DF Retro: Shadow of the Colossus - The Ueda Collection Part 2
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- Опубликовано: 29 сен 2024
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John revisits Shadow of the Colossus, revealing early concept work, deep-diving into the brilliant technology, then moving on to the best way to play this PS2 classic today.
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Oh hell yes. DF retro is amazing. You guys make me so happy to be an old school gamer (I'm 30). Keep hitting me with the waves of nostalgia, please. I think you guys have one of the best channels on RUclips.
Scott Douglas Get a life.
***** Nah. I'm a zombie.
***** Zombie says "Run forest Run!!!"
Scott Douglas I tried doing something new. I do that daily.
holamoco It fits. Thanks man! Your tip worked!
I feel like the imperfections in the PS2 version were a huge part of the visceral experience of the game, neither the remaster nor the remake truly capture the atmosphere of the original.
Yeah definitely. I really would have liked it if the remake captured that muddy and desolate look of the original. I think what we ended up getting was too pretty and clear.
If that atmosphere are implayable performance then yes.
@@StrazdasLT Beat the game many times on PS2 and many others have, so theres that.
@@Henry14arsenal2007 Theresp lenty of sadomasochists around.
Lol imagine being a game dev, you pour your heart into the art of your game, you slave away at the combat and boss design, you craft an evocative, enduringly thought-provoking narrative, all of that just to see all your hard work handwaved aside by nostalgic doofs on the internet who for some reason attribute your game's worth to its single-digit framerate. Rose-tinted glasses are real.
Hey, thanks for the mention! Your video is very impressive in its technical details as how the colossi were created in the PS2 version. i.e. the lighting, shadow effects and colossi fur/skeletal models! Awesome work - loved the video ; )
That Bluepoint port, they are just the best.
Great video.
True Pride I dont remeber that FPS issues in MGS3, and I played in xbox 360.
HDR used in TVs actually is essentially the same technology in play here. Bloom filters are applied to compensate for highlights too bright to be displayed, but that only happens because internally those highlights are still being rendered at much higher levels. As such, if this game was released on PS4, for example, they could natively output those higher levels on an HDR TV without needing to apply the bloom filters, or at least change the cutoff point to where bloom gets applied to 1000nits or higher.
I just have to say that I subscribe to DF purely for these Retro videos. Sublime and expertly made, this really is a quality show. I love it! Even when you're talking about some random DOS game I've never heard of, I'm fascinated by your presentation. The history, the impact, variations and performance of the games... It's a genuinely impressive production each week. Please keep up this excellent work!
I think the best thing about digital foundry is df retro. No matter how long each episode is I always watch it in 1080p max brightness max volume it's just that gripping.
The amount of work you put into this DF Retro videos is simply outstanding. Highly entertaining stuff, thanks a lot!
OMG i've been playing it this week for the first time on my PS3!
It's already one of the most epic and majestic games i played on my whole life, just loving it!
Only the last colossi left now 😊
People don't realise how clever and ambitious these games are.... It's how games should be.,pushing new boundaries.....
Hanniffy Dinn yeah they were really ambitious but I cant help the feeling that most PS2 Exclusives really suffered using this rather weak platform. I was multiplattform because PS2 had FF and this but boy would this game have been better on xbox, gamecube or even PC.
@@bingobongo1615
That lack of pixel shaders and lack of VRAM probably hurt more than just the performance. The massive fill rate and VRAM bandwidth of the PS2 enabled the fake motion blur, fur, volume shadows (these are very fill heavy compared to modern shadow mapping techniques) and heavy dust effects in play, which would probably buckle the otherwise-stronger Xbox.
The Vector Units could be used as a psuedo Vertex Shader, which is probably what enabled the Inverse Kinematics to be used (pretty certain the
Hanniffy Dinn there some ways to do this effectively... According to digital foundry you dont wanna push the console to the limit,.
Even the smallest things can make all the difference.
Take a look at Metal Gear Solid 2
Man.. that music always gets me.
You've analysed the game that has kind of changed my life, and I want to thank you for that.
What a way to end a DF Retro season.
Loving Digital Foundry, the work you guys been doing for the last years makes the difference and it´s completely necessary. Keep it up.
