inputs table in a corner of my studio sleeping under the dust . I was looking at SOMA Lyra but expensive. So your video is completely relaunchoing my interest in free music creation. You' re great !
So glad to hear that! I have a spirit folio 12 too! Such a good mixer, lot of routing possibilities! Hope you'll have fun with it! And thank you for the nice words!
This is fascinating technique. At 1m 36s you say "it's very difficult to broke anything". If I had known this, I would have been doing it 40 years ago, Thank You!! It does make sense for an analogue circuit to behave this way. I don't think the results from a digital mixer would be as usable (digital distortion) and I don't want to risk one to find out.
I do this with pedals and Matrix mixers, digital pedals, especially the cheap ones will clip in in an unusable way, like a high frequency radio static. It's possible but you need to carefully control the levels and place those pedals carefully in thd chain. Which limits the creativity you get from the spontaneous results.
Woooow, sounds like a collection of Aphex Twin samples. Thanks for a good idea to get the "He's going completely mad" sticker from my neighbours during the long evenings of this winter.
15:57 I do experiment with feedback in a modular system. Interesting that the results are very different from using mixer and pedals. Attended some performances with no input mixing on a noise festival in Berlin and it was a mind blowing experience.
the pedal vs modular thing is mostly down to impedance and the (failure to) gain of one V range patched into the next input and of course the routing and mixing stages [i've had most of the metasonix tube modules and my favorite euro-format noise-gen is the 4ms NoiseSwash. In pedals I love DIY anything ...and the EHX Flanger Hoax fits this video to a T ]
Thanks for putting together this great tutorial! Question: Have you played around with these feedback loop techniques well, having regular audio feed into the chain? For example, a guitar feeds into the mixer but then you use these kinds of ideas to play with the audio
You can totally do that, just connect your guitar to the mixer. Of course, as said in the video, don't connect the mixer directly to your amp (the speaker) but use something else in between: another mixer, an audio interface, etc. Something that you can use to control the maximum volume before going into your final speaker/headphones. You can use the feedbacks as a sort of extreme distortion, and the mixer a sort of effect for your guitar. Of course the interaction between the feedback and the guitar sound is unpredictable and you need to try it to find the timbre you are looking for.
You're a genius!!!!! I need a Mixer,a sampler, a hammer, Metal, a YAMAHA DX 7, alot of cables and some guitar effect pedals...... And I can do anything at musical steps with some very new ideas... Maybe I find some cheap of them........ Greetings from germany!!!
Well that was cool I'm gonna have to watch this video now. As somebody who inherited a mixer that was thrown out from the TV station in their dumpster then got new life in a church then that got replaced and it's sitting in my basement I've been wondering what to do with that 32 channel behemoth. And the thought about playing around with feedback internally in the mixer has popped into my mind a few times.....
I was doing this with my 4 track tape deck in 2007.. the reason I know it was 2007 is all my taped music recordings have a high pitched buzz from that year so I must of left something connected 😮. Seems about 2021 when I was digitizing my tape archive for further mixing and stuff…. I did throw out the 4 track .. I wish I had not . Thanks for the video I needed it in 2007. 😅. Subscription added
Great! I recently started to try out digital version of this technique, I use Logic Pro's built-in effects and routing capabilities to create feedback loops and manipulate them in realtime.
Very impressive. I still own a Dutch D&R 1500 inline mixer in which one can create a whole bunch of subgroups by switching channels in and out of a matrix. That should be fun.
Several years ago I connected some random output and input on my basic Yamaha mixer and accidentally created slap back echo. Can't remember what I did ???. Not been able to do it again.
I made a multi band EQ thing from a article in Popular Electronics in the 70's. It had a tiny amp in it to support the signal strength when the frequencies were cut. Then I got the idea, what if I connected the output to the input with a volume knob in-between. I had a weird 10 knob tone generator. Really fun stuff. This is the same idea here. Now I have a MXR 10 band EQ pedal for my guitar .... HMMMM
It's totally worth a try. I used some external inputs (not a radio but the principle is the same) into the feedback chain in the last video here: ruclips.net/video/z7l4x_5z1dg/видео.html
nice, thank you, haven't done this, we had an amp head with EQ and distortion ran to the Shredmaster distortion pedal with a looping delay for time stretch on it's effect loop, would be kind of expensive now, 25yrs ago they were just broken lumps of house paint
It's even possible in soft-synths like VCV Rack, but you have to seed it with a noise or pulse input since most things don't simulate the inherent noise floor that exists in real hardware. And one should put a limiter between this and the main output, because it can definitely peak really fast on feedback if you don't catch it.
