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One of my favorite Gen 9 Pokémon, Garganacl, is as such in part because the Pokémon’s design philosophy feels almost tailor-made to address the type chart without actually making a new Type just for one Pokémon. A hypothetical “Salt” Type that hits Water and Steel for super-effective damage (Salt Cure) and also resists Ghost (Purifying Salt) sounds like one of those oddly specific solutions to something you might see in a ROM hack or some other place.
It and Iron Bundle are just straight up the most insane "regular" Pokémon Game Freak has come up with. Just... Give a near unresistable type combo the perfect stats to do the only thing they want? And movepools that further enable them to boot?
Ghostmons often get really solid designs, which irks me when TPC uses Gengar for the 80 billionth time when doing anything Halloween/spooky related. Guys you have a whole roster of ghostmons. USE THEM.
Give Bug resistance to both Ghost and Dark. Most bugs enjoy dark places and they've been historically related to rituals and potions, justifying the Ghost resistance.
You forgot to mention the lower tier gatekeeper that is Lokix. Held back only by its base stats, it combines Dark's spammability with STAB on the best utility attack in U-turn and the strongest priority attack in the game, First Impression. Tinted Lens severely limits defensive switch-ins.
Nah. Pre-steel nerf would have probably been bad for them. More pokemon would be able to resist their STAB moves so more mons could potentially switch in on them.
I don't know that XY Aegislash would care that much to be honest. It still has perfect neutral cover with sacred sword/close combat and a ghost attack if you want a more offensive set, and defensive sets relied more on gyro ball and toxic anyways and didn't always run ghost moves. Having more defensive utility probably benefits it more and lets it have an easier time setting up with stuff like substitute or swords dance which is probably more useful
@@sirmoony5633I'm not really sure what world you're living in where steel isn't one of the single most dominant types in competitive play right now. There's like 14 different broken steels running around between various Smogon tiers and VGC regulations this gen.
@@This_0ne_Person I was thinking instead of giving steels their dark and ghost resistance back they could give some steels an ability similar to thick fat that gives them resists to ghost and dark, I call it "holy armor"
Gamefreak making ghost types in gen 1 have One line, that is all special instead of physical, and giving it a type specialist: My goals are beyond your understanding
im convinced that steel types losing a reist to ghost and dark was a product of GF thinking that would help balance aegislash while also premautely buffing it at the same time
Imagine if the Fairy type didn't exist and that Steel still has the Dark and Ghost resistances, then Aegislash would be neutral to Dark and Ghosti nstead of being weak to them, making it's only weaknesses to be Fire and Ground. Pretty much like with how the Steel/Psychic combination used to function before the Fairy type.
Nah, I think its because they thought making steel resist fairy and hit it for super effective was a worthy trade off, not a nerf. Aegislash is probably a foregone conclusion of this "heeey now that steel doesnt resist ghost and dark we can make a sick steel ghost pokemon!"
Honestly after the insanity that was Calyrex Shadow and Last Respects, it's only a matter of time. Well, for Ghost anyway. Because no matter how good Dark is, it's never getting a move above 100 that doesn't have a stipulation to it. Or another good special attack, while we're at it.
It's feels right that the power of Ghost and Dark types are how much of an annoyance they can be with their tricks like ghost's defensive immunities and dark's diverse moves that cause issues to any team
As a lover of ghost-type Pokemon, I'm torn. I love that there's so many viable ghost options now, but it does feel a little bit over-saturated. Certain types (like ghost or dragon) would be cooler if they were less common IMO
What options are there outside of pult goldhengo and gengar? Ghost has the fewest amount of mons and they’re either broken (aegi and calyrex) or just weaker variants of a diff ghost with few niches to separate them. Oh and I forgot sinistea is decent
@@shoodychakras820 it only feels like there aren't that many because the rest are banned or neutered. Ignoring the boxart legendaries there's houndstone and basculegion (if they had access to last respects in singles), annihilape, flutter mane and spectrier. For things with OU niches or just recently being discovered to be good enough for OU there's pecharunt, ceruledge, skeledirge and sinistcha like you mentioned. And then there are the dudes who aren't in this game but would be banned or OU if they were like marshadow, blacephalon, mega gengar, mega sableye and mega banette. Tera would also likely give even nerfed aegislash a niche again with the king's shield mind games it can do on top of that That's a lot of ghost types imo
Gamefreak to Gengar: “Here, you get to kill Metagross and Skamory. And a broken mega.” *Steals his ability to float through the air when smells a delicious pie one gen later*
@@vanjagalovic3621 Most of the time it’s standing on the ground. Just because a Pokémon can levitate doesn’t mean it should have the ability. If that was the case, the Sinnoh legends, Milotic, and all fish Pokémon should have the ability.
@@primrosevale1995Agreed. The other day some dude was arguing with me hella that Metagross should have levitate cause it can levitate. I told him just what you said but brother just refused to listen 😂 instead he started insulting me
@@goGothitaLOL its not because of Tera, Metagross hates Terastallizing. Its mainly because it got access to better moves in Heavy Slam, Psychic Fangs and Knock Off and it (was) a great Latios answer. Its falling off in UU recently though
@@mogalixir they wanted steel to be "the" defensive type because gen 1 in general was offense heavy. Later on I think they realized having one type with 11 resistances was overkill
I think it’s because for Dark, many things used to combat crime are made of steel, and for Ghost, steel machines aren’t really living beings and therefore can’t feel fear.
For ghost i think it was the was based on the old belief that iron warded off ghost and spirits For dark IDK maybe because silver and gold are commonly seen as able to ward back evil
May as well two other similar types of the same coin, Ice and Rock (They’re more similar than initially realized, gameplay-wise anyway) High offense (both threaten 4 types), low defense (4 and 5 weaknesses respectively), both have more slow bulky mons than fast offensive ones, both resisted by Steel, both have an iconic move that more known from being used by anything but Ice and Rock types themselves, and both can’t even be saved by being paired with /Steel.
The Saddest thing is at least one of those types have an identity Ice actually does really good when they lean into the strengths of an ice type, by making them bltizing fast or a way to to boost their speed while relying on the high defense they give most ice types. Rock can't even live up to being an amazing offensive type with how inconsistent their moves are, and with how ground pretty much just uses them better for the most part :(
I've been saying for a long time that Ice needs defensive buffs. At least Rock resists some types, but Ice resists only itself. Make it resist Water and one other type, at least. Maybe Flying.
