I use both also, and the main thing I’ve found is that the Victron products seamlessly integrate together to form a complete solution, particularly in much more complicated applications (ie marine, off grid, etc).
Great work Stefen. I really value your reviews and the thoroughness you put in to them. It helps make decisions on products like these. Thanks very much. 👏🏻
Some interesting perspectives for both teams! Love Both and run them both. Victron got my business last time round and I must say when wanting multiple separate unites for reduncancy, and alot of amps, I am not dissapointed! So long as you're not buying any/most of the other brands I think you're onto a winner!
I have 50 years of experience installing and maintaining predominantly DC systems of all shapes and sizes. Included in that was a fair chunk of time doing fleet installations of 12V equipment. I installed whatever the customer wanted and generally, had a good run with Redarc and Victron gear. That said, as an Aussie I would love to say that Redarc was the better product but, in my opinion, it wasn't born out by the facts. I never had a single Victron product rattle itself to pieces, but I can't say the same for Redarc. That is why I choose Victron when installing stuff for myself.
Interesting perspective, thanks for sharing your experience. Interest how the old Redarc chargers could rattle to pieces. Mine have survived the Canning ,Tanami and countless Desert Trips. Old chargers also had a potted board so nearly impossibly to rattle to pieces. Can’t talk about other Producst besides inverters and batteries though.
Thankyou for the comprehensive review. A couple of comments if I may: #1 Victron chargers can be networked to a Victron SmartShunt so that any Victron charger will work off the more accurate voltage at the battery terminals, preventing it prematurely switching to absorption mode (from voltage drop in the cables). You didn't say whether you networked the Orion. #2 Sad that they both lack cooling fans. The Enerdrive DC2DC is bulkier because it does runs cooling fans and at 40A I haven't seen it derate. You can run it at 50A but I don't know whether it would maintain the higher output. Downside is the fan noise when mounted inside the cab. #3 I prefer a separate solar controller for any roof solar on vehicle or caravan. It is a small extra cost and means you have full alternator output available in addition to full solar output and overcomes issues related to blending. I then have the solar input on the DCDC charger available for portable solar. #4 It is good that you can vary the output of these DCDC chargers - I reduce mine when the high output is not needed. I find I rarely need to use the DCDC in our van because it has plenty of solar on a separate controller. I prefer not to stress the alternator every time I go for a drive.
Thanks for your thoughtful comments! I've never had an issue with premature switching to absorption mode. In fact, I usually set the input voltage to around 14.2V for LFP batteries. I actually prefer that these chargers don't have cooling fans. The Redarc's specs are superior to the Enerdrive, even without a fan. Fans can fail, and if the thermal management relies on them, performance might suffer if they do. I'd rather use a third-party external case with a fan if needed. For larger solar setups, I agree that using a separate MPPT controller is ideal. However, in my four-wheel drive setup, I previously used both a Victron MPPT and a Redarc DC-DC charger and noticed no significant difference. For such installations, I prefer an all-in-one unit. It's great that you can adjust the output of these chargers, but it's even more crucial to be able to reduce the input as well. This flexibility allows you to use a 50A charger with a small alternator by simply reducing the input and adjusting it later if you upgrade your alternator or add another charger. This feature is particularly beneficial when running two chargers simultaneously; you can limit the input of one or both chargers to maintain efficient thermal operation.
As always, love your videos, Stefan! Your videos are always factual and unbiased - love it. I’ve been on the fence about upgrading my DC charger, torn between Victron and the new Redarc Alpha series-which looks like a real game-changer in the DC charger market. On another note, have you considered checking out the Projecta 12-24V 50A DC-DC Battery Charger (IDC50X)? It’s a new player on the market and falls into the same power and class as the Victron SX and Redarc Alpha 25/50. Has similar features as the Redarc Alpha 25/50 however much nicer and cleaner app and the added bonus feature of IO replay control. Would love to hear your thoughts on it! Ethan
From personal experience, I can vouch that Both are great DC-DC chargers and they certainly should be for the PRICE. I personally have many Victron products that have never had an issue. However, I have installed multiple "Renogy" 30A and 50A DC-DC chargers with solar input (and bluetooth plug in interface)and have had ZERO issues at a fraction of the cost of these models to the point that if one ever died I would just buy another one... without a second thought.
Good to know. I don't mind Renogy I have one of their 2000w inverters, I'm just concerned by the support here in Australia, as I heard on multiple occasions people having quite some issues.
Have had 3 Renogy products - 20A MPPT - excellent, over 6 years old now I think, still runs like a dream - 60A DCDC - died after 14 months, never got close to expected output - possibly due to alternator capability (BIG cables running to it) (assuming battery input capacity was as advertised) - 50A DCDC with MPPT to replace above - so far so good....
Like the review, I find that being able to limit the charging current a great feature on the victron, this enables easy control to limit the amount of current drawn from your alternator when you dont ha e the 50amp capacity
I’m currently trying to decide between these two units. Thanks for the video. Some points that I think are worth nothing. 1. You can add a temp sensor to the victron unit if you add the smart shunt. 2. Using a separate dcdc and mppt means a higher total charge with a victron setup. 3. If you add more victron units, you get a better combined product experience than the redarc. All this said I’m leaning towards the redarc unit. Oh and lastly the victron documentation suggests that the unit must be mounted vertically. This may help thermal management. Worth a try
thank you for your constructive comments interesting with the vertical mountain. Can’t see how that can make a difference but who knows at present the 80a good enough for me. I can only say having both units if you have them side-by-side and take them apart the red rock feels way more solid and better mate. The Victron feels quite flimsy.
