GMG Reviews - Necromunda: Hive Secundus by Games Workshop
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- Опубликовано: 18 сен 2024
- It's into the UNDERHELLS. Loved Space Hulk? Love Aliens? Want to pit a suicide-squad of Gangers against an endless nightmare horde of aliens in the ruins of a Dead hive as they seek to confront and kill the monstrous Brood-Father lurking there? Let's dive into Hive Secundus, the one-off game mode expansion and two-player game box from the Boxed Game team at Games Workshop.
Thanks to GW for the copy of the Box to review.
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Intro and Outro music used via Creative Commons "Benji" by Dyalla
Ash was so disappointed with the quality of the cardboard box packaging he turned into the Red Hulk
Ash Smash!
I still have my Indominus box since it was so nice. If this is anything like my AoS Soul Wars box, I understand.
There are reports by a store I peruse (taschengelddieb) that the Skaventide packaging is too flimsy for it's 5kg(!) content and they had to support it themselves and had several boxes arrived damaged/punctured. I hope this isn't a new GW trend...
This is what happens when you expose a Canadian to sunlight.
This is probably the biggest hit in a while for me from GW. My buddy and I were sitting and discussing after we played at our weekly Alpha Strike book how we really wanted to play a tile based Necromunda game that worked with two players and only needed a single book to play, because the normal game suffers from immense rule bloat and we have a couple guys in our gaming group that are too competitive for Necromunda and probably would try to break it. He said he really wanted to play Genestealer Cult and I said I really wanted to play Van Saar. Two weeks later they announced this box, haha.
I don't think I had ever directly wishlisted a GW product, but man were me and my buddy excited. Love the Aliens theme this has going for it.
I freaked out while watching this because I saw the horizontal black line and thought my television was broken. But no, it's just Ash trolling us with the edge of his green screen.
I had the exact same reaction! :)
One thing I did with the last Necromunda box's paper "board tiles" was grab an old game board from an unused board game for which my kids lost most of the cards/pieces, use a spray adhesive, and glue it down. It makes it foldable but also WAY more sturdy. Works a treat if you can find the right sized board!
It looks like the paper mats are double sided. You'd have to choose one side if you glued it to a backing.
@@chadnine3432 - that is true, but I only liked one side of the last one, so....
old board games are a good idea - colour photocopies of the tiles would probably work. to get you another set of tiles.
The box is one thing, the paper play mats though were very disappointing, I have to say that I just don’t believe the cost saving required on the paper mats over card ones would have been make or break for this set
Oh no, the mint colored dice.....I NEED.
I love that this story started as a White Dwarf mission for Space Crusade.
Now i want to run a linked campaign
The final part of the Aranthian Succession Campaign had background stuff about the ash walls being breached and the new overlords (House Aranthus) not knowing what the alarms were for and just ignoring them. The malstrain are out of Secundus.
Thanks for all the information. I can’t wait to see the Let’s Play
"We're proud to announce that over the year 2024, we've surpassed expectations in profits! Sadly, please expect a raise in prices across the board by 3-5% and sadly we have to cut back on manufacturing. So the nice cardboard boxes, will be a thing of the past." - GW CEO Kevin Rountree
Shareholders gotta wet their beak.
3-5% price increase every single year as long back as I can remember(except for… 2020? because Covid) and profits up across the board.
Apparently boxes made primarily from wishes and hopes cut down on shipping so much that profits skyrocketed
Ash turning into Magnus half way through was very enjoyable. The cheap paper mat, not so much.
Secundus really looks like it could be the 40k Mordheim, with the Radiated Genestealers as the Skaven (sort of). I hope they expand this line.
My 2 cents regarding the box and "gameboard" decisions, coming from speculation due to incomplete data:
IF, if the prior Forge World boxes were made of a heavier material like that of the tiles that came with the Escher/Goliath box (and also the Palanite/Corpsegrinder box??), then that material is probably "Binders' Board" - it is wood pulp and recycled paper waste at the final non-recyclable state of its existence, the next step is into the garbage for disposal. It is definitely this Binders' Board that is used for the Necromunda counters. [It is called Binders' Board because Book Binders use it to create hardcover books, or book sleeves, or clamshell boxes, etc.]
The box containing Secundus, and the game-surfaces/"boards" are extremely thin cardstock or laminated paper and therefor recyclable.
[I still have my original Space Hulk, Deathwing Space Hulk Expansion, and Battlefleet Gothic boxes - they are thin cardstock, but perhaps heavier than the stock used for Secundus, so they are recyclable.[
The box and "board" components also weigh less, which probably translates into fuel savings or reduced freight costs.
So recyclability versus garbage, and less weight for increased fuel/transport savings.
Funny, I was about to point out that you got a nasty sunburn! ;) lol
Paper mats is just an insult at their price point. I still can't deal with the crap in the Ash Wastes box.