I honestly think dark's type chart is really balanced currently, maybe even on the weaker side, what makes dark so good in my opinion is more so the really good stabs it gets with knock off allowing it to do consistent progress even on resistances, as even old steel types would be threatened by knock off. In the end gen 6 nerfed dark more that it helped it with fairy types, it's just that the knock off buff was more noticeable due to the lack of great fairies. Ghost in the other hand is easily one of the best types in the game, in my opinion it's third below steel and fairy and above ground, water and flying, it only got two defensive answers and normal is so bad it's almost never seen in competitive, making dark the only option (which also explains why dark is so prominent right now, it's the only reliable answer to ghost). The type is only held back by its roster, which generally find themselves lacking in power, bulk or speed, as well as shadow ball being a somewhat weak stab option. Ghost honestly feels like a better dragon type right now, it has a similar number of matchups with 1 big counter (fairy and dark respectively), 1 defensive check and 4 resistances, ghost just has the benefit of having two of those resistances be immunities and not being as blocked by dark as dragon is blocked by ghost. In my opinion ghost should lose its bug resistance and be resisted by bug, this interaction makes the least sense and unfairly nerfs bug while the type is already struggling defensively. I think bug resisting ghost would make some sense, ghost powers are mostly about the target being isolated and spooked, which wouldn't be that effective against a swarm of bugs.
Hey FSG, I have an idea for a video. Why not make a vid about “Pokemon that were viable in tiers far higher than their own” or something. (Like RU Pokemon that were viable in OU)
dark and ghost have long been tied as my favorite types, so watching their ascent into godhood after having so long been stuck in a supportive role has been... satisfying :)
Dark is kinda already broken when GF create it to destroy the Gen 1 superb Psychic type. Spammable STAB just makes them better and better every Gen, especially when Dark type Got the Buffed Knock Off Ghost type will be busted even in Gen 1 if they have gave them more moves and make them actually deal super effective damage against psychic
Dark only had noteable TTar. Everyone rlse just used it as coverage and knockoff (which was bad) Gen4 made it useable for everyone and Gen5 buffed it. So overall Gen4 was best they ever did
It should be noted that the utility of knock off is so good that none dark Pokemon like Landorus often carry it. Also Incenerior was left out of this video perhaps the best non-legendary VGC Pokemon even then it beats out a lot of legends
I like how this is basically a sister series to Golden Owl's more game design oriented analysis of the types. Very cool seeing that kind of back and forth with different angles.
@@the_bookworm8281explain why dark was special, then. Every single offensive dark move prior to gen4 got shifted to physical after the split. It's nonsense.
@@Trelior Looking at the available Dark type moves in Gen 2.... yeah I got nothing. lol I guess they don't want to screw over Houndoom or something idk.
@@Treliorit's because, as stupid as it sounds, they wanted half of the types to be physical, half to be special. In gen 1 to gen 3, there were an odd-numbered amount of types, so you couldn't split perfectly, and physical was the atrribute given to the 8 types instead of special's 7 types in gen 1, and that gen's victim was ghost. Now, with gen 2's dark and steel addiction + shadow ball, you would think "well, surely game freak would tweak the physical special atrribute a little", BUT NO, what was physical and special on the gen before remained 100% unchanged, and they still wanted a new physical type and a new special type to keep the theorical perfect split of physical and special ratio. Tldr, steel OR dark was gonna get screwed, and dark was the chosen victim
I've always wondered if Game Freak decided to nerf Steel resistances purely because they created the ultra powerful at the time Aegislash, which would have only had two weaknesses if not for the nerf. Sure, Fairy was almost certainly a factor, but Aegislash would have been something else without those additional weaknesses.
I want my Darkrai’s Dark Void back instead man. I missed running around terrorizing players who weren’t ready from gen 4-5. Last game a played was Ultra Moon. Tried getting into Gen 8 when it came out, but I just couldn’t. The Pokémon designs aren’t as good anymore, the power creep was too much, the constant hand holding & easier routes the games take, nah I’m good. Idk even know what generation this “Nemona” chick is from, but after seeing her team & gameplays of how easily she can be swept, can’t get into Pokémon anymore.
Hear me out: What if in gen 10 we give the Rock type a Ghost resistance? That way Rock types might have a chance at filling a defensive niche that steel types can't.
Most of them don't have the special bulk to tank many shadow balls even with a resist, and would still be in trouble from common coverage or worse, secondary stab from stuff like Goldengho.
@@Yunobolt that's great logic and yeahhhhh rocks could definitely use more special defensive stuff, it's like they knew this with the sandstorm buff but then just expected sand for all rock type engagements
Not mentioning Mega Gyarados when it came to offensive darks and pokemon that resisted ash greninjas stabs in gen 7 is such an oversight. I mean, it's niche yes but it's still really good and definitely worth mentioning over the UU hydreigon. Not only was it a decent offensive switch to greninja, it set up dragon dances on its face. it's also one of the few pokemon that could single handedly wipe out hard stall teams which none of the other dark types except choice band Ttar could as its mold breaker ability lets it ignore unaware quagsire and clefable. Maybe I'm biased cause mega gyarados is one of my fav dark types but like still, it at least deserved a mention
Funny enough I was thinking about this the other day and it’s just me thinking about it the other day beicase they knew they made Agislash op and wanted to add in some new counters to it like removing steel resistance to ghost and dark allowing you to hit it for super effective damage with more types other then Fire and Ground. The only two from my memory who would’ve been able to hit that typing. Little did they know that would have such a more drastic negative effect
Ghost is only kept in check due to its weak attacks. Shadow ball is only 80. Imagine how many ghost types will be banned, if we ever get a wide spread ghost fire blast or overheat.
Poltergeist has a bigger issue in regards to how it can't be paired with Knock Off users on your team so your team overall is a lot worse. It also sucks that a lot of good ghost types like Basculegion, Aegislash, Mimikyu and Dragapult don't get access to it. Well I say sucks but this is for the best, giving the little guys something to work with. If only Moonblast received this treatment and not the other way arouns
I love the relationship between two types. Even in game, though I tend to prefer dark types to combat psychic and ghost due to the resists. But if my team has a lot of fighting weaknesses I might pick a ghost instead
for gen 9, I believe you're forgetting chi-yu, who's mostly famous for being an insane sun sweeper/breaker that has no defensive switch-ins, and even resists get 2HKOed. however, because everyone knows the sun set, no one expects the tera dark dark pulse nasty plot set that's arguably even more obscene, because there are flash fire and well baked body switch ins to the sun set, but the dark pulse set really has no switch ins.