Nice one mate... I wish both Redarc and Victron would make their apps CarPlay compatible, especially when it would be quite easy to do so. I use the BCDC1240D and am still happy with it since I resolved my derating issues inside the cabin by mounting it to a 300x200x2mm sheet of aluminium, sucking a lot of heat away from the unit. I have also 3D printed my own version of the Redtek cooling unit utilising ultra quiet Noctua CPU fans. Excellent review as always.
@@AlloffroadAu I believe it is - it has to be "authorised" as being safe to use while driving, which is why some other common apps (e.g. our own ExplorOz) can't be used via CarPlay/Android Auto. Some others may have more detail
Great review Stefan, I have the Victron installed in my vehicle and ventilation is not ideal and will likely get the redtek cooler. I monitor output regularly and I definitely get more than 10-15 mins prior to derating. More Mike 45-60 mins in qld summer. Redarc is very appealing but love the victron adjustability and eco system
I run the XS and its been flawless, sits at 49ish amps no problems.I think location location location and wire sizing is key. The app and integration with device and other victron gear is a massive plus in my book. Victron just nails that value to features at this point. Big point on the alternator (and wiring!) as you noted, almost no one mentions this
interesting my cable size and installation is more than sufficient and i'm wondering why your sits on forty nine ish without a problem. I have two chargers installed I match the settings and the red arc even at idle always managed to pull at least 10 amp more than the Victron. I think for simple four-wheel drive installations where you may have one solar panel and on the roof and maybe use one additional panel the red arc is way more compelling however for bigger installations on caravans or RVs I can definitely see the Victron being the better choice
Redarc has taken time to catch up with Victron in terms of BT connectivity and the GUI so I agree that Redarc's DCDC is finally better than the Victron (excluding under bonnet installation which has always been a unique feature). The only thing I'll add is that Victron offers the Cerbo OS for free which can be installed on a realitvely cheap Raspberry Pi compared to the extremely expensive Redarc Redvision system. Thanks for sharing Stefan. Cheers
I agree if you need a more complex set up and don’t want to go the Redarc Redvision route the Victron is the more versatile option but for a simple four-wheel-drive install the Redarc wins handsdown in my book
@@AlloffroadAu yes, i should have added that Redarc has always had it over Victron for simplicity and a smaller form factor but less customisability. Cheers
Nice vid. I have 2x orions and love them but the back charge feature of Redarc would be very nice to have. Also on the price the Orion xs was released at close to the the price in your bid but I’ve noticed they are generally just over $400 now(not even on sale). Not sure why that is
And also via the victron app both chargers, mppt and battery monitor all talk to each other for no additional cost which is great. Nice to see the app for the Redarc unit seems to work without redvision screen. I would have bought their rouge for switching already if I didn’t have to pay more for revision to use Bluetooth
I must admit after discovering Victron a few years ago, I am a bit of a fan. Funnily enough, that's the thing that the Victron stuff seems to need (good cooling) but I've not had an issue even in central Australia in the heat (which is something I'm about to do again in a few weeks) I love how the many products work together, showing everything in the app. I have two alternators, yes I could have just upgraded to a larger unit like you but I also like redundancy, so if one was to go out, I'd still have a working unit. (though I wouldn't mind to have an alternator that I could weld with) I have a reasonably high power demand at idle & in the extreme heat at times. I'm yet to step up to lithium so when I do, I expect the fast charging rate will help even more especially as I also plan to upgrade my solar when that happens. I do like that fact that Redarc is Aussie made Here in S.A.) but every time I compare prices, the Redarc stuff seems to be way over priced. Another good video, Thank you! 👍
yes good products, I had my dual battery isolater from Victron stopp working when installed under the bonnet after 2 h of slow beach driving on a hot day
@@AlloffroadAu Hmmm, that's not good. I've never tried one of their isolators, I usually just use a Redarc isolator & I certainly don't trust any DC to DC chargers to disconnect from the main charging source correctly either. I've had 2 fail in that department (neither were Victron or Redarc) I am trialling a large capacity relay on the main feed to the latest failed DC to DC charger for my house batteries (I used the other failed DC to DC charger for my car trailer that has lighting & a winch but I would still like to sort that system a bit better too, especially for winching. I really need to do some research on that system! I do have a continuous duty solenoid on one system (feeding a multi switch for lighting, compressor etc) I like using them as they are designed to handle the power loads, though that HD relay on the DC to DC charger has been working fine. Sometimes trial & error are the best thing to find out what works, particularly in my case where I have a high demand electrical system (I run an inverter just for a laptop & surveying equipment on top of everything else, it's in extreme climates) Cheers! 👍
I have the Renorgy 50 DCDC w/ MTTP charger and a 200w solar panel. Just like the alpha it also charger the starter battery once the house battery is full and never had issues with it and had it for two years now
Thanks for the in-depth comparison. Whilst I agree with your conclusion on the Redarc, the only draw back is the combination of DC to DC with the solar charger. It would be great to get the full 50A from the DC to DC plus what ever roof top solar you might have thus charging even faster.
Yes that's a great point, you'd have much faster charging with the combined setup but heat management is already difficult for that kind of currents. It would need to be a much bigger unit then and likely fan cooled.
you mean for the MPPT? Got to keep in mind that the Redarc BCDC is more designed for simple four-wheel drive installations, as Redarc obviously has their whole Redvision system for bigger caravan installations. And for that purpose, I think it is now class leading.
The units are both in the vehicle so has AC cooling... why heat is a issue is a installation issue. Anyone wanting big output knows you need to have active cooling adding.
definitely not a installation issue any of the non-fan call charges but from what I heard even for the inner drive fan cool charger derating happens more or less quickly. As you can see the red dark derates slower and far less and has a much higher operating temperature.
great video mate. Very insightful. few questions: Can you turn off the redarc charger via the app or a switch? Can you change the input charging voltage on the redarc? On the victron you can adjust the input trigger voltage to allow for wire loss
The Victron looks to be a good option in a caravan along with a suitable solar charge controller for your panels. Compared to the Enerdrive system I now have, you don't have a noticable noise from a fan that turns on/off and can fail as happened to me. Luckily it was still under the 5 year warranty.
