Toyota 1.6/1.8L Oil Burning -'96 Geo Prizm -Part 3 of 4
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- Опубликовано: 15 сен 2024
- Join me on this Christmas Special as I attempt to cure a chronic oil-burning problem on this '96 Geo Prizm with almost 240k miles on the clock.
The procedures performed here will apply to these 4-cylinder engines used on Toyota Corolla and Geo/Chevy Prizm vehicles 1993 thru 2002:
1.6L 4A-FE
1.8L 7A-FE
Part 1: Intro and vehicle history, symptoms, plan of attack. -Pre-teardown compression and leak-down check.
-Cylinder head removal.
Part 2: Piston removal/cleaning, piston ring replacement.
Part 3: Cylinder head valve cleaning/lapping.
Part 4: Reassembly, start-up, test drive, follow-up.
Enjoy the series, and Happy Holidays!
-Ivan, Pine Hollow Auto Diagnostics
Its nice to see the other side of a not disposable society repair where fixing an engine instead of scraping a car that is quite common in other parts of the world. Of course the numbers have to makes sense but for a friend they always do LOL When I do small engine valves I use my sandblaster cabinet modified of course it didn't work out of the box correctly but I use it for brake calipers , slide pins and anything else I can fit in there. I highly recommend it for the type of work you do.
+Steve Rob Is true, manual brushing is certainly very slow.
I totally get what he is doing here,,, no reason to polish a turd. Look at the shape the car is in, he is just making it run better for as long as the car itself will last. That's the point here, not preparing the car for the Indianapolis 500. Great job Ivan.
+chungaleta1234 LOL finally someone sees the light! But man can you imagine this thing in the Indy 500? I would pay to see that.
+motoYam82 Funny to see Eric's customer on the other side is sending a much better looking car to the scrappy.
Civic with weaksauce Auto tranny belongs in the scrap HAHAHA the only reason I'm keeping this thing alive is because it's a stick shift lol
+motoYam82 Stick shifts rule! I'll give you that
+motoYam82 Not the Indy 500, but a six hour ChumpCar race for sure!
I have to hand it to ya man, this is almost like schooling for me. The tests you've shown on top of the step by step processes of valve cleaning has really helped me gain a better understanding the process. Slowly but surely, I'm becoming less and less intimidated by internals. Thanks much!
looking forward to wrapping it all up in episode 4.
Keep it up, & Keep em coming!
Should use Permatex 80038 Prussian Blue, .75 fl oz Tube to check valve and seat conformity. Enjoy your videos !
I appreciate the videos ..A long time ago i was a mechanic for Gm and apparently sales sold a Ford truck to a fellow and it used a lot of oil. So they decided the service department would make it right . I was the lucky guy to fix patch it up. So in framed the engine and used Continental rings ..Rolled in a set of bearings. Honed the cylinder after i had wrapped the crank journals to keep them clean ect . Had the heads serviced . I was surprised how well the 390 ran after i got it together. Used pistons, worn cylinder ect . I did not check the cylinders for taper ect ..with dia bore gauge . One thing i seen in the past from another shop they ground the valves and seats but did not check the valve stem length . Non adjustable valve train . Results was a cylinders with the vavles not seating
I know now why mechanics charge what they do.
Great video 😎
Those pitted valves are the pits! You would be better off at least seeing if they can be ground down to get the pits out. I wonder if you could even make a jig for your grinder to touch them up a bit.
I used that paste in the 1960s on a motorbike engine There was a stick with a suction cup on each end that went along with
the paste, worked great on valves with flat surfaces not so good on dished ones
some guys used an electric drill on the shaft of the valve for a quick and dirty job
+Colin McGregor What vintage motorbikes did you work on Colin? I've lapped valves before in the field with some Crest toothpaste (must have flavor crystals to be effective lol) when lapping paste was not available.
See page 4 of the ride report here:
advrider.com/index.php?threads/cross-country-on-a-50-bike-ny-sf-and-back.366117/
Hey Ivan! A small tip I learnt from Jafromobile. I masked off the valve stem, stuffed it in a drill and at low speed attacked the wire wheel! Cleaned em right up
+TGsrao1989 You should have seen the rock-hard deposits on these valves. Off camera I actually had to GRIND a few bigger chunks off! Had to charge the guy a couple extra hours for that lol...
Wish I bought a few spare exhaust valves before the procedure as they are pretty cheap for aftermarket. Then again, the original ones have been through hell and were still *usable*...not sure how well the aftermarket ones would hold up. I'm paranoid of aftermarket parts, especially critical engine internals :)
I like that valve cap/keeper removal tool. I've never seen that before. Nice wrok saving the old car for a while.
