Westone AM Pro 20 and Bose IE2 In Ear Monitors and ambient sound
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- Опубликовано: 25 авг 2024
- I talk a bit about my experience moving from traditional stage monitors to In-Ear monitors and my need for ambient sound. I talk about isolating ear buds, Bose IE buds, and the new Westone AM Pro series.
I've been playing for in bands for over 30 years. In Ear monitors were not an option for me or most of the guys I performed with because of the inability to hear any ambient sound. No one like being "in their own head" while performing. But, we all wanted the clarity and reduced stage noise that comes with in ear monitors.
Bose IE2 earbuds were my answer. They allowed almost undisturbed ambient sound while still having a full range of sound. The problems with the Bose IE's are (1) the are consumer grade and tend to not hold up to touring and (2) the look bad with the black and white wires hanging down the side of your face.
Thank you Matthew! I decided to make the switch to in-ear vs. stage monitors a few months ago. I play guitar in a cover band and I have not been happy with anything I've done up to this point with my in-ear setup. I play through an Axe-Fx IIXL (the best for a cover band) and take it straight to the mixer (FOH). The isolation with the in-ear monitors I've purchased so far has driven me crazy. I just couldn't get used to them and the sound quality isn't good enough. Your video just saved me $400. I was going to buy the AM Pro 30's which have the ambient function. I started watching reviews before pulling the trigger and ran a crossed this video. I just happen to have an old set of IE2's (which are awesome) stored away that I pulled out and tried. Very happy with the result. Yes, it may look a little funny playing on stage with conventional ear buds but its worth the trade off. After all, Paul Gilbert has been playing on stage with over the ear headphones for years.
Say hey Nathan. I'm just about ready to buy Westone AM pro 30's. What's wrong with them? I play acoustic guitar, vocals, and a BeatBuddy drum machine in bars and restaurants so my gig is way way different from yours w/ electric guitar, bass, keys, drums, etc. I wanna shut out distractions from people hollering at the game on the widescreens but don't wanna feel weird with total isolation. Which in ears would you recommend fro me? I have zero experience in IEM's..!!!
@@ironman1290 I have little to no experience with iem’s. I go back and forth from stage monitoring to iem
I struggle with full isolation because I feel removed from the crowd.
I bought the Pro X30’s yesterday. Hoping that a step up in quality might stick
Like you, I've been using the Bose IE2 buds because they allow you to still hear the room ambience. I don't care that they don't wrap around my ears like 'pro' models do. I still route the cable down the back of my shirt. My hair covers most of the buds anyway. When on break between sets, I don't even remove them from my ears because you can still hear the room. I mainly use them so I can keep my guitar volume fairly low on stage but still be able to hear 'more me' in the mix. ( I send a line out signal from my amp to my IEM transmitter ) I recently purchased a set of Westone AM 30's (they have since been discontinued) based upon the concept of open air ambience. I used them at my last gig, an outdoor festival and I 100% agree with Matthew. They offer just a tiny but of outside ambience but not nearly enough. I found myself pulling out one earpiece in mid-song to try to get a better balance. One word of advice. Watch your master volume. The AM30's, with three drivers, can handle high volume and can damage your ears. I agree with Matthew regarding the Bose IE2's. Bose should use the concept to design and build a pro level version of these buds. And they should be made with detachable and replaceable cable systems just like most pro models do. I will give one more positive note of Bose. My original pair of IE2's were in use for years mainly with my iPad. Eventually, the somewhat flimsy wiring wore out and one bud quit working. I stopped into a Bose outlet store with them and they exchanged them for a brand new pair at no charge. Some people have bad things to say about Bose but I have had the opposite experience.
There is just nothing like pure live sound. When I put anything in my ears, I am not having nearly as much fun. On the other hand, tinnitus and hearing loss is just bad, so I'm looking to fully protect what I have left with earplugs/IEMs.
This is so funny, I feel I could make exactly the same video, except I haven't bought the Westones yet. I'm using the Apple standard earphones, the ones you get with the iPhone, and my main problem with them is like you say, they just don't look professional. I wonder if having all those db's of isolation is a choice for Westone, or if it's hard to have more ambient sound. If it's not, let's hope they make some more open ones.
Bose listened to you and discontinued the IE2 (and similar models). I have exactly same issue as you have but can’t find any solution under $2000. (Maybe that option is not going to solve my problem I don’t know) I have recently bought set of an AM Pro 30 (new series). Not used them yet. I will give an update after couple of gigs.
I would love to hear an update from you. Thanks.
Hello Matthew, thanks for your video and adressing this issue with IEM and the separation. I deal with the same issue. Have you find any alternative buds to the BOSE IE2 which are no longer avaliable these days? Second question, have you seen the product from ASI audio - special IEM with internal mic?