Awesome work! I have iTECHDCDC40 and if I were to upgrade to one it would be the RedArc Alpha 50 however Itech40 was $250 on special I would not justify $900 for main battery recovery and the consistently higher amperage, iTECH also made for australia is good but definitely has temperature limitations very often cutting out due to overheating at +30amp when its too hot to touch. I need to look into active cooling fans it would improve performance greatly.
well, I have a video here of a iTech blowing smoke and nearly burning a car down so personally I stay away from them. but I hear you with the Price $820 is not cheap but in my book it’s a one of investment and should last a lifetime.
@AlloffroadAu absolutely, buy once cry once. I'll have to give that one a watch must have missed it, and now you've mentioned it I'll have to make sure it's in a less fire prone installation. At the time, I'd bought it as my first dcdc mppt. If I did it again I would budget more for it, being invaluable to the setup, 200ah itech Lithium with 3kw inverter, 2kw induction, working remotely on laptop with starlink, I use a lot of electricity and a faster charge between 2hour campsites is crucial. Edit: Nearly burning a car down???? 😮 Update on DCS lawsuit soon? (Chucked some money to the go fund me)
I have the redarc unit, no issues at all, but i like the Victron unit just a little more for its global user base and expandability options, also having solar separate to the unit can also be better in case of failure
I never had a unit fail and the back charging to the starter battery and solar overflow charging of starter battery is a big plus for me. not to mention the much higher operating temperatures. The Victron stops working at 60 degrees, which in Australia and in the desert is not unheard of.
Alpha 50: There was a comment about the Max PV input of 48VDC as a negative. I feel this is unfair on your part for not understanding. Two common types of PV voltages are low voltage panels commonally found on cheap or old stuff that maxes out around 20V. Then you get your "House" panels that sit up around 40V max. These are best as they move more energy with less loss in cabling and allow MPPT's to run best. The bit you called a negative is far from the bucket, 48V is limit for other reasons, two of which being legalities and safety. 50V is considered the legal cutoff of DIY in many (I think its actaully all but others can confirm please) states. Over 50V, electrician is required. Safety, well, the paper-based people feel this the max safe voltage you can handle. Sadly, wet skin and 12V is enough to be uncomfortable or dangerous in some rare instances (not going into detail here so don't ask). The limit of 48VDC is sweet, allows big house panels or if people have low voltage suckers, can put a pair in series. One point that does stand out is the support for use on 24V vehicles while supporting 12V storage in the rear. Take note, the "Start Battery Charge Mode" and "Start Battery Recovery" only support 12V vehicle batteries, can't charge 24V systems.
Definite agreement Stefan . The Redarc Unit is Local Product , with OUR conditions in mind . Victron are certainly " No Slouches " and come with an EXCELLENT reputation , but Redarc wins this one .
I've got an old Orion 12/12-18 and it's never performed very well at all. I thought it was derating due to heat, but now I'm just not sure if my alternator is up to it. Anyway, there has always been a ton of people complaining about the original Orions derating and then Victron came out with this new one and immediately people were concerned there was no heat sink.... Victron claimed it wasn't necessary! Seems like perhaps it is.
My caravan has all Redarc components including an additional BCDC charger and it’s set and forget. Quietly goes along doing its job. Previously I had iTechworld devices and had nothing but issues.
Great review and thanks but a quick google would indicate the Victron can be had for ~$400 vs the Redarc at ~$760, I actually have the older 25A redarc but at twice the price if I were upgrading I’d nearly rather buy 2 Victron units and get the seamless integration, redundancy and have 100A name plate or 70A fully derated charging capacity.
it's a tough call isnt it... i like the victron for it's connectivity and monitoring... not having seen much about the redarc unit, the higher voltage solar input and bi directional charging would be a very nice addition to keep the main topped up when solar has finished charging my aux
No mention of vrm or remote monitoring options for orion? Good to see redarc finally listening i was telling them ten years ago the manager 30 and bcdc would need to go to 50a asap. Also i dont know where you got the orion price from havent seem one over $500 for quite a while. Please mention ve smart networking among victron products for smaller systems its why a temp probe isnt really part of the xs imo. Finally i think. Ot being a dual charger is a bonus. I prefer my solar to be seperate so its amperage can stack on top of the dcdc not be limited to 50 total. Also if one breaks or fails you still have the other
sorry never used it or needed it, prices are from google but change frequently. Yes everything has pros and cons I don't mind the combined DCDC and MPPT especially now where I can see what solar does but I sure can see separate products being beneficial especially for bigger installations. I never had one fail in 14 years so I'm ok with having both in the same unit
@ while you haven’t used vrm it it is relevant to a feature people use imo. Same as ve smart which locally connects via bluetooth devices so they all work hand in hand. For example batt temp being sent to all devices, sump loads for excess solar
Yep, fair point, but again, I have no experience with it, and I don't know anyone who runs a system like that, so it wasn't on my radar. However, I think I mentioned in my video that for bigger installations and integrations, Victron is probably a good choice. Redarc obviously has their Red Vision system, which I believe is more closed than Victron, and the Alpha 50 is more designed as a standalone unit for four-wheel drives, for instance. For that purpose, I think it does a brilliant job and is better than the Victron unit. I will take that into account next time I review a Victron product though.
