gasp… i’m so sorry about the minute-long blank screen at 1:12:00. i was editing this at like 4am and told myself i’d go back and fix that part where the camera glitched but i forgot to. god bless america and god bless the gays!
I can't believe I'm seeing an HIV positive old man, melts my heart to see him get this far in life and to know he fought for all of us too, incredible episode, incredible guest, just amazing.
I’m not as old at 48, but there’s a huge number of us who escaped becoming infected, while watching our friends and peers die. It wasn’t easy for anyone, poz or neg. The early to mid-90s were the hardest time of the epidemic.
@@UnionAdvocate I'm sorry you had to see that, it's truly terrifying for me as a young queer person to see how the government just abandoned the community, it took a great number of heterosexual people also being infected and dead for them to care. I bet you've received hundreds of condolences, hope you've found resignation and are living your best life. ❤️🩹
Hearing you say that activism is hard now and how what you did then wouldn't work now feels so validating. To have somebody who made a difference actually acknowledge the changing times and struggles is something we don't see often enough from the older generations. Thank you so much for that ❤
You don't? I'm surprised. I find gay activism harder now than I did forty years ago, especially now that we have to fight the left almost as much as the right. It always seems to get harder. The really chilling thought is how much worse things will be in the 2060s, when I suspect we may have to be rebuilding from scratch. How sad that the periods that look as if things have gotten and will continue to get better are always so short.
@@seto749 at the same time, we shouldn’t use the fact that things are harder now to justify doomerism. That’s not going to help anyone. We need to figure out what tactics to use in the ongoing fight.
@@anthonyscarborough3813 Oh, we're like Laura Collins (the phoenix on Dark Shadows). Even if they undefine us out of existence we'll rise from the ashes; we always have.
A lot? thats simply not true. You have no idea. I am a german who lived in the 80ies in San Francisco. I am not gay, but i was a hippi and i lost so many friends in the castro, just one of them is alive. Actually he thinks that he got infected in late 70ies. He had symptoms but somehow made it. He simply had no tcells . But came to a meds try and made it short before He would die and made it. From early 80s not many are still here. A few had luck
yes, but Covid is airborne .. AIDS transmission is slower.. And OF COURSE, in the public's mind it was associated to intravenous drug use & the gay community (=minorities not many people in power cared about).. I often heard awful homophobic things in the 1990's
@@knightkaley yeah, it's crazy isn't it? Imagine if Trump couldn't even bring himself to say the NAME COVID like Reagan did with AIDS? Imagine doctors refusing to treat COVID patients like many doctors didn't treat AIDS patients? Imagine people were told they deserved it or it was God's holy wrath for getting sick with COVID? Compared to the AIDS crisis the COVID pandemic was handled nearly perfectly. However, both viruses are still with us and they're both actively killing around the world. Take your precautions for your sake and the sake of others. Oh, and continue to demand that people, no matter their circumstances, are given the and medicine they need no matter the cost. No human should die from preventable or treatable disease, especially if they can't afford to pay for it. Healthcare should never have a profit motive behind it.
I had never considered the aftermath of so many people who were convinced they were dying having to learn to live again in the wake of an immensely traumatic event, obviously I knew how horrific the aid’s crisis was but damn that’s an aspect I just didn’t really think about
I relate to that on a lesser level as someone who was so disabled i thought i was permanently homebound in intractable pain as well, and became abled passing to the pt i rarely think abt my disability now. it was such a mindfuck to dare to reaccept smtg i already grieved.
As someone who was living in New York in the 1980's as a gay man, seeing the decimation of a generation of my gay brothers and surviving, something that is still a mystery to me, I think about all of them every single day and miss them terribly. It's good to see Peter Staley who to me is a true hero to the gay community.
As a 26 year old woman who works for a nonprofit that serves people living with HIV, it was so important for me to watch this and hear his story. Thank you ❤
@@angelynnrivera15 you most likely have a HOPWA or Ryan White provider in your local area that would love volunteers. I work for a small local nonprofit in NE Ohio that provides housing assistance for low-income people living with HIV
I really recommend the documentaries "We Were Here" and "Silverlake Life" to really get a sense of both the horror and humanity during that time. Having seem them all, these are the finest.
Peter is my hero. I fought as one of his and Larry’s minions in the streets of late-1980s US of Scarymerikkka. It is chest-swelling to see him celebrated today for his history-altering and billions-of-lives-saving fierceness-and by an equally fierce kid like yourself. And that you credit him with YOUR LIFE is not at all weird and not even a little bit hyperbole. Thank you for your work. ❤️❤️❤️
Just starting the video, but the book "And the Band Played On" by Randy Shilts should be essential reading for EVERYONE to understand the scope, impact, and social consequences of the AIDS Pandemic. RIP Randy Shilts and all the other amazing people we've lost to this horrific illness, and anti-RIP to that monster Ronald Reagan.
Absolutely. Everyone should read "And the Band Played On". They should also go into it knowing that Shilt's characterization of Gaetan Dugas is inaccurate and villainizing. Dugas was not Patient 0 and should not be considered the villain of the early pandemic. That shame should be squarely on Reagan, his administration, and the broader homophobia in the media, legal system, and culture.
A point to remember about Shilts and "The Band Played On" is that he heavily featured Gaëtan Dugas in the book, and blamed him for contributing to the early spread of HIV in the US. This essentially scapegoated him by incorrectly referring to him as "Patient Zero" (really, "Patient O"). While Dugas was diagnosed as HIV positive in 1984 and continued to have sex (something Staley mentions early on in the podcast being an attitude that many gay men had at the time), he was also incredibly helpful and willing to assist researchers by engaging in contact tracing with his sex partners. And in response, the book contributed to the panic that blamed Dugas and portrayed him as a sociopath. Science has proven that HIV had jumped from Africa to the Caribbean to North America as early as 1971 and Dugas contracted HIV well into the middle of the pandemic. He didn't "bring HIV to the US", nor was he an index patient, as many media sources incorrectly concluded after reading Shilts's book. Shilts's editor later expressed regret in "How to Survive a Plague" for making the conscious decision to vilify Dugas in the book, noting that it was also a bid to sensationalize the book and help it sell.
