I've never thought to put capo on and tune down to create a shorter scale length. You sure are full of knowledge Randy. Thanks for sharing this concept with us.
with a capo on the second fret of a 25.5" scale, you have shortened the scale by over 2.75" which drops the string tension far lower than it would be on something more typical such as 24.75". The top is being way under-driven with the capo setup/tuning.
using the shorter scale sucked the life right out of the guitar. thanks for sharing this. This has solved an issue i have been having with a short scale guitar. much appreciated.
That is something else! I could definitely hear a difference. I can hear that it wasn't made to be a shorter scale guitar. Very interesting video, Randy.
Its quite a noticeable difference, funny thing I've noticed too it seems like the better the guitar sounds normally, the worse they sound when you do what I did in this video to them. Seems that way to me anyways. Thanks for stopping in Dale.
Hi Randy!! Very useful info, i do agree, the scale length is so important, it affects sound, playability, resonance, tone, guitarist's humour, everything on an acoustic! guitar! all the best my friend!
It sure does, every one of those things you mentioned! Someone on Facebook was talking about bass, most bass players I've talked to prefer a long scale length and say it really helps with the bass ringing out. Thanks for tuning in my friend!
Hello mate. Need to know is it theres a particullar scale lenght that need watch out, for example i replace my 21 frets guitar neck to 24 freted guitar neck?? They said is not possible because there is a particullar scale lenght of a guitar. And i disagree, for me if your going to replace your 21 freted guitar neck from 24freted guitar neck, i know it wont work anymore on E standard tunning because the tension would be to much to the string. But if your going to lower the tunning like, A standard for me that might work? I want to know what is your input on these argument?? Thanks mate.
On the off chance someone sees this (like maybe Randy)...I have an old Epiphone FT-160 12 String I bought a long, long time ago when I was in Uncle Sam's Canoe Club (aviation arm) that I've always detuned to D and then capo'd it back to E to keep the load off the neck and bridge (still had to take the bridge off and reglue it recently and I'm shimming the neck to make up for the slight belly it and I have gained over the years). What does everyone recommend for a string height measurement in that configuration?
Hey Randy - just wanted to say thanks for all the great videos lately. I'm learning a lot and appreciate all the good content. I've been playing nothing but electric for the past couple years, but there is something about country and bluegrass on an acoustic that makes me want to get mine outta the closet.
I've been on that road before too! lol Back when I played banjo I would switch from bluegrass to southern rock on electric guitar, played in bluegrass bands on banjo and rock on electric at the same time for about 10 years. Finally I went with banjo until I quit around 1988 and started back on acoustic guitar in 2009. So yep, get that acoustic out! :) Thanks for tuning in brother!
Good video! I do a mixture of both. I have small hands, so the frets being closer together is nice, but I use medium strings to get my tension back up :) and get the sound I like.
Thanks, Randy! Beautifully presented. My arthritic fingers prefer shorter scales and fewer strings, so I've been having fun with Baritone Ukuleles - also known as the "Cuatro" in Latin America. Some of the cigar box 4-strings are a hoot, too. We even built a solid one with an epic piezo sound. My question to you is what you expect to happen if the shorter scale is accompanied by a change of strings to maintain similar string tension?
@@JR-pr8jb - Yes! The critical element seems to be finding an instrument/configuration that suits you. I have always struggled with Guitaleles and Banjars, but my daughter took to the Guitalele immediately. But then, I'm the one with the huge hairy hands and increasing arthritis!
It is a good way to see I have an idea for a guitar that has to do with scale it gives different sounds to. Like short is better treble long is better bass so I have an idea that I will be doing with an acoustic frist. And then I'll do the same with an eletric acoustic would be better to hear the different. Good demonstration though I actually had been searching this.
Mine too! I guess a shorter scale would be handy on electric guitars if you want the strings to bend easier but on acoustic it effects the sound. Thanks for viewing Dale.