Still better frame rate than ARK in consoles
It will, hopefully, get better over time, Remember how bad Unreal Engine 3 was when it first came out? every bit as bad, if not Worse, than UE4 is at the moment, now its one of the most.. "Solid" Engines out there... I am not making Excuses for UE4, it is an absolute Pile of Shit at the Moment I agree and in need of some serious Optimization Work! I am just saying it Should, Hopefully, get better! .
This is one of my favorite games of all time.
Best RUclips video of the week right here!
I believe that music is one of the gems of the game.. One of the best scores ever
Keep it up man. DF Retro is pretty awesome. I hope this series continues! :)
HOLY SHIT That Halo Ending with the music was SO FUCKING HYPE
I knew nothing about this game or ICO and bought it on a whim because the box art screenshots looked interesting. Little did I know, the game my PS2 just loaded was going to be one of the best games I have ever played in my entire life. I still remember the first time I ran into the first colossi...I believe I said something like "holy shit........" as it was walking towards be with his massive club, lol. #NeverForget
I love these DF retro videos. This game is incredible, I own the PS3 version and I'm going to have to replay it again.
We need to get hanging on Colossi's back with VR!
played this game in 2007 when i was 8 and it was a truly amazing experience, wish i could go back
The rendering for close vs far is exactly what VR is going to do by tracking your eyes.
A technical masterpiece on PS2.
If this is a technical masterpiece for Ps2 then wow, I'd like to know what Ninja Gaiden and F-Zero Gx on the Xb and GameCube are.
@Spiral I have a ton more respect for the Ps2 now then I used to. Plenty of beautiful games on it.
I was a bit salty of the systems huge success as a teen (gc and xb owner) and it kinda bled into adulthood until I've been playing so many more games these past 5 yrs on it. Tons of great content.
DF Retro is the best show ever!
I've always said there is no better horse in a game than in SOtC. Agro had so much character and controlled brilliantly.
I remember when this game launched, i was super amazed with the graphical quality, and now that i see it its like, EEH. Damn you PC for spoiling my eyes!!!!
Easily one of my favorite series to watch on RUclips. Looking forward to the Halo episode next year. Just hearing the music from Halo 1 brings back lots of good feels!
This game... what a masterpiece..
Masterpiece, I always felt kinda bad when I killed each colossus, the animations are so good that you can feel the suffering and the pain and somehow feel guilty after those epic battles. Oh, and Agro is the best friend a game character could have.
Amazing series, and holy crap i got goosebumps from just hearing the Halo music!
I've still got this when it was free on ps plus back in. 2013
AGRO
I've been waiting for this!
Very nice video to one of my all time favorite games. Now please do a MGS 1-3 retro.
Can't wait for the Halo episode. DF Retro has been a great series. Hope you guys will also cover MechWarrior 3 and 4.
I'd love DF retrospective on either Ninja Gaiden, Okami, Killer 7, F - Z ero GX, Metal Gear Solid 3 or Jet Set Radio Future next. Heck, I hope a'' those classics are conered eventually! :)
Still has better frame pacing then every soulsborne game.
Ps2 = ♥
MUST LIKE BEFORE WATCH!
Man, congrats! Keep up!!!
A masterpiece.
The 3rd distance layer is just a flat texture? *Earth Waifu:* "I'm not flat!"
Will you please make an episode of this with MGS 3 Snake Eater? Comparing the versions? Or the entire saga, if you're feeling it. MGS3 was a very similar case to this, in it the remastered HD Collection was a HUGE upgrade over the original PS2 one.
Oof, that framerate in the PS2 version! It definitely seems like the remaster has made the original somewhat obsolete.
halo ce was the first fps i ever played on my older bros OG xbox, the intro scene blewy mind in so many ways, the open sandbox shooting, musical score, and presentation was top notch. shame of the current state of the series
I do wonder if running the original Shadow on a ps3 through backwards compatibility gives any noticeable improvements, like display res, framerate, or visual effects. I am also curious if the tweaks and tricks used in the original game to get to areas you weren't supposed to work on the HD re-release ;)
now i have to try the game
Great video.
I know that's the fps is bad at the ps2, but at that time gamers use to enjoy the games not arguing about how have the better system , or wither a game hit 60 fps, I have a ps4 the normal version and the last guardian is running 23-30 fps and I'm very ok with that, please enjoy the games
I wish they would rerelease the Ico/SotC remaster on PS4. Get it closer to x86 for future's sake + just let me have and enjoy them again, on the one system I have. PS Now streaming was ok for letting my cousin finally play the game, but isn't ideal.