My freshman year of high school, we watched "And the Band Played On" (and "If These Walls Could Talk" which was wild), and it completely changed my view on myself and how important community and identification, even if i was too cowardly to for a long time. If you struggle to read, or can't find the book, watch the movie. Or best off, do BOTH
I was coming here to mention this book specifically. It is a GREAT on the ground recollection of the era. Politics in SF, the sex clubs, the mishandling of hemophilia blood by big pharma, the scientists doing groundbreaking work (and backstabbing shit), THE LESBIANS. The only critique is his treatment of Patient Zero, which has subsequently been thoroughly debunked (you can find a really good documentary on RUclips about him). But that was also the information they had at the time.
I am in my 40s, so I am between the two generations Peter and Matt represent. Part of my fear in coming out was the fear I could/would die of AIDS. I am so glad that because of people like Peter Staley, it's not like that anymore.
Same here. Also in my 40s Also it’s crazy to think when I was in school, education on HIV was pretty extensive, even in the conservative state I lived in. But neither of these two learned about it till after coming out? That amazes me
this episode was so eye opening for me as a gen z gay. It’s kinda embarrassing how little i know about HIV/AIDS, because I thought everyone who got it passed away. Its so important to hear from people that survived it, as your stories are never heard enough
@@MaffyTaffyHaffy this just in! gen z’er commits crime of being young, inexperienced, and not knowing everything out the womb. unsympathetic millenial does not like this despite being treated the same by baby boomers. more at 5 🖕
My Dad passed from AIDS in 1989. He lost so many friends he created many quilts for friends before he died. A friend of his paid to have a song written for him by the Boston Gay mens Chorus! He was a beautiful man with a beautiful soul who never deserved the pain he had to endure. Not only from The disease but from a country who deserted him blaming him for getting sick. I sm so glad things are better for those who get sick. I hope the future will be even better.
Peter Staley has been a hero of mine since I was a young teenager in the early '90s. I did my best to mirror his activism at my high school by bringing HIV and AIDS awareness to our faculty and students. It really wasn't part of our curriculum. Each year I'd fight to speak on World AIDS Day over the intercom during morning announcements and pay tribute to those affected. My friends and I would pass out pamphlets, red ribbons and condoms on holidays for donations to give to the local AIDS hospice. We were often featured in our school newspaper advocating for better sex education and safer sex. We tried so many other creative methods just to get the message out. To this day, I am still stunned that we often never received any backlash, especially being some geeky queer punks in South Texas, but Peter and ACT-UP (and yes, Madonna) were the blueprint for our cause. At 46, I still have immense gratitude for him, them, and all of the knowledge they gave us to share. I am so happy he is still around to listen to and learn from. (And still hot, too!!) Thanks, Matt. Great job!
Young people hate on Madonna due to their ignorance…many Gen Z need to read so much more and learn about all the different cultural influences and movements…
My mom was a queer youth involved in act up in the 90s. I haven’t ever really asked her about it, because I know how hard it must have been, but it was incredibly touching to hear this story and learn more about my community and our history
i used to avoid asking older queer people questions about our history, but the more i’ve gotten the opportunity to talk to them the more i’ve learned that a lot of them really really appreciate the opportunity to share their history. it’s a lot of individual stories of people that we don’t get to hear, and as a result, they’re lost to history. i’d really encourage asking your ma about her past. if anything else, so you know her stories are safely held with you and you will have the opportunity to keep her history alive for as long as possible. it’s also a great bonding moment as im sure you already know :)
My mom was a nurse during this time… she said for quite a while THEY were not given information either. Outside of the doctors who had special interest in it, no one was bothering to distribute info to the rest of the medical profession :/ literally people just didn’t care I guess.
I haven't fully finished the episode yet, so forgive me if this is mentioned somewhere! - We recently watched "How to Survive a Plague" in my MSW Social Work Policy class. An extremely important and moving watch in my opinion. Our professor pointed out that some of the criticism that has arisen of this doc is its focus on the white, male, middle class experience during the height of the AIDS epidemic. This does not at all take away from the very important work people like Peter Staley did, but I do want to plug the book "Let the Record Show: A political History of Act Up New York" by Sarah Schulman (one of our required readings) as it shines a light on the POC and women who were also vital in the success of the ACT UP movement. Thank you for this interview, Matt!
Also an MSW student here. I really appreciate that your professor both brought this to the class and was educated enough to share important critiques to further understanding of the topic. Often that second part doesn't happen with these kinds of topics. And thank you for that book recommendation. I'm going to put it on my list.
I wrote some of the first local news coverage of AIDS, ACT-UP and Queer Nation in Tucson, AZ, partly because I lost a co-worker to AIDS. One of the tough things about being queer now is conveying the horror and hope of that time. It’s wonderful to see an interview with Peter Staley after all these years; Matt Bernstein is an excellent interviewer. It really gives me hope for the future to see queer people sharing their stories across generations. Thank you, Matt & Peter!
Also as a scientist, especially one who wanted to do infectious disease research and literally got kicked out of a grad school for proposing that in my qualifier but "not enough people die of that" (I mean there were a lot of other factors too, but then freaking COVID happened!) thank you so much for recognizing us, we don't get that very often. Being more successful at a much more diverse graduate school now. But even after COVID there's not nearly enough funding for infectious disease.
Reading VIRAL was a shocking plunge into the history for me. What happened was so powerful and phenomenal. I was livid that I wasn’t learning about the AIDS epidemic until I was sitting in the library as a twenty-three year old trans man reading a book. (I’m 24 now.) My mother was born in 1960 and as a college health educator, was someone who would help teach people about HIV/AIDS and how to stay safe. We don’t always get along, but my learning of this history gave us something important to bond over. Thank you so much for this interview. It too brought tears from me several times. Seeing someone who was in the heart of the crisis being able to sit and talk today about what happened is something so special. (Edited to add more clarification.)
OK Matt, I'll give you a little more back up on this story. During the 80's and the epidemic was cranking up, Me and everybody else would head for the local gay bar on Friday night. Soon as I would come up to the bar for my favorite brand of Scotch, I'd ask the bar tender have you seen so and so tonight. He'd say, "didn't you hear?" I'd say, "Hear what?" so and so died on Wednesday. After several more appearances at the bars, I wouldn't ask any more because I knew what the answer was. It got so bad Matt that I got so scared that I started to date a woman, forced myself to start a new life as a straight guy. We lived together, got married and I helped raise three kids. Fast forward 22 years later, my wife left me and me and my kids would be together from then on. Today, I have kids, grand kids and one great grand kid a 9 Y/O boy named Emerson. so now, I have to start all over again although, now, at my current age, I don't have the energy to go at the speed that I used to. Thought that this might give you some idea how bad it was.