I own an Eastman e20d guitar witch sounds absolutely beautiful. the problem is that with a capo the sound rapidly gets worse. I understand that's normal because the strings are shortened. However: a friend owns a Gibson J45 With a capo on the J45 the sound also gets worse but not as bad as on the Eastman. Is this caused due to the string tension? I thought that maybe because of the shorter scale length and less string tension on the J45 the strings vibrate easyer when capo-ed on the 7th fret and therefore sound better. Can you tell me if this is true or absolute nonsense?
a lot of variables contribute to this, guitars tops are tapped tuned to resonate best around a certain frequency, usually a440, but, not all of them are, because of this difference guitar will react differently in different frequencies. the J45 may sound better than yours when capo'd up, but your might sound better than the j45 tuned lower such as drop d tuning. I hope this sheds some light on it. thanks for watching.
Interesting. A good example of the more rounded short scale sound is the Hummingbird. Much more balance and mid ranged, less twangy, and good smooth strummer, ideal for recording.
No it is you measure from the nut to the 12th fret then 12th fret to the bridge or double your first measurement. It works because of the capo acting as the nut. He knows what he's talking about.
Hi Randy! Great info! I agree....do you think that the capo might be muffling the sound a little? Hey you saw my last Harmony! i'm looking at a Rocket now! ;-) I just can't help myself!!! Hey, i've been trying to get used to a heavier string guage too..It'll take a minute! Take care! ;-)
Thanks mate! I don't think the capo is muffling it as much as the shorter scale length. Cool on the Rocket! Search my channel for Harmony Rocket, I worked on one a few months or years lol back and videoed it, the thing was in mint condition!
oh I watched that video a long time ago! ;-) yeah, that was a beauty! the one I'm looking at is a little rougherl, but that's what I do....save old worn guitars that are on deaths door & resurrect them! cheers!
Important information, especially for the uninitiated ! * Even though it's contrary to 'logic' - you would 'think' that longer strings would be easier to bend , but they're under higher tension to hold pitch , which = more work to bend them ! ( I go short scale on electrics )
haha I have thought about that too exactly as you described it, you would think because they are longer they'd be easier to bend. I go shorter scale too on electric guitars, or did when I owned them.
Randy...I closed my eyes and really tried to listen. That particular guitar sounded richer and fuller on the longer scale. On the other hand the shorter scale sounded a little more ( exciting?)
yessir you would be correct! longer scale the strings are going to be tighter when tuned to the same pitch of a short scale. thanks for checking it out!
Man how do you remember all of this? lol. I try but I can't remember it. Have you ever heard of DADGAD tuning? lol. Randy a guy near me has s Martin HD35 for two thousand dollars. its about 2 years old. He also has A 2016 Martin D18 for sixteen hundred dollars. I being try to trade it up with him for my truck. What do you think about thoes prices?
I guess because it's been bored into my head for so many years lol Yes I love that tuning, I can't play anything in it but love listening to those who can. Both of those prices sound very good but its hard to say without seeing the guitars and inspecting them. But that sounds fair if they are in good shape.
Thomas Tommy Look at the logos on the headstock and compare them with Martins from the same years or close, and look how the bridges are made and compare that too to Martins of the same year, get specs on them if you can and also compare those. Not very many Martins are fake unless they are the copies from the other side of the big pond.
I made a video today showing my guitar collection. 3 guitars :D Also I have been watching a British lady who restored an old parlor guitar. It was a great series of videos and I learned a lot. Her name is Susan Gardener. You might like to check her channel out.
I'll check out your video shortly. Yeah I watcher her restore that old guitar too, she did an awesome job on it. I hope she makes a video playing it soon, I'd love to hear more what it sounds like. Thanks for tuning in John.
That happens to me a lot! I start missing someones uploads, I go check and sure enough have to sub them again, I wish they'd fix it. Thanks for stopping in! :)
Because it took time to retune, usually people don't like it because it drags the video out too long, they seem to prefer short videos so that saved me a little time.
Yeah I thought about ordering one of them from there so I could show how to detect them when looking at new guitars. I might try to do it yet if enough funds available. Thanks for watching Thomas.
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I've never thought to put capo on and tune down to create a shorter scale length. You sure are full of knowledge Randy. Thanks for sharing this concept with us.
You're welcome Josh, thanks for checking it out! It makes the guitar chord a lot easier and more comfortable but sacrifices a little tone.
with a capo on the second fret of a 25.5" scale, you have shortened the scale by over 2.75" which drops the string tension far lower than it would be on something more typical such as 24.75".
