The Northern City Line with RMTransit
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- Опубликовано: 31 окт 2023
- The weird line from Moorgate up to Finsbury Park feels like it's been unloved and lost forever, and you're travelling along an abandoned line and stations - even though it's not! And as RM Transit was on a visit to London, I thought I'd take him along to show him around all the stations ...
Reece's Channel is RM Transit : @RMTransit
Should also acknowledge the Moorgate Train Crash from 1975. If you've never seen this excellent documentary on the subject, it's well worth a watch: ruclips.net/video/iem5zLPniTk/видео.html
Any updates from avantu
Any updates from avanti
The memorial on the corner of Finsbury Square is worth a visit too.
Yeah, the fact this crash happened there and under such strange, never fully elucidated circumstances, makes the whole Northern City Line even more eary.
Hi Geoff I was at your event last week! Thanks for the story of the old 455s and also answering my question about it!
Nothing like a Thameslink train with a front exit on it to get me excited! This was fun!
very thameslink yes
Following up on your comment on the Class 66 at Drayton Park - just occasionally, locomotives actually work down to Moorgate on test trains, see this video of Class 73s on the Northern City line in 2021: ruclips.net/video/4Q5pDVHTPXk/видео.htmlsi=o1iAb878ObE3FxRl They look somewhat odd down there...
Yeah
If you had to compare wich, train beteen the 717 and Toronto Rocket for better looking front hatch, wich would you choose?
Two of my favourite youtubers, hurrah!
Considering Reece makes a lot of videos on the best public transit in the world, seeing his reaction to London's worst commuter line is so much fun lmao
I wouldn't call it the worst but sure
@@lordgemini2376 the definitive 'worst' line in london is a matter of opinion (i mean tbh i'd rather be on the northern city line than the central in summer lol) but it's certainly up there
@@smokeyeyes__ "worst" you're all so spoiled in LDN
@@jamesjross 😅true, i don't even live in london anymore lol
The scent of those deep level passages is certainly distinctive \m/
Either way, 156 or 158 steps at Essex Road is the equivalent of a 15 storey building.
Unusual video Geoff. But I liked it! Can't wait for the next one 👍
I love how Reece is impressed by the dual-voltage system, describes Drayton Park as "nice", and Geoff dismisses the station as "you have no reason to come here" while an enormous football stadium lurks right next door! As for Essex Road, if you told me it was a front for a spy agency's outpost, I'd completely believe you.
Yeah, might have something to do with him being a spurs fan... Can't go acknowledging the enemy now!
There is, but note the poster at 08:58 saying that Drayton Park station is closed during matches... I guess the stairs being the only exit would be dangerous with lareg impatient crowds - some of which might be tempted to cross the tracks and a wall or two...
@@paulharvey9149Oh I didn't realise that! I assumed that it was one of the stations used for match days alongside Arsenal, Holloway Road and Finsbury Park. Perhaps some work on improving access and capacity would help shuttle fans in and out?
@@ricequackers It would need an awful lot of work to make it safe for match crowds. As well as narrow stairs it has a long narrow island platform (with access only at one end) - very like Claphams North and Common, except in a cutting rather than in tunnel.
@@paulharvey9149it’s open during concerts though
Reece somehow acts a lot more natural and relaxed than he does in the videos on his own channel. Thanks, Geoff, for an engaging collaboration.
Reece very relaxed when he does live stream q&a’s, maybe it’s just when he records!❤
It’s the jet lag.
"this train has too many seats" said no commuter ever.
Reece will be in the next Guinness Book of Records as the only person to ever describe Drayton Park as "nice", although being Canadian he was probably just being polite.
Haha I always used to think it was cute, and pretty too when there are hanging baskets up. Was a nice contrast between the sprawly uneasyness of Finsbury Park, and the eery dingyness of the underground section (especially pre-refurbishment). Felt like you'd briefly entered a village halt, as long as you didn't look up at the buildings towering above.