The logistics of the condom on the house kills me. I love those details. Def walked so we can run. Thanks for this interview! BTW 1hr 3mins in I was wondering if Peter's BF at the time was Kevin (met him at a cafe in SF) AND IT WAS! The gayborhood is much smaller than I even thought!
I am in my mid 40s, and Peter was part of the queer generation before mine. We saw and benefited from their labor, learned about our sexual health, and became politicized across gender lines because of their courageous leadership. The antiretrovirals that he and other activists tirelessly advocated for became available just as I began exploring my own sexuality, and I survive because of Peter and his peers. I have felt a sense of responsibility to continue building on that legacy, rather than settle into contentment. While the organizing strategies must evolve - as he suggests - the awakening he helped stir back in the 1980s has guided me and many others who have gone on to contribute to other social movements.
Excellent comment I am also straight a straight woman actually. But i am a ally to lgtb community whixh i find my own community. I love them Brothers and sisters of the 80s 90s who følger against this political and biological virus. Rip to all those gorgeus angels. Peace.
I work with people living with HIV/AIDS, their support of me, in my grief made me understand what it meant to be human. This man is one of them. I cried throughout this interview. Thankyou and I love you so much ❤
Matt, this is SUCH a wonderful interview, it was a joy to listen to you and Peter connect ❤️ genuinely startled my wife bursting out laughing at his comments on the ACT UP lesbians lmao
Thank you for bringing this history back into consciousness. I knew about AIDS but I did not feel its impact until I joined an intergenerational queer organization. Long time members sent in old party photos- they were beautiful and looked like my friends now. It hurt my heart learning how many of them were lost to the AIDS crisis.
i really enjoyed this episode. being able to talk to older queer people is such a rare experience now, and i am so grateful to be able to hear Peter’s story
As a 16 year old In 83, with a fla ID that made me 19, I was in the gay bars early 30 miles away, a world away from my rural town and high school. I was very aware of the new disease 😔 lost so many friends right thru the 90s.. I was one of the lucky ones.
What a beautiful interview with Peter Staley! I started crying as he was discussing how despite so many political victories Act Up was making in the late 80's, at the same time the AIDS numbers were spiking to an all-time high, still no cure. So it was this conflicting time of heavy grief, victorious wins, and then you'd get to go clubbing in between all this. What a gorgeous palette he paints. Really puts the time frame into context. I hope the day comes very soon when we are as fed up with the systems put into place to start rising up again in justifiable collective anger.
I rewatch How to Survive a Plague every couple of years. With each viewing, my admiration for the people in the movements grows- as does my absolute hatred for Reagan. I spent much of my teen years in hospitals with my friends and acquaintances who have HIV/AIDS. It's thanks to Peter Staley and all the other activists like him, that my friends have so many options in treatment for their HIV/AIDS or were even born in the first place, when their parents likely would've died from complications from AIDS before my friends could even be born otherwise.
Matt's intro was eye-opening for me! I'm 30 years old and my middle/high schools taught us a reasonable amount about the AIDS crisis and its connection to the queer community. Then again, I was also raised in a liberal center of Oregon. Goes to show just how much work remains.
I love that you are bringing in the older members of our community to share really important history. It was so sad to hear you learned nothing of this from school. There is so much to be learned from AIDS activism - and that became clearer to me as the pandemic rolled out.
Another fantastic interview Matt, fascinating to hear Peter's personal journey with HIV but also his views on activism today. As a Brit, my understanding of HIV and AIDS in the US isn't as deep as I'd like it to be, and this has left me wanting to read/learn more.
On the flip side, I didn't know much about the epidemic on your side of the pond. It's not the same as a documentary by any means, but watching "It's a Sin" on HBO gave me some insight.
This is the second time I have the honor of listening to this, first through the podcast and now here on yt - thank you and Peter for educating us all about such a horrible and dark chapter of modern history ❤
So happy you were able to bring Peter on to the show! I have a book on my reading list called Let the Record Show: A Political History of ACT UP New York, 1987-1993 by Sarah Schulman and this reminded me to read it next.
I'm halfway reading "Let The Record Show" and watching Pose, with "And The Band Played On" waiting. This couldn't come at a better time ❤️ appreciate your podcast so much, the topics, guests and depth is refreshing and commendable
how to survive a plague is one of the best films i've ever seen -- will literally never forget the rush it gave me my first time watching and may just be stuck chasing that exact kind of high for the rest of my life
As a proud North Carolinian I'm so sorry about Helms...not that I was alive at that time...but we're still stuck with politicians who act like that not because NC is particularly conservative but because we're gerrymandered AF. Thank you for the suggestions on how to protest because I feel like a lot of the politically active people in NC are listening!
I'm tearing up so much, thank you for having Peter on. I work with the unhoused and housing insecure population in western washington, and some of the same lack of humanity and empathy is present here with homelessness getting worse and the fentanyl crisis killing many people I know. I was so touched to learn how harm reduction became a thing and how empathetic people learned to live through situations where nothing seems to be on a person's sode while struggling. The care to combat that wickedness is equally "wicked" and powerful. And I have so much love for people who did what was right in the face of so much apathy and disdain.
Amazing man! I am so glad he is still here. I am old so I remember all the stuff about AIDS, it was truly terrifying, though must have been so much more so for gay men at the time. I am a cis woman and was a teenager during the worst of it. My Dad used to volunteer in a hospice for people with AIDS so my sister and I actually knew pretty early on that we couldn't get it from touching someone etc but a lot of people didn't know that so people were treated like pariahs. I remember going to some event raising money for the hospice Dad volunteered at, there were a few men that my Dad introduced us to and we shook hands with them, and Dad told me afterwards it probably meant a lot to them that he was happy for his daughters to touch them!
I'm new to your podcast but I've been working my way through a lot of your videos the last few weeks. I only just found this one, but it's *easily* my favorite so far. Thank you so much for this!