Totally. I showed a vcv rack patch just as a quick example. But of course didn't have the time to explain the whole process, for the sake of length of the video. Thank you for the added informations!
when i was younger i had groove box by roland , pc and some mixing programm - and just spend 24/7 playng......i did nothg special in end but that was hell of a fun!
Using a mixer as a sound generator? I love it! I wanna try this with a mixer that has an EQ where you can sweep the frequencies. My first idea: With three channels or more (and corresponding number of outputs) you could make a chord.
It is definetely possible but in some mixers there is also some cross talking between channels, so they influence each other and it's impossibile to have 3 indipendent sounds. In a large mixer with more routing possibilities it is definetely easier.
Do you havve a video about cheap but good or only good effect pedals, specialy to combine with a N.I.M.B. or to use for No Input technique? Sorry for all my questions, but you are a pro and i'm a noobie in production or live-jamming.
have created sounds that can take a while to make in daw, such a time saver, the reese basses are sooooooo siiick !! am using a beat up xenyx24fx with plenty of crust, the crust is the best bit, its like as you say a modular system, the tonality is crazy good thank you for sharing this.
@@AndreijRublev its great! something i came across while browsing was LiveSPICE , its free audio circuit building software, with fairly good emulation. only seems to work in reaper tho.
Dear Andreij, very thanks! And what about digital mixers? How would it works? Could we repeat the same procedures? Is there any risk to equipments? I´m loving all here...
Happy you like it here! In general it should work also on a digital mixer, but since I've never tried with one of those I cannot say if they have some sort of feedback protection in the DAC section. Probably it depends on the specific mixer features. Also I don't know how the Digital to Analog converters will react, they are probably built to manage clipping and saturated signals, but I don't know if they can be damaged on the long run, since I've never tested it. The analog part of the circuit is totally safe if you use only line level signals, but not sure about the converters.
Really enjoying your channel. I recently sold a no brand 8 ch mixer that I paid to much money for and was sour on, and because I didn't know what to do with it.I thought it was just taking up space. But after watching StMag and youI bought another, bigger, and heavier 16 ch mixer for the same price that I sold the other (apparently two channels are a bit "noisy.") 🙄 It has main stereo out, 3x AUX 1pre, 2 post fader), headphone out, monitor out, AND a TRS "Insert" jack for each channel. These send, and receive... Have you ever fooled around with the Insert jacks? If so how do you use them for No Input mixing?
@@AndreijRublev Interesting. Thanks for the "feedback" 🤣 Anyway, Insert cables are split right? Tip-send, Sleeve-receive... so are Insert cables different to stereo-twin mono cables? If so, how would you use the cables in cross-channel patches? Do you have a video on any of this?
I came here because Simon the Magpie was so annoying and kept talking over your video. Excellent work and you got a thumbs up and a sub, Simon got nothing off me 😆
I used to do this in the 1990s, taking the aux outs from a 4-track into rackmount effects and back to a channel input instead of the aux return. I still have tapes of multitracked fx feedback! I was planning to sample it, but didn't even have a sampler. By the time I got the ability to start sampling stuff I'd decided it sounded horrible and never bothered 😅
![I.N "HALLUCINATION" | [Stray Kids : SKZ-PLAYER]](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/n5B5q1Hwt_U/mqdefault.jpg)
Since many people asked this question and I didn't mentioned it in the video I thought to write the answer here: yes, you can use active mixers but DON'T USE THE AMPLIFIED OUTPUTS to generate a feedback loop, because they will FRY your circuit. Use only the passive outputs.
and this work only on analog mixer ;)
@@PatternFactoryOperat Not necessarily. Depends on if you can defeat noise suppression and may need to seed the feedback loop with a noise input source. It happens to be self-starting on analog because of the noise floor properties.
@@PatternFactoryOperat you can do it on a computer with e.g. ableton live, an audio interface and mixing in some guitar effect pedals etc, routed in & out in a loop, and then performed with your imagination through a midi controller. Just be carefull with gain staging to protect your ears. Learn how your specific feedback system reacts. But yeah, some kind of analog/acoustic signal needs to be involved to make it feed.
Je suis surpris
Would a pre amp on the mixer register as an amplified output?
Shout out to Simon The Magpie for showing me this!!! I’m very happy to find another awesome channel
Thank you so much! Happy to have you here!