But just look at that nice, blank wall!
it is nice though.
It actually does look nice from street level, the station building at least. I've never gotten out here, despite passing through many times, and never thought it would be anything other than an Essex Road type entrance!!!
This line feels like a transit museum of sorts that is still used for daily commuting. As for Reece's suggestion at the end, i think it would be a great idea for Geoff to visit Canada and explore the transit systems in Montreal and Toronto, just to get his impressions on them compared to (real) London.
Aw man, Essex Road... I have that exact feeling when I visit that station. When you exit the train, you feel like you're transported back in time to the 1990s...the signage, the lights, the livery and the design in general looks like it hasn't been renovated for 30 years. And yes, that eerie quietness that you experience even in the middle of the day, absolutely amazing and surreal. My last visit was sometime in 2018 or 2019, when they still ran the old Class 313s down the line and had adverts that look like they date back to 2006. Even more nostalgic back then.
What I can't believe wasn't shown was the network map on the _other_ platform (only the Southbound version was shown at 10:20). The northbound one is much bigger as it shows the entire Great Northern network up to Stevenage, Welwyn Garden City and beyond...all in that retro 1990s Network Southeast design. Absolutely amazing.
My mother-in-law spent some time there hiding from the V bombs towards the end of the 2nd World War. I took here there a couple of years ago. Hardly a person off peak.
@@geofftech2why anglophone countries so bad at high speed rail
You know the old joke:
"Elevator"
"Lift"
"Elevator. We invented the damn things."
"Yes, but we invented the language."
This line gives me a creepy feeling, it always has done. I remember the first time i ventured into this railway abyss, it left its mark in my conscience.
This line just isn’t the same without the sound and smell of the 313’s! I once loved this line it felt so nostalgic.
Thanks for shining a light on Essex Road, it's one of my favorite London stations simply for being an eerie, spooky step back in time. And with Reece as an added bonus!
The Thameslink, like a lot of other lines, is a hybrid commuter -regional radial line. So having seats is important for long trips where the train is emptier
Gotta Love The Northern City Line Its Like Another Line On The Underground
The best collab in transit history doesn't exi-
When you got to Drayton Park I thought 'What? no Essex Road!'
I take this line weekly to get my children to Hornsey. It's a great line imo and Essex Road is as close to a disued station as you can get. Love it.
Interesting to hear Reece on about the rolling stock. I feel his view is very informed from a City Transit perspective (as is understandable) and slightly ignores how far the trains actually go demanding that they have seats (Although maybe ironing boards)
He'd have a point if he was talking about the sutton loop.
This is something I've actually been waiting for. Geoff Marshall and RM Transit collaboration. Please do more
I'm looking forward to a RMTransit video about how to improve the Northern City Line.
I used to buy a Red Rover tickets during the school holidays back in the sixties and go off and explore London. I lived in Finsbury Park and on one occasion took the opportunity to travel on the Northern City line which then terminated underground at Finsbury Park before the platforms were repurposed for use by the Victoria Line.
I felt that there was something unworldly about the whole line especially Essex Road Station and the strangeness included the small tube trains running through the big tunnels.
The line was so little used that at times I would be the only passenger on the train and the stations were deserted. I can identify with the feeling that you had that you were somewhere you weren't supposed to be.
Whoa, Essex Rd Station is definitely the creepiest station! A perfect Halloween video, Geoff, ha!
If you think the northern city line is spooky now, you should have experienced it in the days of Lt pre 1938 standard tube stock! Essex road was so quiet and echoey. You could hear the train disappearing in the tunnel towards Drayton park for ages!
The philosopher and the nerd. Always so much fun!
Two nerds rather, but okay :D
As someone who lives in Barnet, that whole line is incredibly useful for getting into many parts of central London & is certainly much quicker than the Northern line.
PS : And I have in the past used both Essex Road & Drayton Park stations ! 😎
The crossover we needed and the crossover we deserved. Great stuff!
Hang on a minute....