WOW, just wow! Matt, my god, what an honor. Growing up in Utah I completely understand the passive aggressiveness and fear-mongering aspect of Peter’s experience. This was truly a gem of an interview, you make such a fantastic host. I won’t lie, I’m 36, I knew a lot of the history. But, to hear from Peter was really important. Congrats Matt, I can only imagine what this meant to you. Sending love ❤️
This is the kind of commendable, needed, important content that youtube should be showcasing and spotlighting Not mukbangs and Reaction BS Videos. Good for you Matt Bernstein ...
Seeing a young man in Act Up wearing a Keffyeh shows how far back queer support for Palestine has been going on as is not a "new trend" as some say! Very moving!
I can't believe this doesn't have more views! More people absolutely need to see this. This was a fantastic and really eye-opening episode. I love the show!
Theres a Designing Women episode with the guy, not Patrick Swayze, from Ghost where Dixie Carter reams her friend a new one when she says ' these boys are getting what they deserve' So good was that episode.
I can't imagine how frustrating it would have been during the aids crisis to live in a society with people that not only didn't care but wanted people to die from it to prove a religious point. I have so much respect for men like this who stood up for what was right in such a dignified manner in a world of hateful people who had no shame or dignity what so ever. Todays world is so much different because of them.
Thanks so much for this wonderful interview. As someone of Peter Staley's generation who spent most of the 1980s and 1990s outside the US but had the privilege of getting to know a number of ACT UP (and Queer Nation) activists when I lived in LA in 1991, I appreciate his work and perspectives and self-reflections so much and am so glad he survived to tell this important story. I look forward to reading his memoir.
My uncle died of aids related illness in 1991 in San francisco (we're Canadian). I was born in 89, My family cut him out, I found out through the ancestry website that he had married a woman in San Fran, I assume for citizenship. I...wish I could meet her if she's still alive. I wish I could know who he was, what was he like? What were his hopes and dreams? What was his passion? Was he...alone in the end? Or surrounded by friends? So many questions, so far no answers :( probably won't ever get any.
Loved this podcast episode. Like you, Matt, I’m 25 years old but was largely in the closet until my senior year of college during Covid lockdowns when I first had my first gay sex experience. I spent lots of my time outside Zoom classes watching movies and tv shows like It’s A Sin, BPM, And the Band Played On, the Normal Heart, etc. So glad I discovered this channel yesterday.
1:23:50 I've been lucky to meet an awesome couple while working in homeless services. One of whom is an hiv positive gay man in his 50s, a survivor of the aids crisis. The man is lovable and snarky and deeply empathetic. He's talked about his meth use and how deeply tied it is his life as a gay man. He's said no one gets it who doesnt "get it". He's talked about addiction treatment, and how it has to be somewhere he can speak frankly about being gay, having hiv and meth use, or it wont do him any good. Words cant say how great those guys are and how much they are admired by me for supporting the network of fellow survivors around them. (Rest in peace to their sweet bulldog-pitt)
This was such an important conversation to have and I really hope this conversation taught someone at least one thing. You are two incredible people and I really thank you for this conversation ❤❤❤
gasp… i’m so sorry about the minute-long blank screen at 1:12:00. i was editing this at like 4am and told myself i’d go back and fix that part where the camera glitched but i forgot to. god bless america and god bless the gays!
You’re a filthy stereotype.
you are a gem!
I kinda dig it, it’s like a moment of gravitas and contemplation after the Pat Buchanan clip. lol.
@@nessthinghi
I thought my eyesight😂 was
failing
I can't believe I'm seeing an HIV positive old man, melts my heart to see him get this far in life and to know he fought for all of us too, incredible episode, incredible guest, just amazing.
I’m not as old at 48, but there’s a huge number of us who escaped becoming infected, while watching our friends and peers die. It wasn’t easy for anyone, poz or neg. The early to mid-90s were the hardest time of the epidemic.
Were you under the impression that they all died? This comment is so baffling to me. The virus didn't kill every gay person alive.
@@dariang4725 dude don't just take everything to extremes to be upset lmao
@@UnionAdvocate I'm sorry you had to see that, it's truly terrifying for me as a young queer person to see how the government just abandoned the community, it took a great number of heterosexual people also being infected and dead for them to care.
I bet you've received hundreds of condolences, hope you've found resignation and are living your best life. ❤️🩹
Hearing you say that activism is hard now and how what you did then wouldn't work now feels so validating. To have somebody who made a difference actually acknowledge the changing times and struggles is something we don't see often enough from the older generations. Thank you so much for that ❤
You don't? I'm surprised. I find gay activism harder now than I did forty years ago, especially now that we have to fight the left almost as much as the right. It always seems to get harder. The really chilling thought is how much worse things will be in the 2060s, when I suspect we may have to be rebuilding from scratch. How sad that the periods that look as if things have gotten and will continue to get better are always so short.
@@seto749 at the same time, we shouldn’t use the fact that things are harder now to justify doomerism. That’s not going to help anyone. We need to figure out what tactics to use in the ongoing fight.
@@anthonyscarborough3813 Oh, we're like Laura Collins (the phoenix on Dark Shadows). Even if they undefine us out of existence we'll rise from the ashes; we always have.
That comment almost made me burst out crying! It's so hard right now
@@seto749 well, there's not really a Left in the US anymore. It's a Center Right and Far Right that we're fighting
Please remember a lot of us long term survivors are still here.
I'm glad
we are so grateful. i love you
I’ve met some people who have lived with it for decades. Ya’ll went through so much.
A lot? thats simply not true. You have no idea. I am a german who lived in the 80ies in San Francisco. I am not gay, but i was a hippi and i lost so many friends in the castro, just one of them is alive. Actually he thinks that he got infected in late 70ies. He had symptoms but somehow made it. He simply had no tcells . But came to a meds try and made it short before He would die and made it. From early 80s not many are still here. A few had luck
Media attention 4 years after the crisis started. Wow. Imagine if we JUST started reporting on covid. So heartbreaking to hear. ❤
doesnt azt kind of remind you of the “vaccine”? after 6 months, the virus mutates and then you need a new drug…
Wow. What a way to put it into perspective, I can’t even imagine
yes, but Covid is airborne .. AIDS transmission is slower.. And OF COURSE, in the public's mind it was associated to intravenous drug use & the gay community (=minorities not many people in power cared about).. I often heard awful homophobic things in the 1990's
@@knightkaley yeah, it's crazy isn't it? Imagine if Trump couldn't even bring himself to say the NAME COVID like Reagan did with AIDS? Imagine doctors refusing to treat COVID patients like many doctors didn't treat AIDS patients? Imagine people were told they deserved it or it was God's holy wrath for getting sick with COVID? Compared to the AIDS crisis the COVID pandemic was handled nearly perfectly. However, both viruses are still with us and they're both actively killing around the world. Take your precautions for your sake and the sake of others. Oh, and continue to demand that people, no matter their circumstances, are given the and medicine they need no matter the cost. No human should die from preventable or treatable disease, especially if they can't afford to pay for it. Healthcare should never have a profit motive behind it.
