@@joshuahuff607 We can infer it for one major reason. Eönwë was the highest ranking entity present at the war and he was just a maiar, hence Sauron was told he had to go to Valinor to face judgement. If Tulkas or Ulmo was there then this wouldn’t have been an issue.
Balrogs did not have wings, they had a veil of shadows which in Fellowship is described as "wing-like."You would not describe actual wings as wing-like, just as you would not call an object "branch-like" if it was a branch.
A lot of people tend to automatically hand it to the balrog because it's a maiar. But it wouldnt just automatically win because of some arbitrary power level chart. Tolkien's universe doesnt tend to work like that. Youre incorrwct saying you can "prove it" just because of this. I believe it would be situational and depend on the environment.
The most powerful elves in the first age were crazy strong, an elf name Fingolfin even had duel with Morgoth and wounded him multiple times before losing and dying.
@@Kissamies1exactly! which crumbles the argument that the balrog automatically wins because of some nonexistent power level tier chart. Exceptional elves can kill balrogs and wound a valar. So can a dragon.
Balrog would win. Dragons are a creature of flesh and blood, hard to penetrate their skin but it can be done. Balrog are a demon of fire and flames, and a dragons fire wouldnt hurt him.
The logic that the Balrog is older so it is stronger than Smaug is moot. Ancalagon was also younger than the Balrogs but no Balrog could stand before him. He was Morgoth's greatest weapon. Also, elves have killed Balrogs in battle while being significantly less powerful and less old. We have to study their battle feats for a more accurate comparison.
There' a train of thought that Morgoth embodied Maiar spirits when breeding the original Dragons. Some say that Maiar dont breed, but against this argument Melion was a Maiar who bore Thingol a daughter. So i'm inclined to think that some Maiar maybe fire spirits like the Balrogs, were embodied into the Dragon making process. This would circumvent the problem of the imperishable flame not being needed to create life. Also the Balrogs took the form of Balrogs wheras they were originaly fire spirits or Maiar that didnt take on that appearence before they decided to serve Morgoth. So if Dragons were embodied Maiar then the decendents of the Dragons ie Smaug would also be in part Maiar. So any unlikely fight between a Balrog and a Maiar would probably go down to the wire with either being the victor or vanquished or both.
A dragon might have tried to flee the battlefield, but if the Balrog wanted to finish it off, it would have little chance as according to the Silmarillion, Balrogs are incredibly fast. They rushed to Morgoth's aid when the latter was attacked by Ungoliant and covered a huge distance in a very short time. I doubt that a dragon can be faster than that.
Balrog is a being like Sauron. Balrogs are made of fire...Dragon's attack is fire. Balrogs predate most of creation like Morgoth and Sauron do. Morgoth is top tier while, Sauron and Balrogs are the next tier down. Dragons are a creation Morgoth created and are not existed beings created by God in Tolkien's Universe like Balrogs are. A being far greater than Morgoth created what became Balrogs to Morgoths Dragons......Morgoth who is lesser than God created Dragons.
@truthseeker6532 Smaug is 5 to 10x larger than a Balrog: A lynx can't kill a tiger. Brute force via massive size difference kills the Balrog, and Smaug is also magical. Gandalf kills a Balrog I fair combat. Gandalf dies against Smaug in fair combat.
@@Mentallect You don't understand the situation. Here: Tolkien took the Bible and made a universe with it changing out names and what they are. Morgoth, would be an Archangel, Sauron and Balrogs would be angles and a Dragon would be like a human compared to them. Thus, now you can see the comparison would be: a human against an Angle aka Great limitations compared to hardly any at all. Now, you can see how the situation escaped your understanding of how Tolkien created his Universe. Morgoth was good at the start, went bad aka Satan is who he is. Balrogs, were normal beings but, when they went Evil, their body shape changed like Morgoths as well. You did not study up on Tolkiens Universe. If you did, such things you would have known and would not be defending Dragons up against Balrogs.
