I like how he says something like "just walk back and do the combo" but then the first attempt doesn't combo, and the second attempt is stuffed by JP jumping kick exactly like in the real match. So I don't believe lariat needs to hit crossup, it doesn't need to be the same as last game. However, it got stuffed ON REACTION twice in this video. So it is unreliable as a simple anti-air whereas jumping in is cheap and easy. Plus, I hardly think it's fair to compare 2300 damage with amazing spacing vs 4800 damage with no oki and difficulty getting in.
I'm quite certain they made it purposely more difficult to antiair crossups in this game, only Rashid can hit crossups with his heavy mixer but that move has it's own issues as an antiair. Still looks very odd when Gief's lariat just goes through characters that are behind him
Yeah, crossups in SF6 lost the little bit of mixup potential they had with parry being able to OS and block both sides. I imagine since crossups aren't really a mixup threat at all anymore, they made them harder to outright anti-air.
Remember, Nemo notoriously despises Gief (cuz of Itazan). He didn’t even put gief in his sf6 tier list. As a Gief main (master), I find his slander unacceptable! I would challenge him to a duel for Giefs honor but id get wrecked.
@@MuscularAlligator420 hahaha appreciate it! I think i need to hit 1700 master rating before i feel confident. The best gief in the world didnt even hit top 50 at evo :( tho one guy did get top 30. idk why snake eyez didnt go
'Why doesn't gief just walk back and anti air?' I mean...you just did a drive rush low lk that hit before your jump....there was no way he was walking back
Because giefs lariat has always punished crossups (afaik) Its a thing he has which helps with his otherwise weak normals and slow walk speed and edge in gameplan.
It's not just about cross up defence. The character is at the bottom of the barrel at this point. When characters like Ken have almost every single tool at their disposal, Gief basically only has his command grabs and his lariat. If he at least had the ability to punish cross up attempts consistently then that would at least kind of counterbalance all his other shortcomings. He is slow, his normals suck for the most part, he can barely cancel anything into Drive Impact, his combo ability is very limited by design, but God forbid we let him at least have something over the other characters.
I agree anyone who complains about gief being broken or unfair are the same people who don't know the match up and what nemo complaining about he plays JP lol gief's worst match up
Nemo failed to realize the situation lol his JP hit gief with DR cr.m. The gief player could probably jumped back air to air but no way he can walk back from getting hit
Gief literally needs his lariat to hit cross ups. It is completely bonkers to have a character who's sole mission is to walk you down to the corner, only to put himself in a disadvantaged situation. Makeing gief have to walk backwards to anti air a character in that situation means taking the pressure off the opponent and its a pure guess on Gief's part. It takes all the effort in the world for Gief to walk characters to the corner. It shouldn't be a rewarding situation for the opponent.
Just goes to show even pro's are not always great at analysing strength of characters. Theres no way you can compare that very situational anti air combo from Gief to JPs one of many great anti air options. They're also completely different archetypes, so Gief needs big damage off of reads or he just doesnt work as a character. I think the main issue with gief is the amount of flaws and inconsistency with alot of his tools that makes him difficult to play.
It makes little to no sense to me what he says. He justifies Zangief has the option to walk back, which first cannot be done in the corner, and second if you misread and there was no jump, you just gave up closed-up space, which Zangief's game relies on.
If Zangief gets a correct read (in the absolute best and most advantageous situation he can be in, which is when cornering the opponent) he deletes 40% of your life bar. He he guesses wrong, he loses screen space. Like, that's the definition of fair. What the fuck do Zangief mains even want? To be able to cover all options that people have to get away from the grappler at all times?
Comparing an ex special move thats supposed to beat jumpins vs a non meter normal that honestly still has a better hitbox and similar startup on a zoning/teleporting character...... only a salty player would make that comparison.
A buff to lariat would help towards giving him a real fighting chance. All of his buttons are bad and have very low priority. Every character has the ability to serve as much damage as him with each touch… so that just makes him slow, same damage, no priority with buttons and terrible supers. It is really difficult to accept how bad they actually made him…
Zangief is a big character so the opponent needs less time to attack, than make harder for Zangief to react with antiair that alone make Lariat hit crossups a much needed buff and is total logic.
@@nilojohnsoniii Nemo spend months trying to convince people how JP's cheapness was a myth and only recently he admit it, not for honesty but cause is already undeniable.
