I got the F650GS(800 twin) use that off road on forest roads nice bike on the road not too heavy on the trails but definitely not a dirt bike, but would recommend it for starting & a lot smaller than the R1200GS. I've been out with the 1200 bikes as part of a group & it's more than kept up even left them behind a few times on the trails. Also not as aggressive as the 800GS, the forks are different, lower centre of gravity & 15hp down on the engine
I just saw this now and judging by all I've heard about the bike since, I can say this guy really listened well. There's more good information here on what makes this bike new and different than any other review I've seen since.
Excellent review, this guy what he is doing. This is what reviews are supposed to be, this is whats new, this is why its better worse or indifferent then the old version, and there you have it. No bulshit, no small talk, direct, and he doesn't waste your time. well done my friend !~!!! well done.
I've been told that this new GS has a problem with a weak frame. If dropped, they are bending when being picked up. Maybe worth inquiring before buying :S
In my opinion, analog instruments are way better to read if it comes to a short glance. Of course a digital speedometer tells you the "exakt" speed (depending an the accuracy of the system), but what use is it to see if you go with 60 or 61 mph? Or if it's 4231 revs/min or 4235 revs/min. With an analog instrument you don't have to "read" your speed or the revs. You get an instant information of the region of your speed/revs/temperatur etc.
My 1200 GS was a joy on the road and very comfortable. I have a bad back and the ergo was fantastic. The problem was that it was SO TOP HEAVY that I would sweat bullets I was going to drop the thing (or my passenger on one occasion). And pushing it around or backing it up was a nightmare. You can compensate with various techniques but in the end I sold it. I was hoping they would eventually get in the 21st century and make it lighter. Instead this model is MORE top heavy. ... Harumph :-(
You do NOT HAVE to get to get all the electronic options. In fact, only ABS comes with the base model. And you can override on the trail it if you want. Besides that, ESA, ASC, cruise control, TPM... heck, even heated grips are offered as option packages. So, there.
The BMW R1200GS and the KTM 1190 are both too heavy for the average rider to ride aggressively off road. So that topic should just not even be discussed. If I was looking to do aggressive off road riding I would not purchase either of these bikes! The GS is a bike that you can have a great time on, ride long distances, and has off road capabilities. That actually work great. I have owned both brands. Both are great. Whoever is bashing the other, is just a backyard bbq'ing bullshit talker. Or like a couple 10 year olds at christmas "my bike is better than your bike". Buy what you like. Each have advantages over the other, and disadvantages.
Not sure I agree. It's not like there's circuit boards hanging off the sides. It's all controlled by the same transistor based PCM that controls just about every other modern bike. The only thing that I don't really like is the dynamic dampening, because to me, yes, that is a possible fail point on a bike meant to go anywhere...but hey, for all I know the system can be damn-near bullet-proof.
I used to own an '06 (now have an F 800 GS). Not a single problem with either. They do exactly what you tell them to. With a motorcycle, that's obviously very important. With regard to getting pinned under the bike. Well, I suppose that's why I lift weights :-).
Sadly they are also very dated and the klrs at least have some pretty major issues right from the factory. Now if they would get a basic fuel injection system to get away from the problems of a carb add a 6 speed transmission and lose some weight. maybe a shaft drive a taller windshield and better suspension.
I agree with the production comment on this video. What happened to side shots of the entire bike. At the summery; from 4:00 on, I think the camera should have pulled back to give that IMPORTANT side view. But, maybe that's for brochures only, not a video..That being said, it could have given us all a feel for the over-all flow and balance of the entire design. Maybe it was just a trick. You teased us just enough: Now we HAVE TO go to the web site to see the pictures! ..But none there either..