I’ve had units from both redarc and victron fail. I now use enerdrive. The battery has a built in Bluetooth monitor and the charger does solar and 12v from the car. Much less to go wrong and thankfully hasn’t in the 4 years I’ve had it.
you must’ve been unlucky. I overall between my 10 cars in camper trailer would have easy owned 15 Redarc and 10 robo Victron devices over past 14 years never an issue
Yeah I know! Not very common. unfortunately redarcs authorised dealer reinstalled it and must have shorted out the victron battery monitor. My auto electrician was amazed at how bad a job they did and had to reinstall it and the new monitor. Victron was great to deal with though!
I am curious why Redarc only gives 2 yrs warranty? I had a manager30 remote display fail after 4 yrs (mostly in desert sun direct behind the windscreen), went to the nearest ARB, even though it was out of warranty they opened a brand new box they had on the shelf, took the remote display out and gave it to me - no charge.
@AlloffroadAu well let's hope not. At least they have damaged their reputation big time. I'll never touch their products or services. Thanks for the update Stefan.
I'm not sure under bonnet installation makes sense especially diesels, turbos coupled with vibrations. I've had electric air compressors and car alarms fail when installed here. After market car stereos fail and they are in the cabin. 4wd in Australia are a tough environment.
depends on cells used, good cells nowadays have between 4000-10,000 cycles and as long as you charge within cell specs the batteries will likely outlive their use case.
A bugbear with the previous RedArc unit was even when you had the ignition wire connected, it would turn on the unit above 12.5v (I think!). If you were using a lithium start battery, it would just turn on all the time without a way to turn it off, and a bigger issue in my eyes, was when you put the starter battery on charge with an external charger, it would turn the charger on. If your charger was 10A, that's 10A in and 50A out! Did they fix this in the latest version? By the way, great review mate.
I never had that issue, but I did alternator charge when I had lithium under the bonnet, which for obvious reasons I don't have anymore. I will hook it up to a charger tomorrow, once the battery is a bit empty, and see what happens when I connect a Victron 10 amp to the starter battery.
I would assume as long as you have correctly installed the ignition lead to a source that is only live when the ignition is on, the redarc will not supply charge to the house/aux battery when you apply an external charger to the starter battery. I would be seriously disappointed if this were not the case with this latest model.
@Washburn81 "You'll certainly be disappointed then" I had exactly the same issue. Turns out the so called Ignition wire is actually a choice of two different voltage cut out levels. I eventually installed a 60 amp Ignition triggered relay into my system to fix this issue. When I spoke to Redarc technical centre as to "WHY" the reply was that's just the way we do it now. I was very disappointed and pissed off having to hate a product that I once loved. I hope they have this sorted on the latest model.
Do you have two sets of cables to the engine bay? Your cable heat says is why to small. Probably why have such low results compared to many other tests
Plenty big enough cables mate. I did run a 270 amp alternator and charged 260 amp hours of lithium’s directly with it. Trust me cable size is no issue. We also could reproduce the same issues on the bench around a year ago with previous DCDC charges and that was at 25° ambient temperature and lying flat on the metal work desk
Great video. I have one question though. Do either units have the ability to reset a lithium ion bmc thats shut the battery off when its flat? Ive had the previous redarc generation that isn’t able to do it and often have to use my acdc victron unit to reset it. Cheers 🍻
@AlloffroadAu No, you can get proper heat sinks and fans from Altronics. Heat sink need to be mounted on the back of the Victron with heat sink paste on the metal plate and the fan on the fins of the heat sink. I would probably design a 3D printed part in high temp plastic to make it work. Would look nice, and work and be cheaper than the alternative
Thanks for clarifying, mind you Victron does have good quality control and certainly makes good quality products no matter where they made. If I can I like to support Australian made though.
sorry mate, this is after a five part New England tableland series. I can’t be on the road 24 seven with The family not to mention the time and money it takes to get all the stuff, tested researched and edited. I need to mix it up.
I use both also, and the main thing I’ve found is that the Victron products seamlessly integrate together to form a complete solution, particularly in much more complicated applications (ie marine, off grid, etc).
Yep agree Victron does excel when it comes to integration. Redarc is limited to Redarc.
Great work Stefen. I really value your reviews and the thoroughness you put in to them. It helps make decisions on products like these. Thanks very much. 👏🏻
Appreciate you watching. Glad you found it helpful!
Some interesting perspectives for both teams! Love Both and run them both. Victron got my business last time round and I must say when wanting multiple separate unites for reduncancy, and alot of amps, I am not dissapointed! So long as you're not buying any/most of the other brands I think you're onto a winner!
Very detailed and practical review! The derating info is very helpful and often overlooked
Thanks Kai, yep, most people seem to just focus on the peak amps but that does not mean much if it can provide them for long
@TinkerersAdventure hey good to see an American following and watching Australian content videos 😎👍🏽😂
good to review two great brands! thanks mate
Great review. I am installing Redarc Alpha 50 in my new camper.
I have 50 years of experience installing and maintaining predominantly DC systems of all shapes and sizes. Included in that was a fair chunk of time doing fleet installations of 12V equipment. I installed whatever the customer wanted and generally, had a good run with Redarc and Victron gear. That said, as an Aussie I would love to say that Redarc was the better product but, in my opinion, it wasn't born out by the facts. I never had a single Victron product rattle itself to pieces, but I can't say the same for Redarc. That is why I choose Victron when installing stuff for myself.
Interesting perspective, thanks for sharing your experience. Interest how the old Redarc chargers could rattle to pieces. Mine have survived the Canning ,Tanami and countless Desert Trips. Old chargers also had a potted board so nearly impossibly to rattle to pieces. Can’t talk about other Producst besides inverters and batteries though.
Thankyou for the comprehensive review. A couple of comments if I may:
#1 Victron chargers can be networked to a Victron SmartShunt so that any Victron charger will work off the more accurate voltage at the battery terminals, preventing it prematurely switching to absorption mode (from voltage drop in the cables). You didn't say whether you networked the Orion.