![Daigo’s Throw-Loops Break Nemo’s Mind [Nemo]](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/xNMiBKMpUgo/mqdefault.jpg)
![Daigo’s Throw-Loops Break Nemo’s Mind [Nemo]](/img/tr.png)
![This Defense Technique Makes Luke a Very Strong Character [Nemo]](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/9z79R8m_q_I/mqdefault.jpg)
Honestly at this point I believe Capcom Japan just watches Nemo streams, doesn't get Nemo is just trolling, and nerfs Zangief even more.
" u know they love to read?" his hate is so pure lol
nemo hated gief with every essence of his soul and body to the point he happens to play gief randomly, he would probably won alot
I like how he says something like "just walk back and do the combo" but then the first attempt doesn't combo, and the second attempt is stuffed by JP jumping kick exactly like in the real match.
So I don't believe lariat needs to hit crossup, it doesn't need to be the same as last game. However, it got stuffed ON REACTION twice in this video. So it is unreliable as a simple anti-air whereas jumping in is cheap and easy.
Plus, I hardly think it's fair to compare 2300 damage with amazing spacing vs 4800 damage with no oki and difficulty getting in.
zangief can still jump and air grab or air to air. and parrying is an option.
I'm quite certain they made it purposely more difficult to antiair crossups in this game, only Rashid can hit crossups with his heavy mixer but that move has it's own issues as an antiair. Still looks very odd when Gief's lariat just goes through characters that are behind him
Yeah, crossups in SF6 lost the little bit of mixup potential they had with parry being able to OS and block both sides. I imagine since crossups aren't really a mixup threat at all anymore, they made them harder to outright anti-air.
@@TruthAndReconciliation The parry is nice but it basically just makes every jump in a strike/throw mix since you’ll get countered if you’re thrown.
Crosscut DPs still exist though
Why does nemo hate gief? Because that theatrical action gives him money
Remember, Nemo notoriously despises Gief (cuz of Itazan). He didn’t even put gief in his sf6 tier list. As a Gief main (master), I find his slander unacceptable! I would challenge him to a duel for Giefs honor but id get wrecked.
I say do it even if you lose i believe in you
Hit him with a FT50 money match. I believe in you
@@MuscularAlligator420 hahaha appreciate it! I think i need to hit 1700 master rating before i feel confident. The best gief in the world didnt even hit top 50 at evo :( tho one guy did get top 30. idk why snake eyez didnt go
Y'all cant spot a troll these days
'Why doesn't gief just walk back and anti air?' I mean...you just did a drive rush low lk that hit before your jump....there was no way he was walking back
Because giefs lariat has always punished crossups (afaik)
Its a thing he has which helps with his otherwise weak normals and slow walk speed and edge in gameplan.
It's not just about cross up defence. The character is at the bottom of the barrel at this point. When characters like Ken have almost every single tool at their disposal, Gief basically only has his command grabs and his lariat. If he at least had the ability to punish cross up attempts consistently then that would at least kind of counterbalance all his other shortcomings.
He is slow, his normals suck for the most part, he can barely cancel anything into Drive Impact, his combo ability is very limited by design, but God forbid we let him at least have something over the other characters.
I agree anyone who complains about gief being broken or unfair are the same people who don't know the match up and what nemo complaining about he plays JP lol gief's worst match up
@@MuscularAlligator420 He isn't complaining about Gief lol he's just saying he doesn't need buffs in this area tf
@@TruthAndReconciliation Nemo is famous for his hatred of grapplers, he was definitely complaining about Gief.
Nemo failed to realize the situation lol his JP hit gief with DR cr.m. The gief player could probably jumped back air to air but no way he can walk back from getting hit
Someone considering to buff the bottom character in any aspect? How do they dare?! Nemo calling the police immediately.
gief couldnt walk back....
Gief literally needs his lariat to hit cross ups. It is completely bonkers to have a character who's sole mission is to walk you down to the corner, only to put himself in a disadvantaged situation. Makeing gief have to walk backwards to anti air a character in that situation means taking the pressure off the opponent and its a pure guess on Gief's part. It takes all the effort in the world for Gief to walk characters to the corner. It shouldn't be a rewarding situation for the opponent.