That was the key of bikes like the Kawa KLR650. It was soo simple you can fix it whit a paperclip and a rubber band. In 20 years you will see kawas from 1996 still rolling. But hoy many of this Electronic bikes will survive??
you should read before you comment, I did not say that BMW has never won a Dakar race that they have even done three times in a row, ktm twelve times in a row, I'm just saying it gets a lot of attention because bmw is on each motor magazine on the front page (mony) and that it is too heavy for serious off-road work, it is a motorcycle for the scented candle generation, solid and not too crazy for in daily life
I used to think this Beemer's Boxer type engine configuration was silly & maybe it still is,cuz any toppling over on any side or skidding off on the coarse surface of especially asphalt,the block's head will get some degree of rutting-in or shaving-down,respectively,no matter how small & it's absolutely essential,compulsory even to get the after-market roll bar-fodder cradles,like those from Touratech to take-up any abrasion incurred.However now,I begin to see the light & have found new use for those stupid cantilever engine blocks.One can actually rest his/her pair of feet on each side of those transversally-offending protrusions,like how one rides on a Harley & that also,is if his/her members are right enuf to actually get comftable at all.Tho' of corz they arnt in anyway meant for that kind of abuse.Maybe Beemer shud might as well,just make good useful function out of it,by reversing the blocks' orientation from leading to trailing edge,actually the port block goes to starboard & vice-versa,to allow better foot-hold & probably even adding-on over the blocks some kind of foot-pads like those found on Harley Electra Glides to shield engine heat from permeating thru' the rider's shoes.Yeah-right..,these all sound rather silly don't they,but then so are its engine blocks' ridiculously strange positions.
Yep the ABS. And the transmission but that was from being laid down on its side in transport. Bet KTM is still kicking themselves for backing out of that deal.
I use to work at BMW Motorrad, one of my concern was the reliability with adding more electronics and complexity in these bikes. If I want to go to Patagonia the 1200GS wouldn't be my first choice, I prefer de 1150Gs more simple and proven bike. This new 1200GS is less off road and more city ride in my opinion.
The best motorcycle reviewer in the business. Your move into the business sector has been a great loss for bike enthusiasts everywhere. But good luck anyway!
They have a whole different set of problems due to just being so outdated and a lower performance bike so not as nice on the highways and that sort of thing. I would think the ideal adventure style bike would be light but fairly powerful with fuel injection abs that you can shut off and thats about it for electronics. Shaft drive for its low maintenance. Stuff like the electronically adjustable suspension seems like a problem waiting to happen.
However if you want to do proper adventure riding, which means long distances (you need extra fuel), carrying lots of extra weight etc. then a small KTM enduro is not very suitable. GS is actually perfect for adventure riding.
Completely agree .... How about a KTM 950 Adventure? Pair of carbs Chain Driven Nice simple fuse box Fix it with a tool kit not a laptop! Guess which bike I ride!
You may have right, but we are all different. I don't need all that electronic. Maybe it is controlled and stuff, but once some of the electronic fail, your screwed and you have to put the bike into pieces. Been there done that
Exactly. Like the computer you are writing this from. Or even better, the mobile phone with internet access and touch display you watched this video from. And don't forget to replace the ice bars that keep your food cold every day, either. ;)
You're completely right, but BMW wants to make a bike for everything and everybody, so you are probably a good rider where there are people who are scared of their rear wheel slipping. But if i would buy one these days, if electronics would brake, there are alot of ppl who for their safety should leave their bike at home. My dad went on a trip to india and he just hired a royal enfield there. sometimes these fancy bikes are not meant to do everything. Tip: watch "the long way round", its amazing
No, the f800GS is a different bike, this new GS1200 is suffering from BMW car syndrom, every new model gets larger, heavier and more complicated, and usually not for the better.
Yeah, I think what it dumbs down to is simply that if you want a simple,low-tech bike, a 1200GS won't be for you. Like my Honda (while albeit, not a dual sport) is about as simple as you can get, but honestly, even if it had a dual sport setup, it would *never* ride like that BMW. So it's hard to say what those electronics lend to the rider. . That being said, the only electronics I'd worry about with the GS is the spring dampening - not the electronics, the dampener actuators themselves.
Cool bike, but what does BMW have against digital speedometers? They continue to use these crowded analog units that are almost impossible to read at a glance. Just my humble opinion, but after riding bikes with a digital readout, I don't ever want to go back!
Am i the only one that feels more fancy electronic stuff isn't what you want on a bike that is ment to go off road and long distances? nice on a street cruiser sure but if your riding down miles of dirt or gravel it seems like a lot of extra fragile stuff to go wrong. For a bike ment for long trips of exploring absolutely everywhere i would want nice and simple and reliable.