Ghost is hitting everything. Except normal and a resisting dark. A shadow ball is knocking the pins off everyone gen 8 onwards when the pursuit specialist quit.
All that’s needed to neuter ghost types is bringing back Pursuit. I don’t really know why it was removed from the game. Sure it makes psychic types worse than they already are but there is no other option. You might think this would make Dark types even broken but they were never “broken”, at least as much as ghost is rn or dragon was before gen 6. Theyre good offensively but they at least have more common resists in fairy, dark, fighting types. Ghosts really are only resisted by dark as normal types are quite rare in the higher tiers, and if you’re using a normal type its for its offenses, not its defensive ghost immunity. As even Chansey and Blissey have fallen off tiers. At least Gamefreak had the foresight to not give ghosts a stronger special attack than shadow ball but even still, I think Pursuit would be a nice way to balance stuff again, as it always has been. It’s weak at 40 BP, it’s not like its a brokenly strong move either, and often times a ghost can just stay in predicting this and go for a coverage move. But pursuit is great to dissuade choice specs ghost types mindlessly spamming shadow ball. Either that or you give ghost resistance to another type.
I'm genuinely surprised that Meowscarada isnt used more as a Gliscor check. You'd think they'd be rising in use concurrently. Triple Axel ice coverage for 4x effectiveness and Flower Trick against a water terra, slap on Knock off and a fourth of your choice(something strong vs steel, really) and you've got some serious coverage there. Or even skip knock off and go for sleep rest talk, why not.
There is a couple interesting reasons on why Meowscrada isn't super popular despite matching up good on paper into a lot of things like Gliscor, Gold, Bolt and Tusk - It has to complete with ogrepon as a fast, offensive grass type. With ogrepon having stronger support moves, better bulk, stronger stabs, and swords dance making it better overall at breaking through opposing defensive mons despite its weaker coverage. - Zamazenta, Darkrai, Weavile, Booster Val and Pult's popularity make it have to decide between boots for longevity and not being so heavy on prediction vs scarf to be better into offensive teams and possibly beat/cripple Zama. also if your scaf gliscor will just protect to scout making it hard to actually force the ko. - And lastly it has a tendency to struggle to pick up KOs without other team mates/hazards softening them up first, since even with its great coverage its not too strong
In addition to this, Meowscarada is just super frail so it can’t really be used to “check” anything. It can only do the revenge killing. Also some Gliscors run U-turn so it’s really unreliable as well.
@@Super_Top_Secret_Area The Reason Why The Ghost/Dark Spiritomb/Sableye Had No Weaknesses Barring Scrappy+Fighting Attacks Was Because They Represent Devils,Who Are Nigh Invincible To Everything But Resisting Them(Fighting Attacks,Humans Resisting Temptation),And Angels/The Power Of God's Grace(The Fairy Type)!
All metas begin in darkness, and all so end. Pokemon are no different. Darkness sprouts within them, it grows, consumes them. Such is its nature. In the end, every metagame returns to the darkness whence it came. For you see, darkness is the meta's true essence.
This is actually a fascinating video. Dark type especially has become ridiculously powerful. Sucker Punch, Knock Off, Prankster immunity, very powerful mons… Dark is almost too good. I know knock off can’t be nerfed because of technician but they gotta do something about that move. Really what needs to happen is better fighting types and better fighting moves.
For knock off just remove the power boost from knocking put the item it will be strong as a utility more in single but i think in vgc too but will be way worse as an offensive
I felt at the time and DEFINITELY feel now that it was Grass and Bug types that Steel should have lost its resistance to in gen 6, not Ghost and Dark. Think about it; both Grass and Bug are a bit notorious for the excessive amount of types that resist them, so what better way to give them an easy but effective leg up than the distinction of NOT being resisted by Steel (which would still be far and away the best defensive type).
As someone who loves ghost and isn’t much of a dark type user (besides my all time favourite Pokémon shiftry), I think a big issue is a lack of solid normal types to get around ghost types. Scarlet and violet doesn’t have a lot of normal types that can beat ghost and dark besides ursaluna. Gen 8 at least dubwool has such monstrous defence with cotton guard fluffy it could payback chip through ghosts and body press dark types but we need more bulky decent attacking normal types now more than ever. Also Gholdengo needs some nerf to its ability or make it rain as both together make it more busted than Aegislash ever was (who I love but was a menace in gen 6). Also more fighting types, like gen 9 has Flamigo quaquaval and annihilape but like why no bulky fighting types there? Give us a really specially defensive fighting type for some variety and make sure they resist ghost by being either dark fighting or normal fighting. Tldr: buff normal and fighting more and ghost and dark will feel a lot better than right now, feel like every game I need to use dark or a normal type or a bulkier/faster ghost type
Bug should resist Dark Rock should resist Ghost (GameFreak even made an ability with Garganacl) Steel should resist Dark again (but be weak to Electric)
Here’s something that’s interesting In competitive ghost spam seems really reliable but normal types are immune to ghost So maybe normal types need buffing as a way to keep ghosts in check?
I think the biggest issue with the normal type is they keep making normal types mono type Which usually are just worse then dual type mons with a lack of a secondary stab, and for normal types in particular, valuable resistances. The lack of secondary stab especially hurts too for normals since most of the time they can only status ghost or try to hit them with crunch or something
Honestly there was something more interesting about the creative, defensive use of ghosts before they started just spamming Shadow Ball. Even if spamming that Shadow Ball can be satisfying at times.
In the early generations, steel types like Skarmory were way too annoying because they seem to resist EVERYTHING that isn't Ground, Fire, or Fighting. Game Greak nerfed them HARD in Gen 6 though when Steel lost its Ghost and Dark resistance, and rightfully so imo.
@ I’m pretty sure it has to do with a type that made Mawile horrifying in Gen 6, part of what got Magearna banned to Ubers 3 Gens in a row, and S-Calyrex’s only choice of Tera Type to make it Mega Rayquaza Part 3.