I love it, workin' on the ground like the rest of us! (Well, I must confess, I wimped out a month ago and built a small workbench. I"m old.) Can't wait to hear that baby purrr.
Hope you replaced the worn out valves .no amount of lapping is going to help them.
I like your videos, but this one you should have talked your friend into getting all new valves. And there is a special tool with a suction cup meant for lapping. To my understanding you're supposed to twist back and forth while quickly lifting and lowering the valve into its seat.
I love spot repair, when just need to repair that only, thanks mate.
great series.!. watched all 4 episodes and loved every single one... very detailed (consult with Haynes manual) but helped gain confidence into tackling this job or get more familiar with this emgine... thanks
Wait a second!! In 14:40 you have on your table "Delicje"?! It's from my country made by Wedel. I didn't realize that sweet piece of heaven is available in US:)
+kuuuba777 LOL we have Eastern European Market (aka Russian Store) here in State College, PA. You are right it is sweet piece of heaven with tea :)
+motoYam82 oh yeah I love them with tea too. As a secret I can tell you that name "Delicje" means something delicious. I can truly recommend other Wedel's sweets. For example "Ptasie mleczko" but DO NOT eat them all because you will soon look like Jabba the Hutt. Cheers!
+kuuuba777 He is Russian.
Yo Ivan, Great series so far man! I watched all three parts while tearing down 3 pistols I shot the crap out of yesterday. Wish I could have come down to give a hand with this job and bear the burden of some of the comments with you lol. I think you did a fine job so far and look forward to seeing the out come. Ripping down engines is fun IMO and wish I did more of it actually but it is a little different at my shop as you know. The valve tool you were using caught my attention though I LIKE IT! Do you have to fiddle with it much or does it work every time?
+South Main Auto Repair "bear the burden of the comments" LOL it's tough man!
That magic Lisle valve spring tool works incredibly well. Gets those keepers back on the stem on the first or second try every time! I have used the C-clamp method before, but that's like cave-man style haha! This might be the one tool that I have and you don't :P
Yeah ya got me on that one. Sounds like me, I am right 50% of the time every time.
:8
ivan, you forgot the valve stem oil seals, a major source for oil burning problems.
+happy543210 Ahhh you didn't pay attention in Part 1 :) It's in the "boring" part with the notebook lol
nice work Ivan. music does help the work along for sure.
Hope you replace those worn out valves and their seals as well! Otherwise it will bite you back soon!!
nothing wrong with building a motor like this for a friend on a budget. of course you wouldn't do this in a larger shop with a customer willing to pay for proper repairs.
but those pitted valves are pretty bad, would be nice to get some decent used ones from the junkyard.
This is awesome!!! Thanks so much. Gonna do this on my 1994 Corolla Wagon in the next few days!
Cool! Corolla wagons are awesome, keep it alive :)
The valves are cooled by their contact with the seat and the intake valve will be cooled by the seat & air/fuel mixture and that is why the intake valves are in better shape. Those exhaust valves with get worse and get so hot the oil will coke again and pit even worse (if they get hot enough they will crack & you will be pulling the head again). The valve stems will also get hotter so hopefully the valve guides will not have excessive wear. The exhaust valves could be refaced by the machine shop and returned to service as long as the margin is within spec to keep it from burning up. Intake valves are more forgiving exhaust valves are not. Let the customer know it's not going to last and next time you may be replacing the valve seats because they will get so hot they may crack & pit like the valve. Sometimes you have to spend a little money to keep from spending more money next time. It is a 96 NY car so maybe the car will give out before the engine.
+Robert Hayward Yes, heat transfer from the valves to the seats is absolutely key here! But keep in mind we addressed two problems here:
One: the valve lapping already improved the head transfer dramatically, and
Two: there should (hopefully) be no more oil to burn with the new piston rings.
Soooo I'll give him a 100K MILE GUARANTEE on my work, and will pull the head and replace valves FOR FREE if the problem returns.
I'll make sure to post a follow-up video in a couple months once he puts a few miles on my ghetto rebuild and see how things are progressing :)
+motoYam82 Just trying to let you learn from @40 years experience & keep you from getting bit next time b/c this one will come back long before 100K. Valve lapping with good valves is one thing, lapping with pitted burnt exhaust valves is not. Sometimes doing favors for customers and trying to keep the price down will cost you in the long run. Tell them the price to fix it correctly and if they decide to have you do it the cheap way document it and let them know what the normal warranty is if done correctly and the adjusted warranty for doing it the cheap way. Just watched Eric's video he posted today on a Honda that shredded a timing belt and bent some valves and he gave them the price for doing the job correctly with the head going to the machine shop. Your reputation for quality work is important and not worth a customer saying you just did his engine & had piston rings and a valve job and it only lasted ????? miles.