#2 Sad that they both lack cooling fans. The Enerdrive DC2DC is bulkier because it does runs cooling fans and at 40A I haven't seen it derate. You can run it at 50A but I don't know whether it would maintain the higher output. Downside is the fan noise when mounted inside the cab.
#3 I prefer a separate solar controller for any roof solar on vehicle or caravan. It is a small extra cost and means you have full alternator output available in addition to full solar output and overcomes issues related to blending. I then have the solar input on the DCDC charger available for portable solar.
#4 It is good that you can vary the output of these DCDC chargers - I reduce mine when the high output is not needed. I find I rarely need to use the DCDC in our van because it has plenty of solar on a separate controller. I prefer not to stress the alternator every time I go for a drive.
Thanks for your thoughtful comments!
I've never had an issue with premature switching to absorption mode. In fact, I usually set the input voltage to around 14.2V for LFP batteries.
I actually prefer that these chargers don't have cooling fans. The Redarc's specs are superior to the Enerdrive, even without a fan. Fans can fail, and if the thermal management relies on them, performance might suffer if they do. I'd rather use a third-party external case with a fan if needed.
For larger solar setups, I agree that using a separate MPPT controller is ideal. However, in my four-wheel drive setup, I previously used both a Victron MPPT and a Redarc DC-DC charger and noticed no significant difference. For such installations, I prefer an all-in-one unit.
It's great that you can adjust the output of these chargers, but it's even more crucial to be able to reduce the input as well. This flexibility allows you to use a 50A charger with a small alternator by simply reducing the input and adjusting it later if you upgrade your alternator or add another charger. This feature is particularly beneficial when running two chargers simultaneously; you can limit the input of one or both chargers to maintain efficient thermal operation.
As always, love your videos, Stefan! Your videos are always factual and unbiased - love it.
I’ve been on the fence about upgrading my DC charger, torn between Victron and the new Redarc Alpha series-which looks like a real game-changer in the DC charger market.
On another note, have you considered checking out the Projecta 12-24V 50A DC-DC Battery Charger (IDC50X)? It’s a new player on the market and falls into the same power and class as the Victron SX and Redarc Alpha 25/50. Has similar features as the Redarc Alpha 25/50 however much nicer and cleaner app and the added bonus feature of IO replay control. Would love to hear your thoughts on it! Ethan
interesting I used to own a few Projecta products in the past but they never convinced me. I will do a bit of research in to IDC50x …
love your work Stephan
🥉 here !! Thank you for your comparison video 😊
Glad you enjoyed the video!
From personal experience, I can vouch that Both are great DC-DC chargers and they certainly should be for the PRICE.
I personally have many Victron products that have never had an issue.
However, I have installed multiple "Renogy" 30A and 50A DC-DC chargers with solar input (and bluetooth plug in interface)and have had ZERO issues at a fraction of the cost of these models to the point that if one ever died I would just buy another one... without a second thought.
Good to know. I don't mind Renogy I have one of their 2000w inverters, I'm just concerned by the support here in Australia, as I heard on multiple occasions people having quite some issues.
Have had 3 Renogy products
- 20A MPPT - excellent, over 6 years old now I think, still runs like a dream
- 60A DCDC - died after 14 months, never got close to expected output - possibly due to alternator capability (BIG cables running to it) (assuming battery input capacity was as advertised)
- 50A DCDC with MPPT to replace above - so far so good....
Great review Stefen. Personally I would opt for Redarc as its Australian made and owned.
Like the review, I find that being able to limit the charging current a great feature on the victron, this enables easy control to limit the amount of current drawn from your alternator when you dont ha e the 50amp capacity
Yep, it's very handy to have that control when you don't want to tax the alternator too much. You can do the same with Redarc Alpha 50
I’m currently trying to decide between these two units. Thanks for the video. Some points that I think are worth nothing. 1. You can add a temp sensor to the victron unit if you add the smart shunt. 2. Using a separate dcdc and mppt means a higher total charge with a victron setup. 3. If you add more victron units, you get a better combined product experience than the redarc. All this said I’m leaning towards the redarc unit. Oh and lastly the victron documentation suggests that the unit must be mounted vertically. This may help thermal management. Worth a try
thank you for your constructive comments interesting with the vertical mountain. Can’t see how that can make a difference but who knows at present the 80a good enough for me. I can only say having both units if you have them side-by-side and take them apart the red rock feels way more solid and better mate. The Victron feels quite flimsy.
Nice one mate... I wish both Redarc and Victron would make their apps CarPlay compatible, especially when it would be quite easy to do so.
I use the BCDC1240D and am still happy with it since I resolved my derating issues inside the cabin by mounting it to a 300x200x2mm sheet of aluminium, sucking a lot of heat away from the unit.
I have also 3D printed my own version of the Redtek cooling unit utilising ultra quiet Noctua CPU fans.
Excellent review as always.
Good point about the apps! CarPlay compatibility would be great, but I’m guessing it’s probably more complicated than it seems.
@@AlloffroadAu I believe it is - it has to be "authorised" as being safe to use while driving, which is why some other common apps (e.g. our own ExplorOz) can't be used via CarPlay/Android Auto. Some others may have more detail
Great review Stefan, I have the Victron installed in my vehicle and ventilation is not ideal and will likely get the redtek cooler. I monitor output regularly and I definitely get more than 10-15 mins prior to derating. More Mike 45-60 mins in qld summer. Redarc is very appealing but love the victron adjustability and eco system
I run the XS and its been flawless, sits at 49ish amps no problems.I think location location location and wire sizing is key. The app and integration with device and other victron gear is a massive plus in my book. Victron just nails that value to features at this point. Big point on the alternator (and wiring!) as you noted, almost no one mentions this
interesting my cable size and installation is more than sufficient and i'm wondering why your sits on forty nine ish without a problem. I have two chargers installed I match the settings and the red arc even at idle always managed to pull at least 10 amp more than the Victron. I think for simple four-wheel drive installations where you may have one solar panel and on the roof and maybe use one additional panel the red arc is way more compelling however for bigger installations on caravans or RVs I can definitely see the Victron being the better choice
Good review Stephan, 👍 I ended up going with the Victron electronics only because of its seamless integration and individual Bluetooth capabilities
Yep agree, Victron really does excel in integration.