Same Here!! Andreji, I had literally boxed up a xenyx1622fx on 2023-04-19 that was going to be thrown out this weekend. I had NEVER considered trying this! And I DO believe in your ethical reason too - at the very least, I will try. Thank You for honestly inspiring my to try this. I've subscribed!!
@@e.b.1279 thank you! The ethical part of it is something that really matters to me, so I'm super glad to hear that.
One of my favorite tricks for feedback loops is to put a stereo tremelo pedal at the end of a loop and split it to two different channels. Without turning on the pedal you can simply achieve a two channel loop from a single output which is cool, but when you turn it on you can get awesome rhythm! Unplug either channel with high depth in the tremolo to get hard chops. I use a behringer ultra tremelo pan for this method cheers to the freaks out there 🎉
Sounds awesome! Thanks for sharing this trick!
John is that you?
Wow, just cancelled my plans for the rest of the day to go play with feedback!! Thanks for a fantastic tutorial
Super happy to hear that! Have fun!
You can use a trig out from a drum machine, which is just a 5v pulse, in combination with this technique, to create more rhythmic pulses of feedback
Totally! I use also cv signals in more complex setups but here I tried to cover the basics to not have a 3 hours long video ;)
@@AndreijRublev I want to see CV used 👍
It's on the list ;)
@silvertongues2 how would you do that?
@@baileyallenbaker You can connect a sequencer (or a drum machine trig out, as suggested) that sends a cv signal to any audio input of a no input mixer since it is a rather small voltage (usally 5v) and it will interact with the feedback loop in intersting ways with no damage to the circuit.
Very very cool! The example clips near the end blew my mind. Toshimaru Nakamura's "No-Input Mixing Board" albums are my favorite examples of this technique
Absolutely a master and a reference!
legit one of the best music making videos I've ever seen. you're a legend. thank you!
Thank you so much for your super kind words!
I remember doing\discovering this by accident years ago with an old rackmount stereo equalizer. When I moved the EQ sliders it changed the sounds. I got some very interesting sound effects. It was feeding back on itself and playing through my home stereo. The EQ had inputs\outputs balanced and unbalanced connections. Yes, I hooked up something wrong but, that’s how I discovered you can make sounds with an EQ feedback. -Cheers!
Lovely! Thank you for sharing your memories!
really love the last part of the video, the idea of giving mixer a second life, probably the most touching idea i've been heard these years, your music philosophy was absolutely mind blowing, thanks andreij for this amazing video
Thank you for your kind words! That is super important for me, I'm happy this approach is shared by other people!
Excellent work Andreij! So happy to have a tutorial from you
Thank you! Happy you enjoyed it!
Thanks for this. Seeing all the live jams at the end was awesome. What a concept! And just using what you have on hand - that is powerful. Looking forward to more.
Thank you! There will be more in the future!
This is quite fitting. I used to work at a music shop when the first behringer gear was coming through , we were laughing at the mixers quality because I noticed the cross talk was so bad you could use outputs as inputs and vice versa haha .
So I suppose you could say this has come 'full circle' pun intended 🤣🤣
Cross talk is perfect for feedback modulation and unpredictable results! I love it!
Thank you so much. I inherited a mixer today -- one does not inherit lightly -- and I am so grateful for this. I'm looking forward to some fun.
(And now I know I misspoke when I complained about consumerism on another post of yours -- you seem to have a similar approach to my own. There is a story by William Gibson where one of the characters is a musician/engineer/sculptor who uses disposed objects as his materials and who was referred to as 'sensei no gomi,' a master of garbage. I see that as aspirational.)
@@cravensean Sounds great! And I feel you, being a master of garbage in a world we fullfill with our trash is totally something meaninful. Let me know how it goes with the inherited mixer!
@@AndreijRublev Bless you and keep you and I will try to do so.
My music buddy and I tried this today and the results were spectacular. I'll be dragging out the old Alesis EQ out tomorrow so we can give that a shot as well. Holy smokes, this is fun. Thank you so much!
@@cravensean Super happy to hear that!
YT recommended the magpie vid which led here ... COOL ur inspiring others to get into circuit bending !! I'd also like to add, it's not that far off to just use the opamps themselves. It may seem remarkable/unfathomable to use the components themselves, but what is happening here is just adding wires. You can take the cover off the mixer and add single wires or alligator clips & passives(resistor/cap/inductor)... that will make even MORE sounds and get you into learning electronics
Thanks! Yeah, that can be super interesting too!
man, this is sick. I come from simon the magpie channel. I will watch this video a bunch of times. liked and subscribed ofc. keep up, good luck!