You mean to say you actually got out at Drayton Park, went up to street level, and Reece DIDN'T notice the bloody great Football Stadium next door?
Geoff, you are a Spurs fan and I claim my £10. 🤣
Why would Geoff acknowledge the mere existence of the Woolwich Trespassers?
@@markcf83 The same way we barely acknowledge the existence of the Middlesex Deniers :D
Personal view is that an upgrade to Drayton Park to allow match day use (at present it is closed due to fears of overcrowding on the island platform) would be well merited.
A more pie in the sky idea would be to extend at the south to London Bridge and turn the line into a mini Thameslink, but that would probably end up costing billions...
Upgrade to Drayton Park well overdue as it's the nearest station to Arsenal's Emirates stadium. Surety Emirates has enough money to easily cover the significant funding needed.
I once used Drayton Park in 2019 to actually go to an Arsenal match and it wasn't closed! Though, It was a Thursday night in the Europa League group stage game so nobody really attended...
Was very handy though and I got something ticked off on my list
@@miked351947 Why would they do that when there are other stations available within a short walk of the stadium? Hardly a good use of their capital.
Nice to see the Geoff x Reece Collab! Such fun 👏🏽
I travelled into Essex Road station a few months ago since I was in the area (plus I had never done it before and I was curious since I've travelled *through* the station before and was interested in how it still has its old Network SouthEast signage) and the vibe was INCOMPARABLE. It really feels like a haunted tunnel and sorts; no other underground station in London feels like it. Kinda surreal experience but I loved it.
Watching Geoff always makes me want to come to London (halfway across the country i might add) and just ride the tube all day.....
Go for it! Life’s too short, etc.
The legend about Victoria line is true. Back in the early 70s we often met North American visitors who found themselves going in the wrong direction. Most saw the funny side of it! Good sports.
Reece and Geoff,, in the same video what a great combination.
I rode on this line on the first day it reopened under British Rail. I remember being amazed at how much they had done to make it as least like a tube line as possible by stripping it bare.
The other amazing thing was riding the first BR sliding door trains. The class 313 were space-age in comparison with anything that had been on BR before. They originally had very garish interiors with the whole door vestibule in yellow. Also air suspension for the first time. The whole experience was very refined as the track had all been relayed to a very good standard, much better than anywhere on the tube.
I've been to Toronto often enough that I'd watch a Geoff video about it. But I think Geoff also could make some intriguing videos about the delightfully quirky transport system in San Francisco, with tram lines crossing cable car lines, the weird 3-rail (plus two-slot) sections of the latter over Nob Hill, trams folding up their stairs as they turn into sort of a metro system, the _X_ aspects in the traffic signals (I still don't know what it means when red and green blink simultaneously!), and the stations where tourists confuse the metro with the suburban BART system. The new Transbay Terminal is very nice, too, but it needs trains. 😏 It's honestly more of a Tim Traveller town, but if Geoff beats him, Tim could still do a California video about 'the world's shortest mountain range' (the Sutter Buttes).
The Northern City Line really is the line that time forgot, you half expect the tannoy announcements to be done by Rod Serling.
Essex Road is a bizarrely quiet station for how densely populated the area is ... maybe given how close it is to central London, and the fact that trains only go as far as Moorgate before needing to change, residents prefer high frequency buses that have better penetration across Zone 1.
Love Drayton Park for the power changeover! Great video Geoff!
Also the overgrown depot tracks opposite the platform - reckon the service pits are still there \m/
Geoff and Reece (RM Transit) together on RUclips 🌟👏🏾 The Northern City Line from Moorgate - one of the lesser-known lines in London, which is wonderful to travel on, especially on a Summer day 🚇 Really interesting how this section of line has been integrated into the London Underground map at times.
Seeing you two together always makes me happy. Much needed in these difficult times. Geoff trip to Toronto when?
This video inspired me to travel on the Northern City line today, from Essex Road to Moorgate. Thank you
Yes, we need Geoff in Toronto!
