This is a pretty good explanation of how to optimize the oil system in the Windsor blocks. I would only add a few things I can think of that I do. The lifter bores need to be mic'd because if they are worn out of spec you will have a huge internal oil leak and low oil pressure. If they are out the lifter bores would need to have bushings installed. If you have a good machine shop going over your block they will generally catch this if it is an issue but I have dealt with machine shops that would not do anything beyond exactly what you specifed in your work plan so mic checking the lifter bores needs to be listed in the plan. I also ditch the press in oil galley plugs and have my machine shop intall all threaded screw in plugs with sealer on the threads. I have mine sealed with blue loctite. I also never run factory/stock oil pumps. In the Windsor engines I run Melling 10687 standard volume PERFORMANCE oil pumps in the 289/302 blocks and 10832 in a 351W block. They are made a lot better than a stock oil pump or the standard volume regular Melling pump. You also should mention running an ARP extra heavy duty oil pump shaft even with a standard volume pump and even if the engine is not going to be rev'd hard but especially if it is going to be rev'd hard. Oil filters are not all created equal either. I use only Wix racing filters on even the mild built 302 in my truck. I know it is hard to think of totally everything when you are doing a video.
yes, this engine actually has screw in oil galley plugs, a 10832 oil pump and oil pump drive and a wix 51268 oil filter . i showed a few of those things in other videos . funny thing those melling select pumps use a standard pump housing and have a different base plate and threaded bypass valve . if you look at the housing it will say M83 for example on the 10832 windsor pump . a modified stock pump is adequate for most applications . I show how to mod a stock pump in a seperate vid . thanks for the comment sir .
Thanks buddy, I appreciate you taking your time to overview the oil flow mods that you do. Hopefully this one stays up so I can revisit it when I get my block back from the machine shop.
I'm on your side dude.. because if there's any f****** idiot who thinks that he's come up with something new. .. I'm here to tell you it ain't happened...I've been through Chrysler research and development training school....I've been through GM tech center for master mechanics... In all I've been through seven.. college-level courses.. all for engineering design & automotive.... Cuz I love the hot rod stuff..... If he's talking about chamfering your oil holes.... Well everybody in the world has been doing that since at least the 30s... ..
Blue oval dude if anybody can't see that you do your own thing then they are out of their mind I can tell you know what your talking about and I can tell your not copying off of anyone but maybe their copying off of you how about that .Not right what they did to you but keep up the good work i think you do a great job👍😊
And if he thinks the chamfering oil galleys in a block to SpeeD oil flow ain't been done either..he's dead wrong because the factories been doing experiments with stuff like that since time began
With roller lifters what oil do you use I got factory 5w15 in mine but it has very low oil pressure at ideal. Is this my oil or my high volume oil pump
Oil weight depends on bearing clearance and engine usage, there are a few guides online. The zephyr 5.H8te has DRIVEN full synthetic 10/30 right now . Very thin oil is used in drag racing where they want to get every last drop of horsepower , I would never use a thin oil in a street/strip car . I would switch to something thicker if I were you . What kind of oil pressure do you have? images.app.goo.gl/9Yi4rbBd9KveYEvXA check this out for an oil weight guide .
@@777smitty4I would Switch to a heavier weight oil and cross my fingers. That is concerning though. With a Hv pump you should have better oil pressure at idle over a standard volume pump . If a switch in oil weight doesn't work, my first thoughts are.. . . Is pump pickup to pan clearance correct ? Is the oil pump gasket blown? Are all softplugs installed (I've seen it happen from a machine shop ) and the scariest , is there excessive bearing clearance?( Fried bearings) you can lose a bunch of oil pressure just from bad cam bearings. Hope that helps you out.
Copyright on oil mods that have probably been done since the first (insert make) engine was rebuilt!?! 😂 what’s next this guys going to copyright gaping a spark plug?
Yeah , pretty silly huh . Someone feels entitled. It's not like I used someone else's pictures or videos,just me working on my own private property on my own equipment.
@@blueovaldude Oh ok I didn't know if you took it off when you were getting too much oil to the top of the motor . I ordered a few Napa golds 1268 for 8 bucks each that is supposed to flow the same as wix filters and if im not mistaken wix is the maker of the napa golds
@@79beans347 I have a few engines with the filter adapter. Yeah , if it has a similar number it probably is wix , they do use wix filters. We are a wix filter club member so I think less than $6 each filter for me . About half price of a 51515R and a better micron rating and about the same flow rate . Win win I say .
