Federal Punch 9mm VS .38 Special ULTIMATE Test
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- Опубликовано: 6 авг 2024
- This is the ultimate test between 9mm and .38 Special with the Federal Punch line of ammunition. I am testing with 10% equivalent FBI gel from 4 different barrel lengths as well as getting some chronograph averages from a 4" and 2" barrel with the .38 Special and 5" and 3.2" with the 9mm. I am also shooting these rounds from 25 yards at my 10" steel gong to test for longer range accuracy. Always appreciative of any channel help :) www.patreon.com/user?u=5828221
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This was my first time using gelatin, so I didn't realize that the clarity from the overhead camera wasn't going to be very good. Next time out I will figure out the best way to record side shots of the gel. Edit 3/29/21, this is my solution: ruclips.net/video/RZ8vwKJt4BM/видео.html
very cool dude i have a mag of 9mm hst in a 17 round g3 mag for my g2c the other three out of box i fed to my g2c and proved it functioned a mixed mag of misc ammo it ran well and that hst stuff out of 3 in barrel isnt screwing around i think its fine ammo in 9mm.
can you make a short video comparing firearm sizes. I have alot of experience with semi autos, beretta, m&ps, glocks ect but almost know nothing about revolvers. I was looking at getting a 4 inch 686 or something like that with a boot grip to conceal. but I haven't handled too many revolvers but I want to get one to conceal part time and be a woods gun part time.
@@dirtsailoroff-road5580 great idea as for the choice id say thats a great gun they work very well
If you had a board over the gel to block the sky's reflection, it should do much better.
I like the gel better, even though I did like that you simulated bone before.
Try a dark base covering. It will high light the lighter bullet tracks lit by the sky.
I believe I can speak for many when I say we appreciate your efforts making these videos. I really enjoy your content. Thank you
Thank you and thanks for watching!
The local grocer now has a surplus of baloney packs since Gun Sam has switched to ballistics gel.
To be fair, I haven't really switched, but I will use more gel than I did before obviously.
Meat pack in front of gel would be interesting.
😂
This channel is grossly underrated. Your efforts are helpful and much appreciated. These tests give us some very good information. Thanks a bunch, Sam.
Thank you.
Here is a tip regarding clear gel. You can use a heat gun on the exterior to clarify it. All the cloudiness comes from imperfections of the mold and is only on the surface layer. The heat gun melts the outermost layer and it becomes like a window. You can do this before or after shooting it.
Also, clear gel typically has 10% (actually about 8-12%) more penetration compared to pork gelatin so if you want it to be as close as possible to ballistics gel, take your clear gel depth and multiply it by .9.
Clear gel also tends to bounce back more than natural gel so if you get bullets with a channel longer than the bullet's resting place, always measure to the end of the channel and not to the actual bullet itself.
Bonus point about the Punch ammo. According to Federal, the punch line has primer sealant. Put a thin layer of clear nail polish around the case mouth and they are waterproof!
The "Jug Or Not" has become the "Gelly belly", simulating 15 inches of belly fat.
Stubborn belly fat😁
That's why we love the .38 Spl!
I take my model 36 over a sub compact block any day
It’s 45 ACP or nothing
@@memezoffuckery3207 45 AARP
@@infjintegrityvsnarcissism7295 bet you wont stand in front of one
@@randomgamer-st1ie Nope, getting shot once with a .44 special was enough
The beginning of a new era. I'll miss you Bologna pack!
I don't intend to get rid of it entirely!
@@GunSam It's what made you, you. On the other hand, you could very well show that the old test is just as good as gelatin if you shot them side by side.
Nicely done. Great idea, comparing 2 barrel lengths with each ammo. The results prove why many of us still use the 38+p for most purposes. Enough performance without being too much, and fine accuracy.
So many thoughts whirling about my mind, but DUDE!!! You are quite The Marksman. Tight groups with a .38 Snubby??? Much respect. Before being blown away by your shooting skills, I was already thinking about how impressed I was by your conceptual approach to the whole test. SO thoughtful and helpful. I carry between a Glock G19 and G26, so your comparison of the two 9mm barrel lengths really helps me. Also, my BUG is a ported 2” Taurus Stainless .38 Special. I was very interested in seeing how my 2” barrel compares to a 4” barrel revolver. Also, I much appreciate your calm delivery and complete absence of political advocacy. I’m a new subscriber to your channel, now. Thank you. Grace and Peace
Great video a lot of information on this vid! Thank you for taking the time to put it together for us!