Maaan, I really wish there was a way to play this on ps4 w/o having to get PS now
Alejandro H. I hope it's not to far off.
Too bad Sony isn't cool like MS and includes BC
Same here. I'm hoping maybe Sony will release the PS2 version, it should run at 1080p60 based on the other emulated PS2 games released. That said, there have hardly been any PS2 games released on PS4 (and very few are good ones), so I don't know what the hold up is.
Alejandro H. ps now is just stupid
photographboy ikr... hopefully they will add SOCOM
wish they had a trilogy option for ps4.
damn i remembered when the ps2 was one of the most precious things in my life. I defeated the first colossus, but i never really gotten into the game. maybe it is just not for me.
What was the first game to use this fir rendering technique, I wonder? I'm sure I remember an original Xbox game trying it.
Too bad the PS3 version is considerably much harder. But Shadow of the Colossus is one of my all time favorites.
Digital Foundry, PLS PLS PLS MAKE A VIDEO ABOUT THE NEW PATCH ON BF1 TO SEE IF THE FRAMERATE HAS BEEN IMPROVED SINCE THE PATCH NOTES INCLUDED IMPROVE PERFORMANCE ON CONSOLES
Loved the video, insta-like
A great game for DF-RETRO would be Killzone Mercenary for the vita.
To this day i have no idea how such a Game can run in that system.
That my friend would be the result of an incredibly well optimised engine. Guerilla took the specs for their Killzone 3 engine and heavily modified it specifically for the Vita.
MGS 3 pls!!! it's most technology game on ps2!!
Thanks for the kickass series this year, John! Loved all of the episodes, although I have to say the DF Retro over Silent Hill 2 is probably my favorite.
Enjoyed this on the PS3 collection and im really enjoying The Last Guardian on PS4, these games are like a work of art, amazing games.
RubberDuckerFuckerBerg get the fuck out of here.
Hold on... ICO, NICO, TRICO?
Actually TRICO have sense, TR (Third) chapter of ICO. N-ICO can means New ICO, so, yes, it's connected in some way.
it was called Nico because Ni actually means two in Japanese, so that Trico thing seems to be on purpose.
QUADCO?
Quintco, and of course.... SEXCO
Seeing this game has me really interested to see a DF retro on MGS2's original release as well.
MGS 1-3 definitely deserve to appear in these series.
Agreed, MGS 1-3 please DF Retro
Cantabile I just finished playing through them, so I'd love that as well. Maybe even show a bit of the Twin Snakes version too.
MGS and then Gran Turismo 3/4 please.
You're pretty good
MGS3 and SoC are masterpieces of end era of PS2. Dear DF team can you deep-dive into MGS3 also?
This game's OST is godlike, truly an amazing achievement on it's own!
The music always get overlooked. The soundtrack is so important to this game.
All the 3 soundtracks are beautiful. One better than the other.
DF retro makes Sundays so much better.
Work tomorrow? back to the daily grind. We all know it :(
And I have a test tomorrow. :)
Happy Monday everyone. :)
Ps2 runs on 10-17fps
,,awww what a great console, my childhood omg"
PS4 runs on 54-60fps
,,OMFG WHAT SCAM, SHITTIEST CONSOLE IN THE WORLD"
Ps4 is 25 fps lol
Rias Lucifer you mad you have no really good exclusives 😂 lol
Adolf Hitler not all games but some do 😜 deal with it
any console can run at any fps they want.
Most PS4 games run at 30fps
Remember playing that game, and my Dad asked, what movie is this?
WilliamDsk arkam night
I never thought i would say this but the low frame rate on PS2 actually adds to the scenes. It feels like the world can't cope with the size of those things and makes them feel even heavier. It works a bit like slow-mo i would guess. Or maybe i'm crazy and need to revisit the game to see, it's been a long time since i played it but i remember not having a huge problem with the frame rate and i'm a frame rate person.
Imgema sounds like nostalgia goggles excusing the fact that a lot of classic games ran much worse than any game released today...