I like that this Redarc charges the main battery too. That is a feature that will save your bum one day
Great review.
Appreciate you watching!
Redarc has taken time to catch up with Victron in terms of BT connectivity and the GUI so I agree that Redarc's DCDC is finally better than the Victron (excluding under bonnet installation which has always been a unique feature). The only thing I'll add is that Victron offers the Cerbo OS for free which can be installed on a realitvely cheap Raspberry Pi compared to the extremely expensive Redarc Redvision system. Thanks for sharing Stefan. Cheers
I agree if you need a more complex set up and don’t want to go the Redarc Redvision route the Victron is the more versatile option but for a simple four-wheel-drive install the Redarc wins handsdown in my book
@@AlloffroadAu yes, i should have added that Redarc has always had it over Victron for simplicity and a smaller form factor but less customisability. Cheers
Both excellent units. I run redarc in the 76. Victron in the bus, as it’s a large solar system at 48volts.
I also have been happy with both brands for many years now I just choose products depending on use case.
And thanks for the bringing redtek to my attention. 👍
Nice vid. I have 2x orions and love them but the back charge feature of Redarc would be very nice to have. Also on the price the Orion xs was released at close to the the price in your bid but I’ve noticed they are generally just over $400 now(not even on sale). Not sure why that is
And also via the victron app both chargers, mppt and battery monitor all talk to each other for no additional cost which is great. Nice to see the app for the Redarc unit seems to work without redvision screen. I would have bought their rouge for switching already if I didn’t have to pay more for revision to use Bluetooth
I must admit after discovering Victron a few years ago, I am a bit of a fan. Funnily enough, that's the thing that the Victron stuff seems to need (good cooling) but I've not had an issue even in central Australia in the heat (which is something I'm about to do again in a few weeks) I love how the many products work together, showing everything in the app. I have two alternators, yes I could have just upgraded to a larger unit like you but I also like redundancy, so if one was to go out, I'd still have a working unit. (though I wouldn't mind to have an alternator that I could weld with) I have a reasonably high power demand at idle & in the extreme heat at times. I'm yet to step up to lithium so when I do, I expect the fast charging rate will help even more especially as I also plan to upgrade my solar when that happens. I do like that fact that Redarc is Aussie made Here in S.A.) but every time I compare prices, the Redarc stuff seems to be way over priced. Another good video, Thank you! 👍
yes good products, I had my dual battery isolater from Victron stopp working when installed under the bonnet after 2 h of slow beach driving on a hot day
@@AlloffroadAu Hmmm, that's not good. I've never tried one of their isolators, I usually just use a Redarc isolator & I certainly don't trust any DC to DC chargers to disconnect from the main charging source correctly either. I've had 2 fail in that department (neither were Victron or Redarc) I am trialling a large capacity relay on the main feed to the latest failed DC to DC charger for my house batteries (I used the other failed DC to DC charger for my car trailer that has lighting & a winch but I would still like to sort that system a bit better too, especially for winching. I really need to do some research on that system! I do have a continuous duty solenoid on one system (feeding a multi switch for lighting, compressor etc) I like using them as they are designed to handle the power loads, though that HD relay on the DC to DC charger has been working fine. Sometimes trial & error are the best thing to find out what works, particularly in my case where I have a high demand electrical system (I run an inverter just for a laptop & surveying equipment on top of everything else, it's in extreme climates) Cheers! 👍
I have the Renorgy 50 DCDC w/ MTTP charger and a 200w solar panel. Just like the alpha it also charger the starter battery once the house battery is full and never had issues with it and had it for two years now
Thanks for the in-depth comparison. Whilst I agree with your conclusion on the Redarc, the only draw back is the combination of DC to DC with the solar charger. It would be great to get the full 50A from the DC to DC plus what ever roof top solar you might have thus charging even faster.
Yes that's a great point, you'd have much faster charging with the combined setup but heat management is already difficult for that kind of currents. It would need to be a much bigger unit then and likely fan cooled.
Good to see Redarc finally starting to raise that input voltage limit. though still smaller then the lowest victron.
you mean for the MPPT? Got to keep in mind that the Redarc BCDC is more designed for simple four-wheel drive installations, as Redarc obviously has their whole Redvision system for bigger caravan installations. And for that purpose, I think it is now class leading.
Great review…thankyou
Thanks for watching!
The units are both in the vehicle so has AC cooling... why heat is a issue is a installation issue.
Anyone wanting big output knows you need to have active cooling adding.
definitely not a installation issue any of the non-fan call charges but from what I heard even for the inner drive fan cool charger derating happens more or less quickly. As you can see the red dark derates slower and far less and has a much higher operating temperature.
great video mate. Very insightful. few questions: Can you turn off the redarc charger via the app or a switch? Can you change the input charging voltage on the redarc? On the victron you can adjust the input trigger voltage to allow for wire loss
no sadly no turn off, Victron still has a few more set-up options over Redarc from memory no input trigger option in redarc
Awesome watching it now. In the market for a new dcdc.
Hope this video helps you with your decision!
@AlloffroadAu yes thankyou
The Victron looks to be a good option in a caravan along with a suitable solar charge controller for your panels. Compared to the Enerdrive system I now have, you don't have a noticable noise from a fan that turns on/off and can fail as happened to me. Luckily it was still under the 5 year warranty.