Thanks for your comments. No, I haven't found any alternatives as of 2024. I still have my secret stash of Bose IEs that I hold on to like they are gold. I have seen some of the other products, but haven't tried any of them. Most of the guys I work with these days just tell me to suck it up and get used to the isolated ear buds. What can I say - old dog, don't like new tricks...
With the Westone AM series line up you can interchange the ambient filters to 16db, 20db and 25db filters plus they sell them in Custom Monitors as well
I'll have to check them out again, its been a few years. If they have really low filter values now it my be worth it.
thanks for the review. and sharing your experience with the Westones... I am looking for a good in ear monitor and I was thinking of the Westones. They are just so expensive and it's not like you can try them and return them if you don't like them... did you like the sound of the AM 20 thought? The bass response was good enough for the kick drum and the bass?
I hope the video was helpful. Yes, I liked the AM 20s. They sound good and do let in SOME ambient. The bass and kick response sounds great when listening to your ipod - but I couldn't tell you for sure in a performance situation as I don't typically put much of either in my monitor mix. I learned many years ago not to put sub frequency instrument into monitor mixes. Dave Ratt did a great video on this a few years ago that I suggest watching. He points out, and demonstrates, that the sub frequencies will cause flutter and "muddy" up vocals when in the same speaker. That's why he used 3 or 4 wedges per performer to separate out vocals from instruments from sub instruments. I found this to be true with in-ears as well. So, I've learned to key off the hi hat and snare and basically rely on a little ambient and "feel" of the bass. Also, if you're worried about cost, try the AM Pro 10s. The reality is that the dual drivers don't make enough difference in a live show for most amateur and semi-pro musicians to tell the difference. Sure, the dual drivers sound better - but the mix is usually so imperfect that I have found little practical difference in real life situations.
Here is the link to the Dave Ratt video I mentioned: ruclips.net/video/HO3XZnDkYfE/видео.html
Good video and EXACTLY the struggle I've been having for years. I was forced to use IEM's at a recent show and ended up with one of them hanging out most of the show so I could hear everything in the room.
I've tried several pairs of the high fidelity ear plugs like etymotic, eargasm slides and loop pro's and ALL of them may as well have been me just plugging ten cent foam plugs into my ears.
My main problem is that the SPL meter we have taken on stage with us a couple times has shown upwards of 110~111 sustained volume and my ears are ringing like crazy the next day. I'm in my early 40's and continuing to do this simply isn't an option and with just a few db's reduction with the bose units, it sounds like that won't help much either.
Have you looked into the ASI 3DME monitors? They have a mic built into them to let in ambient sound and an app on your phone/tablet to control how much ambient sound is let in. They're about twice the price of the AM Pro 30's though 😬
i haven't tried any other options in a while. The idea of the microphones built in for ambient is cool, but I seriously question how cost effective it would be. It sounds like your stage volume is an issue - we don't have that problem. Our drummer isn't a pounder and the only other sound on stage is the bass amp. So with my ear buds out, our stage is really very quiet.
Hi, I had a different problem with my AM PRO 30’s. I found them to sound incredible but let in too much ambient sound. I need more protection.
I can see that happening if you have a really loud stage volume. You DEFINITELY don't want to use the Bose earbuds then...
I play acoustic guitar, vocals and BeatBuddy drum machine in bars and restaurants. I have zero experience with IEM's. I wanna shut out all distractions from guys hollering at the game on the widescreen though I don't wanna feel strange with total isolation OR maybe I do. Which would you say is the better Westone buy for me AM or isolating?
Since my original message here my Westone's have broke. The company offered no repair service so they ended up in the bin. I would not buy these again as they obviously can't stand up to many gigs and I haven't been many of those over the last two years. Very poor build quality.
Sorry, I keep saying AM Pro 20s, I meant AM Pro 10 - the single driver version.
Can I simply ask which ones are you using currently?
What kind of packs do you get for regular bose ear buds?
We use Shure PSM 900 transmitter/packs
Hey. 4years too late… but if you think the Westones dampen the sound too much with 12db filter, and wish for something that doesn’t dampen at all, like the Bose, but wraps around the back of the ear… have you tried to just remove the filter from the Westone and do without dampening filter 9:56 ?
No, I haven't. But my guess is that you would lose all low end...
I’m wondering what the Westone pro x series is like !!!
And the guitar tone ?
How do you hear the tone of the guitar through those in ears? in my case, I ask the sound engineer for the complete mix of the whole band and the vocals and then I mix my guitar with the mix
I use Koch preamp and run the guitar direct - no amps on stage. So what i hear in the ears is what is going to the house mix.
Good video Thankyou. What are the “newer” Bose model called? Still ie2? Wondering if I can find some...
I believe they are call the SoundSport earbuds and they only come with microphone for smart phones.
@@mgroseva1 Are you still recommending this for an ear monitor? I really enjoyed your review.
@@sherylfox3138 Yep, its what we are still using - or would be using if all our shows weren't getting canceled...
I would laugh at someone if the asked me to pan their monitors. Diva move.
