If you want to hunt private land then buy private land.. pretty simple equation.. Public land is multiple use lands and hunters have no more right to be on that land then any other user. The fact that you were born in Montana is not your “ me first” card for anything public.. This guys video and his attitude is everything that’s wrong with hunting & fishing and thankfully the powers that actually manage those endeavors don’t pay any attention to the crybaby mindset.As a private land owner in Montana I’m not letting anyone on my land that isn’t paying for the privilege and that includes a large damage deposit for any trash left or fences left open or unauthorized vehicle use.. All those things become an ongoing problem with general public access.. The hunting public at large have become the worst offenders of all… My Outfitter cares more about my land and my infrastructure and protecting it is his first priority.. Private land in Montana has become off limits to residents for a multitude of reasons and none of them had anything to do with greed… the money came into the equation long after trust had been eroded by despicable behavior from the public sector…Y’all destroyed access forever.. My Land My Rules
@@6by6by6 I appreciate your opinions. I really do thank you for watching. Please don’t call me a big crybaby. I don’t think anything that I said qualifies for that. All I am trying to say is that there are folks here born and raised I don’t have these kinds of opportunities. I grew up on private land with all kinds of big deer - I farmed underneath the Mormon temple in Billings- we didn’t get to shoot anything- I don’t know where your private lands at, but trust me, dude I don’t think you have any idea the actual damage dealing with public is… we own all that is left of the farmland don’t talk to me like I’m unfamiliar with that
@@6by6by6 we’ve had haystacks burned we’ve had four wheelers stolen we’ve had cattle target practiced at we’ve had thousands of dollars worth of gated pipe broken we’ve had the local hot rod, community come out and turn our place into 4 x 4 mud course I’ve had my dog ran over right in front of me - I’ve got all kinds of family in the shields Valley that enroll land in the BMA because they believe in the same values that I do
Whose money is it? That’s gonna help protect your property when there’s a wildfire that starts.!?!? … I’m sure you would like the government to come and help right but you don’t wanna play buddy buddy with anybody that needs something to eat ?
Did you hear anything I said in this video are you just trying to be angry at me because I wanna shoot an elk - what’s the elk population density where you live where you are outfitting?- I’m just curious I would like to open this conversation because you seem to wanna go full-send on me as though you’re some sort of biologist I’ll be perfectly honest with you dude I have never hunted antelope because it’s something that you have to put in for and I’m not dumb they only exist in vast areas without fences -but deer and elk jump over those fence -so they are targetable - honestly is there a way that you would like to get together and I could interview you? I wouldn’t even mind if you like full on cussed me out on video. We could have a open conversation about everything. I think that there’s no reason you’d wanna come on here and yell at me without knowing me- you don’t know what my actual background is you just think that I am just a regular Joe blow public hunter
This happened in the midwest years ago. Outfitters came in and leased or bought up all the farm land and large tracts. Then you add the uptick in adult onset hunters. Outfitters have the best land and the public has become so overcrowded it's not almost not worth hunting public anymore.
I was born and raised in NE Montana... Have land ownership with friends and family in Missouri Breaks... It was my rotation for an archery land owner bull elk tag a couple years ago... As now being a NATIVE NON-RESIDENT I had to go thru a ton on paperwork to get my tag from Helena... Must have been 10 - 12 documents... Plus archery certificate even though shot archery animals for many years and State & National certificate for 4-H in Nevada, etc... Live d35 years in Montana then moved to Nevada for 35 years for work... This was to be a hunt of a lifetime for me... Retired and ready... The Fish & Game application personnel in Helena were an absolutely positive force in communicating with me on everything that I need to send to them... Well, we (son-in-law, daughter & wife) went up a couple weeks early and scouted like hell... Looking for a nice six point again... Hadn't put in for many years due to all rule changes, etc... I let my friends (as per our rules I had exclusive time at Heartland Cabin) hunt some of our property... They respected where I was hunting (Doney & McKay drainages)... I only ran into trespassers coming up from Missouri River... Well, 2 weeks of scouting & patterning 3 nice six points... I actually slept 2 nights down in the bottom with them... So, my son-in-law male a plan and we are in the bottom, in the trees, and we have one in range of my bow... All of a sudden a helicopter outer flies over from Wolf to Doney... Goes below ridge line I believe... Can't really tell but we were in bottom... I can see the personnel and appears to be Fish & Game... Ran the elk up and back down Doney and bottom part of McKay... Bulls went flying by us and then back by us and headed south east on a dead run... Imagine my FRUSTRATION... Private property during archery season... I was so pissed that I called Glasgow F&G Manager and he stated unequivocally that it wasn't them... I called people I knew in Malta and they confirmed it was them... Manager called me back and said YES it was their guys... The remainder of my available 4-5 day hunt not a one of those bulls or anything over a couple very small rag horns and some cows came back... I called the Manager back and stated that F&G had ruined my hunt of a lifetime as far as coming back home... He did ask What do you think would be fair?" I stated, for all the trouble and expenses (upwards of $3,500) and time it took me & my wife to fulfill this trip I thought it only fair that I should get a new tag the following year... No BS...!!! He would talk it over with his superiors and see about the $555 tag refund...BS... Not close enough... Not good enough... Well, he never got back to me nor did he get me a new following year archery tag... But he did make a call to the president of the Heartland Recreation Corp and offered him an apology... What a farce... I got screwed royally as did my family... Now, I have never had an issue with F&G and my dad always worked with or cooperated with the G&G, Border Patrol and Malta's Sheriff's Dept... We have always had a great working relationship... But this really leaves a sour taste in my mouth with the injustice...!!! I thought you guys were better than that...!!! Jesse Murdock
@@JesseMurdock-o3y hate having to ‘love ‘your comment but this is exactly what I’m taking about - a management plan tailored for out of state and outfitters - I realize they’re broke but damn it we all - our collective playing by the rules only enables governments to abuse our resources- thank you for sharing this experience- man you ever come back I’ll take you to all my spots or give you any of my onX pins !
@@JesseMurdock-o3y BTW - I know at least a few wardens are gonna see this cause they ‘❤️ me so much - gets the word out and that’s what I want to accomplish
Sounds like hunting. Sounds like you think you own the air space above the property too. Hopefully they were moving elk off of private to public Because you know some welfare rancher Farmer is complaining about too many elk grazing on the BLM that he rents for $1.50 per cow calf pair.😂😂😂😂😂
Money Money Money, Power Power, Power….. I was born and raised in Montana. I’ve lived in hunted Northwest Montana my entire life. I’ve hunted the swan range since I was a kid. I don’t hunt the swan range anymore. There is virtually no elk to hunt and very little Whitetail deer. You’ll occasionally see a mule deer. But you have no problem seeing out of state license plates Everywhere. Usually at least two per gate or logging road. I’ve only killed elk outside of the swan range. Helmville area, Missouri Breaks, and the wisdom area. But I agree with you 100%. Now, all those areas are being guided and landlocked. To see a legal bull elk anymore is a rare rare deal on any public land. To get an elk is a rare rare deal on public land. The last few elk I have taken, I had to draw a special permit. Which the chances anymore are so minimal because they give them out to, out of staters. Our system is beyond screwed up, And the FWP and government is literally taking hunting away from us so they can line their pockets. I don’t understand how they don’t realize they’re taking their own jobs away in the near future if we have no game to hunt. I will quit buying tags myself.
Yeah, I remember a time when everybody was adamant that the next Montana State record for a white tail was gonna come out of the swan absolutely depressing now …. Yeah recreational hunting has got in man. People don’t understand. This is grocery store. Sure there’s some choice cuts in there, but this is a grocery store. Me myself I’m sick and tired of the face of Montana being and Steve Rinella and Randy Newberg, neither of which are from here.
@ you are dead right about they used to say the state record Whitetail would come out of the swan. I believe it was supposed to be around the Falls Creek area. You’ve obviously done your homework and paid attention. Absolute great video and it already might be too late. But something has to change soon! I enjoy hunting every chance I get with my kids cause I keep telling them it’s gonna go away soon.
@ hell yeah buddy I’m a fifth generation on the white side … I hunted up around Condon a couple times .. I’m from Belgrade so it was a long drive big big Whitetail though .. places like a ghost town now
@ I started rambling on at my phone and I think if I get a little more directly to the point, keep the videos a little tighter I might be able to share some insight. Thanks for subbing dude appreciate it a lot.
@@bugz9650 getter done man ! That s great - I don’t hear a lot about that area except no griz is that true ?- it’s pretty well unknown do your best to keep it that way ! Darby sound s nice
I have an outfitter who lives right across from me. Here in southern Illinois. Leases almost everything around me . Guys like him and the out of starters. Have made it impossible almost to have a place to hunt
Colorado is just as bad, maybe even worse. 76 years old hunted near Meeker Co in the flat tops the last 35 years property land locked National forest now thanks to the rich. Only let guides in to the good. And they dont get enough preasure to help us out . Im still in goid health. But im not going through this shit anymore😢
@@robertems6455 .. my good sir it’s guys like you that I am trying to advocate for you shouldn’t not get a bull just because you can’t CrossFit - I got a lot of older buddies that still hunt man. I’ve extended the word to all of them as well. You knock one down you call me. You come to Montana you call me.
Get a petition going to put it on the ballot to raise the outfitters license to operate to 90% of their guided hunt fee. Outfitters do nothing but exploit wildlife for profit, and put nothing into nothing to manage the herds. Only take take take and need to get real jobs. Real hunters don’t use outfitters anyway. No gratis tags for non-resident land owners. No gratis tags unless you earn 51% of your income from working the land. If the land owners don’t want to cooperate with opening up the land, let the elk eat. Get cattle off the BLM and forest service land too. Get behind the corner crossing legislation keeping the public off public land. Never vote for legislators that are govt welfare ranchers and welfare farmers. They never look out for anybody but themselves. I’ll bet that’s 3/4 of the problem in the legislature.
Well I live in Washington. We have tremendous potential hunting opportunities that are so mismanaged that it ruins our hunting and no one wants to hunt here.
@ yes and they act like no one really needs the best food we have available. Washington’s goal is to replace hunters and anglers with predators. I guess it’s happening lots of places.
