I knew Howie Carlson from back in the sixties when i was an FDNY auxillary and just couldn't beleive i happened upon this. I had heard he passed away. He sure was a great guy.
Nothing against the new rigs. I love the new Ferraras and Seagraves, Hell, Rescue 1 "Outstanding" Pierce was magnificent. But I love these old vintage Mack Rigs and these documentaries!
I met Chief Carlson after the passing of his father-in-law in Louisville, KY. He was a great man, and I truly enjoyed the short time that I was able to know him. The entire family on both sides are great people. I miss his phone calls, where he would call and ask me how I was doing to get the formalities out of the way, then proceed to tell me of the latest big jobs. He certainly loved the fire service. Thank you for posting this. Rich Bliven, Capt. E32 Louisville, KY
God bless those men who put their own lives in danger for us, on the Tonka truck, to run into a fire when all are running out of the fire, to me I just can't put it words. God bless bless all those men who put their own lives in danger for us. Thank you guys. Frankie t. Bronx County.
It does actually mention in a way why it is called the Tonka Truck, because while others where zapped of energy these guys seemed to carry on, ie indestructible. I doubt the company would be that bothered about a FDNY Rig carrying there name, good advertising for free lol
So each man has a specific job on the truck and that never changes? he will ride in the same position/do the same job every shift? Do they ever ride on an engine or stay on the ladder all the time?
I believe that you are a firefighter in the UK or in Oz. Is that correct? Assuming so, I'll give you the L-O-N-G answer. When this was filmed, a typical Truck Company, ( i.e., Ladder Company) probably had at least 25 firefighters assigned on their roster. The Company has a commander, the captain. He has 3 lieutenants. Either a captain or a lieutenant is on duty each tour and supervises unit operations. Each firefighter is assigned a position during roll call at the beginning of the tour. The positions are: Can man, Irons man, (who together comprise the forcible entry team & accompany the officer under his immediate supervision), then there is the Roof man, the Outside Vent man, and the Chauffeur These 3 are under the company officer's functional supervision via personal radios. These positions may (but not always) gain access via the exterior. However, their actual positions are determined by the type of occupancy, and the order in which their unit arrives on the scene. For example, 2 ladders, 3 engines 1 battalion chief are typically assigned to respond to phone alarm reporting a building fire. The the 2nd truck company arriving on the scene already knows that they have a different position than the 1st just by virtue of their being assigned "2nd due." And, individual firefighter positions vary depending on the type of structure. For example, the Roof Man does not go to the roof at a fireproof high rise multiple dwelling. He would go to the apartment directly above the fire and bring a life saving rope. Today, a fire curtain is also brought to the apartment above to deploy over the fire apartment window ,as necessary, in wind impacted fires. Company policy, or the particular officer working may determine how the positions are assigned. Often, it involves seniority and/or experience. Sometimes firefighters from other units are detailed in for a particular tour when there is a vacancy caused by medical leave etc. Sometimes firefighters swap tours, both from within the fire company or from without. If a firefighter is assigned to an Engine Company finds himself working in a Truck, he would typically be assigned "the can" so he will be under the direct supervision of the company officer... because as an Engineman he probably doesn't have the same experience at forcible entry or conducting searches as that's not what Engines are tasked to do. And keep in mind, Truck members have no hose line to follow. And in situations, such as being assigned to the floor above the fire in a non-fireproof building and having to force a door and conduct a search by feel prior to a line being in operation can be challenging. Don't even ask about what happens when Truck members work in Engine Companies and they catch a good job. Rumor has it that sometimes "the stretch" isn't exactly as smooth as silk. Now the short answer is...no guys aren't always given the same assignment... with the exception of when a senior chauffeur is working. I hope that this answers your question.
*David Tirions* You are quite welcome, David. I hope that it was more helpful than confusing! I think that there are many misunderstandings regarding how different fire departments are organized & operate. I hope that you enjoy your career over there in Antwerp!. Take care.
If you are assigned to an engine or ladder, that is where you remain. You could elect to transfer to one or the other if you wanted. The duties are assigned by the Lieutenant or Captain at the beginning of the tour.