Ok, I'm really, really confused. I'm looking at buying a 2013 R1200GS Adventure Triple Black edition but the shaft drive is on the Right side! It is definitely a 2013 but it seems that all the upgrades discussed in this video are for the 2014 model year. What the hell is going on??
It is a bit confusing, I know. 2013 was the year that BMW redesigned this bike, as you all ready know. But, it happened midyear. So, you do have to be careful, if you buy a 2013 it may be the older design or the new water cooled engine.
For you guys I'd recommend buying a discounted oilhead GS and using the savings to buy a camera that shoots at more than 20FPS. Seriously, this is the probably the biggest bike launch of the year, so what's with the amateur production quality? I'd understand it if you were just some guy with a GoPro but you claim to be professional journalists.
We ran a couple of GS-models in our family over the years. Currently there are 3 LC-models and one aircooled-model. None of those bikes ever had any problems with corrosion.
The host was knowledgeable and personable but most of the video was nauseating because it was constantly shaking. Invest in a real camcorder and tripod! Check out Cycle World videos - super professional looking.
fact: 95% of GS riders never go off road ... and thats not bashing GS-Riders...I am one myself ... but yeah, in principle i agree but these bikes so rarely see heavy off road use that it really doesnt make a lot of difference in the grand scheme of things
But you smash those things on a rock or short them out crossing a river that was deeper then it looked they wont leave you stranded in the middle of nowhere.
... and so they should. What ... *bleep* ... those *bleep* ... how dare they ... *bleep* ... we'll show them ... *bleeeeeeep*. LOLOL - so funny - go Charlie. I have only recently begun to look at KTMs again - mainly cause the 990SMT is so, so nice.
it is better if the previous blah blah blah, the promotion machine did so in the previous motorcycle, it's the money of the Bavarian manufacturer that does its job, it is a motorcycle that almost does not change and is just too heavy for the offroad driving, you guys ever heard of ktm .... do have a new motorcycle and won the dakar a few times, that's advertising
You purists kill me. You can have your XR650's or KLR's... I'm picking up my new R1200GSW next week with ALL the goodies. Do you want to fly a sweet P-51 in to combat, or a F-22? I'll take the later any day. Give me technology.
BLAH, BLAH, BLAH.... radiators,enclosed clutch,looks top heavy. Not sure what it is really? Dirt or street. Stick with a Ducati 1100 multistrada. thx anyways F-1
![R1200GS / R1250GS | Complete Buyer's Guide [2005-2020]](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/9arUyUFD5wk/mqdefault.jpg)
Nice job on the review, informative, no BS. Told us exactly what is new on this year model over others. Well done my friend !
Very comprehensive 5 min video! Managed to squeeze in, and touch upon many of the important features. Well done!
I got the F650GS(800 twin) use that off road on forest roads nice bike on the road not too heavy on the trails but definitely not a dirt bike, but would recommend it for starting & a lot smaller than the R1200GS. I've been out with the 1200 bikes as part of a group & it's more than kept up even left them behind a few times on the trails. Also not as aggressive as the 800GS, the forks are different, lower centre of gravity & 15hp down on the engine
I just saw this now and judging by all I've heard about the bike since, I can say this guy really listened well. There's more good information here on what makes this bike new and different than any other review I've seen since.
Excellent review, this guy what he is doing. This is what reviews are supposed to be, this is whats new, this is why its better worse or indifferent then the old version, and there you have it. No bulshit, no small talk, direct, and he doesn't waste your time. well done my friend !~!!! well done.
Finally some decent coverage of this bike. Good job guys.
Just picked mine up today in black and white 🖤 🏁
I've been told that this new GS has a problem with a weak frame. If dropped, they are bending when being picked up. Maybe worth inquiring before buying :S
In my opinion, analog instruments are way better to read if it comes to a short glance. Of course a digital speedometer tells you the "exakt" speed (depending an the accuracy of the system), but what use is it to see if you go with 60 or 61 mph? Or if it's 4231 revs/min or 4235 revs/min. With an analog instrument you don't have to "read" your speed or the revs. You get an instant information of the region of your speed/revs/temperatur etc.
Don't have exact dates, but it's only a matter of time.
Cool. Now what will break first?