@@meta1429 I never denied fairy types impact,but it would be still op with mono ghost or mono fairy typing Also calyrex would still get banned from ubers without tera because there's no yveltal
@ The part Fairy kind of gave a lot more leverage, sure it’d still be pretty strong and uber worthy especially Flutter’s stat distribution. But consider changing a X4 Ghost/Dark weakness into a neutrality and resistance when both those types are “broken” in the modern gen, not even Yveltal would wanna switch into a Tera Fairy Draining Kiss after a Nasty Plot/Grim Neigh boost.
@@yeet8036I don’t understand what GF was thinking removing Yveltal..they’ve already seen how monstrous Calyrex shadow was in gen 8. So how did they think it would be a good idea to remove the one pokemon that keeps Caly from potential brokenness. Although it might not have mattered so much cause it can just terastalize now to beat Yveltal but still
Download Marvel Strike Force for FREE now: bit.ly/3PBlMsZ to support my channel and unlock up to 17 total characters within the first 30 days of playing! Redeem the promo code DEC24 to get free 100x Captain Carter Shards, 50x Strange (Heartless) Shards, 50x Star-Lord (T'Challa) Shards, 1,440 L2 Training Modules, 360,000 Gold in Marvel Strike Force!
No.
Rather have Raid flavor of greedy than MSF tbh.
Steel-types losing their Ghost- and Dark-type resists was the worst day of Bronzong’s life.
And Metagross
And Jirachi
@@Kubosarutobinah Jirachi deserves it for what he did
why?@@Nethaura
@@DjilaliAlaouia
Serene Grace Iron Head
honestly just a bad call in general
One of my favorite Gen 9 Pokémon, Garganacl, is as such in part because the Pokémon’s design philosophy feels almost tailor-made to address the type chart without actually making a new Type just for one Pokémon. A hypothetical “Salt” Type that hits Water and Steel for super-effective damage (Salt Cure) and also resists Ghost (Purifying Salt) sounds like one of those oddly specific solutions to something you might see in a ROM hack or some other place.
We love Big Minecraft Man in this household
I don’t know what to say other than I like and agree with this comment. Garganacl is fire
I have a shiny Garganacl@@knucklesskinner253
Love your profile pic, ukelele pichu takes me back
A salt type would be redundant due to the fact it’s a rock
“And Flutter Mane for… existing.”
I mean, that’s the most accurate way to describe banning that… monstrosity.
It and Iron Bundle are just straight up the most insane "regular" Pokémon Game Freak has come up with. Just... Give a near unresistable type combo the perfect stats to do the only thing they want? And movepools that further enable them to boot?
@@poppyfrancis7338 well, iron bundle has to use hydro pump so it's not as cracked. but yes
@@poppyfrancis7338
It’s also one of the most inconsistent pokemon thanks to hydro pump
@@poppyfrancis7338 its not near unresistable, its completely unresistable, theres nothing in the game that resists both water and freeze dry
@@ogmechsftwimagine if it got scald lol
Competitive relevance is cool and all but don't forget: They generally get some of the most BANGER designs in the franchise
True!
Furret and Pigeot declare normal type supremacy.
TRUE! Ghost and Dark are some of my favorite types because of those amazing desings, I always loved those guys
*Mimikyu has entered the chat*
Ghostmons often get really solid designs, which irks me when TPC uses Gengar for the 80 billionth time when doing anything Halloween/spooky related. Guys you have a whole roster of ghostmons. USE THEM.
Give Bug resistance to both Ghost and Dark.
Most bugs enjoy dark places and they've been historically related to rituals and potions, justifying the Ghost resistance.
Give Bug super effectiveness against Fairy while we're at it, it makes way more sense than Fairy resisting it
Minus 2 weaknesses on Shedinja, Orbeetle, and Rabsca is strong for them all being designed as defensive, especially Shedinja with it's gimmick defense
@@baxterbruce9827 ye, never really understood why fairy resists bug
@@baxterbruce9827 They should be neutral to one another imo, they coexist in forests.
@@cabrondemente1 Fairy and Bug should resist each other like Bug and Fighting do IMO.
34:34 "Houndstone for Last Respect, Annihilape for Rage Fist and Flutter Mane for existing" I busted out laughing so hard
You forgot to mention the lower tier gatekeeper that is Lokix. Held back only by its base stats, it combines Dark's spammability with STAB on the best utility attack in U-turn and the strongest priority attack in the game, First Impression. Tinted Lens severely limits defensive switch-ins.
"You took my only resists! Now I'm gonna get OHKO'd!"
- Iron Patrick
Imagine without the nerf how much more broken XY Aegislash, Mega Metagross, Dusk Mane Necrozma and Gholdengo would be
Nah. Pre-steel nerf would have probably been bad for them. More pokemon would be able to resist their STAB moves so more mons could potentially switch in on them.
No wonder why Steel was way better Gens 2-5 since it's way more of a defensive type anyway. LOL
I don't know that XY Aegislash would care that much to be honest. It still has perfect neutral cover with sacred sword/close combat and a ghost attack if you want a more offensive set, and defensive sets relied more on gyro ball and toxic anyways and didn't always run ghost moves. Having more defensive utility probably benefits it more and lets it have an easier time setting up with stuff like substitute or swords dance which is probably more useful
@@sirmoony5633I'm not really sure what world you're living in where steel isn't one of the single most dominant types in competitive play right now. There's like 14 different broken steels running around between various Smogon tiers and VGC regulations this gen.
They meant that steel was even more broken than now,which is true@@sylvrwolflol
"...and Flutter Mane for.. existing." WHY IS THAT SO FUNNY TO ME im literally rolling on my bed laughing
Anytime fluttermane uses an offensive move my router catches on fire
For Ghosts types, at least, it's largely because Pursuit got snapped out of existence
Yep. Pre-gen 8, ghost types were being kept in check by pursuit. Now, without that and steel not resisting it, ghost is running around uncontrollably
@@This_0ne_Person I was thinking instead of giving steels their dark and ghost resistance back they could give some steels an ability similar to thick fat that gives them resists to ghost and dark, I call it "holy armor"
Yeah the removal of pursuit was a big mistake.
Still don’t know why they did this.
@@epicwuexcaliburumbra1736Tyranitar caught a stray just by existing
Amazing how both of these types share the same super effective coverage as well as a low amount of other types that resist them.
Fairy was added not only to break dragon types and to actually give dark and ghost combo a weakness 💀
Not Ghost.
Ghost is neutral.