The fear sounds unthinkable.
I had never considered the aftermath of so many people who were convinced they were dying having to learn to live again in the wake of an immensely traumatic event, obviously I knew how horrific the aid’s crisis was but damn that’s an aspect I just didn’t really think about
I relate to that on a lesser level as someone who was so disabled i thought i was permanently homebound in intractable pain as well, and became abled passing to the pt i rarely think abt my disability now. it was such a mindfuck to dare to reaccept smtg i already grieved.
As someone who was living in New York in the 1980's as a gay man, seeing the decimation of a generation of my gay brothers and surviving, something that is still a mystery to me, I think about all of them every single day and miss them terribly. It's good to see Peter Staley who to me is a true hero to the gay community.
CCR5 aka Delta 32 Gene 🧐
They marched so we could fly and soar ❤
Well, not so you could still have rampant, careless, sordid sex.
@@kittiesshortie5011silence, granny.
As a 26 year old woman who works for a nonprofit that serves people living with HIV, it was so important for me to watch this and hear his story. Thank you ❤
What nonprofit do you work for? I’d love to get more involved in something like this :)
@@angelynnrivera15 you most likely have a HOPWA or Ryan White provider in your local area that would love volunteers. I work for a small local nonprofit in NE Ohio that provides housing assistance for low-income people living with HIV
I really recommend the documentaries "We Were Here" and "Silverlake Life" to really get a sense of both the horror and humanity during that time. Having seem them all, these are the finest.
Peter is my hero. I fought as one of his and Larry’s minions in the streets of late-1980s US of Scarymerikkka.
It is chest-swelling to see him celebrated today for his history-altering and billions-of-lives-saving fierceness-and by an equally fierce kid like yourself.
And that you credit him with YOUR LIFE is not at all weird and not even a little bit hyperbole.
Thank you for your work. ❤️❤️❤️
thank you for yours! ✊
Just starting the video, but the book "And the Band Played On" by Randy Shilts should be essential reading for EVERYONE to understand the scope, impact, and social consequences of the AIDS Pandemic.
RIP Randy Shilts and all the other amazing people we've lost to this horrific illness, and anti-RIP to that monster Ronald Reagan.
Absolutely. Everyone should read "And the Band Played On". They should also go into it knowing that Shilt's characterization of Gaetan Dugas is inaccurate and villainizing. Dugas was not Patient 0 and should not be considered the villain of the early pandemic. That shame should be squarely on Reagan, his administration, and the broader homophobia in the media, legal system, and culture.
RIP to reagan. he can rest in piss
A point to remember about Shilts and "The Band Played On" is that he heavily featured Gaëtan Dugas in the book, and blamed him for contributing to the early spread of HIV in the US. This essentially scapegoated him by incorrectly referring to him as "Patient Zero" (really, "Patient O"). While Dugas was diagnosed as HIV positive in 1984 and continued to have sex (something Staley mentions early on in the podcast being an attitude that many gay men had at the time), he was also incredibly helpful and willing to assist researchers by engaging in contact tracing with his sex partners. And in response, the book contributed to the panic that blamed Dugas and portrayed him as a sociopath. Science has proven that HIV had jumped from Africa to the Caribbean to North America as early as 1971 and Dugas contracted HIV well into the middle of the pandemic. He didn't "bring HIV to the US", nor was he an index patient, as many media sources incorrectly concluded after reading Shilts's book. Shilts's editor later expressed regret in "How to Survive a Plague" for making the conscious decision to vilify Dugas in the book, noting that it was also a bid to sensationalize the book and help it sell.
My freshman year of high school, we watched "And the Band Played On" (and "If These Walls Could Talk" which was wild), and it completely changed my view on myself and how important community and identification, even if i was too cowardly to for a long time. If you struggle to read, or can't find the book, watch the movie. Or best off, do BOTH
I was coming here to mention this book specifically. It is a GREAT on the ground recollection of the era. Politics in SF, the sex clubs, the mishandling of hemophilia blood by big pharma, the scientists doing groundbreaking work (and backstabbing shit), THE LESBIANS. The only critique is his treatment of Patient Zero, which has subsequently been thoroughly debunked (you can find a really good documentary on RUclips about him). But that was also the information they had at the time.
I am in my 40s, so I am between the two generations Peter and Matt represent. Part of my fear in coming out was the fear I could/would die of AIDS. I am so glad that because of people like Peter Staley, it's not like that anymore.
Same here. Also in my 40s
Also it’s crazy to think when I was in school, education on HIV was pretty extensive, even in the conservative state I lived in. But neither of these two learned about it till after coming out? That amazes me
this episode was so eye opening for me as a gen z gay. It’s kinda embarrassing how little i know about HIV/AIDS, because I thought everyone who got it passed away. Its so important to hear from people that survived it, as your stories are never heard enough
Y’all are embarssing in general
@maffytaffy1231 😂 Noooo bro don't have a furry icon and tell someone else they're embarrassing.
@@dariang4725 that’s a self own honestly
@@MaffyTaffyHaffy way to miss the point and punch down lol
@@MaffyTaffyHaffy this just in! gen z’er commits crime of being young, inexperienced, and not knowing everything out the womb. unsympathetic millenial does not like this despite being treated the same by baby boomers. more at 5 🖕
My Dad passed from AIDS in 1989. He lost so many friends he created many quilts for friends before he died. A friend of his paid to have a song written for him by the Boston Gay mens Chorus! He was a beautiful man with a beautiful soul who never deserved the pain he had to endure. Not only from
The disease but from a country who deserted him blaming him for getting sick. I sm so glad things are better for those who get sick. I hope the future will be even better.