My 1200 GS was a joy on the road and very comfortable. I have a bad back and the ergo was fantastic. The problem was that it was SO TOP HEAVY that I would sweat bullets I was going to drop the thing (or my passenger on one occasion). And pushing it around or backing it up was a nightmare. You can compensate with various techniques but in the end I sold it. I was hoping they would eventually get in the 21st century and make it lighter. Instead this model is MORE top heavy. ... Harumph :-(
You do NOT HAVE to get to get all the electronic options. In fact, only ABS comes with the base model. And you can override on the trail it if you want. Besides that, ESA, ASC, cruise control, TPM... heck, even heated grips are offered as option packages. So, there.
The BMW R1200GS and the KTM 1190 are both too heavy for the average rider to ride aggressively off road. So that topic should just not even be discussed. If I was looking to do aggressive off road riding I would not purchase either of these bikes! The GS is a bike that you can have a great time on, ride long distances, and has off road capabilities. That actually work great. I have owned both brands. Both are great. Whoever is bashing the other, is just a backyard bbq'ing bullshit talker. Or like a couple 10 year olds at christmas "my bike is better than your bike". Buy what you like. Each have advantages over the other, and disadvantages.
Great review good job
Not sure I agree. It's not like there's circuit boards hanging off the sides. It's all controlled by the same transistor based PCM that controls just about every other modern bike. The only thing that I don't really like is the dynamic dampening, because to me, yes, that is a possible fail point on a bike meant to go anywhere...but hey, for all I know the system can be damn-near bullet-proof.
What do you all think it's best year for bmw adventure 1200gs production quality and durability??
What's this? An actual REVIEW that offers useful info???? Great to see!
Does it come with quick-shifter integrated?
Apart from cracks in the bike's frame. Wasn't it the electronics that let Ewan, Charlie and Claudio down?
65% air cooled still. 35% liquid cooled. Like the wet clutch mounted on the front. No more splitting the bike in half to to clutch work. Looks nice.
How long before this engine etc makes it to the other R1200 models (esp R1200R), I wonder? The twin-cam upgrade took a long time to filter through.
I want one. Last GS I rode was an 1100GS I bought 2nd hand in Thailand. I did 34,000k on that bike in just 14 months. Loved it to bits . . .
I used to own an '06 (now have an F 800 GS). Not a single problem with either. They do exactly what you tell them to. With a motorcycle, that's obviously very important.
With regard to getting pinned under the bike. Well, I suppose that's why I lift weights :-).
Sadly they are also very dated and the klrs at least have some pretty major issues right from the factory. Now if they would get a basic fuel injection system to get away from the problems of a carb add a 6 speed transmission and lose some weight. maybe a shaft drive a taller windshield and better suspension.
I agree with the production comment on this video. What happened to side shots of the entire bike. At the summery; from 4:00 on, I think the camera should have pulled back to give that IMPORTANT side view. But, maybe that's for brochures only, not a video..That being said, it could have given us all a feel for the over-all flow and balance of the entire design. Maybe it was just a trick. You teased us just enough: Now we HAVE TO go to the web site to see the pictures! ..But none there either..
That was the key of bikes like the Kawa KLR650. It was soo simple you can fix it whit a paperclip and a rubber band. In 20 years you will see kawas from 1996 still rolling. But hoy many of this Electronic bikes will survive??
you should read before you comment, I did not say that BMW has never won a Dakar race that they have even done three times in a row, ktm twelve times in a row, I'm just saying it gets a lot of attention because bmw is on each motor magazine on the front page (mony) and that it is too heavy for serious off-road work, it is a motorcycle for the scented candle generation, solid and not too crazy for in daily life
I used to think this Beemer's Boxer type engine configuration was silly & maybe it still is,cuz any toppling over on any side or skidding off on the coarse surface of especially asphalt,the block's head will get some degree of rutting-in or shaving-down,respectively,no matter how small & it's absolutely essential,compulsory even to get the after-market roll bar-fodder cradles,like those from Touratech to take-up any abrasion incurred.However now,I begin to see the light & have found new use for those stupid cantilever engine blocks.One can actually rest his/her pair of feet on each side of those transversally-offending protrusions,like how one rides on a Harley & that also,is if his/her members are right enuf to actually get comftable at all.Tho' of corz they arnt in anyway meant for that kind of abuse.Maybe Beemer shud might as well,just make good useful function out of it,by reversing the blocks' orientation from leading to trailing edge,actually the port block goes to starboard & vice-versa,to allow better foot-hold & probably even adding-on over the blocks some kind of foot-pads like those found on Harley Electra Glides to shield engine heat from permeating thru' the rider's shoes.Yeah-right..,these all sound rather silly don't they,but then so are its engine blocks' ridiculously strange positions.