Awesome work! I have iTECHDCDC40 and if I were to upgrade to one it would be the RedArc Alpha 50 however Itech40 was $250 on special I would not justify $900 for main battery recovery and the consistently higher amperage, iTECH also made for australia is good but definitely has temperature limitations very often cutting out due to overheating at +30amp when its too hot to touch. I need to look into active cooling fans it would improve performance greatly.
well, I have a video here of a iTech blowing smoke and nearly burning a car down so personally I stay away from them. but I hear you with the Price $820 is not cheap but in my book it’s a one of investment and should last a lifetime.
@AlloffroadAu absolutely, buy once cry once. I'll have to give that one a watch must have missed it, and now you've mentioned it I'll have to make sure it's in a less fire prone installation. At the time, I'd bought it as my first dcdc mppt. If I did it again I would budget more for it, being invaluable to the setup, 200ah itech Lithium with 3kw inverter, 2kw induction, working remotely on laptop with starlink, I use a lot of electricity and a faster charge between 2hour campsites is crucial.
Edit: Nearly burning a car down???? 😮
Update on DCS lawsuit soon? (Chucked some money to the go fund me)
Have you done a review of the National Luna DC-40? Would be interested to see a comparison of the DC-40 vs the new Redarc bcdc Alpha 50. Thanks.
Kings!
I have the redarc unit, no issues at all, but i like the Victron unit just a little more for its global user base and expandability options, also having solar separate to the unit can also be better in case of failure
I never had a unit fail and the back charging to the starter battery and solar overflow charging of starter battery is a big plus for me. not to mention the much higher operating temperatures. The Victron stops working at 60 degrees, which in Australia and in the desert is not unheard of.
Alpha 50:
There was a comment about the Max PV input of 48VDC as a negative. I feel this is unfair on your part for not understanding. Two common types of PV voltages are low voltage panels commonally found on cheap or old stuff that maxes out around 20V. Then you get your "House" panels that sit up around 40V max. These are best as they move more energy with less loss in cabling and allow MPPT's to run best. The bit you called a negative is far from the bucket, 48V is limit for other reasons, two of which being legalities and safety. 50V is considered the legal cutoff of DIY in many (I think its actaully all but others can confirm please) states. Over 50V, electrician is required. Safety, well, the paper-based people feel this the max safe voltage you can handle. Sadly, wet skin and 12V is enough to be uncomfortable or dangerous in some rare instances (not going into detail here so don't ask).
The limit of 48VDC is sweet, allows big house panels or if people have low voltage suckers, can put a pair in series.
One point that does stand out is the support for use on 24V vehicles while supporting 12V storage in the rear. Take note, the "Start Battery Charge Mode" and "Start Battery Recovery" only support 12V vehicle batteries, can't charge 24V systems.
Definite agreement Stefan . The Redarc Unit is Local Product , with OUR conditions in mind .
Victron are certainly " No Slouches " and come with an EXCELLENT reputation , but Redarc wins this one .
Would have been a better comparison seeing a standard Redarc BCDC in cabin version tested against the victron
I've got an old Orion 12/12-18 and it's never performed very well at all. I thought it was derating due to heat, but now I'm just not sure if my alternator is up to it.
Anyway, there has always been a ton of people complaining about the original Orions derating and then Victron came out with this new one and immediately people were concerned there was no heat sink.... Victron claimed it wasn't necessary!
Seems like perhaps it is.
yes, that’s why the old Orion charges were really never on the cards for me. Way too small output and two low operating temperatures.
My caravan has all Redarc components including an additional BCDC charger and it’s set and forget. Quietly goes along doing its job.
Previously I had iTechworld devices and had nothing but issues.
Great review and thanks but a quick google would indicate the Victron can be had for ~$400 vs the Redarc at ~$760, I actually have the older 25A redarc but at twice the price if I were upgrading I’d nearly rather buy 2 Victron units and get the seamless integration, redundancy and have 100A name plate or 70A fully derated charging capacity.
G’day Stefan, what is your camper trailer set up electrical wise? I can’t run two 50amp chargers in my patrol as I’ll outpace the alternator
Great review….
Thanks for watching!
So is it the Redarc BCDC 50 or 60? Seem to have two different names (eg 6:28 vs 21:22)
Its the alpha 50, i think the 6 was a typo
it's a tough call isnt it...
i like the victron for it's connectivity and monitoring...
not having seen much about the redarc unit, the higher voltage solar input and bi directional charging would be a very nice addition to keep the main topped up when solar has finished charging my aux
What about solar preference? So either prefer solar over engine like the old Redarc?
yes still solar over engine
48 volt input is better than the 32on the old ones. Can use some house panels or connect panels in series.
I agree certainly sufficient enough for most for wheel drive installations
No mention of vrm or remote monitoring options for orion? Good to see redarc finally listening i was telling them ten years ago the manager 30 and bcdc would need to go to 50a asap.
Also i dont know where you got the orion price from havent seem one over $500 for quite a while.
Please mention ve smart networking among victron products for smaller systems its why a temp probe isnt really part of the xs imo.
Finally i think. Ot being a dual charger is a bonus. I prefer my solar to be seperate so its amperage can stack on top of the dcdc not be limited to 50 total. Also if one breaks or fails you still have the other
sorry never used it or needed it, prices are from google but change frequently. Yes everything has pros and cons I don't mind the combined DCDC and MPPT especially now where I can see what solar does but I sure can see separate products being beneficial especially for bigger installations. I never had one fail in 14 years so I'm ok with having both in the same unit
@ while you haven’t used vrm it it is relevant to a feature people use imo. Same as ve smart which locally connects via bluetooth devices so they all work hand in hand. For example batt temp being sent to all devices, sump loads for excess solar
Yep, fair point, but again, I have no experience with it, and I don't know anyone who runs a system like that, so it wasn't on my radar. However, I think I mentioned in my video that for bigger installations and integrations, Victron is probably a good choice. Redarc obviously has their Red Vision system, which I believe is more closed than Victron, and the Alpha 50 is more designed as a standalone unit for four-wheel drives, for instance. For that purpose, I think it does a brilliant job and is better than the Victron unit. I will take that into account next time I review a Victron product though.