The DNR in Minnesota lies about wolf numbers and denied that cougars where here until they reached the metro area and got caught on highway cams. The insurance companies lobby for more tags to be issued and the state just can’t take in enough money. 10 billion dollar surplus the last couple of years and they spent all of it and then some, now there’s a deficit.
I forgot to mention non-stop ATVs all summer long and yes during calfing season and thousands of cattle. Hunters get whats left and are millions of $$$
@@robertems6455 atv are limited to roads accessable by any other vehicle. Closing access to vehicles means that you have to get your cash and pay someone to haul your butt into the closed vehicle access areas.
@Mike-xi4zt my point is there are atv riders on the trails nonstop hunting means nothing to them. Then thers is the hunters that ride trails all day. And they leave the trails all the time. And yes they will get spanked if caught. The point tims have changed ther every where. Maybe slot times for ATV. NOT DURING HUNTING SEASONS.!!!!. They definitely push the game to private land
@@robertems6455 if you can't drive to with in about 1/2 mile of where you shoot a elk are you are not getting one out if you shoot one. Close the road is closing access to everyone except out fitters with horses or paying for access to private land. You sound like a outfitter who gets paid for hauling hunters with horses, who doesn't want anyone to have access except you. Saying a Atv or any vehicle using a road for access is going to "push game onto private land" is rediculous. Even if it's Spooks the animals, they can move away from private land just as easily as running towards private land. A road a mile away from private land with vehicles on it, is not going to drive animals onto private land. Absurd
@robertems6455 i am calling BS on you packing several elk more than a mile on your back. 1 mile is 2 miles round trip. Minimum 3 round trips, that is more than 10 miles of hauling a 100 lbs on your back up and down a mountains not just straight line. Your are a make up BS hunter not a real hunter.
Thank you for watching man. I just stood out here in my depression cave and let my phone have it. It’s nice to know that somebody out there gives a shit. Dude, you must be Irish as shit -Garrett Galloway that’s a strong Celtic name
😂 cant wait for the cam hanes dudes to come in and say, well work harder then. Access is the #1 decider in hunter success. Its an issue everywhere, every state. Poor access to the resource drives up costs for that access.
@@zaynemikita6897 don’t even get me started on the ‘Cam’ crowd - we hunt elk at 8-9000’ in usually around (except last two years) 15 to 0 degrees - nobody is grinding or sweating in those temps it’s a whole different beast than any other state
The access is the biggest problem we have here now. There's a lot of public land in Montana, but we are all parking in the same spot to try and access it. The increased number of hunters combined with poor public access makes it difficult to get motivated to fight the crowds. It's damn near impossible to find a spot you can just go hunt and not be walking all over each other, even when there's no game in the area. It's just not enjoyable to hunt like this
@Brandansquests that's crazy. Yet another reason people don't need to be shooting long distances without knowing what or who is between them and the target. Hunting ethics has really gone out the window
@ totally agree man my grandpa hunted with a 3040 krag - killed a lot of elk with it … now people want a 700 yard gun ….?…… spoils the chase -/ the passion of the stalk is better than the work you get into after success.. I find anyway .. never warm after the adrenaline dump -
Here in Idaho non-residence get the first crack at tags, it’s bull shit. IDF&G won’t sell a resident an elk tag once quota is filled. They want everybody fighting for tags here and if you don’t get in early, you’re eft as a resident.
@@theretroseller I agree with you I know people here who are super determined to get their Idaho elk tag .. because I know that the Idaho fishing game manages towards a non-resident …. It’s a beautiful thing when the local community feeds themselves… keep plugging away get out there and enjoy it. Don’t let anybody stop you.
@ I put the link for Idaho elk tags in the description. Hopefully that clears things up- I don’t know I’ve never been elk hunting in Idaho but I know a few guys that hunt the centennial s from the Idaho side and they are very adamant about Idaho elk management being so much better than Montana - I’ve been told to stop wasting my time around Ennis or Gardner
Yes res can buy a lic and tag in dec. but we can't select the area for the elk tag until july. Or we put in for a draw tag in May. Most areas, even for res have a quota. First come first serve. Non res buy tags on 10th of Dec this year and pick the area in which they want to hunt same day
Yes it's true I hunted this year walked 100miles and saw nothing nada niks the out of staters come and make a war on our public grounds and go home after it's done and leave us residents with the mess And sorry to say if you don't have money you won't get to hunt a nice elk here in central Montana And the land owners in the land locked areas are even worse The money they charge I can go to Africa to hunt some outfitters and land owners ask up to 6500$ to hunt a bull that's not even he's property I'm from Africa and for that money you can go hunt for 10days like a king and the best of all is you see animals and can hunt them
@@grizzlyadams4390 nooo ! … we are a simple people here in Montana. We ve historically never had the same opportunity as the rest of the country. But we have always been able to feed ourselves.. no born and raised citizen of Montana wanted to see property values septuple or be forced to rub elbows with elites . But Montana became a destination for the stars in their eyes overcrowded crowd … some of us blue collar types need both seasons to get meat ! I am still out hunting don’t go back to work till January 6 and I’ll be pounding it every day until then!
I'll like to go on a elk hunt, I currently live in Tennessee! I've always been under the impression there are no more elk in western states due to over populations of wolves
@Brandansquests sucks! Should be over the counter! Government making money 💰off God's creation! Communist laws in America 🇺🇸 ! American citizens can't even hunt
@@samdeyton5449 mostly I’m talking born and raised citizens of Montana hunting on public land I grew up connected to all kinds of agricultural lands, family, and friends, and the answer was always don’t ask awkward and weird for them to have to say no to somebody that works so hard for them because their outfitting their property - yeah the reason that my father-in-law ends up with a general every year is cause he’s putting in for his 380 still so I think that there’s gonna be a skewed number when you look at the volume of residence that are buying eggs versus the volume of residence that bought tags who were actually hunting I know lots of people who end up with a general cause they’re putting in for their 410or they’re putting in for their three 310-46 they’re putting in for the 380 - but if they don’t draw any of those, they’re not going out .. I’m referring to all of my friends and all of my cousins and all my uncles I’m pretty much everybody. I know I don’t know it might be different for you. This is the truth I know.
@ appreciate the insight, I’m currently not a resident, but looking to either MT or WY with an emphasis on resident opportunities on an annual basis (general tags). I have hunted with friends in MT in general units, for mule deer, saw a lot of the state. In my experience vast majority of animals being harvested were far from what I’d consider mature, lil forkies and maybe some crab claws. Deeper we got into steep country with deep snow, the better age class we got into, at least on the mule deer tip. I did see a lot of quality whitetails in many different areas while I was there.
@ absolutely the case hundred percent things do not mature on flat ground I’ll tell you that - that being said CrossFit crowd had figured that out - somewhere in between being able to hike mountains on a low volume of food, being in shape good enough to not sweat .. that is how you kill elk
As a Georgia native or whitetail deer hunting here in Georgia has gotten out out reach for most people. Super rich out of state hunters have took over all the wood company and private leases and 8:51 drove the prices up to astronomical amounts .This is the first yr in 40 yrs that I haven't hunted. I'm 48 yrs old. The sport is ruined. Our open FOREST SERVICE land is almost dangerous to Be on due to tourism.
@ no I understand exactly what you guys are saying. I live in a state that depends heavily on nonresident income and tourism. I personally don’t understand the hate for folks that bring in money to local businesses and the local economy. It’s that mentality that leads to the abandoned towns and shrinking towns all over the west. That being said, I’ll wish you good luck instead.
@ I appreciate that it’s not that I don’t wish you luck - it’s more of a matter of our state government still wanting to make money off of the antler rather than feed the people- abandoned towns !?!? .. where was the world and the millions of dollars when the Yellowstone River tore itself down through in ‘22 - Gardiner, Jardine , Corwin Springs gobbled up by the rich and left working class stuck with no road for months … I believe you you when you say you spend good money but brother it ain’t going to where it’s needed at ALL
Research how these TV show hunters are getting tags every year. Pretty fishy. I don't get tags every year and lived here all my life. SE end is leased up by and owned by non residents and they get tags every year. Non resident land owners shouldn't be given land owner preference
@@robpederson281 I agree and I also think that one of the big things that we need to do is establish some sort of an organization who’s gonna audit some of these people who claim to live in Montana at least six months I suggest we call them three times you come to the fish wildlife in Park’s office when you’re called if you can’t come there those three random dates that’s because you don’t actually live in Montana … will call it the bureau of citizenship
@@nealecole8768 Montana split between the Northwestern Whitetail and the Great Plains Whitetail either of which can be sizable, but when they’re hybridized they just got a super stocky little rack. Nothing special big ones like a 120. The creek bottom of deer they’re just tiny.
@@Brandansquests Kansas early muzzleloader is lit. We have gotten some amazing partial velvet racks with blood and all. They make such amazing mounts like that. I believe we are all victims of our own consumerism.
@ look up corner Crossing - when I first heard about that I was baffled. It reminded me of M&M‘s part in the first Kid Rock album where he tells everybody to hold their breath because they’re breathing the wrong air
BTW as a born and raised bitterrooter class of 93 florence we still hunt every year from Sept - Dec 20 for heritage.. in fact I'm sitting in my treestand right now listening to this video on earphones. Waiting for the whites to walk by..lol have a great day
Born and raised here. I have killed 12 elk in 15 seasons. 10 of which were 5-6 point bulls. Some Of us are still out here doing it but it isn’t as it used to be. Since the terrible pandemic.. there isn’t a space to Have even ten miles into a trailhead where people aren’t at. Being a backpack bivy hunter is at an all time high. The shoulder seasons arent near what it Was 5 years ago. But the elk are still on public land for Those from here wanting hope. A little time spent and dermination will find you success. Any elk is a great elk. I’ll be 34 years young this year. See you boys on the mountainside. Ps. The hippie dog bit is hilariously true.