I'm so sorry you don't have your dad. He didn't deserve what he went through, his country and many fellow humans failed him
Peter Staley has been a hero of mine since I was a young teenager in the early '90s. I did my best to mirror his activism at my high school by bringing HIV and AIDS awareness to our faculty and students. It really wasn't part of our curriculum. Each year I'd fight to speak on World AIDS Day over the intercom during morning announcements and pay tribute to those affected. My friends and I would pass out pamphlets, red ribbons and condoms on holidays for donations to give to the local AIDS hospice. We were often featured in our school newspaper advocating for better sex education and safer sex. We tried so many other creative methods just to get the message out. To this day, I am still stunned that we often never received any backlash, especially being some geeky queer punks in South Texas, but Peter and ACT-UP (and yes, Madonna) were the blueprint for our cause. At 46, I still have immense gratitude for him, them, and all of the knowledge they gave us to share. I am so happy he is still around to listen to and learn from. (And still hot, too!!) Thanks, Matt. Great job!
Young people hate on Madonna due to their ignorance…many Gen Z need to read so much more and learn about all the different cultural influences and movements…
How to Survive a Plague is streaming for free right now if anyone is interested.
streaming where?
@user-dg6qn4si1h just look it up. It's on a bunch of sites that are free with ads, use whichever you prefer.
watched it on prime pretty recently@@babs_babs
@@babs_babs it's free here on RUclips
it's on pluto tv@@babs_babs
My mom was a queer youth involved in act up in the 90s. I haven’t ever really asked her about it, because I know how hard it must have been, but it was incredibly touching to hear this story and learn more about my community and our history
You could ask her, I'm sure- she has experience and wisdom to share.
i used to avoid asking older queer people questions about our history, but the more i’ve gotten the opportunity to talk to them the more i’ve learned that a lot of them really really appreciate the opportunity to share their history. it’s a lot of individual stories of people that we don’t get to hear, and as a result, they’re lost to history. i’d really encourage asking your ma about her past. if anything else, so you know her stories are safely held with you and you will have the opportunity to keep her history alive for as long as possible. it’s also a great bonding moment as im sure you already know :)
Yes ask her she will most likely be happy you are interested in her past!
My mom was a nurse during this time… she said for quite a while THEY were not given information either. Outside of the doctors who had special interest in it, no one was bothering to distribute info to the rest of the medical profession :/ literally people just didn’t care I guess.
Please hear her history before it leaves unsaid with her ❤
I think I'm just a little bit in awe of this interview, honestly. What a privilege to be able to experience it.
I haven't fully finished the episode yet, so forgive me if this is mentioned somewhere! - We recently watched "How to Survive a Plague" in my MSW Social Work Policy class. An extremely important and moving watch in my opinion. Our professor pointed out that some of the criticism that has arisen of this doc is its focus on the white, male, middle class experience during the height of the AIDS epidemic. This does not at all take away from the very important work people like Peter Staley did, but I do want to plug the book "Let the Record Show: A political History of Act Up New York" by Sarah Schulman (one of our required readings) as it shines a light on the POC and women who were also vital in the success of the ACT UP movement. Thank you for this interview, Matt!
Also an MSW student here. I really appreciate that your professor both brought this to the class and was educated enough to share important critiques to further understanding of the topic. Often that second part doesn't happen with these kinds of topics. And thank you for that book recommendation. I'm going to put it on my list.
I wrote some of the first local news coverage of AIDS, ACT-UP and Queer Nation in Tucson, AZ, partly because I lost a co-worker to AIDS. One of the tough things about being queer now is conveying the horror and hope of that time. It’s wonderful to see an interview with Peter Staley after all these years; Matt Bernstein is an excellent interviewer. It really gives me hope for the future to see queer people sharing their stories across generations. Thank you, Matt & Peter!
I, a gay man from Norway, learned a lot from this conversation. Thank yew.
Also as a scientist, especially one who wanted to do infectious disease research and literally got kicked out of a grad school for proposing that in my qualifier but "not enough people die of that" (I mean there were a lot of other factors too, but then freaking COVID happened!) thank you so much for recognizing us, we don't get that very often. Being more successful at a much more diverse graduate school now. But even after COVID there's not nearly enough funding for infectious disease.
I had no idea just proposing something could get you kicked out of grad school. How?
Reading VIRAL was a shocking plunge into the history for me. What happened was so powerful and phenomenal. I was livid that I wasn’t learning about the AIDS epidemic until I was sitting in the library as a twenty-three year old trans man reading a book. (I’m 24 now.)
My mother was born in 1960 and as a college health educator, was someone who would help teach people about HIV/AIDS and how to stay safe. We don’t always get along, but my learning of this history gave us something important to bond over.
Thank you so much for this interview. It too brought tears from me several times. Seeing someone who was in the heart of the crisis being able to sit and talk today about what happened is something so special.
(Edited to add more clarification.)
OK Matt, I'll give you a little more back up on this story. During the 80's and the epidemic was cranking up, Me and everybody else would head for the local gay bar on Friday night. Soon as I would come up to the bar for my favorite brand of Scotch, I'd ask the bar tender have you seen so and so tonight. He'd say, "didn't you hear?" I'd say, "Hear what?" so and so died on Wednesday. After several more appearances at the bars, I wouldn't ask any more because I knew what the answer was. It got so bad Matt that I got so scared that I started to date a woman, forced myself to start a new life as a straight guy. We lived together, got married and I helped raise three kids. Fast forward 22 years later, my wife left me and me and my kids would be together from then on. Today, I have kids, grand kids and one great grand kid a 9 Y/O boy named Emerson. so now, I have to start all over again although, now, at my current age, I don't have the energy to go at the speed that I used to. Thought that this might give you some idea how bad it was.
My word thank you for sharing
I hope you feel free now to live your authentic self
This episode is your best yet. Just wow. I have no words. What an incredible well of experience and wisdom.
The logistics of the condom on the house kills me. I love those details. Def walked so we can run. Thanks for this interview! BTW 1hr 3mins in I was wondering if Peter's BF at the time was Kevin (met him at a cafe in SF) AND IT WAS! The gayborhood is much smaller than I even thought!