Learn how to ride and it won't be a problem
I do this also lol
Did the new nylon lever (I assume clutch?) feel wierd?
You can turn it all off, and it is done very quickly too with the mode button.
Yep the ABS. And the transmission but that was from being laid down on its side in transport. Bet KTM is still kicking themselves for backing out of that deal.
I use to work at BMW Motorrad, one of my concern was the reliability with adding more electronics and complexity in these bikes. If I want to go to Patagonia the 1200GS wouldn't be my first choice, I prefer de 1150Gs more simple and proven bike. This new 1200GS is less off road and more city ride in my opinion.
And then reality happened.
The best motorcycle reviewer in the business. Your move into the business sector has been a great loss for bike enthusiasts everywhere. But good luck anyway!
Informative, but what he does not tell you is that a well specced F800GS is more fun than this (even 2 up) I rode them back to back twice.
Brakes are "Precision modulated" ?
nice review.
They have a whole different set of problems due to just being so outdated and a lower performance bike so not as nice on the highways and that sort of thing. I would think the ideal adventure style bike would be light but fairly powerful with fuel injection abs that you can shut off and thats about it for electronics. Shaft drive for its low maintenance. Stuff like the electronically adjustable suspension seems like a problem waiting to happen.
anybody know what a good bike would be to start out with for adventure and on-road like this one?
However if you want to do proper adventure riding, which means long distances (you need extra fuel), carrying lots of extra weight etc. then a small KTM enduro is not very suitable. GS is actually perfect for adventure riding.
Now THAT is amazing!
Completely agree .... How about a KTM 950 Adventure?
Pair of carbs
Chain Driven
Nice simple fuse box
Fix it with a tool kit not a laptop!
Guess which bike I ride!
fantastic review, now lets talk about that price tag, 20,000$USD !
You may have right, but we are all different. I don't need all that electronic. Maybe it is controlled and stuff, but once some of the electronic fail, your screwed and you have to put the bike into pieces. Been there done that
Exactly. Like the computer you are writing this from. Or even better, the mobile phone with internet access and touch display you watched this video from. And don't forget to replace the ice bars that keep your food cold every day, either. ;)
Very nice bike!
No Mention of Kevin Ash?
You're completely right, but BMW wants to make a bike for everything and everybody, so you are probably a good rider where there are people who are scared of their rear wheel slipping. But if i would buy one these days, if electronics would brake, there are alot of ppl who for their safety should leave their bike at home. My dad went on a trip to india and he just hired a royal enfield there. sometimes these fancy bikes are not meant to do everything. Tip: watch "the long way round", its amazing
No, the f800GS is a different bike, this new GS1200 is suffering from BMW car syndrom, every new model gets larger, heavier and more complicated, and usually not for the better.
So how much does it cost?
Ever hear of video stabilization?
Yeah, I think what it dumbs down to is simply that if you want a simple,low-tech bike, a 1200GS won't be for you. Like my Honda (while albeit, not a dual sport) is about as simple as you can get, but honestly, even if it had a dual sport setup, it would *never* ride like that BMW. So it's hard to say what those electronics lend to the rider.
.
That being said, the only electronics I'd worry about with the GS is the spring dampening - not the electronics, the dampener actuators themselves.
Okay mate!
What is the topspeed of it?
Interesting stuff... I like it ;)
Cool bike, but what does BMW have against digital speedometers? They continue to use these crowded analog units that are almost impossible to read at a glance. Just my humble opinion, but after riding bikes with a digital readout, I don't ever want to go back!
Am i the only one that feels more fancy electronic stuff isn't what you want on a bike that is ment to go off road and long distances? nice on a street cruiser sure but if your riding down miles of dirt or gravel it seems like a lot of extra fragile stuff to go wrong. For a bike ment for long trips of exploring absolutely everywhere i would want nice and simple and reliable.
dr650 will never let you down!
i'm so agree with you. more electronics = more troubles
garageband music! classic
This is a touring bike with a midlife crisis. A KTM 690 Enduro with aftermarket tanks and side bags is an adventure bike.