*emt5330* 1. Are you claiming that a guy can't be detailed into another unit at the beginning of a tour in order to balance manpower? 2. Are you claiming that a guy can't get detailed out in the middle of a tour to a different unit ANYWHERE in the city because of vacancy caused by an injury during that tour? 3. Are you claiming that a guy can't get hired on overtime (in order to meet minimum manning requirements) and sent to another unit for an entire tour? 4. Are you claiming that a guy can't be given a detail of 60 or 90 days for the express purpose of cross training in either Truck or Engine? 5. Are you claiming that a guy can't swap off a tour (mutual exchange) with a member of another unit thereby causing each participant to work in a different company for that tour? 6. Are you claiming if a guy owes the city a tour (due to an incomplete mutual) that he can't be sent to a different unit in order to repay that tour depending on the needs of the Dept.? Also, are you claiming that in some units preparing the riding list (BF-4) isn't delegated to the senior man, (typically the chauffeur) especially when there is a covering officer working? Kindly elaborate. I look forward to hearing your answers.
Is anyone a FDNY fireman from this time period? Id like to know why mack got out of the firetruck business? Somebody told it was the warranty that FDNY wanted on all the new rigs. It was killing their profits.
semper fi Mack stopped building fire trucks in 1990. I'm pretty sure the fdny contracts didn't help. they came pretty close to folding back then. nobody ever got rich building vehicles for NYC. talked to a Seagrave dealer once, he said that it's so one sided in favor of the city, any excuse to not pay. they use. they took the contract so they could market to other departments. it was worse with NYC transit read about Pullman and Saint Louis car.
Mack was part of Renault and Volvo by those years. Fire Apparatus building was about 1/2 of 1% of their business. Hardly worth the effort to continue research, development and modernization of the fire business for that size of business. EPA never helps any either. Look at today...EPA has destroyed the ability to get any chassis you want and diesel engine.
If we had painted anything like that on the station or appliance in the '70's we would be at the employment exchange within the next 24 hours. Even now there is zero chance of it ever happening. We were as happy as pig's in muck even though the pay was crap and the hours long but we didn't need to paint cartoons on the station.
Too bad there wasn't esprit de corps; sounds like a boring nanny state. That type of micromanagement is usually a function of small dep't. size and low call volume; larger departments have bigger things to worry about. It is the same in military; front line/ special operations units have more latitude, while rear echelon/ support types adhere to rules and regs. If you want thoroughbred horses in your stable, you can't treat them like field mules. I have always questioned how an agency convinces the public that they can trust the men with their lives, but not to make an appropriate choice on superficial things like a logo. I was fortunate to have a different experience in life; especially since we only get one career. Did you stay in that environment for long, before moving on?
Unfortunate that they spent so much time writing disciplinary regulations and policies, and didn't spend more time developing procedures for response to bombings and continuity with police; they could improve upon their 2 hour response time.
Small departments it's more about the look where as in FDNY it's all about the team and the effort by them to do their job. I came from a smaller department and no we couldn't do anything like that unless it was so small nobody else saw mainly the Mayor and city council. I toured many FDNY houses years ago and I will tell you this they are a tight group of firefighters unlike anything I ever saw here in the midwest. I was itching to send a letter back home saying screw you I'm staying in NY to be a firefighter.
@@davidsuperdavelarson6174 Look up his little department, the Greater Manchester Fire Rescue. It is the one who didn't show up at a sports arena bombing, then claimed they didn't know about, ROFLMAO! I was fortunate enough to work in the golden age of New Orleans Fire Department, during Hurricane Katrina, when FDNY sent 300 men down here. Many are still friends today.
Wish i had a new Mack as a rehab all volunteer operated unit.Our 2008 International is a real piece of junk.We can't buy new because we have virtualy no help from our governments, and yes i live in a relatively rich country; Canada!
I started out on a Mack CF600. Best friggin firetruck ever. The Mack aerialscopes were the best trucks. 34 years on the job here. This is a great "look back" for me. I really miss the 3/4 boots and canvas coats...lol!
I knew Howie Carlson from back in the sixties when i was an FDNY auxillary and just couldn't beleive i happened upon this. I had heard he passed away. He sure was a great guy.
Nothing against the new rigs. I love the new Ferraras and Seagraves, Hell, Rescue 1 "Outstanding" Pierce was magnificent. But I love these old vintage Mack Rigs and these documentaries!
Who doesn't?
Nothing beats the old trucks, the new ones may be shiny and nice but no one builds them like they used to.
My father Neil Donnelly was in ladder 124 for many years
I met Chief Carlson after the passing of his father-in-law in Louisville, KY. He was a great man, and I truly enjoyed the short time that I was able to know him. The entire family on both sides are great people.