Peter Staley is my hero. Where would we be now without him?
I am in my mid 40s, and Peter was part of the queer generation before mine. We saw and benefited from their labor, learned about our sexual health, and became politicized across gender lines because of their courageous leadership. The antiretrovirals that he and other activists tirelessly advocated for became available just as I began exploring my own sexuality, and I survive because of Peter and his peers. I have felt a sense of responsibility to continue building on that legacy, rather than settle into contentment. While the organizing strategies must evolve - as he suggests - the awakening he helped stir back in the 1980s has guided me and many others who have gone on to contribute to other social movements.
Straight but proud to be an ally of your community.
Excellent comment I am also straight a straight woman actually. But i am a ally to lgtb community whixh i find my own community. I love them Brothers and sisters of the 80s 90s who følger against this political and biological virus. Rip to all those gorgeus angels. Peace.
I work with people living with HIV/AIDS, their support of me, in my grief made me understand what it meant to be human. This man is one of them. I cried throughout this interview. Thankyou and I love you so much ❤
Took me a while to realize when he says "the f word" he probably doesn't mean fuck....
Thank you for making this episode, it's a valuable personal record of queer history.
Matt, this is SUCH a wonderful interview, it was a joy to listen to you and Peter connect ❤️ genuinely startled my wife bursting out laughing at his comments on the ACT UP lesbians lmao
Thank you for bringing this history back into consciousness. I knew about AIDS but I did not feel its impact until I joined an intergenerational queer organization. Long time members sent in old party photos- they were beautiful and looked like my friends now. It hurt my heart learning how many of them were lost to the AIDS crisis.
i really enjoyed this episode. being able to talk to older queer people is such a rare experience now, and i am so grateful to be able to hear Peter’s story
As a 16 year old In 83, with a fla ID that made me 19, I was in the gay bars early 30 miles away, a world away from my rural town and high school. I was very aware of the new disease 😔 lost so many friends right thru the 90s.. I was one of the lucky ones.
What an amazing episode. I feel like I learned so much. Peter seems like such a great guy, someone we can all look up to.
What a beautiful interview with Peter Staley! I started crying as he was discussing how despite so many political victories Act Up was making in the late 80's, at the same time the AIDS numbers were spiking to an all-time high, still no cure. So it was this conflicting time of heavy grief, victorious wins, and then you'd get to go clubbing in between all this. What a gorgeous palette he paints. Really puts the time frame into context. I hope the day comes very soon when we are as fed up with the systems put into place to start rising up again in justifiable collective anger.
I rewatch How to Survive a Plague every couple of years. With each viewing, my admiration for the people in the movements grows- as does my absolute hatred for Reagan. I spent much of my teen years in hospitals with my friends and acquaintances who have HIV/AIDS. It's thanks to Peter Staley and all the other activists like him, that my friends have so many options in treatment for their HIV/AIDS or were even born in the first place, when their parents likely would've died from complications from AIDS before my friends could even be born otherwise.
Matt's intro was eye-opening for me! I'm 30 years old and my middle/high schools taught us a reasonable amount about the AIDS crisis and its connection to the queer community. Then again, I was also raised in a liberal center of Oregon. Goes to show just how much work remains.
I didn't even know gay men had back sex until I got exposed to queer social media .
I'm 30 and grew up in a small conservative town and we didn't learn about it at all.
Amazing interview. Brought me back to the troubles of the 90's and being closeted, gay, and paranoid of HIV. Peter Staley is a true survivor and hero.
Thank you so much for doing this interview Matt! Peter Staley MUST NEVER be forgotten!
Every minute of this was so eye opening. Thank you
I love that you are bringing in the older members of our community to share really important history. It was so sad to hear you learned nothing of this from school. There is so much to be learned from AIDS activism - and that became clearer to me as the pandemic rolled out.
Another fantastic interview Matt, fascinating to hear Peter's personal journey with HIV but also his views on activism today. As a Brit, my understanding of HIV and AIDS in the US isn't as deep as I'd like it to be, and this has left me wanting to read/learn more.
On the flip side, I didn't know much about the epidemic on your side of the pond. It's not the same as a documentary by any means, but watching "It's a Sin" on HBO gave me some insight.
my favorite podcast! thank you for your Barbie-inspired insta post on Gaza. We have so much respect for your vocal activism!
This is the second time I have the honor of listening to this, first through the podcast and now here on yt - thank you and Peter for educating us all about such a horrible and dark chapter of modern history ❤
cries in HIV/AIDS student! i have been waiting for this episode.
This was the most beautiful conversation I have had the privilege to listen to. The grief, the joy, the hope, the despair.
Excellent job with the interview Matt. Thanks for letting Peter tell the Act Up story to young members of the community that may not know of it.
So happy you were able to bring Peter on to the show! I have a book on my reading list called Let the Record Show: A Political History of ACT UP New York, 1987-1993 by Sarah Schulman and this reminded me to read it next.
I'm halfway reading "Let The Record Show" and watching Pose, with "And The Band Played On" waiting. This couldn't come at a better time ❤️ appreciate your podcast so much, the topics, guests and depth is refreshing and commendable
i’d highly recommend adding “the viral underclass” by steven thrasher to your list!
@@ebetg4191 thank you, ill check it out!
how to survive a plague is one of the best films i've ever seen -- will literally never forget the rush it gave me my first time watching and may just be stuck chasing that exact kind of high for the rest of my life
Thanks to everyone in the comments who wrote their stories. It is so important. My condolences to everyone to which it applies.
As a proud North Carolinian I'm so sorry about Helms...not that I was alive at that time...but we're still stuck with politicians who act like that not because NC is particularly conservative but because we're gerrymandered AF. Thank you for the suggestions on how to protest because I feel like a lot of the politically active people in NC are listening!
The clip with Peter and Pat Buchanan was awesome!!!!!
I'm tearing up so much, thank you for having Peter on. I work with the unhoused and housing insecure population in western washington, and some of the same lack of humanity and empathy is present here with homelessness getting worse and the fentanyl crisis killing many people I know. I was so touched to learn how harm reduction became a thing and how empathetic people learned to live through situations where nothing seems to be on a person's sode while struggling. The care to combat that wickedness is equally "wicked" and powerful. And I have so much love for people who did what was right in the face of so much apathy and disdain.