I remember my first year living in London, discovering the Northern City line at Highbury/Islington by accident. The platforms adjacent to the Vic line seemed almost abandoned or stepping back in time. It’s funny how often they refer to the vibe as being spooky, pretty spot on😂
I've always been fascinated by this line. I made a video at Essex Road when the Class 313s were still running and just before the platforms were refurbished. It was an even more mysterious station back then!
Essex Road is definitely on my list next time I’m in London! Reece looked bewildered walking through it!
During the last few years of London Underground operation, Essex Road was closed at weekends. Although opening daily from the takeover by BR, the entire line was without a Saturday or Sunday service for many years from 1986. This was only reinstated 2 or 3 years ago .
Yes! Always nice when 2 of my favourite RUclipsrs get together. Interesting choice for a video. I rode the line last year, but didn't get off at Essex Road. My only beef with it is that they took down or covered up the NSE signs on the long strip above the platform. They removed it's main quirky feature! Although it's nice that they left a few remnants at least.
When I used to work in the City - near Moorgate; used to use this line to get to Finsbury Park for the evening matches at Highbury to see the Arsenal. Very useful.
Great video! I lived briefly between Highbury & Islington and Essex Road in 2019. As a newcomer to London I had no idea about this line or its history, I lived in a ground floor flat and could hear the rumble of these trains at night time but couldn’t - in my naivety - figure out which tube line was running south to north up Essex Road!
Then I visited Essex Road station and got into one of the old class 313s, heavily graffiti’d of course. the whole experience was so surreal. Felt like I’d been transported back to the 1990s or even earlier! Great that the old signage is still in place, I hope they leave it be.
Wow ..2 Transit superstars sharing the stage... this is a very nice surprise.
Both cerebral, playful, informative and insightful.
You're both fantastic ...yes, like others are saying you have to do more collabs.
MARSHALL!!! You should go to Toronto and then ride ‘The Canadian’ all the way to Vancouver. 4 days 4 nights it’s an incredible experience. Maybe take Reece with you. Then you can meet up with @downielive in Vancouver.
This video made me realise that no passage way on the tube echo’s like the passage ways in this video, something that I’ve never appreciated before
Whato Geoff,
Didn’t you show Reece the lovely Egyptian style cinema at Essex Road? A truly entertaining bit of architecture.
Great to see a Reece collab!! Maybe Reece could take Geoff to London, Canada just for the weirdness?
I remember my first time in London in 2011, passing by Essex Road station and how intrigued I was because I was unable to find that station on the tube map :D Great video as always. Thanks Geoff!
Nothing like a bit of NSE signage to cheer up your day.
I've had my stays near Manor House and only now starting to appreciate the fact people got closer to there instead of the city center.
You should definitely take a trip to Canada, Geoff. Both Toronto and Vancouver have excellent, but different, transport systems. In between them are some great places to visit.
Oh, I would say Toronto's transport system (TTC & GO combined) is underdeveloped, rather than "excellent". Freedom of info: I've lived in Toronto and York Region since 1980.
@@watson956A fair point. I was speaking as a visitor from Britain. My wife and I made use of the subway and the easy interchange to the buses impressed us. Perhaps not so excellent to a Toronto resident like you, but it was far better than some of the cities that we have visited elsewhere in the World.
Some of RM Transit's videos have covered both the good and not so good aspects of Toronto, but hopefully, Geoff Marshall may team up with him there and do a report.
The cities in Canada that I have visited are Sept-Iles (taxis), Toronto (Subway & buses), Niagara (People Mover), Banff (walked), Jasper (walked), Kamloops (walked), Vancouver (Skytrain & trolleybuses) and Victoria (walked).
Toronto's system -- ah, bad to mediocre for a city of that size. Canadians settle for less and still have an idea that public services there are great.
@@MervynPartin I'm glad you experienced so many places on your trip!