@@YoJoRockThaBeat OP means Sableye and Spiritomb
^Facts. This individual is a fellow vet. @Lord_Nexus14
@@cabrondemente1LMAO Spiritomb
@@YoJoRockThaBeat I said the ghost and dark "combo", before gen 6, it had no weaknesses
Gamefreak making ghost types in gen 1 have One line, that is all special instead of physical, and giving it a type specialist: My goals are beyond your understanding
I mean the only damaging ghost move was lick, so I can understand that being physical. Everything else though... yeah...
They were also Poison-type so weak against Psychic-type moves.
@@jasonmoscynski8170 And they fumbled and made psychic immune to ghost by accident
That almost feels in character for Gengar's devious nature.
"I've got a high special attack, but good luck using stab with my typing!"
im convinced that steel types losing a reist to ghost and dark was a product of GF thinking that would help balance aegislash while also premautely buffing it at the same time
Imagine if the Fairy type didn't exist and that Steel still has the Dark and Ghost resistances, then Aegislash would be neutral to Dark and Ghosti nstead of being weak to them, making it's only weaknesses to be Fire and Ground. Pretty much like with how the Steel/Psychic combination used to function before the Fairy type.
Nah, I think its because they thought making steel resist fairy and hit it for super effective was a worthy trade off, not a nerf. Aegislash is probably a foregone conclusion of this "heeey now that steel doesnt resist ghost and dark we can make a sick steel ghost pokemon!"
Turns out having Great Neutral coverage is very good. Now imagine ghost or Dark getting a Draco Meteor equivalent STAB
Dark has knock off
@@wyatt422798 power for one turn isn’t as bad as 130
Honestly after the insanity that was Calyrex Shadow and Last Respects, it's only a matter of time.
Well, for Ghost anyway. Because no matter how good Dark is, it's never getting a move above 100 that doesn't have a stipulation to it. Or another good special attack, while we're at it.
It's feels right that the power of Ghost and Dark types are how much of an annoyance they can be with their tricks like ghost's defensive immunities and dark's diverse moves that cause issues to any team
Never thought I’d see the day where Fighting, a type with less than 4 resistances, would be valued for its defensive capabilities
I love how until platinum this is just a "how GREAT was gengar actually"
15:28 Darkrai using Dark Pulse in Revolution looks so badass, it fits it perfectly.
As a lover of ghost-type Pokemon, I'm torn. I love that there's so many viable ghost options now, but it does feel a little bit over-saturated. Certain types (like ghost or dragon) would be cooler if they were less common IMO
What options are there outside of pult goldhengo and gengar? Ghost has the fewest amount of mons and they’re either broken (aegi and calyrex) or just weaker variants of a diff ghost with few niches to separate them.
Oh and I forgot sinistea is decent
@@shoodychakras820 it only feels like there aren't that many because the rest are banned or neutered. Ignoring the boxart legendaries there's houndstone and basculegion (if they had access to last respects in singles), annihilape, flutter mane and spectrier.
For things with OU niches or just recently being discovered to be good enough for OU there's pecharunt, ceruledge, skeledirge and sinistcha like you mentioned.
And then there are the dudes who aren't in this game but would be banned or OU if they were like marshadow, blacephalon, mega gengar, mega sableye and mega banette. Tera would also likely give even nerfed aegislash a niche again with the king's shield mind games it can do on top of that
That's a lot of ghost types imo
Gamefreak to Gengar: “Here, you get to kill Metagross and Skamory. And a broken mega.”
*Steals his ability to float through the air when smells a delicious pie one gen later*
Why? Look at the model it's clearly standing on the ground, not levitating.
@@primrosevale1995Pls ignore the lore, movies, anime, manga and official artwork which features Gengar floating in the air.
@@vanjagalovic3621 Most of the time it’s standing on the ground. Just because a Pokémon can levitate doesn’t mean it should have the ability.
If that was the case, the Sinnoh legends, Milotic, and all fish Pokémon should have the ability.
@@primrosevale1995Agreed. The other day some dude was arguing with me hella that Metagross should have levitate cause it can levitate. I told him just what you said but brother just refused to listen 😂 instead he started insulting me
Alt title: How Pokemon Broke The Ghost Type and Also Knock Off
After 20 years they could overcome their phobia
Metagross after losing the dark and ghost neutrality: 😢 *falls to RU*
But hey it’s back to UU in gen 9, even if only because of Tera
@@goGothitaLOL its not because of Tera, Metagross hates Terastallizing. Its mainly because it got access to better moves in Heavy Slam, Psychic Fangs and Knock Off and it (was) a great Latios answer. Its falling off in UU recently though
@@albabimam1114 back to RU it goes...
@@benross9174 We RU players will eagerly welcome it back with open arms
Why did they do this to steel types??
Good GOD imagine what havoc Aegislash could have wrought if it was Gen 5
Instant Ubers, or even AG given how Steel worked in Gens 1-5
@@cheyanne2001*Gens 2-5. Steel didn't exist in Gen 1. Just thought I'd point it out.
@justinnzamora5366 right, duh. Brain fart
S tier uber threat
@@justinnzamora5366 yes you're right, I had a fabulous brain fart my bad! (Also RUclips exploded my previous comment, thanks youtube!)
It makes Oricorio Sensu better, so I'm all for it
They did Gengar dirty. The original final evolution ghost.
Losing levitate is a bummer
@@mogalixir Why? Look at the model it's clearly standing on the ground, not levitating.
I do wonder why Steel resisted Dark and Ghost in the first place
Because Steel was not supposed to have any good moves.
Because GF is weird.
@@mogalixir they wanted steel to be "the" defensive type because gen 1 in general was offense heavy. Later on I think they realized having one type with 11 resistances was overkill
I think it’s because for Dark, many things used to combat crime are made of steel, and for Ghost, steel machines aren’t really living beings and therefore can’t feel fear.
For ghost i think it was the was based on the old belief that iron warded off ghost and spirits
For dark IDK maybe because silver and gold are commonly seen as able to ward back evil
May as well two other similar types of the same coin, Ice and Rock (They’re more similar than initially realized, gameplay-wise anyway)
High offense (both threaten 4 types), low defense (4 and 5 weaknesses respectively), both have more slow bulky mons than fast offensive ones, both resisted by Steel, both have an iconic move that more known from being used by anything but Ice and Rock types themselves, and both can’t even be saved by being paired with /Steel.