You can antiair crossups with lariat but it's a very small window you have wait until zangief looks to the opposite side.
at that point, you're just waiting until the side correction kicks in, kinda like if you were doing a crosscut DP
Just goes to show even pro's are not always great at analysing strength of characters. Theres no way you can compare that very situational anti air combo from Gief to JPs one of many great anti air options. They're also completely different archetypes, so Gief needs big damage off of reads or he just doesnt work as a character. I think the main issue with gief is the amount of flaws and inconsistency with alot of his tools that makes him difficult to play.
He's kinda trolling
@@DigitalKingyo He isn't, Nemo hates grapplers with a passion, he believes everything he is saying.
I swear Nemo always pick the character that has the best MU against Gief, he turns out on the weaker side of the roster and he still complain 😭
This is nothing more then Nemo showing his raging bias against Gief. You don't like him, we get it.
Gief literally spins in a 360 motion. Logically it makes no sense that it doesn’t hit behind but, I didn’t design the game so whatever lol
Capcom design sf6 so no hit, hit both way but yes by Geif logic 360 should lol.
It makes little to no sense to me what he says. He justifies Zangief has the option to walk back, which first cannot be done in the corner, and second if you misread and there was no jump, you just gave up closed-up space, which Zangief's game relies on.
I mean you should probably be punished for miss reads
If Zangief gets a correct read (in the absolute best and most advantageous situation he can be in, which is when cornering the opponent) he deletes 40% of your life bar. He he guesses wrong, he loses screen space. Like, that's the definition of fair. What the fuck do Zangief mains even want? To be able to cover all options that people have to get away from the grappler at all times?
he is extremely biased against Gief..
based nemo making gief frauds seethe
Nemo, reads anti air and réaction anti air are 2 différent things, come on.
the dude was only carried by top tiers his whole career, so thinking isnt his strong suit
Gief can do 4300 only at the corner getting the very specific last hit of OD Lariat and JP can do 4700 from an average anti Air in mid screen.
You're just going to leave out the "needing a lvl 3" thing huh? Nice.
@sc065 He left out the needing to hit with the late part of the lariat, while the opponent is cornered, and spend 4 bars thing.
So sayth the guy who doesn't play Zangief, I love it.
bias at its finest LMFAO nemo i think youre cool but i dont trust a word out of this mans mouth when it concerns the dark order of the grab
So weird to see a pro player continually complain about the worst character in the game.
It’s a bit funny that his hypotheticals are so unrealistic and incomparable.
The Zangief hate is real.
he deserves all the hate he gets
You think that gief AA combo is unrealistic? That's a skill issue dude.
I admire Nemo's logical creativity.
Comparing an ex special move thats supposed to beat jumpins vs a non meter normal that honestly still has a better hitbox and similar startup on a zoning/teleporting character...... only a salty player would make that comparison.
i didnt know he had that combo. 4300 for 2 ex's on an anti air. if you want easier anti airs your not keeping that.
A buff to lariat would help towards giving him a real fighting chance. All of his buttons are bad and have very low priority. Every character has the ability to serve as much damage as him with each touch… so that just makes him slow, same damage, no priority with buttons and terrible supers. It is really difficult to accept how bad they actually made him…
Make lariat a quarter circle or DP and give it the cross up hitbox idk
Honestly 2 punch buttons is really easy but I would take a motion input for a lariat that hits both sides 😓
Zangief is a big character so the opponent needs less time to attack, than make harder for Zangief to react with antiair that alone make Lariat hit crossups a much needed buff and is total logic.
I wouldn't be surprised if that loser was of the ones who cried to capcom to get Gief's crossup hit on lariat removed.
Nemo doin the lords work
Lowest tier character lilly,Jamie,Zangief unless your very skilled to play this characters
My man talking like this game is easy to do anti airs. Infiltration even tweeted that anti-airs were iffy.
Nemo spend lots of time trying to show how his beloved JP is not cheap.
Now Nemo try to show how his hatred Zangief is not weak.
😹😹😹
He made a tier list and put JP in "S" tier. He even said JP is OP so I have no idea what you're talking about
@@nilojohnsoniii
Nemo spend months trying to convince people how JP's cheapness was a myth and only recently he admit it, not for honesty but cause is already undeniable.
Saying Gief doesn't need buffs despite his numerous flaws cause he got that big damage. Classic Gief hater moment right there 🤣
@jchensor