Toronto has farther reaching transit than Vancouver (though it's also a more sprawling metro) and great bus service, but at the same time, the subway doesn't really feel like it has great coverage even though the lines are long. Frequencies are only ok and the TTC kinda sucks at communication - in stark contrast to something TransLink actually does about as well as much better transit cities
Vancouver itself is a very small city with a lot of other municipalities as part of the metro area, and outside of Vancouver itself, bus service has good coverage but poor frequency. We don't have any rail service to speak of to many of the farther suburbs unlike GO. We have a very radial rapid transit system and using more frequent / BRT-like lines to close some loops and make the whole thing less radial is an ongoing battle
I don't think transit gets quite the love it should from government here despite how many people use it
Really enjoyed Montreal's métro. Stations are kind of a blast from the past but the service is quite good and the layout is well suited to Montreal and non-radial. Found bus service to be meh but kinda the same as Vancouver, very busy
From 1978 until 1991 my regular commute to the West End from Hornsey was either by W3 bus or BR from Harringay West, in both cases to Finsbury Park to the Victoria Line. The Northern City Line in those days was plagued by a technical issue with the switch from third rail to overhead and back, and the fact that train crews starting from Moorgate had to sign on and off their shifts at Kings' Cross. It was often quicker to walk! I sincerely hope it has improved.
He’s so handsome! 😍
I thought it was only me 🙈
used to love commuting from Drayton Park. It was like my little secret - but not so fun when the trains were so full that you had to splay your feet to get on board!
transport nerd collab of the century on my favourite Line!
Yes, it's a weird underworld all of its own - made spookier by the lack branding, advertising and signage.
Not quite London Underground, not quite British Rail, not quite Network Rail, but definitely a little bit Network South East.
The ultra-bland colourless class 717s also add to the other-worldliness of it.
It's such a strange space that my wife and I actually got lost in Highbury and Islington station the other day.
Thank you guys for sharing this video that was very interesting.
new geoff video!! my day has immediately become 10x better 😃
i live near to essex road station and it really is eerie and quiet,could just sit there and read a book in peace
Good to see you guys together 🎉😊
I used to use the GNR to visit family who live near Bowes Park - it wasn’t even busy on the evening rush hour! The interchange to Northern line at Old Street is particularly spooky at night.
Best cross-platform interchange for me is either Finsbury Park Vic/Picc or Baker Street Jubilee/Bakerloo.
Anything on this line always reminds me of journeys out to Wood Green (BR), since renamed Alexandra Palace, when friends had a flat there after we all left University. The line had only just been transferred to BR and the main line trains had replaced the tube trains. The blue and grey full sized trains looked oddly out of place even though the stations had been designed for that size rolling stock. Memories of the awful crash were still strong - this was around 77 to early 80s. But I've never got off except at Moorgate, the former Wood Green and possibly Finsbury Park. Surprising that you didn't mention the huge stadium looming over the line which you can't access on most match days!
Happy to see this collab
Old Street definitely gives me vibes of some European transit networks I've been on. Might have to visit for the nostalgia!
The legendary collab we always knew we needed.
As someone who lives in Hertford and who worked in the City and then a stone's throw from Old Street station for years it feels odd to have this line described as "unloved and lost"; it was my regular commute and it was always busy and it still is at peak hours. And I still use it regularly, usually to access the fantastic connection to the Victoria Line at H&I.
I only got out at Essex Road recently for the first time; what a useful access point it is for Islington. Now that probably is a fairly well kept secret.
But I'm not a fan of the Class 717 trains. They may be capacious, as you describe, but they aren't very comfortable and the decision not to include any toilet facilities was a bad call.
I’ve just come back from a trip to London. If I’d known about this line I would have travelled on it. Maybe next time😀
Great clip 👍
Last time I was in London in 2022 I stayed right next to Drayton Park station and to be honest I actually liked the station :))
The station building looks lovely and gives off more of a village vibe and down on the platform everything is so calm
My little transport nerd brain jumped for joy seeing this haha
Brilliant video chaps - my family know it as the spooky line long may it remain that way 😱
It's nice when the big channels like RMT have time for the little guys!