@@mt4merica400 I’m glad to hear you’re having success man I really am I have quite a few miles under my belt. Last few years just hasn’t been very good. Truth be told I have never seen a cow elk on public property during the shoulder season. Which really sucks around Gallatin county because for me what it’s done is turned everybody loose into the area i used to shed hunt - I have scoured every piece of state land you can legally access in 393. 311 312 390. 391. 392. - I’ m 41 - 5 elk in 38 seasons three bulls one raggy and two fives - all after my buddies quit hunting - two cows on the ol’ Climbing Arrow when the Anderson s had it . I’ve quit three jobs over elk season and tried hard not to let but have a destroyed marriage over wapiti- probably go out tomorrow 😏
I lived in Montana for a decade while working and going to college. I regret not attempting to hunt elk in the state while I had the opportunity to do so for dirt cheap. I did hunt deer and antelope, however. Not to mention small game and fishing. Now I live in western South Dakota and intend on staying. The problems you are raising are similar across the country. Really, the big question is what do we want hunting to look like on publicly accessible land? Big game hunting can supplement a household's food stores every year, but if I'm being honest I just don't think hunting alone can be relied on completely for meat. If you look at self-sustaining communities (like the Amish) hunting is a supplement and a hobby but agriculture is what feeds families most of their calories. That's the big issue with hunting for self-sustainability. It worked back in the day when the population density of people was low, but the west has filled up quite a bit since then and people are increasingly dependent on imported food instead of living off the land. How many native people used to populate Montana at once? 50k? Maybe 75k? Well, Montana has over a million people in it and 200k people are hunting elk compared to probably about 10k people back before settlement. The fact is there are too many people for those old lifestyles to be viable and it's been that way since 1900. From the self-sustainability perspective, nonresident hunters and outfitters are obstacles to filling freezers with venison. There's no two ways about it, you can't have a state overrun with hunters from across the country AND a sizeable population of people who want to live solely off the land. If we gave everybody cheap tags and a three month season to satisfy demand then Elk would quickly go the way of bison. From the outfitter perspective, resident hunters and landowners are obstacles and competition which eats into their profits. The fact is some rich guy from back east who paid $20k for a Montana elk hunt isn't likely to come back if he's not successful. Such hunters are more interested in the experience and the antlers than the meat. And yet, these nonresident hunters are invaluable. Nonresidents drive the hunting industry in this country. They spend many times more money and bring in far more cash to local towns than the good ol' boys going out to get their annual elk meat. Neither side is wrong and neither side is bad, but for hunting to continue to be enjoyed by future generations there is going to need to be compromise between the people who hunt as part of their way of life and people who hunt purely for recreation. If you ask me, that compromise is that the most popular game animals, like elk, need to have wait period between tags. South Dakota goes a decade which sounds extreme, but for every available tag there are about thirty resident applicants (no nonresident elk tags in SD). Montana wouldn't have to go to the same extreme, but it might be a good idea if residents could only hunt every other year while nonresidents have to wait three or four years. This would give everyone a more equal opportunity to bag an animal AND it would encourage people to hunt the less-popular game species in the state. Not to mention it would even out pressure on elk herds. I doubt such a thing will come to pass though. Residents want to be able to hunt elk every year and would wish to not have any outside competition. Outfitters and nonresidents want to have exclusive access to public lands for the handful of clients willing to shovel out $$$ year after year. Fish and Parks wants the money but needs the voters so the most they will do is raise tag prices and make adjustments to tag availability in each hunting zone.
@@JamesWillmus I don’t believe hunters that use guide services contribute anything to the local economy- and here is just a case in point I know that the outfitter who hunts Cedar Mountain takes his clients up at 1 AM - they come back off of the mountain at 2 PM - they never leave their ranch except whirl they hunt the lee metcalf wilderness -they fly in to Ennis they fly out of Ennis - they will not spend any money in Madison County other than with the Guide- there’s no stores or restaurants or bars open - you make a guy get up at 12:30 and hike a mountain you’re not going drinking that afternoon ! -- I know a lot of people from not Montana will have something to say about this, but I’ve lived my whole life here I’ve never left and this is what I see -- remember I said %1500 over elk population objectives-/ that’s %1400 more than can survive the winter healthy -/ it’s no secret that guys like the Wilkes have caused elk to STARVE so they can hunt 9 bulls on a ranch that’s bigger than the smallest Montana county !
@@JamesWillmus so then you’re thinking they paid for an exclusive recreational experience on this ranch, except for everybody that works for the ranch is from Vermont -- so now they’re exploiting national forest and or wilderness areas trying to sell somebody in Montana experience with back east help - people in Billings don’t take time off in the fall to go elk hunting - I got laid off the first week of September I would love nothing more than a weeks worth of work or to shoot an elk right now-
The fwp sell the tags to out of state why I pay 17.00 and the out of state's pay 800.00 and happy to do so I'm 72 years young and I can't get a flippin tag for about 15 years now what's up with that shit period
You're right but unfortunately it aint gonna change. I killed my first elk in montana in 1967. Back then ranchers welcomed hunters, hazed elk off they're property and everyone hunted elk on public land on an even playing field. We always had outfitters for back country hunts but they didnt charge much nor make much. Its simply a matter of many hunters with fat wallets now.
Fish and Games WONT cut back Tags to help populations,,,,,,,,because their Payroll is already set,,,if they cut back on tags there goes their revenue and Paycheck,,,,,,,,Idaho is a Mad House now day's,,bow or Gun season,,,,,,,Combat Hunting like Combat fishing on the Russian river in Alaska,,,,,,,,,so sad because it used to be Great
Wow. This is crazy. I'm a Michigan resident and would love an Elk hunt in MT. But residents first. Period. Hard stop. Residents first and foremost, shouldnt even be an issue. Outfitters should have NO preference of any type over resident hunters. Sounds more like Elk hunting in MT has become a business.
@@wolfgangvonmueller6895 man I don’t wanna sound like a Debbie downer so don’t let it stop you - thank you for listening. Thank you for watching. I really do appreciate it. My biggest complaint really is just a complete commercialization of elk - one has to kill seven deer to get the same volume of meat one elk - when I was younger, I would focus on just one elk and a deer was a plus .. now elk it’s pretty much just off the menu -- I wanna put the focus back in the food part of hunting and not the trophy part it’s fun killing ones with antlers don’t get me wrong but I’m 41 born and raised never shot a six point bull -- but I see lots of them in the back of trucks out of state plates
@Brandansquests The "commercialization" part is disappointing. Forget the non-residents as that commercialization impacts the individual resident hunter. I'm with you Brandan, "freezer first", antlers second. I have some killer Michigan mounts in my house but you can't eat antlers.
Although you may be correct that it is worse in your state, that is all over now days. Nevertheless, you gave a fair analysis. As far as the "hippy dog walkers" you reference, that also is all over. But it is more remarkable about the hunters that act like the motorized recreation, and free ranging target shooters also do not impact hunting, just like all the hippy activities. Yamaha et al always made a good buck from us selling outboards. Now this expanded. Go to a hunting or gun show and reps from these industries are there. Don't fool yourself, that is drawing a lot of kids away from hunting into activities that offer faster gratification. Once you start your snowmobile the fun starts (I guess, wouldn't know personally). And it starts at the roadside or trailhead, not the hike back in miles you discussed. Hunting is the polar opposite. There is not much difference with target shooters that do not hunt or do not hunt avidly. Back not too long ago, nobody would be plinking during an open hunting season, they would rather hunt. That is no longer true. Indeed, most hunters do some target shooting, if only to the extent of sighting in their rifle. But nobody serious prefers to do it in the woods. A target range has measured distances, target stands, a trash can, benches and parking. That goes for clay target shooting with shotguns too. When someone is basically wasting a hundred dollars' worth of ammo (or more) and then does not want to pay a nominal fee to use a range, it is not because they cannot afford it. Rather it is because they don't like following rules and may even have been kicked off one or more shooting facilities... Next, we take money for hunting programs and misuse them on range construction on public lands, often under the guise of "training new hunters" to comply with grant guidelines. As you stated, with each passing generation, knowledge is lost and as this gap widens, we get closer to the point of no return. The people studying college wildlife biology, then subsequentially gaining employment to run hunting programs also do not hunt. This heads toward a blind leading the blind situation. We need to do it all a different way the NEXT thirty years, the recent has failed and cost us. Drop the ideology, get real, and get back to basics...
@@ny-dovehunting5602 I really appreciate this comment. I really really do this. It means a lot to me. Thank you for understanding. I have videos posted where I’m yelling at guys that are riding their four wheelers on closed logging trails. I have videos posted where I’m yelling at guys that are out target practicing while I’m stalking mule deer - this is the exposure. I’m trying to get right here man really I don’t wanna be the Debbie donor. I feel maybe I might’ve attracted some of the wrong crowd with the Debbie downer. I’m not I get up every day and tries as hard as I can. This was very very well put and you’re dead right man if somebody goes out to national forest and is driving up one trail to set their target when driving up another trail to sept themselves up only to shoot off three $400 worth of ammo it’s not because they can’t afford to go to arrange and be respectful of the folks that are also out trying to use the public land - it’s that they are king of their own world in their mind and they give zero about anybody else - I wish you a pleasant experience the next time you go hunting
This is what’s happening in Arizona. Our Game & fish department is funded all on its own, no help from the government. They literally work hand in hand with guides and influencers handing them first dips on everything. The guides have been known to buy huge parcels of land and chase wildlife into areas year round. Everyone out here is aware of the payouts they are receiving to turn a blind eye or to cushion the draw odds in guides favors
@@Dirtbagoutdoors-qh4nk we are the hunting district here 310 -/ special zone 310-46 only 5 tags - right against Yellowstone National Park- the president of the Mule deer foundation of Montana and his wife have drawn that tag each twice since 2005 - you would literally have greater odds of winning the lottery while being struck by lightning while having your face painted by bill gates - 2023 our fish wildlife parks commissioner that just stepped down during season was caught trespassing on a ranch in the 360 .. can’t even trust the FWP to uphold the law
All of the Western states have adopted this practice. You used to be able to buy over the counter tags in most states decades ago for regular hunts.....drawings ONLY for very special hunts. We bowhunted Utah every season. California still offers ample tags for deer hunters however there are lots of homeless folks occupying national forest campgrounds and roadside turn offs..... My son lives in Nevada....3 years to draw a DOE TAG!!! Complete BS!!! That is why I moved to the Florida!! 3 bucks and 2 antlerless deer per season, per hunter....unlimited wild hogs year round. Very hunter friendly State. The west is toast........