That was definitely entertaining Sam! The ballistic gel is cool but, that new gong is sweet! It was really hard to track your shots on the old steel tank. Like a channel reborn now! Plus, I actually just purchased 9mm PUNCH ammo recently, great too see it in action. Thanks for sharing.
Excited for you next level of testing!
Outssstanding! Thanks for sharing your experience with the Federal Punch.
Thanks for the tests of different barrel lengths, revolver,
And semi-auto. Great work.
Was looking forward to this vid with the gel ! Not disappointed ! I like the overhead view !!!
Thanks, the lighting overhead is a bit less impressive than I had hoped for, so I will probably use a side camera angle for my next test with the gel.
Great review. I really liked you barrel depth gauge. Also nice job indexing those two wheel guns on double action. Revolvers rock it.
Good video as always. I really appreaciate the time and effort you put into your work. 👍
Thanks. Sometimes there's quite a bit of work, but I often don't realize it as I am so focused on the production and also having some fun.
Thanks for doing all of this testing, Sam! It really is useful info. 👍👍👍👍🇺🇸🇺🇸🇺🇸🇺🇸
Thanks for watching!
great review. thank you very much. got an opportunity to pick up some 38 special punch and did not know whether i should go for it. a little pricey at $26.99 for a box of 20. but i guess in this day and age i should get it. i have a 1.875 inch barrel s&w airweight and glad you did a 2 inch barrel test. thanks again
Great video. Very concise and informative. I found this information very useful. Keep up the good work, Thank you!
Thank you.
Excellent video. You provide very useful and applicable information. Thanks.
I have found the 9mm Punch for about 30% less cost than the HST 124.
I can’t help but give it a like because of the effort you put in
Thanks a lot brother for your work and effort , excellent video, great.
I have all those barrel lengths in those two calibers so I really appreciate the ammo review in each. Seemed to all work pretty good to me. Excellent review, thanks.
Thank you.
Love the new gong. Way better than the old propane tank. You can actually see your hits and the energy they have. Thanks you for the hard work and great videos keep them coming
Thank you. I have a ton of defensive ammo to test, like 10 boxes of Buffalo Bore various calibers and Silvertip in several calibers.
Very nice work on this test
Ballistics gel! I like it. Not that the box was a bad thing, but this is just so much more visible.
I will figure some better way to make it more visible as the shots go in.
I still preferred the bologna pack vs. just 4 layers of denim. But overall, still an awesome test! Thanks for making this video.
Wow that .38 is very impressive!
Nice video review like always sir!🇺🇸💯🗽👍🏼
Although I handload (and I'm even messing with reloading primers) I've been looking for some Factory carry/defense ammo for my 856 for some time. Found some today and it was Federal Punch. I'd never heard of it but it was the first c/d ammo I've seen in months so I bought some. It was great to get home and see some testing & now I feel good that I found it.
Thanks for the video.
I give a thumbs up to both of those loads, especially the 38.
Thanks for the testing.
I certainly enjoy watching ballistic research and the comparison between cartridges. You’re comparisons have become my favorite because you now use the chronograph and ballistic gel. Most important you compare apples to apples, you don’t show a bias as MOST do. I’ve seen people compare full power 10mm against 45acp target loads and say see 10mm is more powerful. Well look at your test median, it’s a biased test. Anyway, keep up the excellent work.
Your tests of this new breed of .38 Special ammo makes me want to haul out my 4" Colt Police Positive revolver and reconsider it as a defensive pistol. Thank you for your excellent videos.
Thanks for watching. I have noticed over the years that a 4" revolver with .38 Special is about as good as it gets for a well rounded setup.
I'm buying some of this for my model 15 combat masterpiece.
This is an interesting and fair comparison. Thank you for your presentation.
Thanks. I have since made a "gel shelf" as the overhead view was bad.
You know I thought I wanted you to start doing ballistic gel but I was wrong!!!
More top quality content. Thanks! The accuracy issue is interesting. Paul Harrell has a good video about carrying what you practice with because of this same point of impact variance issue between cartridges. The 9mm velocity is impressive but you have get them on target.
Indeed, some ammo has a vastly different POI at 25 yards.
Love your visual aid.
you're on your way to becoming the new Tnoutdoors9!! its awesome to see ballistic gel now..