Thank you! Happy you liked it!
Cool video. The Scratch Perverts DJ crew used similar techniques on DJ mixers to create feedback bass/lead lines in the early 2000's. Innovative stuff
Didn't know that, thank you for the information!
It brings me back a few decades ago (and some burnt tracks on my mixing tables (since of course, I tried on my main and only mixer first, excited and young sound maker, thinking naively I discoverd an uncharted territory (well, at least by me^^).
That may be why I had shown so much interest in the japanese experimental scene (Rioji Ikeda, Otomo Yoshihide, Sachiko M, who were in analog works) and the "experimental" soundscapes of the 90's
Try the excellent Solliloquy for Lilith by the mysterious Nurse With Wounds, a true ghost piece, with ni sound input, only pedals, feedbacks resonating to create a creepy melody.
Yeah, the Onkyo scene is an amazing source of inspiration. Toshimaru Nakamura is also one that works basically only with no input mixers. But yeah feedback techniques are such a vast field that they were used in many different contexts, like for example in Dub music, in Turntablism, etc etc etc. Such a simple and yet inspirational process that crossed the genres and the years.
I just want to thank you, this video was in my recommended and I tried this today and it was the most fun I had in a while
Tried it just with just a few pedal for now, I’m gonna try it next with the rc202 and the Syntakt to see what shenanigans I can make but it scares me a bit more because my mixer is an old mackie, the ones with the crazy gain, lot of character to it but also powerful
Thanks again 🙏
Thank you! I'm super happy you are having fun!
PERFECT, found myself an MX802A not too long ago, stoked to try these out :)
Cheers Andreij (+ Simon the Magpie for the link to this!)
Ohhh glad to hear that! Let us know how it will go!
"no input mixer technique" was not on my bingo card for today. Horizons broadened. Good stuff :-)
Thanks! Glad to hear that!
You explain in a very easy to understand way and I appreciate that. I have an old mixer and I have to experiment with that too. Great video, thanks for sharing! :)
I tried to be as clear as possible, happy to hear that it worked! Thank you for the kind words!
So cool. Subbed!!
Thank you! Glad you liked it!
I almost threw out a bad mixer & now I am eternally grateful I did not!! Will be trying this when I wake up 🔥🔥🔥
Glad you didn't do it! And have fun with it! It's always magic to give a new life to something that apparently is "dead".
This is one of thd best Nimb I have seen. I got hooked on diy electronic music years ago and I fully embrace reusing old gear. With new stuff released each day we ard knee deep in yesterdays "hot new item". I repair and hack old pedals radio and tape. You really have mastered shaping this unweildly technique. I have been using filters for a while,The Blurst and Gristliser. Im definitely going to look up that Waldorff. Im looking forward to checking your albums.
Thank you so much! Your words mean really a lot to me!
@@stuartchapman5171 Thank you for the invitation, much appreciated! I'll let you know when I will be in the UK!
It's amazing what sounds and beats are hidden inside mixers.
It's always a surprise for me too, even after so many years using this technique.
@Andreij Rublev I've managed to get some quite varied sounds by patching two mixers together in various ways. Recently I've been exploring no input with guitar pedals too (using a passive matrix mixer or stereo splitter to create feedback loops with them). There are some which give quite interesting results even on their own, such as the Boss MO-2.
@@domek. Sounds great! I never used a matrix mixer but it's on my list!
@Andreij Rublev Definitely a very useful tool for sound experimentation!
You are amazing - enjoyed that video very much.
Good explanations and demonstration, Thanks
Thank you for your kind words!
I didn't know there were demonstrations of this technique, Ive heard about it many times from noise musicians, particularly Richard Ramirez, it's nice to see a comprehensive demonstration such as this
Thank you! Happy to share some noise knowledge!
Andreij, thanks so much for sharing your knowledge and experience. I saw this today and immediately set up my old mixer and spent a few hours having a great time. I’ve recently been using Berna3 and have been looking for a similar approach in Ableton live. This may be it, along with some creative thinking on my part. It is unpredictable but I’m in the mood for a challenge. I’ve subscribed and will be watching for some more insights and inspiration :)
Thank you! I really like Berna and all of the Giorgio Sancristoforo's virtual instruments!