RM Transit's First Appearance since the tottenham court road elizabeth line video
The pedestrian tunnel at Essex Road Station reminds me of when I found a tunnel at Sydney's Central Station, which served a strange assortment of suburban, intercity and interstate platforms. 'It feels like we're not supposed to be here' indeed. I believe it's gotten closed to the public in the recent (beautiful) renovations of the station, where they've added some metro platforms… but not to that tunnel!
The collab we all needed 🤩
yay Reece in the uk again!
I went to Essex Road recently, I was doing the three “Home Counties “ - Kent House, Essex Road then Surrey Quays ( to then go to Surrey Quays Odean , I do all the Odeons too);
I remember travelling on this line (when it was the Northern Line) in the 50's and 60's when travelling between Enfield Chase and Moorgate via Finsbury Park. My main recollection is how dingy the platforms were compared with true underground ones, and the plain trackside walls. At times we could travel via Kings Cross York Road/Platform 16 and the widened lines.
Loving these RM crossovers
Another great video Jeff! You missed Finsbury Park Station, but it's also interesting how the Northern City Line platforms became Victoria Line platforms.
Fantastic collab!
Essex Road. 12 years my local stop. I loved that stop. It was my 'lazy stop' if it was raining (or hungover). Otherwise a 15 minute walk to Highbury and Islington. That walk down the stairs at the platform was such a pain though.....
Love your channel, Geoff. Always interesting.👍😊🇮🇪🇬🇧
2:35Even though it isn't a Thameslink train, that question's a valid one. The thaneslink trains are very much designed for commuter services, with high density and very uncomfortable seating, but they work as far as Brighton, Bedford, Peterborough etc so people have no choice but to use these uncomfortable trains
The three stations you list (and Cambridge, Rainham, etc) have other services so you don't necessarily have to have the ironing board seats.
I used to travel on this line almost every day when I went to university at Moorgate. Then, when I did my LL.M. at Westminster University, I would change onto the Victoria Line at Seven Sisters.
Although I found the high-back seats the Class 313s were fitted with when WAGN refurbished them (sort of), neither they nor the 315s then used on services out of Liverpool Street were my favourites.
My favourite seacret of this line is at Moorgate where you can still see the tunneling shield in place for the never built extension to Lothbury. Lothbury is also the airvent at the end of the Docklands Light Railway, so there is an alternate reality where it all got joined up and we would have Welwyn Garden City to Canary Wharf trains!
I'd never thought of Drayton Park being similar to Primrose Hill, but you're right about their general similarities, even though they were built by different companies (I think). Essex Road is weird - the platforms are so narrow, and there's not a single advertisment panel anywhere - which rather re-inforces how few people ever go there! I trust you did explain to Reece how it was intended to be part of the Northen Heights scheme and was therefore considered part of the Northern Line? That used to puzzle the hell out of me, given the lack of southern connection!
Moorgate... that brings back memories lol Really enjoyed the video with RM Transit
I discovered Essex Road about a year and a half ago, on the back of a hideous hangover. What a surreal station that is, inside and out. Great video as ever!
The sentimental part of me really wishes it was part of the Tube still. It's always captured my interest so I loved this video.
Great collab! Love Reece's videos on transit around the world, especially the Mexico City Metro. (A bit biased since CDMX is my home away from home)
Geoff, would recommend you check out the Metro if you ever make it to CDMX. Thanks for the content fellas!
Got to say, after sitting on a Thameslink train from Peterborough to Gatwick, I hate their seats too. No seats would have been more comfortable.
Drayton Park Station is closed on match days when Arsenal are at home
I remember using that line when it was the old 319/2 stock on the line and they were filthy. Also the tunnels exiting Essex Rd and Old St were never LED lit, so it was proper dark in the tunnels, added to the no ticket barriers back in the day and it was WILD after dark.