Hi Stephan, I couldn't find a Redarc Alpha with a 24v output. Am I mistaken?
I’ve had units from both redarc and victron fail. I now use enerdrive. The battery has a built in Bluetooth monitor and the charger does solar and 12v from the car. Much less to go wrong and thankfully hasn’t in the 4 years I’ve had it.
you must’ve been unlucky. I overall between my 10 cars in camper trailer would have easy owned 15 Redarc and 10 robo Victron devices over past 14 years never an issue
Yeah I know! Not very common. unfortunately redarcs authorised dealer reinstalled it and must have shorted out the victron battery monitor. My auto electrician was amazed at how bad a job they did and had to reinstall it and the new monitor. Victron was great to deal with though!
Why is the input voltage so low? Isn't that from the alt and should be around the 13.8-14.4v mark?
yep - if you have a big battery - electric cooking and not a long drive time, faster charging is well appreciated.
I am curious why Redarc only gives 2 yrs warranty? I had a manager30 remote display fail after 4 yrs (mostly in desert sun direct behind the windscreen), went to the nearest ARB, even though it was out of warranty they opened a brand new box they had on the shelf, took the remote display out and gave it to me - no charge.
Any more updates on the DCS case?
nop, we are waiting for court to deliver verdict if DCS is an excluded corporation
@AlloffroadAu well let's hope not. At least they have damaged their reputation big time. I'll never touch their products or services.
Thanks for the update Stefan.
I'm not sure under bonnet installation makes sense especially diesels, turbos coupled with vibrations. I've had electric air compressors and car alarms fail when installed here. After market car stereos fail and they are in the cabin. 4wd in Australia are a tough environment.
Does charging lithium that fast shorten its lifespan?
depends on cells used, good cells nowadays have between 4000-10,000 cycles and as long as you charge within cell specs the batteries will likely outlive their use case.
Hi have a question is your vehicle a prado 150.
What is the alternator and where did you get it from please
105 Landcruiser, m2kinc.com/product-category/alternators/
A bugbear with the previous RedArc unit was even when you had the ignition wire connected, it would turn on the unit above 12.5v (I think!).
If you were using a lithium start battery, it would just turn on all the time without a way to turn it off, and a bigger issue in my eyes, was when you put the starter battery on charge with an external charger, it would turn the charger on. If your charger was 10A, that's 10A in and 50A out!
Did they fix this in the latest version?
By the way, great review mate.
I never had that issue, but I did alternator charge when I had lithium under the bonnet, which for obvious reasons I don't have anymore. I will hook it up to a charger tomorrow, once the battery is a bit empty, and see what happens when I connect a Victron 10 amp to the starter battery.
@@AlloffroadAu thanks mate, I would be interested to find out if they've fixed it.
I would assume as long as you have correctly installed the ignition lead to a source that is only live when the ignition is on, the redarc will not supply charge to the house/aux battery when you apply an external charger to the starter battery.
I would be seriously disappointed if this were not the case with this latest model.
@Washburn81 "You'll certainly be disappointed then" I had exactly the same issue. Turns out the so called Ignition wire is actually a choice of two different voltage cut out levels. I eventually installed a 60 amp Ignition triggered relay into my system to fix this issue. When I spoke to Redarc technical centre as to "WHY" the reply was that's just the way we do it now. I was very disappointed and pissed off having to hate a product that I once loved. I hope they have this sorted on the latest model.
Do you have two sets of cables to the engine bay?
Your cable heat says is why to small. Probably why have such low results compared to many other tests
Plenty big enough cables mate. I did run a 270 amp alternator and charged 260 amp hours of lithium’s directly with it. Trust me cable size is no issue. We also could reproduce the same issues on the bench around a year ago with previous DCDC charges and that was at 25° ambient temperature and lying flat on the metal work desk
Great video. I have one question though. Do either units have the ability to reset a lithium ion bmc thats shut the battery off when its flat? Ive had the previous redarc generation that isn’t able to do it and often have to use my acdc victron unit to reset it. Cheers 🍻
Stefan you forgot to mention that the redarc is stackable
stackable ?
I would just buy an alu heat sink and fan from Altronics for the Victron, its just a few dollars
yes, that would definitely be an option. Interestingly I tried a Bunnings fan from the outside and that didn’t make much difference.
@AlloffroadAu No, you can get proper heat sinks and fans from Altronics. Heat sink need to be mounted on the back of the Victron with heat sink paste on the metal plate and the fan on the fins of the heat sink. I would probably design a 3D printed part in high temp plastic to make it work. Would look nice, and work and be cheaper than the alternative
Also, my husband mounted the back of the victron onto just an alu plate and the performance was just much better
MOST VICTRON EQUIPMENT IS NOT MADE IN EUROPE BUT RATHER ASIA (CHINA, MALAYSIA ETC)
Thanks for clarifying, mind you Victron does have good quality control and certainly makes good quality products no matter where they made. If I can I like to support Australian made though.
Orion xs 50 is better price !
Too many product reviews (adverts) these days Stefan.
sorry mate, this is after a five part New England tableland series. I can’t be on the road 24 seven with The family not to mention the time and money it takes to get all the stuff, tested researched and edited. I need to mix it up.
I like them he’s honest and legit and not a full time traveler at least he’s not jamming shitty product down our throat like other RUclipsrs tho
@@AlloffroadAuLove all that you do. Keep up the great work.