I greatly enjoyed listening to you talking about your passion and philosophy at the end of the video at least as much as the practical tutorial itself.
Thank you! Much appreciated!
This kind of inventiveness and unpredictability reminds me of the instruments made by Soma, such as the Lyra and Pulsar. Great stuff!
Thank you!
Inventiveness? I mean, don't get me wrong video is nice, but people have been doing no input mixer processing since the 80's lol.
@@0CETI absolutely, and feedback is used in electroacoustic and electronic music since the beginning of electronic music itself. I didn't invented anything obviously, just showed it in a simple way!
@@0CETI maybe I can add a couple of references in the video's description to make it more clear and help people to explore different ways it was used in the past and nowadays. There are tons of amazing artists who worked with this technique!
It's a new technique for me, and I've been making electronic music since the 1980s. I guess it's similar to tape loops and "pinging" - ideas that go back to the musique concrete era, but never achieved mainstream recognition.
Yup. At the end of the day it is all nothing but voltages inside an audio circuit that are being altered. The basics of how a sound is created and shaped inside an analog synth :) Even without an actual raw-sound generating oscillator. A Feedback loop is a great idea. You can even use a ground-hum noise as a sorta source for a raw sound that you can shape. And turning an often unwanted humming buzz into a usable sound to shape and alter.
Totally agree!❤
I agree, I use feedback and pedals. Sometimes I'll use a cheap unfiltered non isolated power supply alongside high gain units like Metal Zone and Tube Screamers, you can really start to work that 50hz when you clip it hard.
obligatory Merzbow would be proud comment
interesting video, never knew how they make those sounds, and really appreciate the bands and projects at the end, definitively worth a listen. Maybe I'll pick up on it if I find a used mixer at dirt cheap or happen to know someone who has no use for it anymore, who knows
I hope you'll find one! And thanks for the nice words about the bands!
ilpo väisänen and mika vainio aka pan(a)sonic would be also proud.
@@dualsphere that's a great compliment! Thank you!
First thanx for the entry into the no input world. Your Video for Simon the Magpie flashed me and inspired me to use this technique with my old back up dj-mixer, a reloop scratch pro dj-battlemixer...
Now my question:
Which output you prefer to grab the sound?! Make it any diffrent if i use the master-out, the booth-out or the headphone-out? Ask cause i use the headphone-output to grab the sound out of my reloop scratch pro dj-battlemixer i use for N.I.M.B. technique. ...i use the headphone-out cause it's on frontside and all other in's and out's are on the back. Greetz
Thank you for the kind words! Yes, you can use whatever output you prefer. Usually the main one or the phones one are ok because you can easily control their volume, but of course it depends also on the patch and on the mixer's routing possibilities! There is no wrong or right, it's just a matter of finding your own way to use it!
Can it damage the mixer that he's allways in the redlight zone by using em that way? Heard in a video that some mixer's are killed by it quickly. That's why i don't try it with my good old yamaha mg10/6 (sometimes still need him).
...anyway, it's absolutly fun to play with N.I.M.B. technique.
@@3-ZEE In my personal experience I've never damaged any mixer in years and years (and some of them have literally hundreds of continous hours of feedback on their back). But of course my suggestion is always to use partially broken mixers, cheap second hand ones, etc. Something you won't use for any other purpose.
Good to know ...but yes it makes sence to use cheap used or broken once. Have 2 other old dj-mixer's which crossfader's are no longer in good conditions and one of them have balance problems with the panning. This one should be interesting to use. It's a bit crazy, i run through the day and in my mind i hear me allways asking "what can you turn into a modular synth like instrument?". I mean it should work even with an HiFi Amplifer if you use the tape out. This technique is in my eyes as easy to start with, as it is freaky and nerdy (in the best way).
Amazing video! Thank you for sharing this really cool and super creative technique!
Thank you!
Today I learned a cool new way to use mixers, thank you!
Happy it was useful!
i love this so much. frying squeal synth at 7:00 and others reminds me of 2000s kinda sonig/sun papi ok ko/jab mica och el/ Nathan Michel and stuff scene
Names noted! Thanks ❤
@@AndreijRublev youre welcome :)
Hello. I dare saying I did not know this technic despite making electronic music during 50 years and I have an old Spirit Folio Lite Soundcraft 12 inputs table in a corner of my studio sleeping under the dust . I was looking at SOMA Lyra but expensive. So your video is completely relaunchoing my interest in free music creation. You' re great !