The top is being way under-driven with the capo setup/tuning.
Randy ur the coolest! Thanks man for all your great informative videos.
Analogies and alternate descriptions to the same concept really help it t be understood easier. Thanks!
using the shorter scale sucked the life right out of the guitar. thanks for sharing this. This has solved an issue i have been having with a short scale guitar. much appreciated.
That is something else!
I could definitely hear a difference. I can hear that it wasn't made to be a shorter scale guitar. Very interesting video, Randy.
It really does make a difference, more on acoustics than electrics but yep. Thanks for checking it out Ben.
Thanks for the insight. I was tryna figure out the difference.
Randy I wanted to ask you about gragh techs the black XL nuts it said it coated with PTFE is it good or bad or is the white one better Thanks FLOYD T
Good video Randy. I knew that scale length has an effect on the playability but never thought about the difference in tone on an acoustic guitar.
Its quite a noticeable difference, funny thing I've noticed too it seems like the better the guitar sounds normally, the worse they sound when you do what I did in this video to them. Seems that way to me anyways. Thanks for stopping in Dale.
Hi Randy!! Very useful info, i do agree, the scale length is so important, it affects sound, playability, resonance, tone, guitarist's humour, everything on an acoustic! guitar! all the best my friend!
It sure does, every one of those things you mentioned! Someone on Facebook was talking about bass, most bass players I've talked to prefer a long scale length and say it really helps with the bass ringing out. Thanks for tuning in my friend!
Hello mate. Need to know is it theres a particullar scale lenght that need watch out, for example i replace my 21 frets guitar neck to 24 freted guitar neck?? They said is not possible because there is a particullar scale lenght of a guitar. And i disagree, for me if your going to replace your 21 freted guitar neck from 24freted guitar neck, i know it wont work anymore on E standard tunning because the tension would be to much to the string. But if your going to lower the tunning like, A standard for me that might work? I want to know what is your input on these argument?? Thanks mate.
which is the better on 18 frets on 21 frets acoustic guitar
With my aviation destroyed ears it seamed like the shorter scale seams deeper fuller more mellowed. Did I hear this right?
On the off chance someone sees this (like maybe Randy)...I have an old Epiphone FT-160 12 String I bought a long, long time ago when I was in Uncle Sam's Canoe Club (aviation arm) that I've always detuned to D and then capo'd it back to E to keep the load off the neck and bridge (still had to take the bridge off and reglue it recently and I'm shimming the neck to make up for the slight belly it and I have gained over the years). What does everyone recommend for a string height measurement in that configuration?
Good info brother! That guitar sounds really good! Rock on!
This guitar vibrates all over when played! I wish I'd kept it. Thanks for viewing brother! Cheers!
Good explanation, thanks for that Randy.
You're welcome mate, thanks for viewing!
Hey Randy - just wanted to say thanks for all the great videos lately. I'm learning a lot and appreciate all the good content. I've been playing nothing but electric for the past couple years, but there is something about country and bluegrass on an acoustic that makes me want to get mine outta the closet.
I've been on that road before too! lol Back when I played banjo I would switch from bluegrass to southern rock on electric guitar, played in bluegrass bands on banjo and rock on electric at the same time for about 10 years. Finally I went with banjo until I quit around 1988 and started back on acoustic guitar in 2009. So yep, get that acoustic out! :) Thanks for tuning in brother!
Good video! I do a mixture of both. I have small hands, so the frets being closer together is nice, but I use medium strings to get my tension back up :) and get the sound I like.
@@JR-pr8jb That’s where I’m at home too!! Yamaha has some great options and my 00015M by Martin is my most comfy guitar.
Good Vid Randy - I am sure this is going to help many people to consider scale length as an important factor when choosing a guitar...Thx Up!
I hope it does help them, depending on the genre of music could make a big difference for them. Thanks for stopping in Cesar it is always appreciated!
I like both scale lengths for different reasons....thank you for the video. :D
I like short best on electric guitars but don't play much on electric anymore. Thanks for viewing Suzanna! :)
Good video Randy, I like short scale I play mostly finger style. 🎸🎸🎸👍🏼👍🏼👍🏼😊
Thanks Steve! I've been working on my finger style lately, almost forgot how lol
Thanks, Randy!