@@blueovaldude man that is cool i need to become a member so I can save money because all the other ones that I saw were 20+ bucks each so I found these marked down so i bought several off of Ebay for 8 bucks each and they had plenty more so im going to build up a bunch of them so that I wont have to worry about them for a while because I change my oil more often than recommended by factory just because I might have to do a burnout or 2 more than my daily so I show it a little extra love 😂🚗💨💨💨
@@79beans347 yeah,check it out . I usually go around 1,500 -2,000 miles on a street strip kinda deal , cheap insurance. The Endurance car, every race or every other race , depending on oil condition .
That hole in the front of the block by the distributor has nothing to do with the oiling system or drain back. It is just a place where the casting cores touch each other.
@@blueovaldude Retired Ford power train engineer here. That hole was just a consequence of how the cores are laid out In some blocks that hole is not even there it is literally a crap shoot if it is there or not. Once the blocks were vibrated clean of casting sand part of the sprue removal included giving that spot a whack with a hammer to knock it through if the casting was thin. This was done so it did not break off into the engine at a later date. 335 series may or may not have that hole as do many other blocks from various manufacturers. It is just a by-product of the casting process and that is it. The Chain and dist gear are lubricated by the cylinder head return and the cam thrust plate lubrication all they need is a bit of splash. Too much oil in the front of the engine can overwhelm the front crank seal, so do not be too quick to open that hole up...
@@matthewq4b with all due respect sir, you are not telling me anything I don't already know . The last part of your statement is just plain is not true, it is not going to cause a leak. How would I know ? Perhaps because I have been building engines and making engines survive in a hot steet,drag racing and oval track racing environment for getting close to 30 years, no front seal leaking issues to date . True the 335 series may or may not have that hole. The 335 series when used for racing purposes is famous for having terrible oil return . you need to modify the oil drain backs including that area in the china wall that may not be open in a 335. If you know what I'm talking about you must know that it is common on the 335 for guys to put a .040 hole in the front oil galley plug behind the distributor gear to oil the cam gear and distributor gear more so they do not eat gears so easily when using a HV oil pump . I don't normally reccomend a HV pump or drilling the oil galley plug . But opening up and smoothing out the hole in the china wall behind the distributor has been a successful place for better oil drain back and oiling the distributor gear and timing chain better. Also having less oil fall onto the rotating assembly makes a little more horsepower. Which is why current production engine blocks scallop oil down and away from the rotating assembly. Thank you sir.
@@blueovaldude I get where ye are coming from BUT you are only looking at short-term performance and especially race engines typically do not go 100k without being opened up. If you need to increase dist gear lubrication in the SBF drill a 0.025" hole in the oil galley plug behind the dist shaft. And really most performance applications are using rear sump pans. So that is where you want to get the oil anyway. Regardless none of this changes the fact that that hole has nothing to do with oil return and is just a by-product of the casting process. None of the racing blocks or the AL blocks have it. But a friendly word of advice since you are building performance engines you probably should not be taking material out from around that hole, especially from the bottom of the hole. If you remove material from around this hole it really lowers the stress required to split the block down the lifter valley. This hole typically is where the lifter valley split propagates from when the SBF blocks do split. If a block does have this hole it just smooth the edges to eliminate stress risers. But ideally, if you are building a performance engine if at all possible start with a block without this hole as it makes a substantial difference in the strength of the block..
@@matthewq4b well sir there are good explanations for those . Such as . The 351w normally rips the main webs out instead of splitting. Many f4te blocks have tiny cracks in the cam bearings journal area from the factory something you have to watch for in high performance use . But If you are going to make enough power to rip the mains webs out, it is time to upgrade anyway. As many guys now make over 1,000 horsepower on the stock block and rotating assm with boost and at some point it will have had enough. The world man o war block for Example, cannot have a hole in the china wall because of priority main oiling. It literally has the main oil gallery boss right in that location. It also has twice as many drain holes in the lifter valley. Why ? Because it needs good oil return. Something the factory block lacks . Which is why these modifications are done . If you are are planning on having a granny machine making leisurely Sunday drives . It need not apply . If you think I don't want or don't need an engine to last you are sadly mistaken sir . That is exactly why I do these modifications, for Longevity. I want my street cars and racecars to have to have a longer lifespan between freshen ups and it helps. The nice thing is that YOU can choose if or what you want to do or don't want to do, that is up to you. Good day sir .
Good question. It increases the efficiency of the oiling system. Better drain back gets oil back to the pan faster to decrease the the chance of sucking the pan dry, higher pressure requires better drainage. Pressure is a function of restricted flow . The bypass spring in the oil pump controls total oil pressure . Even without touching the pump , I normally see a increase of 5-10psi after mods , because oil can more easily get through the filter and filter pad and where it needs to.