Why Duke is making reveiw of GS :X
Ok, I'm really, really confused. I'm looking at buying a 2013 R1200GS Adventure Triple Black edition but the shaft drive is on the Right side! It is definitely a 2013 but it seems that all the upgrades discussed in this video are for the 2014 model year. What the hell is going on??
It is a bit confusing, I know. 2013 was the year that BMW redesigned this bike, as you all ready know. But, it happened midyear. So, you do have to be careful, if you buy a 2013 it may be the older design or the new water cooled engine.
I wish i could have one , but in Taiwan the price of this type is high expensive than any other country in the world.
German made,says it all. Seems a bit big for knocking around the woods with though,but may be too small for the pros.
hey...this guy definetely wins the PAUL WELLER look alike contest... twins!!!
if it kicks back, say goodbye to you're ankle...
Anyone own a BMW like this and a Buell Ulysses? How do they compare?
For you guys I'd recommend buying a discounted oilhead GS and using the savings to buy a camera that shoots at more than 20FPS. Seriously, this is the probably the biggest bike launch of the year, so what's with the amateur production quality? I'd understand it if you were just some guy with a GoPro but you claim to be professional journalists.
Nothing about the poor finish, parts being replaced due to corrosion in first year including engines.
How much??
We ran a couple of GS-models in our family over the years. Currently there are 3 LC-models and one aircooled-model. None of those bikes ever had any problems with corrosion.
I question this bike's offroad capabilities. It's a tank!
gs adventure bike should have a kickstart !!! then it would be complete
The host was knowledgeable and personable but most of the video was nauseating because it was constantly shaking. Invest in a real camcorder and tripod! Check out Cycle World videos - super professional looking.
fact: 95% of GS riders never go off road ... and thats not bashing GS-Riders...I am one myself ... but yeah, in principle i agree but these bikes so rarely see heavy off road use that it really doesnt make a lot of difference in the grand scheme of things
Like he said, if thats what you want then lucky you, KLR 650's and DR 650s are very cheap and just as you describe.
I've never seen anyone kickstarting a 1200cc engine.
hello friend, i'm from Venezuela, and believe me, there's no place in the world more expensive than here... not even available...
HD Shovel-head sporty
But you smash those things on a rock or short them out crossing a river that was deeper then it looked they wont leave you stranded in the middle of nowhere.
So is it liquid cooled?
I just want every bike on the market. Is that asking too much?
... and so they should. What ... *bleep* ... those *bleep* ... how dare they ... *bleep* ... we'll show them ... *bleeeeeeep*. LOLOL - so funny - go Charlie.
I have only recently begun to look at KTMs again - mainly cause the 990SMT is so, so nice.
Rip Kevin Ash
that's like kickstarting a nissan micra
Who's "kickstarting" anything? Who in the last century even knows what kickstarting a bike means?
this guy looks like daniel craig! :)
i agree but i bet most people that buy these bikes wont even take them off road.
That bike needed to LOOSE 21 pounds, not GAIN it.
buy a KLR 650.
it is better if the previous blah blah blah, the promotion machine did so in the previous motorcycle, it's the money of the Bavarian manufacturer that does its job, it is a motorcycle that almost does not change and is just too heavy for the offroad driving, you guys ever heard of ktm .... do have a new motorcycle and won the dakar a few times, that's advertising
The best
Haters are jeeeealllous!
I though that was a street bike...
You mean LOSE 21lb!! It did LOSE 21lb, it's called f800gs!!!
Give me KTM anytime.
BISA CARI YANG GANTENGAN LAGI GA ORANGANYA?
You purists kill me. You can have your XR650's or KLR's... I'm picking up my new R1200GSW next week with ALL the goodies. Do you want to fly a sweet P-51 in to combat, or a F-22? I'll take the later any day. Give me technology.
my 660 tenere is looking better and better all the time
nat geo adventure (y)
Agreed. It's all gimicky.
BLAH, BLAH, BLAH....
radiators,enclosed clutch,looks top heavy. Not sure what it is really? Dirt or street. Stick with a Ducati 1100 multistrada. thx anyways F-1