@@Papa-rm6hr- different worlds but different worlds. I’ll make a video right now for you ! “ how many dead deer on the way to big sky” the real toll of the rich
I don’t quit I never quit - but everybody around me is, and I think I just speak to the general sentiment of the most of the folks born and raised in Montana I appreciate you watching, though I really do - I couldn’t imagine being a hunter and living in New England -
@@jacobpalmer7589 mmhuh - lots of little ranches will let a guy pop a cow - but you’re probably get permission to punch a baby before you can get permission to shoot an elk with antlers
@@mx500a4 no that’s the opposite of what needs to happen like I said there’s places where elk population is 1500% over objective .. what does that mean? Well in 20 acres - maybe there could exist five or six healthy elk- in some places they’ll be over 100 - they don’t have anything to eat they’re subsisting entirely off of haystacks which is why land owners feel like they own the elk -
@@toddthun yeah I truly believe that that’s what needs to happen and that’s the only thing that’s gonna fix the problem in 393 410 451 390 391 the problem starting to spread now out into Reed Point and Absorakee .. won’t be long until they have shoulder seasons on the reservations. Those hunting districts I just named are all at least 500% over population objective. That means when you get an elk from those areas they’re skinny. They’re small. And the antlers aren’t gonna be as developed as they would if there was enough nutrients- look at it look at the hunting district 380 - highly coveted tons of people put in for it shed hunting there is absolutely phenomenal There are no rag horns. They’re all massive . Right across the road. 391. Shoulder season, absolute garbage.
@ that will only lead to animals starving to death- and that is problematic federalist way of looking at it - in the depression area when people didn’t play by the rules the animals were decimated - it’s Montana State taxpayers that fund the initial wildfire battle costs no matter where they start - I’m not sure what kind of comment this is. Do you ever send me a deer starving to death?
@@REIronminer I have a lot of family in Butte- hell we may be related all my Irish-Norwegian comes from butte - other side is crow - we like to drink just not good at it 😂… there’s been an explosion in the highlands of elk seeking refuge from the shoulder season from Table to the Beaverhead they have been growing - fricking turkeys along the Jefferson now can you believe that!?
@@REIronminer there is still good meat hunting here - but my kids may not have ‘general’ tags my oldest started hunting this year (10 yo) and I tried to never let him see me get frustrated- if it isn’t fun he won’t carry it on .. that for me right now is the hardest part keeping a positive attitude towards it and teaching my son to love it
Nonresident here 32 % of Montanas State Budget is paid by Federal Funds, money for your schools, roads, hospitals, welfare and on and on Most all of the nonresident s are hunting on Federal Lands, Blm,National Refuges, National Forest and Wilderness Areas. When some of you were in Iraq or Afghanistan did you ask what State the copter or A10 pilot was from? The law which is able to be modified gives States custody and control over the wildlife living in its borders, but I seriously doubt it gives exclusive use to only its residents. The Feds could stop hunting on all Federal Lands.
@@williamfeldner9356 .. let me first state if you’re a veteran all hail, buddy hit me up. If you come back to Montana I’ll take you out personally myself. I won’t even bring a rifle.-/ but I hear what you’re saying on the federal public land thing.. and I’m gonna tell you this .. back in the 50s and 60s there was no none zero zilch nada elk in the Bridger Mountains and it actually took a rich guy from California buck Anderson God bless his soul to put together a huge ranch called the climbing arrow … he put together a bunch of tiny homesteads .. and after they were all conglomerated The few elk that were left actually got a reprieve and slowly, but surely the Bridgers filled up, that being said, I hope that nobody thinks that I completely hate privately owners or outfitters because frankly, it took some large landowners back during the depression era to save Montana’s wildlife- which gets me to the point- Montana would not look the way that it does right now had it been the current management practices - we’re pretty fortunate to have a wildlife rich public land resource I 100% agree it is absolutely just as much yours as it is mine- however you have to understand there is only elk and deer left on there because I play by the rules- and because I am willing to yell and scream at people who are not -in the middle of nowhere- even if they are armed- but truly, though William, if you’re a veteran hit me up, man I’ll give you all my elk spots !!!
@@darrylhoupt3763 - in Montana it hasn’t been- increasingly more so year over year- I’m hoping this to be able to get an honest opinion of the local folks in Montana - we’ve always had a really poor economy but at least you could feed yourself - now that’s becoming an issue- hard to stand behind the commercial aspects of this industry this year in particular things are so tight financially - it’s the beauty of self -sustainability
Okay... Born and raised in NE Montana... Still own land... Hunted for 35 years and enjoyed it... Moved to Nevada and then became a non-resident... Guides and millionares and non-profits (oxymoron) lobbying ruining hunting now... Now it costs me a fortune as a native non-resident hunter to go home and harvest an animal... POLITICS...!!! Now, it is also happening in Nevada as rich people buy Governor tags, etc. and can buy a couple $250K bull elk tags and "posch" it with a rifle during archery season and take these monster bulls away from residents...!!! $$$ TALKS and POLITICIANS promote it...!!! Hunting becoming a $$$ game... Not even real hunts most of time... Buy tag, hire guides, fly in, hike 1/2 mile, guides gun set up, shoot, take photos, give meat away, head to taxidermist, hang mount on wall and then write an article or brag about how good the hunt was...!!! Wasn't even a hunt just a SHOOT...!!! Now, here, we have to draw any maybe every 5-6 years you might get a deer tag and 13-17 for an elk... Driving hunters, young and old, away...!!!
@@JesseMurdock-o3y that’s what I want to avoid here in Montana - we’ve always been a hard economy to live in but at least there was elk meat every fall when you went on job attached unemployment- there’s some sort of nationalist feeling that the elk belong to everybody in America -/ while there’s some pretty hard feelings from the local population that x state ruined it’s hunting so you need to clean up state x’s own backyard instead of trying to come here and adding fuel to this fire where are you in relation to the Fort Belknap? Have you heard about what they’re doing with the sheep? Millions of dollars spent trying to bring back those big horn in the Gros Venture are poaching just to be able to eat
@@shawnrieser6299 let’s make it not ! - let’s get back to fun and making memories and friends - every body is so competitive including me I’m not a push over but we gotta keep it going for another generation or two at least!
@@markburrell2778 I’m on a one man campaign to try to change that I’ve decided to make it my life mission you from Montana let’s get out. I’ll help you. I’ll help anyone.
@@Mike-xi4zt yeah absolutely man I don’t know why anybody would’ve ever wanted to bring the wolf back without first having put forth effort to bring back national forest Buffalo - I mean, wouldn’t it be kick ass if you could get your general elk tag general deer tag General bison tag General bighorn, sheep tag since there were so many of those here when Lewis and Clark walked through that they couldn’t sleep at night because it sounded like thunder, even on a clear night for all the bighorn fighting
@@barrysmith916 we have a lot of biologist who put in their input - but in Montana, all of our elected officials are from California - and so we end up with outside influence, telling us how we should run our state - noticed that you haven’t seen a Flathead governor or a Crow senator or a Shoshone congressman- we have Gianforte and Daines and now Shady-Sheehy-- our voices of the state are Steve Rinella and Randy Newberg neither of who grew up in this state .. we have no way to compete with the outside $ … I would encourage you to drive highway 191 from Gallatin Gateway to Yellowstone National Park every single day there will be multiple animals hit on the road .. this is an area that needs more hunting not less - .. I’m sure there’s places that need to rest - but there are places where the Elk population is %1500 over what the land can sustain and that only happened because we do not have free range hunting - chronic wasting disease would never have happened historically because everything had to run for its life -
@@Brandansquests I'd vote for a democrat but they're all complete morons, not saying I like Gianforte but we didn't have a choice. Tester ended up being a posterchild for the dingbat left.
@Brandansquests try and get drawn for a resident rifle hunt. Not easy unless you go with worse odds units. Then the amount of people out running up and down the roads is nuts. If you are willing to go into some remote areas and lots of hiking you raise ur odds
If you want to hunt private land then buy private land.. pretty simple equation.. Public land is multiple use lands and hunters have no more right to be on that land then any other user. The fact that you were born in Montana is not your “ me first” card for anything public.. This guys video and his attitude is everything that’s wrong with hunting & fishing and thankfully the powers that actually manage those endeavors don’t pay any attention to the crybaby mindset.As a private land owner in Montana I’m not letting anyone on my land that isn’t paying for the privilege and that includes a large damage deposit for any trash left or fences left open or unauthorized vehicle use.. All those things become an ongoing problem with general public access.. The hunting public at large have become the worst offenders of all… My Outfitter cares more about my land and my infrastructure and protecting it is his first priority.. Private land in Montana has become off limits to residents for a multitude of reasons and none of them had anything to do with greed… the money came into the equation long after trust had been eroded by despicable behavior from the public sector…Y’all destroyed access forever.. My Land My Rules
@@6by6by6 I appreciate your opinions. I really do thank you for watching. Please don’t call me a big crybaby. I don’t think anything that I said qualifies for that. All I am trying to say is that there are folks here born and raised I don’t have these kinds of opportunities. I grew up on private land with all kinds of big deer - I farmed underneath the Mormon temple in Billings- we didn’t get to shoot anything- I don’t know where your private lands at, but trust me, dude I don’t think you have any idea the actual damage dealing with public is… we own all that is left of the farmland don’t talk to me like I’m unfamiliar with that
@@6by6by6 we’ve had haystacks burned we’ve had four wheelers stolen we’ve had cattle target practiced at we’ve had thousands of dollars worth of gated pipe broken we’ve had the local hot rod, community come out and turn our place into 4 x 4 mud course I’ve had my dog ran over right in front of me - I’ve got all kinds of family in the shields Valley that enroll land in the BMA because they believe in the same values that I do
@@6by6by6 but what I was saying, none of them that enrolled their land in the BMA hunt --
Whose money is it? That’s gonna help protect your property when there’s a wildfire that starts.!?!? … I’m sure you would like the government to come and help right but you don’t wanna play buddy buddy with anybody that needs something to eat ?