So glad to hear that! I have a spirit folio 12 too! Such a good mixer, lot of routing possibilities! Hope you'll have fun with it! And thank you for the nice words!
Thank you for freely sharing your knowledge with us. This has pushed away my desires for an unobtainable Syntrx
Always happy to share good stuff! Thank you!
Bro this is dope, a mixer can now be centre stage
This is fascinating technique. At 1m 36s you say "it's very difficult to broke anything". If I had known this, I would have been doing it 40 years ago, Thank You!! It does make sense for an analogue circuit to behave this way. I don't think the results from a digital mixer would be as usable (digital distortion) and I don't want to risk one to find out.
Yeah don't risk it if you don't feel it. Analog mixers are perfect for the goal!
I do this with pedals and Matrix mixers, digital pedals, especially the cheap ones will clip in in an unusable way, like a high frequency radio static. It's possible but you need to carefully control the levels and place those pedals carefully in thd chain. Which limits the creativity you get from the spontaneous results.
Very nice, tapping into the primal roots of electronic music, i was getting a few Forbidden Planet vibes there
Oh thanks! Much appreciated!
bro !! you just changed my world with this hahahaha soooo cool! sooo easy, sooo cheap!! will be looking out for the crusty mixers !
Super happy to hear that! Have fun!
This is amazing. Changed my life just now. My mind is blown. Can I use a powered mixer?
Woooow, sounds like a collection of Aphex Twin samples. Thanks for a good idea to get the "He's going completely mad" sticker from my neighbours during the long evenings of this winter.
Glad you like it! Hope it will help you to make the winter less boring ;)
I'll be darned it works. The man is a genius! Thanks for a great video. "Souvenirs, Novelties, Party Tricks.."🤣
Not a genius, just a noise aficionado, but thanks!
15:57 I do experiment with feedback in a modular system. Interesting that the results are very different from using mixer and pedals.
Attended some performances with no input mixing on a noise festival in Berlin and it was a mind blowing experience.
That's super nice!
the pedal vs modular thing is mostly down to impedance
and the (failure to) gain of one V range patched into the next input
and of course the routing and mixing stages
[i've had most of the metasonix tube modules and my favorite euro-format noise-gen is the 4ms NoiseSwash. In pedals I love DIY anything ...and the EHX Flanger Hoax fits this video to a T ]
The technique always amuses me.. It is such a mysterious and lovely technique..
It's still surprising and fascinating for me too, after so many years working on it!
Thanks for putting together this great tutorial! Question: Have you played around with these feedback loop techniques well, having regular audio feed into the chain? For example, a guitar feeds into the mixer but then you use these kinds of ideas to play with the audio
You can totally do that, just connect your guitar to the mixer. Of course, as said in the video, don't connect the mixer directly to your amp (the speaker) but use something else in between: another mixer, an audio interface, etc. Something that you can use to control the maximum volume before going into your final speaker/headphones. You can use the feedbacks as a sort of extreme distortion, and the mixer a sort of effect for your guitar. Of course the interaction between the feedback and the guitar sound is unpredictable and you need to try it to find the timbre you are looking for.
Thanks for this !
I would love to see more about this subject ;)
Thank you! I will do more for sure!
@@AndreijRublev I am looking forward
You're a genius!!!!! I need a Mixer,a sampler, a hammer, Metal, a YAMAHA DX 7, alot of cables and some guitar effect pedals...... And I can do anything at musical steps with some very new ideas... Maybe I find some cheap of them........ Greetings from germany!!!
Not really a genius, just a guy who likes noises 😊!
Awesome as always Andreij! Another gem from your channel 🙂
Thank you! Much appreciated!
Good stuff :-) getting so much out of one piece of gear. Do you use balance or unbalanced cables? The performances at the end are awesome
Thank you! Unbalanced cables!
@@AndreijRublev thx :-) and again, great great stuff you are putting out
@@yvesbajulaz Glad to hear that! Much appreciated ❤
Well that was cool I'm gonna have to watch this video now. As somebody who inherited a mixer that was thrown out from the TV station in their dumpster then got new life in a church then that got replaced and it's sitting in my basement I've been wondering what to do with that 32 channel behemoth. And the thought about playing around with feedback internally in the mixer has popped into my mind a few times.....
That mixer had a super interesting life and deserves a new one for sure! Have fun with it!
This is sooo cool! It totally works! I'm doing it right now. I'm about to go looking for more mixers...😮
Let's go!