I actually use to watch a lot of his videos. I found it funny as for awhile people were saying "you're a Paul Harrel Wannabe!" and it was before I knew who Paul Harrel was lol, but if at the time they would have said I was a TNoutdoors9 wanna be, I would have somewhat agreed.
@@GunSam I was swearing up a storm when he quit for the 3rd time!
@@GunSam i found your channel when Paul mentioned you, that was 3 accounts ago lol.
Agreed!
Great test - results were both expected and surprising...thanks for sharing. BTW , you are a great double action revolver shooter - that takes practice and skill to be able to ring steel with a revolver in double action...I know because I stink at it !!!
Another good and interesting video. Also nice 25 yard shooting with the two revolvers. Take care.
Thank you. You too.
Thank you Sam! nice to see you mixing it up a bit.
Thanks for watching!
Thanks for all you do
Best tid bit from this video: Always test your defensive ammo for accuracy amd pick the one that performs the best in your gun before carrying. Nice video!
Great video, testing, and shooting. Looks like a good round for defense. Glad you switched to ballistics gel. 🎩♠️☯️
Thanks. I plan to use both mediums from time to time.
@@GunSam sounds like a plan Sam.
I like the new test format. Gel and both barrel lengths. A number of people prefer the longer duty barrels with the various ammo, such as I prefer 3 and 4 in 38 spl, and would like to see the performance from other than short barrels, and visa versa.
Thanks Sam, Well done sir
That’s screamin fast out of your M&P and I’m seeing the exact same thing in my p30 longslide. I stumbled onto 100rd boxes of Winchester’s Active Duty modular handgun flat nose 115 grain ammo and its advertised is 1330! 9 of 10 were over advertised, that’s a +p+ rated military round and they are bad ass! If you see it, buy it, trust me, they are accurate and hit bowling balls like little hammers 🔨
Congrats on your first gel test. I liked it. You know what else I liked? Your camera angle on the chronograph. It's a more nature angle to my mind when you're shooting left to right. I was hoping you were going do at least one Jug-or-not test to see how well your equivalence theory held up. Nice video.
I think I probably will do a side by side of gel to jugs at some point. Sometimes my chronograph angle is different as I have to situate it in such a way that the chronograph face does not glare. But recently I been using a camera tripod that has more adjustments, so i'm able to keep it in the same spot, it's amazing as just half an inch too low or high and there's glare, but with the right angle you see the number in 3D almost lol
very nice. I've got a little S&W 640pd, 357 mag is brutal through it, looks like punch might be the best carry round of ammo that is available now. Appreciate the video!
Love all your videos. Love my wheel guns!
I have a confession....I gave this video a thumbs up before I watched the entire thing based solely on the fact that the video was done at all, considering the ammo shortage. Plus I had a strong suspicion no matter what happened in the video I was going to appreciate most, if not all of it. Of course, I was right. Thanks for the video! I definitely wanted to see what these loads would do. Excellent.
Thank you. You are the type of subscriber I appreciate, as you sort of admit you watch me to watch me, as I entertain no matter what. Some people are rude like one guy told me last night he's done and never watching again because I did this one test with gel. That's more or less saying he's using me for info, hates my personality so what might I do now isn't a use for him. So good riddance lol. I actually told him I was blocking his comments as a service to him, so he didn't feel tempted to comment on my videos from now on.
One of my go to video guys
Great video brother
Thank you
OH MY GOD !!!! You just shot all the ammo left in America !!!!
lol, I got a lot more than that
@@GunSam Don't tell people that , You'll have so many New Friends You'll not be able to get out of the house ! for well wishers wanting to borrow or buy some off You .
My Rock Island Armory m200 38 special loves the punch and puts them in a 4" circle at 50 yds, out of that 4" barrel. Good stuff
Nice job!
Absolutely satisfied with this test. (: Great video 😎🤙🏻
Thanks!
@@GunSam No, thank you!
The end of an era. Glad you’ll still be doing the old Jug Or Not too. Will be interesting to see the comparison.
Well, I don't see much of an end of an era, but maybe the big boys will take notice of my work.
I thought I was a fairly well informed shooter. I admit I have never heard of Federal Punch ammo.
It came out maybe a year and a half ago. It's more or less like how the Critical Defense is compared to Critical Duty (LE VS CCW Citizens) but in reverse order, as Critical Defense came out long before Critical Duty, but Federal did their HST for law enforcement long before their Punch for citizens.