Did you hear anything I said in this video are you just trying to be angry at me because I wanna shoot an elk - what’s the elk population density where you live where you are outfitting?- I’m just curious I would like to open this conversation because you seem to wanna go full-send on me as though you’re some sort of biologist I’ll be perfectly honest with you dude I have never hunted antelope because it’s something that you have to put in for and I’m not dumb they only exist in vast areas without fences -but deer and elk jump over those fence -so they are targetable - honestly is there a way that you would like to get together and I could interview you? I wouldn’t even mind if you like full on cussed me out on video. We could have a open conversation about everything. I think that there’s no reason you’d wanna come on here and yell at me without knowing me- you don’t know what my actual background is you just think that I am just a regular Joe blow public hunter
This happened in the midwest years ago. Outfitters came in and leased or bought up all the farm land and large tracts. Then you add the uptick in adult onset hunters. Outfitters have the best land and the public has become so overcrowded it's not almost not worth hunting public anymore.
I was born and raised in NE Montana... Have land ownership with friends and family in Missouri Breaks...
It was my rotation for an archery land owner bull elk tag a couple years ago... As now being a NATIVE NON-RESIDENT I had to go thru a ton on paperwork to get my tag from Helena... Must have been 10 - 12 documents... Plus archery certificate even though shot archery animals for many years and State & National certificate for 4-H in Nevada, etc... Live d35 years in Montana then moved to Nevada for 35 years for work...
This was to be a hunt of a lifetime for me... Retired and ready...
The Fish & Game application personnel in Helena were an absolutely positive force in communicating with me on everything that I need to send to them...
Well, we (son-in-law, daughter & wife) went up a couple weeks early and scouted like hell... Looking for a nice six point again... Hadn't put in for many years due to all rule changes, etc... I let my friends (as per our rules I had exclusive time at Heartland Cabin) hunt some of our property... They respected where I was hunting (Doney & McKay drainages)... I only ran into trespassers coming up from Missouri River...
Well, 2 weeks of scouting & patterning 3 nice six points... I actually slept 2 nights down in the bottom with them... So, my son-in-law male a plan and we are in the bottom, in the trees, and we have one in range of my bow... All of a sudden a helicopter outer flies over from Wolf to Doney... Goes below ridge line I believe... Can't really tell but we were in bottom... I can see the personnel and appears to be Fish & Game... Ran the elk up and back down Doney and bottom part of McKay... Bulls went flying by us and then back by us and headed south east on a dead run... Imagine my FRUSTRATION... Private property during archery season...
I was so pissed that I called Glasgow F&G Manager and he stated unequivocally that it wasn't them... I called people I knew in Malta and they confirmed it was them... Manager called me back and said YES it was their guys...
The remainder of my available 4-5 day hunt not a one of those bulls or anything over a couple very small rag horns and some cows came back...
I called the Manager back and stated that F&G had ruined my hunt of a lifetime as far as coming back home... He did ask What do you think would be fair?" I stated, for all the trouble and expenses (upwards of $3,500) and time it took me & my wife to fulfill this trip I thought it only fair that I should get a new tag the following year... No BS...!!! He would talk it over with his superiors and see about the $555 tag refund...BS... Not close enough... Not good enough...
Well, he never got back to me nor did he get me a new following year archery tag... But he did make a call to the president of the Heartland Recreation Corp and offered him an apology... What a farce... I got screwed royally as did my family...
Now, I have never had an issue with F&G and my dad always worked with or cooperated with the G&G, Border Patrol and Malta's Sheriff's Dept...
We have always had a great working relationship... But this really leaves a sour taste in my mouth with the injustice...!!! I thought you guys were better than that...!!!
Jesse Murdock
@@JesseMurdock-o3y hate having to ‘love ‘your comment but this is exactly what I’m taking about - a management plan tailored for out of state and outfitters - I realize they’re broke but damn it we all - our collective playing by the rules only enables governments to abuse our resources- thank you for sharing this experience- man you ever come back I’ll take you to all my spots or give you any of my onX pins !
@@JesseMurdock-o3y I’ve heard and can’t figure how to verify -- no one kills more wolves than MT FWP
@@JesseMurdock-o3y BTW - I know at least a few wardens are gonna see this cause they ‘❤️ me so much - gets the word out and that’s what I want to accomplish
Sounds like hunting. Sounds like you think you own the air space above the property too. Hopefully they were moving elk off of private to public Because you know some welfare rancher Farmer is complaining about too many elk grazing on the BLM that he rents for $1.50 per cow calf pair.😂😂😂😂😂
Money Money Money, Power Power, Power…..
I was born and raised in Montana. I’ve lived in hunted Northwest Montana my entire life. I’ve hunted the swan range since I was a kid. I don’t hunt the swan range anymore. There is virtually no elk to hunt and very little Whitetail deer. You’ll occasionally see a mule deer. But you have no problem seeing out of state license plates Everywhere. Usually at least two per gate or logging road.
I’ve only killed elk outside of the swan range. Helmville area, Missouri Breaks, and the wisdom area. But I agree with you 100%. Now, all those areas are being guided and landlocked. To see a legal bull elk anymore is a rare rare deal on any public land. To get an elk is a rare rare deal on public land. The last few elk I have taken, I had to draw a special permit. Which the chances anymore are so minimal because they give them out to, out of staters. Our system is beyond screwed up, And the FWP and government is literally taking hunting away from us so they can line their pockets. I don’t understand how they don’t realize they’re taking their own jobs away in the near future if we have no game to hunt. I will quit buying tags myself.
Yeah, I remember a time when everybody was adamant that the next Montana State record for a white tail was gonna come out of the swan absolutely depressing now …. Yeah recreational hunting has got in man. People don’t understand. This is grocery store. Sure there’s some choice cuts in there, but this is a grocery store. Me myself I’m sick and tired of the face of Montana being and Steve Rinella and Randy Newberg, neither of which are from here.
@ you are dead right about they used to say the state record Whitetail would come out of the swan. I believe it was supposed to be around the Falls Creek area. You’ve obviously done your homework and paid attention. Absolute great video and it already might be too late. But something has to change soon! I enjoy hunting every chance I get with my kids cause I keep telling them it’s gonna go away soon.
@ I just subbed. You got some interesting videos. I like your knowledge and honesty!
@ hell yeah buddy I’m a fifth generation on the white side … I hunted up around Condon a couple times .. I’m from Belgrade so it was a long drive big big Whitetail though .. places like a ghost town now
@ I started rambling on at my phone and I think if I get a little more directly to the point, keep the videos a little tighter I might be able to share some insight. Thanks for subbing dude appreciate it a lot.
It's all about greed! Money!
born and raised bitterrooter here. myself and all my friends still hunt every year for elk .
@@bugz9650 getter done man ! That s great - I don’t hear a lot about that area except no griz is that true ?- it’s pretty well unknown do your best to keep it that way ! Darby sound s nice
I have an outfitter who lives right across from me. Here in southern Illinois. Leases almost everything around me . Guys like him and the out of starters. Have made it impossible almost to have a place to hunt
Colorado is just as bad, maybe even worse. 76 years old hunted near Meeker Co in the flat tops the last 35 years property land locked National forest now thanks to the rich. Only let guides in to the good. And they dont get enough preasure to help us out . Im still in goid health. But im not going through this shit anymore😢
@@robertems6455 .. my good sir it’s guys like you that I am trying to advocate for you shouldn’t not get a bull just because you can’t CrossFit - I got a lot of older buddies that still hunt man. I’ve extended the word to all of them as well. You knock one down you call me. You come to Montana you call me.
Get a petition going to put it on the ballot to raise the outfitters license to operate to 90% of their guided hunt fee. Outfitters do nothing but exploit wildlife for profit, and put nothing into nothing to manage the herds. Only take take take and need to get real jobs. Real hunters don’t use outfitters anyway. No gratis tags for non-resident land owners. No gratis tags unless you earn 51% of your income from working the land. If the land owners don’t want to cooperate with opening up the land, let the elk eat. Get cattle off the BLM and forest service land too. Get behind the corner crossing legislation keeping the public off public land. Never vote for legislators that are govt welfare ranchers and welfare farmers. They never look out for anybody but themselves. I’ll bet that’s 3/4 of the problem in the legislature.
@capt.america6296 well put sir .I'm so glad I got to hunt during the 70s 80s and 90s. Young hunters will never know what it was like
Well I live in Washington. We have tremendous potential hunting opportunities that are so mismanaged that it ruins our hunting and no one wants to hunt here.
I completely understand. Have a wonderful opportunity here. But it’s being replaced by this theory that self sustainability is a recreational hobby
@ yes and they act like no one really needs the best food we have available. Washington’s goal is to replace hunters and anglers with predators. I guess it’s happening lots of places.
The DNR in Minnesota lies about wolf numbers and denied that cougars where here until they reached the metro area and got caught on highway cams. The insurance companies lobby for more tags to be issued and the state just can’t take in enough money. 10 billion dollar surplus the last couple of years and they spent all of it and then some, now there’s a deficit.
Oregon is even worse. No preditor management and the wildlife is toast
Try CA. Montana is a dream vs here.
I forgot to mention non-stop ATVs all summer long and yes
during calfing season and thousands of cattle. Hunters get whats left and are millions of $$$
@@robertems6455 atv are limited to roads accessable by any other vehicle. Closing access to vehicles means that you have to get your cash and pay someone to haul your butt into the closed vehicle access areas.
@Mike-xi4zt my point is there are atv riders on the trails nonstop hunting means nothing to them. Then thers is the hunters that ride trails all day. And they leave the trails all the time. And yes they will get spanked if caught. The point tims have changed ther every where. Maybe slot times for ATV. NOT DURING HUNTING SEASONS.!!!!. They definitely push the game to private land
@@robertems6455 if you can't drive to with in about 1/2 mile of where you shoot a elk are you are not getting one out if you shoot one. Close the road is closing access to everyone except out fitters with horses or paying for access to private land. You sound like a outfitter who gets paid for hauling hunters with horses, who doesn't want anyone to have access except you. Saying a Atv or any vehicle using a road for access is going to "push game onto private land" is rediculous. Even if it's Spooks the animals, they can move away from private land just as easily as running towards private land. A road a mile away from private land with vehicles on it, is not going to drive animals onto private land. Absurd
@Mike-xi4zt im done im not an outfitter.and your obviously not a educated hunter. And I have packed several Elk more than a mile or more
@robertems6455 i am calling BS on you packing several elk more than a mile on your back. 1 mile is 2 miles round trip. Minimum 3 round trips, that is more than 10 miles of hauling a 100 lbs on your back up and down a mountains not just straight line. Your are a make up BS hunter not a real hunter.