With all the problems he was having; I wonder if he and the band would've benefited with a open floor mic or omnidirectional mic on the stage, plugged into the mixer?
Tried that, it sucked...
Thnx i saved alot of money watching this video i have treid shure 215 and there 535 and some others, and was thinking to buy westone am 30.
I play guitar in a melodic metal band and i think the 215 was better then the 535 for me, maybe becourse i play distorted guitar and i dont need all those drivers or the shure 535 is just not that good with distorted guitars, btw i think all distorted guitar sound i have treid with eaphones and inear sound terrrible, some cheap sounds better then the premium ?. So thnx for the video and i will try these bose ie2 and see have they are.
Maybe mic the ambient sound? I have to do this for live video's - then you can mix in the audience and mains into a channel and adjust it to your liking? I know it's another mic and another channel - but just a thought!
Tried it. I kinda sucks. Trouble is it can create phasing issues and it sounds weird in mono.
@@mgroseva1Did you put delay on the room mic to make up for the distance the band was away from it? Could help with phasing and combing.
Nice review. I just picked up the UM 10's and I understand what your issues are about having it shut everything out. I have some food for thought though: have you ever considered putting a mic towards the audience and subtly mixing it in with the packs? The mega-churches and large venues I play for have shotgun mics pointed at the audience for this purpose exactly (the preacher at one church and various musicians at the others have the same thoughts as you do about wanting to hear the audience). You could probably just add an extra sm57 or two to accomplish this instead of needing to invest thousands into shotgun mics. Something to think about!
Best of luck in your search!
~Adam
Yes, we have tried the "audience mic" in the past. It worked - kind of. It does not help with the "hearing your own voice, muffled and muddy, in you own sinus cavities" problem. My issues were as much about how I was hearing my own voice and the phase issues as hearing the audience. Also, there is a known phenomena where the brain expects to hear sound in a three dimensional space and gets confusing signals when it doesn't. Put more simply, when you turn your head your brain expects the sound sources to move in space accordingly. With in-ears, you don't get that - you turn your head and nothing changes. The Bose earbud help with this since they are allowing ambient sound in. When you turn your head toward the drums, the sound moves in relative space. Granted, that is getting kind of deep and nit-picky. Most performers don't complain about that - but their brain does notice it and it does effect them even if only on a subconscious level.
@@mgroseva1 tell ya what, I'm actually going to a rehearsal at one of those churches later in the week. I'll ask their singers, singing coaches and audio engineers for some ideas to see if something pans out.
@@Sulli00700 Please share any feedback you get from them. I'm ALWAYS looking for new ideas.
@@mgroseva1 Hi Matthew. Just wondered what you are using as of now. I've tried the Westone AMs, but like you say, they still cut too much stage volume. I can't get hold of any Bose ie2s, seems they have been discontinued. Do you know of any other model which are similar to the ie2s?
@@deepzepp4176 Still using the Bose. They now call them the SoundSport earbuds. They are dark gray and are only available with a microphone. However, there are still some new old stock soundsports on ebay - but be careful that you don't get Chinese fakes.
Hey Matthew. I play acoustic guitar, sing vocals along with a drum machine in bars and restaurants. As you know it can get loud sometimes though less often than not. I'm really really undecided about which would be the better choice ambient or isolating in ear's. I'm looking at the Westone AM 30 & ProX30's. Both are quite expensive and I have zero experience working with in ears. Which would you recommend for a player like me. I want to shut out distractions though I don't want a strange awkward feeling of total isolation BUT maybe I do want that isolation. I just don't know...???
I think between the two choices, I'd go with the AM version with some ambient. AND, I'd save a little more and go with the AM 10s.
@@mgroseva1 Have you happened to have tried any really expensive choices in the $1000.00 range? All things considering if I’m playing through a $600 QSC monitor wouldn’t I want an in ear mix just as cost efficient or more? I’m really interested in an amazingly warm and beautiful tone out of my Martin D28 Custom. Vocals and electronic percussion can go by the wayside I think??
@@ironman1290 I have tried some expensive and I have used cheap. Truth is, for live performances the cheap versions are as good as you'll need. Its not like your in a studio and using them as reference monitors. You should limit the amount of low end in your in-ears for performances so the low frequencies don't distort the vocals. That's why I suggested the AM-10s. They are going to let some ambient in and still have some isolation. But the dual and triple drivers really aren't necessary - in my opinion. I don't think its worth the extra money.
Have you tried these bose in ears? Interested in your thoughts.
ruclips.net/video/9MO7bwWIDIY/видео.html
That is basically the exact same video I made. Those were the newer version of the IE2s. Those are what we've been using for the last few years. They are getting hard to get now.
Omg 😣. You wear those IEM totaly wrong.... Look at that first picture at the beginning of the video 🙈
They are Bose earbuds, not IEMs. That is what the whole video is about. OMG....