That's illogical. As you stated pressure is resistance to flow. Pressure is limited by the bypass spring. Regardless of smoothing the bearings still leak the same amount and the bypass spring is still the same. Pressure cannot increase.
@@hotrodray6802 Yes,The oil pump has not changed relief pressure . But There are soo many restrictions between the oil pump and the port at which you test pressure , the pump is against the relief valve and at full pressure. For Example Let's say there is 60 psi at the pump outlet, but that's not at the test port in the block, perhaps just 45 psi at the test port . The bearings, lifters ,rockers ect are bleeding off oil faster than the restrictions between the oil pump pad and the test port can flow . which is why you see lower pressure at the test port compared to what pressure the pump is set for . If you remove those restrictions like in the video, your engine & test port will see closer to what you oil pump pressure relief is set for . I hope that helps explain it . 👍
😎👍 18:40 pressures is resistance to flow. Radiusing reduces resistance so flow increases at the same pressure. The higher the pressure the more stress on the oil pump shaft and horsepower loss. ALL excess flow will bypass, so as you noted, high volume pumps are not needed. Note also that since you can prime an engine with an electric drill at 4,000 engine rpm and using room temperature oil..... How much horsepower is the pump actually consuming? It's drill!! THINK ABOUT IT. 😁 JME/JMO
I don't understand how the guy can claim copyright when mods like that go back 40 + yrs i know i learnt it 35+ yrs ago from my grandfather
Geez, this stuff has been done for at least 60 years that I personally know of.
We were circle tracking in 59.
One of the most important modification is to drill a 0.40 hole in the front ds oil galley plug, it sprays the distributor gear.
This is a pretty good explanation of how to optimize the oil system in the Windsor blocks. I would only add a few things I can think of that I do. The lifter bores need to be mic'd because if they are worn out of spec you will have a huge internal oil leak and low oil pressure. If they are out the lifter bores would need to have bushings installed. If you have a good machine shop going over your block they will generally catch this if it is an issue but I have dealt with machine shops that would not do anything beyond exactly what you specifed in your work plan so mic checking the lifter bores needs to be listed in the plan. I also ditch the press in oil galley plugs and have my machine shop intall all threaded screw in plugs with sealer on the threads. I have mine sealed with blue loctite.
I also never run factory/stock oil pumps. In the Windsor engines I run Melling 10687 standard volume PERFORMANCE oil pumps in the 289/302 blocks and 10832 in a 351W block. They are made a lot better than a stock oil pump or the standard volume regular Melling pump. You also should mention running an ARP extra heavy duty oil pump shaft even with a standard volume pump and even if the engine is not going to be rev'd hard but especially if it is going to be rev'd hard.
Oil filters are not all created equal either. I use only Wix racing filters on even the mild built 302 in my truck.
I know it is hard to think of totally everything when you are doing a video.
yes, this engine actually has screw in oil galley plugs, a 10832 oil pump and oil pump drive and a wix 51268 oil filter . i showed a few of those things in other videos . funny thing those melling select pumps use a standard pump housing and have a different base plate and threaded bypass valve . if you look at the housing it will say M83 for example on the 10832 windsor pump . a modified stock pump is adequate for most applications . I show how to mod a stock pump in a seperate vid . thanks for the comment sir .
Thanks buddy, I appreciate you taking your time to overview the oil flow mods that you do. Hopefully this one stays up so I can revisit it when I get my block back from the machine shop.
You're welcome dude !
Always very interesting and informative engine videos! Thanks for sharing!
Dont stop dooing waht your doing God is always with you God blessyou.
Thank you !
Thanks, great information.
Appreciate it.
Awesome stuff brother! 🇺🇸💪🏼
Thank you sir!
Well done.....don't scratch that crank☠️🤘
I'm on your side dude.. because if there's any f****** idiot who thinks that he's come up with something new.
.. I'm here to tell you it ain't happened...I've been through Chrysler research and development training school....I've been through GM tech center for master mechanics... In all I've been through seven.. college-level courses.. all for engineering design & automotive.... Cuz I love the hot rod stuff..... If he's talking about chamfering your oil holes.... Well everybody in the world has been doing that since at least the 30s...
..
Blue oval dude if anybody can't see that you do your own thing then they are out of their mind I can tell you know what your talking about and I can tell your not copying off of anyone but maybe their copying off of you how about that .Not right what they did to you but keep up the good work i think you do a great job👍😊
Thank you sir.
Thanks for sharing! unfortantly their are idiots out their that try to snot things up for others.
No doubt! Thanks.
@@blueovaldude Keep up your work.