No, i was a frame rate guy even back then. I did notice the frame rate being bad. But unlike other games where it did bother me (Perfect Dark for instance) in this game i didn't mind it.
This game had revolutionary visuals and animations, the framerate is understandable
the last guardian? not quite
Transition from one over-complicated system to another came at its cost.
you guys should do a Df:retro on silent Hill 3
I still haven't played this, an error I intend to fix over the holidays.
Great video as always
Play it...your gaming life gonna be changed forever...
Long Tran I've genuinely meant to play it for years.
Owned it briefly on PS2 but was burgled. I only ever owned PS3 at the end of the gen & never got to it.
Burgled is such an awesome word, sorry to hear that though, I feel it is the loss of the feeling of security that is the worst when burgled, not so much, the loss of possessions, though it sucks as well.
Honestly I'm still amazed at how the PS2 version managed to run as well as it did
God, please make a DF Retro on Morrowind! :>
Morrowind Xbox, PC, Xbox 360 emulation, Overhaul 3.0.
When SotC was released in 2006, I had played Morrowind 4 years before and I was playing Oblivion right then. Wasn't impressed at all by the open world of SotC.
Great idea! They could also analyse Daggerfall and it's impressive technical features for the time.
not gonna happen, this is a sony chanel, ive been waiting for gothic 1 and 2 about 6 months.
+Stefan
They critique graphics, performance and development here. The PS Pro, and the development going into enhancing games that are getting patched almost weekly are taxing this channels work load. The XBOX One has had every game that has come out analyzed as well, so who's Fanboying, You or DF? Also, The Last Guardian is the perfect excuse to do a retro video on two very relevant classics. The same way XBOX One had almost all their backwards compatible games that see improvements compared to their 360 versions. The evidence is clear, you're crying about nothing.
"this is a sony channel" did you see the end of the video?
A masterpiece on every level. The visual design, game design, sound design, and storytelling are all done so beautifully.
the big problem with the HD remaster is that there is a bug with grappling. Wander in the HD remaster is significantly more sensitive to shaking from the colossi, so some are more difficult than they should be to kill.
Does the PS3 version actually have some physics bugs with regards to getting thrashed around on colossi, or is it really just my imagination? I swear that it's A LOT harder to stay on, and I sometimes get thrown around with barely any movement on the part of the colossus. There were times when I was being shook all the time, without stopping, till my stamina ran out and I fell :/
Also does the PS3 version have higher LOD distance or just better LOD quality? (popin is more noticable due to the sharper image though)
Poki#3 yeah the ps3 version is harder
look at the sotc wikia
it's confirmed
but i like it
I just got it for the PS3, planning to play the shit out of it during Christmas :)
Same here! Can't wait to try out these fantastic games! :D
DeMichel
Bro i'm playing it right now, for the first time! Bought the Ico HD Collection my PS3 months ago, already finished ICO, but not this yet.
Only the last Colossi left 😊
Just prepare yourself, this is one of the greatest experiences in gaming i ever had, it's a masterpiece.
I just got it as well! Platinum trophy, here I come!
NecromancerAdr
Finished it today 😊
What a blast of a game! Epic from the beginning till the end, one of the most beautiful games of my life.
Insane battles with the colossi, amazing story and ending. The atmosphere is so unique and breathtaking.
I hope not to overhype you bro 😂😂😂
NecromancerAdr
By the way, forget the platinum in this, is extremely hard and play the game just to totally experience it and not focus on trophies, at least in the first playthrough. My advice 😉
So why do people care about fps? Back then if 20 fps was fine why complain so much about 30?
Sahal Sidat Because 20-30FPS is fucking garbage?
Back then many games had fixed cameras and it didn't look as bad
But it's fucking 2016
Why don't we live in fucking caves?
bait
because those games werent made to run at 60FPS, just at 30FPS, which is a big deal,thats why the 6th generation is the best
-frame rates didnt matter
-full game on the disc
-no delays
-BC
60 FPS just isn't enough anymore.
I remember buying this game purely based on the box art - and I LOVED this!
I hope they do an HD remaster on ps4 someday.
SOTC in 3D on the PS3 is amazing. I hope if they ever remake it for the PS4 they include the 3D option.
I really enjoyed 3D, to bad it didn't catch on with the mainstream.