Agreed. Really appreciate any tips from pros in the field; that is how we all learn!
The owner of this Geo is completely on-board with the operation :) Reputation is absolutely key of course. At this point I can probably rip the head off this thing and replace a few valves in a few hours with my eyes closed so it wouldn't be a big loss of time/money on my part.
And you can bet the entire process is well-documented from start to finish :)
Thank you for your great comments, Robert! You will enjoy the final part in this series for sure :)
haha.. zawsze dobrze miec Delicje lol :D Made my day Ivan, having that delicious candy lying around :-P
Ivan you need a bench buddy.Never seen that Valve Collet tool before looks good.Tam.
nice magnetic tray. another cheap trick is to use an old egg carton to keep a bunch of lil bits organized!
+1quickchevy2 Nice tip!
+motoYam82 Multi-compartment muffin tin with magnets glued to the bottom.
You carefully kept the buckets in the proper order to maintain the original valve clearances. But did lapping the valves and seats remove enough material that your clearances are now out of spec?
Great vid Ivan. I want a raspberry whatever that was next to your grinder ..
Ha. I sometimes use a drill and lap the valves in when they are really pitted
Then once 3/4 done. Move to hand lapping. Yea buddy. Keep it up. !!!!
I run Quaker State oil because it burns clean and in recent years the 4 engine's that I rebuilt were clean inside.
Did some work on my dads bikes, the first was a BSA b33 500cc a big single cylinde plodder the next was a BSA road rocket a 650 twin both bikes had a double adult sidecar with trailer in the old days this was not an unusual sight in the uk lol
The procedure was very well done but the long term result is doubtful. I guess we will just have to wait and see.
+wysetech2000 I'll post a follow-up vid in 100k miles ;)
+motoYam82 Sounds good to me bud.
The EGR Tube most likely for the cause for the exhaust valve issues and oil burning
How many of those valves I would have to order.? I to am having a oil issue and I only use my car local use. Currently have a 2001 chevy prizm and also still having a misfire in cylinder 4. Spark plugs were just changed yesterday. How do I truly fix my cylinder 4 misfire without having to put in a different engine.
soak the valves in a glass of Coca-Cola over night, they will come out glowing ;)
Why would you go to all this trouble and not put in new valves? You could probably get all new valves for less than $75.
Soak them in WD-40 for a couple of minutes or seconds and use a flat head to remove the carbon, it makes it easy 👍
You are so good!!!
You could build yourself a valve grinder with a 5C collet indexer and a die grinder clamped in a homemade fixture.
when the valve is pitted like those are you toss em in the trash, cost of new exhaust valves are cheap, your valve job will only last a year or less,I know this a buget build but the seats should have been cut , in fact, after the valve seat and valves have been refaced at a machine shop, thats when you lap em in, also keep the lapping compound off the stems and clean the heck out of every thing, the shims will will need to be changed(maybe), but yeah you got it down.
It's been a year and 16k miles later and top end is in beautiful shape, doesn't burn a drop of oil. Will be replacing the con rod bearings soon though...a simple 2-hour procedure on this engine.
Nice work keeping the old girl running... that valve cap tool was awesome...with the amount of carbon on the exhaust valves common or is something down the line not pulling the exhaust out? great video Ivan...
Hi Ivan thanks for this series, I think u would have been better to renew the exhaust valves because of the heavy pitting and the labour involved in cleaning them up, let's hope u don't get burnt exhaust valves now! cheers sandy
+sandy anderson Hey if they survived up till now, they are made of some top-quality Japanese metal!! Definitely tougher than those soft ones on the Chevy Cobalt we saw earlier...
第三个排气阀门应该换新的了，才$8 左右一个。因为已经烧蚀了一个凹孔，再安装下去就不耐用。日后又要换新的，拆开引擎人工费要比买一个新的阀门贵50~60倍。
Did you hone the cylinders don't remember seeing that part
head work is better done at machine shop or buy a remanufactured one. its a road we have all been down before. i did that to a taurus it was fine for a few months.
+jimmy neutron But that would cost more $$ and wouldn't be any fun :)
I would of replace the valves done
good work man .but just put in new valves😉
Seafoam is alot less issues put in every cylinder use a funnel soak two times 8hr each soak. Crank disconnect distributor tell fluid is all gone. I have twice as much power solved issue.