You should make a video on the 460 big block and how to mod the oiling system
It's really very similar to the Windsor block and all the same concepts can be used . Perhaps sometime in the future I can show one though.
And if he thinks the chamfering oil galleys in a block to SpeeD oil flow ain't been done either..he's dead wrong because the factories been doing experiments with stuff like that since time began
Factory ain't racing these things, they're selling cars.
I think I have talked with Paul Kane? I think he is part of my 429/460 Big blocks group on fb? Lol!! I've heard that name before?
The whole deal is pretty silly if you ask me . Lol
With roller lifters what oil do you use I got factory 5w15 in mine but it has very low oil pressure at ideal. Is this my oil or my high volume oil pump
Oil weight depends on bearing clearance and engine usage, there are a few guides online. The zephyr 5.H8te has DRIVEN full synthetic 10/30 right now . Very thin oil is used in drag racing where they want to get every last drop of horsepower , I would never use a thin oil in a street/strip car . I would switch to something thicker if I were you . What kind of oil pressure do you have? images.app.goo.gl/9Yi4rbBd9KveYEvXA check this out for an oil weight guide .
At idle it’s 10 or less give it gas it jumps to 40
@@777smitty4I would Switch to a heavier weight oil and cross my fingers. That is concerning though. With a Hv pump you should have better oil pressure at idle over a standard volume pump . If a switch in oil weight doesn't work, my first thoughts are.. . . Is pump pickup to pan clearance correct ? Is the oil pump gasket blown? Are all softplugs installed (I've seen it happen from a machine shop ) and the scariest , is there excessive bearing clearance?( Fried bearings) you can lose a bunch of oil pressure just from bad cam bearings. Hope that helps you out.
Copyright on oil mods that have probably been done since the first (insert make) engine was rebuilt!?! 😂 what’s next this guys going to copyright gaping a spark plug?
Yeah , pretty silly huh . Someone feels entitled. It's not like I used someone else's pictures or videos,just me working on my own private property on my own equipment.
dont drill the oil plug near the dizzy gear?
No sir , and I have never had a gear failure . 😀 I forgot to mention in the video that I also convert pressed in oil gallery plugs to screw in plugs .
Are u still running the T Myer oil filter adapter on your 351w
Yes I am and a 51268 wix filter.
@@blueovaldude Oh ok I didn't know if you took it off when you were getting too much oil to the top of the motor . I ordered a few Napa golds 1268 for 8 bucks each that is supposed to flow the same as wix filters and if im not mistaken wix is the maker of the napa golds
@@79beans347 I have a few engines with the filter adapter. Yeah , if it has a similar number it probably is wix , they do use wix filters. We are a wix filter club member so I think less than $6 each filter for me . About half price of a 51515R and a better micron rating and about the same flow rate . Win win I say .
@@blueovaldude man that is cool i need to become a member so I can save money because all the other ones that I saw were 20+ bucks each so I found these marked down so i bought several off of Ebay for 8 bucks each and they had plenty more so im going to build up a bunch of them so that I wont have to worry about them for a while because I change my oil more often than recommended by factory just because I might have to do a burnout or 2 more than my daily so I show it a little extra love 😂🚗💨💨💨
@@79beans347 yeah,check it out . I usually go around 1,500 -2,000 miles on a street strip kinda deal , cheap insurance. The Endurance car, every race or every other race , depending on oil condition .
That hole in the front of the block by the distributor has nothing to do with the oiling system or drain back. It is just a place where the casting cores touch each other.
If you don't modify it, oil will never be able to drain out there . Which is beneficial.
@@blueovaldude Retired Ford power train engineer here. That hole was just a consequence of how the cores are laid out In some blocks that hole is not even there it is literally a crap shoot if it is there or not. Once the blocks were vibrated clean of casting sand part of the sprue removal included giving that spot a whack with a hammer to knock it through if the casting was thin. This was done so it did not break off into the engine at a later date. 335 series may or may not have that hole as do many other blocks from various manufacturers.
It is just a by-product of the casting process and that is it. The Chain and dist gear are lubricated by the cylinder head return and the cam thrust plate lubrication all they need is a bit of splash. Too much oil in the front of the engine can overwhelm the front crank seal, so do not be too quick to open that hole up...