Thank God for Act-Up…saved so many peoples lives.
this documentary had me in a veil of tears. Riveting.
Amazing man! I am so glad he is still here. I am old so I remember all the stuff about AIDS, it was truly terrifying, though must have been so much more so for gay men at the time. I am a cis woman and was a teenager during the worst of it. My Dad used to volunteer in a hospice for people with AIDS so my sister and I actually knew pretty early on that we couldn't get it from touching someone etc but a lot of people didn't know that so people were treated like pariahs. I remember going to some event raising money for the hospice Dad volunteered at, there were a few men that my Dad introduced us to and we shook hands with them, and Dad told me afterwards it probably meant a lot to them that he was happy for his daughters to touch them!
I'm new to your podcast but I've been working my way through a lot of your videos the last few weeks. I only just found this one, but it's *easily* my favorite so far. Thank you so much for this!
Peter is amazing and a hero in our community.
this is making me so emotional. I will forever be grateful for peter and everything he has done
this was so informative, emotional, and compelling.. thank you for sharing these powerful stories
WOW, just wow! Matt, my god, what an honor. Growing up in Utah I completely understand the passive aggressiveness and fear-mongering aspect of Peter’s experience. This was truly a gem of an interview, you make such a fantastic host. I won’t lie, I’m 36, I knew a lot of the history. But, to hear from Peter was really important. Congrats Matt, I can only imagine what this meant to you. Sending love ❤️
Peter is a fucking HERO! The Ashes Action in 1991 was a highpoint in my varied protest career. You will always be a comrade.
This brought me to tears, i have no words. Thank you matt
This is the kind of commendable, needed, important content that youtube should be showcasing and spotlighting
Not mukbangs and Reaction BS Videos.
Good for you Matt Bernstein ...
Agreed. I love a good reaction video, but I'd much prefer stuff like this rose to the top.
This was such an emotional interview to watch. Peter really is an inspiration.
I'm with the people saying that it's an honour to be able to watch this. this was incredible! thanks for bringing this to us
Ugh this episode was so good 😭 it was my favorite yet! I hope we can have more guests like Peter!
merci beaucoup pour cette incroyable interview, super travail, merci
Thank you for this wonderful interview. It’s so strange to think that younger people might not know about this history!
Seeing a young man in Act Up wearing a Keffyeh shows how far back queer support for Palestine has been going on as is not a "new trend" as some say! Very moving!
Thank you for this, Matt
This came my way entirely randomly in the recommended and it was awesome. Such a good and insightful conversation.
This is one of the best episodes of a podcast I've ever listened to, it's so incredibly eye opening, informative and moving. Peter is a hero ❤️
I'm so glad and thankful for peter to come on here and share his story, it's so important to learn
Probably the most powerful podcast episode ive ever listened to. Thank you both.
I can't believe this doesn't have more views! More people absolutely need to see this. This was a fantastic and really eye-opening episode. I love the show!
GOOD JOB ! Groeten uit Nederland/Greetings from The Netherlands ! 🌷✊🌷
Theres a Designing Women episode with the guy, not Patrick Swayze, from Ghost where Dixie Carter reams her friend a new one when she says ' these boys are getting what they deserve' So good was that episode.
I can't imagine how frustrating it would have been during the aids crisis to live in a society with people that not only didn't care but wanted people to die from it to prove a religious point. I have so much respect for men like this who stood up for what was right in such a dignified manner in a world of hateful people who had no shame or dignity what so ever. Todays world is so much different because of them.
Thanks so much for this wonderful interview. As someone of Peter Staley's generation who spent most of the 1980s and 1990s outside the US but had the privilege of getting to know a number of ACT UP (and Queer Nation) activists when I lived in LA in 1991, I appreciate his work and perspectives and self-reflections so much and am so glad he survived to tell this important story. I look forward to reading his memoir.
My uncle died of aids related illness in 1991 in San francisco (we're Canadian). I was born in 89, My family cut him out, I found out through the ancestry website that he had married a woman in San Fran, I assume for citizenship. I...wish I could meet her if she's still alive. I wish I could know who he was, what was he like? What were his hopes and dreams? What was his passion? Was he...alone in the end? Or surrounded by friends? So many questions, so far no answers :( probably won't ever get any.
My dad/family refuses to speak about him due to their shame over abandoning him I imagine, a friend who survived the crisis said that happened a lot.
Gosh. That's awful. I'm sorry to hear it. I hope he was surrounded by loved ones or at least a lovely nurse who was by his side as he transitioned.
Loved this podcast episode.
Like you, Matt, I’m 25 years old but was largely in the closet until my senior year of college during Covid lockdowns when I first had my first gay sex experience.
I spent lots of my time outside Zoom classes watching movies and tv shows like It’s A Sin, BPM, And the Band Played On, the Normal Heart, etc.
So glad I discovered this channel yesterday.
This made me sob and was so important thank you!
Love from Haarlem NL❤.. Peter Staley a Hero...
Best video yet! This is so so important
Beyond eloquent and touching. I feel so privileged to be able to witness this interview of two generations. Thank you for the work you both do!
1:23:50 I've been lucky to meet an awesome couple while working in homeless services. One of whom is an hiv positive gay man in his 50s, a survivor of the aids crisis. The man is lovable and snarky and deeply empathetic. He's talked about his meth use and how deeply tied it is his life as a gay man. He's said no one gets it who doesnt "get it". He's talked about addiction treatment, and how it has to be somewhere he can speak frankly about being gay, having hiv and meth use, or it wont do him any good. Words cant say how great those guys are and how much they are admired by me for supporting the network of fellow survivors around them. (Rest in peace to their sweet bulldog-pitt)
I got tears in my eyes many times watching this video and had to stop a couple of times. Wow.
This was a phenomenal interview
Thank you Peter, and Tim, and Larry and all the others. I lost so many friends but I lived to tell, and that is bittersweet.
Thank you so much for putting together this amazing interview !
amazing and very important episode 💕💕 tysm matt
This is a fantastic interview
This was such an important conversation to have and I really hope this conversation taught someone at least one thing. You are two incredible people and I really thank you for this conversation ❤❤❤
this was a great interview matt
Thank you to both you and Peter for this Matt
I think this is the episode i have enjoyed most so far!! Thank you so much this was a great time!!