Yep looked Good !
I bought some the last time I seen them in stock. That was about a year ago.
Impressive marksmanship w/the snub Sam
Great shot group in double action.
Great job
Nice test!
Thanks.
Many shoot gelatin. The bologna pack and jug-or-not box set you apart. Keep up the great work! Love the content and presentation.
Thanks. Did an experiment where I found the bologna/MDF pack represents 7" of 10% Clear Ballistics. This gives me a great way to get what I feel is the best testing method, but to also give a solid penetration number with.
That 5 inch with the punch is knocking on .357 sig territory....
Thank you for another great video!
I would like to see a video when you shoot the Jug or not box compered to ballistic gel with the same denim in front. Of course with the same ammo.
Thanks. I may do it just to see what happens. I think some ammo probably is exact to my claims of penetration, but it's possible other ammo might not be. And of course, fiberboard that don't make a difference on high powered rounds will make the difference on low powered rounds. So 9mm+P if I say "15 inches", this would be dead on but .380 might not expand in gel, but would in my bologna pack, this would change it up a bit, not that in general the calibration is wrong, but an expanded bullet will penetrate less.
@@GunSam That is what would be interesting to see, the difference, but also whats about the same.
Good stuff 👍
Thank you.
Great video.
Thanks
This video was excellent.. my Taurus M65 shall do great with the 4” barrel ⚡️
Earned a sub👍
Modern jacketed bullets are designed to expand at the average velocity of the intended cartridge/firearm they are used in. Higher velocity does not always give better penetration.
A real advantage of the 686 over the M&P is that you can dial in the sights to coincide with POI, with the M&P you have to match the ammo to the sights.
Good video...but the water jugs and baloney are more entertaining .. :)
Thanks, great video.
Thanks!
Appreciate this !
Great video as usual. However I personally like the water jugs more on several levels. Damage to the 1st jug and let's face it, far more entertaining. Best!
Thanks. I get a mix of reactions from, "I like gel better" to "I like jugs better". I will probably do a mix of both, maybe some in the same test from now on.
so in short: both will do what they suppose to do. Great vid. Thanks.
Thanks. Great video
Thank you.
Just for the uninitiated: point of impact issues with handguns will shift depending on the chosen ammo. If shot perfectly horizontal to the horizon, a bullet will immediately begin falling the instant it escapes the barrel. How far it falls is merely a factor of how long it is flying before it impacts. In order to hit something at a given distance, the gun barrel is actually titled up from the horizon to direct a rainbow shaped arc and ensure impact. This means the flight path will cross the line-of-sight twice if the distance is far enough.
Thanks for testing these rounds. I've seen them for sale on Gunbroker but was leery of investing in them till I saw some testing. This is a round I would buy now. I will admit that I prefer watching you get covered in bologna, but then again I don't pay for your laundry so I will have to accept the gel.
Thanks for watching. I think I will still do some bologna testing also. It's a delicate situation as my subscribers like the bologna damage, but the people higher up and seemingly more legit in testing use mostly gel. I'm a little torn. I thought about doing bologna pack, one gallon to catch the debris then gel, but someone told me any water getting into the block is bad.
@@GunSam I think your testing is more real world that gel.
damn Sam , your sure do study n get down to the Nitty Gritty. a variety of knowledge is a fruit of life
Love Federal HST, never seen punch anywhere...ammo is becoming barrel length critical...you got a keeper in the SW 9 mm...I 'd invest in green fiber optic night sights...it will improve your groups...and the 25 yard shots...have it done by a Smith who can bore sight tbe new sights...love love love clear gel for ammo videos...you are now in the upper teir of reviewers....clear gel gives consistent comparable results....someone else mentioned....you are the new TNoutdoors9..
THANK YOU for another useful test! The move to clear gel is a very good thing, even if expensive and labor intensive. At least you don't get splashed now! And no more baloney soup! Yes, better light on the gel will show the bullet trail damage from expansion better, which is the whole point, right? Me want some Federal Punch now---that was some accurate stuff!.........................elsullo
Thanks for watching. I will probably still use the bologna pack in some videos, and gel in others. Just depends on what i'm testing.
Excellent. Thank you.
Thanks!
Thanks for sharing.
I wish the ammo companies would come out with a new cartridge that would cost nothing to develop.
The 357 Special
The 38 Special is loaded to a maximum chamber pressure of 20k psi. 357 Mag is 40k psi and 9x10 is a little over 30k psi.