Thanks for this video......needed badly to be said....
thanx 4 the video man😂 FUCK YEAH !
Thank you for watching man. I just stood out here in my depression cave and let my phone have it. It’s nice to know that somebody out there gives a shit. Dude, you must be Irish as shit -Garrett Galloway that’s a strong Celtic name
😂 cant wait for the cam hanes dudes to come in and say, well work harder then.
Access is the #1 decider in hunter success. Its an issue everywhere, every state. Poor access to the resource drives up costs for that access.
@@zaynemikita6897 don’t even get me started on the ‘Cam’ crowd - we hunt elk at 8-9000’ in usually around (except last two years) 15 to 0 degrees - nobody is grinding or sweating in those temps it’s a whole different beast than any other state
The access is the biggest problem we have here now. There's a lot of public land in Montana, but we are all parking in the same spot to try and access it. The increased number of hunters combined with poor public access makes it difficult to get motivated to fight the crowds. It's damn near impossible to find a spot you can just go hunt and not be walking all over each other, even when there's no game in the area. It's just not enjoyable to hunt like this
@ agreed .. I was shot over twice this year.. was intense
@Brandansquests that's crazy. Yet another reason people don't need to be shooting long distances without knowing what or who is between them and the target. Hunting ethics has really gone out the window
@ totally agree man my grandpa hunted with a 3040 krag - killed a lot of elk with it … now people want a 700 yard gun ….?…… spoils the chase -/ the passion of the stalk is better than the work you get into after success.. I find anyway .. never warm after the adrenaline dump -
Here in Idaho non-residence get the first crack at tags, it’s bull shit. IDF&G won’t sell a resident an elk tag once quota is filled. They want everybody fighting for tags here and if you don’t get in early, you’re eft as a resident.
@@theretroseller I agree with you I know people here who are super determined to get their Idaho elk tag .. because I know that the Idaho fishing game manages towards a non-resident …. It’s a beautiful thing when the local community feeds themselves… keep plugging away get out there and enjoy it. Don’t let anybody stop you.
Bullshit. Idaho residents get to buy tags December 1st and non residents have to buy Dec 10th. Non residents dont get to buy tags before residents.
@ I put the link for Idaho elk tags in the description. Hopefully that clears things up- I don’t know I’ve never been elk hunting in Idaho but I know a few guys that hunt the centennial s from the Idaho side and they are very adamant about Idaho elk management being so much better than Montana - I’ve been told to stop wasting my time around Ennis or Gardner
@ no we don’t they go on sale for non resident Dec 1st
Yes res can buy a lic and tag in dec. but we can't select the area for the elk tag until july. Or we put in for a draw tag in May. Most areas, even for res have a quota. First come first serve. Non res buy tags on 10th of Dec this year and pick the area in which they want to hunt same day
Lived in Bozeman 17years. I'M a hunter wolves destroyed hunting in Montana.
Yes it's true I hunted this year walked 100miles and saw nothing nada niks the out of staters come and make a war on our public grounds and go home after it's done and leave us residents with the mess
And sorry to say if you don't have money you won't get to hunt a nice elk here in central Montana
And the land owners in the land locked areas are even worse
The money they charge I can go to Africa to hunt some outfitters and land owners ask up to 6500$ to hunt a bull that's not even he's property I'm from Africa and for that money you can go hunt for 10days like a king and the best of all is you see animals and can hunt them
Time to split the seasons for elk hunting, you choose bow or rifle but not both.
@@grizzlyadams4390 nooo ! … we are a simple people here in Montana. We ve historically never had the same opportunity as the rest of the country. But we have always been able to feed ourselves.. no born and raised citizen of Montana wanted to see property values septuple or be forced to rub elbows with elites . But Montana became a destination for the stars in their eyes overcrowded crowd … some of us blue collar types need both seasons to get meat ! I am still out hunting don’t go back to work till January 6 and I’ll be pounding it every day until then!
I'll like to go on a elk hunt, I currently live in Tennessee! I've always been under the impression there are no more elk in western states due to over populations of wolves
No, they’re still elk - but unfortunately, there’s two types of people in this world - public and private
@Brandansquests so would I have get drawn for an elk tag or can a non resident buy over the counter elk tags in Montana?
@ you have to put it in for nowadays -/ March 1 -comes fast
@Brandansquests sucks! Should be over the counter! Government making money 💰off God's creation! Communist laws in America 🇺🇸 ! American citizens can't even hunt
Are you referring to your general zones or your LE units?
@@samdeyton5449 mostly I’m talking born and raised citizens of Montana hunting on public land I grew up connected to all kinds of agricultural lands, family, and friends, and the answer was always don’t ask awkward and weird for them to have to say no to somebody that works so hard for them because their outfitting their property - yeah the reason that my father-in-law ends up with a general every year is cause he’s putting in for his 380 still so I think that there’s gonna be a skewed number when you look at the volume of residence that are buying eggs versus the volume of residence that bought tags who were actually hunting I know lots of people who end up with a general cause they’re putting in for their 410or they’re putting in for their three 310-46 they’re putting in for the 380 - but if they don’t draw any of those, they’re not going out .. I’m referring to all of my friends and all of my cousins and all my uncles I’m pretty much everybody. I know I don’t know it might be different for you. This is the truth I know.
@ appreciate the insight, I’m currently not a resident, but looking to either MT or WY with an emphasis on resident opportunities on an annual basis (general tags). I have hunted with friends in MT in general units, for mule deer, saw a lot of the state. In my experience vast majority of animals being harvested were far from what I’d consider mature, lil forkies and maybe some crab claws. Deeper we got into steep country with deep snow, the better age class we got into, at least on the mule deer tip. I did see a lot of quality whitetails in many different areas while I was there.
@ absolutely the case hundred percent things do not mature on flat ground I’ll tell you that - that being said CrossFit crowd had figured that out - somewhere in between being able to hike mountains on a low volume of food, being in shape good enough to not sweat .. that is how you kill elk
As a Georgia native or whitetail deer hunting here in Georgia has gotten out out reach for most people. Super rich out of state hunters have took over all the wood company and private leases and 8:51 drove the prices up to astronomical amounts .This is the first yr in 40 yrs that I haven't hunted. I'm 48 yrs old. The sport is ruined. Our open FOREST SERVICE land is almost dangerous to Be on due to tourism.
I hunted Montana in 2022 with a guide and I’ll be putting in again for 2025! Wish me luck!
@@K.Fulkerson I got laid off in September- things are looking bleak here bud , I think your a little tone deaf here-
@ no I understand exactly what you guys are saying. I live in a state that depends heavily on nonresident income and tourism. I personally don’t understand the hate for folks that bring in money to local businesses and the local economy. It’s that mentality that leads to the abandoned towns and shrinking towns all over the west. That being said, I’ll wish you good luck instead.
@ I appreciate that it’s not that I don’t wish you luck - it’s more of a matter of our state government still wanting to make money off of the antler rather than feed the people- abandoned towns !?!? .. where was the world and the millions of dollars when the Yellowstone River tore itself down through in ‘22 - Gardiner, Jardine , Corwin Springs gobbled up by the rich and left working class stuck with no road for months … I believe you you when you say you spend good money but brother it ain’t going to where it’s needed at ALL
@ if you’re interested in doing it yourself, I would love to hunt with you no billshit
@ that way you can spend you money at restaurants owned by the good folks of Montana instead of FARCE establishments like Ted’s Montana Grill
Research how these TV show hunters are getting tags every year. Pretty fishy. I don't get tags every year and lived here all my life. SE end is leased up by and owned by non residents and they get tags every year. Non resident land owners shouldn't be given land owner preference
@@robpederson281 I agree and I also think that one of the big things that we need to do is establish some sort of an organization who’s gonna audit some of these people who claim to live in Montana at least six months I suggest we call them three times you come to the fish wildlife in Park’s office when you’re called if you can’t come there those three random dates that’s because you don’t actually live in Montana … will call it the bureau of citizenship
Happening in Kansas now. 😞 They buy up everything that was public access and now its outfitter
@@nealecole8768 I’ve never wanted to hunt any other state except for Kansas muzzleloader
@@nealecole8768 Montana split between the Northwestern Whitetail and the Great Plains Whitetail either of which can be sizable, but when they’re hybridized they just got a super stocky little rack. Nothing special big ones like a 120. The creek bottom of deer they’re just tiny.
@@Brandansquests Kansas early muzzleloader is lit. We have gotten some amazing partial velvet racks with blood and all. They make such amazing mounts like that. I believe we are all victims of our own consumerism.
@ I know the whole country wants one of them as much as the six point bull !
Can drones be used to drive them off private land?
@@mattbrown9484 no you’d be invading the airspace - same reason you cannot corner cross onto checkerboard public property
@ invading airspace… so what
@ look up corner Crossing - when I first heard about that I was baffled. It reminded me of M&M‘s part in the first Kid Rock album where he tells everybody to hold their breath because they’re breathing the wrong air
It's not invasion of air space that doesn't apply. It's called hazing and that's illegal for anyone to keep animals on or off property
BTW as a born and raised bitterrooter class of 93 florence we still hunt every year from Sept - Dec 20 for heritage.. in fact I'm sitting in my treestand right now listening to this video on earphones. Waiting for the whites to walk by..lol have a great day
Colorado you have to draw for most tags.
That’s against everything I represent and want to change about the hunting industry and culture! Food first !
GET RID OF THE GUIDES
@@russellheifort5054 I agree, buddy I agree hundred percent if the elk are over population objective - no bull tags and no guides 💯
Born and raised here. I have killed 12 elk in 15 seasons. 10 of which were 5-6 point bulls. Some
Of us are still out here doing it but it isn’t as it used to be. Since the terrible pandemic.. there isn’t a space to
Have even ten miles into a trailhead where people aren’t at. Being a backpack bivy hunter is at an all time high. The shoulder seasons arent near what it
Was 5 years ago. But the elk are still on public land for
Those from here wanting hope. A little time spent and dermination will find you success. Any elk is a great elk. I’ll be 34 years young this year. See you boys on the mountainside.