This was very inspiring Andreij, thank you so much!
Glad to hear it! Thank you!
Excellent video, I've been meaning to try this for a few years now, I think it's finally the time
Glad it inspired you! Have fun!
Here from Magpie, this is the first time I've seen this technique. Very cool!
Happy you liked it!
The life and times of a mixing table, hehe. Very avant-garde.
I love the "life and time" vision!
This technique is fascinating and pioneering and everything. Thanks!
Super fascinating, I agree! But there are many people that used it in the past, so I'm more of an humble noisemaker than a pioneer hahaha
I was doing this with my 4 track tape deck in 2007.. the reason I know it was 2007 is all my taped music recordings have a high pitched buzz from that year so I must of left something connected 😮. Seems about 2021 when I was digitizing my tape archive for further mixing and stuff…. I did throw out the 4 track .. I wish I had not . Thanks for the video I needed it in 2007. 😅. Subscription added
Thank you for sharing your memories!
Nice!
Thanks!
Great! I recently started to try out digital version of this technique, I use Logic Pro's built-in effects and routing capabilities to create feedback loops and manipulate them in realtime.
Let's go!
Thanks Andreij, this is pretty much something. Great!
Thanks! Happy you liked it!
Very impressive. I still own a Dutch D&R 1500 inline mixer in which one can create a whole bunch of subgroups by switching channels in and out of a matrix. That should be fun.
absolutely! More internal routing possibilities more fun!
Several years ago I connected some random output and input on my basic Yamaha mixer and accidentally created slap back echo. Can't remember what I did ???. Not been able to do it again.
I made a multi band EQ thing from a article in Popular Electronics in the 70's. It had a tiny amp in it to support the signal strength when the frequencies were cut. Then I got the idea, what if I connected the output to the input with a volume knob in-between. I had a weird 10 knob tone generator. Really fun stuff. This is the same idea here. Now I have a MXR 10 band EQ pedal for my guitar .... HMMMM
Sounds great ;) Have fun!
I use one of those. It plays especially nice with modulators, of any sort.
@@ExcessiveSpareTime definetely gonna try that in the future!
Now you've got the gears turning. I wonder how we can influence the tones generated with radio frequencies.
It's totally worth a try. I used some external inputs (not a radio but the principle is the same) into the feedback chain in the last video here: ruclips.net/video/z7l4x_5z1dg/видео.html
nice, thank you, haven't done this, we had an amp head with EQ and distortion ran to the Shredmaster distortion pedal with a looping delay for time stretch on it's effect loop, would be kind of expensive now, 25yrs ago they were just broken lumps of house paint
Thanks for sharing your memories!
It's even possible in soft-synths like VCV Rack, but you have to seed it with a noise or pulse input since most things don't simulate the inherent noise floor that exists in real hardware. And one should put a limiter between this and the main output, because it can definitely peak really fast on feedback if you don't catch it.
Totally. I showed a vcv rack patch just as a quick example. But of course didn't have the time to explain the whole process, for the sake of length of the video. Thank you for the added informations!
when i was younger i had groove box by roland , pc and some mixing programm - and just spend 24/7 playng......i did nothg special in end but that was hell of a fun!
That's all that matters! Super happy you had fun at that time and hope you are having fun nowadays too!
Awesome, today I tried this with my yamaha o1V. With the internal patch and effects there were a lot of possibilities
Great! Happy you found something interesting!
Do more like this I'm definitely wanting to see more about this and more things about the details of how it works
It's on the list 😊!
Using a mixer as a sound generator? I love it! I wanna try this with a mixer that has an EQ where you can sweep the frequencies.
My first idea: With three channels or more (and corresponding number of outputs) you could make a chord.
It is definetely possible but in some mixers there is also some cross talking between channels, so they influence each other and it's impossibile to have 3 indipendent sounds. In a large mixer with more routing possibilities it is definetely easier.
Do you havve a video about cheap but good or only good effect pedals, specialy to combine with a N.I.M.B. or to use for No Input technique? Sorry for all my questions, but you are a pro and i'm a noobie in production or live-jamming.
No worries! Always happy to answer! Yes, I have a video about pedals and no input here: ruclips.net/video/atQnddfG47c/видео.html
Super Cool!! Thanks Andreij!!
Thank you! Happy you liked it!
that's amazing!!! thank you for sharing this, i had no idea! looks super fun.
you play very well even though i had to cover my ears a few times ;)
Thank you for the appreciation!