It just feels beyond scummy at this point. Price up and product quality down. How long will it be until we just get a download link for paper mat we have to print ourselves?
Really hard to place barricades on the ash wastes mat. The fold lines tip everything over
I love the rules and the re-worked background for the Spyrer and all the malstrains. Not a fan of paper game mats
This was obviously filmed after visiting the ash wastes.
Little disappointed with the game „board“ but im hyped for the game and already preordered.
Rules for "Malstrain Corrupted Gangs" will come with the "Book of Desolation" book, but you can't run a Malstrain only gang. I'm hyped for that.
This review by Ash has made the 'buy/no buy' question easier to answer - definitely leaning towards picking it up for sure. Retail price in Canada looks around $195 (local game store applying discount) to $210 (actual GW store), so even just on the models it's a reasonable price.
The last couple release cycles from GW left me kinda uninterested, but this one made me windmill slam the credit card down. I don't care for the paper mats, but I was gonna build them in 3d anyway and the brood scum are kinda meh, but that's what kitbashing is for. :D
Hive Succondeeznuts
Very hyped for this! Anything to pull more people into Necromunda is a good thing in my book. I'll figure out something for those crappy paper tiles...
The book situation at this point feels like it be cheaper to buy a junk tablet and collect the digital versions.
GW drops the ball hard yet again by not including solo & coop play, despite having the perfect inspiration of ALIENS. They even had their own Ambot Hunt rules from 2020 to draw upon...
They dont do solo games sadly. The only one i know is the Darktide box and thats it more or less.
@@uwesca6263
At this point, yes, it seems as though GW are still living in 1994 rather than 2024 - pretending that solo-coop wargaming and 3D printing doesn't exist. For the so-called market leader its a poor show.
The last substantial solo-coop games GW released were Blackstone Fortress and Cursed City, but haven't been supported in a few years and months, respectively. If they would just support them it would be something.
@@uwesca6263 and now there are solo and co-op rules for Kill Team coming out.
Necro has been my favorite GW IP since the 90s, but no one plays it locally. Solo would be a welcome addition.
This reminds me of Necromunda STALKER. A gang goes into an exclusion zone to come out with valuable data, in a place surrounded by gravity anomalies and infested with mutated Genestealers.
Cant wait for mine to turn up. I love both Necromunda and STALKER, to see them sort of mashed together, im all for it.
I was not really interested in necromunda, but this looks very interesting! Id love to see more of these kinds of box sets- horror movie style, space hulk style, dungeon crawl, sci fi adventure.
Can’t wait to see a play through!
I don't care if it isn't PC! Bring back Scavvys and Ratskins, you cowards! 😂
I wouldn't be surprised if they at least bring back the Scavvys in this edition. With Ash Wastes they added The Nomads and the Prospectors. This next series of releases is updating the already existing Xenos Cult, and adding Spyrers... so they may add at least 1 new Gang to the mix. (I don't count the Malstrain as a new gang, since it is more meant for these Arbitrator led games... which was something they did have back in the 90s with monsters, Genestealers, and other non humans wandering around the hive).
If we look back to the original Outlands expansion to Necromunda, they added Spyrers, Scavvies, Ratskins and Redemptionists... which were incorporated into the Cawdor gangs in this edition. so really just the Mutants, and the Inner hive Nomads are left. I am sure, they can easily be respectful to indigenous people with Ratskins if they approach it at a different angle (Like the Spyrers aren't just spoiled rich kids going out for a little murder, but Nobles trying to prove their worth... they can easily turn the Ratskins into groups of people who are rejecting the relegated drudgery of working for the imperium of man, and are surviving in secret in the under hive.
I played a couple games with my normy buddies, they loved it. I've been building (casting) columns and walls forever to continue after we had so much fun.
This new box set is perfect. Before I was worried about all the fluf rules. This box makes that not a thing. I get it in two weeks and damn we gonna do the nestromo run!
I wish this book would be sold separately -- or this campaign to be more precise
I'm so pumped for this release
So, it's like Warhammer Quest, but for Necromunda.
Ith all of the terrain being separated into their own boxes - the Data Stacks and ruined Zone Mortals - GW can sort of keep the initial price point down and let the people that want to get the terrain only do just that.
To buy everything would be NZ$ 619.
Sunday reviews!! 🎉🎊🥳🤩
Here's the book I've been waiting for the man to read to me. I tend to only play with one person anyway so I'm looking forward to running through a campaign that feels tailored for 2 people.
ah, i thought it was the Ash lobster arc
Wow that box.
secundus might be bigger than we thought the interview with rob said we might move to there hive that is near secundus such as the hive with the skull face. I know this will be a big if on gw side but if it dose happen and they choose that one we might find out that they are not dead as we thought ???