If they made 357 Special loaded to 30k psi and simply listed what revolver were safe to shoot it, that would be great.
I have actually thought that one out for awhile and know the solution. If someone just made a .357 Magnum cartridge, and loaded the bullet deep like a wadcutter, you would be at about a 9mm powder charge, pressure and energy with the same felt recoil, and because the case mouth is still .357 Magnum, it would not chamber in a .38 Special revolver. The only issue is that you really want a rounded nose HP for a round like that, and the case mouth with no bullet up to it, could potentially bend and then it would chamber in a .38 special revolver. The best option is the .38 Special 130 gr HST bullet, but it's a little too wide of a HP to use at velocities over 1,000 FPS.
I've waited a year for you to make this...lol. last year I commented have you got the puch .38 plus p. You said you were looking for some. I had had some at that time for personal protection
Liking and posting for the Al Gore Rhythm! Staying for the great info!
you have a very professional presentation on handgun ballistics.please , sometime do a session on the .44 magnum s&w 2.5" barell. thanks,G.C.
How much you got left would like to see both these retested through mdf and 4 layer. Because only hst imo perform great below 3.5" 9mm and this looks like it does too. Also for 2" snub I would as of now still think it good behind the underwood 125 GD but I'm sure that's more recoil in lighter snubs.
How would you rate the Federal Punch 38 special with a 2" barrel to the Remington 158 + p HTP?
I don't know how I missed this video before. I ordered a couple boxes of Federal Punch recently to see how they do in my M&P340.
It was my first ever gel test. I have tested these again after this a few times.
Good revolver action. Very accurate. I’m decent but nice groups.
Thanks
I tested the velocity on the 124 grain federal punch myself, and it stayed consistent around advertised velocity (1150) out of my Glock 19 (4 inch barrel). I wonder why you got similar numbers out of a much shorter barrel, thats pretty odd to me. Granted I used my friends lab radar chronograph and I'm not sure how accurate those particular chronos are.
Good video. Would be interesting to test your 327 Fed Mag carry rds in the gelatin for a comparison.
Thanks. Yes this would be cool to see as there really is very little info on that. I would love to see how it does in a snub VS a 9mm+P in a duty size gun, as this is a comment I get a lot like "what do you think the stopping power is for .327 Federal Magnum". While there's no way to know, if we get similar energy, penetration, bullet expansion and "wound" track to a known round, this is telling that the percentage is similar.
The 38spl punch looks like a hood performer especially from a snubnose
In my 856UL carry 130gr HST which is rated +P but has low recoil .. wondering if the 120 Punch is similar?
Is the item number for the 38 special +p, PD38P1? Also does anyone know for a fact that Federal follows the SAAMI specifications?
The woodland critters are going to be looking in vain for their bologna 😷
I took some with me in case the .38 in the snub failed to expand entirely. I never needed it, so I took it with me. A raccoon had a tear, and the birds got their tail feathers in a bunch.
Wow those r both exceptionally good short barrel rounds. I'm in need of a few snub rounds bad. Did u get sponsored by clear ballistics or just mixed it up? The 9mm from short seems almost as good as hst at least not in hard barriers and would say the .38 is up there w best of snubs prob better than lighter critical duty and on par w underwood 125 would u agree?
I just ordered clear ballistics. I have exactly zero sponsors. It's hard for me to assess how good this is as a snub nose load, I believe if I remember right that the Hydrashok was also exactly 231 ft lbs energy in this revolver, but it probably would not expand in gel. Underwood is pretty good but Buffalo Bore's version is a bit better. Honestly, I think that the Winchester Ranger 130+P is the best of the best snub nose rounds. It's sort of in the middle of the hardness of a Gold Dot and Short Barrel Gold Dot, also in the middle for weight, so it really is probably the best snub load currently.
After watching your videos for so long I pulled the trigger and bought my first snubby. S W 642. The only defensive ammo I could get was that golden saber. I saw the video where it performed not good at all. Have you tried it after remingtons restructuring. With new management maybe they improved performance. If you get a chance try some new production. Thanks for the great videos.
Thanks. I haven't tried it in awhile. I can't imaging it being changed, but who knows.
Looked like a big difference in energy on the steel plate between the 4 inch and 2 inch barrel .38's. If I could conceal the 4 inch, that's what I'd carry. Thanks, take care!
Thank you.