@@Mentallect You lack Bible knowledge. Father created Jesus first before anything for Jesus is his Manager/Helper (He is not an archangel nor, angel nor, anything. Jesus is a unique being that Father created "One of a Kind". Then, Jesus as his Manager aka worker/helper Father works through did all the work of creating. Thier home of Heaven etc... using Father's Spiritual Blood called "The Holy Spirit" which is how Father will make us family by. God = Is a family name that Father and Jesus are in. "The Word" is a job title Jesus holds in Heaven which means Manager. Father is Supervisor overall and Jesus is Manager overall. Those 2 templates were used in the creation of Man and Woman. Man is Supervisor and Woman is Manager/Helper. Morgoth, is too many (group made) that were created as well as Sauron. Each to a different kind of creation and neither of them 2, being one of a kind. You must not be near or over 40 years of age to not know this.
Every dragon was killed far easier than most balrogs Even when a Balrog was killed, it almost always killed either a glorious Elf Lord or maiars Humans have killed dragons The only dragon that could possibly if at all kill a balrog would be Ancalogon, cause Morgoth put his own power into it as a final weapon
I'm fan with only movie deep knowledge plus a little, but I'm hearing stories of elves killing balrogs. That's at least a couple deviations below the hierarchical class of Maiar. And since this this whole argument is based on logical conclusions, it should make sense that a dragon at least has a decent shot. Yes, Smaug was killed by a man, but i don't see Durin's Bane wielding a bow with a quiver of black arrows, so that's kind of a specific vulnerability they added to dragons to make the plot work in the Hobbit. But just scrubbing it up to the fact they are different classes without providing specifics or advantages of what that disparity brings to the balrog doesn't make the best argument in my book. P.S. didn't Wormtongue kill Saurumon?
Well, if some men or elves could rise to a tremendous level of power, dragons could too. However smaug's most devastating attacks are associated with fire and Balrogs were made of fire, I don't think Smaug has a chance.
There' a train of thought that Morgoth embodied Maiar spirits when breeding the original Dragons. Some say that Maiar dont breed, but against this argument Melion was a Maiar who bore Thingol a daughter. So i'm inclined to think that some Maiar maybe fire spirits like the Balrogs, were embodied into the Dragon making process. This would circumvent the problem of the imperishable flame not being needed to create life. Also the Balrogs took the form of Balrogs wheras they were originaly fire spirits or Maiar that didnt take on that appearence before they decided to serve Morgoth. So if Dragons were embodied Maiar then the decendents of the Dragons ie Smaug would also be in part Maiar. So any unlikely fight between a Balrog and a Maiar would probably go down to the wire with either being the victor or vanquished or both.
![ALL Unreleased & Deleted Scenes from Lord of The Rings: The Fellowship of the Ring [NEW Edition]](/img/1.gif)
The onset of the dragons drove the Valar back, Balrogs were not even a concern and they ran away.
Only maiar were known to have fought in the war of wrath, so no.
@@eaglefangkaratedojo7473 We also don't know if the valar didn't fight either. Manwe is the only definitive non-participant
@@joshuahuff607 We can infer it for one major reason. Eönwë was the highest ranking entity present at the war and he was just a maiar, hence Sauron was told he had to go to Valinor to face judgement. If Tulkas or Ulmo was there then this wouldn’t have been an issue.
@@eaglefangkaratedojo7473tulkas fought In it
I wish we would have seeing more magic from gandalf in the movies..
Dragons are more powerful than Balrogs. Ancalagon drove back an entire army and change the tide. The should answer the question
its still up in the air for me but tbh i would love to see a balrog riding smaug, that could be an unforgettable sight
Shadow and flame
Would Smaug actually let Durin’s Bane ride him on their way to Mordor to greet Sauron? If all three joined (along with Saruman), they would’ve won. 🤔
Smaug is more clever than Balrog. So that wouldn't happen.