Sec UN dus, Secund US, potato, potahtoe. Same same, at least you aren’t saying “Cust ODES”.
Honestly I just want the miniatures for my Kill System Process games
Nah, Spyrers weren't 'basically' the Necromunda version of Dark Future's Hive Brats. They both come from Uphive, no doubt. But Brats were basically the 'Gang of Juves'. They had nothing near the tek of Spyrer Hunting Rigs. Spyrers background may have borrowed from Hive Brats, but only as a starting point that went way beyond the scope of what Brat Gangs were.
Never played Necromunda, but this is tempting.
can you use this as a starter set? i've been interested in necromunda for a while but i heard that the core rule book they sell outside of boxes is horribly outdated and the ash wastes box is too expensive for me
I FREAKIN LOVE YOUR VIDEOS DUDE!!! Been watching a while now. Stellar game reps.
Sadly this box is too expensive for what you get. $10 worth of plastic, some cardboard, some paper, and a book. Its too much money these days. You dont even get any real terrain. I have enough unpainted models. RENT comes first. My PILE OF SHAME doesnt need a bunch more models for a game that will sit in the corner.
This isn't from Forgeworld; Necromunda is produced by the Specialist Games Studio which isn't part of FW.
Not that this excuses the poor quality box 🙁
All the boxes have become closer to the 90s quality of boxes. While Kill Team and Necromunda did have the heavy duty boxes, the last Necromunda Box to use it was the Ash Wastes, and Kill Team hasn't had a quality box since Into the Dark. Even Skaventide has the cheaper box when compared to Dominium and Imperium.
It’s all under Tony IIRC which is synonymous with FW in my mind lol
Hive War starter set was soft box as well
I've been wanting to get into necromunda but man they haven't made it easy so far. Would love to start playing this
Don't want to be the "lore guy", but the genestealers are like this because it is a completely different hive (or what is left of it), not because of the radiation of van saar territory in hive primus where the rest of necromunda happens
He covers it in the vid. They tried to cure the genstealer virus which changed them.
'Zona Necromunda'?
The box for Hive War was terrible quality as well, really thin.
Got a black line across my video. Wondered if my phone was breaking.
So this is a good boxset for someone who's never touched necromunda before it seems. The whole vibe/theme of this box is very attractive. How are the rules compared to other GW game systems in terms of difficulty?
Please do a campaign!
Ash you get some sun recently? XD LMAO
I read that the game mats are designed with the expectation that you’ll purchase the Ruined Zone Mortalis and Hive Data Stack Cluster terrain pieces separately. Can you confirm that (and also that 1x ruined ZM and 1x data stack box are enough for the box game mat? Also how are gonna upgrade your game mat from the box?
Yes you are correct - you gona need 2 and a half boxes of riuned zone mortalis terrain and 1 box of data clusters to fill the board entirely. And that is only at zero level. If you want to go higher you gona need more up to infinity :D Keep also in mind that you would need regular ZM columns and walls sets as those new are "broken" versions so not to good to build upon them - those are mere like "finishing" parts to add a flavour :D
@@pawegownicki7250 ty for the reply - im goin for 3rd Party terrain then
I was enthused for this , but the cheap mat and single paltry sprue of scenery is a deal breaker. I was thinking some of the Mortalis ruins were included…sadly not the case. But hey, what can you expect for a crappy $170USD?
People complained when GW put plastic terrain in the box because it makes the product expensive. People complain when they don’t put terrain in the starter box but offer it separately.
Ash I pre-ordered but if I use a gang and have a guy with limited how does that work when they go out of ammo?
Limited means that the ammo type is removed from the player card but the gun generally is not. It's different than scarce which prevents the weapon from being used at all for the rest of the game. With limited ammo types, you're still free to reload it and fire it using a different ammo profile.
Naw GW has never used AI art Ash
I mean how would we know?
@@GuerrillaMiniatureGames lol I think it would be all the rage in the community! Folks have sharp eyes... I'd put it at 98-99% chance that we'd know lol, but yeah could be wrong you're technically right
Have you not seen any of the Warhammer Community articles about this game? Because you are making a lot of statements about the background that are wrong.
Do you need the Necromunda Barricades and Objectives to play this?
Nope! Not for the scenarios in here
@@GuerrillaMiniatureGames Thank you ;)
"Please don't be AI art" my favourite thing about the panic about AI art is people acting like they've never seen digital art before. 90% that's just digital art, yes it's always looked like that, it looks wrong because digital art isn't done with real paint it's just photoshop layers that don't merge with each other like paint or layer up like paint so you get these weird giant "brushstrokes". (Actual AI art can look very weird but does not have this kind of artefact, if anything it's uncannily smooth and detailed) There is a distinct lack of range of colour or detail because it's done with digital colouring (Pure hexadecimal colours you need to specify each time for the computer to change and which do not merge into each other like physical objects) and to a set digital resolution and isn't a physical object. Finally because it allows outsourcing and encourages artists to have several pieces on the go to a huge scale, the level of passion and quality is generally lower. Just like AI art there is a distinct quantity over quality theme with digital art.