I miss his phone calls, where he would call and ask me how I was doing to get the formalities out of the way, then proceed to tell me of the latest big jobs. He certainly loved the fire service.
Thank you for posting this.
Rich Bliven, Capt.
E32
Louisville, KY
God bless those men who put their own lives in danger for us, on the Tonka truck, to run into a fire when all are running out of the fire, to me I just can't put it words. God bless bless all those men who put their own lives in danger for us. Thank you guys. Frankie t. Bronx County.
They used them till the mid 90's... Chicago just switched over around 06'-07' I wish they bring them back
I believe this truck is in service in Dillsburg, PA now, refurbed with a new cab and whatnot
I was born about 2 decades too late.
It does actually mention in a way why it is called the Tonka Truck, because while others where zapped of energy these guys seemed to carry on, ie indestructible. I doubt the company would be that bothered about a FDNY Rig carrying there name, good advertising for free lol
Another awesome video! thanks for posting it!
1:33 That Mack Ladder is beautiful.
love the tonka mack truck
Just a few names of the past Barney Devlin, Eddy Fulford, Lenny Smith, Jimmy Connelly.
I just saw a fire truck with TONKA124 number plate on Nat Geo 9/11 documentary. I wonder if this is the same truck.
Same Company- TL-124. Different rig, the one after the Mack in this video.
nice!!!!! keep up the good work!!!!!!!!
FDNY has had the same siren for many years.
Is it a requirement that all New York cops and firemen have a moustache?
Tucson arizona would not even enter any old buildings like that. Everything is done on the outside. To old to dangerous.
So each man has a specific job on the truck and that never changes? he will ride in the same position/do the same job every shift? Do they ever ride on an engine or stay on the ladder all the time?
I believe that you are a firefighter in the UK or in Oz. Is that correct? Assuming so, I'll give you the L-O-N-G answer.
When this was filmed, a typical Truck Company, ( i.e., Ladder Company) probably had at least 25 firefighters assigned on their roster. The Company has a commander, the captain. He has 3 lieutenants. Either a captain or a lieutenant is on duty each tour and supervises unit operations.
Each firefighter is assigned a position during roll call at the beginning of the tour. The positions are: Can man, Irons man, (who together comprise the forcible entry team & accompany the officer under his immediate supervision), then there is the Roof man, the Outside Vent man, and the Chauffeur These 3 are under the company officer's functional supervision via personal radios. These positions may (but not always) gain access via the exterior. However, their actual positions are determined by the type of occupancy, and the order in which their unit arrives on the scene.
For example, 2 ladders, 3 engines 1 battalion chief are typically assigned to respond to phone alarm reporting a building fire. The the 2nd truck company arriving on the scene already knows that they have a different position than the 1st just by virtue of their being assigned "2nd due." And, individual firefighter positions vary depending on the type of structure. For example, the Roof Man does not go to the roof at a fireproof high rise multiple dwelling. He would go to the apartment directly above the fire and bring a life saving rope. Today, a fire curtain is also brought to the apartment above to deploy over the fire apartment window ,as necessary, in wind impacted fires.
Company policy, or the particular officer working may determine how the positions are assigned. Often, it involves seniority and/or experience. Sometimes firefighters from other units are detailed in for a particular tour when there is a vacancy caused by medical leave etc. Sometimes firefighters swap tours, both from within the fire company or from without. If a firefighter is assigned to an Engine Company finds himself working in a Truck, he would typically be assigned "the can" so he will be under the direct supervision of the company officer... because as an Engineman he probably doesn't have the same experience at forcible entry or conducting searches as that's not what Engines are tasked to do. And keep in mind, Truck members have no hose line to follow. And in situations, such as being assigned to the floor above the fire in a non-fireproof building and having to force a door and conduct a search by feel prior to a line being in operation can be challenging.
Don't even ask about what happens when Truck members work in Engine Companies and they catch a good job. Rumor has it that sometimes "the stretch" isn't exactly as smooth as silk.
Now the short answer is...no guys aren't always given the same assignment... with the exception of when a senior chauffeur is working. I hope that this answers your question.
azul8811 thx for the long version.
I enjoyed it very much, greetings from the Antwerp Fire Departement.
*David Tirions*
You are quite welcome, David. I hope that it was more helpful than confusing! I think that there are many misunderstandings regarding how different fire departments are organized & operate.
I hope that you enjoy your career over there in Antwerp!. Take care.