I got a question, what colour is the inlet and outlet springs? im dismounted mine and now im not sure which is which, theres brown springs and grey
You can take photos of things before you disassemble them. Saved my butt dozens of times. Sorry can't answer that.
where did you buy that tool to remove the spring?
Ivan, judging by the age and shape of the car, your friend cannot or does not want to invest any sizable amount of money in this vehicle. At the same time because he keeps repairing it, he must also rely on this vehicle for his sole means of transportation. That being said your friend is probably more than happy for your best efforts to keep his baby breathing as cheaply as humanly possible, including going all out caveman on it! LOL! We all know there is a right way to do things, and wrong way to do things. Then again, sometimes there is only one way ( because of money constraints ) to do things. People out there have to remember you are not a machine shop with all the proper equipment such as lathes, milling machines, etc.. which services are not cheap. What you did for this engine is not exactly optimal, but you may have bought a few more months or longer for this car and for your friend to find a suitable replacement ! Keep e'm coming Ivan ! Happy Holidays !
+Billy R Thanks Billy! I told him that he can't buy a new car until this one really bites the dust...so he might be out of luck for a while. I promise to let you guys know if and when he decides to trade in the Prizm :)
+motoYam82 As I have told you before my friend, I have no plans in letting "Turbolet" go, but since it has proven unsuitable for driving over obstacles such as this www.artvbal.com/photos/i-Vs2tjZn/0/XL/i-Vs2tjZn-XL.jpg I plan to save some moneys and get me used Suzuki SX-4 AWD, to which you shall add skidplates and lift kit, so I can finally rock those roads :) . As for "Turbolet", its days of forest riding are coming to an end, but its state highways days are far from over...
Not many tech these days can say they have hand lapped a set of valves !
pretty sloppy job you did-Eric Obrochta would be dissappointed also-NO brake cleaner used !!
-I would check for bent valves,valve guide wear,plus blow residue out of heads,lightly oiling parts before reassembly
-possibly new sodium valves-and check for flatness of head-mill if necessary since aluminium heads prone to warp
-i have 50 yr old valve lapping compound still -I have DIY done 12 to 15 engines
-many down to crankshaft bearings- -from 3 to 12 cylinders -so semi experienced
Check out the "Sloppy Mechanics" RUclips channel. I love cheap sloppy fixes that work perfectly ;)
nice
Where did you get "Delicje" from?
why don't you put valve stem seals?
Seeing that you are doing a major part of the work, why not go the whole hog and replace the valves.Your clientele wont thank you for doing a 2nd rate job and wont do your reputation any good either. Most of them haven't a clue about the inner workings of the engine and rely on your expertise to do a good job.Don't let them dictate your standards.These jobs have a habit of coming back to bite you.
+Tom OConnor Considering I have had to tear into this engine three times in the past two years, I see your point :)
However, if you fix everything at once, you can't perform the scientific "separation of variables," which is absolutely key to learning about cause and effect (i.e. how much of the oil is due to valve seals vs. oil rings?). If I need to replace the valves further down the road it will be my pleasure to do so. But what if these pitted things last another 200k miles?? That will be valuable experience to me as to where to draw the line between rebuilding and replacing.
I can say that I have learned a tremendous amount from this car, and am doing my best to share it with everyone here.
This customer is my good friend and he completely supports this long-term "case-study" with the Geo Prizm, as long as it's reliable of course :)
I can see your point of view and there's probably a method in your madness.Keep up the good work.
Looks like someone wasn't taking care of their engine.
why wouldent you just buy new valves for the deformed ones
Time constraint is one valid reason. They used to cost $8 and were a week away, no telling how it is in the new millennium - I just dated myself didn't it?
But those two should have been replaced as well as the cylinders de-glazed for the new rings. Coulda, woulda, shouda. Too late now in any event and so am looking forward to the final episode.
Send head to Jaffromobile :) ! Port job with new valves!
+Steve Allen LOL and then put a turbo on it! Then it would be a freakin tire-burning rocket! :)
@@PineHollowAutoDiagnostics I sense that you're being facetious.
My 2000 corolla goes through a quart of oil in 45-50 miles lol
Interesting thing though the labor is around 9 hrs just for rings not including valve job and 14 hrs for engine swap.. why didn't you just get a 500$ used engine? considering you had the head off 2 times. I would have recommended a used engine the first time because of oil consumption and low compression... Not hating on you or anything man just saying the customer already spent more on this + previous repairs then a used engine..
Used engine would likely be an oil burner as well lol... Waste of time
For all the new marketing kids out there. This is sutainabilty! Make the nost out of what you allredy got, not just trow it away for the new "green labeled" version that is most certainly even worse.
It is too painful to watch