The Saddest thing is at least one of those types have an identity
Ice actually does really good when they lean into the strengths of an ice type, by making them bltizing fast or a way to to boost their speed while relying on the high defense they give most ice types.
Rock can't even live up to being an amazing offensive type with how inconsistent their moves are, and with how ground pretty much just uses them better for the most part :(
I've been saying for a long time that Ice needs defensive buffs. At least Rock resists some types, but Ice resists only itself. Make it resist Water and one other type, at least. Maybe Flying.
I honestly think dark's type chart is really balanced currently, maybe even on the weaker side, what makes dark so good in my opinion is more so the really good stabs it gets with knock off allowing it to do consistent progress even on resistances, as even old steel types would be threatened by knock off. In the end gen 6 nerfed dark more that it helped it with fairy types, it's just that the knock off buff was more noticeable due to the lack of great fairies.
Ghost in the other hand is easily one of the best types in the game, in my opinion it's third below steel and fairy and above ground, water and flying, it only got two defensive answers and normal is so bad it's almost never seen in competitive, making dark the only option (which also explains why dark is so prominent right now, it's the only reliable answer to ghost). The type is only held back by its roster, which generally find themselves lacking in power, bulk or speed, as well as shadow ball being a somewhat weak stab option. Ghost honestly feels like a better dragon type right now, it has a similar number of matchups with 1 big counter (fairy and dark respectively), 1 defensive check and 4 resistances, ghost just has the benefit of having two of those resistances be immunities and not being as blocked by dark as dragon is blocked by ghost.
In my opinion ghost should lose its bug resistance and be resisted by bug, this interaction makes the least sense and unfairly nerfs bug while the type is already struggling defensively. I think bug resisting ghost would make some sense, ghost powers are mostly about the target being isolated and spooked, which wouldn't be that effective against a swarm of bugs.
The fact that Ghost type was physical before the physical/special split will forever baffle me.
my favorite part is dark being special but once gen 4 came in, every already existing dark type move became physical
Hey FSG, I have an idea for a video. Why not make a vid about “Pokemon that were viable in tiers far higher than their own” or something. (Like RU Pokemon that were viable in OU)
That's the quagsire theorem
Quagsire Theorem video has got you covered.
dark and ghost have long been tied as my favorite types, so watching their ascent into godhood after having so long been stuck in a supportive role has been... satisfying :)
Im loving these videos on the history of types themselves
Last respect/rage fist is probably the most broken move gamefreak has ever released. 😂
Dark is kinda already broken when GF create it to destroy the Gen 1 superb Psychic type.
Spammable STAB just makes them better and better every Gen, especially when Dark type Got the Buffed Knock Off
Ghost type will be busted even in Gen 1 if they have gave them more moves and make them actually deal super effective damage against psychic
Dark type should not have the best version of all the non-hazard utility moves.
Dark only had noteable TTar. Everyone rlse just used it as coverage and knockoff (which was bad)
Gen4 made it useable for everyone and Gen5 buffed it.
So overall Gen4 was best they ever did
It should be noted that the utility of knock off is so good that none dark Pokemon like Landorus often carry it. Also Incenerior was left out of this video perhaps the best non-legendary VGC Pokemon even then it beats out a lot of legends
incin is great in doubles sure but in singles (what this vid focuses on) its nothing more than any other random lower tier mon sadly
I like how this is basically a sister series to Golden Owl's more game design oriented analysis of the types. Very cool seeing that kind of back and forth with different angles.
I kinda don't mind the insanity of ghosts since it has always been my favorite type since the beginning.
Imagine if Game Freak finally got their heads out of the gutter and made Bug Type genuinely meta viable
Ghost being physical in the first place was weird. Now we have Flutter Mane and C.Shadow to show how it should really work
Ghost was physical in Gen 1 because the only move in that gen that dealt Ghost type damage (so no Night Shade) was Lick.
@@the_bookworm8281explain why dark was special, then. Every single offensive dark move prior to gen4 got shifted to physical after the split. It's nonsense.
@@Trelior Looking at the available Dark type moves in Gen 2.... yeah I got nothing. lol
I guess they don't want to screw over Houndoom or something idk.
@@Treliorit's because, as stupid as it sounds, they wanted half of the types to be physical, half to be special. In gen 1 to gen 3, there were an odd-numbered amount of types, so you couldn't split perfectly, and physical was the atrribute given to the 8 types instead of special's 7 types in gen 1, and that gen's victim was ghost.
Now, with gen 2's dark and steel addiction + shadow ball, you would think "well, surely game freak would tweak the physical special atrribute a little", BUT NO, what was physical and special on the gen before remained 100% unchanged, and they still wanted a new physical type and a new special type to keep the theorical perfect split of physical and special ratio. Tldr, steel OR dark was gonna get screwed, and dark was the chosen victim
You don't see Skarmory on video thumbnails often, Nice.
Lol the gengar in the thumbnail looks more like crobat
I blame this channel for my insatiable appetite for history of Smogon despite never playing any Singles
I've always wondered if Game Freak decided to nerf Steel resistances purely because they created the ultra powerful at the time Aegislash, which would have only had two weaknesses if not for the nerf. Sure, Fairy was almost certainly a factor, but Aegislash would have been something else without those additional weaknesses.
I like how a good portion of this video is "here's how Gengar got better over time" because for a while it just was the Ghost type
For some reason “get sent to mega Rayquaza land” cracked me up
Give Gengar Levitate Back :)
They could make it its hidden ability
Gengar gets Levitate back when Confusion becomes a viable strategy again. God gen 7 was just addicted to nerfs
Give me levitate gengar or give me war
I want my Darkrai’s Dark Void back instead man. I missed running around terrorizing players who weren’t ready from gen 4-5. Last game a played was Ultra Moon. Tried getting into Gen 8 when it came out, but I just couldn’t. The Pokémon designs aren’t as good anymore, the power creep was too much, the constant hand holding & easier routes the games take, nah I’m good. Idk even know what generation this “Nemona” chick is from, but after seeing her team & gameplays of how easily she can be swept, can’t get into Pokémon anymore.
@ vgc smeargle memes
Spectrier was so good that I remember people running Mud Shot on it for coverage back in Gen 8
Fun fact! Every offensive Dark-Type move introduced in gen 1-3 became physical. They all changed categories.