Beautifully presented. My arthritic fingers prefer shorter scales and fewer strings, so I've been having fun with Baritone Ukuleles - also known as the "Cuatro" in Latin America. Some of the cigar box 4-strings are a hoot, too. We even built a solid one with an epic piezo sound. My question to you is what you expect to happen if the shorter scale is accompanied by a change of strings to maintain similar string tension?
@@JR-pr8jb - Yes! The critical element seems to be finding an instrument/configuration that suits you. I have always struggled with Guitaleles and Banjars, but my daughter took to the Guitalele immediately. But then, I'm the one with the huge hairy hands and increasing arthritis!
Great Video and thanks for the information..
Thanks for checking it out brother!
It is a good way to see I have an idea for a guitar that has to do with scale it gives different sounds to. Like short is better treble long is better bass so I have an idea that I will be doing with an acoustic frist. And then I'll do the same with an eletric acoustic would be better to hear the different. Good demonstration though I actually had been searching this.
Dude I love your channel. You just triggered an epiphany, I don't need to keep looking at OOO models. I can just use the capo on my OM :)
Another interesting video, Randy! Again thumbs up :-) Cheers......Jenny
Thanks for checking it out Jenny! Wishing you a wonderful day! Cheers! :)
That really made an incredible difference in the sound. It was like two completely different guitars. The longer string length gets my "thumbs up".
Mine too! I guess a shorter scale would be handy on electric guitars if you want the strings to bend easier but on acoustic it effects the sound. Thanks for viewing Dale.
I own an Eastman e20d guitar witch sounds absolutely beautiful.
the problem is that with a capo the sound rapidly gets worse.
I understand that's normal because the strings are shortened.
However: a friend owns a Gibson J45
With a capo on the J45 the sound also gets worse but not as bad as on the Eastman.
Is this caused due to the string tension?
I thought that maybe because of the shorter scale length and less string tension on the J45 the strings vibrate easyer
when capo-ed on the 7th fret and therefore sound better.
Can you tell me if this is true or absolute nonsense?
a lot of variables contribute to this, guitars tops are tapped tuned to resonate best around a certain frequency, usually a440, but, not all of them are, because of this difference guitar will react differently in different frequencies. the J45 may sound better than yours when capo'd up, but your might sound better than the j45 tuned lower such as drop d tuning. I hope this sheds some light on it. thanks for watching.
Interesting. A good example of the more rounded short scale sound is the Hummingbird. Much more balance and mid ranged, less twangy, and good smooth strummer, ideal for recording.
Hi Randy, interesting info.
Have a great Tuesday,
Cristina
Thanks Cristina! Wishing you a wonderful day as well! Cheers! :)
Nice info Randy.
Thanks Jerry!
It sounds life more definition or separation of the notes with the longer spacing..
Its in standard d tuning with capo on second fret.i always tune to standard d and capo up.
Good demo Randy! Cheers mate:-)
Thanks for checking it out brother. Cheers!
Think I'm glad I have a 25.5. Man, I think I'm starting to learn some stuff! Thanx.
That's what this guitar has 25.5, I wouldn't want any shorter on acoustics. Thanks for viewing Scott glad the videos are helpful.
Tuning down and putting on a capo, is no way to demonstrate the sound-difference from two different scale lengths.
Why not? At least this eliminates other differences which are impossible to account for...
He retuned the guitar with capo on to 440 which is logical.
It actually IS the way
No it is you measure from the nut to the 12th fret then 12th fret to the bridge or double your first measurement. It works because of the capo acting as the nut. He knows what he's talking about.
I hear it! Definitely.
Totally changes the tone for sure!
Hi Randy! Great info! I agree....do you think that the capo might be muffling the sound a little? Hey you saw my last Harmony! i'm looking at a Rocket now! ;-) I just can't help myself!!! Hey, i've been trying to get used to a heavier string guage too..It'll take a minute! Take care! ;-)
Thanks mate! I don't think the capo is muffling it as much as the shorter scale length. Cool on the Rocket! Search my channel for Harmony Rocket, I worked on one a few months or years lol back and videoed it, the thing was in mint condition!
oh I watched that video a long time ago! ;-) yeah, that was a beauty! the one I'm looking at is a little rougherl, but that's what I do....save old worn guitars that are on deaths door & resurrect them! cheers!