If you are assigned to an engine or ladder, that is where you remain. You could elect to transfer to one or the other if you wanted. The duties are assigned by the Lieutenant or Captain at the beginning of the tour.
*emt5330*
1. Are you claiming that a guy can't be detailed into another unit at the beginning of a tour in order to balance manpower?
2. Are you claiming that a guy can't get detailed out in the middle of a tour to a different unit ANYWHERE in the city because of vacancy caused by an injury during that tour?
3. Are you claiming that a guy can't get hired on overtime (in order to meet minimum manning requirements) and sent to another unit for an entire tour?
4. Are you claiming that a guy can't be given a detail of 60 or 90 days for the express purpose of cross training in either Truck or Engine?
5. Are you claiming that a guy can't swap off a tour (mutual exchange) with a member of another unit thereby causing each participant to work in a different company for that tour?
6. Are you claiming if a guy owes the city a tour (due to an incomplete mutual) that he can't be sent to a different unit in order to repay that tour depending on the needs of the Dept.?
Also, are you claiming that in some units preparing the riding list (BF-4) isn't delegated to the senior man, (typically the chauffeur) especially when there is a covering officer working?
Kindly elaborate. I look forward to hearing your answers.
Is it a requirement that all FDNY and NYC cops have a moustache?
Is anyone a FDNY fireman from this time period? Id like to know why mack got out of the firetruck business? Somebody told it was the warranty that FDNY wanted on all the new rigs. It was killing their profits.
semper fi Mack stopped building fire trucks in 1990. I'm pretty sure the fdny contracts didn't help. they came pretty close to folding back then. nobody ever got rich building vehicles for NYC. talked to a Seagrave dealer once, he said that it's so one sided in favor of the city, any excuse to not pay. they use. they took the contract so they could market to other departments. it was worse with NYC transit
read about Pullman and Saint Louis car.
Mack was part of Renault and Volvo by those years. Fire Apparatus building was about 1/2 of 1% of their business. Hardly worth the effort to continue research, development and modernization of the fire business for that size of business. EPA never helps any either. Look at today...EPA has destroyed the ability to get any chassis you want and diesel engine.
That’s why pierce won’t bid on contracts. The warrantee work kills them. KME lost the last contract for engines , couldn’t deliver .
The Renault buyout. Not enough profit.
If we had painted anything like that on the station or appliance in the '70's we would be at the employment exchange within the next 24 hours. Even now there is zero chance of it ever happening. We were as happy as pig's in muck even though the pay was crap and the hours long but we didn't need to paint cartoons on the station.
Too bad there wasn't esprit de corps; sounds like a boring nanny state. That type of micromanagement is usually a function of small dep't. size and low call volume; larger departments have bigger things to worry about. It is the same in military; front line/ special operations units have more latitude, while rear echelon/ support types adhere to rules and regs.
If you want thoroughbred horses in your stable, you can't treat them like field mules. I have always questioned how an agency convinces the public that they can trust the men with their lives, but not to make an appropriate choice on superficial things like a logo. I was fortunate to have a different experience in life; especially since we only get one career. Did you stay in that environment for long, before moving on?
Unfortunate that they spent so much time writing disciplinary regulations and policies, and didn't spend more time developing procedures for response to bombings and continuity with police; they could improve upon their 2 hour response time.
Small departments it's more about the look where as in FDNY it's all about the team and the effort by them to do their job. I came from a smaller department and no we couldn't do anything like that unless it was so small nobody else saw mainly the Mayor and city council. I toured many FDNY houses years ago and I will tell you this they are a tight group of firefighters unlike anything I ever saw here in the midwest. I was itching to send a letter back home saying screw you I'm staying in NY to be a firefighter.
@@davidsuperdavelarson6174 Look up his little department, the Greater Manchester Fire Rescue. It is the one who didn't show up at a sports arena bombing, then claimed they didn't know about, ROFLMAO! I was fortunate enough to work in the golden age of New Orleans Fire Department, during Hurricane Katrina, when FDNY sent 300 men down here. Many are still friends today.
Wish i had a new Mack as a rehab all volunteer operated unit.Our 2008 International is a real piece of junk.We can't buy new because we have virtualy no help from our governments, and yes i live in a relatively rich country; Canada!
I started out on a Mack CF600. Best friggin firetruck ever. The Mack aerialscopes were the best trucks. 34 years on the job here. This is a great "look back" for me. I really miss the 3/4 boots and canvas coats...lol!
I love the Mack CF.