Video 1 of requesting you to cover the Monotype metagame
Hear me out: What if in gen 10 we give the Rock type a Ghost resistance? That way Rock types might have a chance at filling a defensive niche that steel types can't.
I agree and was thinking something along those lines
Most of them don't have the special bulk to tank many shadow balls even with a resist, and would still be in trouble from common coverage or worse, secondary stab from stuff like Goldengho.
Because tombstones seal spirits or something, it could make sense and Rock definitely needs to be more defensive
@@Yunobolt that's great logic and yeahhhhh rocks could definitely use more special defensive stuff, it's like they knew this with the sandstorm buff but then just expected sand for all rock type engagements
It's the salt pokémon from gen 9 so it will make it's ability useless
02:30 wow darkrai existed way before darkrai
Not mentioning Mega Gyarados when it came to offensive darks and pokemon that resisted ash greninjas stabs in gen 7 is such an oversight. I mean, it's niche yes but it's still really good and definitely worth mentioning over the UU hydreigon. Not only was it a decent offensive switch to greninja, it set up dragon dances on its face. it's also one of the few pokemon that could single handedly wipe out hard stall teams which none of the other dark types except choice band Ttar could as its mold breaker ability lets it ignore unaware quagsire and clefable. Maybe I'm biased cause mega gyarados is one of my fav dark types but like still, it at least deserved a mention
Keep in mind the Dark type in Japan is known as the evil type and we see that come to fruition
To be fair, Ghost was always powerful.... that's why they had to limit the moves and the Pokemon....
Alternate title: Why Metagross hated the jump fron Gen 5 to 6
Dark type was made up for with fairy , but the knock off buff might made it overwhelming. Wish it stayed to only a few mediocre mons like in gen 3.
Funny enough I was thinking about this the other day and it’s just me thinking about it the other day beicase they knew they made Agislash op and wanted to add in some new counters to it like removing steel resistance to ghost and dark allowing you to hit it for super effective damage with more types other then Fire and Ground. The only two from my memory who would’ve been able to hit that typing.
Little did they know that would have such a more drastic negative effect
Gengar losing Levitate was one of the happiest days in my life
Ghost is only kept in check due to its weak attacks. Shadow ball is only 80. Imagine how many ghost types will be banned, if we ever get a wide spread ghost fire blast or overheat.
Poltergeist kinda counts, doesn't it? Sure, it needs an item, but basically everything wears an item except Paradox
Poltergeist has a bigger issue in regards to how it can't be paired with Knock Off users on your team so your team overall is a lot worse.
It also sucks that a lot of good ghost types like Basculegion, Aegislash, Mimikyu and Dragapult don't get access to it. Well I say sucks but this is for the best, giving the little guys something to work with. If only Moonblast received this treatment and not the other way arouns
Gengar is slowly becoming my new favorite ghost type.
I love the relationship between two types. Even in game, though I tend to prefer dark types to combat psychic and ghost due to the resists. But if my team has a lot of fighting weaknesses I might pick a ghost instead
for gen 9, I believe you're forgetting chi-yu, who's mostly famous for being an insane sun sweeper/breaker that has no defensive switch-ins, and even resists get 2HKOed. however, because everyone knows the sun set, no one expects the tera dark dark pulse nasty plot set that's arguably even more obscene, because there are flash fire and well baked body switch ins to the sun set, but the dark pulse set really has no switch ins.
False Swipe Gaming
I personally am happy that picking pokemon of my favorite type and pressing the attack button is a semi viable strategy now
Ghost is hitting everything. Except normal and a resisting dark. A shadow ball is knocking the pins off everyone gen 8 onwards when the pursuit specialist quit.
dark types are my favorite type in pokemon, no questions.
All that’s needed to neuter ghost types is bringing back Pursuit. I don’t really know why it was removed from the game. Sure it makes psychic types worse than they already are but there is no other option. You might think this would make Dark types even broken but they were never “broken”, at least as much as ghost is rn or dragon was before gen 6. Theyre good offensively but they at least have more common resists in fairy, dark, fighting types. Ghosts really are only resisted by dark as normal types are quite rare in the higher tiers, and if you’re using a normal type its for its offenses, not its defensive ghost immunity. As even Chansey and Blissey have fallen off tiers. At least Gamefreak had the foresight to not give ghosts a stronger special attack than shadow ball but even still, I think Pursuit would be a nice way to balance stuff again, as it always has been. It’s weak at 40 BP, it’s not like its a brokenly strong move either, and often times a ghost can just stay in predicting this and go for a coverage move. But pursuit is great to dissuade choice specs ghost types mindlessly spamming shadow ball. Either that or you give ghost resistance to another type.
This video makes me wish Steel still resisted Dark and Ghost, Aegislash would still be broken anyways (at least in Gen 6 and 7)
You forgot chi-yu in the gen 9 section.
Dark is my favourite type so I love the video
the last time i was this early gengar was immune to earthquake
But they took levitate away from Gengar, and I’ll never forgive them.
I'm genuinely surprised that Meowscarada isnt used more as a Gliscor check. You'd think they'd be rising in use concurrently.
Triple Axel ice coverage for 4x effectiveness and Flower Trick against a water terra, slap on Knock off and a fourth of your choice(something strong vs steel, really) and you've got some serious coverage there. Or even skip knock off and go for sleep rest talk, why not.
There is a couple interesting reasons on why Meowscrada isn't super popular despite matching up good on paper into a lot of things like Gliscor, Gold, Bolt and Tusk
- It has to complete with ogrepon as a fast, offensive grass type. With ogrepon having stronger support moves, better bulk, stronger stabs, and swords dance making it better overall at breaking through opposing defensive mons despite its weaker coverage.
- Zamazenta, Darkrai, Weavile, Booster Val and Pult's popularity make it have to decide between boots for longevity and not being so heavy on prediction vs scarf to be better into offensive teams and possibly beat/cripple Zama. also if your scaf gliscor will just protect to scout making it hard to actually force the ko.
- And lastly it has a tendency to struggle to pick up KOs without other team mates/hazards softening them up first, since even with its great coverage its not too strong
In addition to this, Meowscarada is just super frail so it can’t really be used to “check” anything. It can only do the revenge killing. Also some Gliscors run U-turn so it’s really unreliable as well.
It makes no sense why dark is SE against ghost? Don’t ghost thrive in the dark?
Dark type is Evil type in Japan. Ghosts are easily susceptible to malice and hatred.