Agree. I think especially in videogames it looks awesome, even more so than in movies.
Yeah... and that 14 fps fluid experience in 3D mode.
I probably sound weird here, but I actually like the low frame rate in the PS2 version. For me, it gave the game kind of an old movie feel to it, and I feel it meshes well with the game's aesthetic and presentation.
I love what they did with the HD version, don't get me wrong, it's just that there was something unique about the PS2 version that isn't easily replicated in... well... any kind of game out there really.
outstanding video! Team Ico pushes the PS2 hw beyond to its maximum... even issues like low framerate , SOTC is so impressive for that time.
I fucking loved this game
DF Retro has become my favorite part of this channel. Can't wait for more in 2017
To be completely honest, I couldn't give a shit about Halo, but I will watch it because I like to see the technical analysis and to support this series.
I always imagined and dreamed new Zelda game in open world to be like Shadow of Colossus and decade later BoTW kind of delivered it.
can you do Silent Hill 3 next??
I always wonder: why people hate so much screen shimmering resulting from lack of mip-maps and texture filtering? For me it's the part of the package you get - the way how game is supposed to look. All these HD remakes look bland and barren without those screen imperfection and higher resolution for me. Textures suddenly are blurry, stretched mush when mip-maps and filtering are added to ps2 games and models look blocky and choppy. Playing SH2/3 without those rendering imperfections feels really lacking for me. Yeah, it's low res and imperfect but that's the part of the PS1/2 charm
Yep. These games are meant to be played on the ps2.
If no mipmaps mean no texture blur at a distance, just that there'd be some shimmering, seems to me like mip maps are now useless with 4k+ resolution.
Masterpieces like this will never come to PC
Andrew dude get out from your cave.. pcsx2 exists
Reyhan Farabio Good luck with shitty old ps2 version which looks even worse on pcsx2
Lmao at thinking Shadow of the Colossus is clunky or a walking sim
well, dark souls eventually made it. But yeah, this likely won't.
Fuddy Duddy Dark Souls was never an exclusive.
It was impressive on a PS2 sure, but it also runs more choppy than an N64 game.
I think Goldeneye and Turok 3 can get lower than this iirc.
Goldeneye single goes down to 10, and multi goes into single digits. Don't know the fps counter for Turok 3 though.
DF Retro is hands down the best series on RUclips. Absolutely love it. Keep up the work John!
Best "Experience" I had in a game ever was playing SotC. Love it.
This game looks amazing but I'm not sure I can stomach killing the colosi. They just seem to be wandering around, doing nothing wrong, peacefuly minding their own business. Unless they have a background I am not aware of, that justifies ending their existence.
Its like hunting in FarCry games, I hate to kill deers and small critters just so my stupid avatar can carry more guns and ammo.
the colossi are not live being they are incarnated seals for this reason appear from nowhere, dormin saids it from start, a lot of people are wrong about this subject and is one the kindest games in the story,you cant compare this with games like zelda, is more violent than this.
Psygnosis DD I don't know, you tell me bro
Maiti Dukku You're not alone.
I loved this game.
I hope The Last Guardian gets a remaster. It would be awesome to play it again with a steady 30 or 60fps, HD textures, and improved controls and camera.
I shouldn't have to buy a PS4 Pro. In fact, I just bought a PS4 slim, and the textures look okay from a distance, but when you get up close, you can tell they're not on par with other PS4 games. It's not a matter of opinion, it's a fact which stems from the troubled development of the game. All I'm saying is that someday, maybe when Sony's next console comes out, it would be nice to have a remastered version of this. I'm thinking something like the ICO/SOTC remaster or The Last of Us Remastered, how they updated and released them on the next console.
***** You misunderstood me. I didn't say I wouldn't have to buy a new console. In fact, I specifically said I would expect such a remaster to be released on Sony's next console. What I'm saying is that I shouldn't have to buy a PS4 Pro just to get acceptable performance out of a PS4 game. PS4 Pro is just a slightly more powerful PS4 that gives performance boosts to existing PS4 titles, but it's a luxury, really. Since games are designed for the PS4 platform in general and not specifically the Pro, they should run acceptably on both consoles.
For some reason I prefer this on the PS2 to the PS3 or PS4 remakes...
One of my favourite games of all time, it really is a great achievement,
A really special game.