@@matthewq4b with all due respect sir, you are not telling me anything I don't already know . The last part of your statement is just plain is not true, it is not going to cause a leak. How would I know ? Perhaps because I have been building engines and making engines survive in a hot steet,drag racing and oval track racing environment for getting close to 30 years, no front seal leaking issues to date . True the 335 series may or may not have that hole. The 335 series when used for racing purposes is famous for having terrible oil return . you need to modify the oil drain backs including that area in the china wall that may not be open in a 335. If you know what I'm talking about you must know that it is common on the 335 for guys to put a .040 hole in the front oil galley plug behind the distributor gear to oil the cam gear and distributor gear more so they do not eat gears so easily when using a HV oil pump . I don't normally reccomend a HV pump or drilling the oil galley plug . But opening up and smoothing out the hole in the china wall behind the distributor has been a successful place for better oil drain back and oiling the distributor gear and timing chain better. Also having less oil fall onto the rotating assembly makes a little more horsepower. Which is why current production engine blocks scallop oil down and away from the rotating assembly. Thank you sir.
@@blueovaldude I get where ye are coming from BUT you are only looking at short-term performance and especially race engines typically do not go 100k without being opened up.
If you need to increase dist gear lubrication in the SBF drill a 0.025" hole in the oil galley plug behind the dist shaft. And really most performance applications are using rear sump pans. So that is where you want to get the oil anyway.
Regardless none of this changes the fact that that hole has nothing to do with oil return and is just a by-product of the casting process. None of the racing blocks or the AL blocks have it.
But a friendly word of advice since you are building performance engines you probably should not be taking material out from around that hole, especially from the bottom of the hole. If you remove material from around this hole it really lowers the stress required to split the block down the lifter valley.
This hole typically is where the lifter valley split propagates from when the SBF blocks do split.
If a block does have this hole it just smooth the edges to eliminate stress risers.
But ideally, if you are building a performance engine if at all possible start with a block without this hole as it makes a substantial difference in the strength of the block..
@@matthewq4b well sir there are good explanations for those . Such as . The 351w normally rips the main webs out instead of splitting. Many f4te blocks have tiny cracks in the cam bearings journal area from the factory something you have to watch for in high performance use . But If you are going to make enough power to rip the mains webs out, it is time to upgrade anyway. As many guys now make over 1,000 horsepower on the stock block and rotating assm with boost and at some point it will have had enough. The world man o war block for Example, cannot have a hole in the china wall because of priority main oiling. It literally has the main oil gallery boss right in that location. It also has twice as many drain holes in the lifter valley. Why ? Because it needs good oil return. Something the factory block lacks . Which is why these modifications are done . If you are are planning on having a granny machine making leisurely Sunday drives . It need not apply . If you think I don't want or don't need an engine to last you are sadly mistaken sir . That is exactly why I do these modifications, for Longevity. I want my street cars and racecars to have to have a longer lifespan between freshen ups and it helps. The nice thing is that YOU can choose if or what you want to do or don't want to do, that is up to you. Good day sir .
Just curious, do these mods increase or decrease oil pressure? Thanks.
Good question. It increases the efficiency of the oiling system. Better drain back gets oil back to the pan faster to decrease the the chance of sucking the pan dry, higher pressure requires better drainage. Pressure is a function of restricted flow . The bypass spring in the oil pump controls total oil pressure . Even without touching the pump , I normally see a increase of 5-10psi after mods , because oil can more easily get through the filter and filter pad and where it needs to.
That's illogical.
As you stated pressure is resistance to flow. Pressure is limited by the bypass spring.
Regardless of smoothing the bearings still leak the same amount and the bypass spring is still the same.
Pressure cannot increase.
@@hotrodray6802 Yes,The oil pump has not changed relief pressure . But There are soo many restrictions between the oil pump and the port at which you test pressure , the pump is against the relief valve and at full pressure. For Example Let's say there is 60 psi at the pump outlet, but that's not at the test port in the block, perhaps just 45 psi at the test port . The bearings, lifters ,rockers ect are bleeding off oil faster than the restrictions between the oil pump pad and the test port can flow . which is why you see lower pressure at the test port compared to what pressure the pump is set for . If you remove those restrictions like in the video, your engine & test port will see closer to what you oil pump pressure relief is set for . I hope that helps explain it . 👍
😎👍
18:40 pressures is resistance to flow. Radiusing reduces resistance so flow increases at the same pressure.
The higher the pressure the more stress on the oil pump shaft and horsepower loss. ALL excess flow will bypass, so as you noted, high volume pumps are not needed.
Note also that since you can prime an engine with an electric drill at 4,000 engine rpm and using room temperature oil..... How much horsepower is the pump actually consuming? It's drill!! THINK ABOUT IT. 😁
JME/JMO
Edit:. Volume is limited by the bearing clearances... Pressure being equal.
All the oil in the world won’t help if you make enough power to pull the main Webs out of the block. 🤔
🤔 Probably time to upgrade the block at that point. Lol