Balrogs did not have wings, they had a veil of shadows which in Fellowship is described as "wing-like."You would not describe actual wings as wing-like, just as you would not call an object "branch-like" if it was a branch.
The pic for thumbnail doesn't represent balrog
A lot of people tend to automatically hand it to the balrog because it's a maiar. But it wouldnt just automatically win because of some arbitrary power level chart. Tolkien's universe doesnt tend to work like that. Youre incorrwct saying you can "prove it" just because of this. I believe it would be situational and depend on the environment.
While I agree 100% with you
Balrogs have better feats than dragons
Dragons are glass cannons and are almost led by balrogs in battle
agreed, if you went by that thought process you'd never account for elves that killed Balrogs or injured Melkor himself.
@@fred_rock exactly. My dude fingolfin
So Smaug was a punk cause an arrow fired by a man killed him, but didn't a Balrog fall in battle against a single elf (Glorfindel) wielding a sword?
The most powerful elves in the first age were crazy strong, an elf name Fingolfin even had duel with Morgoth and wounded him multiple times before losing and dying.
@@Kissamies1exactly! which crumbles the argument that the balrog automatically wins because of some nonexistent power level tier chart. Exceptional elves can kill balrogs and wound a valar. So can a dragon.
@@Kissamies1Yeah Glorfindel is a badass, however Ecthelion was even a greater badass. He killed 3 balrogs. What a feat!
Great content 🎉
Balrog would have rocked Smaug's world.
Balrog would win.
Dragons are a creature of flesh and blood, hard to penetrate their skin but it can be done.
Balrog are a demon of fire and flames, and a dragons fire wouldnt hurt him.
The logic that the Balrog is older so it is stronger than Smaug is moot. Ancalagon was also younger than the Balrogs but no Balrog could stand before him. He was Morgoth's greatest weapon. Also, elves have killed Balrogs in battle while being significantly less powerful and less old. We have to study their battle feats for a more accurate comparison.
There' a train of thought that Morgoth embodied Maiar spirits when breeding the original Dragons. Some say that Maiar dont breed, but against this argument Melion was a Maiar who bore Thingol a daughter. So i'm inclined to think that some Maiar maybe fire spirits like the Balrogs, were embodied into the Dragon making process. This would circumvent the problem of the imperishable flame not being needed to create life. Also the Balrogs took the form of Balrogs wheras they were originaly fire spirits or Maiar that didnt take on that appearence before they decided to serve Morgoth. So if Dragons were embodied Maiar then the decendents of the Dragons ie Smaug would also be in part Maiar. So any unlikely fight between a Balrog and a Maiar would probably go down to the wire with either being the victor or vanquished or both.
The A.I voiceover is getting better and better every day.
What makes you think it's AI?
@@MovieFactsEN the cadence of the voice. There is a pattern to it, ordinary speakers usually do not have a cadence. I only see that in news anchors.
We started our channel with AI voice acting, but now we have a professional voice-over artist.
@@MovieFactsEN its very obvious ai
A dragon might have tried to flee the battlefield, but if the Balrog wanted to finish it off, it would have little chance as according to the Silmarillion, Balrogs are incredibly fast. They rushed to Morgoth's aid when the latter was attacked by Ungoliant and covered a huge distance in a very short time. I doubt that a dragon can be faster than that.
Gandalf stepped up to take on and kill a balrog but he didnt want any part of smaug..just sayin..
.
Sauron defeats Balrog 9/10 unless Balrog discovers Smaug's weak spot.
Balrog is a being like Sauron.
Balrogs are made of fire...Dragon's attack is fire.
Balrogs predate most of creation like Morgoth and Sauron do.
Morgoth is top tier while, Sauron and Balrogs are the next tier down.
Dragons are a creation Morgoth created and are not existed beings created by God in Tolkien's Universe like Balrogs are.
A being far greater than Morgoth created what became Balrogs to Morgoths Dragons......Morgoth who is lesser than God created Dragons.