Ps. The hippie dog bit is hilariously true.
@@mt4merica400 I’m glad to hear you’re having success man I really am I have quite a few miles under my belt. Last few years just hasn’t been very good. Truth be told I have never seen a cow elk on public property during the shoulder season. Which really sucks around Gallatin county because for me what it’s done is turned everybody loose into the area i used to shed hunt - I have scoured every piece of state land you can legally access in 393. 311 312 390. 391. 392. - I’ m 41 - 5 elk in 38 seasons three bulls one raggy and two fives - all after my buddies quit hunting - two cows on the ol’ Climbing Arrow when the Anderson s had it . I’ve quit three jobs over elk season and tried hard not to let but have a destroyed marriage over wapiti- probably go out tomorrow 😏
We need to get rid of guiding and have all hunters get back to the basics
Good video,mbut I will say Alaska is a close second in how they cater to moneybags. The more money you spend the bigger animal you cwn expect :-(
I lived in Montana for a decade while working and going to college. I regret not attempting to hunt elk in the state while I had the opportunity to do so for dirt cheap. I did hunt deer and antelope, however. Not to mention small game and fishing. Now I live in western South Dakota and intend on staying. The problems you are raising are similar across the country.
Really, the big question is what do we want hunting to look like on publicly accessible land? Big game hunting can supplement a household's food stores every year, but if I'm being honest I just don't think hunting alone can be relied on completely for meat. If you look at self-sustaining communities (like the Amish) hunting is a supplement and a hobby but agriculture is what feeds families most of their calories. That's the big issue with hunting for self-sustainability. It worked back in the day when the population density of people was low, but the west has filled up quite a bit since then and people are increasingly dependent on imported food instead of living off the land. How many native people used to populate Montana at once? 50k? Maybe 75k? Well, Montana has over a million people in it and 200k people are hunting elk compared to probably about 10k people back before settlement. The fact is there are too many people for those old lifestyles to be viable and it's been that way since 1900.
From the self-sustainability perspective, nonresident hunters and outfitters are obstacles to filling freezers with venison. There's no two ways about it, you can't have a state overrun with hunters from across the country AND a sizeable population of people who want to live solely off the land. If we gave everybody cheap tags and a three month season to satisfy demand then Elk would quickly go the way of bison.
From the outfitter perspective, resident hunters and landowners are obstacles and competition which eats into their profits. The fact is some rich guy from back east who paid $20k for a Montana elk hunt isn't likely to come back if he's not successful. Such hunters are more interested in the experience and the antlers than the meat. And yet, these nonresident hunters are invaluable.
Nonresidents drive the hunting industry in this country. They spend many times more money and bring in far more cash to local towns than the good ol' boys going out to get their annual elk meat. Neither side is wrong and neither side is bad, but for hunting to continue to be enjoyed by future generations there is going to need to be compromise between the people who hunt as part of their way of life and people who hunt purely for recreation.
If you ask me, that compromise is that the most popular game animals, like elk, need to have wait period between tags. South Dakota goes a decade which sounds extreme, but for every available tag there are about thirty resident applicants (no nonresident elk tags in SD). Montana wouldn't have to go to the same extreme, but it might be a good idea if residents could only hunt every other year while nonresidents have to wait three or four years. This would give everyone a more equal opportunity to bag an animal AND it would encourage people to hunt the less-popular game species in the state. Not to mention it would even out pressure on elk herds.
I doubt such a thing will come to pass though. Residents want to be able to hunt elk every year and would wish to not have any outside competition. Outfitters and nonresidents want to have exclusive access to public lands for the handful of clients willing to shovel out $$$ year after year. Fish and Parks wants the money but needs the voters so the most they will do is raise tag prices and make adjustments to tag availability in each hunting zone.
@@JamesWillmus I don’t believe hunters that use guide services contribute anything to the local economy- and here is just a case in point I know that the outfitter who hunts Cedar Mountain takes his clients up at 1 AM - they come back off of the mountain at 2 PM - they never leave their ranch except whirl they hunt the lee metcalf wilderness -they fly in to Ennis they fly out of Ennis - they will not spend any money in Madison County other than with the Guide- there’s no stores or restaurants or bars open - you make a guy get up at 12:30 and hike a mountain you’re not going drinking that afternoon ! -- I know a lot of people from not Montana will have something to say about this, but I’ve lived my whole life here I’ve never left and this is what I see -- remember I said %1500 over elk population objectives-/ that’s %1400 more than can survive the winter healthy -/ it’s no secret that guys like the Wilkes have caused elk to STARVE so they can hunt 9 bulls on a ranch that’s bigger than the smallest Montana county !
@@JamesWillmus so then you’re thinking they paid for an exclusive recreational experience on this ranch, except for everybody that works for the ranch is from Vermont -- so now they’re exploiting national forest and or wilderness areas trying to sell somebody in Montana experience with back east help - people in Billings don’t take time off in the fall to go elk hunting - I got laid off the first week of September I would love nothing more than a weeks worth of work or to shoot an elk right now-
The fwp sell the tags to out of state why I pay 17.00 and the out of state's pay 800.00 and happy to do so I'm 72 years young and I can't get a flippin tag for about 15 years now what's up with that shit period
@@kimmower6196 using bonus points ?.. I’m super happy to sell tags - it’s the quotas and the access that comes into question
You're right but unfortunately it aint gonna change. I killed my first elk in montana in 1967. Back then ranchers welcomed hunters, hazed elk off they're property and everyone hunted elk on public land on an even playing field. We always had outfitters for back country hunts but they didnt charge much nor make much. Its simply a matter of many hunters with fat wallets now.
Fish and Games WONT cut back Tags to help populations,,,,,,,,because their Payroll is already set,,,if they cut back on tags there goes their revenue and Paycheck,,,,,,,,Idaho is a Mad House now day's,,bow or Gun season,,,,,,,Combat Hunting like Combat fishing on the Russian river in Alaska,,,,,,,,,so sad because it used to be Great
Wow. This is crazy. I'm a Michigan resident and would love an Elk hunt in MT. But residents first. Period. Hard stop. Residents first and foremost, shouldnt even be an issue. Outfitters should have NO preference of any type over resident hunters. Sounds more like Elk hunting in MT has become a business.
@@wolfgangvonmueller6895 man I don’t wanna sound like a Debbie downer so don’t let it stop you - thank you for listening. Thank you for watching. I really do appreciate it. My biggest complaint really is just a complete commercialization of elk - one has to kill seven deer to get the same volume of meat one elk - when I was younger, I would focus on just one elk and a deer was a plus .. now elk it’s pretty much just off the menu -- I wanna put the focus back in the food part of hunting and not the trophy part it’s fun killing ones with antlers don’t get me wrong but I’m 41 born and raised never shot a six point bull -- but I see lots of them in the back of trucks out of state plates
@Brandansquests The "commercialization" part is disappointing. Forget the non-residents as that commercialization impacts the individual resident hunter. I'm with you Brandan, "freezer first", antlers second. I have some killer Michigan mounts in my house but you can't eat antlers.
Although you may be correct that it is worse in your state, that is all over now days. Nevertheless, you gave a fair analysis. As far as the "hippy dog walkers" you reference, that also is all over. But it is more remarkable about the hunters that act like the motorized recreation, and free ranging target shooters also do not impact hunting, just like all the hippy activities. Yamaha et al always made a good buck from us selling outboards. Now this expanded. Go to a hunting or gun show and reps from these industries are there. Don't fool yourself, that is drawing a lot of kids away from hunting into activities that offer faster gratification. Once you start your snowmobile the fun starts (I guess, wouldn't know personally). And it starts at the roadside or trailhead, not the hike back in miles you discussed. Hunting is the polar opposite. There is not much difference with target shooters that do not hunt or do not hunt avidly. Back not too long ago, nobody would be plinking during an open hunting season, they would rather hunt. That is no longer true. Indeed, most hunters do some target shooting, if only to the extent of sighting in their rifle. But nobody serious prefers to do it in the woods. A target range has measured distances, target stands, a trash can, benches and parking. That goes for clay target shooting with shotguns too. When someone is basically wasting a hundred dollars' worth of ammo (or more) and then does not want to pay a nominal fee to use a range, it is not because they cannot afford it. Rather it is because they don't like following rules and may even have been kicked off one or more shooting facilities... Next, we take money for hunting programs and misuse them on range construction on public lands, often under the guise of "training new hunters" to comply with grant guidelines. As you stated, with each passing generation, knowledge is lost and as this gap widens, we get closer to the point of no return. The people studying college wildlife biology, then subsequentially gaining employment to run hunting programs also do not hunt. This heads toward a blind leading the blind situation. We need to do it all a different way the NEXT thirty years, the recent has failed and cost us. Drop the ideology, get real, and get back to basics...
@@ny-dovehunting5602 I really appreciate this comment. I really really do this. It means a lot to me. Thank you for understanding. I have videos posted where I’m yelling at guys that are riding their four wheelers on closed logging trails. I have videos posted where I’m yelling at guys that are out target practicing while I’m stalking mule deer - this is the exposure. I’m trying to get right here man really I don’t wanna be the Debbie donor. I feel maybe I might’ve attracted some of the wrong crowd with the Debbie downer. I’m not I get up every day and tries as hard as I can. This was very very well put and you’re dead right man if somebody goes out to national forest and is driving up one trail to set their target when driving up another trail to sept themselves up only to shoot off three $400 worth of ammo it’s not because they can’t afford to go to arrange and be respectful of the folks that are also out trying to use the public land - it’s that they are king of their own world in their mind and they give zero about anybody else - I wish you a pleasant experience the next time you go hunting
This is what’s happening in Arizona. Our Game & fish department is funded all on its own, no help from the government. They literally work hand in hand with guides and influencers handing them first dips on everything. The guides have been known to buy huge parcels of land and chase wildlife into areas year round. Everyone out here is aware of the payouts they are receiving to turn a blind eye or to cushion the draw odds in guides favors
@@Dirtbagoutdoors-qh4nk we are the hunting district here 310 -/ special zone 310-46 only 5 tags - right against Yellowstone National Park- the president of the Mule deer foundation of Montana and his wife have drawn that tag each twice since 2005 - you would literally have greater odds of winning the lottery while being struck by lightning while having your face painted by bill gates - 2023 our fish wildlife parks commissioner that just stepped down during season was caught trespassing on a ranch in the 360 .. can’t even trust the FWP to uphold the law
Western hunter from WI. I quit. Public a joke. 10k now for private land outfitted hunt. C ya..