Only a few pieces even come close to GW's previous standard like the cover to the new CSM codex, the cover to the GSC codex and this box art. (I think the artist for the first two is Lewis Jones) Paul Dainton did a few good digital art pieces in the mid 2000s right through to his retirement but even those seemed to suffer from the problem of the foreground and background not seemingly to be part of the same painting. Some of the stuff he produced for the Votann codex was not very good (This is actually a big problem for the Votann, they have no good legacy art to draw on) but his swan song was the cover for the new Kroot army box that looked better. He also did a good SM codex cover. Better use of digital art has been the use of small illustrations of things but without backgrounds and other marginalia. I think a big problem with digital is it's so bad at low detail filling out, doing scribbled and low detailed elements seems to blend better than with digital or else the business model of digital with so much competition means we get "good enough" pieces that are below what once was acceptable. Even GW seems to have noticed this with a lot of legacy art now making it into recent Codex releases despite their desire to get rid of "first born" all the best art is just them. (Can you think of any artwork with Primaris you really remember or made you feel anything? It's almost like it lacks detail and richness in colour.) Seems like they don't rate a lot of the art they've been commissioning for the last 10 years. (Look at some of the stuff they get as BL covers)
The new Old World books use a lot of digital art but they widely removed the issue of colour by having it all be sepia-toned line art and this also helps the issue of background merging, they also seem to avoid background or minimise them a lot.
It amazes me people are only seemingly noticing now. The other thing that the Forge World guys (Now "Specialist games") do a lot is use real models (Since they were threadheads who used to paint everything very realistically, literally the best military painters worked at Forge World, the promo for the new HH box was actually just the models themselves but people weren't 100% sure if they were art or not) and put photoshop layers over them to make "photographs" since they had smaller teams and budget.
TL;DR That piece was just digital art, actual AI art wouldn't be trained on unfinished or bad digital art, it'll be trained on good art or real paintings and will produce better results than bad digital art. And it'll do a much better job technically since humans aren't very good in general at attempting to emulate oil paintings with photoshop, it's really hard, things that nature just does for you you have to specify for the computer to do (And it can't actually do some of it) and I wonder if the process isn't detrimental to artist flow. I just find it really funny how people haven't noticed the advent of digital illustrations in fantasy and sci fi for the last 10-15 years and now are paranoid about AI art and so see things that are pretty typical artefacts of bad digital art and assume it's AI when infact AI typically doesn't have those giant photoshop layer "brush strokes". (Since it's a computer and it can replicate things without actually "painting" them) In the end the shift away from inhouse artists who work in physical medium was the presage for AI art and the general devaluing and decline of working conditions for artists. But anytime somebody like me complained about it I would get slammed by a brigade of DeviantArt people, enjoy being replaced by an algorithm that makes better digital art than a human can make because somehow it's unthinkable to use easier to use physical tools and scanners.
Nah this is not evocative of Dark Uprising, it is evocative of Underhive, the very first N17 starter box, except Underhive came with thick cardstock map tiles and not those garbage paper map tiles.
The paper stock mats is why I didn't buy this box. Couldn't believe it... utterly ridiculous, unnecessary cost-cutting bullshit.
Someone ate to many carrots!
But it seems GW is cutting costs on boxes and boards.
Always more money, less content inside.
You pronounce "Secundus" correctly: se-cun-dus. Otherwise, it would be written as secondus: se-con-dus.
Whelp, seems to be out of stock at pretty much every discount on-line retailer I can think of in the UK. And according to Wayland Games at least, this is a single print-run product. Well done GW.
Shame about the mats and box. Im tired of building out gw boxes to make em last. Gonna skip this one.
Oh on the website it says mat. A mat to me implies something stronger than a paper map. Kinda misleading. Yeah gonna miss this one.
tbf mat could be any material. It's a mat. If it said board now that would have be misleading. Still premium price crap quality product
The art is sketch-y... Do you even 'Blanchitsu'? A helluva lot of GW art is akin to glamorized 'pencils', 'charcoal' & general sketch type work.
Do people really care about the quality of the box? It’s not like there is terrain to keep in it. Once you have assembled the models and put your rule book and paper board on your bookshelf what will you keep in the box. If you were planning on buying it and keeping in the box then I can see why you might want a more robust box.
Cardboard is low quality because GW has so high profit rate, 30% or so. But think, few years from now they might just selling products in a paper bag.
WTF. I paid £85 for paper mats? It looks cheap and tatty.
Seems like a cool setting, fluff wise..