Did you use a Dremel to shorten the scale then glue it back on?? Hehe good stuff. Regards to you and Q-Ball. Peace.
No I just used a hand saw it was quicker lol thanks for viewing mate! :)
Sounds great @ 25.5 not so great shorter, good info I never quite understood it before. ☕️
I couldn't agree more! Even if I took time and set it up for that scale length it still wouldn't sound as good. Thanks for tuning in mate!
Important information, especially for the uninitiated ! * Even though it's contrary to 'logic' - you would 'think' that longer strings would be easier to bend , but they're under higher tension to hold pitch , which = more work to bend them ! ( I go short scale on electrics )
haha I have thought about that too exactly as you described it, you would think because they are longer they'd be easier to bend. I go shorter scale too on electric guitars, or did when I owned them.
I had a short scale 24.75 that sounded horrible. Went right back to the 25.5.
Randy...I closed my eyes and really tried to listen. That particular guitar sounded richer and fuller on the longer scale. On the other hand the shorter scale sounded a little more ( exciting?)
yessir you would be correct! longer scale the strings are going to be tighter when tuned to the same pitch of a short scale. thanks for checking it out!
Man how do you remember all of this? lol. I try but I can't remember it. Have you ever heard of DADGAD tuning? lol. Randy a guy near me has s Martin HD35 for two thousand dollars. its about 2 years old. He also has A 2016 Martin D18 for sixteen hundred dollars. I being try to trade it up with him for my truck. What do you think about thoes prices?
I guess because it's been bored into my head for so many years lol Yes I love that tuning, I can't play anything in it but love listening to those who can. Both of those prices sound very good but its hard to say without seeing the guitars and inspecting them. But that sounds fair if they are in good shape.
yes I just seen pictures of them. But they look like new guitars. What do I look for to make sure there not fake Martin's?
Thomas Tommy
Look at the logos on the headstock and compare them with Martins from the same years or close, and look how the bridges are made and compare that too to Martins of the same year, get specs on them if you can and also compare those. Not very many Martins are fake unless they are the copies from the other side of the big pond.
Yes, but you shortened the scale by at least 2 inches, whereas a short scale guitar is usually about .6 - .7 inches shorter.
A capo sounds different because you now have a metal nut. It is always twangy when a capo is usef
Standard was waaay twangier, so your point is wrong
Standard just has a fuller sound imo.
Cool. short scale you can bend a chord sometimes.
Yes! lol bend the whole chord! I forgot about doing that. Thanks man!
Smart
I made a video today showing my guitar collection. 3 guitars :D
Also I have been watching a British lady who restored an old parlor guitar. It was a great series of videos and I learned a lot. Her name is Susan Gardener. You might like to check her channel out.
I'll check out your video shortly. Yeah I watcher her restore that old guitar too, she did an awesome job on it. I hope she makes a video playing it soon, I'd love to hear more what it sounds like. Thanks for tuning in John.
Hello Randy, youtube unsubbed me from your channel, ugh! :/ cool infos, happy week! :)
That happens to me a lot! I start missing someones uploads, I go check and sure enough have to sub them again, I wish they'd fix it. Thanks for stopping in! :)
Man I don't PayPal. If there is another way let me know. If every one gave a dollar.......
Shorter scale more resonance, longer scale more sustain
I don't get it, am I missing something , why do you need to go away to put a Capo on and off !
Because it took time to retune, usually people don't like it because it drags the video out too long, they seem to prefer short videos so that saved me a little time.
Oh now I see, many thanks for your reply
This video is complete waste of time, you just stated the obvious repeatedly for 6 minutes, thats great, thank you.
Then why you waste even more of ur time AND mine posting this stupid moan and piss comment Mary? Lol
Thanks for the advice.Yes there are a lot of fake Martin's out there now. They are coming from China. Thanks for the tips.
Yeah I thought about ordering one of them from there so I could show how to detect them when looking at new guitars. I might try to do it yet if enough funds available. Thanks for watching Thomas.