Impressive some of them can be a source for sampling, shape in the right way all of those impredictable drone can be a good sound design started.
Totally agree!
have created sounds that can take a while to make in daw, such a time saver, the reese basses are sooooooo siiick !! am using a beat up xenyx24fx with plenty of crust, the crust is the best bit, its like as you say a modular system, the tonality is crazy good thank you for sharing this.
Glad you are having fun!
@@AndreijRublev its great! something i came across while browsing was LiveSPICE , its free audio circuit building software, with fairly good emulation. only seems to work in reaper tho.
This is super cool!!!! Best video I watch today
impressively inventive
I've seen some gear familiar to me 🙂Thanks for this massive video tutorial! See you this Sunday ;-)
Eheheh I know you know ;)! See you on Sunday!
Dear Andreij, very thanks! And what about digital mixers? How would it works? Could we repeat the same procedures? Is there any risk to equipments? I´m loving all here...
Happy you like it here! In general it should work also on a digital mixer, but since I've never tried with one of those I cannot say if they have some sort of feedback protection in the DAC section. Probably it depends on the specific mixer features. Also I don't know how the Digital to Analog converters will react, they are probably built to manage clipping and saturated signals, but I don't know if they can be damaged on the long run, since I've never tested it. The analog part of the circuit is totally safe if you use only line level signals, but not sure about the converters.
this is so fricken dope
Thanks!
Really enjoying your channel. I recently sold a no brand 8 ch mixer that I paid to much money for and was sour on, and because I didn't know what to do with it.I thought it was just taking up space. But after watching StMag and youI bought another, bigger, and heavier 16 ch mixer for the same price that I sold the other (apparently two channels are a bit "noisy.") 🙄 It has main stereo out, 3x AUX 1pre, 2 post fader), headphone out, monitor out, AND a TRS "Insert" jack for each channel. These send, and receive... Have you ever fooled around with the Insert jacks? If so how do you use them for No Input mixing?
Happy you found some inspiration in our videos! Insert channels can be super useful to add effects in the feedback chain (delays, filters, eqs, etc)!
@@AndreijRublev Interesting. Thanks for the "feedback" 🤣 Anyway, Insert cables are split right? Tip-send, Sleeve-receive... so are Insert cables different to stereo-twin mono cables? If so, how would you use the cables in cross-channel patches? Do you have a video on any of this?
Damn this is awesome!
I love N.I.M.B so much..!
And I have thathell of a Repeater optical delay from Greydressedboy too..great isn't it?!
Thank you! I love NIMB too, as you can imagine ahahah. And yeah, greydressedboy pedals are amazing.
Amazing!! Well demonstrated. I must give this a go
Thanks! Happy it is clear and informative!
I came here because Simon the Magpie was so annoying and kept talking over your video.
Excellent work and you got a thumbs up and a sub, Simon got nothing off me 😆
Poor Simon 😂! Jokes aside, thank you!
Simon the magpie showed me the way... Awesome discovery !
Thanks ❤
Great stuff! You demonstrate both imagination and talent with this technique. Best wishes in your future musical journey...
Thank you for the kind words! ❤
That's so crazy, man!! I'd really love to put that in one of my songs! Haahhaha
Let's go!🎉
Great video explaining this technique in an inspiring way, thanks! 🥳
Thanks! Glad to hear that!
Very interesting and inspirative, Thank you Andreij
Thank you!
This is f-ing crazy, keep it up man
Thank you very much! Will do! ❤
that last record is amazing , i can imagine that music put on a game
Thank you!
This is so good! Really enjoyed those live clips at the end 👍
Thank you! Happy you appreciated our musical projects!
When not only the beats, but also the mixer are sick!
First!
second
@@AndreijRublev third
you are first have a cookie 🍪
@@epiphonium can i get a cookie too..?? please.. 🥺🥺🥺
I used to do this in the 1990s, taking the aux outs from a 4-track into rackmount effects and back to a channel input instead of the aux return. I still have tapes of multitracked fx feedback! I was planning to sample it, but didn't even have a sampler. By the time I got the ability to start sampling stuff I'd decided it sounded horrible and never bothered 😅
Thanks for sharing your memories!
Awesome, praise be the algorithm! Subbed.
Thanks!
dude this is amazing... I cannot wait to mess with it. Also, I agree re: the ethical bits at the end with giving new life to other people's "trash."
Thanks for the kind words!