@truthseeker6532 Smaug is 5 to 10x larger than a Balrog: A lynx can't kill a tiger. Brute force via massive size difference kills the Balrog, and Smaug is also magical. Gandalf kills a Balrog I fair combat. Gandalf dies against Smaug in fair combat.
@@Mentallect
You don't understand the situation.
Here: Tolkien took the Bible and made a universe with it changing out names and what they are. Morgoth, would be an Archangel, Sauron and Balrogs would be angles and a Dragon would be like a human compared to them.
Thus, now you can see the comparison would be: a human against an Angle aka Great limitations compared to hardly any at all.
Now, you can see how the situation escaped your understanding of how Tolkien created his Universe. Morgoth was good at the start, went bad aka Satan is who he is. Balrogs, were normal beings but, when they went Evil, their body shape changed like Morgoths as well.
You did not study up on Tolkiens Universe. If you did, such things you would have known and would not be defending Dragons up against Balrogs.
@truthseeker6532 Morgoth was the most powerful being that entered the world like Jesus was, not some archangel.
@@Mentallect
You lack Bible knowledge.
Father created Jesus first before anything for Jesus is his Manager/Helper (He is not an archangel nor, angel nor, anything. Jesus is a unique being that Father created "One of a Kind".
Then, Jesus as his Manager aka worker/helper Father works through did all the work of creating. Thier home of Heaven etc... using Father's Spiritual Blood called "The Holy Spirit" which is how Father will make us family by.
God = Is a family name that Father and Jesus are in.
"The Word" is a job title Jesus holds in Heaven which means Manager. Father is Supervisor overall and Jesus is Manager overall.
Those 2 templates were used in the creation of Man and Woman. Man is Supervisor and Woman is Manager/Helper.
Morgoth, is too many (group made) that were created as well as Sauron. Each to a different kind of creation and neither of them 2, being one of a kind.
You must not be near or over 40 years of age to not know this.
Smaug would slap the fire outta the balrog
Every dragon was killed far easier than most balrogs
Even when a Balrog was killed, it almost always killed either a glorious Elf Lord or maiars
Humans have killed dragons
The only dragon that could possibly if at all kill a balrog would be Ancalogon, cause Morgoth put his own power into it as a final weapon
Hmmm Maybe the Balrog because it had a Whip and Sword, Smaug had fire but that would not help him and Both can fly.
I'm fan with only movie deep knowledge plus a little, but I'm hearing stories of elves killing balrogs. That's at least a couple deviations below the hierarchical class of Maiar. And since this this whole argument is based on logical conclusions, it should make sense that a dragon at least has a decent shot. Yes, Smaug was killed by a man, but i don't see Durin's Bane wielding a bow with a quiver of black arrows, so that's kind of a specific vulnerability they added to dragons to make the plot work in the Hobbit. But just scrubbing it up to the fact they are different classes without providing specifics or advantages of what that disparity brings to the balrog doesn't make the best argument in my book.
P.S. didn't Wormtongue kill Saurumon?
I’m going to laugh if balrog wins 🤣🤣🤣
Well, if some men or elves could rise to a tremendous level of power, dragons could too. However smaug's most devastating attacks are associated with fire and Balrogs were made of fire, I don't think Smaug has a chance.
There' a train of thought that Morgoth embodied Maiar spirits when breeding the original Dragons. Some say that Maiar dont breed, but against this argument Melion was a Maiar who bore Thingol a daughter. So i'm inclined to think that some Maiar maybe fire spirits like the Balrogs, were embodied into the Dragon making process. This would circumvent the problem of the imperishable flame not being needed to create life. Also the Balrogs took the form of Balrogs wheras they were originaly fire spirits or Maiar that didnt take on that appearence before they decided to serve Morgoth. So if Dragons were embodied Maiar then the decendents of the Dragons ie Smaug would also be in part Maiar. So any unlikely fight between a Balrog and a Maiar would probably go down to the wire with either being the victor or vanquished or both.