Dark type is called Evil type in Japanese.
Logic here would be that evil can corrupt spirit.
@@Super_Top_Secret_Area The Reason Why The Ghost/Dark Spiritomb/Sableye Had No Weaknesses Barring Scrappy+Fighting Attacks Was Because They Represent Devils,Who Are Nigh Invincible To Everything But Resisting Them(Fighting Attacks,Humans Resisting Temptation),And Angels/The Power Of God's Grace(The Fairy Type)!
@@Super_Top_Secret_Areathank you! I never knew that!
Not to mention evil individuals can disrespect the dead in various acts.
Dark and ghost types are goated
Sableye & Spiritomb are watching from somewhere reading this
They are goated² @@雪者
I think it’s just about finding a new triangle of types. The closest thing to the fire-water-grass core is fighting-ghost-dark.
All metas begin in darkness, and all so end. Pokemon are no different. Darkness sprouts within them, it grows, consumes them. Such is its nature. In the end, every metagame returns to the darkness whence it came. For you see, darkness is the meta's true essence.
Imagine a world where Game Freak waited one more generation to nerf steel and in Agislah’s debut is was not weak to ghost and dark
i think a good change would be to buff bug into being a defensive check for both of these types
I think Bug should resist Fairy.
Surely this means Spiritomb stocks are rising right? Haha... Surely....
This is actually a fascinating video. Dark type especially has become ridiculously powerful. Sucker Punch, Knock Off, Prankster immunity, very powerful mons… Dark is almost too good. I know knock off can’t be nerfed because of technician but they gotta do something about that move.
Really what needs to happen is better fighting types and better fighting moves.
For knock off just remove the power boost from knocking put the item it will be strong as a utility more in single but i think in vgc too but will be way worse as an offensive
I love this kind of video can you do water next it's my fav type
I’m curious to see what Gen 10 might do to reel things back in
I felt at the time and DEFINITELY feel now that it was Grass and Bug types that Steel should have lost its resistance to in gen 6, not Ghost and Dark. Think about it; both Grass and Bug are a bit notorious for the excessive amount of types that resist them, so what better way to give them an easy but effective leg up than the distinction of NOT being resisted by Steel (which would still be far and away the best defensive type).
True even more for bug
@terminawarfrance6104 Indeed... I weep when I consider we were denied Ferrothorn having a third weakness.
As someone who loves ghost and isn’t much of a dark type user (besides my all time favourite Pokémon shiftry), I think a big issue is a lack of solid normal types to get around ghost types. Scarlet and violet doesn’t have a lot of normal types that can beat ghost and dark besides ursaluna. Gen 8 at least dubwool has such monstrous defence with cotton guard fluffy it could payback chip through ghosts and body press dark types but we need more bulky decent attacking normal types now more than ever. Also Gholdengo needs some nerf to its ability or make it rain as both together make it more busted than Aegislash ever was (who I love but was a menace in gen 6).
Also more fighting types, like gen 9 has Flamigo quaquaval and annihilape but like why no bulky fighting types there? Give us a really specially defensive fighting type for some variety and make sure they resist ghost by being either dark fighting or normal fighting.
Tldr: buff normal and fighting more and ghost and dark will feel a lot better than right now, feel like every game I need to use dark or a normal type or a bulkier/faster ghost type
Ghost types being so offensive at least gaves the normal type a useful inmunity.
imagine telling a gen 2 player back then that, in gen 8, 3 of the best offensive types in OU are ICE, GHOST and DARK
Can you do electric types next?
Bug should resist Dark
Rock should resist Ghost (GameFreak even made an ability with Garganacl)
Steel should resist Dark again (but be weak to Electric)
Eletric is already decent don't think it need a nerf
@terminawarfrance6104 Electric beating Steel is a BUFF
@@MariotheAnimator i mean buff idk where my brain went XD
Give psychic a type advantage against ghost so we can have a dynamic where both are strong into each other
I love me some 50 - 50 Kingambit.
Remember when there was no Ghost stab (basically) in Gen 1 and Psychics ruled the roost because of it? My how times have changed
Here’s something that’s interesting
In competitive ghost spam seems really reliable but normal types are immune to ghost
So maybe normal types need buffing as a way to keep ghosts in check?
I think the biggest issue with the normal type is they keep making normal types mono type
Which usually are just worse then dual type mons with a lack of a secondary stab, and for normal types in particular, valuable resistances.
The lack of secondary stab especially hurts too for normals since most of the time they can only status ghost or try to hit them with crunch or something
And normal as a type is not good ngl
Honestly there was something more interesting about the creative, defensive use of ghosts before they started just spamming Shadow Ball. Even if spamming that Shadow Ball can be satisfying at times.
In the early generations, steel types like Skarmory were way too annoying because they seem to resist EVERYTHING that isn't Ground, Fire, or Fighting. Game Greak nerfed them HARD in Gen 6 though when Steel lost its Ghost and Dark resistance, and rightfully so imo.
Something Something Flutter Mane.
…except it wasn’t the Ghost Typing, it was something else that also could use a video.
To be honest it's being ghost type helped
Immunity to fake out is important and its ghost typing helped against steels
@ I’m pretty sure it has to do with a type that made Mawile horrifying in Gen 6, part of what got Magearna banned to Ubers 3 Gens in a row, and S-Calyrex’s only choice of Tera Type to make it Mega Rayquaza Part 3.
@@meta1429 I never denied fairy types impact,but it would be still op with mono ghost or mono fairy typing
Also calyrex would still get banned from ubers without tera because there's no yveltal
@ The part Fairy kind of gave a lot more leverage, sure it’d still be pretty strong and uber worthy especially Flutter’s stat distribution.
But consider changing a X4 Ghost/Dark weakness into a neutrality and resistance when both those types are “broken” in the modern gen, not even Yveltal would wanna switch into a Tera Fairy Draining Kiss after a Nasty Plot/Grim Neigh boost.
@@yeet8036I don’t understand what GF was thinking removing Yveltal..they’ve already seen how monstrous Calyrex shadow was in gen 8. So how did they think it would be a good idea to remove the one pokemon that keeps Caly from potential brokenness. Although it might not have mattered so much cause it can just terastalize now to beat Yveltal but still
Skarmory in a miniature again?
Wow!
Gen 2 - 5 stelle types resists both dark/ghost types.