All of the Western states have adopted this practice. You used to be able to buy over the counter tags in most states decades ago for regular hunts.....drawings ONLY for very special hunts. We bowhunted Utah every season. California still offers ample tags for deer hunters however there are lots of homeless folks occupying national forest campgrounds and roadside turn offs..... My son lives in Nevada....3 years to draw a DOE TAG!!! Complete BS!!!
That is why I moved to the Florida!! 3 bucks and 2 antlerless deer per season, per hunter....unlimited wild hogs year round. Very hunter friendly State. The west is toast........
Wawawah you didn’t get your elk try deer hunting New Hampshire. Can go a couple of years without seeing a deer. We don’t quit .
@@Papa-rm6hr- different worlds but different worlds. I’ll make a video right now for you ! “ how many dead deer on the way to big sky” the real toll of the rich
I don’t quit I never quit - but everybody around me is, and I think I just speak to the general sentiment of the most of the folks born and raised in Montana I appreciate you watching, though I really do - I couldn’t imagine being a hunter and living in New England -
It could be worse, you could be in Oregon*
The kings deer!
@@jacobpalmer7589 mmhuh - lots of little ranches will let a guy pop a cow - but you’re probably get permission to punch a baby before you can get permission to shoot an elk with antlers
Get rid of all nonresident hunts, no guides.
Just lower the quota.
@@mx500a4 no that’s the opposite of what needs to happen like I said there’s places where elk population is 1500% over objective .. what does that mean? Well in 20 acres - maybe there could exist five or six healthy elk- in some places they’ll be over 100 - they don’t have anything to eat they’re subsisting entirely off of haystacks which is why land owners feel like they own the elk -
@@toddthun yeah I truly believe that that’s what needs to happen and that’s the only thing that’s gonna fix the problem in 393 410 451 390 391 the problem starting to spread now out into Reed Point and Absorakee .. won’t be long until they have shoulder seasons on the reservations. Those hunting districts I just named are all at least 500% over population objective. That means when you get an elk from those areas they’re skinny. They’re small. And the antlers aren’t gonna be as developed as they would if there was enough nutrients- look at it look at the hunting district 380 - highly coveted tons of people put in for it shed hunting there is absolutely phenomenal There are no rag horns. They’re all massive . Right across the road. 391. Shoulder season, absolute garbage.
Stop residents from hunting on Federal Land. BLM Land, National Forests, National Wilderness Areas and National Monuments…..
@ that will only lead to animals starving to death- and that is problematic federalist way of looking at it - in the depression area when people didn’t play by the rules the animals were decimated - it’s Montana State taxpayers that fund the initial wildfire battle costs no matter where they start - I’m not sure what kind of comment this is. Do you ever send me a deer starving to death?
Born in Butte, been gone a longtime. Mining in the ironrange. Sounds like Michigan & it’s deer hunting. Gone. Put a fork in it.
@@REIronminer I have a lot of family in Butte- hell we may be related all my Irish-Norwegian comes from butte - other side is crow - we like to drink just not good at it 😂… there’s been an explosion in the highlands of elk seeking refuge from the shoulder season from Table to the Beaverhead they have been growing - fricking turkeys along the Jefferson now can you believe that!?
@@REIronminer there is still good meat hunting here - but my kids may not have ‘general’ tags my oldest started hunting this year (10 yo) and I tried to never let him see me get frustrated- if it isn’t fun he won’t carry it on .. that for me right now is the hardest part keeping a positive attitude towards it and teaching my son to love it
Nonresident here
32 % of Montanas State Budget is paid by Federal Funds, money for your schools, roads, hospitals, welfare and on and on
Most all of the nonresident s are hunting on Federal Lands, Blm,National Refuges, National Forest and Wilderness Areas.
When some of you were in Iraq or Afghanistan did you ask what State the copter or A10 pilot was from?
The law which is able to be modified gives States custody and control over the wildlife living in its borders, but I seriously doubt it gives exclusive use to only its residents.
The Feds could stop hunting on all Federal Lands.
@@williamfeldner9356 .. let me first state if you’re a veteran all hail, buddy hit me up. If you come back to Montana I’ll take you out personally myself. I won’t even bring a rifle.-/ but I hear what you’re saying on the federal public land thing.. and I’m gonna tell you this .. back in the 50s and 60s there was no none zero zilch nada elk in the Bridger Mountains and it actually took a rich guy from California buck Anderson God bless his soul to put together a huge ranch called the climbing arrow … he put together a bunch of tiny homesteads .. and after they were all conglomerated The few elk that were left actually got a reprieve and slowly, but surely the Bridgers filled up, that being said, I hope that nobody thinks that I completely hate privately owners or outfitters because frankly, it took some large landowners back during the depression era to save Montana’s wildlife- which gets me to the point- Montana would not look the way that it does right now had it been the current management practices - we’re pretty fortunate to have a wildlife rich public land resource I 100% agree it is absolutely just as much yours as it is mine- however you have to understand there is only elk and deer left on there because I play by the rules- and because I am willing to yell and scream at people who are not -in the middle of nowhere- even if they are armed- but truly, though William, if you’re a veteran hit me up, man I’ll give you all my elk spots !!!
The sport of kings, hunting is for the rich and famous
@@darrylhoupt3763 - in Montana it hasn’t been- increasingly more so year over year- I’m hoping this to be able to get an honest opinion of the local folks in Montana - we’ve always had a really poor economy but at least you could feed yourself - now that’s becoming an issue- hard to stand behind the commercial aspects of this industry this year in particular things are so tight financially - it’s the beauty of self -sustainability
Okay... Born and raised in NE Montana... Still own land... Hunted for 35 years and enjoyed it... Moved to Nevada and then became a non-resident... Guides and millionares and non-profits (oxymoron) lobbying ruining hunting now... Now it costs me a fortune as a native non-resident hunter to go home and harvest an animal... POLITICS...!!! Now, it is also happening in Nevada as rich people buy Governor tags, etc. and can buy a couple $250K bull elk tags and "posch" it with a rifle during archery season and take these monster bulls away from residents...!!! $$$ TALKS and POLITICIANS promote it...!!!
Hunting becoming a $$$ game... Not even real hunts most of time... Buy tag, hire guides, fly in, hike 1/2 mile, guides gun set up, shoot, take photos, give meat away, head to taxidermist, hang mount on wall and then write an article or brag about how good the hunt was...!!! Wasn't even a hunt just a SHOOT...!!! Now, here, we have to draw any maybe every 5-6 years you might get a deer tag and 13-17 for an elk... Driving hunters, young and old, away...!!!
@@JesseMurdock-o3y that’s what I want to avoid here in Montana - we’ve always been a hard economy to live in but at least there was elk meat every fall when you went on job attached unemployment- there’s some sort of nationalist feeling that the elk belong to everybody in America -/ while there’s some pretty hard feelings from the local population that x state ruined it’s hunting so you need to clean up state x’s own backyard instead of trying to come here and adding fuel to this fire where are you in relation to the Fort Belknap? Have you heard about what they’re doing with the sheep? Millions of dollars spent trying to bring back those big horn in the Gros Venture are poaching just to be able to eat
Iam from mich. Res. Should be the first ones on the tags., your dnr sound like ares is all just about $$ thats it
Its all about money
@@shawnrieser6299 let’s make it not ! - let’s get back to fun and making memories and friends - every body is so competitive including me I’m not a push over but we gotta keep it going for another generation or two at least!
Leased land has ruined deer hunting for the common man who wont or cant pay $2000 to $10,000 to have a place to hunt.
@@markburrell2778 I’m on a one man campaign to try to change that I’ve decided to make it my life mission you from Montana let’s get out. I’ll help you. I’ll help anyone.
Wolves kill 365 days per year no limit and wolves do not contribute in any way to the betterment of any big game animal.
@@Mike-xi4zt yeah absolutely man I don’t know why anybody would’ve ever wanted to bring the wolf back without first having put forth effort to bring back national forest Buffalo - I mean, wouldn’t it be kick ass if you could get your general elk tag general deer tag General bison tag General bighorn, sheep tag since there were so many of those here when Lewis and Clark walked through that they couldn’t sleep at night because it sounded like thunder, even on a clear night for all the bighorn fighting
How about let the land and animals recover from the human footprint. Maybe every other year.
Just stay in California barry.
@@barrysmith916 we have a lot of biologist who put in their input - but in Montana, all of our elected officials are from California - and so we end up with outside influence, telling us how we should run our state - noticed that you haven’t seen a Flathead governor or a Crow senator or a Shoshone congressman- we have Gianforte and Daines and now Shady-Sheehy-- our voices of the state are Steve Rinella and Randy Newberg neither of who grew up in this state .. we have no way to compete with the outside $ … I would encourage you to drive highway 191 from Gallatin Gateway to Yellowstone National Park every single day there will be multiple animals hit on the road .. this is an area that needs more hunting not less - .. I’m sure there’s places that need to rest - but there are places where the Elk population is %1500 over what the land can sustain and that only happened because we do not have free range hunting - chronic wasting disease would never have happened historically because everything had to run for its life -
@@Brandansquests I'd vote for a democrat but they're all complete morons, not saying I like Gianforte but we didn't have a choice. Tester ended up being a posterchild for the dingbat left.
Arizona hunting is bad in my opinion
@@justbaggit70 Steven Drake would make me believe it’s superb- ain’t that where all the Utah guys film their shed-hunts ?
@Brandansquests try and get drawn for a resident rifle hunt. Not easy unless you go with worse odds units. Then the amount of people out running up and down the roads is nuts. If you are willing to go into some remote areas and lots of hiking you raise ur odds